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s0nido
January 23rd, 2009, 03:03 AM
These three religions are very closely related to one another, and they even believe in the same God and the same Prophets. But how well do we know each other? I myself am a Muslim, and I didn't know until about five years ago that as Muslims, we had to believe in Jesus as a Prophet of God, not a son of God or his reincarnate. But I still don't know much about Christianity or Judaism, and I would really like to find out about them. So, post the similarities and differences between the three religions and find out more about them.

Amachi
January 23rd, 2009, 03:24 AM
We don't believe in the same God, what are you talking about?

s0nido
January 23rd, 2009, 05:02 PM
Actually, we do, just in different ways. Christians believe in The Father,The Son and The Holy Spirit, while Muslims just believe in God alone. Jews do the same, but they believe that another prophet, whose Arabic name is Uzair, is the son of God. So we believe in the same God, but in different ways. Otherwise, we wouldn't have the same prophets. We believe in Jesus, Moses, Abraham, Jonah and all of them. So, yes, we do believe in the same God.

Zorua
January 23rd, 2009, 05:06 PM
Actually, we do, just in different ways. Christians believe in The Father,The Son and The Holy Spirit, while Muslims just believe in God alone. Jews do the same, but they believe that another prophet, whose Arabic name is Uzair, is the son of God. So we believe in the same God, but in different ways. Otherwise, we wouldn't have the same prophets. We believe in Jesus, Moses, Abraham, Jonah and all of them. So, yes, we do believe in the same God.

I'm not sure if the Egyptians and the Greeks and the Romans would have that same view, don't you think?

Haza
January 23rd, 2009, 05:09 PM
The three religions actually do have the same base and background but there are major differences and thats where Gaga got that from.

Zorua
January 23rd, 2009, 05:10 PM
The Egyptians etc believe in like thousands of gods, if you were referring to my post. They're not monotheistic, like Gaga suggested. :|

s0nido
January 23rd, 2009, 05:12 PM
I'm not sure if the Egyptians and the Greeks and the Romans would have that same view, don't you think?

Hmmm? I don't get you.

I said that we all believe in the same God, but its our idea of how to believe in God that makes us different. Like I said, we believe in the same Prophets, and God tells Muslims in the Qur'an to believe in the other books, like the Bible, the Torah and the Psalms. So, we do believe in the same God.

Amachi
January 23rd, 2009, 05:14 PM
Actually, we do, just in different ways. Christians believe in The Father,The Son and The Holy Spirit, while Muslims just believe in God alone. Jews do the same, but they believe that another prophet, whose Arabic name is Uzair, is the son of God. So we believe in the same God, but in different ways. Otherwise, we wouldn't have the same prophets. We believe in Jesus, Moses, Abraham, Jonah and all of them. So, yes, we do believe in the same God.

No we have completely different concepts of God. In fact, Islamic theology sees Christians as a polytheistic religion (the concept of the Trinity is actually pretty damn confusing) and it's believers as blasphemers.

Derrick: He's just talking about the three Semitic/Abrahamic religions.

s0nido
January 23rd, 2009, 05:14 PM
The Egyptians etc believe in like thousands of gods, if you were referring to my post. They're not monotheistic, like Gaga suggested. :|
Erm, I didn't say that. I said that Jews, Christians and Muslims believe in the same God. Egyptians didn't believe in the same God that we do now.

Zorua
January 23rd, 2009, 05:16 PM
Erm, I didn't say that. I said that Jews, Christians and Muslims believe in the same God. Egyptians didn't believe in the same God that we do now.

Oh wait..

I thought you meant EVERYONE believed in the same God. I misread your post for that. o_o;

Sorry.

s0nido
January 23rd, 2009, 05:18 PM
No we have completely different concepts of God. In fact, Islamic theology sees Christians as a polytheistic religion (the concept of the Trinity is actually pretty damn confusing) and it's believers as blasphemers.

According to the Qur'an, we think that Christians and Jews are the people of the book, meaning that they believe in one or more of the Holy Books sent from God to his prophets. The Christians still believe in God, but with partners. Same goes for Jews. And how could we not believe in the same God? Don't Jews, Christians and Muslims all believe in Abraham?

icomeanon6
January 23rd, 2009, 05:34 PM
No we have completely different concepts of God. In fact, Islamic theology sees Christians as a polytheistic religion (the concept of the Trinity is actually pretty damn confusing) and it's believers as blasphemers.

Derrick: He's just talking about the three Semitic/Abrahamic religions.
While there is disagreement between the three concerning the exact nature of God, there is no doubt that they believe in the same God. The key is Abraham, his God is the one that Judaism, Christianity, and Islam follow. In addition, all three of them consider the Old Testament, or Torah, to be sacred scripture.

Netto Azure
January 23rd, 2009, 05:44 PM
Well, yes. It's true. The sad thing is people in the US are led to believe that Islam is well to put it mildly "bad."

More people should be aware of this similarity and theological root since it means that about half of the World's population believe in the same God...=/

Angela
January 23rd, 2009, 06:23 PM
I agree with gaga, like I said in a older post all off the religions are so a like but yet so different, like Þór and Hercules, Seifur and Óðin, Urður, Verðandi og Skuld and the three witches of faith,

All religion so that the end of the world will happen, in ástrú it's called Ragnarrök, and after that life will start over, it's a circle just like in Budishm,

All these religions are so a like so there must be some truth in it, because the religion in the old days were all in different parts of the world yet they are so alike so there must be some truth.


Mount Olimpush Ásgarður, and Gaga is right there is always one prime ruler:

God, Óðin, Seifur and the others.

Amachi
January 23rd, 2009, 07:03 PM
According to the Qur'an, we think that Christians and Jews are the people of the book, meaning that they believe in one or more of the Holy Books sent from God to his prophets. The Christians still believe in God, but with partners. Same goes for Jews. And how could we not believe in the same God? Don't Jews, Christians and Muslims all believe in Abraham?
Yeah? So what if we all acknowledge Abraham? His story goes down a different path between Judaism/Christianity and Islam. Furthermore the trinity isn't that simple to be described as "God with partners" and has lead to Christianity being acknowledged by many outside the religion as polytheistic. In addition, it's pretty clear that the trinity is completely different to just one singular god.
While there is disagreement between the three concerning the exact nature of God, there is no doubt that they believe in the same God. The key is Abraham, his God is the one that Judaism, Christianity, and Islam follow. In addition, all three of them consider the Old Testament, or Torah, to be sacred scripture.
Christians are considered to be blasphemers by the other two faiths. That is more than just a disagreement.

The faiths have the same origin, similar beliefs, customs and practices due to developing in the same region and from one another, but that doesn't mean that they share the same God. That's not even relevant when you consider the differences.

~Platina's Jason~
January 23rd, 2009, 08:29 PM
We, the Christians, Jews, and Muslims do all believe on the same God. And what's this about Christianity being polytheistic? o_0. We aren't. The trinity is basically one God with three bodies if I'm remembering correctly.

Amachi
January 23rd, 2009, 08:34 PM
Christianity isn't polytheistic, I know. But it'd certainly seem that way to other religions.

