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Kura December 3rd, 2010 2:24 PM

The Drawover Paintover Thread
So.. for the more serious artists on PC.. I've decided to start a paintover thread! Here is where people can put up artwork to be critiqued and then other people in the community can give a visual paintover for that person to help them visualize your critique.
A lot of professional art communities like to do this to help their fellow peers, so I've decided to do it here.

I'd like to remind people to be RESPECTFUL to the artist. It's always hard getting judged for your work, but that's what makes you grow. Also.. don't take things too much to heart. Maybe you love someone and someone else doesn't, but that's okay! Art is all subjective and that's the beauty of it!

Also, it doesn't hurt to have more than one perspective. If I do a paintover for someone and you think my paintover could be improved further, then go for it! Let's all learn from each other and have fun!

Lastly.. please only paint over people's work who want to be critiqued. Artists.. that means.. feel free to just drop off a piece of art in this thread to get critiqued.. but please don't pull random art from other people's threads to drop in here. They might not have wanted a critique and it wasn't in your place to draw over their stuff in that case.

Happy Critiquing! Remember to keep it friendly!!

did a draw-over of one of Kirozane's pieces of a realistic pokemon. (By the way, check out her art thread because she is very talented at animal art!!!)

Now, I personally think her piece came out VERY successfully, but there were a couple of tweaks that I think would've just taken it to the next level.

I used her permission to post this piece. I'm not a professional at animal drawing, but I wanted to provide a couple tips that might've helped or might help her in her next piece:

The tweaks I wanted to add were that.. if it's a top view of the bird, it would've been nice to have the head in a bit more top-view instead of having it profile.
Also, the feathers are really important in realistic rendering, but I believe you did a good job blocking out the shape of the wings. However, you need to focus a little bit on the structure of the placement of the feathers.
If you look at real birds, you will notice that in flight, the feathers at the tips always fringe. Next time try blocking out the individual feathers and take your time rendering them. It'll boost the dynamism of the illustration by a millionfold!

All in all, it really is a successful piece. Even in the background! I love how you added the river to lead the eye to the subject and since it's asymmetrical, it adds dynamism to the illustration. Like I said, just focus on some of the details a bit more and you'll have work that'll just blow people away!

Hope this helps!!

Anastasia.R December 3rd, 2010 4:38 PM

Ohhh, I love this idea, I shall sticky! =D

Wonderful thread, Kura. This is very helpful for many artists. =] For now, I can't give any Cnc, since I don't have the time at this minute to write a crit. XD I will however sometime later!

Loki December 5th, 2010 12:55 PM

Guuuuh this is such a great idea! *A*
The only thing I really wanted critique on I just finished though, so that's a bit of a downer. xD

I will definitely be spamming this thread like no other. *A* I love redliningggg~!

Kura December 10th, 2010 8:09 PM

You should totally post it anyways. It might help give you some insight for the next project you do! <3

Kirozane January 23rd, 2011 8:27 PM

Soooo I have had this WIP sitting around on my compy for a couple days... I feel like I'm doing 93190348723842 things wrong with it... But then, I always feel that way. XD I'm totally unsure about where to go with it, or even if I am doing it right. I was using references while drawing them, they will also be here....

The WIP:

The References

So yeah.... help me maybe? Please?

Kura January 24th, 2011 8:54 PM

Hey Kiro!

First of all I just wanna start by saying.. you've improved a lot! I'm also really happy to see that you've been using references! This is excellent!

Overall, your picture is successful, but where it's lacking is in readable shape. I blocked out the silhouette of the lion in yours, and then next to it, I showed you how arranging the front paws in a more pleasing silhouette will not only let the viewer read it better, but will make for a much more pleasing shape of the subject. (You can see there's a bit of negative space.. like a little triangle, where the paws and the chest are in both variations. And also a bit of negative space from the belly and the back paw. This would natually happen unless you were giving an worm's-eye view. You can also sorta see it in your current signature.)

