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Forever February 23rd, 2013 7:43 AM

Evolution vs Creationism?
Okay so, in previous games we've had tie-ins to religion, somewhat, with Arceus being the God of the Pokemon world, and the creator of everything, and we've also had evolution occurring in Pokemon ever since the start.

With this in mind, consider this: these games are named X and Y.

While X/Y has a lot of different connotations, one of the speculated connotations are genetics. If this is a possibility, there could be something much more deeper here than has been considered before. DPPt showed us "God", Black and White made us consider the truth's and ideals - getting us to think "deeper", and now these games are named X/Y, with a helix on the art even.

This is interesting because in actual real life, there's a big debate between science vs religion, as well as whether humans were created, or whether we "evolved" from other life forms. While Pokemon has headed down that road before due to evolution of Pokemon, this doesn't actually bring humans into question, and even God only related to Pokemon. Is it possible that due to this, it could take the next step and relate it to humans, and actually ask the big questions that weren't asked before? In terms of Pokemon it couldn't really be as controversial but given that Pokemon mainly relies upon Pokemon to centralise the story on... it would certainly be interesting to turn it to humans, and question where we came from, how we came about, as Pokemon seems like it's already been covered a lot, and other than new evolutions, or things along those lines there isn't that much more interesting I can see them exploring with Pokemon.

However with humans... there could be two camps in the games, or even debate/discussion in the games surrounding this, using Pokemon to aid their debates. The "God" Pokemon, and then the fact that Pokemon do evolve - in relation to how humans have advanced genetically, and how people can actually have beliefs in that maybe we were put here for a reason. If it's the former, there could become an advanced type of human in the games, or perhaps someone seeking ultimate power to become a higher-being, through actual human evolution, or if it's the latter, then could there be proof that events in the game are happening all for a pre-determined reason?

If this is the theme, then what else do you think could relate to this in the games? Do you think it could be interesting, or maybe too deep for Pokemon? Is this possibility more now than ever given that these games have a chance to heavily concentrate on genetics, and what makes us who we are, and thus can cover where we came from/why we have become who we are today through research and such. Discuss!

Mujahid February 23rd, 2013 9:26 AM

That's a little too far-fetched, don't you think. While interesting, This seems "too much" for a pokemon game.
I like the idea of involving Humans to the story line more than just 'Using pokemons to change world' scenario.

OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire February 23rd, 2013 9:52 AM

I don't think they'll go this route. If anything they may introduce another god like Pokémon who they say is the true creator, and argue with Sinnoh's myths.

Rainbow Daaash February 23rd, 2013 10:20 AM

"I just got the new Catholic Church version of Pokemon Red Version guys! How do I get Charizard in this though , my Charmander is level 39 now and still nothing's happened."

:p heh okay seriously though- I'm in favor of the evolution theory. I also do not believe X and Y, even with the potential chromosome relative titles, will be touching this issue at all. I love Pokemon - and have from the start, but they probably won't touch an issue as controversial as creationism vs evolution theory. It would be be bad publicity for them- which as funny as PETA's "Black and Blue" version was, Nintendo and Pokemon International do not want.

Esper February 23rd, 2013 11:25 AM

My understanding is that in DPPt (which I haven't personally played so my info might be way off) they focused on myths and legends and that no one really thought there were 'god' Pokemon in a literal, absolute sense.

That aside, I think we won't really see anything touch on human evolution. If we do it's going to be very vague (because vague is safe, and Pokemon is safe) and talk about how people grew alongside Pokemon in the past, learned from them, etc. etc. I'm sure there will be some team evil character who wants to use the power of some Pokemon to gain power, and they might phrase that in terms of evolving, or reaching a "higher state of being" or enlightenment whatnot, but that they won't touch on humans specifically evolving - just on someone in particular using Pokemon power to do it.

jasonwolf February 23rd, 2013 11:45 AM

I highly doubt pokemon would risk starting a religious debate of this magnitude. they've spent forever trying to keep fanatics off their tails because pokemon metamorphosis is called evolution. its just a term that is used in the game. It means something different there then it does here. Pokemon go through metamorphosis, which is easily seen in the bug pokemon.

larva, cocoon, adult. Caterpie, Metapod, Butterfree.

baby, youth, adult. Charmander, Charmeleon, Charizard.

