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Gothitelle.
August 5th, 2011, 07:19 AM
I read this article about how in Brazil, they not only have a Gay Pride day but they are coming out with a Hetrosexual Day. And everyone is saying that it's homophobic.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/44026478/ns/world_news-christian_science_monitor/?gt1=43001

Think about it, if we had a White Pride day, it'd be 'racist', if we had a day to honor men, we'd be 'sexist'.

Why?

Why are straights not allowed to have a day to feel proud? Or men? Men have ALOT to be proud about, and so do whites? Thoughts?

(and this is not a topic about if homosexuality is wrong or right)

deoxys121
August 5th, 2011, 07:26 AM
I fully understand what you're saying here. The United States was founded on Freedom of Speech, which is the only thing that allows these pride marches and what-not. However, only allowing them for minorities, women, and homosexuals (in other words, people who have been looked down upon in the past, and sometimes still are today) is not right. If they can do it, so can we. Quite simply, it would be unconstitutional in the United States to not allow a specific group to show their pride for a day, no matter what that group may be, because it would violate their constitutional right to Freedom of Speech. True, the general public might not be too big on it, but again, we have our Freedom of Speech.

Went
August 5th, 2011, 08:08 AM
Basically, white heterosexual men have been "the right way to be born as" for hundreds of years- they got the power, the moral acceptance of everybody, etc. And, if you were something else, you were unnatural, strange, inferior. That's why women, gay people, black people, etc, have special days- to celebrate that our world has evolved to (generally) accept them as equals instead of chasing and burning them down. They were proud to be a minority, they were proud to have been considered "inferior" for so long and still be around.

By this logic, the previously dominant group shouldn't have anything to celebrate as they have been celebrating it during the past two millenia, simply by taking power and spreading their ideas.

Of course, if we have a day to celebrate potatoes, I don't see the problem of having a "White-hetero pride day". But having social majorities celebrating that they are the majority could feel kinda discriminative for the other groups.

Esper
August 5th, 2011, 08:42 AM
Why do men, white people, and heterosexuals need a pride day? Every day is already a pride day for them. Having one for those groups is excessive.

Livewire
August 5th, 2011, 08:45 AM
Why do men, white people, and heterosexuals need a pride day? Every day is already a pride day for them. Having one for those groups is excessive.

I think being the beneficiaries of Western Civilization for the past 2,000 years ought to suffice.

Alli
August 5th, 2011, 12:02 PM
Why celebrate acceptance for those that were already accepted? The only people that seem to have been born with acceptance are white heterosexual males. Head of house, slave owners, majority of presidents of the USA, etc. We study white males in history every day (in America anyway, so I'm speaking from an American standpoint) so why should whites, heterosexuals, and/or men have a day dedicated to them when every day/month that's not dedicated to a minority is technically dedicated to them? I see where you're coming from, and it's a shame it'd be viewed as racist, etc, but it's just not needed. They didn't overcome things women, blacks, hispanics, homosexuals, etc have overcome, and unfortunately, not even everything has been overcome. These days/months dedicated to minorities and the steps they've taken give hope to this generation, whether in that minority group or not, so that we can continue to rise above and eliminate the racism, sexism, etc that exists.

Kyoko
August 5th, 2011, 12:21 PM
Why do men, white people, and heterosexuals need a pride day? Every day is already a pride day for them. Having one for those groups is excessive.

THIS. I remember a girl in my history class complaining "why is there African history month? Or Asian history month? Where is our White history month!?!" Ummm...pretty much all of US History IS White history :| we don't need a month dedicated to that when we already have it in our curriculum.

The point of having pride days/months/whatever is for those who want their story and lives understood by people who don't really get it. Since we learn about white history all the time we don't need it, but African history and Asian history and Gay pride is something that is covered less or was at one time covered less. This was the way of telling everyone about it and getting them to learn and accept it.

Gymnotide
August 5th, 2011, 12:25 PM
I lol'd at the idea. Pride is about having endured pain and suffering as a whole entity, bringing like people together and showing them that society has no right to take away their individuality, not a petty show of arrogance. It should be called Straight Hubris.

Gothitelle.
August 5th, 2011, 12:27 PM
Don't assume because they are hetro, male or white, they don't go through struggles. They do. And especially with Men vs Women with one side thinking that they are superior and expect to be treated better than men. Men at least deserve a day because it seems like no one realizes they have rights to.


They (minority groups) can now pretty much use the fact that they are minorities to get what they want from the government. This isn't an attack on minorities because I am half black, so I am one. But that's what it seems like.

Gymnotide
August 5th, 2011, 12:28 PM
Don't assume because they are hetro, male or white, they don't go through struggles. They do. And especially with Men vs Women with one side thinking that they are superior and expect to be treated better than men. Men at least deserve a day because it seems like no one realizes they have rights to.


They (minority groups) can now pretty much use the fact that they are minorities to get what they want from the government. This isn't an attack on minorities because I am half black, so I am one. But that's what it seems like.

Who doesn't realize, exactly?
The whole point is that everyone realizes. Otherwise, we wouldn't any of what you mentioned.