My first attempt had a different choice of foot placement, just because I personally thought it would be more pleasing, but I did another one with your version of the paw curled under. Now, in your original, the other paw is behind the curled under paw.. when in fact it should be the other way, because the other paw isn't being curled under, the length of it will cause it to come closer to the viewer and actually overlap the curled paw.
So just pick whichever version you feel you like best and work with it.. or just try to keep these things in mind and try your own variation of where the paws are! Experiment and see what you think looks good! :33
It's tough to get your head around some of these perspective things, I understand (It was tough for me at first, too) but the more you practice, the more you will be able to pick up these things.

Essentially the only real difference I made in the second version of the critique is put the other hand in front, give it that bit of negative space. So really, you're on the right track, and you're nailing all the bits that are supposed to be nailed.

I sometimes just like to draw over the other parts of the drawing not because they're wrong, but because I'm trying to get a feel for the volume that you've done to make the appropriate adjustments in the smaller parts that could be more accurate.

I hope this helps!

ReyRey-Pyon February 17th, 2011 5:57 PM

sweet thread. definitely helpful (b")b

I think I'll drop this off for some crits before I do any further damages to it 8P

Loki February 20th, 2011 12:30 AM

I feel like there's something up with his arm.... :I Too long..... weird angle.... hmmm =3=

Kura February 20th, 2011 12:37 AM


Originally Posted by ReyRey-Pyon (Post 6461702)
sweet thread. definitely helpful (b")b

I think I'll drop this off for some crits before I do any further damages to it 8P

Before I tackle this the story seems unclear in the drawing. What is the character thinking/ doing here? Is that a tall table or a regular one?

The character to me looks kinda annoyed.. is that what you were going for?

Also, are you okay with reposing the drawing? Or do you want me to work with what you have? Or would you like to see both options?

Loki: Yours is a pretty simple fix. I'll get to yours soon! (Also are you keeping it black and white? It might be a nice touch if you made the tie black.. I know you lose some detail that you drew in it but the balance will be better IMO)

I have an exam on tuesday I need to study for if you don't mind that I'm a little delayed with these :3

Loki February 20th, 2011 6:09 PM

@Kura: I'm not keeping it black and white- but I would, otherwise. xD But please, take your time! *U*b I'm in no hurry. >u<b

Logiedan February 20th, 2011 7:45 PM

His left arm seems quite stiff and fixed, I think it could be more loose. Unless you're going for that.

Kura February 24th, 2011 1:38 PM

Hey ReyRey! You had something good going on! I just thought you needed a bit more room to expand! Also, don't be afraid to play around with big shapes in the foreground and background to really give the character a "setting"!
Technically, I thought the piece was good, but I felt the character needed more space between them and the table. Don't use objects to cover things up. Try drawing through, or visualizing through, the objects!
In this first version, I really tried to work with what you gave me as I know you spent some time on the face already:
However, I didn't know the story, exactly. I didn't know if your character was pointing to themselves.. so I gave them something that they were doing before being interrupted. When dealing with expressions, you sometimes have to tell a bit of a story? For example, a drawing of a man being angry isn't as appealing or entertaining as a drawing of the same angry man who is running after a dog that stole his underwear! (haha) So play with this! It'll make it a lot more fun, too! There are so many anime artists that just like to draw a pretty face, and I can see you already know how to do that, so take it to the next level and have more fun with it!

I also did another version which I find a bit more appealing, but it would entail you having to erase more of the original picture. I felt with the face tilted the other way, your character should be leaning on that arm. I just gave it a shot anyways..

But regardless, these are just suggestions and possibilities! Take whatever aspects you feel regards to you and try applying them in your own work! I hope this can be of some help!

Now Loki, yours was quite interesting, and I felt the part that you were getting "wrong" was actually, not the arm, but, in fact, moreso the shoulder. remember that if you're having a problem with something, go to the source. Go to where it connects and see how it's working.
You could also have a lot of fun playing with the position of the fingers and the angle of the hand to really drive home your picture! As you can see I tweaked just a few other things that popped out at me for you.

