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Pokémon Strategies and Movesets Post your team lineups, get your team rated or rate other teams, talk about lineups, talk about moves/movesets, strategies, etc. For general talk about the games, go to the respective Pokémon game forums.


 
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  #1    
Old June 1st, 2011, 01:33 PM
feralig8rx's Avatar
feralig8rx
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>: D MachPunch to Face >: D

This is my first team ever so please be a little understanding. My goal with it is to knock out Pokemon quickly with my Starmie and Machamp as a supporter, but have my Volcarona scare my opponent with its self power ups. Whimsicott is my annoyer/staller as he will provide me with time to scope out the opponent’s team.


Ferrothorn @ Rocky Helmet
Trait: Iron Barbs
EVs: 136 HP / 120 Def / 252 SDef
Sassy Nature (+SDef, -Spd)
- Thunder Wave
- Spikes
- Leech Seed
- Power Whip

Ferrothorn is my opener. Plan is to get out spikes + Twave immediately. Leech seed and power whip in case I need a backup tank to take a hit since Ferrothorn has high def and HP. Forces opponent to use special attacks due to helmet and Iron Barbs.


Starmie @ Choice Specs
Trait: Natural Cure
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
Timid (+Spd, -Atk)
- Hydro Pump
- Rapid Spin
- Ice Beam
- Psychic

Starmie is a mix. She has rapid spin if I need to remove something but also packs a punch if needed. If I need more of a physical attacker, I can switch to my Machamp.


Machamp (M) @ Choice Band
Trait: No Guard
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spd / 6 HP
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SpA)
- Dynamic Punch
- Payback
- Stone Edge
- Ice Punch

Machamp is my powerhouse. He's designed to take out any opponent with his boost in attack power. It will also be a mini supporter as his fast speed and 100% accuracy can ensure a confused and hurt opponent.


Reuniclus (M) @ Life Orb
Trait: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 Def
Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Calm Mind
- Recover
- Psychic
- Hidden Power [Fighting]

I want him to be a back up attacker for when things get rough with Machamp and Starmie. He can soak up some hits and turn offensive when necessary.


Whimsicott (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Prankster
EVs: 252 HP / 244 SDef / 12 Spd
Calm Nature (+SDef, -Atk)
- Leech Seed
- Substitute
- Giga Drain
- Taunt

I use Whimsicott if I need to take a few hits or need to take a look at my opponents team. Taunt to prevent stat changes as I stall. Should be able to last a little on the field.


Volcarona (M) @ Charti Berry
Trait: Flame Body
EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Quiver Dance
- Bug Buzz
- Fiery Dance
- Hidden Power [Rock]

I have Volcarona in here to put pressure on the opposing team. with her rising stats through quiver dance and fiery dance, the opponent has something to fear. This will either force the opponent to get her switched out or take her out with a rock type. Hidden Power [Rock] for countering Heatran and Salamence. The berry is to prevent it from being OHKO by fire.


Being my first team, I would really appreciate it if I could get feedback. I'm going to be editing this a LOT, and eventually leveling up these Pokemon, so any advice is greatly appreciated!
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Last edited by feralig8rx; June 3rd, 2011 at 06:00 AM. Reason: I'm constantly updating to get the most out of my corrections.
  #2    
Old June 1st, 2011, 01:55 PM
Akerbmusky2
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Machamp Adamant Guts Flame Orb
255 attack 255 speed
Focus punch
substitute
earthquake
stone edge/rock slide

Flame orb gives you the same boost as choice band and allows you to change moves. If you want to use a choice band use machamps no guard ability. Replace Focus punch with dynamic punch and substitute with something else. Cant think of it right now
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  #3    
Old June 1st, 2011, 01:58 PM
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feralig8rx
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Ok thanks for the help I'll get on that
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  #4    
Old June 1st, 2011, 02:18 PM
Vrai
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Alrighty, I'll start off by helping you with this one part, at least. :c

Quote:
Machamp (M) @ Choice Band
Trait: Guts
EVs: 255 Atk / 255 Spd
Lonely Nature (+Atk, -Def)
- Focus Blast
- Substitute
- Earthquake
- Rock Slide
...Where to begin? There are quite a few problems with this specific Pokemon alone. Firstly, let's take a look at Machamp's base stats:

Code:
HP: 90
Attack: 130
Defense: 80
Special Attack: 65
Special Defense: 85
Speed: 55
Machamp's best stat is its Attack. When you make sets for Pokemon, you very generally want to work with their best stat, with a few exceptions. Giving Machamp a Choice Band is a step in the right direction, but not all the way. Focus Blast, the move you have listed first, is a special move, meaning it uses Machamp's Special Attack stat. Looking back at the base stats, his Special Attack is literally half of his Attack. It'd be much better to use a powerful physical Fighting-type move than an unreliable special move. Which one, though? We'll get to that in a second.