Gothitelle.
August 5th, 2011, 12:29 PM
Who doesn't realize, exactly?


People who are cheering the feminazi movement....

Ultraviolence
August 5th, 2011, 12:35 PM
The reason that possibly Men, Whites and Straight people don't have any sort of 'Pride' day is this; they were never considered minorities.

Alli
August 5th, 2011, 12:37 PM
Don't assume because they are hetro, male or white, they don't go through struggles. They do. And especially with Men vs Women with one side thinking that they are superior and expect to be treated better than men. Men at least deserve a day because it seems like no one realizes they have rights to.

Everyone has struggles. But who gets the rougher struggles and has to fight off more prejudice? Blacks. Gays. Women. Muslims. White straight men have rights too, yes. But they've always had rights. They never really had to fight for them, unless you're talking about Americans fighting the British for freedom, which to reiterate, is studied nearly every year in American schools and is celebrated on July 4th. If you want "white straight man day" then July 4th pretty much sums that up for you.

Astinus
August 5th, 2011, 12:39 PM
The "feminazi" movement makes feminists look bad.

Don't assume because they are hetro, male or white, they don't go through struggles.
The day that a straight, white, cissexual, able-bodied male is treated horrible in society because he's any one of those things, then they can say that they have the same struggles as minorities. But there hasn't been a time when straight, white, cissexual, able-bodied males have been largely treated as if they were less than humans or denied rights and services (and I'm thinking more of in American history, since I am American). Otherwise, they're just taking away the attention of minorities who have actually struggled all through history and putting it all on men, making the minorities' struggles invisible.

They (minority groups) can now pretty much use the fact that they are minorities to get what they want from the government.
All minorities want is to be treated the same as straight, white, cissexual, able-bodied males.

Kyoko
August 5th, 2011, 12:40 PM
Don't assume because they are hetro, male or white, they don't go through struggles. They do. And especially with Men vs Women with one side thinking that they are superior and expect to be treated better than men. Men at least deserve a day because it seems like no one realizes they have rights to.


They (minority groups) can now pretty much use the fact that they are minorities to get what they want from the government. This isn't an attack on minorities because I am half black, so I am one. But that's what it seems like.

I don't care if you're a minority, it doesn't make what you said suddenly okay. Minorities are still treated as inferior, for example: a study was run where they sent in applications with the exact same qualifications but one application had a stereotypically white name, and the other had a stereotypically black name. The person with the white name got the calls for the job. So yes, government programs like affirmative action are still needed because minorities still aren't treated completely fair.

White men have rights and freedoms and we do know it. That's why minorities are fighting be to equal in the first place :/

Gold warehouse
August 5th, 2011, 01:00 PM
I don't see why having a special day is a big deal. I don't really need a 'celebration day' to tell me who to respect; although I can see why groups of people who have been oppressed in the past might want one, because there are obviously some people who would have no idea about the past struggles of minorities. But I personally just ignore all 'celebration' days whether they're about pride or not.

People coming up with the idea of having a white/hetero pride month are clearly doing it for the 'principle'; they're throwing their toys out of the pram over the fact there's gay/black/etc. pride. If you don't like it, then just ignore it, don't get upset and demand to have your own special day. What's there to celebrate anyway? Countless wars?

Alice
August 5th, 2011, 01:13 PM
It's not that there's anything wrong with it... it's just kind of pointless. Pride days are meant to make minorities feel welcome, and since Heterosexuals/Whites are by far the majority (in America anyway) having a pride day for them doesn't actually accomplish anything but annoy the minorities that pride days were created for in the first place.

-ty-
August 5th, 2011, 01:29 PM
Alright, this is one of my big pet peeves. When heterosexual white people cannot have something that some else has. There was this girl in my school that said that no one liked her because she was white; the entire school was white. LMAO

Ok, anyway. Every human should be equal. Whether we admit it or not, gay, black, Hispanic, Muslim, disabled, transgender, and several other minority groups are not treated as equals to white Christian heterosexuals, some of these groups more so than others. When affirmative action and civil rights laws are enacted, the scales are tipped a little closer to the normative group, but still a long ways to go to equity. When white people complain that the scales are getting closer to equal they freak out and act as if the other groups are getting special treatment. Affirmative action and Pride days are just a few ways that minority groups achieve more rights. If there was a white pride day, it would just cancel out the other minority groups.

And like Scarf said, don't we celebrate the normative lifestyle everyday? Just turn on a tv, how many people are white and heterosexual? If I didn't know any better, the television stations are celebrating white pride day, lol. That is why BET was created, black people felt that they were being left out by MTV. I have heard white people freak out and say that it is not fair that "they" get a station just for themselves. I just responded that almost every other channel would be considered "white" channels if you had to place a label on them. So one channel is not preferential treatment.

Gothitelle.
August 5th, 2011, 01:33 PM
I don't care if you're a minority, it doesn't make what you said suddenly okay. Minorities are still treated as inferior, for example: a study was run where they sent in applications with the exact same qualifications but one application had a stereotypically white name, and the other had a stereotypically black name. The person with the white name got the calls for the job. So yes, government programs like affirmative action are still needed because minorities still aren't treated completely fair.