I got a little carried away in this other one (haha.. he's smoking two cigs) because I was kinda unsure of what he was holding.. and I wanted to try and use an element to frame the character. I noticed in your art you create quite simple backgrounds unless you're dealing with graphic elements. so I think you should try encorporating part of the character, or part of what the character is doing as part of the background to take it to the next level.
Overall it's great work and I'd like to see it when you've finished it up!

For both of you, I appreciate your patience and everything. I know I'm quite scribbly with the tablet when I sketch, but I guess that's just my way of figuring out things.
This is, by far, not a "final answer" as you can change up poses indefinitely.. and I'm also not perfect and striving to be better.. but I at least hope to have shone some new perspectives on the way you approach your drawings for next time!

Happy Arting! :3

Hiroshi Sotomura February 27th, 2011 2:14 AM

Getting round to doing a post here because I rarely ever post in Art Gallery, and you kept pestering me to. :D I realise I'll actually learn something from listening to others on art stuff (as well as getting reference drawings, I suppose, to get work done) so I'll post this here and hope you can help me where possible.
Larger size

I want to convey a sense of draft and distance - I've seen this sort of thing in action. As you can probably NOT see (because I didn't actually do a good job at it) this guy's sitting on a speeding car and there's a city backdrop to convey it in a way. I'd like to hear your tips.

Thanks Kura!

ReyRey-Pyon February 27th, 2011 11:17 AM

I almost forgot about this lolll fffffff
Thanks so much for the critiques.
i have returned :T
For this one I wanted him to be a bit, worried, because He;s looking for his sister, but at the same time slightly annoyed
because she runs off constantly,

I'm not sure where I was going with this one tbh, :T

Kura February 28th, 2011 3:04 PM

Okay Jake... well I felt the biggest problem with yours was that.. you say that he's on a car.. but you didn't SHOW the car! How is the viewer supposed to know it's a car? I certainly didn't- and not because it was badly drawn (you actually treated the perspective quite well and you did have accurate car elements and it was well done) but it was because you didn't SELL it! I had to look twice and say "Oh yeah, you're right, he's on a car!"
When approaching a picture like this.. you NEED to draw the car first.. because the car dictates how HE is going to be sitting on it. It's like drawing a face starting with a nostril- you wouldn't do that. You'd either start with the eyes (the part that you'd look at the most) or the structure of the skull.

So I did three versions. One was just a simple car with a foreground and horizon and your character. The second one is something much more DYNAMIC. Notice how the horizon is tilted and it's an up-shot. He's in the center, the car is the foreground, and the background is the setting.

The third one was a re-try at your character. Your character was "Twinning" which means.. he was too symmetrical, which therefore makes the pose a bit boring. I admit I had some trouble with the perspective, but I gave it a shot anyways. Also, since you were going for "cool" I tried making the pants a bit baggier. I like what you were doing with the tie, and that adds a lot of motion, but I almost wanted to see you do it with the jacket, too.. to really sell that he's on top of a moving car. Oh and I like the shades and the smirk :3 Really nice character element!
I'm happy that you challenged yourself to try and do a difficult angle. Yeah it was difficult for me, too. I don't think I was even all that successful helping you out.. but I gave it my best!!

Anyways, tried my best.. tell me what you think!

Try another go at it! I hope I could help! Happy doodling! Keep up the great work!


Hey Reyrey! I like how you've improved already! You have some GREAT action lines going through your characters and the compositions are a lot nicer!

I feel like the next step for you is just to work on hands! Practice practice practice! I helped you out on these, but if you're struggling, try just drawing hands at different angles and you'll get it eventually. Use your own hand and a mirror for reference if you need to! It's a great learning tool!

Also on the first drawing don't be afraid to cover the face with some hair! Just push it! Also I made the pupils smaller to show a sense of being frantic! The eyes can show a lot of emotion!

Hands are hard even for me! They are complicated yet sometimes more important than facial expressions.. the hands can sometimes speak for themselves.. For example:
Just hands.. but they're so powerful and tell a story on their own! :3

Keep at it! You're doing some awesome work!

