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Darthatron
November 15th, 2010, 06:13 AM
The layout for the Emulation section makes very little sense nowadays. There are subsections that would be much better off under different sections.

Current layout:
> Emulation
> Beginners Lounge
New to ROM Hacking or looking for a place to start? The Lounge is where the future hackers of tomorrow can come to discuss, showcase, and help out their fellow members while improving their own hack as they grow in skill and ability.
> ROM Hacking
> Tutorials
> Research & Development
> Toolbox
> Hacks Showcase
Want to play a hack? Here, you can play some good quality hacks… or you can make your own and submit it here! (Unless you can show a significant amount of development, your hack starts at the "Progressing Hacks" forum first.)
> Progressing Hacks
> Sideshow Showcase
> Team Discussions
Team up, start a formation of dedicated hackers and helpers. Here, you can discuss production of hacks with other groups, or make your own hacking group (through approval processes).

So as you can probably tell, it would make a lot more sense if the Beginners Lounge, Hacks Showcase and Team Discussions sections were put underneath the ROM Hacking forum, rather than the Emulation forum... Since, you know, they have far more to do with ROM Hacking than Emulation.

Suggested layout:
> Emulation
> ROM Hacking
> Beginners Lounge
> Tutorials
> Research & Development
> Toolbox
> Team Discussions
> Hacks Showcase
> Progressing Hacks
> Sideshow Showcase

The Hacks Showcase can probably stay in the position it's in now, since I would imagine most of the threads there would be about the emulation of the ROM Hacks, rather than the actual hacking of it.

Thanks for the consideration...

Cello
November 15th, 2010, 06:16 AM
+1 to this, I totally agree and support the idea.
I was actually just wondering why the layout is like that the other day. Definitely looks kind of sloppy.

E-Bag
November 15th, 2010, 06:25 AM
Indeed, it looks a little weird at the moment.

Zephyrion
November 15th, 2010, 06:36 AM
I'm sure its something the staff made. Although it would really be better in the layout you suggested. I've been confused with it nowadays and end up on the wrong part of the forum.

Patchisou Yutohru
November 15th, 2010, 06:45 AM
I think there's currently a discussion going on to combine the Emulation and ROM Hacking forums. The suggested format was purposed as:


Emulation and ROM Hacking

Hacks Showcase

Sideshow Showcase
Progressing Hacks


Beginner's Lounge

Tutorials
Toolbox



Team Discussions
Research & Development

Though the discussion in HQ has been inactive for two or so weeks.

Guy
November 15th, 2010, 06:47 AM
I can agree with this new set-up. It makes sense with the layout shown and all regardless of how little I know about this forum. ): The staff can easily make this change, but before we do, it's probably best to run it through with the current Emulation Moderators first. I believe as of recently, Manipulation requested to shift some of the sub-forums around too (which is what Patchisou posted above).

Darthatron
November 15th, 2010, 06:49 AM
Though the discussion in HQ has been inactive for two or so weeks.
Let's hope this thread re-ignites the discussion, then. But the fusing of the sections would still be worse than my suggestion, I think - though still much better than the current layout.

Thanks for posting!

Patchisou Yutohru
November 15th, 2010, 07:09 AM
I'm sure you know more about Emulation than I do. Why would your suggestion do better than fusing Emulation and ROM Hacking? Considering both of them are fairly inactive on their own compared to the other sub-forums, doesn't it seem reasonable to combine them? Share your opinions and experience with us.

Team Fail
November 15th, 2010, 07:15 AM
I like your idea. The current format isn't as good as the format we recently had. I would like this as it makes more sense. I +1 this.

Darthatron
November 15th, 2010, 07:29 AM
I'm sure you know more about Emulation than I do. Why would your suggestion do better than fusing Emulation and ROM Hacking? Considering both of them are fairly inactive on their own compared to the other sub-forums, doesn't it seem reasonable to combine them? Share your opinions and experience with us.

Well, it's just that the sections are profoundly different. On one hand, emulation is replicating the hardware of a gaming console via software, whereas ROM Hacking is the editing of Read Only Memory.

Simply put, the kind of questions asked in the emulation section are "What is the best kind of emulator for PSX games?", but the questions asked in ROM Hacking are more along the lines of "In Pokemon Gold, how can I make it so the player starts with Mew?", to fuse the two sections would cause confusion and would end up causing more work for the Emulation mods (to a similar extent that the Beginner's Lounge (http://www.pokecommunity.com/forumdisplay.php?f=212) has, in which nearly every thread has been closed, anyway).