White men have rights and freedoms and we do know it. That's why minorities are fighting be to equal in the first place :/

Affirmative Action is crap. Not only because the fact that your not white, is your ticket to work, but it makes it seem like minorities can't get a job based on qualifications. In short, I don't need to be auto approved because I'm biracial. I'd rather be accepted for what I can bring to the table. If someone else has it better, then so be it.

In short, I do believe that we are all treated equal. Now all I am seeing is one side trying to get more. Which, in short, if we didn't have ANY pride, days....

-ty-
August 5th, 2011, 01:35 PM
Don't assume because they are hetro, male or white, they don't go through struggles. They do. And especially with Men vs Women with one side thinking that they are superior and expect to be treated better than men. Men at least deserve a day because it seems like no one realizes they have rights to.


They (minority groups) can now pretty much use the fact that they are minorities to get what they want from the government. This isn't an attack on minorities because I am half black, so I am one. But that's what it seems like.


Hetero, male, or white people may go through struggles, but not based off their sexual or racial identity.

Oryx
August 5th, 2011, 01:39 PM
Affirmative Action is crap. Not only because the fact that your not white, is your ticket to work, but it makes it seem like minorities can't get a job based on qualifications. In short, I don't need to be auto approved because I'm biracial. I'd rather be accepted for what I can bring to the table. If someone else has it better, then so be it.

The point is that it's been proven that you won't be given an equal shake just because of your race. That's the idea behind affirmative action - it's forcing companies to give people of every race an equal chance at something, which doesn't always happen.

However, I have mixed feelings. When you think about the big picture it's all well and good, but it does frustrate me a bit that I can be just as qualified as the next person, sometimes even more so, and get rejected for the job just because they need to fill a quota of black people and I'm white.

-ty-
August 5th, 2011, 01:52 PM
Affirmative Action is crap. Not only because the fact that your not white, is your ticket to work, but it makes it seem like minorities can't get a job based on qualifications. In short, I don't need to be auto approved because I'm biracial. I'd rather be accepted for what I can bring to the table. If someone else has it better, then so be it.

In short, I do believe that we are all treated equal. Now all I am seeing is one side trying to get more. Which, in short, if we didn't have ANY pride, days....

Ticket to work!!!??? Really?
Black unemployment 15.8 percent.
White unemployment 7.7 percent.

Also, how are gay and straight people treated as equals. I cannot marry, adopt, or be a boy scout leader, lol. But really the Supreme Court ruled that the Boy Scouts are permitted to ban homosexuals as leaders b/c they have the potential to be pedophiles! Aside from legalities, gay, Muslim, transgender, and so on and so forth, do not have social equity. The media is dominated by straight Christian culture. These pride days are for social awareness, that minority groups are also part of our culture, even though much less recognized.

Anders
August 5th, 2011, 02:16 PM
You guys are saying white people have got it all, but for me where I live, if you aren't part of one of the minorities that make up the majority then you're made fun of for being a white boy.

I'm not saying we need a day to celebrate ourselves any more than every other day celebrating something. Just pointing out that this is the 21st century, being white doesn't give you superiority or more respect over anybody else.

I'm surprised to see people actually fighting the idea though.

Gymnotide
August 5th, 2011, 02:51 PM
People who are cheering the feminazi movement....

Even if they are extremists, the reason they are is because they realize that men have rights. You said pretty clearly that people need to "realize" this, but I was saying that feminism (as a whole, extremists and all) wouldn't exist if they didn't recognize that some groups are freer than others. It's a distinction to be made between "realizing that men have rights" and "men have rights and that isn't fair, so I'm going to be a douche and oppose them".

Blue Nocturne
August 5th, 2011, 02:55 PM
Why celebrate acceptance for those that were already accepted? The only people that seem to have been born with acceptance are white heterosexual males. Head of house, slave owners, majority of presidents of the USA, etc. We study white males in history every day (in America anyway, so I'm speaking from an American standpoint) so why should whites, heterosexuals, and/or men have a day dedicated to them when every day/month that's not dedicated to a minority is technically dedicated to them? I see where you're coming from, and it's a shame it'd be viewed as racist, etc, but it's just not needed. They didn't overcome things women, blacks, hispanics, homosexuals, etc have overcome, and unfortunately, not even everything has been overcome. These days/months dedicated to minorities and the steps they've taken give hope to this generation, whether in that minority group or not, so that we can continue to rise above and eliminate the racism, sexism, etc that exists.

I agree with you, but if minorities continue pride days, wouldn't that just continue any prejudices that remain that we're different and deserve to be treated as such?

Kyoko
August 5th, 2011, 03:09 PM
Affirmative Action is crap. Not only because the fact that your not white, is your ticket to work, but it makes it seem like minorities can't get a job based on qualifications. In short, I don't need to be auto approved because I'm biracial. I'd rather be accepted for what I can bring to the table. If someone else has it better, then so be it.

In short, I do believe that we are all treated equal. Now all I am seeing is one side trying to get more. Which, in short, if we didn't have ANY pride, days....

