Needs a battle

[Action]

Standard battle
lvl 100
No Ubers (Mewtwo/Mew/Ho-oh/Lugia/Wobbuffet
/Kyogre/Groudon/Deoxys/Rayquaza/Palkia/Dialga/Giratina/Darkrai)

No hax items (items that lower accuracy or quick claw)
No hax moves ( DT/OHKO)

PM me if you're interested

[Nightofshadow]

I am up for a battle. Lets play now

[typeZERO]

I can battle later on. I'm already going to have a rematch against JoWood (there was an error , we're getting suited up.)

[Action]

Omega, I was just playing him and he ran. Pity.

[JoWood]

Yeah, *sigh

I ran.

It was more like a switch war. It's funny you failed to mention that you use Cresselia too in that little uber list - which of course it is (an uber). Light Screens and Reflects, along with your legendary tank - there was no way I'd win.

Good match though -

[Arkarian]

Since when is Cresselia an uber?

[Action]

Cresselia isn't an uber. and there is nothing wrong with Light Screen and Reflect

[Gourmet Popcorn]

ill battle you im looking for a tough battle my fc is in my sig.

[Action]

Excellent battle NoS. I definitely got lucky when Hypnosis missed twice at the end.

[Nightofshadow]

Yes you did get lucky.... I never catch a break....

[Action]

btw, I meant to applaude you for the fine manuevering you did around my PZ. You completely predicted it having boltbeam, which threw me off. It appears there are decent battlers here, despite what the majority may lead me to believe.

[Nightofshadow]

There are decent players here. There just arent many. I am relatively new to pokemon(only have been playing for a month) But there are some good players here

Some players to watch out for

Furix
Richard steel
Samson
Born 2 b evil

I am still pretty new. Those are the main guys to look out for.

[Action]

And AragornBird of course.

[Nightofshadow]

Well yeah... I didnt count him because hes hardly around

[Action]

mm, he spends more time on Smogon.

[Richard Lynch]

Cresselia isn't an uber. and there is nothing wrong with Light Screen and Reflect

Cresselia isn't an uber, you're right, but it's still polite to let people know if you use legendaries in general. Some people (like myself) may dislike it.

[Samson]

yeah the usage of legendaries really confuses a lot of people new to the competitive battling scene, and even in some places, is looked down on. it would be preferable to let people know before hand.

[Action]

Cresselia isn't an uber, you're right, but it's still polite to let people know if you use legendaries in general. Some people (like myself) may dislike it.
Eh, I happen to find that a bit silly. Honestly, aside from the aforementioned uber legends, plus Lati@s with Soul Dew which I forgot, legends aren't that special. Sure, some can be awesome, like Raikou, Cresselia, and Jirachi, but some are pretty bad. Entei, Articuno, and Registeel come to mind quickly.

Also, the beef many people have with legends is their high base stats. A stupid point, seeing as how there are 5 pokemon (Dragonite, T-tar, Metagross, Salamence, and Garchomp) with 600 base stats, which either ties or beats the non-uber Legends. Slaking even goes so far as to tie Kyogre, Groudon, and Regigigas in base stats. Yet these 6 pokemon aren't banned are even overly discrimiated against, and they are better than the legends typically. Dragonite possesses a massive movepool, while T-tar/Mence/gross have awesome abilities and are very threatening, more so than Dragonite generally. Garchomp has an unusual base speed stat, thus allowing it to outrun common threats, and it often packs Swords Dance to mess with people allowing it to dent just about everything in the metagame badly.

People shouldn't fear legends, they're no harder to cope with than any of these other pokemon.

[Samson]

well it's not just the stats. it's the abilities, type and the movepool as well. true, all those 600-tier pokemon are just as strong as legendaries and some, stronger. hell, Tyranitar's stats actually come out higher than 600 now because of Sandstream boosting its special defense by 33%, therefore making its base stat total 633. because of this, many consider it an Uber.

the truth is it's just not fair to those who don't have access to those kind of pokemon, and to those who don't want to use them. i have enough trouble using pokemon like Azumarill against teams with Tyranitar, Skarmory, Blissey and Garchomp. strategy and proper training is important, but that all gets thrown out the window when you can use something like Garchomp that outspeeds a majority of the pokemon in the game.

