5th Gen Things in B/W that irritate you - discussion!

Kevin · Aug 25, 2011

Every time you walk into a place it zooms in. That's pretty unneeded.

And the Gym Leader music / Champion music could have been better in my opinion.

Mista T · Aug 25, 2011

Alright, I understand this is all opinion, but I must address some statements that have been made:

1) Too few Ghost-types. Gen I introduced 1 new Ghost family; Gen II, 1; Gen III, 4 (Shedinja included); Gen IV, 5 (Froslass included, Dusknoir not); Gen V, 4, all of which have multiple evolutions. Thus, the amount of Ghost-types is indeed higher than it has been in any generation, while the amount of families is similar to that of the previous two Gens. It's the same for the Fire- and Electric-types. Perhaps you guys are just forgetful, but there were plenty of Pokemon representing these types.

2) The pixelated battle sprites. This is a result of three converging factors: the new battle camera, moving sprites, and the retention of a traditional spriting style. Sprites have always had the same amount of pixels. What's happening now is that the camera and battle movements make the individual pixels more apparent. If you want the battle sprites to be of higher resolution, you are basically crushing nostalgia for others. The sprites would no longer look like those to which we are accustomed.

3) Rival battles. More rival battles allow more chances for EXP gaining, a deeper story, and more of a challenge. Someone said that these more frequent encounters are reminiscent of Gary Oak. Good. It was mentioned that you have to battle N fairly often. This comment actually stupefies me. You have to battle him 5 times throughout the story, with each occasion adding more to his tale and further unraveling the mystery surrounding Team Plasma. If it is the fact that you are battling that irks you, perhaps you should find a different game to play, considering Pokemon is a game of battling.

4) The C-Gear. I get the feeling this thread contains posters who do not, for the most part, have friends who play Pokemon. Otherwise, they would know the value of the C-Gear. It allows for quick battles and trades, the ability to go in another player's game, and the ability to access the Dream World, among other neat things. The difference between accessing the C-Gear and accessing the menu screen is a press of the X button. It's manageable.

5) Level grinding. Audino. The Lucky Egg. The experience Pass Power. Trainers in the Nimbasa sports arenas. The new experience system based on comparative level. All of these factors lead to perhaps the fastest level grinding ever.

6) Removal of the Stealth Rock TM. Game Freak did this because Stealth Rock was annoyingly good at singling out certain Pokemon, such as Beautifly, who already didn't have much going for them. Giga Drain and Drain Punch are no longer TMs because their new base power makes them godly, and thus, they are to remain somewhat exclusive. Someone said Drain Punch's TM now contains Peck. It contains Quash, and if you can't figure out how to use it, you aren't thinking hard enough. Clearly, it's for Double and Triple Battles. I suppose most of you are accustomed to Single play.

Music and game aesthetics are always debatable, so I'll leave those untouched. You can continue to dislike the way that the topics that I touched upon were handled in these games, but know that it would be considerably worse and less popular if they had been handled in the way you imagine they should.

Also, one last thing. Too many bridges? Unless the poster of this comment has experienced some trauma concerning bridges in his lifetime, I don't understand this statement. New York City has many bridges. Bridges showcase the new camera angles. Bridges contain some of the best music. Bridges contain the EV Wings. Skyarrow Bridge allows for a very long and straight path that is ideal for breeders. Why are bridges a symbol of hate?

Oryx · Aug 25, 2011

Mista T said:
4) The C-Gear. I get the feeling this thread contains posters who do not, for the most part, have friends who play Pokemon. Otherwise, they would know the value of the C-Gear. It allows for quick battles and trades, the ability to go in another player's game, and the ability to access the Dream World, among other neat things. The difference between accessing the C-Gear and accessing the menu screen is a press of the X button. It's manageable.

I access the Dream World, battling, and trading maybe once a day for DW and once every couple of days for battling/trading/Entralinking. I access the menu at least 10 times every time I play. It's a reasonable complaint to say that I would have preferred the menu system in HG/SS, as that would have been infinitely more useful. I don't think the game would have been less popular if you had to press a button to access the C-Gear as opposed to the menu, and certainly not significantly worse, if at all.

For the record, all the friends that I am regularly with play Pokemon and own either Black, White, or both.