I personally believe affirmative action does more harm than good, but I apologize for not making it clear in my first post. I was trying to show the reason behind having it in the first place was to ensure minorities were getting a chance at work and education because they were getting denied for being a minority. So while it may not be helpful now, it certainly was back when the policy was introduced. And I also proved that exact statement in my last post, employers are still unfortunately biased or racist and even though minorities have the same qualifications as someone white, the white person got the job first in the study. It was a recent study too. Sad, but true.

Except we're not. Why else are there fights for gay rights? Why did we have affirmative action in the first place? If we were always equal, why the need for social movements? We might all be people, but there still is prejudice out there.

G.U.Y.
August 5th, 2011, 03:10 PM
I agree with you, but if minorities continue pride days, wouldn't that just continue any prejudices that remain that we're different and deserve to be treated as such?

Only a truly horrible person would really think someone should be treated with hatred because they're proud of who they are.

They're celebrating themselves being accepted, not themselves being different.

Me: Oh my god! I am so proud that I am a college graduate!
Person: OMGZORZ I HATE YOU AND ALL COLLEGE GRADUATES!

Shining Raichu
August 5th, 2011, 05:20 PM
as long as they don't flaunt it, well gays do that....

Oh Bluerang, you came so close to not showing your prejudices. THIS CLOSE *makes small gap between fingers*... Ah well, maybe next time.

Anyway, I say let people celebrate what they want. I personally don't see the need for a white pride day or a heterosexual pride day, but if the poor dears don't feel special enough without a parade then they should be able to have one. Tomorrow, I'll start planning my float for the Left-Handers Pride Parade. I'm thinking florals.

Kylie-chan
August 5th, 2011, 05:51 PM
Something that always makes me laugh is privilege pride and those who defend the need for it. You're within your rights to have it, but if you think it isn't a kneejerk reaction to minority pride movements then congratulations on colonising Mars.

Be proud of your heritage, regardless of what it is; I fully advocate being proud of who you are. But the mindset behind majority pride days is often dismissive of what minorities have fought for in order to reach this point. White, straight, cvisgendered men have been able to have public pride days forever. There are other ways to express pride in your heritage, rather than appropriating something oppressed groups do to raise awareness and celebrate their accomplishments in fighting for civil rights. The quote Shining Raichu highlighted is the epitome of why straight pride days are seen as in bad taste.

Doesn't help that white supremacist groups have adopted 'white pride' as well; I'm not saying you're a white supremacist for 'white pride', but it's something a lot of people are going to instantly associate it with.

We're so PC nowadays.

I wholeheartedly enjoy being un-PC, but when it's used as a veil for prejudice (and frankly the majority of 'privilege pride' is likely motivated by such, rather than wanting to have a laugh over a touchy subject), no, that's disgraceful.

Livewire
August 5th, 2011, 06:21 PM
Don't assume because they are hetro, male or white, they don't go through struggles.

White people were never kidnapped from their homes and sold as slaves. They also weren't forcefully evicted from their ancestral homelands, They never were the victims of ethnic genocide, and they weren't shepparded like cattle along a 3,000 mile trek to the American Midwest, without food or water. White people were also never sent to concentration camps without just cause, just because they were Japanese. On that sort of level, white people as a race have never experienced any sort of discrimination or hardship, your view of history is completely jaded and backwards.

pokecole
August 5th, 2011, 06:28 PM
From all this talk I start to think that some of you might not know what pride really means.

Pride: A feeling of pleasure from one's own achievements, the achievements of those with whom one is associated, or from qualities or possessions that are widely admired.

White people, straight people, gays, black people, asians, and whoever else all have achievements of their own. Why not just let them all be proud of it? It's not exactly hurting anyone being proud.

Shining Raichu, I have one question. Can I join you in the left-handed parade? lol

Kylie-chan
August 5th, 2011, 07:07 PM
From all this talk I start to think that some of you might not know what pride really means.

Pride: A feeling of pleasure from one's own achievements, the achievements of those with whom one is associated, or from qualities or possessions that are widely admired.

White people, straight people, gays, black people, asians, and whoever else all have achievements of their own. Why not just let them all be proud of it? It's not exactly hurting anyone being proud.

Shining Raichu, I have one question. Can I join you in the left-handed parade? lol

I'm a little confused here. What is it you are arguing white people should be proud of? If you mean overcoming discrimination and hardship targeted at their race, then I point at you at Live_Wire's post. If you mean personal accomplishments, then a white pride day isn't really appropriate for that.

I by no means intend to disparage anyone's right to be proud of their heritage, but pride days (pride days is a phrase, not two separate words to be interpreted differently) are supposed to be about celebrating the success of a group in becoming accepted. Everyone should be proud of who they are, but if their group has never been mass-targeted by the atrocities historically committed upon certain minority groups, then why do they need a pride day?

