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Feign
April 22nd, 2010, 05:20 PM
So we all belong and otherwise identify with a country. Now to what importance does this signify? I would want to ask more questions, but that might get a bit tedious, and make for too much in one post.

But essentially, what is your view on nationalism, and why do you find it important, or not?

Stairmaster
April 22nd, 2010, 05:37 PM
I have little sense of nationalism for my country, because I am just so disgusted. However, I am grateful that I was born in a developed country, and lucky that I am usually not on the receiving end of the general corruption that occurs here.

But those are two completely different things. Grateful? Yes. Proud? Hell no.

Honest
April 22nd, 2010, 05:41 PM
I have little sense of nationalism for my country, because I am just so disgusted. However, I am grateful that I was born in a developed country, and lucky that I am usually not on the receiving end of the general corruption that occurs here.

But those are two completely different things. Grateful? Yes. Proud? Hell no.

I pretty much agree with this. The USA is a good country, but some things are just wrong, and lately, we've had leaders which don't know a single fart. Bush. I am happy to be born in a developed country though.

NarutoActor
April 22nd, 2010, 06:29 PM
Nationalism... no. I love some things about America, and some things suck. Sectionalism, now that... I am all for. Brooklyn<3

Silver
April 22nd, 2010, 06:33 PM
Nationalism... no. I love some things about America, and some things suck. Sectionalism, now that... I am all for. Brooklyn<3

Pretty much agree with this guy here.
Repping southeast wisconsin ftw.

Esper
April 22nd, 2010, 10:17 PM
I like to think of myself as a citizen of the world.

I identify more with my state (California) than the country and even then not the entire state. I have about as much in common with people in Small Town, Nebraska as I do with someone living in Vancouver, London or Melbourne, language being the most obvious thing, but I've lived abroad and I'm of the opinion that everyone generally wants the same things and I can identify with that. People everywhere are fundamentally equal and deserving so as far as the "My country right or wrong" idea goes I think it artificially and unnecessarily divides people along borders.

I don't like judging people based on how they were born and I take that to include where they were born. I also don't think there's any reason to love a country. I can love the things a country holds up as virtues without having to love the country as well.

Timbjerr
April 22nd, 2010, 10:59 PM
I think I'd like the U.S. better if there was no capitalism and the government wasn't so busy trying to appeal to every single lobbyist in Washington.

Besides, where is the line drawn between Nationalist Patriotism and Fascism?

Yusshin
April 22nd, 2010, 11:05 PM
Nationalism is good for clubs, sport teams, etc. Of course if you live near Ottawa, you'll want to cheer for the Senators, or if you live in Pittsburgh, you'll want to cheer on Sidney Crosby. That's normal. The problem is when we let these things divide us to start wars and other violent nonsense.

I like to think of myself as a citizen of the world.

^ This. We're all just citizens of this Earth; countries only exist because we have different beliefs in how things should work. The boarders shouldn't literally "divide" us, though.

The Fame Monster
April 23rd, 2010, 02:59 AM
sectionalism is just small scale nationalism. if you're against one and for the other your a hypocrite.

nationalism is only good when your the suppressed racial minority with cultural differences from the rest of the nation. such as the czechs in early germany and austria. nationalism was good for them because they needed a way to protect their culture and beliefs. no better way than to have your own country. but nationalism is bad when it makes people poeple that france is better than germany therefore you have to invade and take germany.

meh

like france would do that..-wink-

Guillermo
April 23rd, 2010, 03:22 AM
Like all countries, there are pros and cons. For the mostpart, I love Australia. However, I preferred England. Less scary insects and stuff. On the serious side, I'm glad where I am now. The society could be better, but overall Australia is a rockin' place.

^ This. We're all just citizens of this Earth; countries only exist because we have different beliefs in how things should work. The boarders shouldn't literally "divide" us, though.
What are you talking about? Countries only exist because we have different beliefs? That's silly. Countries exist so we can live on them, duh. We're not divided, just separated by gallons of water. Every country doesn't believe something different to all the others, really.

Yusshin
April 23rd, 2010, 03:35 AM
Every country has differences in laws and opinions, or culture and beliefs.

That's why countries were first made - because people couldn't agree on certain subjects, due to cultural differences. This lead to war and separation eventually - there's a tiny country in the middle of a country in Africa. You know where that came from? It came from people not agreeing with one another and wanting to create a country and form a government that they agreed with. It used to be a part of another country, but it separated a few years ago due to differences.

Languages also play a key role, since different languages have different backgrounds. Quebec, for example, is separate from the province of Ontario because they want their signs in French and their main language to be French. They were always fighting each other about certain things - finally, they decided to form Canada but be separate provinces with separate governments. This is why provinces and states are formed in general, and this is why countries appeared.

In olden times, when someone didn't agree with the king, they're start a riot. Later, when someone didn't agree with the government, they would riot, too. If they felt strongly enough about it, and their needs weren't fulfilled by their current government, they would leave and start a government of their own in a place that they create a settlement at, forming a new "country" if you want. That's pretty much the basis of it.

Guillermo
April 23rd, 2010, 03:39 AM
Every country has differences in laws and opinions, or culture and beliefs.

That's why countries were first made - because people couldn't agree on certain subjects, due to cultural differences. This lead to war and separation eventually - there's a tiny country in the middle of a country in Africa. You know where that came from? It came from people not agreeing with one another and wanting to create a country and form a government that they agreed with. It used to be a part of another country, but it separated a few years ago due to differences.