Chaostorm
January 24th, 2009, 12:30 AM
Hey! To Myself im a Muslim! There is also another Religion Called Hindusim That Only in India. They Believe that theres many god. And when someone die. they burn the dead Person.

to me as a Muslim. I Believe that theres only 1 God

Dakota
January 24th, 2009, 11:16 AM
These three religions are very closely related to one another, and they even believe in the same God and the same Prophets. But how well do we know each other? I myself am a Muslim, and I didn't know until about five years ago that as Muslims, we had to believe in Jesus as a Prophet of God, not a son of God or his reincarnate. But I still don't know much about Christianity or Judaism, and I would really like to find out about them. So, post the similarities and differences between the three religions and find out more about them.

im mus;im too. i actually know all that.
prohet isa is Jesus
Amen is Ameen
As for Jews...

s0nido
January 24th, 2009, 01:48 PM
Hey, don't get flaming other religions, people. Jews have more in common with Muslims than Christians do, then again, they actually follow their religion better than Christians do. Apparently, Christians, Jews and Muslims are not allowed to eat the meat of a pig. A long time ago, Jews were being persecuted, and when they were pretending to be Christians to get out of persecution, the Christians began to eat pork to differentiate themselves from the Jews. The Jews would not eat pork.

That's why we have Christians eating pork while Muslims and Jews don't. And to answer ray's comments, we do believe that the Christians and Jews believe in God, but they associate partners with him. We still believe that you share the belief of one God, but you have different ideas of how to worship him. We never said you are polytheists, just that you made claims that God has a son.

Now, if you think that these three religions believe in different Gods, how did Christianity and Judaism get into the Qur'an? Aren't they totally different religions? I think not. They have the same roots, but the Bible, the Torah and the Psalms were changed, and parts of them were lost. And furthermore, how could all three religions have almost all the Prophets of God associated with them? Sure, Judaism rejects Jesus ad Mohammed, while Christianity rejects Mohammed, but before those two, we all share the belief of the Prophets. Also, the Prophet Abraham built the Ka'bah, the oldest mosque in the world. That must mean that he was a believer in God. And if he was the ancestor of all the Prophets to come, then they must've been believing in the same God as he did.

I think of Christianity as an 'upgrade' of Judaism. After all, Jesus was sent to the Jews to establish their religion when they were swerving to evil. And when the rest of the world began to go wrong, the Prophet Muhammad attempted to change it. He did succeed in changing the Arabs from cold-hearted barbarians to real humans with plenty of decency in their hearts.

So, Islam was esssentially an 'upgrade' to Christianity. It was brought to the world. If you were already a Christian at the time, you should've been racing to Islam. The mere similarity of the prophet Jesus (Arabic: Isa) should've had Christians converting to Islam on the double. After all, it was a change for the better.

So, I think we should begin to highlight the similarities between the three religions now.

Dakota
January 24th, 2009, 03:31 PM
Hey, don't get flaming other religions, people.

I wasnt flmaing if your asking me.
Jews cant eat pig? I didnt know that...
Even though were all connected in some way, we still happen to fight all the time.
(People in my school call Muslims Hindu! I am going to give them a piece of my mind. Racists!*Spits*)

Amachi
January 24th, 2009, 03:48 PM
Yes the consumption of pork is such a major issue >.>

Hey I know we're not polytheists, but I know well and true that you do not believe that Jesus is divine, so our beliefs are at least incompatible there. The trinity is more than just "God with partners", and since Judaism or Islam doesn't believe in a holy trinity, then our God is different.

Um yeah. Of course Christianity follows Judaism. Those who practice the faith believe that Jesus is the messiah foretold by the Jewish prophets.

So, Islam was esssentially an 'upgrade' to Christianity. It was brought to the world. If you were already a Christian at the time, you should've been racing to Islam. The mere similarity of the prophet Jesus (Arabic: Isa) should've had Christians converting to Islam on the double. After all, it was a change for the better.
See, and that's why he's included in the Koran - to draw Christians into the Islamic faith. Plus Jesus and Mohammad have incredibly different teachings.

Frankly I want to know why you're so insistent on this? Is it because you think ~if everyone is the same then we can all be friends~?

Dakota
January 24th, 2009, 03:51 PM
^To much to handle at once. >___>
Anyway, I heard (and its probably wrong) that one day, these groups will clash.
True or False?

Netto Azure
January 24th, 2009, 04:40 PM
^To much to handle at once. >___>
Anyway, I heard (and its probably wrong) that one day, these groups will clash.
True or False?

Aren't they clashing now? Didn't they clash during the Crusades? These wars between the Abrahamic religions has been going on for a long time...

As For the Trinity. It was only the Council of Nicaea which reconciled the various Christian beliefs under Emperor Constantine who established it. If you check out things before the Council of Nicaea, Christianities belief's was very diverse. =/

Yes Christianity would appear as polytheistic, but Christians would argue that the Trinity is the same God of Islam and Judaism. As for the reason, I still can't understand. I don't have the time to research.D=

s0nido
January 24th, 2009, 08:03 PM
They will clash, actually. There will be a final all-out clash between Islam and the rest of the world. One of the signs of the Day of Judgment (http://www.inter-islam.org/faith/Majorsigns.html). The Day of Judgment is the day when everyone will be judged for what they have done on Earth, according to Islamic teachings. Forewarnings of the day are known as signs.

Reminiscing
January 24th, 2009, 09:50 PM
I'm a Christian, we don't believe in the same God, we have different Gods

s0nido
January 25th, 2009, 02:16 AM
I'm a Christian, we don't believe in the same God, we have different Gods

We do. How could we have the same prophets if we didn't have the same God? How could Christianity be mentioned in the Qur'an along with the Bible if they didn't believe in God? Also, the Bible and Torah are two of four holy books revealed by God. The Christians also say that God revealed the Torah and the Bible. Is it not safe to say that we are talking about the same God here? I think so.

Dakota
January 25th, 2009, 11:24 AM
They will clash, actually. There will be a final all-out clash between Islam and the rest of the world. One of the signs of the Day of Judgment (http://www.inter-islam.org/faith/Majorsigns.html). The Day of Judgment is the day when everyone will be judged for what they have done on Earth, according to Islamic teachings. Forewarnings of the day are known as signs.

The Apocalypse *Shudders* I am scared.
There are signs, according to Muslim culture, of Judgment Day. Im sure Gaga will know them. Tell them, Gaga (IDK them, i only know 2)

s0nido
January 25th, 2009, 10:11 PM
OK, the signs of Judgment Day are here. This list was taken from this (http://islamicscholars.newsvine.com/_news/2008/10/09/1973731-islams-50-signs-to-judgment-day-) website, so all the weird text is not me.

