All my motivation is gone, and this board needs to change NOW.

[Coolboyman]

Let's get the obvious out of the way first:
I am not bashing Zel, read the paragraph.
This is not a Koolboyman Vs. Zel Topic, or a Prism Vs. Shiny Gold Topic
This is not about Prism getting limited exposure, this is about all unique hacks getting limited exposure. I am using my experience as an example.

This place is kind of getting depressing.

I've been criticized with comments such as "do Advance Gold is Old", and even though people don't say it, it often shows when all gameboy color hacks have less replies than advance hacks. It shouldn't be a torture to look at something made 8 years ago instead of 5. I want people to realize that the game is not based on graphics, but how much time the author puts into it.

I tolerated it for a while, but lets go back to December when I won hack of the year. I gotten many harsh comments and messages because they thought that my hack shouldn't win, and a few of them were based simply because it was a gold hack instead of an advanced one. Shiny Gold and Zel constantly get more attention than the other 10 runner ups combined. Why couldn't people let someone else win for once? I also still see people complaining on the Shiny Gold Topic. I was insulted, and I was beginning to lose motivation to complete Prism by the deadline, however I didn't want to do that for my fans so I kept it going. Even though I won Hack of the year I still get less attention than the other Gameboy Advance hacks. This wouldn't be a problem really, but I feel some of those hacks are poor hacks, and they're getting more attention just because they're advance hacks. It makes me feel that people don't care about how much hard work people put in their hacks, just what its a hack of.

Zel fans beware of the following topic. Zel's a cool guy, and I've talked to him a few times, but I believe that Shiny Gold is overrated. It's a good hack, but it is not the best, and neither is Prism. The reason I believe people like it so much is because they already know what to expect from it, since most people have obviously played Gold already, they'll know of all the "cool stuff" it has, and Zel actually knows how to pull all of that off unlike other remakers. This hack is the most popular hack on the site. Plus, the "MOTM" had Zel voted as best hacker 13 out of 19 times just because most of the people who voted for Zel never played a hack outside of Shiny Gold. Zel's a good hacker, but not the best. I'm not even the best either. A remake is more popular than all other original hacks based off nothing but the authors imagination.

What's so bad about the Graphics or gold? Or the music? I've also noticed so many things could be done better (like what the hell are invisible items doing as solid objects) and I can go on and on, and I believe Zel does his best. Plus I fully disagree with his statement "Brining Johto Back to Life". It's 100% cool if your favorite hack is Shiny Gold, and your favorite author is Zel, but make sure you've played other hacks first before judging.

And then we have people making remakes just because they want to be as popular s Zel. Anyone can get instantly popular not by taking Nintendo's ideas from one game and putting them in another. It's not original, it's called transferring. Also, when people state they have their own unique features, it's usually something minor like a new rival, different wild Pokemon, but in the end it doesn't matter. It's the same region, and the same game overall.

Remakes should not be getting praised (except Shiny Gold because he knows what he's doing, but not as much praise as he's getting now) by taking regions from one game and moving them to another. Almost anyone can clone a region with mediocre results if they had enough time on their hands. You don't have to use your imagination or make your own ideas, you just have to move everything from one game to another. The main problem is people are way to accepting of these remakes. Honestly, we need one remake of Gold, and Silver and Crystal are basically the same games.

What do I want?
1. Gameboy / Gameboy Color / Gameboy Advance games to be treated the same
2. I want original ideas to be respected more over borrowing ideas from other Pokemon games.
3. I'd like people to be honest of what they think of hacks. Don't just go "oh good job" even if it's poor, tell the author what you think would help improve his or her hack.

I understand none of these will be 100% fulfilled, but you can all help by getting GBC / GBA hacks exposed, as well as all unique hacks. Plus, tell the author what you really think.

I want judgment to be fair for not just me, but everyone on this forum. Plus, it's 100% cool if your favorite hack is Shiny Gold, and your favorite author is Zel, but make sure you've played other hacks first before judging.

[D-Trogh]

Man, I 'love' you ^^ ;)
You're so right ^^

Wish I could say more.. But XD

[Twinx]

I have been often criticized with "OMG dEW ADVeNCE CUZ GOLD IS OLD"Such things would only come from a Noob who doesn't know any better.
I don't see someone, who knows what he is talking about ,saying such a thing.
Just ignore such people, but you know... it's normal that people would prefer playing gba hacks, because let's face it, the graphics are appealing. People are always gonna prefer the new things over the old, it's just the way they are, you can't change that..

This was flat out insulting, and I was not motivated to work on this hack anymore if I was going to be treated like thisHackers, as far as I know, hack for the fun of it, not for the awards and for the fame.
You should be motivated by the fans you have and the things you have accomplished.
The judges probably thought you deserved that award because it was a gameboy color hack and because of all the things that you added to the game, they didn't take in consideration the popularity of you hack, so it's not really about the popularity is it?

IT IS NOT THE BEST.... BUT HE IS NOT THE BEST Why do you see zel as a rival? And why criticize the guy?
If this is about Gb VS Gba hacks, he just happens to be the guy on the other end, I don't see why you have to insult him like that. I suggest you remove that part of the post for the sake of this thread. I'm sure you wouldn't want this thread to become a battlefield..

That's all I have to say for now.

[Zanacross]

I understand where you are coming from. Shiny gold isn't the best hack around. It's over rated. You put a lot of work in to prism and people should know that.

[Kristian]

Im totally agree Coolboyman..
Maaany noobs, just go into a thread, and look at the graphics, is theyre good, the game is good, if theyre bad the game is bad T_T
C'mon, graphics are nice to have sometimes, but Gameplay is much more important!
imagen..a game with the perfect graphics, but the only thing you can do in the game is to look at the graphics..do you think thats a good game? NO
but i doubt this will stop noobs commenting things like that, they even don't read the rules..
-_-

[Coolboyman]

First off, THIS IS NOT A "SHINY GOLD VS. PRISM" TOPIC OR A "COOLBOYMAN VS. ZEL" TOPIC
Secondly, MY STATEMENT IS NOT "GAMEBOY COLOR HACKS ARE AUTOMATICALLY BETTER THAN ADVANCE HACKS", BECAUSE THATS NOT TRUE.

Thirdly, I wasn't insulting him, I don't see him as a rival, I was just saying his game is overrated, which it is. I mean how is it fair that Shiny Gold and Zel gets almost everything, and when he doesn't get ONE thing, everyone cries over it? His hack has the most views, his help topic has the most views, most downloads, most replies, he has a fanclub, won MOTM several times, where even the combined amount of votes from the runners up still wouldn't beat him, and I can go on and on, but I guess that's not enough for the fans. I wasn't even commenting on HIM, I was commenting on his work. And no I'm not going to remove it, because that's partly the point. I knew it was going to happen, so once again, I DO NOT HATE ZEL, I DO NOT EVEN HATE SHINY GOLD. I hate though the fact its overrated while other hacks are based off fresh ideas are flat out ignored (and yes, even GBA hacks apply to this).

You people don't understand, this is not just about Prism, this is about all the hacks on the site. I want all hacks to be treated fairly, whether it's a completely new concept or a gameboy hack. I can imagine that the authors would feel bad if they put a lot of effort into their work, and found out that nobody really cared about their hack. This is what I want to avoid. Plus, Zel should not feel bad because this really isn't even his fault. The fans are the ones who made it popular. I mean hell, dont you all remember when everyone was voting during the first round for Shiny Gold for Hack of the Year? He kept on encouraging people to actually PLAY the other hacks before voting, but of course they probably didn't.

[Olz.]

I don't understand this thread. Is it a rant? or is it a suggestion? Seems like a rant.. And just to say.. Zel is awesome..

[Went]

What can I say, except that I agree to most of it?

The main problem came when Fire Red and Leaf Green came, but Nintendo didn't announce anything for Gold and Silver. Just look at the Pokémon games boards here, each week a thread saying "Has anyone heard something about a G/S/C remake today?" appears. People wants one so much that, when zel made a pretty good one, it became fastly popular.

But people liking a new game better than an old one is too sadly common- not only in hacks. And the problem is that the new people will always choose the new one, because, well, it's new and easier to hack, thanks to all the new tools. The problem is that the results, well, you can see, aren't that good.

About the MoTM, don't be offended, but Zel getting more votes in the MoTM and a FC is because he has gone around outside the rom-hacking boards more, so it's more popular than you outside here. After all, it's a popularity contest- if people don't know you, they can't vote for you :\ That's all.
-It's talking one of the two people who voted for you, being zel the other one-

Prism is a really genius work. Please, don't leave because a bunch of people who can't appreciate good work don't like it, it would be a great loss for rom hacking.

[Skeetendo, Inc.]

Finally... somebody put into words how I, and many others (few of that I know), feel. I know I've talked to you about this on a few occasions, and I know how you feel as well, and now I really do :P

I love you CBM.

But seriously, this is the biggest problem about the hacking section of this forum. Too much attention on one hack, then the potential of others. There are a few hacks I've seen out there that looks awesome, and have potential to be an amazing hack, a lot of others, I don't. I mean I played an old beta/demo of Shiny Gold, it was good, but not that great. Now I know "THERE IS A NEW BETA >=(". I haven't played it because I don't really feel like playing it. It's probably awesome, I've seen some of the videos of his scripts and I'm impressed, but I just don't feel like playing it, it's pretty much something I've played before.

About Graphics. In my opinion, I love Color/Metal Generation graphics much more than the Advanced. I don't know what it is, maybe it's the simplicity, yet awesome looking tiles, maybe it's the 4 colors and how they are done, I don't know. I could just be saying this because I'm a GSC hacker, but it's not why I'm saying it. I also sprite Advanced stuff, I do a lot of tiles and so on for Pokémon Acanthite.

All I can say is... Give other hacks a chance, even if you don't think it'll be good, at least give it a try, if you don't like it, don't play it, but don't play it because the graphics aren't Advanced or they aren't to YOUR standards, because anything can happen. You could end up loving the game, even more than Shiny Gold.

-Pyro

[Νιτραμ]

@CBM: Replying to your very first sentence...

I do care. And I say you're hell right!

With my former account, I criticised low quality of GBA hacks over here. It's just because everyone wants to be like Zel. I like him, Carlos is nice guy, but let's face the truth: IT'S ALL OVERRATED. I have retired from the hacking scene months ago and I am not sure if it is good to make a comeback, even if I am well-prepared and I have all ideas sorted out. I doubt I will get even 1% of the attention Carlos has got. And it's bad that higher quality GBA hacks and GBC hacks with quality higher than all GBA hacks are just IGNORED.

The problem is, when I criticised n00bs last time, they almost virtually killed me. No one can criticise them cause DEY R DA BEZT. And it's pretty stupid.

Hope you guys will invoke even deeper discussion that will get attention of all peoplen in charge.

Cheers!

*changes his sig to reflect anger and puts a link here ;)*

[WaterSplash]

To be honest, Shiny Gold is a good hack at best. Solid invisible objects as CBM already pointed out, First few trainers say "Youngster /1Trainer/1 would like to battle, Prof. Elm saying: come see me when the egg hatches, and I came to him since the day it hatched and it is now a Togetic, and all he says is: Has the egg changed yet? I know it's just a beta and people think that with the "great" grahics these little mistakes can be overlooked, that is why in the end Shiny Gold will be the one that fades in people's memory's, and Brown/Prism will go on forever (or until the ESRB shuts down all emulator sites) :\ Anyway, to the people who think mistakes can be overlooked, do you think Nintendo/Pokemon Company release a game while leaving the small mistakes in? (ok, missingno maybe.) Just something for people to think on. To Coolboyman: don't stop Prism. One thing Shiny Gold does not have due to the fact that it is FireRed is the Day/Night system. I hope Zel reads this and takes this into consideration (the ironing out small mistakes, not the Day/Night system) because it takes a real hacker to hack GB Color games.

BTW: I hate that saying "Bringing Johto back to life. It NEVER died". My avatar and my username come from my starter on Crystal. It isn't dead, it's just stuck back on that game. And the idiots that worship (yes I said worship) Zel are just proving their ignorance. Nintendo made Gold version and Johto. The only big original thing in the game is Carlos and Ashlee and the other random characters, which deserves a bit of praise, but not this bull about "Zel's fanclub". I came up with my username, where's is WaterSplash's fanclub? Get over yourselves and look at the games your rejecting (ie: Gold, Silver, Crystal) where the real Johto is. Before you even pick a tool to use to hack, how about thinking of an original storyline first.

[Coolboyman]

I don't understand this thread. Is it a rant? or is it a suggestion? Seems like a rant.. And just to say.. Zel is awesome..

... I KNEW I would get comments like these. Seriously, fail. Once again, I have noting against Zel, just his fans.

Anyway, I thought up of a great idea today that would help a little. Hack of the Week. Each week, one hack (that would be no older than one month) will be eligable. We'd hold a poll each week of these new hacks, and whoever gets the most votes gets their hack pinned for a week. Next week, we do it again (but no hack can get the award twice or more). I think it would be a great idea to motivate the authors of these hacks, and to help get people aware of these new hacks. Nothing too big, just a little award telling people to keep up the good work, and plus they would get noticed.

When hacks are flat out ignored, the authors lose motivation, and this can possibly help keep new promising projects from being left in the dust, where they don't belong.

Post your ideas too to make this place a more fair place for everybody.

[loadingNOW]

while mostly true there are reasons why this is so
1. I WANT GAMEBOY COLOR AND ADVANCE HACKS TO ALL BE TREATED EQUALLY, is that so much to ask?!
Its never going to happen. Yes from a hacking perspective it does not matter if you're working on the old games or the new ones. you can do impressive things with both however like you said advance will always look better (unless you have absolutely zero talent with art and insist on a gfx change - which sadly a lot of people do). So looking from a user perspective you will probably always prefer the better looking advance games while from a tech/hacking perspective there is no difference at all but tech people are usually not the main audience for games.
2. I want original ideas to be respected more, not stay dead lying on the 5th page while 5 Gold/Silver remakes hog the first page.
I guess the problem there is that it's much harder to come up with a good unique idea remaking gold is something tech people can do well. coming up with a good idea is harder and maybe the people good in this area are not as good in scripting and asm hacking so non innovative the gold remakes look better and have more awesome scripts.
3. I want people to be honest of what they think of hacks. Don't just say "oh its good keep up the good work", because you're afraid you'll hurt the authors feelings if you say something bad about it. I even accepted it on my own hack (besides the "make advance" statement), and if I can take it from my own hack, you all should be able to do it to.
nothing more to say. really stop these "looks good" comments when it's clearly crap and never going to be released anyway.


The fundamental problem is that game design is something very different from hacking. Someone good at finding and reversing the correct function is not necessarly good at making games. And someone good at making good gameplay often cannot implement his ideas because he is not that good at hacking. Working in groups helps but groups tend to have motivation problems.

[Bombah!]

Ok, ok.
First: It sounds like you are jealous of Zel. I could be totally wrong (and I really think I´m wrong), but you sound jealous...

But now to the things I want to say:
I´ve never liked G/S/C. I don´t know why (honestly, I don´t know why...), but I almost hate them.

But it´s deffenitly not the graphic, because my favorite is Red!

