PDA

View Full Version : Too much originality


BeatTheSpecialStage
March 16th, 2009, 01:27 PM
Does anyone else think that the Pokemon Special/Pokemon Adventures is SO original that it is TOO far from the original point of Pokemon? I mean, the originality is great 'n all, but still...

Nnoitra Jiruga
March 16th, 2009, 01:31 PM
0___o
TOO much originality? x D
Well...not THAT much.
Examples?

BeatTheSpecialStage
March 16th, 2009, 01:55 PM
The whole badge in the slots machine thing, evil Elite Four, Ruby being a coordinater... ect.

processr
March 16th, 2009, 02:05 PM
So you want clichéd storylines and predictable characters?

...


Step this way to the first series of the anime, please.

zkid0605
March 16th, 2009, 02:05 PM
I think it is to original. In my opinion...

The Ebon Blade
March 16th, 2009, 02:53 PM
Actually, it really does pry on a lot of cliches but it still is very good. They pull it off well.

The Hero Without a Name
March 16th, 2009, 03:26 PM
I don't really care about "too much originality," especially in a time when we're sorely lacking in that department, as long as it's good. PokeSpecial is good; I remember reading the summaries of the manga when I was in 6th grade, and now that I've actually read it, they far surpassed my expectations.

Dominus Temporis
March 16th, 2009, 03:47 PM
Actually, hasn't Satoshi Tajiri said that Special is closest to his original vision of the Pokémon world? So I don't really think that it's too far off. It's still about kids going out, catching monsters, and fighting villains. If it has a more complex storyline, then that just makes it better and more worthwhile to read than the generic "beat Gyms, beat villain team, beat Elite Four" storyline it would have if it was ripped straight from the games.

mbc2085
March 16th, 2009, 05:07 PM
having unexepection in the manga makes much more fun as story line. They do follow some originalty but its boring to have origin for too much. Play pokemon game for 10 times its boring.
so i do respect that author of manga put something unexpected.

OokamiShipper
March 16th, 2009, 05:13 PM
Well, I think originality is awesome! That's what make the PokeSpecial, Special. xD

Feathing
March 16th, 2009, 05:30 PM
I know what you're saying!
I think the same for some things..

I mean.. Pokemon Special is great! But the badges machine, the frozen characters, the fact that Emerald can know the birthplace of any pokemon just by a luck are way too 'original' as you say...

Anyway, I think it's the best exponent of Pokemon with the RPG games...

Sea Guardian
March 17th, 2009, 10:12 AM
The whole badge in the slots machine thing, evil Elite Four... ect.
What badge in the slot machine? Where was that because I think I totally missed that...
I loved the evil Elite Four! I can usually guess every plot twist of every story but that's one of the only things I did not see coming.

Well, I think originality is awesome! That's what make the PokeSpecial, Special. xD
My thoughts exactly! =D
I'm sure a lot of people also feel the same way.

Mitchman
March 17th, 2009, 10:17 AM
In the manga the original 8 kanto badges actually have magical powers. I find that awesome. And the ice thing was cool. Elite 4 being evil is awesome. Anyway it seems you read a little bit only. I find the mange more awesome cause a lot of things are explained in its own special way like say how the elite 4 of jhoto was made. I found that touching that koga and bruno changed sides as well as will and the other girl and made their own elite 4. So yeah im up for originality and it has what i want. Non generic pokemon stuff and something fans can truly appreciate. lets not forget pokeboobs and the hot spa scenes

THIRTY-SIX
March 17th, 2009, 10:20 AM
Spoil it more for me, you are actually enticing me to read it.

Mitchman
March 17th, 2009, 10:22 AM
Nope im going to leave the rest for you to find out.

OokamiShipper
March 17th, 2009, 04:00 PM
Plus the plots are so well thought out. 'specially RuSa. I mean, it can't get more original than that!
And the shippings are so cute and much more solid.
And for all the girls out there, don't forget, Red takes off his shirt xD

RubyJB88
March 17th, 2009, 04:02 PM
What's so bad about originality? It's what makes stories so popular and be dedicated to be best works of art. What they do in the manga is quite clever and I love how they work with it.

System!
March 17th, 2009, 07:36 PM
What badge in the slot machine? Where was that because I think I totally missed that...


It was used at the Silph Takeover in RBG to fuse the legendary birds together, then used later in the Yellow saga (to take control of Lugia, I believe).

As for the quote, didn't Tajiri say that at the first few chapters of RBG before it strayed away from the games to make its own story? Anyway, it doesn't really matter if Special strays away from the games, it's still entertaining to read. As what people said before, the ideas were quite clever and interesting.

bubblewrap
March 17th, 2009, 08:05 PM
Originality's cool!
I mean, would you want to have the manga with the EXACT same story line as the games?

I think not.

RubyJB88
March 18th, 2009, 11:12 AM
I personally don't see why complain about originality. That's a first in my life.

nhahtdh
March 20th, 2009, 08:08 AM
If it wasn't for the originality, I wouldn't read this manga, and I think most people will have the same thought as me. Why reading this when it's virtually the same as watching anime and playing games?

bubblewrap
March 20th, 2009, 04:55 PM
If it wasn't for the originality, I wouldn't read this manga, and I think most people will have the same thought as me. Why reading this when it's virtually the same as watching anime and playing games?

Lol, agreed. Totally my point.

Wolfwhispers
March 20th, 2009, 05:00 PM
I get what you're saying, but I think that's why they have the Manga and then the Anime. Manga is definently better in my opinion, simply because it seems like a maturer pokemon themed world than the anime. The anime itself and the game are, I suppose, the 'true storyline' of pokemon. However, if it wasn't for that originality of the manga, would you have read it? I know I wouldn't have. :)

~Rose-quartz Iatos
March 20th, 2009, 05:02 PM
I don't see how you mean, I love the pokemon special manga.

Idiot!
March 21st, 2009, 06:59 PM
Yes, it is a little too original. Skipping the required amount of battles in the Battle Palace, Natu and Mantine capable of learning Fly, Volt Tackle without Light Ball, Spheal battling Gardevoir in the Battle Factory where the two would never meet; I wouldn't count on PokeSpe to learn the games.

Spectacular Hero
March 23rd, 2009, 03:50 PM
SO you're saying you want the best Pokemon manga in the world to be some cliche series with now storyline an crappy charactes.

Three works

Anime is enough

I love the originality, I didn't liked RUby being a Coordinator, but it was cool once you got used to it, the whole badges having special powers was the best thing I've ever thought about same thing for they interupting the Pokemon league and make it a place for a huge battle. And more of it all, they just keep adding more and more coolness to it

alexl321
March 27th, 2009, 05:38 PM
Too original? Definitely not.

If you want something with the same linear and boring storyline as the games, then the anime is there for you. But if you want something that isnt exactly what you played through the games, with new and interesting characters, (And not the same guy for 500+ episodes..) Then Pokemon Special is a great outlet. Especially for fans like me, who have been with the series since the Beginning on Game Boy, and arent 12 years old anymore. I understand how Nintendo wants to keep this a childrens series, but I personally am getting bored with the games lately, and Special is actually exciting, there is action and even death in some points, it is definitely more realistic than the show where nothing bad ever seems to happen. Also, the characters in the Anime just seem boring. I mean, May left the team, and now Dawn is there, but they are basically the same person to me. =(

I also Love the character of Ruby, he is a huge departure from many generic anime/manga heroes. I also felt a deep personal connection to his character, in nearly all aspects.

I also love Sapphire's wild personality. Another type of character who is almost unheard of in many anime/manga today, especially for a girl.

Anyway, i love the manga completely, (except maybe Emerald's chapter, i didnt feel much of a connecion with him, lol) and its great for more mature fans of the series and people who like to take the world of Pokemon more realistically.

And also, like another poster mentioned, This version of Pokemon is the one the creator himself said is most like the world he envisioned.

The Pokemon games themself are made to sell, not to entertain anymore, but the manga captures the charm of the series completely, in my opinion.

