Magic: The Gathering

[Latios Master]

Who likes Magic: The Gathering here? I do! My friend just got me into it. So far I've only bought 1 booster pack though...

[Keitaro]

I quit Yu-Gi-Oh! TCG because the game was too simple after beating the best in Canada time & time again and went back into magic. I started magic in 4th Edition but quit when Mirage came out so I forgot lot of it so really I could say that I just started back up again in 8th. I have 3 decks so far...
Type 1: Tri Deck
Extended: Blue-Green Maddness Deck
Type 2: Mirari's Wake Deck

Magic is a good game but it's too addictive so I don't suggest people to play it unless they are thinking about going pro, i'm only in it because the tournaments have cash prizes around here.

[John Denver]

IMO, Magic the gathering is by FAR the best game out there...better than pokemon and all of those...the only reason I play pokemon is cause my parents banned Magic the Gathering from me, and Pokemon is the next best thing...

Have no doubts, if my parents let me play magic, 87.234% of my pokemon cards would be GONE!

No more.........no less........

BO ya!

[Kenny_C.002]

Yeah? I'm the magic player here. Just picked upone of the champion decks the other day...WAKE KILLS. :P

Anyway, I'm bringing Magic back into this dumphole here (since there's a lack of it here).

[unhappy pineapple]

Anyway, I'm bringing Magic back into this dumphole here (since there's a lack of it here).

May I assist you? I love Magic! I have two pre-constructed decks (somewhere, deconstructed, in my pile), and a few boosters...but not nearly enough Black Cards....

*sigh* Ah, bankrupcy... :'( :'( :'(

[Tweak]

Who likes Magic: The Gathering here? I do! My friend just got me into it. So far I've only bought 1 booster pack though...

i used to play MAGIC in 7th grade, i bought as many cards as i did pokemon cards. i love the illustrations on the MAGIC cards, dragons and such.but i stopped playing for some reason unknown. :cross-eye

[Chaeran]

I've just started to become interested in it....*sighs hopelessly*

[Kenny_C.002]

Hehe. No problems. I'll start with stuff. Since Mirrodin just came out, what do you think of the new set?

[Lone_Sandstorm]

I was working on a doomed necro deck with some green beat down.. but I did not have mony for the cards I need...

[Spike Razzor]

I use to play in grade 5, then Pokemon and Digimon came O.o, some of my friends were playing if they were waiting to duel (YGO). They gave me a refresher course and starting today I'm back to Magic. I got a simple Blue/Green deck, nothing speacial but I can win with it so hey, may aswell use it.

[Kenny_C.002]

Yeah. Spikey, came back in one of the trying times of Magic. Combos everywhere and nothing REALLY tourney worthy. But blue/green is making a MAJOR comeback (I love that).

Sandstorm, you can get a reanimator deck from Berlin 2003 comemorative decks. If you use coloured sleeves, you can technically use the cards. Its a pretty good investment, since you cut down the cost by about 90% to just about 15 dollars Canadian.

[Spike Razzor]

Yeah. Spikey, came back in one of the trying times of Magic. Combos everywhere and nothing REALLY tourney worthy. But blue/green is making a MAJOR comeback (I love that).

Sandstorm, you can get a reanimator deck from Berlin 2003 comemorative decks. If you use coloured sleeves, you can technically use the cards. Its a pretty good investment, since you cut down the cost by about 90% to just about 15 dollars Canadian.Sadly since I got 10 cards in my YGO deck stolen I used the blue sleeves from my machine deck and put my Magic cards in them. Because cards are hard to shuffle without them lol, my friends say I should buy a green starter deck since I got all the blue monsters I need.

[Kenny_C.002]

Naw. God with the Black steel black one or the white/green one from Darksteel. Black is a weenie deck (wow, weenies), and the white/green one is fun to use, not to mention myr matrix (the horrors).

Mirrodin has "Wicked Big", a pure green, anti artifact deck. I prefer the blue/black one best, since I have an affinity deck myself. :P

[Lone_Sandstorm]

I am currently collecting the mtg books.... Yeah, I looked into the magic theme decks... I hate blue, except clone, no offense..
*Hordes his doomed necromancers.....*
I like onslaught the best.

[Kenny_C.002]

To Lone Sandstorm:
Hehe. Yeah, I used to think blue was so crappy. Then I started looking at Oddyssey and now I'm hooked onto blue. (Interesting note: Blue and Black are the expert's choice, green and red are the beginner's choice)

I kinda like the affinity thing, 4 colour control wasn't possible in type 2 until pretty much now, which I really like.

Have you read "The Darksteel Eye"? It's actually pretty good (i'm almost done the book). Though I think I prefer Moons of Mirrodin more.

As for my fav set: UNGLUED!!!!!!!!!!! (The chickens shall rule you all!) Apparently my quicksilver fountains with giant fans annoy the heck out of everyone. When I play it, I get the biggest target on my head. SWEET! :P

To all:
What is YOUR favourite set? How about your fav. block?

Set: Unglued
Block: Urza

[digi-kun]

woohoo i just got an akroma!!! the last booster in the box...yay!!!

[Kenny_C.002]

Wow. That's luck man. I gave up on trying for an Akroma. I've decided to keep on with the blue and take Akroma by...stealing methods with Memnarch. :P

[ChoasTheory]

I have been into Magic: The Gathering for a loooooooong time now. I have 3 Black Lotus cards (yes it might be illegal in the tournaments but it are the most elusive card in the game) and a lot of other stuff. if you are a beginner here is some tips.
(I cant spell so give me some leeway here XD)

If you want to buy a deck I would say that you shouldnt go with slivers shiver deck even though slivers are awsome cards they are easily won against (the exact reason no sliver deck made it in the world tournaments) all yuo need to defeat one is a simple mass destruction card such as Wrath of God wich wipes all the cards off the field.

