Thread: [Demo] Pokemon Reborn
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Old November 29th, 2012, 10:38 AM
AmethystRain's Avatar
AmethystRain
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Join Date: Apr 2012
Gender: Female
gyubdsnk HI! Clearly I need to check this topic more often, I am SO sorry guys.
I actually released episode 5 at the start of November and tooottally spaced updating this topic, BUT that has now been fixed! The first post has download links to Episode 5, and I just patched the download, too. If you're encountering these errors, I suggest giving the new download a try:

--Fixed the crash in Shelly's gym
--Fixed the crash exiting the secret pool
--Fixed the Gang Leader battles

Now! Let me get around to the rest of your responses~ <3

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Originally Posted by Zephyr+ View Post
How long is the current demo, in hours of playtime?
Thank you and, it says in the first post that this episode is probably about 11 hours, but of course, your mileage may vary depending on how you play.
The 11 hour estimate is actually somewhat conservative. I have about 20 hours on my test file, and I know one of my players who has about 30 logged on his file, but there are also other people who speed through the game and don't really do the sidequests, etc. So it's mostly just based on you, naturally. c:

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Originally Posted by miksy91 View Post
Spoiler:
I can see real planning put into making this game...


Good luck! I'd play the current version already if I wasn't lazy just had more time to spend on doing such things.
Planning and literally years of history. c: I know that feel though. I hope you find the motivation time at some point though!

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Originally Posted by Shuang View Post
I downloaded the game and tried it out. It's a really great game, though I don't understand how to catch pokemon like teddiursa. I can't wait for the next episode!
Teddiursa is actually a roaming Pokemon, but at the time that Episodes 4/5 were released, the roaming system on the scripts I'm using was actually broken, so I disabled it temporarily.
For the next episode, the roaming syste has been fixed, and you'll be able to find that Teddi~

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Originally Posted by Sabrewulf238 View Post
I like the game although there's this guy with a quiz and I don't know how I'll ever answer the questions...is there a forum where people talk about these things?

Where can I find out about.....how many lines continually used in the league.....or something like that?
Honestly, that quiz was intended to be sort of a gate for people in our community who know the real leaders personally. I wanted to include a bonus for them only. Buuuuut, I see that people are going to break through it anyway. >3>
So lemme help you out
Reborn was started in 2007
There have been 8 lines (this refers to the league on our competitive server)
32 leaders in total,
28 badges
Bon chance~

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Originally Posted by Seraphimon-sama View Post
I found a bug with the 'Mysterious Factory'. When I team up with Fern and start exploring the Left Wing, the first two Team Meteor goons that are to be battled make the game crash.
afghhwefsdigbrfdk this happens to random people and I don't know why, and even more frustrating, in their experience, it tends to go away randomly.
My suggestion: Download this new patch. See if that happens to fix it. If not, leave the factory and re-enter (this resets Fern being with you). Try saving outside and entering. If these things don't work, I'd like to get your save file from you, and maybe I can figure out a bit more about what causes it, and what can be done.

Please let me know how this turns out for you!

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Originally Posted by Xatoku View Post
Albeit I've yet to try it, this is definitely one of them. Keep it up!
Thank you! But concept art? Pshaw, that's their in-game art. c:

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Originally Posted by Sabrewulf238 View Post
Will all pokemon be found in the wild?

So if you accidentely knock out a "special" pokemon will I ever be able to catch it?

I accidentely knocked out the Porygon in the school because it was so weak.
This is something I'm wrestling with. I'm torn between wanting to have everything always available, and wanting event Pokemon to be special.
I feel like the events are less meaningful if you know you can just go catch a wild one somewhere else. That's my hesitation.
In the specific case of Porygon... I do not currently have plans for it to be anywhere else but there. I could probably be persuaded to change that. XD

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Originally Posted by aco View Post
how can i open the door to the second gym leader
Lucario505 hit the nail on the...
...
So there's an expression there and I totally just forgot it. Whatevs. Lucario505 was totally right. There should be an NPC by the door who mentions that, too. But yep, gotta be smart with those questions. The books around the school hold all the answers, too~