* Camels will no longer be used as a means of transport;
* People will ride on saddles that aren't saddles (cars?)
* The distance on earth will become short;
* Horses will not be used in wars;
* Muslims will defeat the Byzantines which will end with the conquest of Constantinople( Istanbul)
* The Jews will gather again to live in Bilad Canaan;
* Very tall buildings will be built;
* The disappearance of knowledge and the appearance of ignorance, with much killing;
* Adultery will become widespread, and the drinking of wine will become common;
* The number of men will decrease and the number of women will increase until there are 50 women to be looked after by one man.
* Islam will become worn out like clothes are, until no one will know what fasting, prayer, charity and rituals are;
* Allah will send a disease to fornicators that will have no cure (Aids?);
* People will begin to believe in the stars and reject AL QADAR (THE DIVINE DECREE OF DESTINY);
* Men will pass by people's graves and say: 'Would that I was in his place'; (large amount of suicidal deaths?)
* The Euphrates will uncover a mountain of gold for which people will fight over (the river of Al Furat that lies near Iraq/Syria);
* Two large groups of people will fight one another, and there will be many casualties; they will both be following the same religion (World War II?);
* Approximately 30 DAJJALS will appear, each one claiming to be the
messenger of ALLAH;
* Earthquakes will increase;
* Time will pass quickly;
* Afflictions will appear;
* Killing will increase;
* Wealth will increase;
* Women will be wearing clothes but not wearing clothes
* THE PROPHET (saw) SAID: 'IF MY UMMAH BEARS 15! TRAITS(QUALITIES) ,TRIBULATION WILL FOLLOW IT.
' (DAY OF JUDGEMENT) SOMEONE ASKED,'WHAT ARE THEY O MESSENGER OF ALLAH?' HE (saw) SAID:
* When any gain is shared out only among the rich, with no benefit to the poor;
* When a trust becomes a means of making profit;
* When paying ZAKAT becomes a burden;
* When voices are raised in the mosque;
* When the leader of a people is the worst of them;
*When people treat a man with respect because what he may do;
* When much wine is drunk; red wind or the earth swallow them, or to be transformed into animals.
* 'IMRAN IBN HUSAYN SAID: 'THE PROPHET (AS) SAID, 'SOME PEOPLE OF THIS UMMAH WILL BE SWALLOWED BY THE EARTH, TRANSFORMED INTO ANIMALS, AND SOME WILL BE BOMBARDED WITH STONES'.
ONE OF THE MUSLIMS ASKED, WHEN WILL THAT BE O MESSENGER Of ALLAH?' HE SAID,
WHEN SINGERS AND MUSICAL INSTRUMENTS WILL BECOME POPULAR AND MUCH WINE IS DRUNK.
*THE GREATER SIGNS OF THE HOUR the Quran will disappear in one night, even from the people's hearts, and no Ayyah will be left on earth.
(Some groups of old people will be left who will say: 'We heard of fathers' saying 'LAILLAHA ILLA ALLAH' so we repeat it)
* The appearance of the MAHDI
* the appearance of the DAJJAL (Anti Christ)
* the appearance of Ya'juj and Ma'juj (biblical Gog and Magog)
* Isa (Jesus) will come during the time of Dajjal
* the rising of the sun from the west
* the destruction of the Ka'ba and the recovery of its treasures
* the smoke.



If you want an explanation of any of the terms mentioned above, I'll give it to you.

Zet
January 25th, 2009, 10:23 PM
but wealth has decreased in a landslide so judgment day isn't here and jews still live all around the world, the distance on the earth is still the same, earthquakes are random and time will always pass by quickly if you do something to kill time

s0nido
January 25th, 2009, 11:01 PM
I never said Judgment day arrived yet. Those were the signs that would occur before Judgment day would occur itself. When all of them happen, Judgment day will begin.

TRIFORCE89
January 26th, 2009, 05:38 AM
All three religions follow the god of Abraham. We have different names for God but it is the same being. There will be differences in our beliefs of course because we are different religions. The beliefs are what separates us.

Christianity has the Trinity. It doesn't make sense for Judaism or Islam to believe in the trinity as neither believes Jesus to be the Son of God. In Christianity, God is one but exist in three "bodies" at the same time - in the Father, Son (as Jesus), and the Holy Spirit. The Trinity doesn't fit if you don't believe Jesus to be the Son of a God. But, the god we follow is the same while we may look at him in different ways.

Amachi
January 26th, 2009, 07:50 AM
All three religions follow the god of Abraham. We have different names for God but it is the same being. There will be differences in our beliefs of course because we are different religions. The beliefs are what separates us.

Christianity has the Trinity. It doesn't make sense for Judaism or Islam to believe in the trinity as neither believes Jesus to be the Son of God. In Christianity, God is one but exist in three "bodies" at the same time - in the Father, Son (as Jesus), and the Holy Spirit. The Trinity doesn't fit if you don't believe Jesus to be the Son of a God. But, the god we follow is the same while we may look at him in different ways.
Ignoring that the idea of God having a son is absolute blasphemy in Judaism and Islam, are you saying that a Christian god that instructs one to love another is the same as an Islamic god that instructs one to slay another?

TRIFORCE89
January 26th, 2009, 07:58 AM
Ignoring that the idea of God having a son is absolute blasphemy in Judaism and Islam, are you saying that a Christian god that instructs one to love another is the same as an Islamic god that instructs one to slay another?
I'm not going to say that, no. Because

a) I'm not well-versed in the Islamic faith or the Qur'an to know what God has instructed.
b) You would be putting words in my mouth.

However, it would not surprise me if that were that case. God is very different between the old and new testaments. I'm pretty sure that somewhere in the Qur'an it says something like "Our Allah and your Allah are one".

Gumball Watterson
January 26th, 2009, 08:00 AM
I bet 50 rep points and 42 pesos this will get closed for any or no reason at all.


Fisrt of all, I'm Catholic, still Christian but we have to know one thing.

The 3 (or 4, 5, etc if you include branches) religions all believe in the one exact same God. However, their traditions differ by their views of God and the world, just like the other religions differ completely like Buddahism and Scientology(?). The religions are all connected by the exact same root of Abraham.

Christians were just people that followed the teachings of Jesus. Jews and Islamics differed by traditions. I think one of them used to call God "Yaweh" or something. I only had that history last year @~@.

I just mean there is not need to quarrel if we know that Abraham was to root of it all by following the orders of God...or something...

Ok, my RAM got low.

s0nido
January 26th, 2009, 02:46 PM
Ignoring that the idea of God having a son is absolute blasphemy in Judaism and Islam, are you saying that a Christian god that instructs one to love another is the same as an Islamic god that instructs one to slay another?

Excuse me? Islam does not order killing each other! Especially not another Muslim! Please don't make such accusations towards Muslims unless you are absolutely sure.

Oh, and the Jews believe that God has a son, but they don't think it's Jesus. I mentioned before that it was a Prophet whose name in Arabic is Uzair.

Dakota
January 26th, 2009, 02:50 PM
Talk about misaccuations. Drifloon, that is so not true! Im Muslim and and i KNOW slaying another Muslim is the top of all wrong deeds.

icomeanon6
January 26th, 2009, 03:06 PM
Ignoring that the idea of God having a son is absolute blasphemy in Judaism and Islam, are you saying that a Christian god that instructs one to love another is the same as an Islamic god that instructs one to slay another?
If you are referring to Islamic radicals and terrorists, they are heretics by every definition of the word. Genuine Muslims don't condone their actions. The same applies to those who kill innocents in the name of Christianity or Judaism. I don't know anywhere near as much about Islam as an actual Muslim does, but I do know that they consider murder to be a grave sin. I think you should do some research on the matter before talking about it any more. I suggest starting by looking up the Islamic view of Jesus. While they definitely don't say that Jesus is the son of God, they still treat him with a very high amount of respect.

Gumball Watterson
January 26th, 2009, 03:40 PM
Guys, I'm pretty sure either you all misunderstood Drifloon or he misworded it.

For sure, the "Are you saying" part does not give the fact that he is stating that the Islamic God does such a thing. Give him a break. Re-read throughly.

icomeanon6
January 26th, 2009, 03:57 PM
Guys, I'm pretty sure either you all misunderstood Drifloon or he misworded it.

For sure, the "Are you saying" part does not give the fact that he is stating that the Islamic God does such a thing. Give him a break. Re-read throughly.
I reread it thoroughly, and if he didn't mean what I thought he meant, then he must have misstated it. If that's the case, than he should edit it, but as it is written right now I'll assume that I understood what he meant perfectly. What he wrote was fairly straightforward. Also, he's a well-established member whose reputation won't be ruined by one little post, he doesn't need a break.

s0nido
January 26th, 2009, 04:00 PM
Drifloon completely misquoted TRIFORCE's post. Completely. He brought up the misaccusation that God ordered Muslims to kill each other. TRIFORCE never said anything about a Muslim God ordering murder. He came up with that all on his own.

We all believe in the same God, even though we see him in different forms. The trinity was invented by that meeting held a few hundred years after the death of Jesus. But if you look through the Bible, it says that there is only one God. It says that in many places. And I think that anything conflicting with that fact in the Bible is false.