Mista T · Aug 25, 2011

Fair enough, Toujours. I just think it's simpler to have the C-Gear as default and press X to access the menu than it would be to have the menu be the default and the C-Gear be in the key items pocket of the bag. I suppose with the improved item-selecting system, however, it wouldn't have been too hard to access the C-Gear if it were in the bag. Point taken.

Shadow-L · Aug 25, 2011

Well, I found that there was a small number of types to use around the middle of your journey, so your team was easily destroyed by even wild Pokemon. C-gear was also confusing, and it was probably even more so for newer Pokemon gamers. You also had to level grind A LOT for the Elite 4, who were pretty annoying in themselves.

PokéSwimmer · Aug 25, 2011

Mista T said:
6) Removal of the Stealth Rock TM. Game Freak did this because Stealth Rock was annoyingly good at singling out certain Pokemon, such as Beautifly, who already didn't have much going for them. Giga Drain and Drain Punch are no longer TMs because their new base power makes them godly, and thus, they are to remain somewhat exclusive. Someone said Drain Punch's TM now contains Peck. It contains Quash, and if you can't figure out how to use it, you aren't thinking hard enough. Clearly, it's for Double and Triple Battles. I suppose most of you are accustomed to Single play.

The problem with Quash though is that it's very situational, even in double and triple battles. If it had priority, then it might have been a different story. Pretty much the only Pokémon that can use it effectively is Prankster Murkrow, and still, it's pretty gimmicky.
While I do agree with the removal of moves such as Stealth Rock, I think many of the TM complaints had to do with GameFreak giving us relatively useless TMs, since some of them (such as Quash, Ally Switch, and Incinerate) are very situational and thus barely qualify to take up a move slot, much less an entire TM.

Shining Raichu · Aug 25, 2011

WELL. This is exactly my sort of thread lol. Here goes:

1 - The Alienation
Unova was set in a land far away and all the Pokemon we've grown to know and love are nowhere to be found. Now, this was the whole point - I know, I get it, I understand. But it doesn't mean I have to like it. I found it to be an incredibly alienating experience as a veteran Pokemon fan, and I really hope the next set of games will ease up on the whole "fresh start / reboot" feel.

2 - The Hand-Holding
Black and White were easily the most condescending Pokemon games I've played in a long while. Every time something could have been remotely challenging, they decided to literally take you by the hand and walk you through it. Lets have some examples of this:

The first Gym purposely pits you against the type that is strong against your starter. This makes it seem challenging from the get-go, until you walk out of town and talk to a girl who gives you an elemental monkey who is strong against the Gym Leader guaranteed to win you the battle!
Want to beat Normal-type Lenora? No problem, just go to the next route and catch any in a forest FULL of Fighting types!
Need to kill Burgh's bugs? Just shoot up north a little and catch a Darumaka who is not only a Fire-type but packs quite a punch!
Before you destroy Elesa, you have to go through an entire desert crawling with Ground Pokemon that will do very well against her Electric types.
Just north of Clay and his Ground type Gym, there is an entire route dedicated nearly exclusively to Grass-types.
And how opportune it is that before you face off against Skyla, you have to go through not only a small route full of Ice-type Pokemon, but also an entire cave full of Electrics?
The layout of Unova is the most patronising part of all. Why bother trying to figure out where you have to go when you can just travel in a big circle?

I could go on...

3- The Internet
Black and White didn't start this, but it certainly stepped up the trend with this whole Dreamworld idea. I play Pokemon because I don't need to involve other people. It's on a handheld console and I can just play it by myself and have fun. But now all this wifi crap has crossed the border from 'optional' to 'necessary to complete the game'. I don't want to have to deal with wifi to get all the Pokemon. Leave me alone. No.

4- The Storyline
I totally acknowledge that the storyline was one of the best things about the games, and I agree. I think it was fantastically written. But at the same time I felt like they put so much effort into making a linear storyline that it kind of restricted your freedom to explore and play Pokemon as I've always played it. It felt like it was constantly directed by the Plasma story rather than the character's journey.

5- Bianca and Cheren
Oh my God, they never leave you alone. They stick to you like fecal matter to a blanket and become more bothersome than they are helpful or even entertaining. It got to the point where the Xtransciever would ring or the game would stop you from walking and I would go "OH WHAT NOW! WHAT NOW!"

6- N
Does anyone else find that guy annoying?