Oryx
August 5th, 2011, 11:41 PM
I would like to point out here the difference between race and heritage. There are white people that have experienced hardships, discrimination, hate in the past. Take, for example, the Irish when they came over to America after the potato famine. But they weren't hated because they were white - they were hated because they were Irish. If you asked to make an Irish Pride Day, you wouldn't be considered racist or anything like that I'm fairly certain, in fact I've actually been to a few of those (Us Notre Dame students take our Irish heritage pretty seriously haha). White people were never discriminated against as a race, but different heritages were at times.

It actually makes me feel bad that while white people can have Irish Pride, English Pride, any kind of country they're from pride, but black people don't often have that luxury. How many people do you know have Botswana, Chad, Kenya, Ghana pride? I never see that; only black pride.

mystletainn
August 6th, 2011, 12:02 AM
People can be proud of whatever the hell they want as long as it's not hurting anyone and it's not anyone's goddamn business in the end. People who say "straight pride needs to exist too" or "where's white history month?" can rot in hell to be honest with you.

However, most days are straight white pride days where they can be like "heck yes I'm super privileged and don't really have to worry about someone hating me for something I can't control today!" Only white straight women have any idea of what it feels like to be discriminated against. White straight guys have it sooooooo good and they don't even realize it. They haven't really faced that much discrimination and have no right to police other people's pride days. The "straight pride" crap is just a reactionary, idiotic idea that means to mock/demean what gay people like me do to feel better about ourselves. Most straight white people aren't made fun of being that and have no idea what the pride events mean to us. It's nice to feel pride about who we are instead of being marginalized by mainstream society in general. So back off.

Anders
August 6th, 2011, 12:42 AM
However, most days are straight white pride days where they can be like "heck yes I'm super privileged and don't really have to worry about someone hating me for something I can't control today!" Only white straight women have any idea of what it feels like to be discriminated against. White straight guys have it sooooooo good and they don't even realize it. They haven't really faced that much discrimination and have no right to police other people's pride days. The "straight pride" crap is just a reactionary, idiotic idea that means to mock/demean what gay people like me do to feel better about ourselves. Most straight white people aren't made fun of being that and have no idea what the pride events mean to us. It's nice to feel pride about who we are instead of being marginalized by mainstream society in general. So back off.

I'm gay and I haven't gone through a struggle. I mean, we don't shoulder the weight of what people had to go through over hundreds of years just because we're gay. Yeah we definitely aren't fully equal in some facets of life, but I just find it incredibly pointless to actively protest and even find disgust in the idea of a white pride day.

So maybe it is an idiotic maneuver akin to monkey see monkey do, what does it effect? Nothing, you can still be prideful on whatever day it is to be prideful for.

I guess I just don't take offense to things as easily as some people, but I feel like this is really being blown out of proportion.

People can be proud of whatever the hell they want as long as it's not hurting anyone and it's not anyone's goddamn business in the end.
People who say "straight pride needs to exist too" or "where's white history month?" can rot in hell to be honest with you.

Well okay then. :paranoid:

meowthy
August 6th, 2011, 02:52 AM
You haven't gone through any struggles being gay?

No one has ever teased you about your sexuality?
Or threatened you?
Your parents were not upset?
You don't care that (depending on where you live) you can't get married or adopt?
You have never been judged based off your sexuality?
People have not made remarks about you while holding hands or kissing your boyfriend?

If none of these things happened, then you are one in a million.

Anders
August 6th, 2011, 03:03 AM
I specifically said we definitely aren't fully equal in some facets of life. When I say we I mean gay people as a collective, because not all of those things have affected me, so I'm not going to whine about them as if they do.

And none of that has any bearing on why anybody needs to be offended or angry at a white pride day or history month, instead of just shrugging it off or being amused by it. This isn't all about gay people.

Melody
August 6th, 2011, 05:07 AM
It's one thing for minorities and once-trodden-upon groups to have their own "pride days".

For a majority group which was the main source of repression to demand a "pride day" is like a troll mocking someone, plain and simple. It's not cool. It should NEVER be considered acceptable even to the most "Politically Correct" person.


HOWEVER, there is a lot to be said about equality in that little restriction. Surely that majority has the right to have a "pride day". But if doing so is rude...why do it? Where's the fun in that, if everybody can't enjoy it equally?

Gothitelle.
August 6th, 2011, 09:08 AM
You know, I can be proud that I am 50% white, I can but there are people like me who are proud to be straight as well. There's a Straight Pride club on DeviantArt that I am in that gets bashed but the Gay/lesbian/trans clubs get a pat on the back.

I mean just because we have a club dedicated to heterosexual pride doesn't mean that we are homophobic. Homosexuals and politically correct people hate it when we have pride because they think pride is only for the minorities. They are wrong.

I am also in a group called MenHaveRightsTo, which doesn't get flack but I believe in men having rights and against women using the fact that they have a vagina to portray men as evil people. Yes, I do believe that they use the fact that they are a woman to get what they want from the government at the expense of man.

Atomic Pirate
August 6th, 2011, 09:13 AM
You know, I can be proud that I am 50% white, I can but there are people like me who are proud to be straight as well. There's a Straight Pride club on DeviantArt that I am in that gets bashed but the Gay/lesbian/trans clubs get a pat on the back.

I mean just because we have a club dedicated to heterosexual pride doesn't mean that we are homophobic. Homosexuals and politically correct people hate it when we have pride because they think pride is only for the minorities. They are wrong.

I am also in a group called MenHaveRightsTo, which doesn't get flack but I believe in men having rights and against women using the fact that they have a vagina to portray men as evil people. Yes, I do believe that they use the fact that they are a woman to get what they want from the government at the expense of man.

There's nothing wrong with being politically correct. Haven't you heard of giving a crap about others' feelings? Black Pride is OK because they have gone through lynchings, slavery, refusal of rights, and much more. Gay Pride is OK because gays have always been mistreated by others. Straight Pride is really kind of arrogant, I mean I'm straight, but I think that the whole "Straight Pride" thing is arrogantly quipping "We're not gay! We are so great because we aren't gay!". Gay people are born that way. Deal with it.

Gothitelle.
August 6th, 2011, 09:26 AM
I never said there wasnt anything wrong with being politically correct, I'm just sick and tired of them shoving their perfectionist beliefs down mine and others throats. Thats why the club was gone to. While there are some who stuck behind us and our beliefs, it was too crazy and being called a homophobe on a daily basis was not cool.

Just because I'm not gay doesn't take away might goshdar rights to have pride. I'm straight and I am allowed to have pride, so is the Straight Pride group, but because of the devine angels who are just sooo perfect because they are PC, we went away.

Oryx
August 6th, 2011, 10:01 AM
The question is, why do you believe in Straight Pride? Gay Pride has very good reasons to be there - it allows people to feel pride in something that is still causing them to be actively discriminated against, it allows them to be in a situation where for once they can look at people and assume that they're gay, instead of the other way around like everywhere else. It allows them to celebrate the strength to overcome hardships cause by being gay.

The idea of straight pride is that "gay people can be proud, so why not me?", at least as far as I can see. Gay pride is a place where gay people can be without being discriminated against. Straight people aren't discriminated against so that reason doesn't apply. Gay pride is a place where they can meet other people who are also gay. It's not a problem to meet other straight people, so that doesn't apply. Gay pride is a place where they can celebrate overcoming the obstacles they encounter because of their sexuality. Straight people, once again, don't encounter these obstacles, so that doesn't apply. So what's the reasoning? Celebrating the fact that you never have to overcome anything related to your sexuality? The reasoning behind Gay Pride is a very positive line of reasoning, while the reasoning behind Straight Pride is overwhelmingly negative.

G.U.Y.
August 6th, 2011, 10:18 AM
I never said there wasnt anything wrong with being politically correct, I'm just sick and tired of them shoving their perfectionist beliefs down mine and others throats. Thats why the club was gone to. While there are some who stuck behind us and our beliefs, it was too crazy and being called a homophobe on a daily basis was not cool.

Just because I'm not gay doesn't take away might goshdar rights to have pride. I'm straight and I am allowed to have pride, so is the Straight Pride group, but because of the devine angels who are just sooo perfect because they are PC, we went away.

When half the world has laws that say if you're caught doing anything that may point to you being a heterosexual you can be shot by a firing squad or hung, or make it so all white people/all straight people are slaves..then you can have pride for being white/straight.

You're a girl. You can have pride that you overcome sexism though, so you have that going for ya'.

Gothitelle.
August 6th, 2011, 10:21 AM
Well I want to be proud of something. I have hardships as well. I have something positive about me that I can be proud of, and I cannot even be proud of it.

It makes it seem like you people are better because your gay.

Black Ice
August 6th, 2011, 10:28 AM
Pride days are generally for non-majority groups. You don't need to raise awareness for heterosexual rights or whatever.

And that is about the only reason I support (or don't oppose) those pride days in the first place.

Oryx
August 6th, 2011, 10:29 AM
Well I want to be proud of something. I have hardships as well. I have something positive about me that I can be proud of, and I cannot even be proud of it.

It makes it seem like you people are better because your gay.


That's great that you have hardships that you've overcome, it really is. You're more than welcome to celebrate that - but that is entirely unrelated to you being straight, so that's unrelated to this conversation about straight pride vs. gay pride. Gay pride is about the hardships they've overcome due to their sexuality, not hardships in general.

Gothitelle.
August 6th, 2011, 10:37 AM
You don't need to overcome hardships to have pride. There are British pride etc, the British didnt over come hardships.

StraightPride group on DA is there for me and other straights to be proud of just being hetro. I'm proud of that, because it's pretty much my only normality. I feel normal whiten the group and that's fun to see. Too bad that they are gone but it was a very fun group and we had a few supporter defending our group.

MenHaveRights group is there to support men and women having equal rights and opposing women being above men because they have a vagina. Women have rights already, but they want more at the expense of men, and this group is here to share your disgust for it. Women always get their way especially in the courts and custody battles and it's sicking.

Oryx
August 6th, 2011, 10:57 AM
You don't need to overcome hardships to have pride. There are British pride etc, the British didnt over come hardships.