Here is a list of all the types and what they are based on.

Forest- These are based on getting out mana fast so you can either bring out more little monsters to be annoying (such as elves XD) or gett out big monsters to wallop people.

Swamp- Hmmm these cards are kinda weird XD it is based on life drain but it kinda balances between certain stuff (quit a good type if i may say so)

Mountain- Well direct damage lol as well as they feature goblins they are awsome they work together much like elves exept have stronger monsters to were they arent 1/1 and 2/2 like slivers (the strongest sliver is sliver queen: brood mother and with a couple of these in your deck slivers are fricken sick however these are aslo mega-rare XD)

Plain- Ah well they have loads of healing cards *shrugs*

Water- Drawing more cards! bunch of those in this.

artifacts!- Yah my personle fav, you can use any color of mana to bring these out! plus most if you want an awsome card that is probably the base card to the wake deck (the deck that won the world championship!) get the card Mirari wich is in the scourge deck I think (might be wrong i got a headache lol) it lets you copy a spell and put the copy on the top of your deck get a Moments peace from the same deck as Mirari is in and that card makes it so your opponenet cant attack you his next turn then pay three use Mirari and copy it and put it ontop of your deck (behold invincability XD unless they destroy Mirari just make sure you got a whole lot of copies of A Moments Peace)
anyway I hoped I help some people (and again srrt bout spelling XD)

[digi-kun]

this is my view on types

Forest(elves, Treefolk)- Mana Helpers, attack boosters, tokens(saprolings) and Flying protection(only green flyer i know is birds of paradise)

Swamp(zombies)- draining life from both creature & player, Sacrificing, and Regeneration to annoy you

Mountain(goblins)- Haste, Burns, and attack boosters

Plain(Clerics and Soldiers)- Gain life,Toughness boosters , life preventation, and Revive creatures

Island(Wizards)- Card drawing, hand returning, and the EVIL COUNTERS!!!!!

and Mirari's in Odyssey...i think

[ChoasTheory]

Well a lot of clerics are from the swamps so if you are making a cleric deck you must use plain and swamp.

Ooof I forgot some stuff XD.

[Kenny_C.002]

"artifacts!- Yah my personle fav, you can use any color of mana to bring these out! plus most if you want an awsome card that is probably the base card to the wake deck (the deck that won the world championship!) get the card Mirari wich is in the scourge deck I think (might be wrong i got a headache lol) it lets you copy a spell and put the copy on the top of your deck get a Moments peace from the same deck as Mirari is in and that card makes it so your opponenet cant attack you his next turn then pay three use Mirari and copy it and put it ontop of your deck (behold invincability XD unless they destroy Mirari just make sure you got a whole lot of copies of A Moments Peace)
anyway I hoped I help some people (and again srrt bout spelling XD)"

Ummmmm.....it doesn't work like that. Moment's Peace would go on the stack as beign played and you put a copy of it on the stack itself. So it plays 2 moment's peace at the same time, meaning you prevent all combat damage this turn twice. So...no copies needed.

Oh yeah, the types:

Green: Instinct/order, basis of mana accel, tends to be fast

White: Order/Intellect, basis of plain life gain, prevention, protection, tends to be slow

Blue: Intellect/Supremacy, basis for card drawing, tends to be slow, my fav. colour.

Black: Supremacy/Chaos, basis for paying life for anything, tends to be slow

Red: Chaos/Instinct, basis for burn, tends to be VERY fast

Artifacts: crappy/mediocore in everything, because any colour can use them

Mirari indeed is in Oddyssey

oh btw, reanimation is red/black or white/black.

Affinity is 2-4 colours

Goblin bidding is red/black

Slide is red/white or red/white/green

Oh yeah, my cleric Bidding deck is white/black (which is what you suggested, ChaosTheory! We do think alike at times. :P)

[ChoasTheory]

Ya! XD, I have a killer cleric deck *huzza* XD. Be sure to have the faithful old Doubtless One in there!

[Kenny_C.002]

Yes, I run with 4 doubtless ones. And for that matter 4 rotlung reanimators. Key card in the deck would probably be Visera, tho I think I might need an Avatar of Woe in there just for more removal (instead of using smothers...)

[digi-kun]

i got a question:
supposibly there was this creature called Infernus(or sumthin) and only one was made in the world...is this true?
they Supposibly based the 2-headed dragon off it and it had an ability like double-strike...supposibly...
Can anyone tell me if this is true cause my friend told me it was brought to this place and buried...

[Kenny_C.002]

There is a dragon card that there is only 1 copy of. I cannot remember it off the top of my head, but this card cannot be used (it dies immediately after it hits the table because of its wording). With this in mind, WotC destroyed all but one copy, which now resides somewhere in Japan I think.

But if I recall, this dragon was supposed to be a 7/7 and has some other abilities that i don't remember.

[Strider]

There is a dragon card that there is only 1 copy of. I cannot remember it off the top of my head, but this card cannot be used (it dies immediately after it hits the table because of its wording). With this in mind, WotC destroyed all but one copy, which now resides somewhere in Japan I think.

But if I recall, this dragon was supposed to be a 7/7 and has some other abilities that i don't remember.

I never knew that. If it's true it's value would be higher than Black Lotus, wouldn't it?

[Kenny_C.002]

Acutally, there would be no value for it, since the card is in a museum and is not dealt to anything. If this, however, got out (like stealing or something), the pricing would rocket for ths thing...higher than the black lotus.