Lol, okay, im done!! Sorry for such a long post, lol, i just coudnt stop. ^^;;

Haha, or maybe im just a nerd with too much time on his hands. >_>

BTW Im only 19!! I didnt mean to sound like an old man! lol

RubyJB88
March 27th, 2009, 06:31 PM
I also Love the character of Ruby, he is a huge departure from many generic anime/manga heroes. I also felt a deep personal connection to his character, in nearly all aspects.

Well said. Totally agree here.

Mika555
March 27th, 2009, 09:04 PM
Too original? Definitely not.

If you want something with the same linear and boring storyline as the games, then the anime is there for you. But if you want something that isnt exactly what you played through the games, with new and interesting characters, (And not the same guy for 500+ episodes..) Then Pokemon Special is a great outlet. Especially for fans like me, who have been with the series since the Beginning on Game Boy, and arent 12 years old anymore. I understand how Nintendo wants to keep this a childrens series, but I personally am getting bored with the games lately, and Special is actually exciting, there is action and even death in some points, it is definitely more realistic than the show where nothing bad ever seems to happen. Also, the characters in the Anime just seem boring. I mean, May left the team, and now Dawn is there, but they are basically the same person to me. =(
Other Rated E video games that I played over the years did had stable plotline so there is really no excuse for Gamefreak to make the Pokemon games repetitive. The primary reason I play video games is because of their storyline. The action and all other reasons are secondary. That is probably why some people look at the characters in the Pokemon games being generic and the same person in each generation. Of course I do not think that way I see them all as individuals characters. Also I think that is a bad sign that Pokemon Special has a more stable plot then the games in my opinion because I feel that the original story should be much better.

And also, like another poster mentioned, This version of Pokemon is the one the creator himself said is most like the world he envisioned.
It has been a while since Satoshi Taijri said that there is no telling how he feels about this manga currently since the plotlines has gone in a different direction then the games.

The Pokemon games themself are made to sell, not to entertain anymore, but the manga captures the charm of the series completely, in my opinion.
In my opinion I think that entertainment is what really entice individuals to buying a product and will help the company make more profit off the product.

I know people are probably going to bash and flame me for saying this though, but this is how I feel and I am allowed to voice my opinion on this matter.

Mileyangel
March 28th, 2009, 06:51 PM
Personally, I don't think there's such thing as too much originality. The Mask of Ice as a main villain was brilliant.

Sea Guardian
March 31st, 2009, 11:44 AM
^Oh Yeah! I completely forgot about that for a second, he was awsome.

T3h Kaiser
March 31st, 2009, 11:49 AM
The Watchmen film should be proof that sticking closely to the source material doesn't always work.

Aside from the whole "legendary bird trio merging" business, the originality worked in the manga's favor. I honestly think the game franchise should take more inspiration from it.

Mileyangel
March 31st, 2009, 01:03 PM
^Oh Yeah! I completely forgot about that for a second, he was awsome.

I know!!!! He's just so kicka*s!!!

red king
March 31st, 2009, 04:36 PM
i don't think the manga has a problem with originality it's was make special a great video game manga like the connection Red had with deoxys and Red's rematch with Giovanni using mewtwo vs Deoxys was awsome without words so i hope the keep it up

invisible-chan
April 4th, 2009, 02:24 PM
I'll just say yes. If I say anymore, people will think that I actually hate the manga, which isn't true.

Sea Guardian
April 5th, 2009, 09:11 AM
I know!!!! He's just so kicka*s!!!
Yup, and we never would've gotten to see him like that if the manga wasn't original.

AshMelody
April 12th, 2009, 05:54 PM
I personally think that the originality is what makes Pokémon Special really is Special. ;)
Why hate originality? That's good, and it never gets too much.
Unless if all Pokémon turned into humans in the manga, and the humans were gone. Now, that's what I call by TOO MUCH.

The Scientist
April 12th, 2009, 06:19 PM
You all are using the wrong word. The word you're thinking of isn't originality, it's congruency. So for all you genii who posted things like "you can never have too much originality", I recommend you edit your posts to actually contain an intelligent comment.

