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Vaccines

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Vaccines are only effective at stopping epidemics if most of the population has been vaccinated. For reasons of public health should everyone be vaccinated, or does this infringe on their choices?

If you're not too familiar with this topic, lots of people are given the MMR (measles, mumps and rubella) vaccine as kids before we enter school (which is kind of a breeding ground for germs and disease) and so develop an immunity to these diseases, keeping them safe and making it harder to spread the disease to those people who aren't vaccinated. There are also sexually transmitted diseases, such as HPV (human papilloma virus) which cause a number of different cancers, that have vaccines, although this and other vaccines are not as widespread as the MMR vaccine. Typically you get one or a few doses of the vaccine and only a few people show side effects, most of which are minor. Vaccines are widely known to be the reason we no longer worry about polio of smallpox.

If you want to bring up the autism rumors, religious objections, conspiracy theories, whether you're vaccinated, or whatever else, go ahead.
 

Oryx

CoquettishCat
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I don't know about the public school like grade school (don't have kids, don't know anyone with kids that age, was too young to know when I was that age) but when I went to college and lived in the dorms I had to be vaccinated against meningitis. Well, actually, now that I think about it, I'm not sure if it was a requirement or a very strong suggestion.

Guess I'm also uneducated about this stuff.

Edit: @Toujours. Maaaaybe.
 
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14,092
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Not getting vaccines is laughable and largely stupid. Say you're headed off to college. You need to get the meningitis vaccine if you're living in the dorms. If you decide to not get vaccinated, and you get Bacterial Meningitis, then well, sucks to be you. If you don't get the proper vaccinations you can pose a threat to not only your own health, but the health of others.

The laws saying you have to be vaccinated are largely a product of an older time when these diseases could run rampant through urban population centers. Look at what Polio did in the 1930's-50's.
 

AChipOffTheOldBrock

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I think it should they should be provided for free but it should still be a choice. And yeah Ausaudrial, at least in America you have to be vaccinated to attend public school. I remember going into middle school we had to get certain vaccinations to be allowed to attend.
 

FreakyLocz14

Conservative Patriot
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Our Constitution, and the principles that it was founded upon, always put the rights of the individual over the collective. I believe that mandatory vaccination is not only unconstitutional, but is also morally wrong because it violates a person's individual sovereignty.
 
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Our Constitution, and the principles that it was founded upon, always put the rights of the individual over the collective. I believe that mandatory vaccination is not only unconstitutional, but is also morally wrong because it violates a person's individual sovereignty.

Keeping somebody from contracting a potentially fatal disease isn't morally wrong.
 

FreakyLocz14

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Keeping somebody from contracting a potentially fatal disease isn't morally wrong.

Forcefully medicating someone is morally wrong, especially these new laws they are passing that allow minors to get vaccines without their parents. Since vaccines have more deadly side effects, it is foolish to believe that a minor can make an informed decision as to the safety of accepting the vaccine. Heck, adults in consultation with their doctors aren't even completely safe!
 

AChipOffTheOldBrock

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Forcefully medicating someone is morally wrong, especially these new laws they are passing that allow minors to get vaccines without their parents. Since vaccines have more deadly side effects, it is foolish to believe that a minor can make an informed decision as to the safety of accepting the vaccine. Heck, adults in consultation with their doctors aren't even completely safe!

Well nothing is completely safe. And I think its fine to let a child get a vaccination without their parents but they should have a choice.
 

Morkula

[b][color=#356F93]Get in the Game[/color][/b]
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I swear, some people would just totally disband the government and condone total anarchy if they could.

Considering vaccines prevent mass outbreaks of deadly diseases, I think that far outweighs the possible side effects. It's the government's job to protect its citizens - if people don't get vaccinated, then not only do they put themselves at risk, but also those around them who don't have the vaccine. Since vaccinations have become routine, we've totally eradicated smallpox, and other diseases such as polio are practically unheard of nowadays. Requiring those shots prevents practically the entire populace from contracting those deadly diseases.
 

AChipOffTheOldBrock

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I swear, some people would just totally disband the government and condone total anarchy if they could.

Considering vaccines prevent mass outbreaks of deadly diseases, I think that far outweighs the possible side effects. It's the government's job to protect its citizens - if people don't get vaccinated, then not only do they put themselves at risk, but also those around them who don't have the vaccine. Since vaccinations have become routine, we've totally eradicated smallpox, and other diseases such as polio are practically unheard of nowadays. Requiring those shots prevents practically the entire populace from contracting those deadly diseases.

There are a lot of people who say they would be glad to totally disband the government and condone anarchy. Im a libertarian personally. Its the only reasonable party to belong to. And as such Im against forcing people to get vaccinated, if only by principle. Im sure almost everyone would still be more than happy to get vaccines for polio and other diseases.
 
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Forcefully medicating someone is morally wrong, especially these new laws they are passing that allow minors to get vaccines without their parents. Since vaccines have more deadly side effects, it is foolish to believe that a minor can make an informed decision as to the safety of accepting the vaccine. Heck, adults in consultation with their doctors aren't even completely safe!

A routine vaccination for polio, small pox, pertussis, diptheria, tetanus, etc, is not morally wrong, it's a standard of basic health that every single industrialized country does to ensure public health. Do you know what Polio did to this country in the early 30's-50's? Whooping Cough? This misguided, selfish notion that "I'm an individual, I can do what I want" line of individual freedom here < public health, and it means you are endangering not only yourself, but your potential children and other people. Most people wouldn't even consider jeopardizing the health of millions because the evil big bad government can tell you what to do.

And what vaccines have 'deadly side effects', exactly? I bet it's only the HPV one.
 

Morkula

[b][color=#356F93]Get in the Game[/color][/b]
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I hardly think one person not wanting a shot just to say "eff the system" is more important than ensuring the health of the public (all 311 million of us in the US). There are some cases where the safety and well-being of humanity in general outweigh the rights of the individual, sorry to tell you.

By your thoughts, I should have the right to do whatever I choose, just because I should do whatever I want without government interference.
 

Oryx

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Vaccines work because of herd immunity. When we start allowing people under any circumstances not to get a vaccine, then we compromise that herd immunity and the vaccines are ineffective.

I got the HPV vaccine and I'm not dead! Yayyy!
 

FreakyLocz14

Conservative Patriot
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A routine vaccination for polio, small pox, pertussis, diptheria, tetanus, etc, is not morally wrong, it's a standard of basic health that every single industrialized country does to ensure public health. Do you know what Polio did to this country in the early 30's-50's? Whooping Cough? This misguided, selfish notion that "I'm an individual, I can do what I want" line of individual freedom here < public health, and it means you are endangering not only yourself, but your potential children and other people. Most people wouldn't even consider jeopardizing the health of millions because the evil big bad government can tell you what to do.

And what vaccines have 'deadly side effects', exactly? I bet it's only the HPV one.

The HPV vaccine is extremely dangerous, and has a long history of death and destruction.
http://truthaboutgardasil.org/

I hardly think one person not wanting a shot just to say "eff the system" is more important than ensuring the health of the public (all 311 million of us in the US). There are some cases where the safety and well-being of humanity in general outweigh the rights of the individual, sorry to tell you.

By your thoughts, I should have the right to do whatever I choose, just because I should do whatever I want without government interference.

This is just a philosophical disagreement between us. You believe that the rights of the collective should trump the rights of the individual. I believe the opposite.
 

LividZephyr

Oxymoron, not a moron, thanks
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I think the Chicken Pox vaccine was a stupid idea. Why immunize kids from a disease they'd only get once, and wouldn't die from? (It's like one in 10 million, or am I overstating?) Let their immune systems grow by fighting an actual disease.

It's also dangerous to use some vaccines, as they have high risk of actually infecting somebody. I think it should be someone's choice on most of them - but some need to be required. We need to prevent these things from killing us. Let us hope they can eventually do this for cancer...
 

FreakyLocz14

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I think the Chicken Pox vaccine was a stupid idea. Why immunize kids from a disease they'd only get once, and wouldn't die from? (It's like one in 10 million, or am I overstating?) Let their immune systems grow by fighting an actual disease.

It's also dangerous to use some vaccines, as they have high risk of actually infecting somebody. I think it should be someone's choice on most of them - but some need to be required. We need to prevent these things from killing us. Let us hope they can eventually do this for cancer...

This is because the body develops antibodies to prevent subsequent symptoms of these diseases. Vaccines work the same way, except the pathogen is dead or inactive, so that the body can develop antibodies without first having experienced the symptoms of infection.
 

TRIFORCE89

Guide of Darkness
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I think the Chicken Pox vaccine was a stupid idea. Why immunize kids from a disease they'd only get once, and wouldn't die from? (It's like one in 10 million, or am I overstating?) Let their immune systems grow by fighting an actual disease.

It's also dangerous to use some vaccines, as they have high risk of actually infecting somebody. I think it should be someone's choice on most of them - but some need to be required. We need to prevent these things from killing us. Let us hope they can eventually do this for cancer...
I don't think they'll do it for cancer. Too much money in that industry. Hopefully I'm just cynical

And I had the chicken pox vaccine. :p It never really went around at my school. So, as I approached the end of my elementary schools years, I was vaccinated because the older you are when it hits you the worse it is. So, why would I want that or why would my parents want that for me?
 

AChipOffTheOldBrock

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By your thoughts, I should have the right to do whatever I choose, just because I should do whatever I want without government interference.

In a perfect world you would be able to live life however you chose without government interference.
 
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