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Originally Posted by Shuang View Post
I downloaded the next episode, but the battle with the aqua team leader isn't working, it's giving me a script error and closing the game. help please
Yeaaaah, it like deleted those battles when I first zipped this up, idk. It made me sad. But! This is patched as of today, so give the new file a download. c:

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Originally Posted by Lucario505 View Post
This games been awesome so far, but... I'm stuck now. I've made it all the way towards the end of this beta, I'm in Shelly's gym stuck battling on of the trainers with the Masquerain... The game gets an automatic error as soon as you start the battle and now I can't really move out of the battle. So any ideas? I might just wait for the next beta. I really enjoyed the story up to this point. Keep up the great work!! :D
This seems to happen to some people, again, randomly, and it's somewhat frustrating for me. XD As far as I can tell, this happens when the strength of your computer kinda gives out. If you can't turn up the performance settings on your compy- are you using animated sprites? If so, I suggest reverting to static, because that'll be a lighter processing power. I've had people fix these errors that way before.
Download the newer version and don't install the animated sprites. If that doesn't help, let me know and I'll see what I can do for you.


Aaaand now that last whopper of a post~:

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Originally Posted by YourFavorite View Post
Good points, yadda yadda~
Thank you~ I'm glad you are enjoying parts of it at least!
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I have bits and pieces but can't put the whole picture together yet (whereas in official pokemon games, everything is usually more-or-less clear).
Yeah, it's a looong game, so I'm trying to take it slow. My approach to narratives is much different than the main series, and I'm trying to blend them. Let me ask this: Although you don't have a clear idea of the bigger picture yet, are you still interested in finding more?
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-Dream world abilities have been present where they're awesome (eg. Contrary Snivy, Technician Meowth) but I've been able to find pokemon without them where I want to (eg. Ekans)
This is purely up to your luck, I'm afraid. Dream world abilities appear as randomly as their normal ones. They haven't been flat-out replaced.
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-This game was obviously made by someone with at least some competetive battling experience, judging from the books in the trainer's school, and the gym leaders' rosters. The gym leaders are challenging not (just) because they are higher-leveled than you, but also because of the variety of types and their movesets.
Reborn is first and foremost a competitive battling community, so ding-ding-ding~
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-While some sprites are very clearly edited, and some look a little hacked together, for the most part the graphics look fine and don't detract from the experience.
If you're referring to the leader sprites, then I'd be a little concerned. The player sprites are actually made from Reborn's sprite customization system. The NPC sprites are a work-in-progress. Every episode or so I add one or two more custom ones. Some of them, like the Hotshot sprites, are just temporary recolours.
This will get better with time!
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-I felt that the park sequence was very well done, seeing the other characters tied up by vines as I walked by was pretty eerie. Also, the machine with the tangrowth as a plot point is not something I've ever seen in a pokemon game, but it still felt like it fit in with the world while still being different.
I'm glad that worked for you! I was a little bit concerned about that fitting in, but I'm trying to make this game kind of feel like the anime- of course, a bit darker, still- but in the sense that there are those quirky little stories. There are more like this to come though, so keep an eye out. c:
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Now for the bad:
-The first and second gym leaders have six pokemon? The first one wasn't bad because I swept through about half of them with my Spinda, but I was honestly quite surprised, and a little jarred. A warning might be nice.
I see your note about this later, but... Yeah, this is kinda the point of the game. I'll try to make that more clear in-game though. ;
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-I found a teddiursa, but I couldn't figure out where it ran off to. If you expect your players to ever find it, you might want to give them a hint, or have it hide nearby. Unless it's important to the story later or something.