[Action]

well it's not just the stats. it's the abilities, type and the movepool as well. true, all those 600-tier pokemon are just as strong as legendaries and some, stronger. hell, Tyranitar's stats actually come out higher than 600 now because of Sandstream boosting its special defense by 33%, therefore making its base stat total 633. because of this, many consider it an Uber.

the truth is it's just not fair to those who don't have access to those kind of pokemon, and to those who don't want to use them. i have enough trouble using pokemon like Azumarill against teams with Tyranitar, Skarmory, Blissey and Garchomp. strategy and proper training is important, but that all gets thrown out the window when you can use something like Garchomp that outspeeds a majority of the pokemon in the game.

Hm, I was under the impression Sandstream boosts Spd by 50%. btw, that doesn't give it a 650 base stat, it's actually higher than that.

Your hardly have a point with accessibilty issue, as the same point can be said about many pokemon. "You can't use Salamence, I can't get it in Pearl" vs "You can't use T-tar, I don't have Diamond" or how about if someone lacks the GBA games - that severely cuts down the pokemon availability.

And as for your Azumarill, this is why there are different metaggames. Ubers, OU, and UU all exist for people who like to use different things.

On a side note, using UU/BL pokemon for standard/uber matches is always fun and throws people off. I have fond memories of my Scizor ohko'ing a Ho-oh with HP Rock.

[Richard Lynch]

People shouldn't fear legends, they're no harder to cope with than any of these other pokemon.

Then there's no reason to use them if people wish you not to.

Like Samson said, it's not about base stats total, it's about the distribution of them, and their abilities. Jirachi isn't an uber, yet it has the same base stats as Mew, who IS an uber. Why isn't Mew allowed? Massive movepool. So you must take into account everything like that.

Metagross is borderline uber, but not really... he suffers the four move syndrome: Meteor Mash and Earthquake are givens 99.9% of the time. The other two can be fillers, and usually not great ones at that.

I really don't mind if you use legendaries, it's your team. Just tell me you use them before we battle. I'm sure everyone here will agree with that. And then have a backup team of normal Pokemon you can use.

With normal pokemon, there's an unlimited amount of possibilities for a single team... but with legendaries? They're just way too over-hyped and "exclusive" for my taste.

[Action]

Then there's no reason to use them if people wish you not to.

Like Samson said, it's not about base stats total, it's about the distribution of them, and their abilities. Jirachi isn't an uber, yet it has the same base stats as Mew, who IS an uber. Why isn't Mew allowed? Massive movepool. So you must take into account everything like that.

Metagross is borderline uber, but not really... he suffers the four move syndrome: Meteor Mash and Earthquake are givens 99.9% of the time. The other two can be fillers, and usually not great ones at that.

I really don't mind if you use legendaries, it's your team. Just tell me you use them before we battle. I'm sure everyone here will agree with that. And then have a backup team of normal Pokemon you can use.

With normal pokemon, there's an unlimited amount of possibilities for a single team... but with legendaries? They're just way too over-hyped and "exclusive" for my taste.

Over-hyped? Yes
Exclusive? Only the event legends, which you won't see much of anyway.

You forget that legends suffer from '4 move syndrome' as you called it. Raikou only ever has one moveset, and 9/10 3 of those moves are t-bolt, sub, and calm mind. And don't give me any of that crap that it's stats are tilted for speed and sp att. Look at Alakazam - that thing is stronger and faster. AND you can breed it. Seems to me that 'zam trumps raikou here.

Celebi, on the other hand, has a decent sized movepool. But it suffers from god-awful typing. Let's count the weaknesses. Grass - Bug/Fire/Ice/Flying/Poison, Psychic - Bug/Dark/Ghost. That makes 6 2x weaknesses and 1 4x. And these are common attack types too. Doesn't seem broken to me.

Another point: you can't breed legends. Typcally legends are going to have average stats. Meanwhile, the non-legend users can simply breed awesome pokemon and get better stats. Catching a good legend often requires just as much of a time commitment as breeding does, if not more.


In short, there is no reason legends should be discriminated against. I'm not saying they're a requirement on my teams, because they're not. But if one fits in nicely, I'm not going to hesisate to use it.

[Richard Lynch]

You forget that legends suffer from '4 move syndrome' as you called it. Raikou only ever has one moveset, and 9/10 3 of those moves are t-bolt, sub, and calm mind. And don't give me any of that crap that it's stats are tilted for speed and sp att. Look at Alakazam - that thing is stronger and faster. AND you can breed it. Seems to me that 'zam trumps raikou here.

In short, there is no reason legends should be discriminated against. I'm not saying they're a requirement on my teams, because they're not. But if one fits in nicely, I'm not going to hesisate to use it.

Not really... Raikou has much higher Defenses, which makes up for a slight lack in Speed and Special Attack. With 100 base in Special Defense, he may even be considered a little bulky.