Kura September 12th, 2011 2:21 PM


Originally Posted by 4Dialga2 (Post 6840604)
Its looks as a Complex Art or Anime Concept. Especially I like the Drawing of the Red Car. Looks like a Lamborghini. Which cartoon is that ? or its your own ?

You'll have to ask Hiroshi Sotomura about that one. This thread here is to help critique art pieces and help artists improve by making them more aware of different approaches to a piece that they're working on, such as different techniques or structure.

Anyone is free to post a piece here that they would like to have critiqued or altered to improve upon. :3 And anyone is free to help with critiquing- not just me. <3

Signomi September 27th, 2011 12:33 PM

First post here, yay!

Anywho, I've been doing a bit of doodling today and ended up drawing a pose that I somewhat like the look of, and I have tried to make it look as realistic as I possibly could...but I'm a bit wary that there are some details I might have fluffed a little, so I'd appreciate if someone could take a look and see if it's alright.

Discount the pointy heel, that I'm going to fix! I'm just wondering if there's anything there I might want to tweak before I add any details.

Kura September 27th, 2011 3:39 PM

You have some great construction going overall, though I just tweaked a few things that I noticed could be enhanced a little.
I think the biggest thing that could have been tweaked was actually the butt.. the way you had it, both legs were on the same plane instead of in perspective, so I shifted the other "cheek" up to show more depth. I also extended the knee a little bit to adjust to this little fix. Other than that it seems in just a couple areas you got a little lost with which part to overlap so I just drew over the line that should be in front. Oh and the leg had a bit of a dip in it and I wasn't sure if you noticed so I just redlined it.

@_@ Also I had to reinstall some drivers on here so my lines may be a bit choppy.. but I hope you get the picture anyways.

THOUGH.. I was wondering if your character was leaning on anything.. because right now she's not balanced (she'd be falling backwards) soo.. let me know if she is or isn't and I can offer some suggestions on how to balance the pose properly.

Also, I'd also suggest drawing in the ear/ears no matter what. The ear really defines the eyeline even moreso than the "line across the face" construction line that helps balance where the features will go. Once you have the ear in you can really get the feeling of the angle of the face.. so although it's not necessary, it's a good habit to pick up.

Hope this helps! I'd like to see it when you've finished :3

Signomi September 27th, 2011 9:44 PM

Thank you for that! The basis behind her pose is that she is supposed to be leaning against the wall, so I tried to reflect that. Although I probably didn't make that obvious in the sketch, just didn't expect to post it!

Kura September 27th, 2011 10:25 PM


Originally Posted by Signomi (Post 6866798)
Thank you for that! The basis behind her pose is that she is supposed to be leaning against the wall, so I tried to reflect that. Although I probably didn't make that obvious in the sketch, just didn't expect to post it!

Well there's no background yet so I didn't want to assume, but even if you didn't want to put a background, if you put a cast shadow according to your light direction and how it would look if she were against a white wall, (and the cast shadow on where she'd be sitting) you'd be able to pull it off like a pro. That way you can sort of.. obscurely show the planes of the picture and still leave a bit of artistic ambiguity for the viewer.
If you have plans to do it another way then I'm just gonna sit tight and wait for the way it'll turn out. Anyways, you're most welcome and I'm sure it will be very lovely when you're done :3

{Swan} December 6th, 2011 8:48 AM


I've got a picture I need some help with, originally I was just going to discard it because I wasn't sure what to do with it, but when I discovered this thread I thought y'all might be able to help me make sense of it.

Red's the body, green's the overclothes, and teal was supposed to become his wings. It's supposed to be Icarus, the bands on his arm connecting to his make-shift wings.

One of the biggest reasons I discarded is is because I really don't know what to do with the wings. I've a decent knowledge of wing-structure, but have no idea how to position them. I'd also like some suggestions on how to make the straps holding the wings to his back look.

If anyone's willing to help me, I'd be incredibly grateful.