As mentioned above, this is one of the broken roaming Pokemon. Normally, it will appear in the wild randomly.
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-This game is pretty difficult, which is fine. The problem is that you don't balance it so that the players can deal with that difficulty. I am stuck at the second gym and here are the problems I'm having:
I will actually be re-balancing the game as a whole in a future update, somewhat soon, but yeah, it is intended to be more difficult than most.
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-The shops don't sell you more items as you get more badges, like in the real games. The gym leaders use several Super Potions, which I don't even have the opportunity to buy. This is not much of a problem in the first gym, since super potions are almost more than you need at that point, but going against the second gym without them is ridiculous. As a player, I feel cheated that the computer players have more tools at their disposal than I will have the opportunity to have.
You make a strong point here. I was actually not even aware that the main-series games shops change over time. Is that a somewhat new feature? I'll admit I haven't played all that much since Pearl. In any case, the department store system was supposed to simulate this with progress through the game.
As for feeling cheated, I see what you mean. I will probably change Florinia's item distribution in response.
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-I have beaten all of the available trainers, but my pokemon still aren't strong enough to beat the gym. I don't have access to any useful TM's, and have no idea how to get Heart Scales, so I can't adjust my pokemon's movesets to better fit the problem. This leaves me with two options, 1. Train up a fire or fighting type pokemon to try to help. I don't like this option because it feels like I'm being bullied into using certain pokemon, but it's what I'll probably do. 2. Grind my existing team up a few levels in hopes that I'll stand a better chance. Having the only options be "grinding, or more grinding" are already annoying, and a sign of bad game design. Also, since I've beaten all of the trainers, and there is no rebattling (not your fault, I suppose), I would be forced to grind on pokemon around level 14, over 10 levels lower than my current team. It honestly takes more time than it is probably worth (especially since every place with wild pokemon is pretty far from the pokemon centers).
So, basically, a summary of the problem is this:
1. You can make your team out of any of X pokemon available (pretty standard)
2. Unless you build your team X way, using the tools you don't have (or using the pokemon that the gym guy tells you to use) you can't beat the gym leaders and advance in the game.
In other words, you're telling the players, "Every choice works, except some choices are wrong." That's pretty bad.
There is actually a hidden area with wild Pokemon approaching level 20 that you'll be able to find only after beating Fern. You should take a look around and see if you can find it to help. ;D
That said, I realise this area is somewhat problematic- it'll be one of the target sections for my overall re-balance.
I absolutely agree that grinding should never be necessary, and in fact, you'll notice with my level-limit, it's something I discourage. I want people to stop and think of new strategies to beat each leader- not just power through on type effectiveness and levels like the main-series.
That said, Florinia has been troublesome to balance. On one hand I'm trying to make a battle challenging for players who started with fire types. Particularly the fire/fighting ones. Unfortunately, there's really -nothing- that the grass type as a whole can do against that combo, even on a competitive level, so I've tried to balance it out in other ways. Of course, this results in it being too strong for players who don't have those Pokemon, and therefore blehhh.
Florinia will be changed more- that's for sure. But for you right now, I know that doesn't really helpy.
As a player and not a developer, I would like to advise you based on what you are using. I totally agree with you about not just using other things as well. In fact the whole point of our online league is about finding new ways to use the things you have. I think that's exactly what you should do in-game too. Look at what's shutting you down, and what tools you have in your current Pokemon to counter those strategies. Play differently; step out of your comfort zone. There is always a solution. c:
I'd actually be really interested in knowing your current in-game team. Both as a player to help suggest you ways to beat her, and as a developer to know what sort of team struggles with her.