[digi-kun]

WAY higher
they based two-headed dragon off it so...its pretty good

[Kenny_C.002]

True that. Too bad it isn't anything now. Just a "dead when it comes into play" guy. :P

[ChoasTheory]

Hmmm, unless it has protection from spells and instants a lot of cards could just kill it. For that reason it doesnt seem like such a good card but whatever.

[digi-kun]

has neone here evr gotten into a couterspell battle?(each player counters the other player's counters after 1 spell)
and its a 1 turn kill so...its pretty powerful...just keep counters in ur deck

[Kenny_C.002]

Actually, the "only 1" dragon CAN survived. All you need is something that will increase its toughness by one (which it will become a 7+x/7+y, where x can be 0 or over and y must be 1 or more).

Anyway, any creature is vulnerable to instants and sorceries just as much as anything else without protection...so...doesn't matter. :P

As for the counter battles: yup. Took some time to sort things out once everything resolved (since cantips were around). Ever gotten into Astral Slide matches? :P

[digi-kun]

nope...i think i have the card though...ever had a karona battle it usually gets crazy if a player has a 1-type deck...

[Kenny_C.002]

Trust me on the dragon. It's the wording that killed it. btw, Clockwork dragon is also a 7 counter guy, but isn't affected because of its wording.

And type 1 tends not to be welcomed here...

[digi-kun]

How does the "can't be the target of spells or abilities work? someone said something about the creature losing flying, first strike, etc.

[Kenny_C.002]

Basically, can't be target of spells or abilities is just what it means.

The permanent having "can't be target of spells or abilities" cannot be targetted by any outside source, including your own (saying it's your own creatures). What CAN hit the creature:

COMBAT damage (NOT SHOCKS)
Global effects (e.g. wrath of god or decree of pain cycled)
Global effects that cause damage (e.g. pyroclasm)
enchant permanents that are already on it (e.g. you gave the permanent "can't be target" after the enchant permanent is already there)
Abilities/spells that don't target (if it can do something to something else without targetting, like "destroy the creature with the highest power" or "it enchants the creature with the lowest mana cost" or something like that, like dragon scales when it's in the graveyard and not played from hand)
Abilities it has on himself (note that it CANNOT have the word "target" on it)

I think that's it. Basically in one sentence: anything that doesn't have the work "target" on it.

[digi-kun]

geez how du u know so much bout magic? >:
oh well...do u have a sort of...trump card(s)? card u can rely on to get u out of a jam?

[Kenny_C.002]

No. I don't have a trump card. I just know stuff, that's all. btw, I'm good with protection now (as in explaining it lol). I learn DEBT! :P

oh and I know stuff from I guess experience in games similar to it, I guess.

And wrath of god tends to get me out of jams. lol

[digi-kun]

i tend to use akroma's vengence instead of WoG hardly anyone uses regeneration cards in my school so its really easy to use

EDIT: Oh and has WotC limited dragons to Max 10 per deck?...gotta verify this for my friend...

[Kenny_C.002]

No. Dragons have enough drawback for it not to be limited. Mainly its costing is too high.

[digi-kun]

ya...usually 5+ total coverted mana cost Draco(16) XD the other affect makes it easier though

[MiNuN*]

I got a deck.. problem is i dono how to play.. >_>
Strogest card; worldgorger dragon

[digi-kun]

a worldgorger is ur strongest card?!?!?! well, i guess the mana cost is ok...but...EASIER TO DOMINATE!!! XD

[Kenny_C.002]

Actually, the dragon has potential to work well. It's just that you'd have to do a lot of things to make it work nicely that it's not worth the time and mana (as in by taht time, you could have finished your opponent with a blaze).

Now again, the kid's just starting out, of course he needs to learn about things before he realizes maybe what we've realized going from newbie to intermediate. He might think the dragon is his most powerful he has, but maybe somewhere down the line he may realize that this other card he has is better suited for him as the "best" card. Time will tell.

And Minun nice to meet you, I'm the blue mage here. :)

And the only dragon that I feel is worth the time is dragon mage. Wheel of fortune? NICE! :P

[digi-kun]

i can agree on that Dragon Mage Is one of the best...then think Kilnmouth Dragon With a hand of dragons

[Kenny_C.002]

Naw. costs wayyyyyy too much. Then again, it still was used in block constructed (aka slide) as sideboarding material. Again, pwoerful, but costs too much.

btw, u heard of ravager affinity/mono-red/12post?

[digi-kun]

nope cant say i have...
Great card to scare people into submission Traumatize-Target player puts the top half of his or her library, rounded down, into his or her graveyard.
To Minun: my favorite is akroma, but i dont consider it my best card...i tend not to use akroma in most of my decks.
i havent chosen my BEST card yet ^_^

[Kenny_C.002]

That and haunting echoes. Just enough to scare them off to use mass counterspelling on me. :P

[digi-kun]

ya real good combo *spark*runs to MTG combos thread* :P

[Kenny_C.002]

Took you long enough. lol

Aside from that, if you ever face any of the decks I've mentioned, good luck...you'll need it. :P

[digi-kun]

ya...i prob will...worst deck ive faced are counter, counter-burn, and control decks...ive faced a dragon/drake deck too...and dont forget sliver decks!!

[Kenny_C.002]

Slivers are funny. They make funny little...

That's goblins. :P

Anyway, I've been facing so many different decks out there that the tough ones get boring sometimes. That's when the fun breaks and I have lke random formats for random stuff...happening. ;D

[digi-kun]

i used to stick with elf-beast-burn decks...then i went to zombie-clerics, and then artifacts...
Note: none of the people i face use artifact breakers...although i do =) with mycosynth lattice

[~Ozy~]

Okay, I need some help. I've just started playing (two decks, modified Transference and modified Life Boost [hey, it was cheap] and a fairly good selection of cards). I'm looking for suggestions on a slim blue for competitive play and a green/white of green/blue for friendly play. Do any of you have any suggestions?