The only connection that can be made between the two sections is cheats (GameShark, etc.), in which the ROM has to be reverse-engineered to find sections of the games internal coding so that they can be exploited to benefit the player. The reserve-engineering side of it is Hacking, where the useablity of the codes is Emulation.

Anyway, my point is: sure, they may be connectable, but so is Graphics in terms of the amount of new graphics added to a ROM Hack, so maybe the Pixel Art section should also be added to the Emulation section? ;)

So yeah, I would just personally prefer the sections to remain separate. But, in the end it's up to the Admins.

PS: Excuse if any of this made little sense - I am running on coffee.

Shinx
November 15th, 2010, 08:20 AM
I think there's currently a discussion going on to combine the Emulation and ROM Hacking forums. The suggested format was purposed as:


Emulation and ROM Hacking

Hacks Showcase

Sideshow Showcase
Progressing Hacks


Beginner's Lounge

Tutorials
Toolbox



Team Discussions
Research & Development



Though the discussion in HQ has been inactive for two or so weeks.This was my idea and I support this :). Emulation (the forum itself, not including sub-sections) is waaaaayy too inactive to have its own stand-alone forum.

Patchisou Yutohru
November 15th, 2010, 08:31 AM
Considering it's activity, do we even need an emulation forum to begin with? Why not just a general Emulation discussion thread for questions and answers and things like that? Since ROM Hacking is what PC is mostly known for, I think it'd make more sense to make ROM Hacking a main forum, rather than a sub-forum of Emulation.

Darthatron
November 15th, 2010, 08:32 AM
Considering it's activity, do we even need an emulation forum to begin with? Why not just a general Emulation discussion thread for questions and answers and things like that? Since ROM Hacking is what PC is mostly known for, I think it'd make more sense to make ROM Hacking a main forum, rather than a sub-forum of Emulation.

I agree, but that leads to the question of where said thread would go?

Patchisou Yutohru
November 15th, 2010, 08:34 AM
If the Emulation forum would be put to an end, the ROM Hacking forum would be the main forum, so there I would imagine.

Could always go in Research & Development, as well.

Melody
November 15th, 2010, 09:27 AM
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/8098578/1up_kc_1128081.jpg

I'm in. If the folks who frequent those areas really think it's worth it, and the staff is discussing it...might as well. Doesn't matter if my two cents are actually worth that or not. I could see a new logical layout reducing the number of confused n00bs who wander over here into CQ&F asking about ____ hack...or some other ROM hacking related question.

Kevin
November 15th, 2010, 11:18 AM
I think there's currently a discussion going on to combine the Emulation and ROM Hacking forums. The suggested format was purposed as:


Emulation and ROM Hacking

Hacks Showcase

Sideshow Showcase
Progressing Hacks


Beginner's Lounge

Tutorials
Toolbox



Team Discussions
Research & Development



Though the discussion in HQ has been inactive for two or so weeks.I'm in for this idea. It looks more well organized and since Emulation doesn't get that much activity merging that forum with ROM hacking will be a good idea. I also like how the Tutorials/Toolbox forums are in the Beginner's Lounge, and it's an easy way for new beginner's to find resources. I hope in the end this is the layout for the Emulation forums. It would also be easier for new people to find the ROM hacking section if they didn't know before that ROM hacking is Emulation.

LightOfTruth
November 15th, 2010, 11:31 AM
I rather it be called Rom Hacking and Emulation forum which is the other way around from what you posted:

ROM Hacking and Emulation forum
Hacks Showcase
Progressing Hacks
Sideshow Showcase
Beginner's Lounge
Tutorials
Toolbox
Team Discussions
Research & Development

QuilavaKing
November 15th, 2010, 09:47 PM
Tbh, I don't really think the beginners lounge should exist at all. It just splits up the threads that were already in the ROM Hacking section, so now people have to go to two different sections to see all of the threads they want to see, when there was plenty of room for them in ROM hacking to begin with.

Team Fail
November 15th, 2010, 10:03 PM
Tbh, I don't really think the beginners lounge should exist at all. It just splits up the threads that were already in the ROM Hacking section, so now people have to go to two different sections to see all of the threads they want to see, when there was plenty of room for them in ROM hacking to begin with.

Yes. The Beginner's lounge made everything confusing. How about we swap Rom Hacking and Emulation, making Emulation a sub-forum of Rom Hacking? That way, everything is kept, Rom Hacking is the way we want it, It is easier to find, and we don't have to go through Emulation to get to Rom Hacking, as Rom Hacking is far more popular than Emulation.