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The solution is simple: give your players more options. I don't see why Super Potions aren't available, or why the Silph Dept. Store requires "stickers" to get to higher levels. It's an interesting idea, but it doesn't make much sense in a worldbuilding sense; wouldn't Silph want all people to have access to their products, so they can get more money? If you are worried that the items in the Dept. Store would make the game too easy, just make them a little expensive, so that if the player REALLY wants to put Fire Blast on their Quilava early in the game, they can still do so, they just won't have much money left to buy anything else. That's just my suggestion, anyway.
I see your point about the economic factor. However, i feel that money in Pokemon games just comes way too easily, and even making it absurdly expensive, teams could very quickly get overpowered. The sticker system is meant also to encourage side-quest exploration through out the game. Jacking the price of everything up would make for a rather frustrating late-game, actually, when people are farming specific items to complete their pokedex, etc.
I want to make an excuse here like, Silph values loyalty to their customers over their own profit, but at the same time I know no international corporation would actually be like that. I feel like the gameplay motivation provided by this system is worth that sacrifice though.
As for super potions, I had what I felt was a very good reason for disincluding them at that time. I currently cannot think what that might possibly have been (naturally >.>). Consequently, they may be added in somewhere.
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-While we're on items, Sitrus berries are annoyingly expensive. I suppose it fits the flavor of the world, since they are probably imported, but when they are the only alternative to potions, and are not equal to super potions in power for quite a while, the price seems a bit excessive. It's a little bit of a conflict between flavor and balance here.
Actually, it's exactly for balance that they're so expensive. As you seem to know, Sitrus Berries are constantly useful throughout the game, and I don't want players to have easy, spammable access to them. At least, not until they have the higher-income of the late game. I want their purchase to selective in the long run.
*checks price*
...Actually, those are kinda cheaper than I would expect for the late-game.
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-I don't know how I feel about the characters. Many of them very clearly feel like characters instead of people. Julia and "Flobot" in particular have quirks that are a little too over-the-top for them to seem real at all, (though maybe I think this because they annoy me). This contrasts a lot with the inconsequential NPC's littering the city, who for the most part are pretty believable. Like I said earlier, you still gave it a better shot than most pokemon games do.
In this case, the leaders are remaining historically accurate to their actual characters in the online league. We're dealing with a portrayal of real people here, actually, and although some of them, like Julia and Shade are very clearly playing a part even IRL, it wouldn't make sense to have their in-game characters be different from how they are face-to-face.
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-Some of the mapping could use a little work. While the overworld city is fine, the factory feels like a series of hallways to get the player to fight the meteor grunts, so they can go find the door, then more hallways so they can find the bombs, so they can get into the final important-looking room and advance the story. It feels very contrived, and doesn't feel like you're in a factory at all. The slums is a bit better, but still suffers from the same problem. Even if your players only visit a place once, if you care about every place you make, your game will have real quality.
Guilty, particularly with the factory. In light of this, I may just redo the factory entirely.
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-I was ok with the level 17 electrode, but a level 27 Cradily? I know for a fact that it doesn't evolve until level 40. Yes, Ghestis has a Hydreigon that is about 12 levels too low to exist, but there is only one, and *everyone* complains about it. It's not that big of a deal, but it could put people off (especially with the whole gym leaders having more tools thing). (Also, by the time in the game that you fought Ghestis, you effectively had as many full restores and max revies as you wanted.)
This is something the main series games have always done, and with some guilt that I replicated. Aside from the options issue though, I'm unclear as to why the Electrode is acceptable and Cradily is not. The Electrode, level 16, is 14 levels away from its natural evolution. Cradily is 13 levels away.
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-While the Pokemon Gang was completely unexpected, and I thought it was a really cool idea, I was pretty disappointed that I didn't have any opportunity to catch Scraggy or Scrafty afterwards. It was probably mostly because of the big lead-up to the battle, where I had been certain that I was going to be able to catch it once I chased it down. Oh well. I think the idea of the Pokemon Gang attacking you one at a time is unrealistic, though. It may have worked better as a double or (if you have the capability for it) triple battle. (EDIT: After going back I did find and catch one, although I have no idea how I was supposed to know to look there because there were no hints or anything that Scraggy would be there.)
Unfortunately the script system does not support triple battles, and probably never will. Otherwise I would TOTALLY do that.