[Kenny_C.002]

I'm not sure what you mean by competitive play. Like are you saying something along the lines of "I want to go to a tournament" or "I want to just havea strong-ish deck"? I should take those into consideration. Either way, that competitive play deck will most likely have 4 skullclamps (two you have).

As for casual, white/blue for me tends to be more "fun" to play, with more zany combos and such than white/green. So I'm leaning probably more to the white/blue deck. btw, casuals don't care whether it's good or not, just have fun building random things. :P

For competitive play, here's the skeleton for Ravager Affinity (aka the big dog in Type 2):

4 Disciple of the Vault (common)
4 frogmite (common)
4 Myr enforcer (common)
4 guys to sac artifacts, like atog (uncommon) or Arcbound Ravager (going for about 30 bucks American each right now).
a whole bunch of artifact lands!
4 skullclamps
4 arcbround workers
(sometimes) 4 ornithopers (uncommon)
4 thoughtcast (common)

Just kinda use this skeleton for it. I mean, you should be able to pick up quite a few of those with relative ease. If you have any questions on HOW it works, ask me.

[~Ozy~]

Okay, thanks. Anyway, the competitive one isn't really for tournament play, per se, but for the local Magic club. They have some nice prizes and such, so I'm interested in having a strongish deck. The fun deck is for just schoolgroup play, a lot like my friend Charlie's Angel deck. Or the "Mr. Smith" deck.

[Simon]

I used to play Magic. I wasted so much money on it. I'm not saying it was bad..but just a waste of money. I used to have a Burn deck and the deck where you use Wild Mongols to use madness with rootwallas and wurms.

[digi-kun]

hey u all know about the Fifth dawn Pre-Release right?

anyways...can sumone tell me what a Sealed Deck tournament format is?(never been to a MTG tourney...

[Kenny_C.002]

Okay. For the competitive deck, it's just teh ravagers and the skullclamps that cost the money. While the skullslamps you can't avoid, you CAN avoid using the ravagers (use Slobad, Goblin Tinkerer, or some of the Mirrodin commons that get bonuses for artifact sacced), although the deck power is decreased, it is still VERY powerful and can likely kick butt in Type 2 competitive play. If it's type 1...then good luck to you too (meaning they'll laugh at you before completely flattening you with their ultra-super decks of doom).
Type 2: It's the format in which only cards from the two newest blocks will be used (so Mirrodin and Onslaught)
Type 1: The format in which all sets are legal, but all restricted cards in type 1.5 (along with the banned cards) are banned (so type 1.5 is just restricting the cards rather than banning them outright)

Sealed Deck:
The sealed deck format is always constructed AND block construction. This format is arguably one of the most fair formats in Magic, meaing that you're depending on luck mostly (for sealed deck), and skill of what to put into a deck.

For the sealed deck format (in prereleases), you are given one tournament pack from the most recent block (it's Mirrodin for this one), and 3 boosters (some are 2!!!) 5th Dawn. You are given any number of BASIC LANDS to run in your deck.

With what you have, you have to make a 40-card deck from it. So from a total of 90 cards, you need to pick out about 24 cards to put into your deck, and the rest are ALL SIDEBOARD (meaning you can literally change your deck if you really want to during a match, although most don't do it).

Then after making the deck, you just play around in the tourney, usually just beating players and stuff. :P

Strat:
Take what you have an identify the Biggest bomb you can find.
Find cards that work well with this bomb.
Check your deck to see if you have enough to make this deck.
If so, you can then throw in your lands (about 17 is good) and make the deck. (aim for 40, you can overshoot by about 2)
Most decks have 2 colours in Mirrodin, you can splash (meaning adding like 1 card from a totally different colour) a third colour (note that you splash ONLY for cards that have a mana cost that doesn't have mroe than 1 of a specific colour. So like a splash on skyhunter Cub is okay, but a splash on leonin skyhunter is not. Usually ppl splash in green for artifact killing.)
Yes, it's about experience, but it's fun right now! and you will learn as times goes on. :P

[digi-kun]

Note: for the ravanger affinity skeleton, you might want to add a Second Sunrise or 4
Second Sunrise 1WW Instant Mirrodin
Each player returns to play all artifact, creature,enchantment, and land cards that were put into his or her graveyard from play this turn.

[Kenny_C.002]

No. Usually you'llbe fireball-turning before second sunrise goes online. So that's why I didn't include it. Tho it is a good idea if you have the room for it...

[digi-kun]

Can someone tell me why Skullclamp is so good??? and why it costs so much?...I got at least 2

[Kenny_C.002]

Skullclamp is basically super deep analysis. technically Skullclamp deeps for 1+mana cost of the 1 toughness creature. Obviously if you use guys like arcbound workers, you don't even lose that 1/1 body (it's just modulared). With its tremendous ability to generat such a card advantage, skullclamp wins it all.

[digi-kun]

wow...that explains y the people at the tourney said its the best darksteel uncommon

[Kenny_C.002]

Yes. And it is arguably the best uncommon in type 2 right now (actually, it is). 100% of the tourney decks in high level either run Damping Matrix (the anti clamp) or skullclamp.