And to Shiny Gold: I´ve played a beta, I liked it, but my oppinion was: Was that all?
I think too that it´s overrated. But hey, I heard from almost everyone in this whole forum that G/S/C are the best. So of course SG is very popular.
But one of the best way to show that your hack is good and that you are serious about it is: Finish it.
I´m not so long in this forum, but I´ve never seen a hack finished.
I´ve seen so many threads and Hacks die. Pokémon Eclipse for example. (If it´s still made, let me know)

But there´s one thing I want to know CBM (I´m just curious): What do you think about Fakemon?

That´s all for now,
Bombah!

[AntiRellik]

I am so right with you Coolboyman.
I got back to hackign like 3 weeks ago and I find myself with all this... Totally unfair.
Hacks back when Mewthree Inc was still alive and I was all day hacking or programming while chatting with Mewthree were the good times. GBA and GBC hacks were treated equally.
Sure, Shiny Gold is one of the best hacks I've played, but its totally overrated. There have been like what...? hundeds of GSC Remakes? I was making a Silver remake myself long ago but I decided to leave the project because it was pure boring... nobody would play your remake if someone else's is better.
Shiny Gold is a great hack, but it's nothing original. It's just transfering from GBC to Advance... NOTHING ORIGINAL.
And this is getting contagious... All pokemon hacking boards of hispanic speech MOSTLY care about GRAPHICS, and here's where the problematic is born.
Pokemon ShinyGold, Naranja, Omega, Crystal Shards, etc... Are mostly from Whack A Hack (WAH) and all there speak spanish... and most of the hispanic speech community care most about graphics, hell I'm even speak spanish myself. I'm not blaming them all for this problematic on this board... But the problem is born there because of all the n00bs in this board complaining and whining that 'insert name here' should have won or that they are the best because they look good.
And sure, Zel makes ShinyGold... ya'll like ZEL PWNZ, yeah he's great we have to admit it... But he's not the best.
But this is the most important part....
Do you think Zel is making ShinyGold 100% by himself?
How about other great hacks arround here? Are they all made by one creator? Here's the answer:
NO!
Then theres the "ShinyGold! help thread" so duh...
There are a few great hacks here, but there are a lot of people that support it, yet have put their hands into the hack by being able to support from a piece of text to a whole script or sprite.
Coolboyman is so right... I agree 100% with him... I guess me and you guys still have this opinion...
I miss having Mewthree hacking arround here haha, I use another name now ;) But sure I know you guys (coolboyman, pyro, fonzy matt, mew3,etc)
I wonder what happened with Interdpth....
Anyway, I agree totally with CBM... Most of the people here should give a chance to other hacks.
Looks like lately a lot of people only care about Graphics... But I grow bored if a hack has no good playability or originality.
I played Shiny Gold, Crystal Shards.... they're great hacks, they have nice graphics and scripts well done... but honestly, I got bored of them.
Why? Because I have played Silver and Crystal a thousand times, from my old GameBoy Color to even the REW emulator back when GBA didn't even exist...
It's just the same old games taken to advance. No originality whatsoever... but this is my opinion though. I don't hate the hacks or anything, I consider these great "ports" of Gold and Crystal.
Remakes are overrated... bunch of n00bs supporting ShinyGold because it's "bringing Johto back to life" and because of this and that... blah blah blah.
Just give other hacks a chance...
And remember, don't just scream "Zel is the best" or "'insert creator name here' is the best", because I'm 100% sure they haven't done the whole hack by themselves... and by the way, Pokemon Naranja has a Dark Lugia sprite on the intro... which was made by me and Mewthree and was modified without any permission... in other words, stolen. I haven't even received a reply from Sergio either. Just an example that these great hacks aren't being worked by one person alone, And these hacks are well done because their creators sit in front of the computer and hack paciently. Others that can't make a **** of a hack are lazy, and there is no other answer to justify why the hack sucks or why you can't think anything out of the box.
I'm back to hacking, But I don't have much motivation to start hacking again since so much morons caring about graphics only.
GFX isn't my strong point, so it doesn't motivate me to make a hack because it won't have great graphix....... -_-'
Though music is my strong point.
But ya'll happy with these remakes... it's until Pokemon ... and .... go out ;) Can't reveal names... or info, it's secret :P
But these are going to be real remakes... Gold based on FR, and Silver based in LG... and not even working with the tools we all use, they're being worked on a disassembly. Oh, and BTW, they're being worked since FireRed and LeafGreen first went out. So imagine the years that have passed ;)
Now these two ARE going to be true remakes, and these just don't include just graphics and scripts... it also has newly inserted music. New MIDIS of the old GBC music revived... And with proper instruments. And this is what I consider true effort. The creator learning assembly to understand music 100%
Because GBA music isn't just MIDIs... they are assemblies, and it's very complicated creating a voicegroup for each newly inserted midi.
GOOD hackers... and I mean the really GOOD ones, work mostly by themselves.
Sure I can make the best hack in the whole world... 100% guaranted it'll be the best in the whole world... that's if... I get Mewthree and D-Trogh sprite me some Graphics, get Kawa and Xiros to make me some scripts, My neighbor to do me some maps, my mom inserting the graphics, my dad can also do mapping, pay 50 thousand dollars to Nintendo programers to program me some new music and just need myself to give orders and set the hack a name...
IMO, it doesn't make much sense to be like... "AntiRellik pwnz" for making "Pokemon Glowing Peanut Version" when I actually didn't do a thing.

So, to make it short, just read here:
Give other hacks a chance, treat them equally, before voting please look at the hack in a smarter way... Did the creator do it all by himself? did he put much effort or did he just get lazy and gave the job to others to do it for him? Does it have graphics but no great maps? Maybe great maps and gfx but no scripts? Maybe just mapping done? or nice scripts but maps using incorrect tiles?
Don't say hacks suck because it doesn't have awesome graphics or anything, or not play them. Give every hack a chance, you might be supporting ShinyGold and saying that this hack and Zel are the best, but you are also supporting others to put their eyes away from your OWN hack and start looking at others that are considered far better, When something like this happens to you, it'll be when you'll get ticked.

I've got nothing else to say... But this board just doesn't motivate me much for hacking.

[Zodeon]

So, your annoyed because people look at advance hacks and prefer them to older generation hacks.

I think thats kind of stupid, taking no ones side I believe that Graphics are a very important factor in a game, so it's only natrual that somethingthat looks better to someones eye makes them feel better.

As for remakes. Well whats the point. Who soever makes a remake is an idiot, as they have little creativity and next to no originality.

Thats my outlook.

[AntiRellik]

^And they even copy the text from the old games... yet less originality or creativity since they just copy it all exactly.
Though Graphics are important factor in a game, It is not fair to judge a game only because of it's graphics.
And this works for every game out there... but In my opinion playability is the better part.
And sure, it depends on what your doing... it has to have respectable graphics if the game is goign to be slow-mo like Pokemon GBC and GBA, instead, you don't need total perfection graphics in a Sonic game for example, because its more about speed and you'll be focused on the fast-action rather than in the graphics.
Hell Sonic games go freaking fast and have pretty visuals... but if you check it out the graphics aren't steady perfect. Graphics depends on what the game is going to be like. On these hacks we all create, graphics IS an important factor, but there is no sentence being able to justify that they should only be judged by the GFX.
There are also other factors here... Scripts, Tracks, Playability...

[Skeetendo, Inc.]

"AntiRellik pwnz" for making "Pokemon Glowing Peanut Version" when I actually didn't do a thing.

Pokémon: Glowing Peanut Version FTW.

I do miss the good old days though like you mentioned :(

[SerenadeDS]

I've got a lot I want to say here about this topic.. but ranting even is boring to me. Haha...

First off, I love you CBM. Whoo, that's been said a lot in this thread. But it's ture.. I treat all hacks with respect. And hey, I may even treat a GBC hack more, becuase of the "Tools" issues. I get with what your getting at Coolboyman, you've said eveything I would to say. I really don't want to get into the issues of shiny gold and such.. but there is some things I would like to go over..

I really starting to despise the new generation of hackerz. There morals also suck. ""Ohh.. I didn't know u could hackz Insert Game Here! Show me ze tools u use!" OMFG.. are you serious? Why can't you guys get over the fact that YOU DON"T NEED TOOLS TO MAKE A GREAT GAME. This is probley what pisses me off the most. It's kinda degrating really. I mean, Coolboyman and SerenadeDS have been hacking for a LONG time. I may not be as old as him, but I did start hacking early. Back then, was there many tools to use? Nope, there wasn't. Things that we've slaved over our computers to learn how to-do, tools are just popping out of nor-where and doing that. Sure, tools do help. Hell, I am even creating my own Map program for Pokemon Red & Blue. [No, It is for personal use ;)]

The point, is I hate n00bs who want to take the easy way. I've been hacking since 2001 and just to see progress in tools is amazing. I love Advance Map! But it makes it just that much easier for some n00b to change some maps and think he "iz da master hackorz." That's Bull****

But whatever.. I hope you don't quite your projects Coolboyman. I support you all the way. People should be thankfull that their even getting a chance to play great hacks such as Prism. Too me, it's a breath of fresh air compared to the crappy hacks which should be just given up on. And you know what hacks I am talking about.

For about 2 weeks now, I've been working on my hack. It is a Pokemon Blue hack. I don't really give a S*** if you don't like them. As for Coolboyman, I guess that is just the way people are, caring about graphics is what they like. But you can't stop a great project just because of some n00bs who don't know anything. I can bet you 50 bucks that they don't have life either and they just sit in front of there computer annoying the hell out of people.

I've done just about enough talking. I wish I could talk to you in person or IM you CMB. There is so much I could talk about right now, but I bet half of you people won't even read this. Ohh.. that gets me to another point. People need to read more, instead of asking stupid questions to get there post count up and crap..

BLAH.. That is my opinion on this subject. @ CMB: What you do is your choice, but just remember what I said, because there is some people like me who will enjoy your hacks and suppot you. I could rant about this on and on, but that's about enough here.. Great Hacks come from great people with a brain and Hex Editor! XD

[AntiRellik]

^ Agree with you too!
You don't need tools to hack... You just need an hex editor ;) but Tools are really useful :D so I use em' LOL :P
I've been since 2001 too :P I was in DL Translations at first, then Mew3 Inc... then I was at both XD Mew3 Inc and the Helmeted Rodent.
Good times... Though I left hacking arround early or mid 2005 :P now I'm back.
And it's all diyin' XDD

[Kristian]

Guys..This topic issnt about tools, or how long u've been hacking..
its about treating all hacks equally..
let's not get off-topic here.. please..

[Νιτραμ]

And who are you to mini-mod? O_o

I absolutely agree about equality... It would be better if the approval system was less benevolent. There wouldn't be too much low-quality GBA hacks which would be preffered over VERY HIGH QUALITY GBC hacks. I posted a thread about it, waiting for approval.

[Νιτραμ]

You cannot say that you would do magic with GBC palette, so shh. I like even GBC graphics, they can be sometimes more appealing than some crappy custom GBA tiles. So what? Graphics aren't real problem. Nothing concerning hacking GBC is REAL problem. The problem is in people.

[+Sneasel™]

well, i agree with you!

1. About the graphics, yes, many people (n00bs or not) care too much about them. Everytime i've seen a hack without a tile change in the screenies, at least 60 comments are made about it.

2. Yes, Shiny Gold is over rated, its a true statement. That doesn't mean its bad though, its the fans' fault (as you have said).

3. I understand how you feel, i love prism, that beta was *amazing*, but there weren't that many people who liked it cause of the G-word. Get a life people! He added in so much stuff (he even had to change the initial game code!) that no hack can possibly match it.

4. Your right too, zel's hack is not original except for a few extra rivals/hoenn pokemon events. But, the reason people like it so much is that everyone liked G/S/C, but they hated the graphics, so this is like the perfect game to them.

5. GBA/GBC hacks need to be treated as equils!!!!

6. There are too many people trying to copy zel, he's the only one who is doing it *right*, all the other ones stink, as they think if they just re-map the place it will be one. I won't list names though, but its pretty obvious which hacks i'm talking about.

[Jesse[TB Pro]]

Ah CBM!
Thanks man!
Ok I'm gonna tell it how it is:

Well first off,
Zel's a good guy and all right?
His hack's not too shabby right?
Well I think all those n00bs should just understand that Zel's not a God!
And that Shiny Gold's not the All-Wonderful Hack they think it is.
I mean no disrespect to Zel!

Now,
I think your hack is marvelous(even though I never posted)!
I think G/S/C hacks are just as good as Advance Gen hacks!
Sure the graphics aren't the greatist,
But who cares?

I also believe that all hackers deserve praise for taking the time to hack it!
No matter what Gen it is!
I really hope these Ideas get implemented!

[Cartmic]

^ Agree with you too!
You don't need tools to hack... You just need an hex editor ;) but Tools are really useful :D so I use em' LOL :P
I've been since 2001 too :P I was in DL Translations at first, then Mew3 Inc... then I was at both XD Mew3 Inc and the Helmeted Rodent.
Good times... Though I left hacking arround early or mid 2005 :P now I'm back.
And it's all diyin' XDD

Wow all all these people appearing from the old days.

I got into the emulation scene in 2001 playing pokemon hacks such as Pokemon OIA, Revolutions, and Generations, I did my first bit of hacking in 2002 with Pokemap, Thingy32, and Mr.ClicksTileED.

And man DL Translations!(they inspired me into hacking Crystal with Pokemon Trainers, and the one where you could get Lugia, I ended making a hack where you lived as a camel), I remember them as well as BG, ER, Coloseum etc.

Iv always been Cartmic/MA Translations, did you have a different ID back then? or do you wish not to let people know?

[AntiRellik]

Well I think all those n00bs should just understand that Zel's not a God!
And that Shiny Gold's not the All-Wonderful Hack they think it is.
I mean no disrespect to Zel!



The same I say. I have never talked to Zel so I have no right to say anything about him, I've played his hack though. But some people really need to put down their attitude of just paying attention to ShinyGold and they could start looking at other hacks.
ShinyGold is a great hack, but it's not the best in the whole world...
Soon you all shall see some teasers of a great remake of Gold and Silver, which HUGE ammount of effort has been put to it.
I think every hack out there is great, if they have put good effort to it, being GBC or Advance games...

Edit: OMG O_o Cartmic
holy... long time no see
remember me? I was the Flame Warz moderator in the Mew3 Inc forum LOL
Scixzor haha
you surely remember me don't ya? XD

[Synyster_Lili]

yo CBM, you've inspired me to work on a hack, one that PC has never seen, just like your GBC games. I like the fact that you and your hacks are unique and you stand for what you beleive in, it's people like you which seperate the noobz from the pro's. To be honest, I'd rather play a decently hacked GBC game with a great story line, like prism or cry of celeby etc, than a game that's been remade more times than micheal jackson's had plastic surgery. The way I see it is that ROM hacking is becoming extremely popular, with all these new noobish hackers, all they really seem to do is start a hack with nice tiles, get everybody hyped up, then leave us high an dry, because they get bored or some "incident" happens with their rom. I agree shiny gold is overated the people only like it because it's an advanced remake of a classic.
Now guys, I don't hate zel, I don't even hate shiny gold, I'm a fan of his hack, but the truth has to be said it's not exactly the most original of games now is it?