But double?
I feel stupid for not even thinking of that. Expect to see that change in the future.
As for finding Scraggy- Well, you weren't supposed to look there. That's exactly the point. :D It is a little disappointing to the people who were hoping to catch one immediately, but for the people who go back to the slums later looking for one... Anyway, I'm deliberately making OU Pokemon harder to get/find.
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-The game corner prizes are... pretty lackluster. Chingling is pretty weak, and I doubt many people would be willing to work that hard to get their hands on one unless they are trying to complete the pokedex. Shinx, while popular, is not game-breakingly strong, and doesn't become remotely useful until it evolves (and therefore is also probably not worth the effort). I don't even remember what the second choice was. It may be a good idea to change which pokemon are game corner prizes; usually, strong, rare, or hard-to-catch pokemon are game corner prizes (eg. Dratini, Abra, Porygon... this is why I was so happy when I found Porygon in the wild). If the players are gonna work that hard for something, it better darn well be good. Also, it would be nice if there were some good items or TM's for prizes, in case the pokemon aren't motivation enough for the player to play in the game corner.
I definitely agree here. I thought Shinx would be more popular itself, too, but this is definitely something I'll be tweaking, too.
As for the TMs, that is already planned. You might notice the blank spot in the counter- That's where it'll go. It only doesn't exist right now because I need to be sure of exactly which TMs I want to be given out there first, vs in context to the rest of the game's sidequests, etc.
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-There's a really large volume difference in the music... If I turn up the volume to hear the Pokemon Center music, then go outside, I have to turn the volume down. If I get into a battle, I have to turn it way down to prevent damage to my eardrums...
True. I'll be sure to turn that up.
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(Here's where I transition more to tips or something)
-Do all of the starters get their dream world abilities? While this is pretty cool, it could definitely cause some balance issues... the game may be significantly harder for someone who picked Chlorophyll Bulbasaur than someone who picked Speed Boost Blaziken. Just something to keep in mind.
Kinda touched on this earlier, but yeah, pretty much. There's a chance for each starter to be dream world. It is just up to luck, but then, someone could just keep resetting. Fire types as a whole are a bit OP in the early game here- that's one thing I'll be fixing with my balance tweaks. As far as I have seen so far, though, even SB Blaziken has not been shown to be any more OP than the other Fire/Fightings.
For now at least...
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-I think it might make the game more believable if Amethyst's exact job, position, rank, or whatever is made known. Her saying, "I'm not a professor, but I do important stuff like one!" made me think your entire game was a complete joke at first. Is she the mayor? Police chief? Author self-insert? The fact that everyone reports things to her when she doesn't seem to have a job other than signing people up for the Pokemon League comes off as a bit strange. Also, what the heck determines rank in this region? When characters say, "so-and-so is one of the highest ranking members in the region!" I have no idea what they mean, because what ranks even do isn't really clear. Are there ranks for citizens? (eg. street rats and criminals are one rank, normal citizens another rank, trusted citizens another rank, similar to the world in The Curfew). Or do they mean ranks in the government? If so, what kind of government is it? Corrupt or benevolent? Democracy or dictatorship? How exactly does one "gain ranks" in the government, by becoming a gym leader? And what benefits do you get from being high-ranking (other than the police letting you into closed areas I suppose)? You don't have to give the players all of this information as exposition, but you should figure it out, and then make it apparent through what the players experience in their gameplay. Doing this will make your world feel real.
Well said. I'll change the intro- not sure quite yet what to say. I'm the owner of the Reborn website/server and I manage the community and league, but I couldn't find a good title for that. That was just me being silly though Q~Q I suppose it's tone-inappropriate.
As for rank, it's gym leader rank. i.e there's 1-17. I can make that more clear somewhere though.
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-This is more of a question... does Contrary actually work? It's probably a problem with the engine you are using, but I can't tell if Contrary works because when pokemon use growl, tail whip etc on my Snivy, it still says the same text. I'm not sure how much you can do to fix it, but I still can't tell if my ability is working, or if I should've chosen a different starter.
Contrary is actually not in the scripts yet, correct. The engine developer is still working on adding all of the 4th/5th gen moves/items/abilities, so it should hopefully be functional soon.

Afterthought- "I definitely like it a lot more than I thought I would?" Was there something that made you think you would dislike it?

I definitely appreciate your feedback- well, everyone's!
Thanks for playing, and responding, and and and and, I'll be sure to check this topic more often, 'kay~?
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Proud owner of Reborn and spearhead of the Pokemon Reborn game~
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