Note the ravager affinity also HURTS your opponent while killing those arcbound guys with disciple of the vault. So, it's like card-drawing + dealing damage. It's crazy. :P

[Styles]

mtg rules.... although i havent played in over 7 years i like it... its kind of confusing now :confused: i should have kept all the magic cards i had

[Kenny_C.002]

Hey it's okay. I mean, you can start again. If it's really that difficult, I'm sure you can find a place where they still sell Ice Age packs (tho they'll be like 50 bucks per pack) and stuff like that. If not, hey welcome back for the ride a second time! This time it's type 2 (only the most current 2 blocks). :P

[emeraldslay]

I am a loyal motg fan. I have a giant deck and I have won the 'championship' in my school. I am the one who introduced it to my school and since then kids have started buying the packs. We had a 'championship' and I was in the final. There were loads of people watching and I was against this really good player. He had a very simple deck but his stratagy was great. He started off with low-mana creatures while placing lots of lands down. Eventually he had all the lands he needed and bought out the strong creatures while I had been slowly chipping off his energey. He suppsoedly 'won' but with the help of the rulebook I proved that I would of won. He used an attack and I blocked it with a creature. But he insisted that since the attack did 3 damage and my creature had only 1 defense then two got through. But I only had two power. He ran off saying he was the champion. But, of course the rule he said that 'two damage got through' was fake and I proved this with the help of the rulebook that I bought to school. Plus, I had a fire axe in my hand that I could of used when I got through that move. After that everyone was not intrested in it. But now, my freind has got a deck and has challenge me.
The champion of the school is back...

[digi-kun]

congrats...a friend of mine just made a crazy Decking deck(made to deck opponent out)
it was crazy because his has this crazy combo
Dragon Mage + Megrim + Words of Waste + a lot of mana = When Dragon Mage deals damage to an opponent, you win the game :P

[Kenny_C.002]

I thought probably the most evil thing to have in a wrath-less world: 4 avatar of woe on the field...Scary. :P

O, isn't dragon mage a little...costly? I mean, a mirror costs 5, wake costs 5, etc. The mage kinda is little weak on the costing. I can see how the strat works very well, tho (esp. against slide).

Anybody found any 5th dawn infinite combos yet?

[kirby00]

i had a combo i made up but its good, (not too goood but it makes alot o creatures)
Lifeline,
Junkdiver, (have at least 2 in deck, 1 in hand 1 in play)
Monkey Cage,
Golbin welder
(doesnt have 2 be in same turn that u get them out in the order) First you have golbin welder, and lifeline out, and a junkyard diver, then you play monkey cage. after you play monkey cage, you play junkyard diver... monkey cage is saced and you get some creatures... then you use golblin welder to switch junk diver w/ monkey cage (helps out more if you have an artifact in graveyard while monkey cage was...let say pyrexion colloses) junk yard diver and golbin welders ability combine to bring back 2 artifacts fro graveyard, then you bring back collosis in play, along w/ the monkey cage, (but monkey cage before collosis if you can), then monkey cage is sacrificed again to the graveyard b/c closisus came into play, and you get more creatures... if u have something that can untap the golblin welder, or you have another welder (or wait till next turn), then you can use its ability again to let say sacrifice colisus to bring back monkey cage, then if u have a 3rd or another creature to untap, (or u just wait till next turn), then you sacrifice junk (w/ wleders aility) diver to bring back collosis, and you get more creatures from monkey cage when its sacrificed...
ANOTHER WAY: lets say you have a creaure for ex: pyrexian collosus alrdy in graveyard,and lifeline & monkey cage is out, lifeline will at end of turn bring collosues to play, which sacrifices monkey cage and bring you your collosues, with a bunch of creatures that you get from the monkey cage... if this is confusing read each card... (excpet pyrexian collosis, its jsut an 8/8 that costs 8 that i would only use to sacrifice and summon more creatures form this monkey cage/welde/r diver combo)

[digi-kun]

No...but i have one for Mirrodin
Atog + Myr Retriever + Welding Jar + Diciple of Vault = infinite damage(x2 if opponent has no creatures on the field) not to mention its a pretty easy one to get XD

[Kenny_C.002]

Actually, the weilding jar ability does not trigger due to you sacrificing the retriever to the Atog. You CANNOT regenerate sacrificed creatures (see rulebook). Thus this cannot happen, sorry. Well technically you can still sac the weilding jar to the retriever, but it just won't do anything. btw, regeneration is a replacement effect, thus the retriever, if regenerated, does not hit graveyard from play.

Kirby, you can use retriever instead of junkdiver (costs 1 less and uncommon). The combo I'm not sure I understood tho. lol

Anyway, killing spree:
Door to Nothingness, Doubling Cube, Twiddle, 11 mana = target opponent loses.

So have 11 mana, activate doubling cube to get 16 mana. Pay 5 (of any mana) for Door to Nothingness. Cast twiddle (1 blue) to untap it. Tap 10 (2 of each colour), sac Door to nothingness: target player loses the game. Simple 11 mana with 6 mana specifications. Should have no problem with channel the suns + 1 blue mana anyway. Anyone up for UG with this? btw, if you do use channel the suns, you need 10 mana, with mana specifications of 1 green mana and 1 blue mana (easier).

[digi-kun]

dang...oh well i wont tell my friends that then XD

[Kenny_C.002]

lol That might work very well, not telling your friends. And I absolutely love to torment my friends with rulebook stuff, too. :P

[digi-kun]

one problem...u have to tap door to nothingness as well...or do artifacts not follow the law on summoning sickness?

[Kenny_C.002]

Only creatures have summon sickness. This is due to the fact that creatures must exit from the Aether, which saps their energy. Creatures with haste tend to be either quicker through the Aether, thus losing less energy, hae have some sort of energy boost after exiting the Aether. Lightning Greaves, flavour-wise, makes it so creatures require less energy to move and such, thus summon sickness is then negated.

