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View Full Version : Suggestion: iz dis b coot? i dink it b


G.U.Y.
May 1st, 2011, 04:42 PM
Lately, I've seen a few members (especially ones who are old enough to realize how truly annoying it is) just posting every single post they can on the forum like this, "iz dis b coot? i dink it b"

I think it's annoying, and I think it should be considered spam if it already isn't.

But I want to know if other people agree with me or if I am being unreasonable..

Forever
May 1st, 2011, 04:45 PM
I honestly don't think it's an issue. As long as the post is still legible as a whole (and for me, contains at least four words in proper grammar, which those posts do), I think it's fine.

We can't police people into posting with proper grammar, and I'm pretty sure we're not going to make it against the rules to post in such a way.

Sydian
May 1st, 2011, 04:50 PM
I don't notice it that much. I've never seen someone post that nubby...I assume you're exaggerating greatly, but yeah. We can't force people to post with good grammar and such. Some members are younger and don't really have a full grasp of how to use a keyboard (why am I laughing as I type that?) or they just peck at the keys. And some are just lazy. Unless it's blatantly off topic, we can't really do much about it.

Lilith
May 1st, 2011, 04:50 PM
i say no because right now i dont feel like using proper grammar. im sure they have their reasons to use a less-than-fabulous kind of typing (browsing pc from phone or netbook?)

Vrai
May 1st, 2011, 05:02 PM
If their grammar offends you, you really don't have to read their post. They're just making their opinion less available to you and everyone else and that shouldn't be something that bothers you.

That said, if they're just spamming to talk like that then yeah, the posts should get deleted. You can't expect everyone to talk with perfect grammar, though.

Crimson5M
May 1st, 2011, 05:29 PM
i ink if u gramer soooo mutz ur gramer natzy !! !

Seriously though, you can't force people into typing correctly. I mean, grammar isn't the law. And also a lot of members who type like that are just too lazy to type properly. Let lazies be lazy.

G.U.Y.
May 1st, 2011, 06:01 PM
If their grammar offends you, you really don't have to read their post. They're just making their opinion less available to you and everyone else and that shouldn't be something that bothers you.

That said, if they're just spamming to talk like that then yeah, the posts should get deleted. You can't expect everyone to talk with perfect grammar, though.

Hmm..you're completely right.

I guess I was just being unreasonable. ^_^;

Hiroshi Sotomura
May 1st, 2011, 07:30 PM
In some forums, posts like that are barred - for instance, in ROM hacking, the sprite forums and others, we require constructive criticism rather than generic comments. We're not grammar nazis and we're not going to enforce netiquette, though.

fenyx4
May 4th, 2011, 08:57 AM
ROFL at the thread title. :cer_laugh:

i ink if u gramer soooo mutz ur gramer natzy !! !

Seriously though, you can't force people into typing correctly. I mean, grammar isn't the law. And also a lot of members who type like that are just too lazy to type properly. Let lazies be lazy.

Yeah, I agree, "n00b talk" can get insanely annoying (primarily because it may imply poor incoherent thoughts or a lack of effort on the poster's part), like the poster in question is an infant trapped in an teen's/adult's body with a minimal grasp on the concept of language and communication. However, proper typing shouldn't be construed as "Law of the Internet". The only time I even attempt to talk like that is when I'm making a comedic side comment in a post or something for the "LULZ".

Anyway, I tend to respect people a little more when they actually take the time to properly adhere to spelling and grammatical rules and such, rather than tyepin liek dis 4 @ lejit msg. I get irritated when people use erroneous spelling that ends up being longer than the actual proper word (i.e., Fireworks' nubby spelling of "natzy" seen earlier).

But typically, I don't like to be one who forces people to adhere to standards crafted by others, and I don't think rules should be implemented on the basis of what's annoying. "Annoyingness" is subjective to the user, and it shouldn't necessarily be reflected in rules and policies and such. But if you "n00b-type" for the purpose of solely contributing SPAM, that's when a rule can be constructed, as SPAM can objectively be seen to contribute essentially nothing to a forum.

In conclusion, I'd personally prefer such a rule for my eyes' sake, but a rule like this shouldn't really be imposed on users. If someone knows proper language and still wishes to convey their message in "n00b-type", I'll just let them be lazy. It's their loss if I just gloss over their eyesore-ish post and move on (thus rendering the time they spent typing for naught), and I'd rather spend time posting for discussion contribution than critiquing someone's conversational manner of speaking/typing. >_>

Avey
May 4th, 2011, 10:26 AM
Sorry, but for clarification purposes, are you talking about people tokin lyk dis or people just not paying attention to simple rules of grammar, such as capitalisations, apostrophes, etc.? 'Cause if it's the latter... what's the problem, exactly? Where's the misconception coming from (that adding in perfect grammar makes your post's content better, I mean)? Obviously you don't want something to be completely unreadable but when you're just typing without capitals because there's no need, I don't see the problem.