Halmtier January 19th, 2012 3:30 PM

I have a new pic I am working on (it will be very large) but the poses just seem off to me. Here is my slightly fleshed out thumb nail sketch, I hope it's big enough. The BG I don't need any assistance with as I have it all thought out, but the people are bugging me.


Kura January 28th, 2012 12:55 PM


Originally Posted by {Swan} (Post 6955686)

I've got a picture I need some help with, originally I was just going to discard it because I wasn't sure what to do with it, but when I discovered this thread I thought y'all might be able to help me make sense of it.

Red's the body, green's the overclothes, and teal was supposed to become his wings. It's supposed to be Icarus, the bands on his arm connecting to his make-shift wings.

One of the biggest reasons I discarded is is because I really don't know what to do with the wings. I've a decent knowledge of wing-structure, but have no idea how to position them. I'd also like some suggestions on how to make the straps holding the wings to his back look.

If anyone's willing to help me, I'd be incredibly grateful.

Heya Swan! Sorry it took me a while! I just came back to this page recently. This one was a real toughie.. and I would agree with you in regards to trying to scrap it and starting again. It's not that the drawing is bad or anything, it's actually working well for the most part, but I agree that if you chose a different pose or different camera angle, then the placement of the wings would come a lot more naturally. I would've tried just to find a more appealing pose.. but as for trying to impliment it into this picture, I tried to add a bit of depth and I just want you to not be afraid of covering things. If a wing will cover the whole arm then let it. See how the silhouette works.. if you can read it, great. If you can't.. I'd try something different. I think the left arm is working well, but I changed the right arm to try and give a sense of "freefalling" by pushing the wrist back. I'm really not sure if it works.. (So that one wing is covering an arm and the other wing isn't)
Um.. I tried also to do a variation in red.. so that red wing is another position that would work with the arm that YOU drew (so you can half see it) and this position is disregarding the arm that I drew.

But yeah.. you can tell by the way my lines are that I had a tough time with this one too trying to find the structure and trying to dip the torso forward. I think when you're trying to tell a story, sometimes it's better to try and use a different angle because you may be conveying something a bit better that way.. but I gave this a shot anyways. I'm not too happy with my own result but I rather post it and maybe spark something for you than leave you with nothing.
If you want to try to tackle it again.. is a great resource for more crits.

Anyways, like I said, I'm not too happy with this one.. but I played around with your silhouette and tried to change the angle a bit and I am happier with those. The second last one I think works most, but art is really subjective.. so try it out for yourself and see what you can come up with too! Either way I hope it helps you <3

And Halmtier, I basically VMed you about yours, but the perspective with the background and the perspective with the men weren't matching. However.. with the way you had it set up, it was a bit impossible to fit the other man in properly. I did stretch it up, and then changed the plane to a diagonal one instead of a horizontal horizon line to make the piece more dynamic. You DID have a 3 point perspective going on with the guy in the foreground, but I dont think you realized this so when it came to adding the guy in the background you struggled. The camera is placed closer to the guy at the bottom, so technically for the guy in the back, his legs are closer to us than his torso, giving the illusion that the legs should be a tad larger.

Also I changed the perspective of the sword a bit since the angle of the sword didn't seem to make sense (if he would swipe the way you had it, he would hit with the flat part of the blade instead of the sharp part) so I changed that a bit and added some perspective.

I also changed the direction the guy in the foreground was looking.. to accommodate the movement of character (so that he's looking at his target.)

If you need something different or if you were going for something different please don't hesitate to explain and I'll try my hand at it again.
Hmm but now that I look at it, the back arm still doesn't look right. I was going for some overlap and I don't know if I achieved it. Try having a play at that while making the sword a bit more 3-dimensional/ in perspective. :3

Halmtier February 4th, 2012 12:30 PM

Thanks, I will work with that- I think you gave me a good idea on how to fix it up, as I can now see the guy in the back was indeed way to flat facing for the scene. And I always have issues with background perspectives... I really need to work on that. XD
Thanks Again!

BOSS-EMILY April 8th, 2012 2:38 PM

You guys are great artists... I especially like Kura's work :)

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