Artifacts, however, are inanimate, so there is no fear of it being sick from being summoned through the Aether.

^ was flavour of summon sickness.

So no, they don't follow that rule the last time I checked. lol

[digi-kun]

BTW how does sundering titan's ability work? too vague in my head

[Kenny_C.002]

when it comes into play, pick 1 of each basic land on the field (if any, but you must pick all valid targets until it fills as much as it can) and destroy them. So destroy up to 5 lands, but it will most likely blow up some of your land too.

[digi-kun]

ok at first i was confused about 1 of the basic land types(choose 1 type of land and destroy them) thx

[Kenny_C.002]

ic what you mean by that. Yeah, sometimes things can get confusing.

btw, Eternal Witness...return of creature slide? *GASP!*

[digi-kun]

Bringer of the dawns and Beacons in fifth dawn are crazyness

[Kenny_C.002]

Well the green bringer sucks. lol The red bringer is next. White/Blue Bringers are second. Black Bringer is #1! :P

Red Beacon I don't particularly like tho. Blue beacon is the best one there. :P

BLUE IS MAKING A COMEBACK! not. :P

[digi-kun]

aw well their cool pics anyways

[nic egan]

Lands

17 Mountains
4 Great Furnaces
1 Forgoten cave
= 22 red mana

Creatures

2 Atogs
1 Megatog
2 Ogre Lead foots
1 Spikeshot Goblin
1 Laccolith Whelp
1 Goblin Piledriver
1 Goblin Sledder
1 Goblin Sky Raider
1 SpurredvWolverine

Artifact Creatures

1 Juggernaut
1 Cathodion
2 Myr Retriever
1 Nim Replica
1 Drill-Skimmer
1 Oxidda Golem
1 Dross Scorpion

Instants

3 Barbed Lightnings
2 Inflame
1 Tears of Rage
1 Shrapnel Blast
1 Grab the Reins
1 Puse of the Forge

Sorcerys

1 Misguided Rage
2 Echoing Ruins

Artifacts

1 Pyrite Spellbomb
1 Scale of Chiss-Goria
1 Tooth of Chiss-Goria
1 Geth's Grimoroire

Equipment

1 Whispersilk Cloak
1 Vulshok Morningstar
1 Leonin Scimitar
1 Shield of Kaldra

Thats my deck :)

[kirby00]

Actually, the weilding jar ability does not trigger due to you sacrificing the retriever to the Atog. You CANNOT regenerate sacrificed creatures (see rulebook). Thus this cannot happen, sorry. Well technically you can still sac the weilding jar to the retriever, but it just won't do anything. btw, regeneration is a replacement effect, thus the retriever, if regenerated, does not hit graveyard from play.

Kirby, you can use retriever instead of junkdiver (costs 1 less and uncommon). The combo I'm not sure I understood tho. lol

Anyway, killing spree:
Door to Nothingness, Doubling Cube, Twiddle, 11 mana = target opponent loses.

So have 11 mana, activate doubling cube to get 16 mana. Pay 5 (of any mana) for Door to Nothingness. Cast twiddle (1 blue) to untap it. Tap 10 (2 of each colour), sac Door to nothingness: target player loses the game. Simple 11 mana with 6 mana specifications. Should have no problem with channel the suns + 1 blue mana anyway. Anyone up for UG with this? btw, if you do use channel the suns, you need 10 mana, with mana specifications of 1 green mana and 1 blue mana (easier).
my combo was you have monkey cage out and you play lets say pyrexian collisus, then it goes to graveyard, & then use goblin welder to switch monkey cage with pyrex and then monkey cage comes into play...you either have lifeline to revive it at end of turn or use another goblin welder to switch lets say retriever/diver to graveyard for pyrex... then u get another 8 2/2 green creatures... also if u have 2 monkey cages u play pyrex and both go to graveyard... then u use welder to send retriever/diver to graveyard to retireve them both...

[Kenny_C.002]

I'm not sure if it works still, though. I think I get what you're saying tho, Kirby.

Lands

17 Mountains
4 Great Furnace
1 Forgoten cave
= 22 red mana

Creatures

2 Atogs
1 Megatog
2 Ogre Lead foots
1 Spikeshot Goblin
1 Laccolith Whelp
1 Goblin Piledriver
1 Goblin Sledder
1 Goblin Sky Raider
1 SpurredvWolverine

Artifact Creatures

1 Juggernaut
1 Cathodion
2 Myr Retriever
1 Nim Replica
1 Drill-Skimmer
1 Oxidda Golem
1 Dross Scorpion

Instants

3 Barbed Lightnings
2 Inflame
1 Tears of Rage
1 Shrapnel Blast
1 Grab the Reins
1 Puse of the Forge

Sorcerys

1 Misguided Rage
2 Echoing Ruins

Artifacts

1 Pyrite Spellbomb
1 Scale of Chiss-Goria
1 Tooth of Chiss-Goria
1 Geth's Grimoroire

Equipment

1 Whispersilk Cloak
1 Vulshok Morningstar
1 Leonin Scimitar
1 Shield of Kaldra

Thats my deck :)

I see randomnessgoing on here. This might be the main problem with this deck here. I mean, a single piledriver?

I guess the first thing would be to home in onto some target deck that you might want and work for that. I can see a great Atog type deck coming along, but I can also see possible Spikey deck, too. Just go ahead and take things out that don't belong (like the driver, the misguided rage, etc.) and work with the gaps you have.