Platinum Lucario
November 15th, 2010, 10:10 PM
Much better! I've noticed the whole time that the Emulation forum has been completely inactive, this is exactly why it should be "Emulation & ROM Hacking" rather than just "Emulation", exactly like what Nick and many others have already said. Because what's really the point in the Emulation Forum having hardly any activity at all? It would be recommended that Emulation and ROM Hacking forums get merged together. And tbh, I was thinking about the same thing before, "Why are the Hacks Showcase forum and all other forums in the ROM Hacking forum?". And I still wonder about that same thing even today. Why should a Hacks Showcase forum be in the Emulation forum rather than ROM Hacking? It would be a great idea if the ROM Hacking section is merged with the Emulation forum. So I'm definately supporting this idea!

Tbh, I don't really think the beginners lounge should exist at all. It just splits up the threads that were already in the ROM Hacking section, so now people have to go to two different sections to see all of the threads they want to see, when there was plenty of room for them in ROM hacking to begin with.

Yes, now that's exactly what I've been talking about with giradialkia and colcolstyles. What's really the point in having the Beginner's Lounge forum? Because people will mistake the forum for asking questions about ROM Hacking when they actually have a Simple Questions thread for asking about ROM Hacking. Honestly... most of the time... people that post the new threads in the Beginners Lounge forum will end up having their threads closed by a Moderator, and yet the Beginners Lounge forum would feel rather too confusing for a member to even know what they should post in it. I repeat, they will easily mistake the forum for asking questions rather than post it in the Simple Questions thread.

Team Fail
November 15th, 2010, 10:22 PM
Because people will mistake the forum for asking questions about ROM Hacking when they actually have a Simple Questions thread for asking about ROM Hacking. Honestly... most of the time... people that post the new threads in the Beginners Lounge forum will end up having their threads closed by a Moderator, and yet the Beginners Lounge forum would feel rather too confusing for a member to even know what they should post in it.

This is easily seen by looking at my screen cap. Everything in RED are the threads that are locked as of the time/date of that screen cap. Everything in GREEN are opened threads. Remember that this is the first page. It should be vanquished, as it serves no real purpose, except as a place for confused new members to spam instead of reading the rules and posting in the Simple Questions Sticky.

Ninja Caterpie
November 15th, 2010, 10:23 PM
The idea behind the beginner's lounge is nice, but next to nobody understands what it's for (and those that do...well, they don't need it any more lol). At the moment, it's just causing confusion and extra work for mods, so... yeah. I don't see it getting any more useful any time soon.

After just looking at Emulation again...what was the point of the subforum? There are more sub-sub forums in Emulation than there are threads...kinda pointless, no? I agree with merging Emulation and ROM Hacking...and kinda just having a thread or two in it which are timeshifted from Emulation, like the save thread or simple questions.

Just my two cents.

Platinum Lucario
November 15th, 2010, 11:03 PM
This is easily seen by looking at my screen cap. Everything in RED are the threads that are locked as of the time/date of that screen cap. Everything in GREEN are opened threads. Remember that this is the first page. It should be vanquished, as it serves no real purpose, except as a place for confused new members to spam instead of reading the rules and posting in the Simple Questions Sticky.

Yeah, that's what I've also noticed... is that there's more closed threads than open threads. lol

The idea behind the beginner's lounge is nice, but next to nobody understands what it's for (and those that do...well, they don't need it any more lol). At the moment, it's just causing confusion and extra work for mods, so... yeah. I don't see it getting any more useful any time soon.

After just looking at Emulation again...what was the point of the subforum? There are more sub-sub forums in Emulation than there are threads...kinda pointless, no? I agree with merging Emulation and ROM Hacking...and kinda just having a thread or two in it which are timeshifted from Emulation, like the save thread or simple questions.

Just my two cents.

Yeah, it sure was a nice idea of the staff to think of the Beginners Lounge as a place to 'begin' their development for their ROM Hack. But the staff never knew that it would confuse members, they were not even aware of what was going to happen. They never even expected for threads asking questions about ROM Hacking to appear in the Beginner's Lounge forum, like what me, QuilavaKing, Team Fail and you have already stated.

And yes... it will indeed cause more work for the staff... that's why the Beginner's Lounge forum was useless to start off with. Like I said, I have already talked to giradialkia and colcolstyles about that forum... and they do agree with the fact that the forum serves no purpose... and only causes more work for the mods. I'm sure they would be glad if the Beginner's Lounge forum was to be removed and the Simple Questions thread to be moved back into the ROM Hacking forum, which might probably by then be Emulation & ROM Hacking.