In my personal opinion, a group of hackers should enroll in some sort of team, and just help out the dedicated people, I'd rather spend some time teaching someone who is on the edge of doing something great, than sit around watching some noob talk about how graphics suck...

good luck man, I respect everything you do, I really do
I'll release my hack soon dude, In respect to you standing up.
To be honest I wasn't gonna release my hack here knowing all of the "pointless critism" that I would get, by pointess I mean things that don't effect a ROMS performance or story..but more into the look of the graphics..
I wish you the best:D

[destinedjagold]

CBM.., I always thought you were an aggresive type of person, yet a very understanding one... :\

The new members were amazed by graphics and so they tend to hack, but never the less they understood the true meaning of hacking, which only you understood the best.

I think expert hackers who likes your hack is better than newbies who likes your hack, except if they're motivated to be like you who's really an expert in hacking. If you know what I mean...

I didn't post in your thread 'cause all my questions are answered already in there...
Oh well... Just try to be more calm and be more open-minded and just close your mind if those annoying comments pops-out.

We've been there, right? We could just simply report those posts... =3
Just cheer up, for I don't want you to leave (and hope that will never happen)...

Thanks for the time to read my post. <)

[Cartmic]

Edit: OMG O_o Cartmic
holy... long time no see
remember me? I was the Flame Warz moderator in the Mew3 Inc forum LOL
Scixzor haha
you surely remember me don't ya? XD

Oh wow man!
Long time no see, infact its been about 2 and half years.

I'll take this to PM/MSN as not to clutter up this thread.

[Coolboyman]

'eh, I'm more calmed down now. I was really tired of always hearing "Zel" "Zel" "Zel" "Zel" "Zel" "Zel" "Zel" "Zel" "Zel" "Zel" "Zel" "Zel" "Zel" "Zel" "Zel" "Zel" "Zel" "Zel" "Zel" "Zel" "Zel" "Zel" and "Shiny Gold" "Shiny Gold" "Shiny Gold" "Shiny Gold" "Shiny Gold" "Shiny Gold" "Shiny Gold" "Shiny Gold" "Shiny Gold" "Shiny Gold" "Shiny Gold" "Shiny Gold" "Shiny Gold" "Shiny Gold" "Shiny Gold" "Shiny Gold" "Shiny Gold" "Shiny Gold" over and over again, while all other hacks don't even get 10% of the popularity of it. However, some people on this board think I'm just saying Zel sucks, when they didn't even read everything.

We still need to have changes made to this forum, so all hacks have a fair amount of exposure based on the QUALITY of it. I still think my "Hack of the Week" idea is a good idea, and I'm eager to hear others.

Honestly, I've felt this way about the board for a while, but I kept it to myself. I really couldn't take it anymore and finally had to tell the world how this forum in my eyes, is failing. This is the most popular Pokemon Hacking Forum on the web, and we should make sure that one hack does not hog the spotlight all the time. This forum is supposed to be about a huge variety of hacks, not just one hack. I really like playing other peoples hacks, even newbies when they're trying something new, but didn't quite execute it well. Everyone has to start somewhere, and shouldn't be passed and forgotten because "it's not Shiny Gold".

Thanks for making me feel better everyone, but this is not just about Prism, this is about all the unique hacks on this site that have been forgotten, just laying dead on page 9. I believe if these got more support, there would be a better chance that the author would work on it. Why would you put a lot of hard work into something if nobody cared?

[waynes world]

Those are the people that only look at the screenshots and just reply

They dont bother reading the new features or everything else

Seriously,will they have fun just because of better graphics and no new features

And why do people want to change the past now,Prism is the winner and now they hate the winner,that is so childish,its like if shiny gold doesnt have another chance

Prism is a very good hack and so is shiny gold.

But when Prism won,people just thought that''shiny gold should win'' and never tried out prism

They prefer Graphics over gameplay

[Kid nino]

'eh, I'm more calmed down now. I was really tired of always hearing "Zel" "Zel" "Zel" "Zel" "Zel" "Zel" "Zel" "Zel" "Zel" "Zel" "Zel" "Zel" "Zel" "Zel" "Zel" "Zel" "Zel" "Zel" "Zel" "Zel" "Zel" "Zel" and "Shiny Gold" "Shiny Gold" "Shiny Gold" "Shiny Gold" "Shiny Gold" "Shiny Gold" "Shiny Gold" "Shiny Gold" "Shiny Gold" "Shiny Gold" "Shiny Gold" "Shiny Gold" "Shiny Gold" "Shiny Gold" "Shiny Gold" "Shiny Gold" "Shiny Gold" "Shiny Gold" over and over again, while all other hacks don't even get 10% of the popularity of it. However, some people on this board think I'm just saying Zel sucks, when they didn't even read everything.

We still need to have changes made to this forum, so all hacks have a fair amount of exposure based on the QUALITY of it. I still think my "Hack of the Week" idea is a good idea, and I'm eager to hear others.

Honestly, I've felt this way about the board for a while, but I kept it to myself. I really couldn't take it anymore and finally had to tell the world how this forum in my eyes, is failing. This is the most popular Pokemon Hacking Forum on the web, and we should make sure that one hack does not hog the spotlight all the time. This forum is supposed to be about a huge variety of hacks, not just one hack. I really like playing other peoples hacks, even newbies when they're trying something new, but didn't quite execute it well. Everyone has to start somewhere, and shouldn't be passed and forgotten because "it's not Shiny Gold".

Thanks for making me feel better everyone, but this is not just about Prism, this is about all the unique hacks on this site that have been forgotten, just laying dead on page 9. I believe if these got more support, there would be a better chance that the author would work on it. Why would you put a lot of hard work into something if nobody cared?

Ok, I hope you dont get ticked off at me for saying some of this stuff because I have nothing against you and hopefully you dont have anything against me.

So, first of all your right you have a kick (Censor) game. Its one of the better ones out there and without a doubt better than mine. I know for a fact that compared to you, baro, zel, serigo and some others I shouldnt even bother trying. Though, you guys are people I basically look up too though this was a blow in my faith in you.

I agree though that people who go games suck because the graphics arent the most high tech in the world suck. For example Rune Scape. Just an example of a non-pokemon game. Plus, as you mentioned before how there is discrimination with gold and the advance games. Now, let me continue before you think im talking about bull (censor).

You and other gold hackers you are a dying breed. There are becoming less and less gold hackers everyday. So, there isnt much to compare too. So, when people see a gold hack they think. Oh, well this hack sucks since there isnt any "cool" things in it. Now, when people see all the noob advance hacks they see the good ones and think. that is so cool.

Now, im done. Hopefully, I didnt hurt anyone and no one hates me now. :)

Also, maybe there could be the consitution of hacks. :O

[Virtual Chatot]

CBM, I agree with you that GameBoy Hacks should be treated the same way as GBA Hacks. But the sad truth is that when we can hack Pokemon Diamond and Pearl, GBA hackers will be shot into the same situation as us old GBC hackers are in. ( Yes I am an old GBC hacker, I was just never on this forum when I did my hacking )

Another reality is that the common noob is going to go and support the most supported thread, before even playing the hack themselves. I am completely disgusted by the fact that people are complaining that Pokemon Prism received First Place at the HoTY.

I think that we need a GBC hacking revival or something, or else nothing is going to change the minds of these morons who get on here to complain about something, and they themselves not knowing the amount of time Hackers put into their hacks.

Now don't get me wrong, I am a GBA hacker myself, and I am completely in support of Pokemon Shiny Gold. But I also want equality among both sides.

[SMGamer]

This is what I'll say, don't judge a book by its cover.

[zel 2.0]

I dont really have too much to say about this topic, just one thing: lets not forget that everyones' goals should be to finish our projects (and I want to think we all share the same goal), and on my 20 years I have learned that life is not quite fair, unfortunately (I hate you life >.<)

I'm really not sure if discussing about it will make anything change, hope it will but, meh, I'm not sure. I may be wrong but it sounds to me as if it were something like "I dont want Nintendo to keep selling their games because people like them more, and that's not fair and it ruins us - Sony" kind of statement? (doubt Nintendo'll stop selling games and Sony'll stop making them, anyway XP)
Sure, I also want GBC hacking to be some more popular (you'll always see me actively posting at the GBC hacks, as long as they call my attention, same for GBA hacks), but that would depend on each person's point of view, so I (or any of us) cant do anything about it. Maybe if there were more people with enough brains to hack GBC and bring good GBC hacks like Prism and Plasma Red/Cobalt Blue, I think the story could change around here...

But, please, dont confuse the things with the MotM and a fan club, 'cause the first one usually involves people not used to the rom hacking scene, and since I'm a little out of the hacking threads, I may be a bit more known. It doesnt mean that much to me, really, dont bother about it. And the fan club is there just because I want to make some more friends and talk to them (and I clearly state SG's talk is forbidden XD), I doubt there's anything wrong in that, is it? ;P

Well, I also hope this doesn't turn out into a zel vs Coolboyman or Shiny Gold vs Prism thread, as you said (in the end, I wouldn't bother about it because there are really more important things to worry about in our life than arguing about Pokemon hacks... *plop*)

Anyway, hope your motivation comes back, dude. Or I'll start stalking you and helping you to search around to find it ;)

[Kid nino]

CBM, I agree with you that GameBoy Hacks should be treated the same way as GBA Hacks. But the sad truth is that when we can hack Pokemon Diamond and Pearl, GBA hackers will be shot into the same situation as us old GBC hackers are in. ( Yes I am an old GBC hacker, I was just never on this forum when I did my hacking )

Another reality is that the common noob is going to go and support the most supported thread, before even playing the hack themselves. I am completely disgusted by the fact that people are complaining that Pokemon Prism received First Place at the HoTY.

I think that we need a GBC hacking revival or something, or else nothing is going to change the minds of these morons who get on here to complain about something, and they themselves not knowing the amount of time Hackers put into their hacks.

Now don't get me wrong, I am a GBA hacker myself, and I am completely in support of Pokemon Shiny Gold. But I also want equality among both sides.
Thats mod phycology. What I bolded.
How about creating the "GBC+GBA Alliance"

Just remembered some other GREAT gbc hackers.
Blazichu, and cooley

[Scorp Con]

Sorry Zel, but I agree with Coolboyman, about your hack and other G/S/C remakes... Ok, from I'll to what Coolboyman says *o*

[thethethethe]

CBM, I agree with you that GameBoy Hacks should be treated the same way as GBA Hacks. But the sad truth is that when we can hack Pokemon Diamond and Pearl, GBA hackers will be shot into the same situation as us old GBC hackers are in. ( Yes I am an old GBC hacker, I was just never on this forum when I did my hacking )

This is the best paragraph written by anyone this thread. That was what I was going to say.

A lot of the hacking section of this site knows, Shiny Gold gets too much attention, but I don't see why that matters. If you're going to quit a hack because you don't have a big popularity base straight away, don't even bother hacking. Maybe it's just me, but I try to only look at my hacks thread every couple of days, just so that I don't have to get distracted by it and how many people posted in it, or are people looking at it? I used to get really upset if people weren't looking at it, but I guess I just don't care about that as much anymore, I'd just rather just work on it. So sorry, but I just don't see the point you're trying to make on that subject.

An on the topic of inequality between GBC and GBA hacks, 3 of the hacks in the top 10 in last years HoTY, were GBC hacks. I don't think it's that they're treated unfairly, it's that they're just isn't enough of them or enough tutorials on them. The only really useful ones I know of is Tauwasser Scripting Compendium and Cooley's Scripting Tutorial which explains simple messages and movements(I think). Maybe CBM, you should write up some tutorials on the GBC Generation or even the GB Generation(Which I want to learn, I've just never found the time) just to draw attention from newer hackers to these generations, so that they don't end up, unfortunately, dying out.

I guess that's all I have to say about this thread.

[Al Sadiyat]

What do I want?
1. I WANT GAMEBOY COLOR AND ADVANCE HACKS TO ALL BE TREATED EQUALLY, is that so much to ask?!


Maybe you are seeing things too much from the perspective of a hacker, not a gamer like most of the people in the forum.
Unless they are a retro gamer they don't want to feel like they are playing in the past, that's all there is to it I think - no need to sweat.

[Νιτραμ]

Seeing how did it turn ino a productive discussion, it makes me happy.

Though, I say, it would be more equal (GBC and GBA) if there weren't that much N00B hacks around. Newbie hack and N00B hack are two completely different things, and it seems that they make no difference here. I posted a thread where I criticised the system and still, it doesn't appear. Way too bad. To ignore criticsm and just let n00b hacks flow, it isn't a good way...

[AntiRellik]

Maybe you are seeing things too much from the perspective of a hacker, not a gamer like most of the people in the forum.
Unless they are a retro gamer they don't want to feel like they are playing in the past, that's all there is to it I think - no need to sweat.

But in this board, every hacker is a gamer.
Looking it from the hacker or gamer perspective... you should still give a chance to other things. Specially as a gamer... where does the word come from?
From playing games... if your just going to play one alone, it doesn't make you a gamer in my opinion.

BTW, I'm really glad this thread didn't turn into a flame war. XD

[Al Sadiyat]

Sorry, I was referring to mainstream and hardcore gamers.
Play games by yourself though? That's why there are PC games to have many people!

[Blazichu]

I totally 100% agree with you CBM. GB/GBC hacks are getting way less attention then GBA hacks even, but that has been happening for probably about 2 years now or even longer. You notice many of the older generation hackers are doing alot of work with hex and many GBA hackers (not all) rely on tools 24/7. We are doing hard work and not get any notification at all. I feel our hacks are not getting the respect we deserve for our work and effort, most of our ideas are much better then some others, most of the GBC hacks tend to have great ideas.

We might be winning this battle, but we are not winning the war, the war being we deserve more respect. Hopefully people take that into consideration.

I also might be a GBC hacker, but I do know alot more about hacking GBA then some other hackers.

[Cirnos Servant]

I was automatically attracted to this thread by it's title.

I have alot of things to say, first of all is basically what you mentioned in my own words. People only like GBA games because of their graphics, and by graphics I mean tiles and maps, though I don't beleive a good hack is a hack with good graphics and storyline, a nice hack would be something with new features, or amazing gameplay. What I mean by this is have the gameplay look like it is something completely new, add new events and so on. Because it's like what someone said to me in tennis, you could run as much as you want but if you cant hit it properly you cant play. In this situation, you could have the best maps or the best tiles, but if you don't have good events, it's plain and bad.

Another point is new things in a hack, if you look at gold hacks you see they completely change things and add features that weren't there before, what we need to do for GBA is look into the game and see if we can alter it, such as have a picture show up when you click on somethings that takes up the whole screen, something new, something not done before. Because currently people are expecting others to do it for them. If you want to become a good scripter, you get scripts from games and you experiment to see what certain things do. Am I right?

I would say more, but my arms hurting from my fitness training, so thats all ;)

[BerserkPaladin]

HELL YEA! I totally agree with you coolboyman! People are only judging on these two factors...

Graphics

and...

POPULARITY!

not...

Storyline...

Thats right "popularity". Youtube made him "popular", and the forums started to fill up (my prediction anyway). People watched his Previews, and other Vids done by other YouTubians. They came here to download the PATCH, thats all! Nothing else, just a PATCH.