[kirby00]

i have a simple blue deck, it uses unblockables/poke creatures to return opponents creatures to owners hand when it deals damage to him, as well as making me draw cards whenever i did combat damage to him with curiosity and coastal piracy... i used like 1 portal 2nd age card tho... if u need help about the other deck i get then pm... btw look up spirit of resistance or sumthing, then lace of something and sterling grove
*cant remember name but hears wut cards do: Spirit of resistance (white enchantment): prevent all damage to u if u control a permanent of each color,
lace of somehting (blue instant): change target permanent to the color(s) of your choice permanently...
^^^OPTIONAL: STERLING GROVE (WHITE, GREEN, 1 COLORLESS) HAVE 2 OUT ULL SEE WHY: Eachother ENCHANTMENT U CONTROL CANT BE TARGET OF SPELLS/ABILITIES... (so if u control 2, then none of enchanttments can be destroyed by getting targeted, and your only weakness is tranquility, hush, etc...^^^

[Kenny_C.002]

Sterling Grove has a converted mana cost of 2...that's why it was so broken back then...

[digi-kun]

BTW why is black lotus so rare and expensive these days?

[Kenny_C.002]

Whenever you can create 3 mana out of thin air, something is wrong. Black Lotus takes the number 1 spot of the "Power 9" aka the 9 most broken alpha cards to ever be printed.

The reasoning behind it is because of the Lotus' ability to literally create 3 mana on turn 1, meaning you have 4 mana to work with. At this point, all I know is that 4 mana is enough to power ENOUGH 1st-turn kills taht it's not even funny anymore. In fact, most 1st turn kill decks have 2nd turn kills only if they have a REALLY BAD HAND.

This makes black lotus a valuable card to anyone. Once that happened, its pricing went up. Then things got crazy and now any card from the power 9 costs rediculous amounts because they're so broken.

Power 9:
Black Lotus
The 5 moxes
Time Walk (blue!)
Timetwister (blue!)
Ancestral Recall (blue!)

btw, the tenth is Library of Alexandria.

try playing with any of them, you'll just see how powerful they really are (like proxy or something).

And here's the link for u to see the power 9:
http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=mtgcom/arcana/432

[kirby00]

what do you mean by sterling gorve or ne card being broken? neways dont you think that is good, w/ spirit of resistance, and lace of something you prevent all damage dealt to u w/ just 2 cards... and to prevent you loosing those enchantments, you have sterling groves out, (1 or 2) and you r impenetrable unless sum1 plays a hush/ or tranquility or such... what do u think kenny_c

[Kenny_C.002]

broken is a term coined by the magic columnists. T basically means, TOO cheap. Not very cheapor cool card, but too cheap. You see people referring to skullclamps as broken, or the good ol' black lotus being broken due to the fact taht they're just too good.

Sterling Grove is broken due to the fact that it costs too little for what it does. The closest thing ever to have such an ability is fountain watch, which costs a whooping 5 mana. To add insult to injury, they slap a second ability to the grove, making it a tutor for enchantments as well as protection.

This effectively prevents the popular point-destructive cards like disenchant and naturalize. Tranquility isn't played anyway, people play tempest of light if needed be...even that's rare.

So yeah, Sterling Grove IS a very good card. lol :P

[kirby00]

whats the 2nd ability to the grove?

[Kenny_C.002]

Tutor for an enchantment.

I think the initial cost is 2,sac it. But I'm also thinking it might be GW, sac it. Not completely sure.

Anyway, the ability is "search your library for an enchantment and put it into your hand."

So extra sterling groves are still good, meaning sterling grove is NEVER a dead card...

[KLS]

Yeah? I'm the magic player here. Just picked upone of the champion decks the other day...WAKE KILLS. :P

Anyway, I'm bringing Magic back into this dumphole here (since there's a lack of it here).
i too shall assist you

[Kenny_C.002]

Thanks Blasty. WE GOT MORE SUPPORTERS YEAH! :P

btw, WAKE STILL KILLS! lol

[KLS]

dude kenny
i think the green 1 and the blue 1 is the best
why do you think the green one is the crappiest (besides from the fact that bringers are so easily disrupted)

[Kenny_C.002]

See. White's got an insanely powerful ability to reanimate artifacts, esp. artifacts that have crazy effects but require sacing.

Red is fractured loyalty every turn...

Black is the best one of them all, giving you vampiric tutor every turn (vampiric tutor is indeed banned in some places). That's insanely broken.

Blue gives you inspiration every turn, which is good to okay.

Green is just pulse of the tangle.

I've always thought the red and the green were the least steallar of the 5. Green makes beast tokens. Big deal, it's not like mindslaver for 4 every turn from white, vampiric tutor every turn with green, or inspiration every turn with blue. I mean, ti's good, just not as good as the other guys.

[KLS]

you've got a point if only the green bringers summoned 4/4 or 5/5 beast tokens
then we'd see alot more play with the green one

[Kenny_C.002]

Yup. It's jsut in comparison, I don't like it.

btw, Black Bringer will see tourney play by rouge players. I swear! :P

[KLS]

well black does have lots of potential
what the **** that card is f---ing broken

[Kenny_C.002]

Yeah. Vampiric tutor every turn? That's brokenness! :P

[KLS]

i have a feeling eternal witness/black dawn is gonna be like THE NEXT SKULLCLAMP
we just weren't ready for it

[Kenny_C.002]

I don't know too well still. It's the fact taht black dawn's cost is wayyyyyyy too much for it to maybe be tourney worthy. I mean, 99% of the tourney worhty decks will be from the uncommons anyway.

[KLS]

well maybe eternal witness might be umm you know banned
cause it's to good
you can use eternal in a reanimate decks to

[Kenny_C.002]

likely. She's like the new skullclamp. lol

[KLS]

aww if eternal becomes banned
it'd suck because my other deck relys on eternal witness

[Kenny_C.002]

Naw. It'll probably be staying due to the fact taht green is just not very pwoerful right now...