Do you know what a Choice item does? It increases a stat (depending on the item: Specs = Special Attack, Band = Attack, Scarf = Speed) by 1.5 times as much as it was before... the equivalent of a +1 boost (like a Howl, for example). But they come with a restriction - when you use them, you're stuck using the first move you pick. Now, what good would being stuck into Substitute be for you? When you're using a Choice item, you should almost never run non-attacking moves because they'll usually get you locked into a move that does nothing and forces you to switch out - a great situation for your opponent. So running Substitute on a Choice Band Machamp is definitely a no-no.

When you build a set for a Pokemon, you have to try to take advantage of the things that make it good. Machamp, for example, is really good but for one particular reason - it has this ability called No Guard. No Guard makes every move hit when Machamp's out, no matter what. This means that Machamp can use moves like DynamicPunch, a move that's really powerful but usually no one uses it because it has 50% accuracy! DynamicPunch & No Guard should -always- be on Machamp because that's what separates it from other bulky Fighting-types like Conkeldurr.

The next thing is something that isn't too easy to explain, at least to someone who's just beginning. Earthquake isn't a very good move to run on Machamp. Do you know why? It's because Ground- and Fighting-type moves have very very similar coverage. For example, Ground hits Steel super-effective... and so does Fighting. Ground hits Rock super-effective... and so does Fighting. Ground does no damage to Flying types... and Fighting is resisted by them. You'll get more mileage out of running a different move to give you more type coverage. :)

Also, a small note, you should run Stone Edge - you don't have to worry about it missing because of No Guard.

Lastly, on EVs: 255 looks like it's maxed out, right? But it isn't! The games calculate the increase in stats from EVs by numbers divisible by four. Therefore, every 4 EVs = 1 stat point. When you hit 252 EVs in one stat, you can't get any more boosts out of it - and when you have 252 in another, you have 6 EVs left over. These can be invested in another stat to give it a little bit of oomph.

So let's run over everything:
1. When you build a set for a Pokemon, play to their strengths, whether that's an ability or a stat or anything!
2. Make sure you know exactly how your items & moves work.
3. EVs can only be maxed at 252 - the extra three won't help! Invest them in another stat.

If you've followed along with me so far, I'd like to see if you can patch up that set a little bit. I think I explained mostly everything but to check your understanding I'd like to see what you got out of that tl;dr. :)

edit:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Akerbmusky2 View Post
Machamp Adamant Guts Flame Orb
255 attack 255 speed
Focus punch
substitute
earthquake
stone edge/rock slide

Flame orb gives you the same boost as choice band and allows you to change moves. If you want to use a choice band use machamps no guard ability. Replace Focus punch with dynamic punch and substitute with something else. Cant think of it right now
Ehhh, not really. You shouldn't run Substitute + Flame Orb unless you want to die of external damage, without the opponent even attacking you. Plus, like I said ^ up there EQ is bad coverage with Fighting-types. No Guard is what makes Machamp good - if you wanted to run Flame Orb you should use Conkeldurr, who has Guts, a higher base Attack, recovery in Drain Punch, and priority in Mach Punch. Guts Machamp is really just not as good as Guts Conkeldurr.
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Last edited by Vrai; June 1st, 2011 at 02:24 PM. Reason: editedd for rate posted while i was tl;dring
  #5    
Old June 1st, 2011, 02:25 PM
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feralig8rx
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Wow, thanks so much! You don't even understand how much that helped haha.

I've literally spent the past 5 days researching online and there's been 0 guides that I've found that have actually explained team building to me in a way I actually understood. FINALLY I have an idea on where to go with this team!

I will definitely go make some changes with Machamp. I will definitely repost once I figure out exactly what I want to do with this team.

I REALLY REALLY appreciate your help. All the replies I got today were 2 line answers saying "lolwut are you doing. Don't do that." or like "wrong nature choose other items l2playn00b". Those aren't helpful. You actually gave me a significant push in the right direction, so thank you ^.^
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  #6    
Old June 1st, 2011, 03:17 PM
Vrai
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Quote:
Originally Posted by feralig8rx View Post
Wow, thanks so much! You don't even understand how much that helped haha.

I've literally spent the past 5 days researching online and there's been 0 guides that I've found that have actually explained team building to me in a way I actually understood. FINALLY I have an idea on where to go with this team!

I will definitely go make some changes with Machamp. I will definitely repost once I figure out exactly what I want to do with this team.