Languages also play a key role, since different languages have different backgrounds. Quebec, for example, is separate from the province of Ontario because they want their signs in French and their main language to be French. They were always fighting each other about certain things - finally, they decided to form Canada but be separate provinces with separate governments. This is why provinces and states are formed in general, and this is why countries appeared.
Just because every country has a few different rules doesn't make it a completely different country. No one is perfect. People don't all agree, seriously. Some countries speak more than one language, too. Fighting is a part of human life. And yes, I can see where you're coming from, and you make very valid points, but we're not all part of the earth. Look at what we're doing to it, anyway. We're killing it.

Yusshin
April 23rd, 2010, 03:41 AM
Canada and America are right next to each other, but they're separate countries. Our laws are pretty much the same, too, except that we permit drinking at a younger age, and we permit the possession of weed under 11 ounces, etc. Just small differences, but it's these differences that don't make us merge to form one giant country.

And yeah, it sucks about the earth :< I recycle, though. I don't litter either, so I do my part where I can xD Like buying recycled paper from Staples.

Guillermo
April 23rd, 2010, 03:49 AM
Canada and America are right next to each other, but they're separate countries. Our laws are pretty much the same, too, except that we permit drinking at a younger age, and we permit the possession of weed under 11 ounces, etc. Just small differences, but it's these differences that don't make us merge to form one giant country.

And yeah, it sucks about the earth :< I recycle, though. I don't litter either, so I do my part where I can xD Like buying recycled paper from Staples.
America and Canada have always been in constant disagreement for a very, very long time. The other changes don't matter.

Porygon-Z
April 23rd, 2010, 04:05 AM
I'm proud of the UK. Not for it's government or anything like that, but I'm proud of the people (Except all the chavs and Ricky Gervais who I hate) of the UK and of our history.

Guillermo
April 23rd, 2010, 04:12 AM
I'm proud of the UK. Not for it's government or anything like that, but I'm proud of the people (Except all the chavs and Ricky Gervais who I hate) of the UK and of our history.
The English have done a lot of crap, but they've also done a lot of good. I'm proud to be English.

Blue Nocturne
April 23rd, 2010, 09:15 AM
Hahahahhahhahaa. Proud to be British? Hahahahhaha...

The Government is corrupt and idiotic and the election system makes about as sense as Katie Price. We were the first country in the recession and the last out of it. Go to the wrong street and you could get your throat slit for 20p. We were responsible for the horrors that are Ricky Gervais and the BNP and the media is a bunch of lying, hypocritical scaremongers. We have mums at 14, smokers and binge drinkers at 13 and a society where people are terrified to talk to eachother. We have made religion an even bigger problem that it already is by enforcing ours on so many people, and we have endlessly exploited countries all over the world for our own benefit.

Am i proud to be British? Hahahahahhaha.

Yusshin
April 23rd, 2010, 09:22 AM
Every government has its issues and problems, and every country has bad things from the past.

The English, for example, invaded most of the world and forced their religion on the others. They killed hundreds of thousands, perhaps millions, of Indians when they settled in America. They beat down India pretty much and forced their language on the entire world - their aggression is what caused English to be the most widely-spoken language.

The Americans dropped the first atomic bombs and helped create what we call WWIII. They also have a big history of slavery and civil wars.

The Germans caused WWII and had the biggest genocide in history.

Those countries have the worst pasts in my opinion, from what I know of. As said, though, every country has good and bad things. I just don't agree with a lot of things the listed three countries have done. I don't agree with their governments either. Meh. Nobody's perfect. Canada's not all white after all. We had a civil war once, and a lot of the country hate the French and vice-versa mutually.

Zeph.
April 23rd, 2010, 09:30 AM
My opionion is divided on this.

As a Scot, I'm both for nationalism and against it at the same time if that makes any sense? :P

On one hand, I like how we try and ask for some international recognition instead of being tarred by the same brush (and thus labeled with the same faults) as Britain in general.

On the other, I feel we may be going out of our way to be noticed. I think our current government (the SNP that is) tries too hard to act like we aren't a part of the UK. While I do favour a degree of independance (as I previously stated), I also regocnise that being part of Britain is for the best. It is one of the most developed places in the world and an economic superpower. Not to mention it'd be ashame to abolish a nation that's been around for centuries.

^Also, the two atomic bombs helped end WWII ^.^

Yusshin
April 23rd, 2010, 09:37 AM
Yeah, but resorting to that... /shudders

I sometimes get concerned. They invaded Iran, where a lot of people believe it's for the oil (such as myself) - Alberta has a crapload of oil! What if they invade us next :s That scares me bad lol

In any case, that's a bit off-topic. Still, I love my country, but I realize that other countries are great, too :] Like Morocco, Peru... em... I'd say France, but they're racist over there a lot.

NarutoActor
April 24th, 2010, 06:43 AM
sectionalism is just small scale nationalism. if you're against one and for the other your a hypocrite.

nationalism is only good when your the suppressed racial minority with cultural differences from the rest of the nation. such as the czechs in early germany and austria. nationalism was good for them because they needed a way to protect their culture and beliefs. no better way than to have your own country. but nationalism is bad when it makes people poeple that france is better than germany therefore you have to invade and take germany.

meh

like france would do that..-wink-Sectionalism- the belief of putting a sections interest over the nation.

Nationalism-putting the nations interest over states interest.

There converse statements. So no hypocrisy here. :D

Esper
April 24th, 2010, 12:32 PM
Sectionalism- the belief of putting a sections interest over the nation.

Nationalism-putting the nations interest over states interest.

There converse statements. So no hypocrisy here. :D
That, or:

Nationalism: believing your nation is better and more deserving than other nations.
Sectionalism: believing your section is better and more deserving than other sections.

I believe this is more or less what The Fame Monster was getting at.

NarutoActor
April 24th, 2010, 05:30 PM
Okay, but you can still be against nationalism, but for sectionalism. Nationalism is not sectionalism on a bigger scale.