I'm sure there are more, but I will leave it at that as I can't think of them right now lol - but don't take this to mean I hate B/W, there are things about the games that I love as well :P

Ho-Oh · Aug 25, 2011

Mista T, loving that post. A lot of things people mentioned I noticed were the minor changes, and for parts it makes me wonder if people are just not adjusting to change yet, rather than not liking those things at all. By the next games you guys will probably love all these new things and go back to gen 1 and say "oh hey I miss these features" etc.

Imma also go through the other posts a bit then list my own tiny dislikes. :3

@most legendary Pokemon: meet dppt, it has too many.
@types lacking in number: hey compare b/w to dppt, where there was only like three fire Pokemon, at least B/W gave a good portion of Pokemon for each time really.
@victini's design: it's not like victini is an essential part of the storyline, so...
@rarity of tynamo: meet cryogonal. meet feebas in gen 3, etc.
@barely surfing: at least you don't need to use every TM to progress.
@hand-holding: these games had huge promotion as the new starts, aka wanted to get newer people into Pokemon, of course they had to make them easier so the new players wouldn't be confused :(

(No offence, by the way, just mentioning things you might not have thought of that don't make those things seem as bad)

My dislikes:
- Lack of a story post-game (really guys? surprised nobody mentioned this lol)
- That we can't access certain inaccessable things. :( Like uh, the place in the city Clay is in that I cannot spell.
^ yeah yeah I don't have many complaints lool.

Since we're all debating/discussing these things, imma add in "discussion" to the title so that people know you can discuss points others mentioned giving them reasons why those things can actually be good. As for general opinions you could use opinions of B/W thread.

Aaand if this thread gets filled with pros/cons later on then we'll just change it completely to feature things you like and dislike, but for now we'll keep it at irritating. :x

johnny18 · Aug 26, 2011

Mista T said:
Also, one last thing. Too many bridges? Unless the poster of this comment has experienced some trauma concerning bridges in his lifetime, I don't understand this statement. New York City has many bridges. Bridges showcase the new camera angles. Bridges contain some of the best music. Bridges contain the EV Wings. Skyarrow Bridge allows for a very long and straight path that is ideal for breeders. Why are bridges a symbol of hate?

1) I never say it is a symbol of hate. I just don't like it since I prefer surfing and you seem to have a problem with that but sorry, it is my opinion. In fact, this thread is about irritated things, not to show what you dislike about others' comments anyway.
2) I love skyarrow bridge. I just think some of them are not necceary so why do we even need them in the game.
3) This may embarrass me but I have never been to New York so I hae no idea that it has many bridges.
4) Music may be best for you but not for me. I barely notice the music of the bridges. They just did not stand out to me like when I am surfing.
5) Ev wings? I do not use them. I rather battle with the wild pokemons. It is much easier. If GAME FREAK wants to, they can make those wings to be found in other places like on the water surface

Pokemon Trainer Touko · Aug 26, 2011

Pixlated sprites and the loading time. >.<

The Nightmare · Aug 27, 2011

The only things that were annoying to me was that most of the pokemon were a bit weak and there was no new fire types or grass types much only bug type.

~*!*~Tatsujin Gosuto~*!*~ · Aug 27, 2011

I just didn't like the fact that N just disappears at the end. I do not like the move Hurricane (since its effecting me in real life right now) and I just do not like the battle subway.

:t354:TG

Elite Overlord LeSabre™ · Aug 28, 2011

1. Post game difficulty and the ridiculously high levels of trainers post E-4.
2. The designs of the playable trainers.
3. Menu design and navigation, particularly the "put new items at the top of the item list" crap and the "only useful at anime/gaming conventions" C-Gear usurping the entirety of the touch screen
4. No Vs. Seeker
5. Pixelated battle sprites
6. Why does the champion look like Cipher Admin Dakim from Pokemon Colosseum?
7. The "diminishing returns" EXP gain system.

Probably more than this, but I don't feel like copy/pasting my Amazon review of White...

Weavile05 · Aug 28, 2011

♪Twiggy♪ said:
- Forced capture of cover legendaries
- UI design being a little bit too basic in certain menus
- I wish there was an "extended battle animations" mode, because somehow it feels TOO fast in certain times...
- Featureless battle backgrounds

At least they made the catch rate ridiculously high for a legendary.