I REALLY REALLY appreciate your help. All the replies I got today were 2 line answers saying "lolwut are you doing. Don't do that." or like "wrong nature choose other items l2playn00b". Those aren't helpful. You actually gave me a significant push in the right direction, so thank you ^.^
No problem, haha. The only other thing I forgot to mention was about natures; generally, when you're dealing with non-mixed attackers, you'll want to have a nature that puts the negative stat in the attack stat you're not using. That was kinda long-winded so example: Machamp, like before, should use physical attacks. If you want to use a +Atk nature, you should use the +Atk, -SpA nature (Adamant) so that you can reduce a stat that you don't use at all instead of impairing his defenses and/or speed. Similarly, a fast, specially based Pokemon such as Azelf would like to use a +Spe, -Atk nature (Timid) because it won't ever use its attack stat.

A lot of learning about this comes with experience; it's really hard to get into without being guided in the right direction to start with. When you do get that set/whatever else figured out, do update! :)
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  #7    
Old June 1st, 2011, 03:22 PM
feralig8rx's Avatar
feralig8rx
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vrai View Post
No problem, haha. The only other thing I forgot to mention was about natures; generally, when you're dealing with non-mixed attackers, you'll want to have a nature that puts the negative stat in the attack stat you're not using. That was kinda long-winded so example: Machamp, like before, should use physical attacks. If you want to use a +Atk nature, you should use the +Atk, -SpA nature (Adamant) so that you can reduce a stat that you don't use at all instead of impairing his defenses and/or speed. Similarly, a fast, specially based Pokemon such as Azelf would like to use a +Spe, -Atk nature (Timid) because it won't ever use its attack stat.

A lot of learning about this comes with experience; it's really hard to get into without being guided in the right direction to start with. When you do get that set/whatever else figured out, do update!
Will do. I play on playing around on Pokemon Online as well as checking forums regularly to learn as much as possible. I keep trying to learn about EVs, IVs, movesets, abilities, stats...there's just too much! The problem is that I have no where to start from, and I'm the type of person that needs to actually do something before they really understand it. Hopefully this team works out and I can start battling soon!
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  #8    
Old June 1st, 2011, 07:15 PM
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I'm new to the competitive battling scene to. Everyone here is really good at what they do and they all give great, comprehensive advice.

You're team is pretty good! It seems like you've got the basics down well, but it'll never hurt to do some more R&D.

Quote:
Originally Posted by feralig8rx View Post
Starmie @ Life Orb
Trait: Natural Cure
EVs: 76 HP / 252 SAtk / 180 SDef
Quiet Nature (+SAtk, -Spd)
- Hydro Pump
- Thunderbolt
- Ice Beam
- Recover
Starmie is a great candidate for Rapid Spin. Having a move that will clear the field is always great considering how many teams out there have a Pokemon that lay entry hazards. So you may want to consider something like that.

Starmie @ Life Orb
Trait: Natural Cure
EVs: 76 HP / 252 SAtk / 180 SDef
Quiet Nature (+SAtk, -Spd)
- Hydro Pump
- Rapid Spin
- Ice Beam
- Recover

Also, if you are going to have a special sweeping Starmie, you may want to try the Choice Specs as Vrai mentioned with Machamp.

Starmie @ Choice Specs
Trait: Natural Cure
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Speed
Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Spd)
- Hydro Pump
- Thunder Bolt
- Ice Beam
- Psychic

But it's probably in your best interest to stay with Recover. There's an awful lot that you can try out until you find what you like.

Good luck Feralig8rx!
  #9    
Old June 1st, 2011, 07:24 PM
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feralig8rx
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alexial357 View Post
I'm new to the competitive battling scene to. Everyone here is really good at what they do and they all give great, comprehensive advice.

You're team is pretty good! It seems like you've got the basics down well, but it'll never hurt to do some more R&D.



Starmie is a great candidate for Rapid Spin. Having a move that will clear the field is always great considering how many teams out there have a Pokemon that lay entry hazards. So you may want to consider something like that.

Starmie @ Life Orb
Trait: Natural Cure
EVs: 76 HP / 252 SAtk / 180 SDef
Quiet Nature (+SAtk, -Spd)
- Hydro Pump
- Rapid Spin
- Ice Beam
- Recover

Also, if you are going to have a special sweeping Starmie, you may want to try the Choice Specs as Vrai mentioned with Machamp.

Starmie @ Choice Specs
Trait: Natural Cure
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Speed
Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Spd)
- Hydro Pump
- Thunder Bolt
- Ice Beam
- Psychic

But it's probably in your best interest to stay with Recover. There's an awful lot that you can try out until you find what you like.

Good luck Feralig8rx!
Thanks so much! I really appreciate the feedback!