[KLS]

well i was pretty pleased with 8th edition
hopefully 9th edition will be better

[Kenny_C.002]

I just want counterspells back. I only got 1 copy (I know, it's so bad...blue mage who's a Johnny has 1 counterspell)!

[KLS]

rewind is 8th edition isn't it?

[Kenny_C.002]

it indeed is. It's the best counterspell there is, and it costs 4. 4!!!!!!!

Coutnerspell is still needed, but I doubt it'll be here in 9th either.

[KLS]

i sure hope fog is coming back to 9th edition
if they bring back birds in 9th i'm gonna be pissed

[digi-kun]

i like fog...but i usually use tangle cuz i have so little fogs XD

[KLS]

tangle?
what's that?
is it better than fog?

[Kenny_C.002]

no, dont remember anything with fog abilities that has "tangle" in it. closest thing is spike weaver. lol

anyway, fog's gone. It's now a white ability, so instead you get holy days.

It's OFFICIAL THAT BIRDS WILL NOT BE ON 9TH EDITION. ELVES ARE BACK.
btw, birds will be back with Champs of Kamigawa. lol

[KLS]

WHAT THE ****
birds on champ of kamigawa
YEAH RIGHT

[Kenny_C.002]

That's what they're saying on one of their articles. I have no confirmation of any type, tho. Anyway, new poll: Blinding Angel vs. Dawn elemental

I picked the Angel -_- (I'm a sucker for angels).

[digi-kun]

tangle?
what's that?
is it better than fog?
Tangle 1G Instant
Card Text: Prevent all combat damage that would be dealt this turn.Attacking creatures don’t untap during their controllers’ next untap steps.
and so wht if it costs 1 more?

[KLS]

Tangle 1G Instant
Card Text: Prevent all combat damage that would be dealt this turn.Attacking creatures don’t untap during their controllers’ next untap steps.
and so wht if it costs 1 more?
what set is it from?

[digi-kun]

tis from invasionmy friends were so annoyed with it...

[KLS]

dang
i'm playing type 2 only

[Kenny_C.002]

And after revising the colour wheel, I'm 90% sure that green lost that ability to prevent combat damage en-masse now...

[KLS]

yeah
is their ANY chance that fog might come back?

[Kenny_C.002]

I'm highly doubting it. I know for a fact that they prefer holy days (which is in 8th) over fogs for some reason. So chances are if you see holy day, you won't see fog.

[KLS]

were holy days in 6th edition?

[digi-kun]

nope...only legends, invasion, and 8th

[KLS]

man fogs were all the way up to 7th

[Kenny_C.002]

Yeah. Basically it's after the colour wheel revision when holy days are taking over fogs.

[KLS]

I still think it has a chance
but it'd be a quite interesting match if it was
fog vs hily day for 9th edition
once again i'd choose fog

[Kenny_C.002]

I'd actually choose holy day. It's nothing personal, but I like white more than green, that's all. :P

[KLS]

white is sort of more defensive so i can see your point

[Kenny_C.002]

YEah. I think that's why they are converting fog to white...

[KLS]

but it'd be cool if they still had it for green

[Kenny_C.002]

I guess, for the green players. AGain, I don't care too much for green (probably one of the colours that I like least). Yeah, def. green and red I care the least about. lol

[KLS]

well green is my favorite color i care least for blue/black

[Kenny_C.002]

lol. I'm your opposite. I'm the blue guy and I occasionally like my white and black (I think I like white more tho). It's so strange! :P

[digi-kun]

can sum1 tell me the storyline for Apocalypse(Book)...barnes and noble hasnt got another copy yet...

[Kenny_C.002]

I don't have any books until the onslaught block. sorry.

[KLS]

lol. I'm your opposite. I'm the blue guy and I occasionally like my white and black (I think I like white more tho). It's so strange! :P
no this is good so we have people from 2 points of view
this is really good
so we can debate more wether which cards are better
i rely on brute force
whereas you make the game interesting(i.e. counterspell)

[Kenny_C.002]

lol. It does make things quite interesting in the long run. lol

I'm betting that you'll hate some of the cards I like (e.g. Statecraft.). It'll be fun that way too. :P

[KLS]

i think green and blue are like worst enemies
green counter to blue=choke

[Kenny_C.002]

And yet blue/green is one of the best colour combinations available. lol

[KLS]

exactly
-__-
you counter every thing with blue and attack with brute force with green

[Kenny_C.002]

Yup. Most recent of that is good ol' UG Madness. :P

[KLS]

but i haven't seen any blue/green card
i'm serious
i've never in my life saw a blue/green card
i've seen treva the renewer but it's white/blue/green

[Strider]

but i haven't seen any blue/green card
i'm serious
i've never in my life saw a blue/green card
i've seen treva the renewer but it's white/blue/green

Mystic Snake from Apocalypse is Blue/Green I think. Not too bad for competitive deck as well.

[Eliana]

I use a green deck, with some elves in it heck i havent played for a loooonng time o_0

[KLS]

it sucks period no doubt about it 4 TO CAST DUDE

[Kenny_C.002]

The snake? yo it was the equivalent of like Exalted Angel today (like back in the day). This guy was blowing the tourney scene right out of the water with a counterspell within a creature (so technically it's a 2-for-1 card), causing such a card advantage that it wasn't even funny. btw, it COULD NOT HAVE COSTED 3 OR LESS due to the fact that aleurn was around (free coutnerspelling O_O).

[KLS]

imo the snake sucks..
period
maybe it's the fact that i rely on big creaturews
big creatures=good