What the OP was trying to say is that the plotline for Pokemon Special is so far out there, so incongruent [to the games and anime] that it barely seems like the Pokemon world anymore. THAT is something I agree with.

RubyJB88
April 13th, 2009, 06:59 AM
Not that I find anything wrong with it, though.

invisible-chan
April 13th, 2009, 05:59 PM
I just wanna say, if anyone cares to read, it isn't the fact that PokeSupe is "original". PokeSupe would be a great manga in its own right, but the way it takes Pokemon and changes it to the extreme that is goes to is what bugs me personally. I love nostalgia, classics, remembering the "good old days". While I'm not quite "old", I do recall the old days of Pokemon. While I love the revamped animation and new plot, it kinda pisses oldbies off when they see that the team they're fighting against, instead of good ole Team Rocket, is a bunch of enviroterrorists or a bunch of computer geeks with spandex. I could make a DragonBall movie reference, but I think that would make me an [insert expletive here] at this point.

RubyJB88
April 14th, 2009, 11:56 AM
I don't think there's nothing wrong with having evil organizations that don't do the same thing that Team Rocket does. Otherwise wouldn't it be bland if they all did that?

pokefangunner
April 14th, 2009, 12:06 PM
i love pokmeon manga it is so great

Orang
April 30th, 2009, 12:06 AM
As long as they don't make their own regions, Pokemons, Gym Leaders and dex holder's names,

It's still not THAT original (or incongruent) for me.

Psyburn
April 30th, 2009, 07:58 AM
So you want clichéd storylines and predictable characters?

...


Step this way to the first series of the anime, please.


Now I want to read this stuff lol

The only thing thats turning me off is the character designs.

Doctor
May 2nd, 2009, 02:24 AM
I don't think it's too original at all. It's based on the games and doesn't care at all about what way the anime goes, and that's something I like. That this manga doesn't even follow the game storylines, but creates a Pokémon world of its own, that's something I admire.

I don't like that it begun to take too much unrealistic inspiration from the games in the Emerald arc though, like with PowerPoints and held items... it was a bit too much ._. I like the weird non-game-like merging of the three birds, the Mask of Ice storyline and Yellow arc much better then.



The only thing thats turning me off is the character designs.

Character designs? Apart from Yellows strange clothing (purple boots? tehe) and the very existence of Emerald, they pretty much look like they do in the games. But with a nice touch that makes them feel more alive and personal :D I like their designs.

RYOUKI
May 2nd, 2009, 03:29 AM
Too much originality, I agree. But it's what attracts me. Every character in the manga is very different from each other, unlike May and Dawn who just want to conquer every Pokemon Contest.

I love the fact that Sapphire focuses on Gyms, while Ruby goes for Contest, and neither Diamond and Pearl go for Gyms and Contest, while Lady Berlitz conquer both!

Spearow
May 2nd, 2009, 07:12 AM
To answer the OP's question directly, no.

They actually follow the basic essence of the games pretty closely - more closely than the anime, it seems to me. Obviously they can't follow it exactly, otherwise each new generation would have the same exact plot - and I can almost guarantee you that reading the whole gym-to-gym, beat Elite Four and take down evil team four times in a row routine would not be nearly as entertaining as playing it through. You also have to keep in mind that they're catering to an audience that has mostly already played the games, so they have to give the story their own interpretation to keep it fresh. I actually like how they incorporate familiar motifs and necessary plot points from the games in such a way that we can't predict exactly what will happen next, but we nod and smile every time we see something we recognize.

And as an example of an "original" twist that worked, the battling is much more entertaining to watch in Special than it is in the anime, where they essentially copied over the turn-by-turn format of the games.

Psyburn
May 4th, 2009, 06:12 AM
Character designs? Apart from Yellows strange clothing (purple boots? tehe) and the very existence of Emerald, they pretty much look like they do in the games. But with a nice touch that makes them feel more alive and personal :D I like their designs.

I guess it's their facial designs. I kinda like the ones from the tv show. Maybe it requires some adjusting to but gold looks like a villain from Bleach....