Let's take into account someone like Jirachi... 100 base in every stat. Doesn't seem like it'd take much effort to fit him into a team, since he could technically excel in any stat. Seems like a bit of a shortcut to me.

Now my opinion on Cresselia... not an uber, and a fantastic dual Wall, along with his ability Levitate. Reminds me of Dusknoir... 135 base in each Defense, without Levitate. But Cresselia has 120 base HP, while Dusknoir has a pitiful 45. 120 HP is actually pretty damn big, and combined with both his Defenses (120 Def, 130 SpDef I think?) makes it a bit too hard to take down. Every wall has their weak point: Skarmory, Steelix, Blissey, Milotic, and even Dusknoir.

A tank of that ability takes no real strategy or skill to use, unlike Blissey or Skarmory.

Like I said, go ahead and use legendaries. I don't like them, but that doesn't mean I don't want you to use them. However, simply state you're using legendaries. It takes two words in your post: "legendaries allowed". And likewise, people who dislike using legendaries, say "no legendaries" (although most do that anyways). That way, everyone will be happy.

[caster]

I dunno, about that Blissey, but Skarmory I do see people taking skill to use. But Blissey on the other hand.....oh yeah, what about Rotom. nobody mentions it ever =(. I haven't caught the one in my game cause, I just don't care about most of the legendaries, all of them I see are pretty ugly looking.

[Action]

Not really... Raikou has much higher Defenses, which makes up for a slight lack in Speed and Special Attack. With 100 base in Special Defense, he may even be considered a little bulky.

Let's take into account someone like Jirachi... 100 base in every stat. Doesn't seem like it'd take much effort to fit him into a team, since he could technically excel in any stat. Seems like a bit of a shortcut to me.

Now my opinion on Cresselia... not an uber, and a fantastic dual Wall, along with his ability Levitate. Reminds me of Dusknoir... 135 base in each Defense, without Levitate. But Cresselia has 120 base HP, while Dusknoir has a pitiful 45. 120 HP is actually pretty damn big, and combined with both his Defenses (120 Def, 130 SpDef I think?) makes it a bit too hard to take down. Every wall has their weak point: Skarmory, Steelix, Blissey, Milotic, and even Dusknoir.

A tank of that ability takes no real strategy or skill to use, unlike Blissey or Skarmory.

Like I said, go ahead and use legendaries. I don't like them, but that doesn't mean I don't want you to use them. However, simply state you're using legendaries. It takes two words in your post: "legendaries allowed". And likewise, people who dislike using legendaries, say "no legendaries" (although most do that anyways). That way, everyone will be happy.

Alright, point taken on Raikou. However, Cresselia still needs plenty of strategy behind it. While it's main weakness may not be typing or poor HP, it has minimal recovery options. It has Rest, which is meh, and Moonlight. And considering the sheer volume of teams running sandstream out there, Mononlight is just as bad, if not worse.

But truly, it seems the only thing you're trying to do in this debate is get me to put "legends allowed" in my battle posts. I still think it's a silly thing, seeing as how I never said they weren't. But regardless, if an effort to tick less people off, I'll start doing that.

[Nightofshadow]

YOu dont even need to do all of that because you never once said that it wasnt possible for people to use them in the first place. Thats a bit petty :V

[Richard Lynch]

I dunno, about that Blissey, but Skarmory I do see people taking skill to use. But Blissey on the other hand.....oh yeah, what about Rotom. nobody mentions it ever =(. I haven't caught the one in my game cause, I just don't care about most of the legendaries, all of them I see are pretty ugly looking.

haha, Blissey takes some strategy. Sure, just push it into a special sweeper and it's fine, but with the new mixed physical/special attacks, Blissey is MUCH harder to use with it's utterly craptacular Defense. Even with a Bold nature and max Defense EVs (standard Blissey), it can be taken down very easily by a physical hit.

And many people don't consider Rotom a legendary... mainly because it can breed, but it also has some pretty bad stats. I'm clueless about why he gets legendary music, tough.

And Action:

That's all I wanted. I wasn't trying to say one should NEVER use legendaries; THAT is silly, because I agree that many legendaries have the stats of an above average commoner (although there are really no "below average" or even "average" legendaries, they're all above average, which is why I see it as a slight shortcut. But hey, it's all relative! It's just common courtesy to let people know if you do use them, since many people round here do not.

