PDA

View Full Version : Lenora's Apron


Meduza
May 9th, 2011, 09:58 AM
It seems that there seems to be some controversy on Lenora's apron.

First, she recieved newer artwork with the apron slung over her shoulder rather than on her.

Then in the episode "A Night in the Nacrene City Museum!", several scenes edited put the apron completely.

So, what's the big deal over the apron? Do they find it offensive to African Americans (Even though we've seen Brock in an apron many times i nthe past) or just offensive to women in general?

Timbjerr
May 9th, 2011, 10:36 AM
You ever watch Gone With the Wind? Or read the book at least?

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_CcHV2wFn640/R8bZ1IvrchI/AAAAAAAAByA/X9OwN0yQZCM/s320/gone+with+the+wind.gif

The apron supposedly makes Lenora look like a charicature of the character Mammy, a less than flattering stereotype of the African-American slaves during the antebellum United States.

Seeds Horizon
May 9th, 2011, 10:38 AM
Um...What? Your calling racism or discrimnation against something so trivial? Hah.. Its an apron, im asuming it implies that she cooks a lot, seeing as the stereotypical womean does housework in aprons (Naked aprons..mm) like cleaning, and cooking. I think its no big deal, other than to show that Lenora is like the typical housewife.

Miss Doronjo
May 9th, 2011, 10:38 AM
Moving this to Pokemon Anime, unless it doens't belong there; it can be locked then.

Kenshin5
May 9th, 2011, 10:59 AM
It's only offensive when people make an issue of it. I am sure pokemon wouldn't make it blatantly controversial after the Jynx dilemma. Some times people need to look past on the trivial things and just enjoy pokemon for what it is(not to say stereotyping is trivial, but that is the last thought running through my mind while watching episodes that she is in).

Aquacorde
May 9th, 2011, 11:41 AM
I figured she wore it so her clothes didn't get dirty doing museum and archeological things, really. :/ It's just part of her outfit. Nothing to fuss over at all.

What the hell are they gonna do with Skyla and Elesa is my question. I mean, their normal attire is rather... skimpy.

Bluerang1
May 9th, 2011, 11:48 AM
Yeah it's the cook/maid thing. I prefer it gone anyway, she doesn't need it. She looks better and smarter without it. Now, those wide trousers... xD

Aquacorde
May 9th, 2011, 12:01 PM
How do you mean, "smarter"? As in, more intelligent or more like... sharper-dressed? 'Cause I really think either could apply here.

Zayin
May 9th, 2011, 02:05 PM
I figured she wore it so her clothes didn't get dirty doing museum and archeological things, really. :/ It's just part of her outfit. Nothing to fuss over at all.
My thoughts exactly! I never associated her apron with cooking and cleaning. She's way more masculine than her husband anyway and I bet he's the one doing these tasks :P!

I find it ridiculous American people see racism against Afro-Americans in Pokemon. Honestly, I don't think the Japanese people care about the topic at all as there are so few of this ethnicity in Japan.

Kirbychu
May 9th, 2011, 06:25 PM
I find it ridiculous American people see racism against Afro-Americans in Pokemon. Honestly, I don't think the Japanese people care about the topic at all as there are so few of this ethnicity in Japan.
The developers and writers of Pokemon aren't stupid people, they know that their games and anime will be distributed across the entire world. Many of Japanese developers for other games, anime, and manga acknowledge the issue as well. Japan still has many negative racial stereotypes, but it's not nearly as bad as it was before. Companies with international products specifically are being a lot more sensitive.

Frostik
May 9th, 2011, 06:50 PM
I find it ridiculous American people see racism against Afro-Americans in Pokemon. Honestly, I don't think the Japanese people care about the topic at all as there are so few of this ethnicity in Japan.
The Japanese are not going to cause another Jynx incident if they can help it, since we don't need a black woman screaming, "Mammie!" over Lenora's apron. Because who do you think saw the stereotype there in the first place and made the big deal out of it? An African-American woman.

And there's just white-ethnic guilt, on top of it. If the Japanese didn't consider it (and they probably did, given how fast that apron was removed from her original design [I can't call it Sugimori art, since he doesn't seem to be the only artist on board anymore], long before it was intended to be released internationally), it was the white head honchos stateside who would make sure there wasn't yet another witch hunt, given that Lenora's not a woman being mistaken for she's not (ganguro, thanks there, Jynx). She's black. Not tan, not ambiguously shaded, but black.

Never mind what the apron is used for, there is one thing adults are going to see it as: a civil rights killer. And that thing should never have been pink, I might add. And she looks so much better without it, design-wise. I love the outfit she wears so much.

TheGr8
May 9th, 2011, 10:01 PM
I didn't mind her apron at all, and didn't think anything in a negative way about it. Although now I do like her design a lot better now.

Zayin
May 10th, 2011, 02:53 PM
The Japanese are not going to cause another Jynx incident if they can help it, since we don't need a black woman screaming, "Mammie!" over Lenora's apron. Because who do you think saw the stereotype there in the first place and made the big deal out of it? An African-American woman.

And there's just white-ethnic guilt, on top of it. If the Japanese didn't consider it (and they probably did, given how fast that apron was removed from her original design [I can't call it Sugimori art, since he doesn't seem to be the only artist on board anymore], long before it was intended to be released internationally), it was the white head honchos stateside who would make sure there wasn't yet another witch hunt, given that Lenora's not a woman being mistaken for she's not (ganguro, thanks there, Jynx). She's black. Not tan, not ambiguously shaded, but black.

Never mind what the apron is used for, there is one thing adults are going to see it as: a civil rights killer. And that thing should never have been pink, I might add. And she looks so much better without it, design-wise. I love the outfit she wears so much.

The developers and writers of Pokemon aren't stupid people, they know that their games and anime will be distributed across the entire world. Many of Japanese developers for other games, anime, and manga acknowledge the issue as well. Japan still has many negative racial stereotypes, but it's not nearly as bad as it was before. Companies with international products specifically are being a lot more sensitive.

I didn't mean to say the Japanese producers are naive enough not to consider the possible reaction of International viewers. All I meant is that Americans who see racism in the anime shouldn't, as I highly doubt the Japanese producers even think of black people when writing it. Here I'm obviously referring to the Jynx incident since Lenora is black. Still, I bet they just intended to design her with an apron either because she wants to keep the archaeological dust off her clothes or because they wanted to make her look more feminine. I bet her designer never thought about slaves at first glance.

Spinor
May 10th, 2011, 10:56 PM
Once again, it's always the blacks. It's ALWAYS the blacks. You don't see Mexicans complaining about their American stereotypes. Asian people don't complain either. Nor Native Americans because its either true, or they simply don't give a damn. 'Texans are weirdos everything is bigger' We don't complain because its true. We still have cowboys. We laugh at the stereotypes being taken as true for all Texans. Speedy Gonzales is aired in Mexico. Who cares right? Because we do have a few drunkards and we enjoy the cartoon! And when some Anime shows a 'foreigner' and depicts an Engrish of the worst possible case, a white person in an internship in Japan is not gonna file a complaint or cause an uproar because they either enjoy it or could care less.

So WHAT the heck of rights does the African American population have to screw with the media? And actually, this is exclusively USA African Americans, because African Mexicans aren't even generally 1% the sensitivity to racial remarks.

To the population of America and the world. Grow up.

Seeds Horizon
May 11th, 2011, 07:04 AM
Once again, it's always the blacks. It's ALWAYS the blacks. You don't see Mexicans complaining about their American stereotypes. Asian people don't complain either. Nor Native Americans because its either true, or they simply don't give a damn. 'Texans are weirdos everything is bigger' We don't complain because its true. We still have cowboys. We laugh at the stereotypes being taken as true for all Texans. Speedy Gonzales is aired in Mexico. Who cares right? Because we do have a few drunkards and we enjoy the cartoon! And when some Anime shows a 'foreigner' and depicts an Engrish of the worst possible case, a white person in an internship in Japan is not gonna file a complaint or cause an uproar because they either enjoy it or could care less.

So WHAT the heck of rights does the African American population have to screw with the media? And actually, this is exclusively USA African Americans, because African Mexicans aren't even generally 1% the sensitivity to racial remarks.

To the population of America and the world. Grow up.



May I ask you what rights the media has to screw with everyone else? Also, on the subject of rights, who gave you the right to tell everyone what to do? (>3.3)>. Let people raise hell over what they wish to, no one gave you the authority nor the power to tell them what to raise hell about or when. If you want to complain about it, go take it up with someone who can actually do something about it, because to me it seems that your trying to start a fight where it would be pointless to do so.

And yes, I mean to come off as rude, because topics and discussions like these really GRIND MY GEARS as Peter would say. It all seems pointless to waste our time fighting about meaningless things especially since talking about it like this does absolutely nothing to help nor hinder the issue >_>.