Dunsparce
May 4th, 2009, 06:27 AM
I get what you're saying, but I think that's why they have the Manga and then the Anime. Manga is definently better in my opinion, simply because it seems like a maturer pokemon themed world than the anime. The anime itself and the game are, I suppose, the 'true storyline' of pokemon. However, if it wasn't for that originality of the manga, would you have read it? I know I wouldn't have. :)

No no no no NO!!!

The Anime is NOT Canon!!!

The Manga is just as "Canon" as the Anime.

The only "True" canon is the VIDEO GAMES, BECAUSE THEY ARE THE ORIGINAL MEDIUM.

I get SICK of people constantly wanting the Orange Islands, Whirl Cup, Anime-Style Contests, ect. in the Videogames. Not to mention calling Red on Mount Silver "Ash" >:O

The Anime is loosely based on the Videogames, not the other way around.

At least the Manga doesn't make up a million towns and locations each region, or even regions themselves(The Orange Islands exist soley as a filler space between the Kanto and Johto Sagas). And who can forgoet the stupid choice to move all the Battle Frontier facilities to Kanto?

I'm at a breaking point here.

WHY do people talk about the Anime like it has just as much credibility as the games?!?

Psyburn
May 4th, 2009, 06:39 AM
Its the only thing that has an actual story, no matter how crappy it is.

Plus, not everyone has access to the manga like the cartoon. (Anime is NOT cartoon in japanese FYI)

Mr. bell
May 8th, 2009, 12:25 PM
No, I think the manga shows us that the pokemon universe can handle some more serious and mature content, and I love it.

invisible-chan
May 17th, 2009, 11:49 PM
No no no no NO!!!

The Anime is NOT Canon!!!

The Manga is just as "Canon" as the Anime.

The only "True" canon is the VIDEO GAMES, BECAUSE THEY ARE THE ORIGINAL MEDIUM.

I get SICK of people constantly wanting the Orange Islands, Whirl Cup, Anime-Style Contests, ect. in the Videogames. Not to mention calling Red on Mount Silver "Ash" >:O

The Anime is loosely based on the Videogames, not the other way around.

At least the Manga doesn't make up a million towns and locations each region, or even regions themselves(The Orange Islands exist soley as a filler space between the Kanto and Johto Sagas). And who can forgoet the stupid choice to move all the Battle Frontier facilities to Kanto?

I'm at a breaking point here.

WHY do people talk about the Anime like it has just as much credibility as the games?!?
Thank you! People don't seem to get that. While both the manga and the anime have many similarities to the games, they are, in fact NOT THE SAME! People also need to realize that whenever they quote, who was it Tajiri I think, when he said something along the lines of the manga being the closest to the world he imagined, that does NOT mean that it is exactly how he wanted it. It also does not mean that the randomly made up characters and the corruption in the original ones were not part of his plan either. The boundaries in the games that are erased in the manga is what I interpret his meaning of "most resembles the world [he] envisioned," or however that quote went.

RedJ
May 18th, 2009, 01:06 PM
In my opinion, there is no such thing as too much originality.

Anyway. Pokemon Special is based on the games, only the manga gives it a more in-depth plot. And there's the violence- its more realistic. And after all, there's more to it than "Imagetall8badgesandfightanevilteamalongthewayandsomehowinvolvealegenderypokemon". Sure that's somewhat what PokeSpecial does, but it gives it some...meat to the bones, if you will.

...Did that make any sense? :/

Clover Cat
May 27th, 2009, 03:39 PM
Too much originality?? I don't understand what you're trying to say. If it's originality that's the problem, that probably means that anything that is or has been based on pokemon previously is wrong. And it's not. Besides, Pokespecial is awesome because of it's originality, not because it's authors wanted to recreate the Pokemon games and anime as a manga. Do you really want every character to have the same kind of personality? Nah. I like Pokespecial because of it's amazing twists. Plot twists FTW!

And don't worry, RedJ, you made perfect sense ^^.

Mileyangel
May 29th, 2009, 07:24 PM
It's just because the anime is what is automatically thought of when the word "Pokemon" is brought up.