Humans change as well. I am very different from when I was a baby. Now I don't have wings or anything too crazy, but I have a different number of bones, my appearance is different, and I am physically stronger. the whole evolution debate in pokemon is just people getting stuck on one world.

Also I am a very strongly believing Catholic, so I want to have that out of the way.

When it comes to Arceus I treat it like any other game with gods. Its a piece of fiction which helps explain the game universe. It shouldn't be taken as anything more than that.

flight February 23rd, 2013 12:17 PM

I only doubt it'll be relating to humans, but that's because all of this time, the game's focus has primarily been on the Pokemon. The questions we are likely to ask this time around is possibly inquiring about the genetics of Pokemon, the origin of Pokemon, and things of that nature. While I do think it's entirely possible that they could delve into the genetics of humans, you have to remember that Pokemon is already treading on a thin line with a lot of extremely religious people, going into anything about evolution and genetics and incorporating that and relating it to humans would cause drama of unrealistic proportions, as it would appear to people that the company would be taking a side, which wouldn't be good. :x

I hope this made sense as I spent a very long time trying to contemplate a reply. @_@

voicerocker February 23rd, 2013 12:20 PM

That would place the focus of the games on humans, which isn't likely to happen. Pokemon has always been about the Pokemon. Specifically explaining the origin of humans in that world really isn't important.

Pokemon evolution isn't the same as Darwin's evolution, it's more like a transformation. A Charizard though will still give birth to a Charmander. Basically, all Pokemon evolutions are like the tadpole-to-frog change, or caterpiller-to-butterfly.

I think it's just easier to say Arceus created humans as well, even if it doesn't outright state it in the games.

Platinum Lucario February 24th, 2013 9:00 AM

If there is going to be anything that would be more deeper than Arceus and the Dragon trio, it would have to be atoms. Since everything is made of atoms... wouldn't it be interesting to see a Pokémon that is only made of atoms?

But seeing as Pokémon X and Y are on a Chromosome theme, I don't feel like it's going to dwelve deeper into something more higher than the Sinnoh legends. But it does seem like these games could actually play out as that the legendaries are what represent life as we know it.

Most likely that Pokémon X and Y would be a matter of both, science and beliefs.

gold/silverFTW February 24th, 2013 9:20 AM

Hmm... that would be interesting to see, but that could be controversial with people. I mean, remember all that "Pokemon is the devil" crap? And the game does say they evolve, but its actually more of a metamorphosis. Like Caterpie(Larva)→Metapod(Cocoon)→Butterfree(fully grown). But maybe one day Pokemon will make a reference to evolution vs. creationism?

OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire February 24th, 2013 9:33 AM

I think Human's might've been a Pokémon that lost it's powers minus a special few. Other than saying that (humans are animals so calling Humans pokemon doesn't seem that off) I don't see anything deeper on the Human side. Now Evolution (the real life kind) was reference long before Groudon Kyogre,Rayquaza (the first creationist mons introduced) with Mew, which is based on a Fetus which ties to the theory that since creatures look similar during Fetus stage, perhaps there's an evolutionary related reason for that (might've butched the theory there, been awhile since I've read up about it...but it's something along those lines). Also Archeops line is the ancestor of all bird Pokémon thus referencing the evolution of bird Pokémon. Now to find a feather covered T-rex Pokémon (not kidding I want one).

Forever March 1st, 2013 3:37 AM


Originally Posted by Magmaruby and Aquasapphire (Post 7552635)
I think Human's might've been a Pokémon that lost it's powers minus a special few.

Hey wow that's a deep way of thinking about it. You know... if that's true, they could somewhat tackle it as in a way to bring humans closer to Pokemon, or maybe the DNA of both get mixed up in a strange scientific experiment in order to make this a thing??

Jake♫ March 4th, 2013 2:52 PM

I feel Pokémon has sort of a middle ground with all of this. Arceus as a deity created all Pokémon (which parallels to creationism), but Pokémon evolve as well. I don't think the games would want to tackle an issue like this, which could potentially cause some controversy.

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