StraightPride group on DA is there for me and other straights to be proud of just being hetro. I'm proud of that, because it's pretty much my only normality. I feel normal whiten the group and that's fun to see. Too bad that they are gone but it was a very fun group and we had a few supporter defending our group.

MenHaveRights group is there to support men and women having equal rights and opposing women being above men because they have a vagina. Women have rights already, but they want more at the expense of men, and this group is here to share your disgust for it. Women always get their way especially in the courts and custody battles and it's sicking.

Going to reply to the women part first because it's kind of disturbing that as a woman yourself you don't understand that. Women still get paid less than men in the same jobs, in 2009 nearly 25% less. I can personally vouch that you are wrong in the fact that "women always get their way in the courts", I know that from experience with my parent's divorce. In different states there are different leanings as a matter of fact. When I lived in Texas, it was difficult for my mother to even get child support when she and my father divorced. When we moved she wanted to get the case moved to NJ because they lean more towards the mother over the father here.

There are women that do seem to believe that men are lower than them, but they are not the majority within the gender and we are not at the point where they're even being listened to. Women may have the same rights as men, but they're still not treated the same, encouraged into the same jobs, paid the same. I suggest you do more research on this topic, because there are obvious disparities that have yet to be addressed.

Pride in a heritage is different than pride in a sexuality. Pride in a heritage is cultural, it's a celebration of the things that make us who we are in different parts of the world. Gay pride isn't the same as British pride just because the word 'pride' is in both.

Livewire
August 6th, 2011, 11:26 AM
Well I want to be proud of something. I have hardships as well. I have something positive about me that I can be proud of, and I cannot even be proud of it.

It makes it seem like you people are better because your gay.


Your hardships are different than the hardships of an entire race. You seem to be confusing some of the finer points here. Every person experiences hardships at some point in their lives, yes. But the struggles on an entire people, especially when the people in question are victimized by the majority (in this case White/Caucasians) White, heterosexual people don't need a pride day, because they own basically the entirety of western civilization. I don't feel the need to celebrate the fact that I'm white in a country of over 100+ million other white people.


Basically, it boils down to this:

You have hardships, we all do at some point. However, your hardships' (White Anglo-Saxon Protestants, I'm looking at you) aren't based on what you look like or where you came from, as seen in minorities across the US. Your confusing the two.


Also, let's try not incite racial or sexual orientation hatred here, you're beginning to derail the topic.

Gymnotide
August 6th, 2011, 03:55 PM
I'm just posting here to point out two things:
The irony that "being equal" most often equates to "having the same privileges as the group that has the most," which is probably going to be white males, tbh.
If we're going to throw the word "pride" around, we might as well just have "Human Pride" parades where we're all happy to just be alive and quit bickering over silly things. Hell, even "Animal Pride" or "[i]Earth Pride" would be great too.

G.U.Y.
August 6th, 2011, 04:05 PM
Well I want to be proud of something. I have hardships as well. I have something positive about me that I can be proud of, and I cannot even be proud of it.

It makes it seem like you people are better because your gay.


I don't understand what can make someone turn "I'm proud that I have overcame adversity and that I love myself for who I am." into "OMGZORZ I B BETTER"

ಠ_ಠ Seriously?

Gothitelle.
August 7th, 2011, 06:51 AM
Your hardships are different than the hardships of an entire race. You seem to be confusing some of the finer points here. Every person experiences hardships at some point in their lives, yes. But the struggles on an entire people, especially when the people in question are victimized by the majority (in this case White/Caucasians) White, heterosexual people don't need a pride day, because they own basically the entirety of western civilization. I don't feel the need to celebrate the fact that I'm white in a country of over 100+ million other white people.


Basically, it boils down to this:

You have hardships, we all do at some point. However, your hardships' (White Anglo-Saxon Protestants, I'm looking at you) aren't based on what you look like or where you came from, as seen in minorities across the US. Your confusing the two.


Also, let's try not incite racial or sexual orientation hatred here, you're beginning to derail the topic.

Actually, my hardships ARE bases on how I look, just to clarify.

And I'm not a hater of anyone. I am just saying that I don't like how I can't get away with being proud of my orientation and and the fact that I'm white and black. If I am, then I'm a homophobic person that needs to go to hell. It's true, many people have said that to me and it bothers me. If I'm not politically correct, they will hate me.

But I am using strong words to I'll stop. My intent wasn't to challenge any lifestyle or anyone for that matter. I wanted to post this because it's a good topic to talk about. Also it lets you know "hey they have pride, they should be able to have it". I accept people, but people don't accept me... why do I accept anyway? I will never know.

Esper
August 7th, 2011, 09:21 AM
But WHY are you proud of being straight? Gay people aren't proud that they're gay - they're proud that they've overcome problems related to being gay. They're proud that they have come to a point where they feel accepting of themselves. It's the overcoming problems and finding acceptance that they're proud of.

I don't know you, but if you've struggled with your sexuality in the past, but have now accepted yourself as who you are then that's wonderful. Plenty of straight people do struggle. It's just easier in general for them because society already supports them. It's a shame that "gay pride" is the term that gets used because it kind of leaves a lot of people out (bi pride? trans pride?). "Gay pride" also sets up a binary where people think that the opposite of it would be "straight pride," but really I think that the only reason you don't get straight people under the "gay pride" umbrella is that it's too long to say "people-who-have-overcome-personal-difficulties-regarding-their-sexuality pride."