EDIT:

YOu dont even need to do all of that because you never once said that it wasnt possible for people to use them in the first place. Thats a bit petty :V

Meh... it's better to make everything clear rather than risk an assumption and get crap from someone. I don't use legendaries, and I don't use clauses, so I let people know in case they think Sleep Clause is in play, and I use Hypnosis out the wazoo. Unless you're in a set tourny, "standards" are in the eyes of the beholder.

[Nightofshadow]

Blissey is a stupid special wall that just sits there for the most part. She requires strat but little to none at all does she require at all. (dont worry thats just my raw hatred for it) If people make a rule You can either conform or dont play them(Which i do pretty often because people tell me i cannot use the pokemon that i want to use :V) If someone can use spore an entire match, Thats fine with you but if someone uses one legendary that isnt? WTF? That makes no sense to me and isnt fair at all. Sorry I dont agree with your view point.

[caster]

yoiu ever think that rotom gets the legend music cause he is a legend. Plus what about blissey's high hp, you forgot about that?

[Legacy]

yoiu ever think that rotom gets the legend music cause he is a legend. Plus what about blissey's high hp, you forgot about that?
But Blissey's high HP is offset by it's 10 base defense stat so it can still be OHKO'd with the right move.

[stevenx12202]

I will challange you but can i use Lucario

[Richard Lynch]

yoiu ever think that rotom gets the legend music cause he is a legend. Plus what about blissey's high hp, you forgot about that?

But... Rotom can breed. Basic rule for legendaries is that they can't breed, not even with Ditto. Besides, if he is a legendary, he's the worst one ever. Only upside is he has Levitate to avoid a ground weakness.

And Legacy is right... Blissey has monster HP, but even Bold with max EVs in Defense (as I said before, standard Blissey), a decent Brick Break can OHKO her. As I've said many times before, it's the distribution of stats that makes a Pokemon uber/legendary, not just the base total.

[caster]

rotom is still a legend, he wouldn't get the music, if he wasn't though. The standard battle theme would still be playing in the encounter, if he was not a legend and he'd appear like a regular random battle.

[typeZERO]

rotom is still a legend, he wouldn't get the music, if he wasn't though. The standard battle theme would still be playing in the encounter, if he was not a legend and he'd appear like a regular random battle.

AND? Cresselia and Shaymin get the wild pokemon battle music. Rotom problably got the legendary music because of how the beginning of the music fits in with the Old Chateau. (Pretty freaky at beginning if you ask me , but would be creepier if they put Arceus theme in there O_o)

[caster]

but don'tyou have to also makes those encounters happen through an event as well? then also what about manaphy as well isn't it a legendary, it is also capable of breeding, is it not? So I don't see how legends can't breed if manaphy is one that can, yunno, so much for the traditional legend, eh.

[Action]

Manaphy isn't a true breeder, as it doesn't produce more manaphies. Phiones suck as it is.

[caster]

Manaphy isn't a true breeder, as it doesn't produce more manaphies. Phiones suck as it is.
It still can breed can't it though. As opposed to nothing period from other legends, it can make eggs and the others can't.

[Action]

look, it's pretty obvious that the definition of "legend" is up for debate. No longer can we say that legends lack genders, or the ability to breed, or are even one of a kind. In my opinion, legends are pokemon that you cannot breed to obtain. That applies to Manaphy and rules out Rotom.

[caster]

hey you wanna battle, action?

[Action]

sure, my FC is in my profile.

[caster]

yay^^, logging on right now

[Action]

Good battle Caster. You're very elec weak though.

[caster]

nah you killed off my electric absorbers from my lack of knowing electvire =(

You had me when you started using the grass, when I didn't have ludi in this time around. The grass knots obilterated Swampert and then the other one got earthquaked, from me, not knowing vire. That guy is very quick.

but it sure was fun^^

[Action]

Yeah, Electivire is a machine. It has an expert belt too, just to give in that extra damage. Anyway, if I may make a suggest: try Sub-punching with Poliwrath. Substitute, and then use Focus Punch behind it. Sleeppunching also works well too, especially now that Hypnosis has boosted acc.

[caster]

I will try the sub, focus punch thing then. I'll be looking forward to the next time we play. ^^

[Punishment]

Action, I'm up for a battle if you still are.

[Action]

Tomorrow maybe. I'm currently finishing one with Fiore and then I'm off to bed. I have work in the morning

[Punishment]

Sure thing. See ya tommorrow then. ^_^

[furix]

I am up for a quick battle.

4 Pokemon, standard rules(No OHKO, DT, Sleep Clause, no ubers, etc)

[furix]

nevermind i gotta go D: D: D: D: D: D: