View Full Version : New Story -- to be cliche or not to be cliche?
July 29th, 2007, 12:21 AM
Thinking of writing a story about three trainers journeys through all four regions. Yes, it sounds similar.
I haven't thought of the names yet, so I'm using some you'll recognize for now:
Ambition: To 'conquer' Kanto.
Personality: Serious and hard-working. Doesn't like arguing.
Other: Lukas starter his journey on his own - the other two somehow managed to tag along...
Ambition: None really, except to collect 'the cute Pokemon'.
Personality: Cheerful, anti-sexist, ignorant, quick to give up.
Other: Safe to say three of her Pokemon weren't caught by her. Pretty useless with a Pokeball.
Ambition: To become the next best Professor.
Personality: Athletic, adventurous, optimistic (not when it comes to Dawn though).
Well, only 'Lukas' takes up the journey. Dawn tends to be comic relief, and Marcus sometimes just walks off on his own. Before you all say 'omg cliche trainer pokemon cliche' it's not on a 'what's the moral today?' basis, more of a 'there is a moral on this story?'
And yes, there will be light violence. Marcus gets punched in the face by somee thief in Chapter 3 =]
So, what do you think?
P.S. I've wrote at least 20 fanfic stories before, I've won an award for one of them, and I won in my English Writing Test by 19 marks, and I'm in the 'boffin english class' at school. So, I'm not a noob in that sense.
July 29th, 2007, 10:06 AM
It seems cliched to me, but with winning an award and stuff I think you can pull it off.
Anyway, tell us some of the things that will make it different from a normal trainer fic.
July 29th, 2007, 11:05 AM
Well, okay, for a start, it isn't all pure lovey-dovey stuff all the way through. Like, my trainers don't share special bonds with their Pokemon (or at least, not ones where they spill out their emotions), and the trianers aren't all that crazy about becoming Pokemon Masters. Although they are all main characters, only one of them does the journey, whilst the other two are the main characters in the story. Lukas is the 'in-between' guy, who tries to get the other two to become friends. Also, I intend to put maybe some blood and tears into this, just to make it that more realistic. And I'm not going to use 'anime' description, where the trainer just calls out attacks. It is going to be a lot more based around the Pokemons feelings and actions. That's just a summary of some of the things. And, not to be stuck-up or anything, I'm generally a better writer than the authors of other cliche fics, from what I've seen.
July 29th, 2007, 11:21 AM
Alright, Mr. Ninjapig, you have fallen into serious error on three counts:
1. You have fallen into the error of saying that "not wanting to become a Pokemon Master" makes this story less cliched. If it does so, it only does so mildly. Most OT fics generally involve a trainer attempting to conquer a specific region or win some award or something, which yours seems to center around.
2. Not having a strong bond with your Pokemon does not make your story any less of a cliche. Having your Pokemon initially mistrust or not know your trainer very well at the beggining and then gradually come to trust and even enjoy their company throughout the course of a story is the route most often taken, actually. If your characters and Pokemon don't eventually form some sort of friendship by the end of the fic, it won't seem that realistic and the Pokemon are at risk of becoming "mindless drones", presuming they're still obeying their trainer's orders.
3. "Anime description?" That's an odd way of putting it. And if the trainers don't call out attacks or help to assist the Pokemon in some way, what's the point of having a trainer anyway? They don't really do all that much for the Pokemon aside from telling it how to fight. Having the Pokemon initially disobey and decide to do its own thing is okay, or having it take initiative when the trainer is still planning things out, but eliminating trainer input during battle entirely is pretty much fail.
To top all that off, while you aren't a n00b, you aren't a divine-powered fanfic author either. In order to make an OT fic good, you need a bit more then common sense. You need to be able to write like your story is about to be published. Think you can handle that?
July 29th, 2007, 11:26 AM
I say, if you want your story to be less cliché, than make it of your own creation, think outside the box.
July 29th, 2007, 11:29 AM
My Answer, ACC:
1. The story doesn't center around trying to conquer anything. The two main characters are only there to support their friend, who is doing the League Battles and such.
2. What I mean is when people say in their fics, when the characters are thinking 'My Pikachu will get through this. I know he can,' and stuff like that. It's too corny for me, and I just can't stand it, and I see it in a lot of OT fics. I'm not just a member on this forum, you know.
3. This is what I mean by anime description:
"Raichu, use Thunderbolt!" shouted Phil.
"No! Come on Mudkip, we can win this! Use Water Gun!"
"Raichu, don't fail! Use Quick Attack and..."
That's what I mean by anime description.
Who said I was a divine powered fanfic author anyway? I said I don't fall into the same traps as everyone else. I tend to be able to spot what is bad in a fic, and what is good. I keep the good, chuck out the bad for something original. Oh, and the last sentence makes me think you're trying to intimidate me. I'm sorry, but whilst I think I can handle it, it is only a story after all, and although I will write to my best standard, I don't really care who says what about it.
July 29th, 2007, 11:45 AM
1. The League Battling main character is what's cliche.
2. That makes more sense, but on its own it won't save your fanfic from being *gasp* mediocre.
3. That isn't anime description, since in the anime you actually get to see the Pokemon pulling the attacks off. What you're talking about is "nondescription", which is essentially replacing the description of the actual attack with the trainer shouting it, or the Pokemon shouting its own name.
Divine Powered Fanfic Author (noun): See "Saffire Persian" and "Chibi_Pika"
I could add a few more names there, but basically anyone whose fanfiction has earned month or week awards is pretty much "divine powered fanfiction author". Not that they're actually divinely inspired, they're just really great authors with original ideas, a grasp of good descriptive imagery, and nothing really wrong with any of their stories. I only say "divine powered" because I'm ACC, and melodrama is what I do best.
You do fall into the same traps as everyone else, by the way. Same basic setup- two boys, one girl. Same goal for the main character- win gym battles and league battles. Same brash overconfidence in your own writing ability. And don't take that last line as a threat. Think of it as a challenge. "I dare you to prove me wrong". That sort of thing. If you do, I'll be forever impressed, but from what I've seen, your writing is fairly mediocre- not bad, but not all that gripping either. It makes me want to say "Ho-hum, this isn't bad but I'd really rather be reading something with a little more drama instead" as apposed to "Wow, this is really exciting and/or original and interesting! This person deserves my utmost respect! I am not worthy to lick his or her boots!"
Just forget that last sentence, yes...
July 29th, 2007, 11:51 AM
1. The main character is not battling the League.
2. I don't care. I'm writing because I want to.
3. Well, I read on a guide here, that is anime description, but whatever you say...
4. You've read one chapter of my work. You can't judge me fairly just yet.
The thing is, I don't write to please people. I write because I want to. If I really want to write something great, I will do. But...as you said, it will probably be mediocre, to the point everyone yawns, and again I'll say, I really don't care.
July 29th, 2007, 1:31 PM
1. I thought you just said he was participating in League Battles?
2. Saying that is basically a cheap way to avoid accepting any constructive criticism.
3. The guide here called that "Anime Description"? Why the heck did they do that?
4. Yah, I can, because eighty-five percent of the time it's the first chapter that sets the tone for the rest of the fic.
So wait, you don't write to please people, yet you're posting your fanfiction here for others to read and enjoy? My logic break senses are tingling....
July 30th, 2007, 12:24 AM
1. There is three characters. The two main ones aren't battling in the League. The other is, but he is not as important.
2. I accept con crit. But 'this story has been done so many times yawn' is not constructive critisicm.
4. Well, I must be a part of the 15% then.
Well, I enjoy writing it myself, and if more people enjoy it, then I enjoy it even more. Also, I want to become an author when I'm older, so stories like this our practise, and using the con crit to make it better improves my 'serious' work, which I don't post here.
July 30th, 2007, 3:55 AM
1. From what I've seen, Lukas has taken the most "screen time" so far, if you get my meaning. I'd also like to point out that if you're going to ditch the cliched league-battling main character, you're going to have to find something to make the story exciting. That's why writing OT fics is so difficult- not only do you need a non-cliched story, you also need an exciting one. If you aren't entertaining anyone with a fanfic, what was the point of putting it online in the first place, Nyeh?
2. No, that isn't the crit. That is a warning. What I'm trying to say is that you shouldn't act like this is something never done before. Chances are that somewhere on the internet, somebody has written a fanfic just like this before, and he's doing a better job.
3. Learn to count good, like what I do.
4. What did I tell you? See, you're only reinforcing my anaylsis of you: you're an overconfident person who really doesn't know when to stop refuting the critic and start proving him wrong. Put your pen where your mouth is. Then I'll either apologize for giving you a hard time, or I'll be proven right. There you go, my challenge to you.
If you want to be a famous author, you should try to improve everything you do. Heck, the only fanfic I've written without the intention of improving it was "The Best Original Fanfic EVER-NOT!". (Bear with me here, yes I know it sounds like a parody, but it isn't). The only reason I don't intend to "improve" that one is that it is there for the sole purpose of making half the people who read it chuckle, and everybody stare at it and go "MXY, who the heck wrote this, it's like.... what the heck is it anyway?" So if you're saying that what you've written here is for the sole purpose of being mediocre, bland, and otherwise meh, I may as well stop reviewing.
July 30th, 2007, 4:15 AM
Well, I've changed the direction of the story. I'm posting the next chapter in a few minutes. The first chapter doesn't make sense according to this one, I'll fix it in due time.
July 30th, 2007, 1:55 PM
Ninjapig isnt a baby, just isnt a member that's been on the forums for a long time. You dont treat me like such!
July 31st, 2007, 3:08 AM
The difference is, Champ, that you don't argue with my criticisms.
July 31st, 2007, 3:22 AM
So you're treating me like a 'noob' because I'm arguing my view aswell. I'm finding that pretty unfair, but as I've said, I've changed the direction of the story, so we don't even need to be discussing this anymore.
July 31st, 2007, 5:09 AM
Agreed, but I don't like it that you're saying I'm "treating you as a n00b". Believe me, I'm much harsher with actual n00bs. I'm telling you that you're cocky and a bit arrogant, or at least it seems that way to me. On the other hand, since you changed the direction of your story, it seems to me that you're not quite as cocky as I had imagined. Sorry.
Anyway, agreed. We can stop now.
July 31st, 2007, 1:10 PM
Hmmph. You even said that I wasnt trying to improve my story. And i've argued with you plenty of times at first.
August 4th, 2007, 5:22 AM
I never actually said that, Dach. I warned you that I was frustrated that you switched from "colored" to "bold" font, both effects that I specifically stated didn't make your fic look better, and in fact made it worse. You stopped doing that, but you are still having trouble with a few other things, chapter placement being chief among them at the moment. You could really stand to combine a few of your chapters.
Now before you say anything else about being new, may I point out that being new isn't an adequate excuse? If you're new, you get easier phrased criticism, but it is still criticism. If you see the criticism, and you don't conform to it or prove it superfluous, then you are the same from that point on as anyone else who thinks they're better then the critic. Newsflash- we're all amateurs. Except for a select few, none of us can say that we are better then the other. By the same token, none of the others can say they're better then we are. So when a critic finds a mistake and it is a genuine problem, he isn't saying he's better then you, ha-ha, he's saying that you could make this better. Kapish?
August 16th, 2007, 9:22 PM
Divine Powered Fanfic Author (noun): See "Saffire Persian" and "Chibi_Pika"
Lol. Whaddya know, people still know my name. xP
But anyways. Garr...that spiraled into an argument didn't it? =P
When I first saw this thread, I thought the title was asking whether a not a story should use cliches. Shame it ain't...I love intentional cliches--adds original zang. Not too common anymore though...
But in any case, as this is profiles, I'll try to add some stuff.
I was a bit confused by the mentioning of "Anime Description" in the thread, as that is what the optimum description would be. It's game description that's bad. oO You need trainer commands--Pokemon can't strategize.
Regardless of whether or not main characters try to be Pokemon Masters, or go for League tournaments or...or conquer regions(?),
I'm sure you know that it all comes down to the main plotline core. Inciting incident, rising action, ect...that's what to focus on.
Staying away from "lovey-dovey" stuff with Pokemon and their trainer is good, however, ignoring bonds is not. It's all in balance.
Oh, and as a bit of a note: laundry listing character traits in profiles is rarely good to do. It starts people out feeling biased against the characters. >< It also leads to connections with stereotypes, regardless of whether or not a character is deserving. I don't know the characters enough to make a judgment in this case.
Eh...that's all I can think of...meh...