The Bible was changed in many ways, after all. So were the Torah and Psalms. In fact, the only holy book revealed by God that remains unchanged is the Qur'an. It does not have any changes in it, and anyone that has attempted to change it failed miserably. Allah himself promised in the Qur'an that he would preserve the Qur'an and that it would never be changed. It still hasn't been. So I think that to quote for the truth, you should quote the Qur'an.

processr
January 26th, 2009, 04:11 PM
The Qur'an remains unchanged as it is regarded as the direct word of God, as revealed through the Prophet Muhammad, whereas the Bible and the Torah were the works of many different authors.

The Supreme Deity that Christians call God (and the Trinity) is also that which Jews and Bahá'ís call God, and Muslims call Allah. They all identify with Abraham, an important figure in the foundation of each of these religions.

January 26th, 2009, 04:46 PM
This thread may not last long...

These religions have nothing in common. Just because they start in the same place does NOT mean they have similarities. The definition of religion is a set of beliefs, and only one can be correct (or none, if you want to get into messy theological debates). If that's the case, then that means they don't have any meaningful similarities because they are polar towards each other.

The Quran is said to be 'bad poetry'. The Old and New Testament are attacked as being inconsistent with each other. Judaism (or some branch, anyways) is claimed as being old-fashioned. The fact of the matter is, they all have criticisms of each other that are unavoidable, no matter what your stances are. Thus, finding similarities is just political correctness and nothing else...Protestants and Catholics hardly have similarities save for the core beliefs.

God Himself is not even portrayed the same in the three...or close to it. Okay, so he created the world...yeah? I think Amun Re (or however you spell it) did that, too. The Old Testament God (Judaism) is of harsh ultimatums; if you don't obey, you'll be a pile of salt or blinded. If you do obey, your children will live and entire cities will fall to your soles. And the instructions he used nowadays are seen as silly...put a red string/chain/something up for something (I forget the specifics)? Okay, that's weird...kill Sisera (I think it was him..) with one of his tent pegs into his temple...uh-huh, thus stuff makes a lot of rational sense.
I'm just pulling this from an old teacher, but, if I recall, his portrayal of Allah is this: "You love Allah, so Allah will love you." An eye for an eye? I don't know; I'm no expert...
The Christian God is more complicated, with the Old Testament persona plus, essentially, his tri-nature, which are essentially different jobs the one entity has; it's like wearing masks. Think--do you act the same at school as you do at home? How about at your friend's house? How about at that fancy French restaurant? Oh, no...you're one person but can wear many different guises; that's the nature of the Christian God. If light can act as a particle and a wave, then why can't God act as a sanctifier, creator, and redeemer without being seen as different pieces? Light is not different things...

Judaism and Christianity themselves have enough quarreling (but no real 'wars' like the Jews and Palestinians) considering the Christians have their Messiah while the Jews are, even while I type this, waiting for the first arrival of their Annointed One. They have nothing in common; this is like saying capitalists and communists should bear hug each other and share a cherry pie. It just doesn't happen; yeah, they agree that we shouldn't be in a barter system, but they disagree over the most fundamental pieces of things...

Do these Gods have anything in common? Other than the generic creation motif, not really...the rest of the religions fall underneath that; if the core beliefs don't agree, then there ain't much connecting them. Otherwise, you had better be prepared to add in Germanic pagan religions, Eastern religions, and others...they all originated on Earth and do their best to explain the start, finish, and nature of our world, don't they?

icomeanon6
January 26th, 2009, 05:22 PM
(I'm not going to put his entire post in a quote box, but let me just make it clear that I'm replying to Agent Zero.)

I think you're making a mistake in focusing entirely on dogma. The point of the thread is not that all three religions are equally valid, the point is that their ideas of God stem from the same place in history. That place in history was Abraham and his descendants. Saying that Jews, Christians, and Muslims don't believe in the same God is like saying that Greeks and Romans didn't believe in the same gods. While they had different names, and modified stories in some cases, the Romans worshiped the same deities as the Greeks. You can't necessarily state that two different religions believe in a different god/different gods just because the two religions have different ideas of morality.

CP3
January 26th, 2009, 06:56 PM
Hey what a concidence, I'm a muslim too.

Zet
January 26th, 2009, 08:03 PM
Excuse me? Islam does not order killing each other! Especially not another Muslim! Please don't make such accusations towards Muslims unless you are absolutely sure.

Oh, and the Jews believe that God has a son, but they don't think it's Jesus. I mentioned before that it was a Prophet whose name in Arabic is Uzair.
I'm pretty sure Jesus was stoned and nailed to a cross by the Jewish nation, if they weren't told to slay each other, Jesus wouldn't have been stoned and nailed

s0nido
January 26th, 2009, 08:21 PM
The Jews kept killing every prophet that came to them. Not because they were told to kill each other. Where do people get such sick ideas from? What God would order the killing of innocent people? I know that my God doesn't.

Zet
January 26th, 2009, 08:24 PM
well Muslims kill people if they want women to have rights and we get these things from the bible

icomeanon6
January 26th, 2009, 08:35 PM
Let's keep it civil, here. The point of this thread is not to judge between religions or lifestyles, but rather to discuss their fundamental relation in history.

Amachi
January 26th, 2009, 09:10 PM
I'm not going to say that, no. Because

a) I'm not well-versed in the Islamic faith or the Qur'an to know what God has instructed.
b) You would be putting words in my mouth.

However, it would not surprise me if that were that case. God is very different between the old and new testaments. I'm pretty sure that somewhere in the Qur'an it says something like "Our Allah and your Allah are one".
Sorry, I didn't mean to do that, I was just trying to make a point upon how vastly different the religions are.
Excuse me? Islam does not order killing each other! Especially not another Muslim! Please don't make such accusations towards Muslims unless you are absolutely sure.

Oh, and the Jews believe that God has a son, but they don't think it's Jesus. I mentioned before that it was a Prophet whose name in Arabic is Uzair.
Talk about misaccuations. Drifloon, that is so not true! Im Muslim and and i KNOW slaying another Muslim is the top of all wrong deeds.
Oh yeah, in Islam slaying another Muslim is terrible.

But that's just killing another Muslim. Those who oppose Islam are free game ;)
If you are referring to Islamic radicals and terrorists, they are heretics by every definition of the word. Genuine Muslims don't condone their actions. The same applies to those who kill innocents in the name of Christianity or Judaism. I don't know anywhere near as much about Islam as an actual Muslim does, but I do know that they consider murder to be a grave sin. I think you should do some research on the matter before talking about it any more. I suggest starting by looking up the Islamic view of Jesus. While they definitely don't say that Jesus is the son of God, they still treat him with a very high amount of respect.
If they are such heretics and radicals, then where are they getting their Qur'an quotes from, the quotes that provide support for their actions? Yes, a lot of Muslims do not condone the violence, but then there are a lot who do. And the one's who do are a lot louder with their voices and their actions. Furthermore, one's who don't condone violence are willfully ignorant of the passages in the Qur'an and do not help change Islam at all.

Oh I have done research, don't worry about me. Yeah, Jesus was a smart guy, it's hard not to treat him with respect - but everything that Mohammad wrote canceled out what Jesus said - heck, what he wrote later on cancels out what he wrote initially (the Islamic doctrine of naskh [abrogation]).
Drifloon completely misquoted TRIFORCE's post. Completely. He brought up the misaccusation that God ordered Muslims to kill each other. TRIFORCE never said anything about a Muslim God ordering murder. He came up with that all on his own.

We all believe in the same God, even though we see him in different forms. The trinity was invented by that meeting held a few hundred years after the death of Jesus. But if you look through the Bible, it says that there is only one God. It says that in many places. And I think that anything conflicting with that fact in the Bible is false.

The Bible was changed in many ways, after all. So were the Torah and Psalms. In fact, the only holy book revealed by God that remains unchanged is the Qur'an. It does not have any changes in it, and anyone that has attempted to change it failed miserably. Allah himself promised in the Qur'an that he would preserve the Qur'an and that it would never be changed. It still hasn't been. So I think that to quote for the truth, you should quote the Qur'an.
9:5 When the sacred months are over slay the idolaters wherever you find them. Arrest them, besiege them, and lie in ambush everywhere for them. If they repent and take to prayer and render the alms levy, allow them to go their way. God is forgiving and merciful.
QFT. I hardly came up with it by myself.

In order to keep this post mostly on-topic, Christianity in comparison is a religion that preaches peace and love. Judaism too forbids killing, and even though in the Torah there are records of violence, this barely compares to the content the Qur'an contains within, plus they're directed at a specific group of people for a specific time.

Heck, the amazing thing about Islam is that it doesn't really have much in common with any religion. Most religions (and civilisations) around the world share numerous principles, but Islam does not.

s0nido
January 26th, 2009, 11:59 PM
THE IDOLATERS! WE HAD TO KILL THE IDOLATERS LONG AGO!
The inhabitants of Makkah 14 centuries ago were worshipping idols, and we had to drive them out because they did the same to us. And in the EXACT same verse, it said, right after the verse you just mentioned:
...But if they should repent, establish prayer, and give Zakah, let them (go) on their way. Indeed, Allah is forgiving and merciful. (Qur'an 9:5)
I am really keeping my frustration inside because I've heard this argument against Islam many times. Many times. But right after what you have just quoted, Drifloon, there was a 'but'.

Oh, and verse 9:6 says:
"And if one of the idolaters seek protection from you, grant him protection till he hears the word of Allah, then make him attain his place of safety; this is because they are a people who do not know. (Qur'an 9:6)"

You were saying? I think that Allah can back up anything he says.

Zet
January 27th, 2009, 12:11 AM
THE IDOLATERS! WE HAD TO KILL THE IDOLATERS LONG AGO!
The inhabitants of Makkah 14 centuries ago were worshipping idols, and we had to drive them out because they did the same to us. And in the EXACT same verse, it said, right after the verse you just mentioned:

I am really keeping my frustration inside because I've heard this argument against Islam many times. Many times. But right after what you have just quoted, Drifloon, there was a 'but'.

Oh, and verse 9:6 says:
"And if one of the idolaters seek protection from you, grant him protection till he hears the word of Allah, then make him attain his place of safety; this is because they are a people who do not know. (Qur'an 9:6)"You were saying? I think that Allah can back up anything he says.
how could idolaters drive a big religious group out who has lots and lots of rocks? also what about protecting women? was that allowed or were they stoned as well?

s0nido
January 27th, 2009, 12:32 AM
At the time, the Muslims were very small and were not very powerful. They had to escape Makkah and flee to Madinah. Then they returned and conquered Makkah in a bloodless invasion. And, no, women, children or old men were not allowed to be killed in any wars against the idolaters.

CP3
January 27th, 2009, 04:02 PM
Oh yeah, in Islam slaying another Muslim is terrible.

But that's just killing another Muslim. Those who oppose Islam are free game ;)



Wrong, Islam forbids killing an innocent soul.

Zet
January 28th, 2009, 02:29 AM
nobody said it was an innocent soul

s0nido
January 28th, 2009, 12:18 PM
It's true. Anyone who opposes Islam through physical force by torturing other Muslims is definitely free game. But physical violence must only be used as a last resort. War causes loss of lives, and Muslim leaders should be wary of that. Some soldiers could go berserk and kill civilians too. So war isn't something that Muslims should be declaring very often.

Anyway, that wasn't the point here...What are the similarities between the three religions? We still haven't determined whether Christians, Jews and Muslims believe in the same God. What I think is that we all believe in the same God, but how we see him is different. The Muslims say that the Christians are associating partners with God by saying that he has a son. But the Trinity is a complicated topic, something I don't understand fully. Someone care to explain it?

Dakota
January 28th, 2009, 12:38 PM
This Thread is really starting to heat up. Everybody, calm down. Youll get this thread closed.

Muslims do not belive in killing each other, i know that for a fact.

Netto Azure
January 28th, 2009, 12:54 PM
Ok, why can't we agree that the three Abrahamic Monotheistic Religions believe in the Same God?
Seriously the fact that Islam refers to the Torah and Bible as Holy Books (But "corrupted" after the passage of time) and that half of the Christian Bible is based of Jewish Books (The Old Testament) should be enough to prove that. =/

Ruphire
January 28th, 2009, 01:17 PM
We actually were reading about this in our World Studies books. And it does state that we do believe in the same God just that, Muhammad was it? Was the Muslims final prophet.

Dakota
January 28th, 2009, 02:15 PM
We actually were reading about this in our World Studies books. And it does state that we do believe in the same God just that, Muhammad was it? Was the Muslims final prophet.

That is correct. See people. even the books say it1

s0nido
January 28th, 2009, 03:34 PM
This thread was heating up? It was just debate off-topic. Which could get this thread closed. Keep on-topic guys.

Anyway, yes, it's true, and I did say that the Qur'an has mention of the other three holy books and mention of the Christians and Jews believing in God.

And no, Muslims do not believe in killing each other, and anyone else, for that matter. Islam has strict war conventions that say that you can't kill women, children or the elderly, or anyone not directly involved in the war. Also, you cannot deny the enemy water or chop down trees to deny food. In other words, the 'scorched earth' policy is banned. Fight fairly or don't fight at all.

Is everyone settled about the belief in God thing? We believe in the same God as the Christians and Jews do, and we also believe in many of the same prophets. Now, what about the founding father of the three religions, Abraham (Arabic: Ibrahim)? What religion did he follow? Islam, Christianity or Judaism? My vote goes to Islam, as he did build the first mosque on Earth.

Netto Azure
January 28th, 2009, 03:39 PM
Now, what about the founding father of the three religions, Abraham (Arabic: Ibrahim)? What religion did he follow? Islam, Christianity or Judaism? My vote goes to Islam, as he did build the first mosque on Earth.

Well that's up for debate I'm sure. I would prefer if we accept that he didn't follow any one religion but instead Founded one in which became very diverse. =D

Amachi
January 28th, 2009, 08:30 PM
THE IDOLATERS! WE HAD TO KILL THE IDOLATERS LONG AGO!
The inhabitants of Makkah 14 centuries ago were worshipping idols, and we had to drive them out because they did the same to us. And in the EXACT same verse, it said, right after the verse you just mentioned:

I am really keeping my frustration inside because I've heard this argument against Islam many times. Many times. But right after what you have just quoted, Drifloon, there was a 'but'.

Oh, and verse 9:6 says:


You were saying? I think that Allah can back up anything he says.
Christians are considered idolaters by Muslims. I mean, we do have statues and pictures everywhere of Jesus, and though we don't consider ourselves idolaters, it's easy to see why others would. Plus the whole "we won't convert or submit ourselves to Islam" thing.

My bad, I shouldn't have used a quote so often referenced by Jihadists everywhere. Here, have some more.

[9:29] You shall fight back against those who do not believe in GOD, nor in the Last Day, nor do they prohibit what GOD and His messenger have prohibited, nor do they abide by the religion of truth - among those who received the scripture - until they pay the due tax, willingly or unwillingly.
[9:73] O you prophet, strive against the disbelievers and the hypocrites, and be stern in dealing with them. Their destiny is Hell; what a miserable abode!

They drove Mohammad out because he was set on converting them. He then came back and destroyed them. No, not without bloodshed or whatever, cause the idea is just absurd that they "convinced" them to convert given the history of the spread of Islam.
At the time, the Muslims were very small and were not very powerful. They had to escape Makkah and flee to Madinah. Then they returned and conquered Makkah in a bloodless invasion. And, no, women, children or old men were not allowed to be killed in any wars against the idolaters.
Spetember 11 anyone?

THE IDOLATERS! WE HAD TO KILL THE IDOLATERS LONG AGO!
conquered Makkah in a bloodless invasion
bloodless invasion
It's true. Anyone who opposes Islam through physical force by torturing other Muslims is definitely free game. But physical violence must only be used as a last resort. War causes loss of lives, and Muslim leaders should be wary of that. Some soldiers could go berserk and kill civilians too. So war isn't something that Muslims should be declaring very often.

Anyway, that wasn't the point here...What are the similarities between the three religions? We still haven't determined whether Christians, Jews and Muslims believe in the same God. What I think is that we all believe in the same God, but how we see him is different. The Muslims say that the Christians are associating partners with God by saying that he has a son. But the Trinity is a complicated topic, something I don't understand fully. Someone care to explain it?
Last resort after the three choices offered:
1. Converting the people, which if they refuse,
2. Submitting the people to dhimmi status, which basically means forcing them to live as second-class citizens, and if they mess that up,
3. Death.

Complicated is an understatement, considering that barely anyone understands it. All 3 are equal, separate but one in the same. The simplest way I can explain it is that Jesus is a reflection of the Father in a mirror, and the Holy Spirit is ... the "love" (ego, self-recognition?) that flows between them.
[9:30] The Jews said, "Ezra is the son of GOD," while the Christians said, "Jesus is the son of GOD!" These are blasphemies uttered by their mouths. They thus match the blasphemies of those who have disbelieved in the past. GOD condemns them. They have surely deviated.
So you still say we have the same God even though the Qur'an condemns us for our beliefs?
This Thread is really starting to heat up. Everybody, calm down. Youll get this thread closed.

Muslims do not belive in killing each other, i know that for a fact.
Yes, everyone knows that Muslims don't believe in killing each other. To make this easier for you to understand, I'll compare it to Jews and Christians, who do not believe in killing anyone.
Ok, why can't we agree that the three Abrahamic Monotheistic Religions believe in the Same God?
Seriously the fact that Islam refers to the Torah and Bible as Holy Books (But "corrupted" after the passage of time) and that half of the Christian Bible is based of Jewish Books (The Old Testament) should be enough to prove that. =/
Cause they're not. The religions are completely different.
We actually were reading about this in our World Studies books. And it does state that we do believe in the same God just that, Muhammad was it? Was the Muslims final prophet.
oh I see. this book is clearly the authority.
This thread was heating up? It was just debate off-topic. Which could get this thread closed. Keep on-topic guys.

Anyway, yes, it's true, and I did say that the Qur'an has mention of the other three holy books and mention of the Christians and Jews believing in God.

And no, Muslims do not believe in killing each other, and anyone else, for that matter. Islam has strict war conventions that say that you can't kill women, children or the elderly, or anyone not directly involved in the war. Also, you cannot deny the enemy water or chop down trees to deny food. In other words, the 'scorched earth' policy is banned. Fight fairly or don't fight at all.

Is everyone settled about the belief in God thing? We believe in the same God as the Christians and Jews do, and we also believe in many of the same prophets. Now, what about the founding father of the three religions, Abraham (Arabic: Ibrahim)? What religion did he follow? Islam, Christianity or Judaism? My vote goes to Islam, as he did build the first mosque on Earth.
Considering the amount of violence propagated by those inspired by Islam, I'd definitely say that there are many that do believe in killing others. And this won't change so long as there are people like you who continue to deny and remain ignorant of the teachings in the Qur'an, so for now the loudest of your faith will continue to encourage and support violence. What's worse is that Islam hasn't changed for centuries, and it's actually forbidden to re-interpret the texts.

Islam may believe in the same prophets, but the teachings of the Qur'an override what they said, so it isn't that big a deal.

I thought Mohammad founded Islam. How could Abraham have built the first mosque if Islam was founded at least 100 a few thousand years after Abraham's time?

Gumball Watterson
January 28th, 2009, 08:50 PM
Alright, I think this will easily turn into a flame war. Pretty much this is turning into a fight.

So there may be SOME, Muslims that believe in killing, are they really Muslims, or are we debating a branch and confusing it with true Islam?

By what I see, any of these branches that follow the same Monotheism of the same root would never believe in murder at all. It is shamed upon by nearly every government in the world anyways, regardless of the religious values.

Those that believe in murder, are more likely than not, terrorists. Because, really, there have been references to the Iraq war as "Crusade", a war of religion, although it's pretty much Government vs Religous Crazy or Insane pack of people.

There should be no reason for murder in any religion at all, not even Satanism believes in Sacrifice, so why Islam for murder?

I am not sure about others but I really want this thread to get closed now.

Ripper
January 29th, 2009, 02:19 AM
To be blunt, I'm not sure if this has mentioned.

All Religions believe in the same god per say, it's just the rules that are interpreted differently. And then, these rules change frequently (in the scheme of things) and, largely, one will choose what rules to obey and what not to obey. We're all labeled as what we believe in most closely, but if you really looked at what your religion is all about, you'd see some things you simply don't follow, and therefore, we all believe in our own form of god (believe isn't really the right word), it just all depends on what group we resemble the most.

Zet
January 29th, 2009, 02:30 AM
To be blunt, I'm not sure if this has mentioned.

All Religions believe in the same god per say, it's just the rules that are interpreted differently. And then, these rules change frequently (in the scheme of things) and, largely, one will choose what rules to obey and what not to obey. We're all labeled as what we believe in most closely, but if you really looked at what your religion is all about, you'd see some things you simply don't follow, and therefore, we all believe in our own form of god (believe isn't really the right word), it just all depends on what group we resemble the most.
Egypt, Greece and many other places had multiple Gods though, so with that said, it shows there are different Gods

Kaiyori
January 29th, 2009, 03:03 AM
Alright, I think this will easily turn into a flame war. Pretty much this is turning into a fight.

So there may be SOME, Muslims that believe in killing, are they really Muslims, or are we debating a branch and confusing it with true Islam?

By what I see, any of these branches that follow the same Monotheism of the same root would never believe in murder at all. It is shamed upon by nearly every government in the world anyways, regardless of the religious values.

Those that believe in murder, are more likely than not, terrorists. Because, really, there have been references to the Iraq war as "Crusade", a war of religion, although it's pretty much Government vs Religous Crazy or Insane pack of people.

There should be no reason for murder in any religion at all, not even Satanism believes in Sacrifice, so why Islam for murder?

I am not sure about others but I really want this thread to get closed now.
Not sure if this is relevant but I'm pretty sure Satanism believes in Sacrifice, In fact I heard a story a while back about some teenagers being "sacrificed" I'll put a link up if I can find it? EDIT: Actually Just Might've been a few Satanists that believe in this not sure if the whole religion believes in it, still looking for the link -.-

EDIT #2:
Found the link I know this post is pretty irrelevant but just wanted to show you.

http://www.livenews.com.au/Articles/2008/09/16/Satanist_stab_teens_666_times_before_eating_remains

s0nido
January 29th, 2009, 01:50 PM
Why does everyone think that the Muslims came back and destroyed the disbelievers? Muhammad tried to convert them with peace and love, not with a sword. The empires that collapsed because of Islam started the wars against it. Persia had attacked Iraq, which was a Muslim country at the time. The Byzantines were causing trouble with the Muslims, so they had to go to Syria to drive them off.