Now you on the other hand... I gotta say, the hack is amazinally challenging despite the graphics, well no DUH it's a G/S/C hack, not GBA! I love to play crystal, Even if you continously play it over and over again and again, you never get bored of it. It's because of it's good planned storyline.

You just gotta show the Community that hacks aren't just about preety new tilesets, or hi-tech colours, its about the STORYLINE and how much you can do to a G/S/C game without Advance-Map or Advance-Text.

EDIT: I just wanted to add this, and i agree with Blazichu, us GBA hackers realy too much on tools. how do you think that Gamefreak themself scripted the game, by HEX. Irish Witch destroyed HEX EDITING by bringing in POKESCRIPT.

How do you think that they made the tilesets, by some very complicated program. All that we have to do is go to paint, make our tile, plug it in to the map and... done! We got an entirley new map.

The colours, HEX.
Items, HEX
Trainers, HEX

Really, any program you have came from people with experiences in coding, GBA hackers should thank them.
Thats all i got to say.

_______________________________________________________________________
TIME'S HAVE CHANGED! BUT THE CLASSICS NEVER WILL!

[Argent Crusader]

Good thread, I have to say.

I agree partially with CBM. GBC hacks can be the same good than the GBA hacks, but, unfortunately, they never will be like GBA hacks.
Ok, there's the problem, technology advances, and you have to go with it. Why Nintendo don't keep releasing old GBC games, but they release NDS games? Simply, people want better games, and, in most people oppinion, that mean graphics, sadly.
I even have some friends that don't play Pokémon because of it's crappy graphics. These people are really on PS3, XBox 360, and Wii, rather than consoles that have the biggest games of all, like SNES.
This problem is simply because the technology keeps advancing, and the people with him. Seriously, what you would think if you see an old chariot wandering in the streets of NYC?
I don't saying that Prism is bad, because IT IS NOT. It's even better that many, many GBA hacks. I mean, this game have stuff that whas not on the original games. Doing that on a GBA hack will be instantly a success. We have to recognize in the technical aspect, that this hack really deserves the Hack of the Year.
Also, when the people of StudioPokemon tried to change the Hack of the Year, I just respected and supported the choice of the judges, despite the fact that Zel is like my best friend on Hacking.
Really CMB, if you choice is to keep in the old games, we'll respect that, but you have to carry up the cosecuences, before you start the GBC hack you always have to think what will be the people's reaction.
Also, I don't know if I'm right, but this thread also have something against the GSC Remakes.
It's thuth that we don't need more than one remake, but, maybe you wonder why the people do new remakes, if Shiny Gold already exist. Simply because weren't happy enough with that, I mean, Shiny Gold have many stuff that aren't really like Nintendo does. I, per example, do my stuff in a Nintendo-like fashion, I realease my remake with a trully FRLG style. Also my original games come up in two versions, like Nintendo does.
After all, do the stuff in your own way is the first reason why the people start a hack, both Remakes and Originals.

So, something that we have to do is improve a little bit the respect. We have to respect other people's choices, but, as well, we have to have our own oppinions about the games we play.

That's all I gonna say. Greetings CBM.

[Shiny_link]

coolboyman, no offense here but these are my thoughts alright.
I think you should get over your self your a very good hacker, Ive been here almost 3 years Im still a noob I still make crappy hacks and yeah I have finished 1 yet. I cant script I can barely map. and your having a cry because your excellent hack is being called old because we live in 2 new gens guess what diamond and pearl are out now too, and guess what when people start hacking them, advance is going to get "old" and if you hack them instead of diamond yes people are going to prefer diamond hacks. Dude have a cry make a hack your still getting rewards you can still hack just get on with it

[Da Man]

I'm a bit perplexed at what I read in this topic.
I'm not one of those bad guys Coolboyman since I enjoyed Shiny Gold and the other hacks I tried here. Heck I even liked Brown and Prism to be honest.

My advice to all you hackers out there is to take your time and don't fall for anyone who say nothing but tell you to "hurry up i wanna play this hack cause I can't wait" or that kind of ramble.

Lots of people are so impatient these days >: (.

[Alistair]

Wow, a very nice read, and a very excellent point, CBM. I fully agree that GBC hacks can be just as good as GBA hacks. I mean, Prism is absolutely amazing, and I never post in your thread out of respect (I am a noob when it comes to GBC hacking, though I am trying to learn assembly). GBC hacks should be treated just the same as GBA hacks. Just because the systems are a little older, that doesn't mean that they are bad. Even though I started a Gold hack a while ago, I mainly quit out of ignorance (it was my first ever hack), and that was a bad choice on my part. Anyway, Just because GBC hacks have more dated systems compared to newer ROMs, they are still good, and sometimes even more stable than the GBA ones. And the graphics can look good, too. It really depends on how they are used. I mean, many new hacks have some good graphics, but they look terrible (because of the way they are used). About the music, many people still play NES games, right? Well, why can't people still hack GBC ROMs? Now, I remember playing Brown just after I found the wonders of emulation about 5 years ago, and I loved it. I still love it, and I still play it, over many of the GBA hacks that are around. So, just because a hack is really old, that doesn't mean it isn't good.

By the way, I also noticed that someone said something about Pokémon Generations. That was another GB hack I liked, from the changed HP bar, to the fact that you could start out with a Dratini and avoid Veridian Forest. Another hack I remember was Pokémon Forest (once again, a GB hack). Mainly a map hack, but it is still fun.

[Νιτραμ]

@Shiny_link: I don't think nationality has to do anything with this thread. You should be more careful when writing. The bit about racism was really bad. And your disrespect is pretty disgusting...

@others but Shiny_link:
Guys, seems like we won't change this situation. Mainly because now no one of noobs cares about quality of their either hacks or posts, as we could have seen. I hope it will get better with the time... Euquality 4EVA xD NOw really, this needs to be further discussed.

Cheers!

[Skeetendo, Inc.]

well i think he should be happy that he can hack thats all. Also my English is like this cause I'm Australian, and your called a racist cause we all talk this...


I'm sorry but I really really have to point this out.

Do not blame your poor grammar on your Australian background.

I know lots of people from Australia and they have very excellent grammar, much MUCH better grammar than you have. You just have bad grammar. Period.

ANYWAYS, back on subject, I really like CBM's idea about HOTW (Hack of the Week). This could give some other hacks a chance to be seen and known!

I know I can hack but not everyone can get Hack of the Year which he has received and he's complaining about noobs saying make a advanced hack. Like everyone else has said just ignore them, its been like that since the beginning. There will always be at least 1 person thats going to say your wrong, don't let them stop you. Ever hear about Einstein? People said he would never accomplish anything in his life but he did, didn't he?

Oh please!

The man is trying to make, and has made, a very valid point. You're pretty much what he is talking about.

[Thrace]

Wow, this is really sad. You are supposed to be 19 and yet you're acting like a kid. Seriously, grow up. If the only reason you are making Prism is to get views and replies and to be famous then that is really pathetic. I'm pretty sure Zel didn't make ShinyGold so that he could become famous. I too believe that ShinyGold is overrated (I know it's been said a lot but it has to be said to make this post objective). A lot of hacks, that are mostly tile changes do get a lot of attention and I'm sure that annoys a lot of people but they don't have a cry about it and abuse other members. This is insulting to the people who already support you. I definitely won't be supporting Prism anymore.

[Νιτραμ]

Insult, anyone? - -'

dshayabusa, please stop blaming on CBM cause of stating his opinion. I know, he should act a bit more politely, but overall he's right, and that's why the most people here support his ideas and him as a person.

I agree with the HOTW thing, I even remember it being here. And ROM Hackers Weekly newsletter. Seems like the mountain is not coming to us, so why don't WE come to it? Let's make some commitee to choose weekly one hack that looks really promising, and let someone write some newsletter pointing out interesting hack and summarize events on this board. I can do at least the newsletter. Seems like mods don't have time, so we should do it by ourselves!

[Thrace]

Insult, anyone? - -'

dshayabusa, please stop blaming on CBM cause of stating his opinion. I know, he should act a bit more politely, but overall he's right, and that's why the most people here support his ideas and him as a person.

I agree with the HOTW thing, I even remember it being here. And ROM Hackers Weekly newsletter. Seems like the mountain is not coming to us, so why don't WE come to it? Let's make some committee to choose weekly one hack that looks really promising, and let someone write some newsletter pointing out interesting hack and summarize events on this board. I can do at least the newsletter. Seems like mods don't have time, so we should do it by ourselves!

Yes, it is insulting. He's basically saying that Zel's supporters are better than his supporters. 'Stating his opinion'? Yes he certainly likes to 'state his opinion' a lot doesn't he? Not just in his own threads but in other peoples threads too. How is calling people idiots constructive? Isn't one of his problems that people make posts like "Hey this looks good" which aren't constructive. Just look at his thread title and subtitle:

All my motivation is gone, and this board needs to change NOW.
But you don't care, do you? Nope, because nobody does.

How childish is that?

EDIT: I also agree with HOTW or at least HOTM.

[SSJ4 Furatman]

But you don't care, do you? Nope, because nobody does.

This place is beginning to depress the hell out of me, and I'm simply sick of it. Tons of one sided opinionated people who can't think outside of the box. Just why am I sad and not motivated? Let's go back (which you don't care about so you can play through johto 60 million more times on the countless remakes like the bias idiot you are.)

I have been often criticized with "OMG dEW ADVeNCE CUZ GOLD IS OLD", and even though people don't always say it, it sure as hell shows when all gameboy color hacks have less replies than advance hacks. WHY i ask, WHY is it such a god damn torture to LOOK at something that was based off a game made 8 years ago instead of 5? I'm SICK of this garbage, cant for once you people get your head out of your asses and actually realize that the game is not based on graphics, but how much time and effort has been put into it? How about I show you a picture of a hairy mans ass, WILL YOU LIKE IT BECAUSE IT HAS BETTER GRAPHICS THAN POKEMON GOLD, OR EVEN POKEMON RUBY? Probably basing it on your guys logic. I have all sorts of graphics I can show you if you want.

Sure I tolerated it, but lets go to December when I won hack of the year. Everyone was going crazy, everyone thought my hack didn't deserve to win, yet Shiny Gold should win. Shiny gold and Zel ALWAYS gets more attention that the other 10 runner ups combined. Why couldn't you all just let someone else win for ONCE? And I see people STILL posting about it on the Shiny Gold Topic ("OMG Shiony Gold shuld win cuz it a remake of Gold and Gold hacks are bad bla bla bla") and other juvenile ****. This was flat out insulting, and I was not motivated to work on this hack anymore if I was going to be treated like this (which once again, I had no control over the outcome what so ever!). However, I had a date set anyway so I decided just to get it done.

Even when I win Hack of the Year, I still get less attention that other Gameboy Advance hacks, this wouldn't be a problem really, except when I honestly look at SOME of them (I'm not saying names) are poor hacks, and they getting more attention than me and the other great Gameboy Color hacks just because of its graphic quality, what does this tell me? It tells me people don't care about how much hard work people put in hacks. All they care about is a good picture.

And Zel heads you better turn away now before reading this paragraph. Zel is a good guy, I've talked to him a few times, but I simply believe his hack is OVERRATED. That's right, Shiny Gold is OVERRATED. Sure, its a good hack, but one hacker looking at it, IT IS NOT THE BEST. And no, Prism is not the best either, so don't go there. The reason I believe so many people like it is because he's taking an already great game and making it advance, and thats more popular than all the other hacks on this site. Plus, the "MOTM" was just insulting to me and other hackers. Zel getting 13 votes while the next runner up gets 3? Zel is a good hacker,BUT HE IS NOT THE BEST. Did these people even PLAY other hacks before voting? That was just a complete joke and insult to hackers everywhere. Hell, I'm not even the best.

A REMAKE IS MORE POPULAR THAN ALL THE OTHER ORIGINAL HACKS BASED OFF NOTHING BUT THE AUTHORS IMAGINATION.

What's more insulting to me about this scenario, he's basing it off of Pokemon Gold, and people are treating it as Gold wasn't a good enough game and Zel was "making it better" by transferring everything to an advance game and adding a few things of his own. Was the original Gold THAT BAD?

Do the graphics make your eyes bleed? Does the music make your ears bleed too? WHAT IS THE PROBLEM? I've also noticed so many things could be done better (like what the hell are invisible items doing as solid objects) and I can go on and on, and I believe Zel does his best. But it is NOT that good. Plus his statement "Brining Johto Back to Life" just pisses me off to no end.

Plus, theres these kids like Garfield or whatever making remakes just because they want to be as popular as Zel. Anyone can get instantly popular now by taking Nintendo's ideas from one game and putting it in another. It's not original, its called transferring. Also, when people state this out, they go "OMG NO WE HAVE ORIGINAL THINGS", minor things like a new rival or a new city or something, but it doesn't matter because overall, it's still the same damn game as before!

This is why remakes upset me, people should NOT be getting praised (except shiny Gold because he does it RIGHT, but not as much as he is getting now) by taking regions from one game and moving them to another. ANYONE can do that if they had enough time on their hands. You don't have to use your imagination or make your own ideas (besides maybe a new rival or minor stuff that you find after 6 hours of playing, big whoop), you just have to move everything from one game to another. The main problem is people are way to accepting of these remakes. We only need ONE remake of Gold, that's right, ONE remake. And no, not silver or crystal since technically they're the same damn games with minor differences.

What do I want?
1. I WANT GAMEBOY COLOR AND ADVANCE HACKS TO ALL BE TREATED EQUALLY, is that so much to ask?!
2. I want original ideas to be respected more, not stay dead lying on the 5th page while 5 Gold/Silver remakes hog the first page.
3. I want people to be honest of what they think of hacks. Don't just say "oh its good keep up the good work", because you're afraid you'll hurt the authors feelings if you say something bad about it. I even accepted it on my own hack (besides the "make advance" statement), and if I can take it from my own hack, you all should be able to do it to.

And whats the future for Prism? I don't know, but I'm really not motivated to work on it due to the conditions currently in place in this board.

I want judgement to be fair for not just me, but everyone on this forum.

-Waits for some retards to reply "Omg how dare u insult shiny gold it da best hax in da unioverse"-

Your right, I can't stand the fact that even though there are many other very promising hacks, like yours... People only seem to come here for Shiny Gold [No Offense Zel], just like you I felt good about making my hack with tons of new ideas but as of Late December I lost interest in making the hack since only the 3 same people would reply to it.

Hell I lost my interest in Pokémon till a few days ago. I'm still trying to learn Hex and Scripting, I found PokéScript too Damn hard to work with.

That's all I have to say right now.

[Coolboyman]

looks like both of you didn't even read the post before replying, well done.

dshayabusa: Look, if I wanted to do something just to be popular I'd change my name to kill0matic and rap about killing people, cars, bling bling, girls, the ghetto, and money and I'd be world famous in a few months. Obviously I'm making Prism because I think people will like it. I posted my views and experiences here because I wanted people to better understand the situation several hackers are in. Not just GBC, but GBA hacks being ignored because they don't have the best graphics or something shallow. It isn't fair to anybody.

Some guy: I started Project Pokemon Bronze in 2004, back when GBC hacks were just as popular as GBA hacks. And no, it's not fair that people are always turning to better hacks. I've considered once moving Prism to Ruby, but it just didn't work at all. Plus all my hard work would have to be reset, just so kiddies could look at 16-bit graphics THAT I DIDNT EVEN MAKE!

Shiny_link: No it's not always been this way. In 2004, they were accepted along side Gold hacks, but as time went by Gold hacks began to be frowned upon, and its only getting worse, and I want this to change anyway possible.

By the way, I'm not canceling Prism, I just need a little more of a break.

[Souless]

But you don't care, do you? Nope, because nobody does [...] Waits for some retards to reply "Omg how dare u insult shiny gold it da best hax in da unioverse"-

Ok, I took all the text there to avoid posting a long quote and a short reply :P

Well, I have to say something here:

ShinyGold is not a popular hack because it is a "Gold" version with graphic improvement, it's because it was something everyone wanted to see.

Take a look around the forums and you will see a lot of threads dedicated to say how people wanted "An upgraded Gold version, just like it happened with Red and Blue versions [Being those FireRed and LeafGreen]"

zel (not a capitalized "Z" I think) has done a great job remaking a Gold version, with all the classic features we wanted to see (maybe, except for the PokeGear) and still, dedicating 3rd Gen possibilities to give a little boost to the game.

If anyone before zel had done a GSC hack so close to being a remake it would be as popular as ShinyGold is now.

I'm not saying it's "da best hax in da unioverse", I'm just saying that he brought to us something we all wanted to see.

Now, for your oppinion on how 2nd and 1st gen don't get the attention they deserve, now is a 3rd gen era, where almost everyone will pay more attention to new things, and the same thing will happen when new tools are created to hack DP, and then 4th gen hacks will get more attention and 3rd and below will get a little more ignored, its like a natural order of things.

I started Project Pokemon Bronze in 2004, back when GBC hacks were just as popular as GBA hacks

You see?

That's a reply to one of Coolboyman oppinions.

Now for the other one, about people that think older games are like "duh" read this.

(I took a look at Coolboyman's hack before writing this) "It looks really good, the inclusion of new types is great, altough I didn't saw a mention on attacks that would be changed onto those types, maybe you could change some moves inte those types like splash [what's that for after all], or trying to find some attacks like Tail Whip and Leer that are almost the same thing and change one of them, it would really improve your game, keep up!"

I wrote that in like two minutes of thinking, was that so hard? I don't think so. When replying to a thread try to put intelligence in your post, not just go there to randomly boost your postcount, and [For the worlds sake] appreciate things for what they are, don't make them bigger or lesser in importance because one came before the other and vice versa.

Even if you can't force yourself to liking 2nd gen hacks, just don't disregard them just because you think 3rd gen is "dah best thing since corn flakes".

That's just my oppinion, if people who read this think I'm wrong, I will just accept it and life with it, because that would be someone else's oppinion.

[AntiRellik]

Well... something is true.
When Diamond and Pearl hacking start to get more used arround here, GBA hacks will be left in the dark just like GBC are being left up today...
Another important factor arround here is that hacking these games get easier by generation.
Thought it would be great if all gens can keep up with eachother... It's hard, but possible.
It's the same thing with cars...
A 1995 Honda Civic EX isn't going to keep up against a 2008 Honda Civic Si, unless it's tuned. (If you know what i'm talking about you'll get my point ;))

[GunSaberSeraph]

i know things may seem hopeless now CBM, but don't think that your hacks never made an impact on anyone.

a few weeks ago, when i first downloaded ShinyGold, i thought it was very good, and i wanted to make a hack just like it, but...
as i kept playing through the game, various thoughts kept flying in my head. " oh, you could never create something this good"
"nothing as good as Zel's" "look what he's done with johto..."
and i belived myself until one day i looked at your Prism thread and decided to download the patch. i didn't expect too much of it since it was a gold hack, but when i started playing it on vba, i was awestruck. Prism took everything that g/s/c had and completly remodled it. a different starter, new music (the battle music that plays at night is my favorite), a new region, even new types...

at first i was silly enough to think that hacks like ShinyGold were " bringing johto back to life" but that wasn't true. when i was playing through Prism all the memories i had with the g/s/c generation kept flooding back to me. nothing concerning new graphics or or capturing 3rd genration pokemon came to my mind at all. The region i was in may have been Naljo but if anything Prism was "bringing johto back to life" to me.

i finally felt like it was very possible to do a hack myself. and now i'm making one with a new region in firered called Pokemon Radiant Sun. and looking forward to see it to the end. sure even after i'm finished people will be too busy talking about ShinyGold and all that jazz, but i'm sure when zel's final beta is finished, people will start complaining about how it doesn't bring anything new to the table. because in the end the only people who could ever make a true g/s/c remake is Nintendo.

so, we should stop adding so much hype to various remakes and do hacks representing our own vision of a pokemon game. don't worry, CBM if noobs say things like " Prism is nice, but a gba hack version would be better." you don't need a "Glimmering Prism" to showcase why you love hacking so much. just a good clean Rom, a hex editor, and one heck of a good vision in mind.

[Luck]

Well i hardly care about graphics.
I care about the story, difficulty of the game, and the controls.
Some people care solely on graphics.
Oh well its just from a different point of view.
And besides the classic games are almost always better.
Ex.Final fantasy VII and Final fantasy XII
Final fantasy 12 is okay and all but i don't understand how the game works.
So... classic games ftw!

[MR. MR. MR. ATOM.]

How about I show you a picture of a hairy mans ass, WILL YOU LIKE IT BECAUSE IT HAS BETTER GRAPHICS THAN POKEMON GOLD, OR EVEN POKEMON RUBY?

No. (I don't even see how this statement makes sense.)

but lets go to December when I won hack of the year. Everyone was going crazy, everyone thought my hack didn't deserve to win, yet Shiny Gold should win. Shiny gold and Zel ALWAYS gets more attention that the other 10 runner ups combined.

Why do you care?

Plus his statement "Brining Johto Back to Life" just pisses me off to no end.

Your jealous of Zel. REALLY JEALOUS. I think you should stop worrying about what people think and do your own thing.

Anyone can get instantly popular now by taking Nintendo's ideas from one game and putting it in another.

You think this is a popularity contest? You're 19 years old, start acting like it.

1. I WANT GAMEBOY COLOR AND ADVANCE HACKS TO ALL BE TREATED EQUALLY, is that so much to ask?!

Who said they weren't? You're the one differentiating one from the other.


Honestly, it's just a pokemon game, no need to fight about it. GBC, GBA, what difference does it make? Just learn to like both and grow up.

[Virtual Chatot]

Who said they weren't? You're the one differentiating one from the other.

Honestly, it's just a pokemon game, no need to fight about it. GBC, GBA, what difference does it make? Just learn to like both and grow up.

Listen Man, do you even know how much time and energy these people put into their work? It's not just a Pokemon Game, its their project that they've molded with their two hands ever since they first uploaded it into advancemap.

The difference is that GBC has always been looked down upon ever since GBA came out, and that left hundreds of GBC hackers in the dust. Which is a terrible, terrible, thing that happened.

Sadly, arguments like these will be continued as long as people are hacking and technology is getting better.

[Skeetendo, Inc.]

Who said they weren't? You're the one differentiating one from the other.

You should seriously lurk the hack section more.

[Luck]

Yes would you be angry if someone got 1st place instead of you just because something looked better?

[Virtual Chatot]

Yes would you be angry if someone got 1st place instead of you just because something looked better?

Prism made first place, Shiny gold hit second...

[Ripper]

Just a few things...

I agree with lots of you points... but there are a couple which are amost completely wrong... I really don't see the point in badmouthing someone just because of the praise they get, it just makes you sound jealous/bitter (which I assume you are not). Also, although lots of people enjoy your hack, the graphics do let it down (wait!). Are you prevented from doing some of the scripts in Advance Games which you can do in colour? Because, even you, i'm sure, can accept that Advance Graphics are better than colour. Although you may have put far more time and imaginaion into it, the graphics WILL put lots of people off. Is there a reason why you can't create Prism on a FireRed rom (scripting problems etc.) because, otherwise, there is absolutely no point in doing a GS games as the graphics are worse than an advanced game. I'm sorry if this upsets you at all, as this is just my opinion, but, when you think about it, would you rather marry a beautiful women with exactly the same attributes as an ugly women, or the ugly women (if that makes sense).

Also, SG is a great game because of what happens in it. Zel still needs to create the scripts, he doesn't just export thm from a G/S rom. Would you rather play G with bad graphics, or G with good graphics?

[Virtual Chatot]

Just a few things...

I agree with lots of you points... but there are a couple which are amost completely wrong... I really don't see the point in badmouthing someone just because of the praise they get, it just makes you sound jealous/bitter (which I assume you are not). Also, although lots of people enjoy your hack, the graphics do let it down (wait!). Are you prevented from doing some of the scripts in Advance Games which you can do in colour? Because, even you, i'm sure, can accept that Advance Graphics are better than colour. Although you may have put far more time and imaginaion into it, the graphics WILL put lots of people off. Is there a reason why you can't create Prism on a FireRed rom (scripting problems etc.) because, otherwise, there is absolutely no point in doing a GS games as the graphics are worse than an advanced game. I'm sorry if this upsets you at all, as this is just my opinion, but, when you think about it, would you rather marry a beautiful women with exactly the same attributes as an ugly women, or the ugly women (if that makes sense).

Also, SG is a great game because of what happens in it. Zel still needs to create the scripts, he doesn't just export thm from a G/S rom. Would you rather play G with bad graphics, or G with good graphics?

You have to understand the CBM feels like GBC hackers are being looked down upon. When people complain that a GBC beats a GBA hack, it just proves that people really don't respect hackers at all.

I know I talk alot about respect when it comes to discussions like these, but it just makes me so sad when there is conflict between hackers who are just wanting to have fun doing what they love.

[Ripper]

^ I completely understand where he's coming from, but I, along with lots of other people out there would rather play and advanced hack due to the graphics, it's somethoing you just have to accept...

[Coolboyman]

"stuff"


You have no idea what this is about...

[PlasticPokeball]

Okay, a few things.

All in all, I agree with you, Coolboyman. GBC hacks aren't getting attention like the GBA hacks. They should be regarded as equally. I am new here (quite new actually) and yes, the first thing I saw when I looked in the ROM hacks was Shiny Gold, and its loyal supporters. And coincidently, I have started playing Shiny Gold like an hour before reading this thread. I have yet to play Prism, but I have seen the threads and it looks promising. And before I move on to my next paragraph, I want to say great job Coolboyman. It is obvious that you put a lot of effort and care into your hack and you shouldn't take any of the following personally.

Now, I'm sorry but, I have to rant against you. Both GBC and GBA have great potential, but to better explain my opinion I have to use some kind of analogy. Like someone before mentioned with the Honda analogy, GBC is old. It's like an old person. GBA is new, like a young person. Both can be great, don't get me wrong, but let's face it, a young person has a hell of a lot more potential than an old person. Plus, anyone would rather look at a young person than an old person. BUT! This doesn't mean that ALL old people are worse than young people. I'm sure you have already thought of a few real live examples of people you know to better understand my analogy. But come on, let's face it, people will chose a young person over an old person any day. They are more appealing and have a greater potential, but unfortunately very few fulfill their potential, which allows room for older people who have. Some hacks are better than others, regardless of their system. So you can't say that ALL GBC hacks deserve the same glory as ALL GBA hacks, or that ALL GBA hacks deserve the same glory as ALL GBC hacks. It is just whether one is better than the other. So it is unfortunate that most people automatically skip to GBA without looking at GBC.

The tools used for hacking advance games are simple. Very simple. Which greatly increases the number of people trying to hack the games. Which, unfortunately, increases the amount of simple people creating very poorly made hacks as well. So, yes. A lot of GBA hacks are very poorly made and it is unfair that they receive better feedback, just because they are advanced.

Last thing, although you have a good point, you should never glorify your game and trash another. Ever. As dshayabusa mentioned, it is childish and pathetic. And just looking at this thread gave me a bad impression of Prism, because the creator, gave a bad impression of himself. You don't have to like me. I'm just telling you the facts. Although I am still going to try Prism regardless.

One more thing somebody mentioned before, you did not answer. What do you think of Fakemon?

EDIT: I had to skip a few posts due to the number of pages, plus I really needed to state my opinion, but I just read Mr. Atom's post. And you probably will hate me for this, but he's right. This isn't a popularity contest. And you are treating it too much so. Plus, you really need to stop thinking about what others think, because it seems like you are taking all of this too personally.

[Mrchewy]

While I think Pokémon Prism is a very good hack, I don't agree with this topic at all. Yelling at people and telling them what they should and shouldn't like is, as mentioned earlier, childish. Some GBC hacks are not getting the credit they deserve, yes, but yelling to the community and making an uproar won't change that.

What you seem to have trouble realising is the fact that graphics DO play an important role in people's opinions of games. If the community wants high quality graphics, it doesn't make them stupid or shallow. You honestly have to be ignorant if you think that a game with great gameplay and poor graphics will be more popular then a game with average gameplay and great graphics.

In short, quit yelling at us and telling us what we should and shouldn't like. We don't have to treat GBC or GBA hacks more equally then each other, and we have a right to dismiss a game because of it's graphics.

[Coolboyman]

One more thing somebody mentioned before, you did not answer. What do you think of Fakemon?

EDIT: I had to skip a few posts due to the number of pages, plus I really needed to state my opinion, but I just read Mr. Atom's post. And you probably will hate me for this, but he's right. This isn't a popularity contest. And you are treating it too much so. Plus, you really need to stop thinking about what others think, because it seems like you are taking all of this too personally.

Well obviously it's a popularity contest if people are willing to play Shiny Gold over everything just because of it's popularity. You people don't understand, I'm not TRYING to be more popular than Shiny Gold, I'm using this as an example that other hackers may relate to. I'm trying to make it so not only GBC hacks are respected the same, yet GBA hacks are all given the same chance at fame as Shiny Gold has, and basing it on its quality.

You honestly have to be ignorant if you think that a game with great gameplay and poor graphics will be more popular then a game with average gameplay and great graphics.

In short, quit yelling at us and telling us what we should and shouldn't like. We don't have to treat GBC or GBA hacks more equally then each other, and we have a right to dismiss a game because of it's graphics.

I'm asking you all to give all hacks a try before judging. The problem is people aren't PLAYING the hacks before deciding which one is the best. Lots of Shiny Gold fans just play Shiny Gold and automatically assume its the best hack without playing anything else. It's 100% cool if your favorite hack is Shiny Gold, and your favorite author is Zel, but make sure you've played other hacks first before judging.

If this topic gets any more uglier, I think I'm going to have ask someone to close it. I really want this to be productive, so I'll change the first post to a more calm tone.

[Νιτραμ]

We all know that GBA=GBC equality is same dream as reaching communism in China xD

Really. It will never be equal, but when people think, it can be better. We can do many thinks to draw attention to other hacks. You can see my example, the ROM hacking newsletter. I already had some complaints about SG not included, but think about it. It's way more popual than all other hacks so it doesn't need a newsletter for any popularity boost.

[Coolboyman]

Yeah I full understand it won't be 100% equal, but we all have to do our part to help GBC hacks, and all unique hacks.

[AntiRellik]

Red and Fire Red are basically the same game.
But it's obvious I'd play Fire Red... Why? it has some stuff that got twisted, and because the graphics are MUCH newer and have pretty visuals instead of playing a whole poorly colored screen...
That is obvious...
and i'd obviously play a well made Remake of GSC rather than the original ones (that is, if they are as well made as FireRed and LeafGreen, which ShinyGold isn't that much perfect of a remake)
Now if its Hack Vs. Hack... GBC VS GBA, Though It's better to play something which doesn't hurt your eyes XD a good made GBC hack is awesome as a GBA hack.
I'm always going to preffer playing a GBA hack over a GBC hack because the visuals of GBA makes me more comfortable while playing but a good made GBC hack with a well built pallete just suits me perfect.
I think here we got another point of why GBC is being left behind... Comfortability of the visuals.

[Νιτραμ]

Red and Fire Red are basically the same game.
But it's obvious I'd play Fire Red... Why? it has some stuff that got twisted, and because the graphics are MUCH newer and have pretty visuals instead of playing a whole poorly colored screen...
That is obvious...
and i'd obviously play a well made Remake of GSC rather than the original ones (that is, if they are as well made as FireRed and LeafGreen, which ShinyGold isn't that much perfect of a remake)
Now if its Hack Vs. Hack... GBC VS GBA, Though It's better to play something which doesn't hurt your eyes XD a good made GBC hack is awesome as a GBA hack.
I'm always going to preffer playing a GBA hack over a GBC hack because the visuals of GBA makes me more comfortable while playing but a good made GBC hack with a well built pallete just suits me perfect.
I think here we got another point of why GBC is being left behind... Comfortability of the visuals.


That was one of the best posts that have been made here.

Yes, we need to live with it. Even I made a little map-hack of Gold when I was younger, but it was jsut for fun and so. I think that there isn't much more to be discussed, cause it will go just round and round the same topic. Anyway, wishing you good luck and once more, congrats to the pinned hack CBM, and congrats to the Featured poster AntiRellik. Your post shows that your mini-award was well-deserved.

[liuyanghejerry]

It tooks me 10 min to read it...
Ok,I'd say ,all the hacks I've played was not good as I thought,In my view,you should just make some thing hacks,or you want or people want,that's all.Don't make this discussions forever,it's no use.

[Apple Inc.]

I completely agree that Gold Hacks can be as good or even better than an advance hack. Seeing Prism There were a lot of unique features that probably could not have been implemented into an Advanced hack. If you want to see Rijon in an Advance format, play RijonAdventures. There is nothing wrong with that. However in case you haven't noticed with Coolboyman's series. It is just like Nintendo's a game for GB with one region, a game for GBC with a new region and a return to the previous region with a new story, and a remake of the GB game for the GBA. CBM works his butt off on making Prism's awesome features. And people are saying its not a good hack simply because of what Rom he is using for a base.

[Cirnos Servant]

I'm going to put another say on this, I don't want to name anyone that caused me to post this because that would be a bit mean.

I've been looking at some hacks that have really bored me, hacks we're the creator cares more about their thread looking good and having heaps of posts rather than hacking there game and just updating. Though, there are two threads that caught the top of my head, because they never actually reply to posts, they post an update and get back to work. They are CrystalShards and Frozen Pearl. Though there are more these are the main ones I like, Kike-Scott and Lex only post with updates, if anyone noticed that. ALOT of people sound serious but really aren't, and this is what I HATE MOST about hacking, i'm actually getting bored of this board because of people wanting to do everything for them. I beleive before anyone starts to hack, they practice mapping, learn to script, and insert tiles or other graphics. It's very easy with the new tools. No one has ever thought about it, but what about Gold/Silver and Red/Blue hackers? Anyone noticed, no scripting tools eh? They use HEX, one of the most best tools ever created. With HEX you can do anything, but people don't take the time to learn it. Now, what about those good hacks? ShinyGold? Legend of Dragons? Ever thought about how much time and effort they put into this hack? Take a think about this.

I've been working on a new hack for quite a while now, and REFUSE to put it on this board, becuase people care more about posting than the hack. I beleive alot of hacks on this board should be deleted, locked or removed.. Sorry if this offends anyone... The only thing that could change this board would be a new one, with all sections on thread approval, with moderators who beleive their should be a change, and who look into the hack and see if it's worthy. Even though the current moderators are doing good.

I'm sorry, but some hackers are a real disgrace to me.

Thats what I wish to say.

Edit:

Yeah I full understand it won't be 100% equal, but we all have to do our part to help GBC hacks, and all unique hacks.

This is one of the best lines i've heard so far.

[DeadlySplash]

I've not played any of the hacks here, and after I write this I will be going back to my hack (or asking for help on my hack), which is an Advanced hack btw. But I have tried hacking Pokemon Blue, and in the past I have also tried Gold and Crystal (Coolboyman, I even remember bugging you about the teleports in Pokemon Gold, then you got pissed off xD).
People who make RBYGSC hacks should really get more praise, because it's harder. There are lots of tools out there for the newer games, we can insert scripts, make new maps in the game, and the tools are actually being worked on. When's the last time Pokemap (old red/blue map editor) got an update? When do we actually see they "Add this later" bits filled in on tools for the older games? Never. People who hack the older games have to overcome these obstacles. For Advanced Generation hackers, sure it's hard, but we have the tools for it.
Just thought I'd add my bit. This is coming from someone not new to ROM hacking, but I've never actually got good at it, and I've just recently started again xD

Added bit :
Also, Crashink, I can see how annoying it must be going around seeing all these crappy hacks from people saying stuff like "Hey look! You can catch Mew outside Pallet Town now!", but I think it's good that people are getting a chance to show what they've done regardless of skill level. Sometimes they do get annoying, but if we had to meet certain requirements then we would have to spend quite a while getting hardly any criticism from people. Though I think there should be 2 hack threads : Practice, and Serious Hacks.

[mistersmeargle]

Before replying to this thread, I played a number of hacks. I played ShinyGold, Prism, Naranja and Ruby Destiny-Reign of Legends. I gave each twenty minutes of my time.

Not to offend anyone but I found Prism to be the most enjoyable and ShinyGold the least. Prism is so elaborate, I mean, he literally took the game apart and put it back together. ShinyGold was OK, but if I want to play Gold, I have it here at home.

Graphics are nice, but I truly hate the tilesets for the Advanced Generation. I just loved the simple design of the Colour and Metallic Generations. If I was able, I would completely replace the tilesets for my hack with the tilesets for Red, Red was and remains my favourite game.

ShinyGold is not 'Johto reborn' because Johto never died. I still play my Gold game regularly, I play it more than Sapphire or Emerald. Zel is a good hacker, much more skilled than me, but he didn't make ShinyGold by himself. Noobs may say ZEL PWNZZZZ!!!!!!!!111 but whoever says KIKE-SCOTT PWNZZZZ!!!!!!!!!111? Or Magnius or Macnic or Birthofdna?

Feel free to ignore this post if you want but as CBM says, we have to give attention to the games which are genually original and unique.

[Godot]

My turn to post.

CBM, I 100% agree with you. I have looked across your thread time and time again, only to see "OMG, why not make it advanced" every few pages. To those of you who posted that on CBM's thread or any other Gold hack's thread, this is my opinion of you:

YOU SUCK.
Maybe that was a little blunt. Oh well.

You have NO IDEA how much Gold Hackers put into their hacks. I hacked Gold for quite some time, only to have my computer recently delete everything I had. I put loads of work into that, and that was using TOOLS along with hex. CBM uses absolutely NO tools but Goldmap and a Hex editor. I cannot imagine how much work he put into that. Saying that you wont play a hack JUST BECAUSE IT IS NOT ADVANCE is a fricking insult to the hard work put into the hack! To CBM, it must be like a slap to the face!

It's like saying this:
Man: "I just built the barn in my backyard by myself and with my bare hands!"
You: "So what? You could have built something like a car."

Think of it that way! It has taken CBM YEARS to get as far as he is. And you're telling him to make something else. People like that absolutely DISGUST ME. That's my opinion, if you don't like it, get over it.

[Mrchewy]

What I find strange her is that you guys put your hacks up for community scrutiny and complain about not getting the attention you desired. I've said it before and I will say it again: putting your hacks here means that they will be judged (positively or negatively). Complaining about how they are judged (or the amount of people who even want to judge them, in this case) is just plain stupid.

The community doesn't need to change: YOU do. While I'm not necessarily saying that you should give up, you need to accept what the community likes and doesn't like.

[waynes world]

What I find strange her is that you guys put your hacks up for community scrutiny and complain about not getting the attention you desired. I've said it before and I will say it again: putting your hacks here means that they will be judged (positively or negatively). Complaining about how they are judged (or the amount of people who even want to judge them, in this case) is just plain stupid.

The community doesn't need to change: YOU do. While I'm not necessarily saying that you should give up, you need to accept what the community likes and doesn't like.

He wants every hack to have the same attention

Shiny Gold is getting all the attention and people just dont bother to look for other hacks.

[Mrchewy]

He wants every hack to have the same attention

Shiny Gold is getting all the attention and people just dont bother to look for other hacks.

Does that tell him anything, then? Maybe the community simply isn't interested in his (or other) hacks. Telling them what they should and shouldn't look at is silly.

[waynes world]

Does that tell him anything, then? Maybe the community simply isn't interested in his (or other) hacks. Telling them what they should and shouldn't look at is silly.

Would you like it if you made something very time consuming and people are less interested just because theres a more advanced one out there instead of one that has more features to it.

[destinedjagold]

He simply doesn't understand what a hacker's life is.
Leave him be...

[Skeetendo, Inc.]

He simply doesn't understand what a hacker's life is.
Leave him be...

Pretty much.

Mrchewy... You honestly don't know how unmotivating it is when nobody pays attention to your hack simply because another is over-rated and "advanced".

GSC can be just as advanced, features-wise and graphics-wise.

I've put FRLG graphics into GSC (Of course they are 4-bit) and if you've seen Prism, well, you know what I'm talking about with features.

Seriously, know what you're talking about before you talk. Yeah, they get judged when they are put on here, mostly by people who really don't know the effort put into some of these hacks. I'm sure more effort was put into Prism that Shiny Gold (and yeah, it won Hack of the Year but that means nothing, if the fans had it their way, Shiny Gold would have won, and you seen that after Prism won)

Nobody is really telling them what they should be looking at. He's simply saying to give GBC hacks (or other advanced hacks) at least a try before you run off going "LOLOL SHINY GOLD DA BEST!!!!!!1!!!!!11!11one". More than 35% of the members that go to the Hacks Showcase really know jack about hacking and automatically think that Advanced is better.

Haven't they heard of the saying "Never judge a book by it's cover."

There is the biggest case of this right now.

Automatically they look at a GBC hack, this is most of their reactions.
"OMG DATS GBC IT'S LKE SOO 50 YERS AGO! GTFO"

Then they see a GBA hack.
"LOL WOW DIS DA BEST, HOTY HOTY HOTY HOTY LOLOLOLOL NEW GENERATION NEW GENERATION."

Yeah I know eventually we'll all have to face the facts that kids nowadays simply disregard the old generation and get automatically hooked to the new generation, but come on, give some things a chance.

Like it was said before, once DP hacking hits the scene, GBA people will be in the same boat, doing the same thing as CBM (and others of us) are doing.

Edit: But don't get me wrong, Zel is a cool guy, and I respect him as a hacker, the only people I blame for this, is the fans who really know nothing.

[mistersmeargle]

Mr. Chewy, it's a little sad of you to assume that this thread is just a vain attempt by Coolboyman to get attention for his hack. His hack is taking years to build, he's doing everything basically from scratch, but when it does come out in its full and final version, one of the things that will comfort me (apart from the fact that Prism has finally come out in its full and final version) is that while I'm playing a revolutionary (yes, I said revolutionary) hack by an amazing hacker, you'll be drooling over pathetically planned and even more pathetically made games by people with all the imagination and skill of a peach yoghurt.

[IIMarckus]

Does that tell him anything, then? Maybe the community simply isn't interested in his (or other) hacks. Telling them what they should and shouldn't look at is silly.You know, the man has a point. After all, I don't look twice (or even once) at most Pokemon GBA hacks, because I have absolutely no interest in them. In other words, I do the same thing. If someone asked me to "give GBA hacks a chance," I'd probably ignore the guy. Who is he to tell me what to play?

Yes, there are people who outright post in threads and say "won't play because not gba," but they're morons... and we all knew that already.

[WaterSplash]

Mr. Chewy, it's a little sad of you to assume that this thread is just a vain attempt by Coolboyman to get attention for his hack. His hack is taking years to build, he's doing everything basically from scratch, but when it does come out in its full and final version, one of the things that will comfort me (apart from the fact that Prism has finally come out in its full and final version) is that while I'm playing a revolutionary (yes, I said revolutionary) hack by an amazing hacker, you'll be drooling over pathetically planned and even more pathetically made games by people with all the imagination and skill of a peach yoghurt.

Prism is the work of Coolboyman. They both have Tyranitar avatars, but in this case it is CBM. fixed.

[Mike2494]

Ok, well first of all: I am not a professional hacker who knows everything, I'm just a guy who will try to say something and I hope people will read this post:

1. GSC-GBA
Well, yes people do look at the graphics, and comment those, because that's all they see in the thread. When they see a completly new Hero, with great minisprites, they are gonna say: Wow, nice Hero! They are not able to comment on the Gameplay or Story or Scripts or whatever. I am not a huge fan of any of these two hacks(Prism, Shiny Gold) but I guess it is really clear that Shiny Gold has more attention, look at the screens and then tell me it is not nice.
GSC is not bad or anything, but true is the graphics is not as great, and it is not as easy to change sprites, for example. There is a huge amount of GSC-Remakes, but some are even older than Shiny Gold, Tutti's Eissturm was started 2006, 1 1/2 years later.

2. The purpose
I guess you got a point, when you are complaining about the sympathy towards Advance Hacks, but you started this thread AFTER the award and AFTER some guys said,that Shiny Gold should get the Award and therefor I think this whole thing is fueled by rage....what I do not think is right.

[mistersmeargle]

You know, the man has a point. After all, I don't look twice (or even once) at most Pokemon GBA hacks, because I have absolutely no interest in them. In other words, I do the same thing. If someone asked me to "give GBA hacks a chance," I'd probably ignore the guy. Who is he to tell me what to play?

Yes, there are people who outright post in threads and say "won't play because not gba," but they're morons... and we all knew that already.

He is not telling you what to play he's telling you to give them a chance. You can look at a hack and think "Y'know, this is an awesome idea, this is really, genuinely cool" without playing it.

All CBM wants is equality between all hacks, GBC, GBA and in the future NDS. It's truly sad that people are misinterpreting this as an attempt to get attention or to make out that GBC hacks are better or telling people what to play and like.

Everyone is drooling over ShinyGold and Naranja, which are great hacks, but they're very unoriginal. ShinyGold is a remake of GSC that isn't as perfect as it may seem and Naranja is based entirely off the TV show.

On the other hand Prism is completely original. The only thing it really has in common with Pokémon is the fact that it's a Pokémon game.

Ok, well first of all: I am not a professional hacker who knows everything, I'm just a guy who will try to say something and I hope people will read this post:

1. GSC-GBA
Well, yes people do look at the graphics, and comment those, because that's all they see in the thread. When they see a completly new Hero, with great minisprites, they are gonna say: Wow, nice Hero! They are not able to comment on the Gameplay or Story or Scripts or whatever. I am not a huge fan of any of these two hacks(Prism, Shiny Gold) but I guess it is really clear that Shiny Gold has more attention, look at the screens and then tell me it is not nice.
GSC is not bad or anything, but true is the graphics is not as great, and it is not as easy to change sprites, for example. There is a huge amount of GSC-Remakes, but some are even older than Shiny Gold, Tutti's Eissturm was started 2006, 1 1/2 years later.

2. The purpose
I guess you got a point, when you are complaining about the sympathy towards Advance Hacks, but you started this thread AFTER the award and AFTER some guys said,that Shiny Gold should get the Award and therefor I think this whole thing is fueled by rage....what I do not think is right.

No it's not. If it was simply fueled by rage, why would me and many others agree with them? About your comment of screens. If you judge a hack on screens then you need to realise you CAN ACTUALLY EXPERIENCE GAMEPLAY by playing a Beta. I've played Betas of Prism and Shiny Gold, as well as many other hacks. I played Shiny Gold and thought two things: 1. I've seen this before and 2. What I've seen before was better.

I played Prism and thought two things: 1. Wow, this is amazing and 2. How innovative!

You are the third person I have called sad in this thread for the simple reason that you are assuming it is fueled by rage rather than a genuine want and need to see equality between all hacks.

[Satoshi Sugimori ©]

I used to think hmm a gold hack..it must suck but since a while ago I saw how hard it is to hack gold and silver and all those other old skool games and I began to look in another way at those hacks and learned to appreciate the hacks, also what you are saying about Shiny Gold is true in some way ,not that I don't like it, but just it is just a remake and not so original , but then also Zel has done some great scripting and changes in the game, But still the remakes are a little un-inspired I still respect people ,including Zel, that work so hard and change so much I also respect people like you who make the gold hacks , although I myself look at graphics as a huge help in a game,

And now I think I wrote to much and forgot why I was posting so I'll stop typing...

O only one thing , Advance games aren't much better than Color games it has the same concept. The only thing advance games have better is some little ,mistakes, taken out and some better graphics...

Now I think I really made my point, so I am going to stop,
Greetz,

:LITTLE EDIT:
I myself still sometimes only look at graphics ,but I know that that is wrong, but it's a big temtation to do look at it like that.

[AntiRellik]

Though it pisses off when you've put lot of work on a hack and don't get any attention, let's get down to the most important point:
They are just rom hacks...
There are other important things in life than just sit your a$s in front of the computer and just HAX,HAx,HAX, lol.
I don't think none of us started rom hacking with the desire of being the most popular r0m hax0rz.
We all probably have similar reasons... I just started hacking because It'd be cool to play a game that can have things that Nintendo/GameFreak didn't build up in a Pokemon game.
ShinyGold gets a lot of attention cause its a nice remake of Gold, and Naranja (no offense, but It annoys me) because it features the Orange Islands and everything that happened in the anime happens in that game...
Work has been put to both hacks, but none are original. Specially Naranja, it's just an edited Hoenn map, no route numbers either... and It's kind of boring too.
Let's get down to a good point IMO:
-Pokemon Naranja (hack of Ruby, which IMO it's the n00b rom choice.)
--No originality... just copying and pasting everything from the anime to the rom.
--It's kind of boring, and it looks like a game that was meant to be released for 4 year old kids.
--Not even the map and routes are original, they are just modified Ruby routes. All erased and turned into water... and it's just like in the anime, Ash being all like "ZOMG PEEKACHEW!"
--The Lugia in the intro is a stolen sprite (made by me and Mewthree) which I never received reply from the "creator" of the hack.

To make it short, I just take Naranja as an example... No originality whatsoever, there are like 800 tools for ruby, I'm pretty sure the hacker of that rom didn't make everything by himself.
So, to make it even shorter, I don't think this hacker has put too much effort into Naranja. It just can't be compared to Coolboyman's Prism.

But never forget this: We all basically rom hack just to lose a bit of all the free time we have. It requires a lot of time to make a hack... if it's done good, and rom hacking isn't a job, or something like school, it's just something we do because we want. We all have to have free time in order to rom hack.
Rom hacking is just a hobby for most of us, we can use it to kill time, or to play ourselves a game that can have features or events or any other things we would of have loved to have seen in a Pokemon game.
I don't know if the rom hacking discussion should be taken so serious, but it does piss some one off when they work on their hack hard, just so n00bs drool at hacks made by a program compiled in Visual Basic. You just pop the ideas in your brain, the programs do all the work for you... and chances are you don't even know how the program works or what actual hex modifications in does inside a rom.

[Virtual Chatot]

I wonder sometimes, If someone actually completed a Rom hack, without any major glitches whatsoever, how many people would actually take the time to play it?

We ROM hackers work our asses off making these hacks, and most are never applauded for their work. People take Hackers for granted, as most Gamers are just n00bs looking to waste two hours of their life playing a beta.

[AntiRellik]

^That is the main reason why I almost never revealed too much about the hacks I've made.
Bascially, they play the hack demo by demo, learning about it screenie by screenie... learning about events line per line of scripting.
It just bores...
Thats why I preffer making my hack... and not revealing much of it.
I grow bored if I see a cool hack, and the creator post a screenshot of a Raikou event or something, and talks about what is goign to happen...
It's just like when you'd love to see a movie, and your friend starts to talk to you about it and you didn't see it yet. It just takes that... "OMG COOL" thing outta it when things happen :P

[Luck]

Look CBM just wants every game to be equal.
Hacking rbygsc is much harder than hacking fr/lg and i think that depending on how much work is put into it, it should have better ratings than the better looking ones because the hackers of rbygsc put more time into their hacks than the new hackers.They usually have a couple of helpers because they can't finish a whole game alone.
The only things that noobs can do is "test betas" and that isn't even a job!
It's just a way to get a game you really want faster.
I personally liked prism the most and shinygold the least because the graphics are btter but the story is basically the same.
CBM created this game from scratch while zel only made the same story but with improved graphics.
Some people are just too shallow when choosing a game and decide automatically whether they like the game or not.They don't even take the ime to read it and just judge a book by its cover.
Now i really think this thread should be closed soon because his will turn into a war all over the pokecommunity.Zel is losing some serious face also as well as some other people.

[Mrchewy]

Would you like it if you made something very time consuming and people are less interested just because theres a more advanced one out there instead of one that has more features to it.

Yes, I would be very frustrated and disappointed, but life goes on. If you can't admit that your project isn't popular, then you seriously have some issues.


Mr. Chewy, it's a little sad of you to assume that this thread is just a vain attempt by Coolboyman to get attention for his hack. His hack is taking years to build, he's doing everything basically from scratch, but when it does come out in its full and final version, one of the things that will comfort me (apart from the fact that Prism has finally come out in its full and final version) is that while I'm playing a revolutionary (yes, I said revolutionary) hack by an amazing hacker, you'll be drooling over pathetically planned and even more pathetically made games by people with all the imagination and skill of a peach yoghurt.

'Drooling over pathetically'? Hardly. I fully support Pokémon Prism, and can't wait until it comes out. Just because I don't agree with what the man's saying here, doesn't mean I'm a ShinyGold fanboy. I played ShinyGold for about 3 hours, had some fun, and haven't played it since. It's a good hack, but not my kind of thing. Your presumptions make you look very immature.

Everyone stop saying 'all CBM wants is equality', as if it's no big deal. None of you understand that when you put something up for public scrutiny, it's up to them whether it succeeds or fails. Many of you can't grasp the concept that, perhaps the public as a whole isn't interested in GBC hacks as much as GBA hacks. Should the entire public change their views, or should you? Why tell 90% of people on here (the public) to change their minds as opposed to changing your own minds which make up for a much smaller percentile)? Honestly, it's silly.

The public play what they want to play, treat hacks the way they want them to be treated and judge games how they want them to be judged. DEAL WITH IT.

[AntiRellik]

The public play what they want to play, treat hacks the way they want them to be treated and judge games how they want them to be judged. DEAL WITH IT

That is STUPIDITY. Because this is not a gamer community, its a rom hacking community and we come to show off our work. What we want is that GBA hacks as much as GBC hacks get the same attention and get treated equally. The thing here isn't forcing peope to view hacks they don't want to, the thing is getting both generation hacks treated equally.
You just can't force people to view a hack though...

[Mrchewy]

That is STUPIDITY. Because this is not a gamer community, its a rom hacking community and we come to show off our work. What we want is that GBA hacks as much as GBC hacks get the same attention and get treated equally. The thing here isn't forcing peope to view hacks they don't want to, the thing is getting both generation hacks treated equally.
You just can't force people to view a hack though...

I'm starting to sound like a broken record. You can't 'make' people treat them equally; they'll treat either one however they please. Gamer community or not, the same thing still applies.

[4fetter0_0]

Many of you can't grasp the concept that, perhaps the public as a whole isn't interested in GBC hacks as much as GBA hacks. Should the entire public change their views, or should you? Why tell 90% of people on here (the public) to change their minds as opposed to changing your own minds which make up for a much smaller percentile)? Honestly, it's silly.

The public play what they want to play, treat hacks the way they want them to be treated and judge games how they want them to be judged. DEAL WITH IT.
[/QUOTE]

Dude,I know what you mean but this hack has alot of work put into and people don't care about the work,all they care is about there stupid GRAPHIXS

What will happen to Shiny Gold if Nintendo remakes Gold,Now Shiny Gold goes down

The public needs to see that GBC hacks are suppose to be treated the same,I was looking at some stupid site saying that 'Shiny Gold shoulda won,Gold is easier to hack''

[Mrchewy]

Dude,I know what you mean but this hack has alot of work put into and people don't care about the work

Are you going to contribute to the discussion, or just repeat what's been said dozens of times already? We know this, it's unfortunate, but if the public aren't interested then that's it. It's no one's fault, the public aren't doing anything wrong, they just don't think GBC hacks are equal to GBA hacks.

[Teh Baro]

Well, people who hack just to be the best hax0rz and everybody lick the land they step in deserve to lose their motivation and stop hacking.
It's the fun of making a game, and the pride of getting stuff done, and well done, what we are talking about.

[mistersmeargle]

Well, people who hack just to be the best hax0rz and everybody lick the land they step in deserve to lose their motivation and stop hacking.
It's the fun of making a game, and the pride of getting stuff done, and well done, what we are talking about.

That is so very, very true.

[AntiRellik]

Well, people who hack just to be the best hax0rz and everybody lick the land they step in deserve to lose their motivation and stop hacking.
It's the fun of making a game, and the pride of getting stuff done, and well done, what we are talking about.

I agree with that... It's the fun of making a game.
Thing is that in this board things are getting a little "shallow".
It's hard to treat GBC and GBA equally, but in the rom hacking sense I think they should... I don't think they are in the same league, but they are when it comes to that "Hack of The Year".
Prism won... and some were like "ShinyGold should've won!".
GBC hacks and GBA hacks, they should be treated equally because it's made all by us rom hackers... They'll never be treated exact equal because one generation is more advanced, and the possibilities are different.
IMO, they should still be treated equal when it comes to that hack of the month, hack of the year, or whatever...

[Coolboyman]

Well, people who hack just to be the best hax0rz and everybody lick the land they step in deserve to lose their motivation and stop hacking.
It's the fun of making a game, and the pride of getting stuff done, and well done, what we are talking about.

That is completely true right there. I just feel bad for other hackers that put lots of work in it and then realize nobody cares about their project. This is more about them than it is me, and people are really missing the point in that. I used my as an example of how shallow people can be, but I know it can apply to several other hacks. My popularity isn't the problem here, other peoples are. While I appreciate the comments, this isn't mainly about me, this is about other people who are suffering from people enjoying hacks that have "Mew on the first route" more than original hacks with nothing but original ideas, and GBC hacks.

[Tentachu]

I like Gold hacks the same, if not more than Advance hacks. I'm an old-skool hacker who still uses Goldmap and programs like that because I think it's much simpler than all these new Advance tools like Elitemap (which I could never get to grips with). I just love hacking Pokémon Gold. Advance is just way too...advanced...

[Virtual Chatot]

I like Gold hacks the same, if not more than Advance hacks. I'm an old-skool hacker who still uses Goldmap and programs like that because I think it's much simpler than all these new Advance tools like Elitemap (which I could never get to grips with). I just love hacking Pokémon Gold. Advance is just way too...advanced...

I wouldn't say that, its just that Elitemap sucks xD

I will agree that hacking Gold is easier though, I don't know why though.
{ Edit } My 1000th post <3

[~Ryukaa]

Hmmmm. This thread makes me remember. When the Gameboy Advance got released and it was my birthday. I wanted a Game Boy Color but my Dad told me to get a GBA so I got it. I thought GBA was the best back then but now I realise that they are both equal ever since Prism and Brown and Cry of Celebi came out. This thread really got to me and I agree that Shiny Gold is overrated, not bad but overrated. There are too many Diamond and Pearl tilesets and CBM thought of his own.

[Tetsu]

You should never give up hope because someone outshines you. Zel is not you. Shiny Gold is not Prism. So why try to put them on the same pedastal?

I admit, older generation hacks could use more... publicity. And as well, most of the newer generation games get the first look ONLY because they have the better look. But you already know what really matters in a game: The game itself! If it wasn't for plot, music, exploration of a world not our own, and yes, even graphics, it'd just be a painting. (Ok that last part was kinda a contradiction, but go with it.)
Because you pour blood, sweat, and tears into the hack, that's what makes the game truly perfect. What do you find more important: Legions of fans who thinks a game looks pretty, or a few true-blue fans who ravish for the next update? It's up to you to keep on chugging, regardless of the world around the game, because what really matters is the world inside the game. You have the resources many hackers do not, about what goes into hacking a game: both the programming, AND the craftsmanship. As well as the potential to exceed, even if only one person truly likes the hack, at least you have one person to tell "Yup I did that. That was mine. Go Me. w00t."

Remember: The man who doesn't live up to his potential, fails every time.

...

Oops. Almost forgot to turn off the corny motivational BGM. *Click*

I look forward to seeing you continue your hack. And if you don't... Well... What's one fan, right?

[Tanro]

I know I am new and this my first post but I have been playing prism avidly for a day now. Its great, I have to say when I heard of pokemon Naranja, and Pokemon Jet Black editions thrhoug some friends and seeing the carts on ebay I was really turned off to rom hacking as they looked like pieces of crap.

But Prism is a really fun game. Its really innovative and I dont give a darn if its on the G/S/C engine. Why? Thats the best engine in my opinion. I really wish it had some of the more advanced stuff in the R/S/E/FR/LG generation like move descriptions and such. But gold had more stuff to offer than any pokemon game I have played to date. My gold cart's battery died and I picked up crystal to replace it and Love it too.

I praise you for hacking rom. Its a great game, and I am sure I will continue to play this and anyother rom hacks that bring things new to the table besides crappy looking knock off pokemon.