I will definitely take note of these changes and play around as I mess with the team. You're right about the rapid spin- I totally forgot about it!
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  #10    
Old June 2nd, 2011, 02:46 AM
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Volcarona seriously needs an item. (Life Orb comes to mind)

Why is Starmie Quiet? It seriously needs the Speed to outrun things. Use Timid instead.
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  #11    
Old June 2nd, 2011, 02:54 AM
Vrai
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Just a few things on Reuniclus: Firstly, you should be using Life Orb. Magic Guard makes it so you take 0 recoil damage so it's almost always the best option. Second, CM Reuniclus wants to be Bold; it's going to be incredibly powerful after a few CMs anyway. Finally, you want Hidden Power Fighting > Focus Blast because Focus Blast is unreliable and has low PP. You'll be making up for that power increase with CMs anyway.

Reuniclus (M) @ Life Orb
Trait: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 Def
Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Calm Mind
- Recover
- Psychic
- Hidden Power [Fighting]

edit: Yeah, Starmie wants Timid. Its speed is really good and should be abused!
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  #12    
Old June 2nd, 2011, 08:29 AM
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feralig8rx
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vrai View Post
Just a few things on Reuniclus: Firstly, you should be using Life Orb. Magic Guard makes it so you take 0 recoil damage so it's almost always the best option. Second, CM Reuniclus wants to be Bold; it's going to be incredibly powerful after a few CMs anyway. Finally, you want Hidden Power Fighting > Focus Blast because Focus Blast is unreliable and has low PP. You'll be making up for that power increase with CMs anyway.

Reuniclus (M) @ Life Orb
Trait: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 Def
Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Calm Mind
- Recover
- Psychic
- Hidden Power [Fighting]

edit: Yeah, Starmie wants Timid. Its speed is really good and should be abused!
Should I be taking EV's out of something and focus more on speed?
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  #13    
Old June 2nd, 2011, 02:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by feralig8rx View Post
Should I be taking EV's out of something and focus more on speed?
Nope. Reuniclus needs all the physical bulk it can get an it's slow as hell anyway.

@Vrai: Focus Blast >>>> Hidden Power (Fighting). Yes, FB is inaccurate, but Reuniclus needs the power it can get against Steels and Darks.
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Old June 2nd, 2011, 05:11 PM
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feralig8rx
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PlatinumDude View Post
Nope. Reuniclus needs all the physical bulk it can get an it's slow as hell anyway.

@Vrai: Focus Blast >>>> Hidden Power (Fighting). Yes, FB is inaccurate, but Reuniclus needs the power it can get against Steels and Darks.

Sorry, my bad, should have been more specific. When I was asking about the EVs I was referring to Starmie instead of Reuniclus. Also, I've been playing around on Pokemon Online and I've been thinking about switching the Hidden Power with something more powerful since it just doesn't seem to be getting the job done. Thanks for the advice!
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  #15    
Old June 2nd, 2011, 05:16 PM
Vrai
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PlatinumDude View Post
Nope. Reuniclus needs all the physical bulk it can get an it's slow as hell anyway.

@Vrai: Focus Blast >>>> Hidden Power (Fighting). Yes, FB is inaccurate, but Reuniclus needs the power it can get against Steels and Darks.
Not when you're spamming Calm Mind. Focus Blast sucks and HP is far far far better on the CM set. I can agree on TR when you aren't boosting yourself but HP Fighting is the best option. The only thing you have to be afraid of is Tyranitar, tbh - and if you're running Reuniclus you better have a check to that anyway.

Quote:
Originally Posted by feralig8rx View Post
Sorry, my bad, should have been more specific. When I was asking about the EVs I was referring to Starmie instead of Reuniclus. Also, I've been playing around on Pokemon Online and I've been thinking about switching the Hidden Power with something more powerful since it just doesn't seem to be getting the job done. Thanks for the advice!
Yes, run maximum speed on Starmie.

When you're using CM Reuniclus, you need to actually use CM before it gets powerful. Keep in mind that you have no investment in Special Attack basically and naturally all of your attacks are weak until you get the opportunity to boost, which is usually readily available for Reuniclus anyway.
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  #16    
Old June 3rd, 2011, 03:27 AM
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Without Focus Blast you lose vital 2hko's on Tyranitar (LO HP Fight doesn't even 2HKO the bulkier variants which is frankly awful imo) and also Skarmory and Scizor.
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  #17    
Old June 3rd, 2011, 05:57 AM
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Alright, I will go fix the speed stat on Starmie. Thanks for clearing that up!
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  #18    
Old June 3rd, 2011, 06:52 AM
Vrai
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dark Azelf View Post
Without Focus Blast you lose vital 2hko's on Tyranitar (LO HP Fight doesn't even 2HKO the bulkier variants which is frankly awful imo) and also Skarmory and Scizor.
I guess. I'm not going to keep Reuniclus in on Tyranitar or Scizor anyway so I guess the point is null in my case. Whichever you prefer, I suppose~
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