Shake
August 7th, 2011, 09:35 AM
Honestly, why is anyone asking for "white" and "straight" pride celebrations to be socially accepted? If you want to celebrate who you are, do it!

Gothitelle.
August 7th, 2011, 10:20 AM
But WHY are you proud of being straight?

This is only my veiws, but I am proud because I managed to follow the rules of god on this one, even when I had some gay thoughts, and well I like my sexuality. As you say, I was born this way. And I am proud that this is a trait that I share with most people.

Anders
August 7th, 2011, 11:25 AM
Gay people aren't proud that they're gay - they're proud that they've overcome problems related to being gay.

Only speak for yourself. I have met gay people that were so obstructive about their sexuality, and when they talk about it they never say "I'm happy to have had problems in my life because not everybody accepts my sexuality" they say "I'm gay and it's fabulous. I loooove being gay. I love the ****."

That's a legitimate answer I've gotten. Not everybody understands what gay pride is the way you do. Does running around in your underwear getting drunk show gay pride? Just an example from many gay pride events.

Alice
August 7th, 2011, 12:15 PM
Only speak for yourself. I have met gay people that were so obstructive about their sexuality, and when they talk about it they never say "I'm happy to have had problems in my life because not everybody accepts my sexuality" they say "I'm gay and it's fabulous. I loooove being gay. I love the ****."

That's a legitimate answer I've gotten. Not everybody understands what gay pride is the way you do. Does running around in your underwear getting drunk show gay pride? Just an example from many gay pride events.
****s are ****s whether they're gay or not.

Err, didn't realize that was a bad word. Well, that's just that person's personality. It doesn't really have anything to do with Gays in general.

G.U.Y.
August 7th, 2011, 12:19 PM
Only speak for yourself. I have met gay people that were so obstructive about their sexuality, and when they talk about it they never say "I'm happy to have had problems in my life because not everybody accepts my sexuality" they say "I'm gay and it's fabulous. I loooove being gay. I love the ****."

That's a legitimate answer I've gotten. Not everybody understands what gay pride is the way you do. Does running around in your underwear getting drunk show gay pride? Just an example from many gay pride events.

I never realized all the gay people you've met were all the gay people in the world. o: We must have met in real life!

Many? More like very few. Most pride events are family events - where alcohol is banned. Obviously you have that stereotype so engraved into your head that you think because it happens sometimes that it must happen all the time.

Anders
August 7th, 2011, 01:13 PM
I never realized all the gay people you've met were all the gay people in the world. o: We must have met in real life!

Many? More like very few. Most pride events are family events - where alcohol is banned. Obviously you have that stereotype so engraved into your head that you think because it happens sometimes that it must happen all the time.

What are you talking about? I specifically responded to her post to say all gays aren't the same, nowhere in my post does it say all gay people are the same. You're putting words in my mouth and being sarcastic, if you don't have an actual argument why are you trying to antagonize me?

Obviously you''re very upset by this. I've seen plenty of gay pride events like that. I didn't say they all were like that.

G.U.Y.
August 7th, 2011, 02:32 PM
What are you talking about? I specifically responded to her post to say all gays aren't the same, nowhere in my post does it say all gay people are the same. You're putting words in my mouth and being sarcastic, if you don't have an actual argument why are you trying to antagonize me?

Obviously you''re very upset by this. I've seen plenty of gay pride events like that. I didn't say they all were like that.

I missread, and I apologize. But you don't have to be so rude about it :(

Bluerang1
August 7th, 2011, 02:43 PM
I think some of you guys are seeing this the wrong way. Pride is being proud of who you are, hardships or not. So really, any group can have a "Pride Day".

-ty-
August 7th, 2011, 03:51 PM
Alright everyone. Everyone should have pride in something. These pride events showcase an attribute that a bulk of society shuns. When you celebrate gay pride you are sending a message to society that their harsh scrutiny and condemnations will not take away their pride. If we talk about straight pride, it does not make sense, there is not a message that you need to tell society purely based off your sexuality. However, everyone, gay, white, bi, trans, black, and everyone else has something that they can be proud of. Gothitelle, you are mulatto, and obviously you have gone through struggles, why not celebrate that? And if you are white and straight, you may be proud to be a father or mother, a veteran, a student, an athlete, a musician, poke-fanatic or whatever. These are things to be proud of because you put a lot of work into those accomplishments. It is not an accomplishment to overcome the adversities of PURELY being straight, it is however an accomplishment to overcome the adversities of being gay, if you have had problems PURELY based off your sexuality.

Livewire
August 7th, 2011, 05:37 PM
Anders, Landorus, Gothitelle., Bluerang1, Quilavaking and others;

The topic's been getting rather flamebaitish and off-topic. If I have to ask/warn you all again, It'll be closed and you'll be disciplined. Let's try to backtrack a bit.