And where on Earth did you get that killing an innocent person is allowed in Islam? If it were, I think that 1.5 billion Muslims should be on a rampage right now. How many 'Jihadists' are there? They are not following true Islam, rather, they are misinterpreting the Qur'an. If they were really following Islam, I wouldn't be on this forum, would I? It is full to the brim with 'non-believers' isn't it? Heck, I think I should blow it up if I were following the terrorists' version of Islam. But I'm not going to do that, because it will involve a loss of innocent lives. More than 500 Muslims were killed in the 9/11 attacks.

Oh, and yes, we do condemn you, even though you do believe in the same God. You did say he has a son, after all. Where did you get that idea from? In fact, where did you get that whole Trinity thing from? Is it in the Bible? Did Jesus say it himself?

And, no, I'm not ignorant of my faith. I folow what the Qur'an says, and I can't believe how shallow you are by labelling an entire religion a one of murder because of a group of men who misinterpret the Qur'an. The Christians are not considered idolaters, rather, they are considered polytheists. But they are allowed to live peacefully because they share similar beliefs with the Muslims. Anyone is, after all. But the ones who attack Islam are not entitled to a peaceful life.

Why are you attacking our religion? What did all the Muslims do to you? Us Muslims should hate America for what they have done to the Muslims in Iraq and Afghanistan. Those countries are laid to waste because of what you have done.

PS: And by the way, it hasn't been proven by the American government that Osama Bin Laden was behind the 9/11 attacks. Even if he did say it, we can't really trust him. He could be a pawn of the American Government, after all.

Dakota
January 29th, 2009, 01:53 PM
PS: And by the way, it hasn't been proven by the American government that Osama Bin Laden was behind the 9/11 attacks. Even if he did say it, we can't really trust him. He could be a pawn of the American Government, after all.

Also, he is a Shihite, not a Sunni. Shihites are a little different, no offense.

CP3
January 29th, 2009, 03:12 PM
nobody said it was an innocent soul

Doesn't matter if nobody said, but just cause someone opposes Islam doesn't mean that they aren't an innocent soul.

s0nido
January 29th, 2009, 04:09 PM
It depends on what you mean by opposing. If someone violently opposes Islam, well, they deserve whatever they get. If it's by words, well, fight back with words. I think we should all keep our faiths to ourselves...but then that would mean that this thread gets closed...

Anyway, well, who doesn't think that the three religion share the same god? Not me, for sure.

Ripper
January 29th, 2009, 07:03 PM
Egypt, Greece and many other places had multiple Gods though, so with that said, it shows there are different Gods

And lets have a look at what half their gods did...

Ancient religions can't be used as examples for they used gods as explanations for what we now know isn't true (i.e. Helios pulling the Sun over the Earth).

Zet
January 29th, 2009, 07:55 PM
well that means jews and them can't be used as an example because their God is ancient

s0nido
January 29th, 2009, 08:26 PM
I have no idea where this thread is heading to.

Shiites are a branch of Islam, but essentially, they follow Islam and the Qur'an. So no point trying to pin the blame on a Shiite, no one will care. Meh, anyway...

What I'm trying to say is that because these three religions are from the same source, they must share the same belief in God, shouldn't they? It's simple. How we believe and what we believe in are two different things, and just because Christians think of god as three forms and Jews believe that Ezra is the son of God, doesn't mean they are talking about a different kind of God.

Ripper
January 29th, 2009, 09:21 PM
well that means jews and them can't be used as an example because their God is ancient

I mean non existent religions now. Or religions that are so scarce and barely count as active. Any religion where something is explained through a god where we now know the real reason for it.

txteclipse
January 29th, 2009, 09:46 PM
Hey, don't get flaming other religions, people. Jews have more in common with Muslims than Christians do, then again, they actually follow their religion better than Christians do. Apparently, Christians, Jews and Muslims are not allowed to eat the meat of a pig. A long time ago, Jews were being persecuted, and when they were pretending to be Christians to get out of persecution, the Christians began to eat pork to differentiate themselves from the Jews. The Jews would not eat pork.

That's why we have Christians eating pork while Muslims and Jews don't.
That is incorrect. Jesus declared that it is what comes out of a man's mouth, not what goes in it, that makes him unclean. Christians aren't "following their faith worse" than anyone.

And we don't have the same beliefs about God, not at all. There's fundamental differences that inherently make Islam, Christianity, and Judaism unlike one another.

Xairmo
January 29th, 2009, 10:34 PM
It always seemed to me that they all have extremely similar basis for their beliefs, they believe in virtually the same things [with a few differences] but they call them by different names. Moreover, I find the whole controversy to be rather childish. Why can't people ever accept that someone else thinks differently and perceives life and the idea of "God" in a different way.

Now don't go flaming me because just as you all have you're right to believe whatever you want, I do as well :P

txteclipse
January 30th, 2009, 05:21 AM
It always seemed to me that they all have extremely similar basis for their beliefs, they believe in virtually the same things [with a few differences] but they call them by different names. Moreover, I find the whole controversy to be rather childish. Why can't people ever accept that someone else thinks differently and perceives life and the idea of "God" in a different way.

Now don't go flaming me because just as you all have you're right to believe whatever you want, I do as well :P

That's easy to say from an outside-looking-in standpoint, but it's definitely not that simple. These three religions are completely unlike each other when it comes to the method of redemption, which is an incredibly important difference. They are in effect incompatible because of it (I don't mean socially incompatible, I just mean that they can't be compared to one another at all).

An-chan
January 30th, 2009, 06:50 AM
I believe that the main problem between these three (and all other) religions is that because it's been important to be "the best" religion, they have mocked the other ones for years. So, now we have bunch of people thinking all others are blasphemers and don't live up to the standards of moral. For example, I've seen a lot of propaganda where one of these three is portrayed as unmoral, beastly religion that's followers are barbarians who believe anything they're told. I've seen all kinds of false facts going around the internet and being handed out at public places. Because it's been done for years, it has made its way deep into our hearts.

Even though I'm not a Christian (nor am I Muslim or Jew), I live in a country where Christianity is the state religion. My parents aren't Christian, either, so I didn't really have any other religious influences than those from school and media. Yet even I have thought of Muslims and Catholics as being scary when I was a little kid. I still don't really know where those thoughts came from. The point is, the bias is very deep. I think we really could make it all a bit better if kids were taught about other religions more properly in school. I know they teach kids about other religions (I myself have been on those lessons. They weren't pretty thorough, though, as I still don't quite know what Jews believe to happen after death), but parents can call the school and get their kids out of those classes. I don't think they should be able to do that. We have to know the truth about others to look at the world truthfully.

Also, I still get a headache whenever I think about what 9/11 did to the public image of Muslims in USA. I have heard of some people - I actually even know some of them - who really think that all Muslims are evil and want nothing but the destruction of the free country that is America. One even went as far as to tell my aunt that if she looked like an Arab, he would have shot her right there, because she clearly had the accent of a foreigner. I also noted that some people didn't want to vote for Obama because of his ties to Muslims.
Things like that could be prevented with some education, I think. At least I really, really hope so.

Xairmo
January 30th, 2009, 11:04 AM
That's easy to say from an outside-looking-in standpoint, but it's definitely not that simple. These three religions are completely unlike each other when it comes to the method of redemption, which is an incredibly important difference. They are in effect incompatible because of it (I don't mean socially incompatible, I just mean that they can't be compared to one another at all).

