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Old June 21st, 2011, 10:58 PM
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Butterfree-Charizard
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HarrisonH View Post
No, you're completely wrong (though I don't blame you, people use "agnostic" incorrectly all the time). "Gnostic" and "Agnostic" refer only to knowledge, any sort of knowledge. "Gnostic" is "knowing", "Agnostic" is "unable to know". See here for a more in-depth explanation.
there really isn't a difference between what you said and what I said. In terms of religious discussion


Quote:
Originally Posted by Gymnotide View Post
Atheist agnostic means that you do not personally believe in the existence of god(s), but you are willing to hear any supporting claims that they do exist. Theist agnostic means that you believe in the existence of god(s), but you are open to ideas that they do not exist. The point being: agnosticism isn't its own thing, per se.

Gnosticism (not Gnosticism; only capitalized as per grammar) is an idea that floats in between atheism and theism and only serves to describe either one.

With the stuff we're discussing in this thread, it's necessary to understand that we're effectively dealing with three (or more, if I deem necessary later on) different gradients. Since the first is least related to your post, I'll spoiler it.

Spoiler:
Antireligious -- Secular -- Irreligious -- Spiritual -- Religious
  • Antireligion is when a person downright states the negative impact of religion (not deities, but those end up being drawn into the fight in the end anyway).
  • Secularity is when a person believes that religion should be practiced separately (though religious individuals may be secular too).
  • Irreligion is when a person is apathetic toward religion as a whole.
  • Spirituality is when a person believes in spiritual forces, but not to the degree of religion. Spirituality is a personal thing.
  • Religion is the incorporation of spirituality into humanity. When spiritual becomes ingrained in community (mass ritual, etc.), it becomes religion.


Atheist -- Theist
  • Atheists do not believe in the existence of god(s).
  • Theists believe in the existence of god(s).

Gnostic -- Agnostic
  • Gnostics are sure of their belief; not open to discussion.
  • Agnostics are unsure of their belief; open to evidence that proves / disproves.

One person may fall into any category of these three gradients (and almost never to a definitive location; people may fall in between some ideas).

Also, stealing this from the link HarrisonH posted, but I think it's definitely useful to be in this thread:

Spoiler:
Your over thinking it. on a basic level Theist = there is a god. Add the prefix "A" meaning "no". Thus they believe there is not god.

Gnostic = Know and A meaning no = Does not know. Agnostic and Atheist are no different things.

The point I was trying to make is that it is stupid not to think in depth and to just say yes there's a god, or no there's no god.

Words are also very much open to the interpretation of the reader as well. Your definition may not be the exact same as mine. Words are almost like poems. The writer had his own view and each person who reads it has there own view. Of course on a much smaller level.

Perhaps you miss understood me because it seems we are arguing the same point.
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Last edited by Butterfree-Charizard; June 21st, 2011 at 11:05 PM.
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