[AntiRellik]

I wouldn't say that, its just that Elitemap sucks xD

I will agree that hacking Gold is easier though, I don't know why though.
{ Edit } My 1000th post <3

You don't know why your talking about XD
EliteMap doesn't suck, Kawa sucked at programming it, hence why AdvanceMap is better. If someone with good programming skills/knowledge would give the EM Source Code a bump, it'd be a useful map editor. Kawa just made it everything fixed size, and glitchy.
Hacking Gold is easier mapping-wise, but it isn't that it's harder, it's more complicated and time-taking because there aren't so many tools that do all the work for you.
Hacking GSC is "harder" because you have to do a lot of things manually in an hex.

[Virtual Chatot]

You don't know why your talking about XD
EliteMap doesn't suck, Kawa sucked at programming it, hence why AdvanceMap is better. If someone with good programming skills/knowledge would give the EM Source Code a bump, it'd be a useful map editor. Kawa just made it everything fixed size, and glitchy.
Hacking Gold is easier mapping-wise, but it isn't that it's harder, it's more complicated and time-taking because there aren't so many tools that do all the work for you.
Hacking GSC is "harder" because you have to do a lot of things manually in an hex.

If the programmer sucks at programming, the program logically sucks xD

What you said made absolutely no sense.

[AntiRellik]

^The program itself is really useful, It doesn't suck.
Kawa sucked at programming it. Download the EM source code and see for yourself... See all the worthless mess he made inside that program.
Your statement of "If the programmer sucks at programming, the program logically sucks" is only valid if the programmer made the program from scratch himself.
EliteMap was created by Bouche, Kawa just made "Enhancements", hence why it sucks now, Kawa just played arround with the coding. Hell, not even Kawa made the Enhancements himself... Tauwasser and Tony (Majin BlueDragon) helped him out.
If someone would give EliteMap a good update and delete the unnecesary crap that lies inside it, it would make it much lighter, faster, and useful tool.
What I said clearly makes sense, if you'd knew what I was talking about ;)

[Aquila]

I think it's great that you go out against people that critisize you. Gold hacks are just as exciting as Advance. But iI don't think Shiny Gold/Zel is getting too much praise, cuz it's a great hack. Also, I don't think Prism is getting enough praise. But these are just my opinions. They are both great hacks!

[Booilicious]

Okay, first things first, Gold hacks obviously need more attention.

Most of the points in your post were very honest and true, and I respect everyone's opinion.

Shiny gold IS overrated. zel is a hacker who's earned his respect, but too many people praise him. Most people should realize Shiny gold isn't the best hack ever created.

I disagree with one point, though. You say that Gold hackers put more work into their hacks then advanced hackers. It's partially true. Hex is a Gold hacker's best friend, but I believe that Advanced and Gold hackers put in the same amount of work. Sure, advanced hackers have easier tools at their fingertips, but it's just to make things...well...easier.
Gold hackers put more time into completing an objectives, yes, but it doesn't mean Advanced hackers don't put time and effort into completing their objectives.

Graphics have never been an important part of hacks to me. Sure, they add an extra spice to a meal, but it's more the game play that matters.

Also another point I don't agree with...that remakes aren't original. Of course, their remakes. But it doesn't mean there aren't spots of originality in the hack. I don't want to sound like a Shiny gold fanboy, 'cause I'm not...it's a nice hack, but it's not my favorite...but zel has some original ideas in Shiny gold.

These are just my opinions though.
CBM, you have inspired me. Thank you.

And about the HoTY idea...I think it could mess up a bit. We'd have a lot of repeated hacks...but yeah, it's a good idea.

Ciao~

[Hat?]

Generally speaking I think most of the "oldskool" hackers make better hacks even if they are using a game engine with limited colours, like a GameBoy or GameBoy Color ROM. But that's only because they're more experienced and have gained way more knowledge over time, therefore knowing how to transfer thoughts into reality more easier.

The only people I think that have a problem with older system hacks are the ones who only grew up playing GBA/DS etc (younger people), or people who just want to play the newest consoles...

I do however think decent GBA hacks are possible/or exist, but I think it takes way more experienced well balanced hackers with ALOT of time, or hackers working together who are good at team work and have a great design.
That's because of the usual larger ROMs, because of more colours, palettes, text, code etc...

[GKS]

I understand what you are trying to say. It is the amount of work you put into games that make it better than others. I have tried both Shiny Gold and Prism (some versions) and both are great. I also see how your motivation could be lost by rude players, after all you are doing this for no money. I'm not completely innocent, i may have ignored some of the hacks that were not Advanced. Next time, i think i should look into them, just to give the author some notice for their hard work.

[EarthsVisitor]

True, I haven't made a post in awhile, but I have something to say.

Equality sounds all good.
I agree with most of what you guys are saying.

The question is...
What are you DOING about it? (Not You CBM, people in general)

Don't ***** to me, I want results!

Here's an idea to kick-start you guys.
1. Bring back the Weekly Hack Newsletter
I believe someone mentioned a Weekly Hack Thing also.

[Hat?]

yeah, the same person who posted this thread

[Haseo, the Sliver Twilight]

Here's how it goes.

I've played Shiny Gold, and it's frewanking awesome.

But does that mean it's the best? No, not really.

I just started playing Ruby Destiny yesterday, and I'm having more fun than I did with Shiny Gold.

Not that I can say that either is better but becuase I DON'T KNOW WHAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN NEXT.

It is the same experience to me as playing a new official pokemon game for the first time, and in certain areas, even better.

I sort of know the plot due to it being said in the thread on it, but other than that simple paragraph, I'm in the dark.

I like the dark.

[GKS]

Maybe the reason that Shiny Gold is pretty popular is because of how much of it's completed. Yes, it may be overrated, but Zel put a lot of work into it. There may be few new idea in the game, but it probably was hard to make it seem just like Gold version, for example, the phone system or the bug catching contest.

[Blazin]

Well, people who hack just to be the best hax0rz and everybody lick the land they step in deserve to lose their motivation and stop hacking.
It's the fun of making a game, and the pride of getting stuff done, and well done, what we are talking about.

I definately agree with Baro here. I may seem like I'm just some random noob, but I started hacking a few years ago but haven't posted on these forums much, but am always looking, so for me to reply must mean something :P

You don't hack to try and become popular on some pokemon forum do you? What a waste of time...you hack because you love doing it, and CoolBoyMan you definately should not lose motivation because a GBA game gets noticed more than yours...otherwise you should rethink why you are hacking if not for the fun of it.

I've seen and played most hacks for the last couple of years, some good, most not very good. The storyline is definately the most important part of any hack by far...so I support what your saying CoolBoyMan. But if history tells you anything it's that graphics are far more important than a storyline to the average gamer. I mean, just look simply from Pokemon Yellow to Pokemon Diamond. The storyline (I detest that it has never once changed...) has not changed since the first generation games...The only thing that's changed are the graphics.

So if Nintendo and GameFreak and whoever have been focusing on Graphics and kept the same crap storyline, it must tell you that players are more interested in graphics than storyline. I like Shiny Gold, I like Prism. And I definitely think storyline should be the first thing to sort out when starting a hack...not getting new tiles, etc etc. But as someone else has stated, when the DS games become hackable, GBA hacks will phase out, just as GBC hacks are phasing out now.

Well that's my 2 cents. :)

[IIMarckus]

Well, people who hack just to be the best hax0rz and everybody lick the land they step in deserve to lose their motivation and stop hacking.What? But that's the only reason I do it! ;_;

[Hat?]

So if Nintendo and GameFreak and whoever have been focusing on Graphics and kept the same crap storyline, it must tell you that players are more interested in graphics than storyline. I like Shiny Gold, I like Prism. And I definitely think storyline should be the first thing to sort out when starting a hack...not getting new tiles, etc etc. But as someone else has stated, when the DS games become hackable, GBA hacks will phase out, just as GBC hacks are phasing out now.


I personally like the older games better, the graphics have less colours, doesn't mean they're not good however. I've hardly played Pearl since I got it, haven't even "completed" it yet.

Also I agree with what Baro said, about trying to be the best hax0rz...

[nonemus]

One thing, although your hack is much more complex than SG, the reason which people like SG is that they wanted a GSC remake in GBA Form. I for one when kurling the board got attracted to that, for i didnt know about all the rest, but a Gold remake sounded soooo cool. Ive also played the new Beta of Prism. Its awesome, and so is Shiny Gold, except the newbies will probably be attracted to SG first, so naturally it will have more supporters.

[Epsilon]

Yes, i agree.

I played prism for a while, and i was amazed by all the new features, and the graphics even look a tiny bit better than in gold itself. But it's not that strange that better graphics appeal to people, i personally love good graphics. Because be honest, the first thing you do is when you see a new hack is look at the screenshots (at least i do) But still, gameplay is more important than gameplay, unless the graphics really suck. And you are as far as i know, the best hacker.

Cronos

[Retribution]

Well I agree and disagree.

i agree in the fact that advance hacks have and most likely will always get the higher end of the popularity but the fact is no-one can really do anything about that. I have not played prism (Not because I dont like the fact that its GBC, actually I have been playing crystal recently) but I am intrested however I disagree you are going to stop hacking for the fact you dont like the fact Shiny Gold has more attention! Ask yourself, do you hack for fun or to become "The most popular!"? I hack just simply because its fun. So if your gonna stop hacking just because another hack is more popular than yours then i can tell your doin it for the fame. besides, you dont know if zel (No offence) will quit or never finish so why give up? Besides it soon might get more popular, who knows? So dont give up ;)

[Virtual Chatot]

Well I agree and disagree.

i agree in the fact that advance hacks have and most likely will always get the higher end of the popularity but the fact is no-one can really do anything about that. I have not played prism (Not because I dont like the fact that its GBC, actually I have been playing crystal recently) but I am intrested however I disagree you are going to stop hacking for the fact you dont like the fact Shiny Gold has more attention! Ask yourself, do you hack for fun or to become "The most popular!"? I hack just simply because its fun. So if your gonna stop hacking just because another hack is more popular than yours then i can tell your doin it for the fame. besides, you dont know if zel (No offence) will quit or never finish so why give up? Besides it soon might get more popular, who knows? So dont give up ;)

He's not mad at the popularity of Shiny Gold, he's mad about the people's attitude towards GBC hacks.
Guys just let this thread die, The point has been made.

[X-Buster]

I agree w/ CBM, all ROMs should be treated equally like balanced equation or something , any way don't let Zel and his ShinyGold smash your Prism w/ his Iron Fist..! as long as that you have a heart that could hack, let it be, do what need to be done..! I admit it, I was planning to make a yellow remake and if it happened and released, I DON'T DARE TO CARE If it will be in the Hack of the month or something and also I don't care If someone rate it or it became popular, the only thing I want is to make for those who want to play it..! I don't care If they HATE it, I don't care If they LIKE it, the only thing that I care was someone could play it, even the last person on earth..!

[Liquid Shadow]

I agree with you 90%. 10% I don't because an older game will ALWAYS have less attention than a newer game. Other than that you are right. Pokemon FireRed and all those advanced games are like NOTHING compared to GSC games. I don't understand why people don't give it a chance. I don't care about graphics much, I know they are a factor in the game but what matters most is gameplay. Don't get your hopes down man, just keep doing your thing and ignore all the ranting and stuff. GSC generation was the best! Also, though I do like shiny gold I think there are many way better games like Pokemon Prism, Pokemon Ruby Destiny, and Pokemon Omega.

[Blitzballer]

Note: I will not be mentioning Zel or Shiny Gold other than the two times I just did.

The only thing that I can say (and I can't say much) is that hacking GBC is a dying art and those that do hack it should be praised for their perseverance. The problem is that when your talking about attention, your dealing with a fine line between free will and nature. People are bound to be more attracted to something newer and more graphically appealing (in their eyes...not saying GBA graphics are more appealing than GBC =X) thats just the way humans are. Who here still plays their SNES or uses their old Mac on a regular basis?? I know I don't, but thats because I'm drawn to the newer, more appealing things. Ok, I still play the original Oregon Trail But thats a different story.! I don't play Super Smash Bros. Melee anymore because I have brawl, and I don't play Pokemon Sapphire anymore because I have Pearl. I just don't.

Also there is a see-saw effect going on here. We shouldn't have to put down certain GBA hacks to boost GBC ones. Can't we just be happy with hacking?

[~Dai-kun~]

CBM you are totally right man if I could talk as much as you lol jk ok now to be serious you make excellent points..And actually its not just old games that don't get attention people to feel like looking at other stuff or doing new stuff they just want to take the easy and boring way out..I mean if you really want to be as popular as whoever you don't need to copy their ideas maybe work with them ask for ideas from them i mean come on i don't know anyone who ever just does the simplest thing but ask.."Hey there how did you do that on your hack it is impressive maybe do you think you can show me how you got ____?" Is that so hard? anyways i almost lost motivation too but hey w/e happens happens.
Bottom line is we all need to be enjoying this whole process of hacking and playing hacks while we still can who knows what will happen. And also what if Shiny Gold and Marble and Prism and other cool hacks were never there some people would probably not even come here..

[thetribemaster]

I agree but like Heatran said:
Guys the point has been made, let it die.

[jongpilyun]

CBM, I registered basically to say I totally support you on that. Baro, you too. I really appreciate all the guys who are trying different things. I honestly wonder sometimes what the point of putting so much time and effort into hacking is if you're just going to clone everybody else's work, including Nintendo's.

[DarkFear]

I'm sure this has been said many times but I can't be stuffed sifting through all the posts but as a constant reminder I say there are no tools for Gold hacking so I see no reception from the public.

But Coolboyman you've made an excellent statement and it is very true how people don't accept Gold hacks.

However I do feel that to achieve fame in Gold hacks, one must go to extreme measures and make drastic risks to actually impact the hacking scene.

I'm going off-topic now so I'll leave by saying a few more things.

Well done to Coolboyman for making this thread and standing up, no wonder you're such a respected figure in these forums.
And I also hope for people to realise the point of this thread and make changes where necessary.

Lastly thanks to anyone who actually gave a damn and read this whole post and sorry to anyone who can't understand me but I don't speak 1337.

Whoo.

[Chrona]

I'm pretty reversed, I never really cared for anything past 2nd gen (Apart from Fire/Leaf). I like ShinyGold as a hack because of what it is, Pokemon Gold. Most new hacks are just Ruby remakes with 4th gen pokemon added in or something. Well since I don't care for third and fourth, I'm just not interested in it.

Prism really took a lot of hard work to get where it currently is, and I'm actually awaiting it's completion more so than SG or any other game. Wellll, I'm also waiting for Brown 1.2, but that one will be out soon =)

[Joey the Cockroach]

I couldnt agree more with you Coolboyman.

I agree with shiny gold being overrated, but like you said, give the retro pokemon games a chance. And also, check out all the other hacks, because one may be better than you thought. could even be better than the most popular ones.

[Ninja Caterpie]

Couldn't agree more... (how many times has that been said?)
But... seriously. Finish Prism for everyone that CARES (us)
And show those graphics lovers

[BigSteve]

i honestly prefer Prism over all other hacks
changing clothes
changing sprite
original storyline that isnt a 10 year old leaving home becoming the worlds best trainer cliche
keep up the good work man!