Fact: the best posts I've ever read on the internet, the ones filled with content and wisdom and laughter and whatever else, were all written in a lax manner (the examples I stated above).

Following basic grammar rules (for the most part) are easy. Do you think people don't follow them because they're not smart enough to figure them out or because they just can't be bothered acting like the internet is an English exam? If I want people to judge my literary abilities, I'll do a school test. If I want people to hear the opinions I'm expressing, I'll post whichever way I want to and that's probably the same opinion of anyone who posts as I've mentioned. There's no need to get so uptight about it; capitals; apostrophes and all those other things don't make or break a post.

Drew
May 4th, 2011, 10:54 AM
I love how the poll results are completely tied at this point..

Anyhoo, PC allows for a lot of different types of people, and while some forums do enforce the use of good grammar, I don't think PC really has to be one of them. D: Some of those people could be posting from their phone (which isn't an excuse, but oh well), and these days people just don't care as much as about good grammar. Back in my day, we had no l33t text speak, so some of us aren't used to it, but now days it's common. That's just how it goes.

fenyx4
May 4th, 2011, 11:50 AM
Some of those people could be posting from their phone (which isn't an excuse, but oh well), and these days people just don't care as much as about good grammar.

Hmm; I forgot about people posting from their phone or gaming systems (which is a bit weird, LOL.) I'm a bit lenient on that regarding readability...while I would prefer posts that didn't look like they came from a phone, typing "proper" with a phone keyboard looks like it takes forever. Even when making brief notes on my Nintendo Wii, typing out "proper" even using an onscreen conventional computer keyboard took a long time. I'd probably never attempt typing here from a phone (I don't text, anyway), and if I did, I'd probably re-format all of my 'phone posts' once I actually got to an actual computer. >_>

Typing "shorthand/"n00b talk"/text talk" does seem like it could save time when conveying a message. Even on RuneScape, while I normally employ standard spelling/grammatical rules, I have to use shorthand at times because the chat is real-time, and typing everything properly wastes a few seconds, which adds up in the long run. And there, whatever I typed quickly goes out of the chat window anyway, so it's not like people will be reading whatever I typed in a few hours. So it appears "time-saving" is another little benefit of "n00b talk", but to those who actually bother to consistently flesh out "proper" sentences from a phone, major props to them.

Oryx
May 4th, 2011, 11:59 AM
Just pointing this out...I think this refers more to lolspeak than text speak. In text speak for example, for the sake of shortness you would write either "is ths cute" or "is dis cute", not "is dis b coot". Everyone is talking about saving time, but these are two entirely different situations imo. Someone talking in text speak doesn't bother me as much.

Although honestly I don't think it's a big enough problem here to ban it. There are very few people who type that way, so it just adds headache and makes the forum look strict to people that just start posting here. If every thread is cluttered with posts that look like they came off of icanhascheezburger, then the ban should be reconsidered, although very leniently, i.e. if you post like that 10 times in your last 15 posts, you're infracted.

Edit: What a boring 666th post. >:/

Melody
May 5th, 2011, 04:15 AM
I would love a rule for this. Would it be fair? Apparently not. So I guess that's decided then.

I will say that I hate when people type like that anywhere you're not limited to X characters per post, where x is less than 300. I think it's inexcusable to type like that no matter who you are on a forum unless of course, you are doing so in a sarcastic/funny way and the entire post doesn't necessarily need to be done in that style.

That style of abbreviation has it's uses in text messaging/twitter/IM. That's the only place it need be completely accepted. Forums however don't need to accept that, and the least we could do is add a Guideline regarding that, asking that you refrain from doing that unless you're posting from mobile. It would make it clear that this isn't against the rules, but is discouraged unless it's necessary.

Alternative
May 5th, 2011, 05:29 AM
If there was a rule against chatspeak in general (aka when people t4lk lyk d1s), I would be for that, but there has to be some boundaries for it. If people excessively talk like that, it should be treated with a warning, then proceed to something more severe, but if someone just uses it for a joke, such as "y u no ____ 4?", then I see no harm in it.

If it's not too excessive, then I see no problem with it.

Melody
May 5th, 2011, 09:14 AM
Well, since people are complaining about it, why not include this as a gudeline?
A basic non-enforceable rule, which would fall under a "Tips" header, and pretty much make it obvious to staff who has/hasn't read the rules. ;)

I agree with the naysayers, they do have a point...but I don't think this should be entirely ignored, mostly because I find chatspeak/leetspeak to be highly annoying...and most of the internet does; it's usually only acceptable if you're doing it once to be silly, and not in every post.

Alinthea
May 5th, 2011, 10:55 AM
Well, I know it is a little annoying when someone posts a point towards the discussion and you can't understand them correctly, but there is a small section of the forums members who don't have English as a first language. So this could be one cause of some incorrect English, but it isn't really their fault as such and would be harsh to make this a rule.

The other is chat speak. Yes, this is also annoying, but it is apart of the technology age and can't be avoided really. Ever since the mid-days of technological communication, people have always found newer ways of faster communication. You could argue that this is a forum where users should be mature and intelligent to talk in the correct manner, but that is in an idel world.

Although it would be nice, I am against this suggestion because you just have the option not to interact with that poor post.

Avey
May 5th, 2011, 11:05 AM
Lately, I've seen a few members (especially ones who are old enough to realize how truly annoying it is) just posting every single post they can on the forum like this, "iz dis b coot? i dink it b"

I think it's annoying, and I think it should be considered spam if it already isn't.

But I want to know if other people agree with me or if I am being unreasonable..

ROFL at the thread title. :cer_laugh:



Yeah, I agree, "n00b talk" can get insanely annoying (primarily because it may imply poor incoherent thoughts or a lack of effort on the poster's part), like the poster in question is an infant trapped in an teen's/adult's body with a minimal grasp on the concept of language and communication. However, proper typing shouldn't be construed as "Law of the Internet". The only time I even attempt to talk like that is when I'm making a comedic side comment in a post or something for the "LULZ".

Anyway, I tend to respect people a little more when they actually take the time to properly adhere to spelling and grammatical rules and such, rather than tyepin liek dis 4 @ lejit msg. I get irritated when people use erroneous spelling that ends up being longer than the actual proper word (i.e., Fireworks' nubby spelling of "natzy" seen earlier).

But typically, I don't like to be one who forces people to adhere to standards crafted by others, and I don't think rules should be implemented on the basis of what's annoying. "Annoyingness" is subjective to the user, and it shouldn't necessarily be reflected in rules and policies and such. But if you "n00b-type" for the purpose of solely contributing SPAM, that's when a rule can be constructed, as SPAM can objectively be seen to contribute essentially nothing to a forum.

In conclusion, I'd personally prefer such a rule for my eyes' sake, but a rule like this shouldn't really be imposed on users. If someone knows proper language and still wishes to convey their message in "n00b-type", I'll just let them be lazy. It's their loss if I just gloss over their eyesore-ish post and move on (thus rendering the time they spent typing for naught), and I'd rather spend time posting for discussion contribution than critiquing someone's conversational manner of speaking/typing. >_>

I would love a rule for this. Would it be fair? Apparently not. So I guess that's decided then.

I will say that I hate when people type like that anywhere you're not limited to X characters per post, where x is less than 300. I think it's inexcusable to type like that no matter who you are on a forum unless of course, you are doing so in a sarcastic/funny way and the entire post doesn't necessarily need to be done in that style.

That style of abbreviation has it's uses in text messaging/twitter/IM. That's the only place it need be completely accepted. Forums however don't need to accept that, and the least we could do is add a Guideline regarding that, asking that you refrain from doing that unless you're posting from mobile. It would make it clear that this isn't against the rules, but is discouraged unless it's necessary.

If there was a rule against chatspeak in general (aka when people t4lk lyk d1s), I would be for that, but there has to be some boundaries for it. If people excessively talk like that, it should be treated with a warning, then proceed to something more severe, but if someone just uses it for a joke, such as "y u no ____ 4?", then I see no harm in it.

If it's not too excessive, then I see no problem with it.

Quoted these to address the post below:

Well, since people are complaining about it, why not include this as a gudeline?
A basic non-enforceable rule, which would fall under a "Tips" header, and pretty much make it obvious to staff who has/hasn't read the rules. ;)

I agree with the naysayers, they do have a point...but I don't think this should be entirely ignored, mostly because I find chatspeak/leetspeak to be highly annoying...and most of the internet does; it's usually only acceptable if you're doing it once to be silly, and not in every post.

There will have been eighteen posts in this thread by the time I post this and the quoted are the 'people who are complaining about it,' on top of that, the poll is 11 - 10. What does that tell us? Everyone who disagreed with the OP in this thread has been around here for quite a while and roughly half of them are staff members. On top of that, how many people do you think read this thread but didn't decide to do anything because they don't care enough?

The amount of people who have nonchalant attitudes towards whatever shorthand you guys are against are a lot more than the people opposing it. Just saying.

Hence a guideline isn't really necessary... that and the fact that 90% of the posters on PC make their posts as presentable as possible so it's pretty easy to see who's going against the flow.

Patchisou Yutohru
May 5th, 2011, 01:16 PM
i don't feel like using the shift key. does that mean that i'm breaking the rules? or is this just a suggestion for making it against the rules to type lik dis all da time?

i think some of you guys are making a big deal out of something really petty. i mean, this suggestion seems to have went from posting somewhat spam to how you type... and that to me seems so ridiculous. i would never support enhancing grammar nazi rules or even making guidelines on how to post. :|

and making a rule against chatspeak? absurd. i wouldn't go around infracting people for that even if it were a rule.

Hiroshi Sotomura
May 5th, 2011, 03:29 PM
It's not happening. Fullstop.