Well that's kind of what I meant. To me it seems they believe in the same general idea, but they call things by different names, and they just practice their beliefs in different ways. It's true that these religions are not identical to one another, for it is easy to differentiate between them, but the basis of their beliefs are still rather similar. If I remember correctly the Qur'an had something called the 5 Pillars of Islam while Judeo-Christian beliefs have the 10 Commandments, both of which seem to have similar morals to live a virtuous spiritual life. Also, all three religions seem to have one main "prophet" or "savior" whom they belief in and they all believe in the one "God".

~MasterMind~
January 30th, 2009, 11:29 AM
they maybe do have the same bass but there not very similiar ._.

st.jimmy
January 30th, 2009, 11:38 AM
they have a god...not the same one necesserilly but didnt angel gabrial appear in q'uran?
o wells...im catholic :D

s0nido
January 30th, 2009, 02:08 PM
Yup, Gabriel (Arabic: Jibreel) appeared to Muhammad, just as he did to Moses, Jesus and Abraham.

And if they do have the same base, how could they not be similar? The three religions are definitely not similar enough to be one religion, but what I want to achieve here is to say that these three religions share the same God.

And just because what goes in a man doesn't make him unclean, it doesn't mean it's wrong to eat certain things. Look at the damage alcohol does to people. It corrupts their body and makes them get liver diseases. I've heard that in Islam, it is forbidden to harm yourself intentionally.

Oh, and I completely agree with the ignorance thing. I'm not trying to convert anyone here, I just want to get you people away from the idea that Muslims are bloodthirsty. If you want to believe that all Muslims are bloodthirsty, then I think that I should fear any American that passes by me. After all, they attacked and killed hundreds of thousands of people throughout their history. And you're condemning Muslims because?

OK, I'm going to finalise this. Muslims, Jews and Christians all believe in the same God. Those quotes that Drifloon pulled out of the Qur'an were quotes referring to the Christians at the time, the ones that attacked Muslims in Syria. It also refers to people attacking Muslims now. We don't believe that Christians are idolaters, rather, we believe that they have deviated from the truth that Allah is alone in his reign. He doesn't have a son, a father or mother or any partners. He existed forever and will exist forever. Allah critisises the Jews and Christians in the Qur'an because they have changed their books and made up things that were not in the original Bible. The men responsible for the attacks on 9/11 misinterpreted the Qur'an and were fueled by the attacks against their countries. What they did was not textbook Islam, and they shouldn't have attacked civilians at all. Can anyone say that what I have said above is wrong? Is it all clear for you?

EDIT: Wait, I just asked my Religious Studies teacher whether we believe in the same God or not. We don't seeing as the Christians appear to worship Jesus as a God or something.

Ruphire
February 6th, 2009, 07:04 PM
I don't get why everybody keeps on bashing on people who are Muslims. I mean wouldn't you get mad if someone kept on bashing your religion?

s0nido
February 6th, 2009, 07:20 PM
I know. Why do people do that to Muslims? I just received bad rep from a Muslim hater, and I don't like it one bit. Maybe I should just bash every Jew and Christian because they attack Muslims, shouldn't I? It's not right to do so. The Qur'an makes mention of killing others because it was talking about the Meccans who tortured Muslims for no reason. But people take those comments and use them misleadingly. These people are Muslims and non-Muslims alike. There are only a handful of Muslims who are evil and murderous, but suddenly, people decide that these people are the role-models to our faith and that every Muslim is a terrorist. I hate that.

Amachi
February 6th, 2009, 07:25 PM
EDIT: Wait, I just asked my Religious Studies teacher whether we believe in the same God or not. We don't seeing as the Christians appear to worship Jesus as a God or something.
I said that at least 5 times.
I don't get why everybody keeps on bashing on people who are Muslims. I mean wouldn't you get mad if someone kept on bashing your religion?

I know. Why do people do that to Muslims? I just received bad rep from a Muslim hater, and I don't like it one bit. Maybe I should just bash every Jew and Christian because they attack Muslims, shouldn't I? It's not right to do so. The Qur'an makes mention of killing others because it was talking about the Meccans who tortured Muslims for no reason. But people take those comments and use them misleadingly. These people are Muslims and non-Muslims alike. There are only a handful of Muslims who are evil and murderous, but suddenly, people decide that these people are the role-models to our faith and that every Muslim is a terrorist. I hate that.
While I can't speak for everyone, I was simply quoting the Qur'an.

And there are more than just a "handful". There entire organisations that span the globe who act this way. Nations of people too.

daigonite
February 6th, 2009, 07:30 PM
Well, if you think about it, all the religions have more in common than they have differences with eachother. For example, look at Karma. Karma, in essence, is the same as the Christian Hell/Heaven - those who do wrong are punished and those who do the right thing are rewarded. I feel that if people looked more at how much we share in common than what our differences were that we wouldn't have so many disputes or discrimination against eachother.

I have been to a Church and a Synagogue. I've been to an average service in each. Both teach the same thing in essence. It's just the way it's presented, really.

It's unfortunate to see those so hyped up about religion to kill others over it. It's not only a Muslim thing, either. Practically every religion has done it in some way, excluding probably Buhddism.

Ruphire
February 6th, 2009, 08:29 PM
I'm Christian and I wouldn't make fun of somebody just because they're Muslim. And like what was stated before all because a couple of Muslims are bad doesn't mean they all are. *Cough we believe in the same God also Cough*

s0nido
February 6th, 2009, 09:34 PM
Exactly so, exactly so. We do believe in the same God, if you see that the Christians believe that Jesus isn't exactly God. Meh, I wouldn't know. But what I do know is that we do believe in the same God, even though we may not believe in Him in the same way.


While I can't speak for everyone, I was simply quoting the Qur'an.

And there are more than just a "handful". There entire organisations that span the globe who act this way. Nations of people too.

These 'organisations' are not representatives of Muslims directly. Unfortunately, Muslims are not exactly very united. So their beliefs are not shared by everyone. And I did say that the quotes you took from the Qur'an are true, but misunderstood.

We don't believe in murdering people who didn't take up arms against Muslims directly. People who oppose Islam with lies and misinterpretation and attempt to discredit our religion are, in fact, free game.

Do everyday Muslims attempt to discredit other religions? I and many others don't. And where do you get the idea that Muslims have to kill others? Jihad is compulsory, yes, but it is just another word for struggling in the cause of Allah. It doesn't have to be in the form of death and destruction. It can be a quest for knowledge, or a debate against Muslim haters.

Now, I have said that Islam does not endorse killing other civilians, and that Islam has strict war conventions. Where do you get the idea that Muslims are murderous people? I think Osama Bin Laden is a loony and he has misinterpreted the Qur'an and used it as an excuse for murder.

evilishan
February 6th, 2009, 10:20 PM
Yeah, It's all one god, and I think the people who committed 9/11 where trying to screw the Muslim communities in the world pretty bad. As for me I believe in a God but don't specifically follow a religion (as of yet), i believe in heaven and hell and doing things wrong is sinning (like lying and killing and not praying).I guess Pokemon is my religon.

It's amazing the hate I see coming from America toward Muslims nowadays, I'd dislike living in the particularly conservative communities there if i were a Muslim.

"It's unfortunate to see those so hyped up about religion to kill others over it. It's not only a Muslim thing, either. Practically every religion has done it in some way, excluding probably Buhddism" The best summary of what been said so far, there's no need to hurt others.

Amachi
February 6th, 2009, 10:55 PM
Edit: Actually this thread has gone way too far off-topic and it would be irresponsible for me to let it continue.

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