I would've preferred that they made some pokemon available earlier on, because seriously, how the heck is anyone gonna use a Mienfoo or a Druddigon or a Gollet because they are available so late... Also, the monkeys needed to be a bit more useful.

zlip · Aug 28, 2011

Forcing you to catch legendairies. At least coul dhave let us use them before e4.
Loading times
Major gaps in typing *coughwatercough*
All pokemon are just okay none really stood out
Almost all the pokemon are remakes of previous generations pokemon
Story adventure path was very straight forward,couldn't possibly get lost. No real feeling of exploring the world of pokemon
Many pokemon did and didn't have types the shouldn't/should have (Tynamos's family should have been Elec/Water)
Sturdy
HAD A HEADACHE THE WHOLE GAME DUE TO BATTLE ANIMATIONS. Should've been able to turn it off

Moltres Rider · Sep 1, 2011

in double wild Pokemon battles, if two of the same Pokemon appear, it says a Pidove and a Pidove appears.... it should say, two pidoves appear! imo

Yoshikko · Sep 2, 2011

I agree with a lot of people on loading times. It takes too long to enter a building, to battle a trainer after they spotted you, even to battle a wild Pokémon the moment you freeze in the grass. But about the pixels considering your own Pokémon in battle - I actually really like that. I can understand 100% why people dislike it, it might look old, or distorted, but it does create depth, and since the sprite is moving as well, it just seems very close, instead of old.

Shining Raichu said:
2 - The Hand-Holding
Black and White were easily the most condescending Pokemon games I've played in a long while. Every time something could have been remotely challenging, they decided to literally take you by the hand and walk you through it. Lets have some examples of this:

The first Gym purposely pits you against the type that is strong against your starter. This makes it seem challenging from the get-go, until you walk out of town and talk to a girl who gives you an elemental monkey who is strong against the Gym Leader guaranteed to win you the battle!

Want to beat Normal-type Lenora? No problem, just go to the next route and catch any in a forest FULL of Fighting types!

Need to kill Burgh's bugs? Just shoot up north a little and catch a Darumaka who is not only a Fire-type but packs quite a punch!

Before you destroy Elesa, you have to go through an entire desert crawling with Ground Pokemon that will do very well against her Electric types.

Just north of Clay and his Ground type Gym, there is an entire route dedicated nearly exclusively to Grass-types.

And how opportune it is that before you face off against Skyla, you have to go through not only a small route full of Ice-type Pokemon, but also an entire cave full of Electrics?

The layout of Unova is the most patronising part of all. Why bother trying to figure out where you have to go when you can just travel in a big circle?

I agree completely with this point, it was made way too easy, I loved it when you had to figure out where to go, or that you had no clue which way to surf when you were in open sea, and just the layout is already one of the things that eliminates most of the exploration. And about the gyms, and encountering their weaknesses just before them; even though I hated having to defeat Brock with a Pikachu in Pokémon Yellow, it made the game so much more exciting and it forces you to train your Pokémon, and maybe in a way teaches you to think strategic, because strategy is what you should rely on in battles like that, and that is what I liked in previous games.

Forever said:
Since we're all debating/discussing these things, imma add in "discussion" to the title so that people know you can discuss points others mentioned giving them reasons why those things can actually be good. As for general opinions you could use opinions of B/W thread.

Aaand if this thread gets filled with pros/cons later on then we'll just change it completely to feature things you like and dislike, but for now we'll keep it at irritating. :x

LOL I think that's a good idea, I was just irritated at the moment about the loading times etc, but please do change it if needed XD

Musician of Literature · Sep 3, 2011

Ok, this. I thought Isshu/Unova was supposed to be a region very far away from all the others. And yet, after I defeat the Elite 4, N, and Ghetsis, I decide to go to Route 11 so I could get to Undella so I could try out the epic diving. Well, so first Pokemon I encountered out there was a Gligar. From Johto. I was really ticked. The Unova region was supposed to be a new start, far from the other regions, without their Pokemon involved. I thought that's what Nintendo meant. Just the 156 Unova Pokemon, then they'd build onto Unova like with G/S/C did with Kanto. So that just made me really mad that they added Pokemon from other regions.

Raizhu · Sep 3, 2011

The sprites... they're just so grainy. And the grinding is extremely annoying.

Zet · Sep 4, 2011

I haven't finished the game yet and the main thing keeping me from doing that is the grinding. It's a pure grindfest and if I wanted that I would go back to playing Korean MMOs.

5th Gen Things in B/W that irritate you - discussion!

kevin del rey

Pityin' fools.

CoquettishCat

Pityin' fools.

Lonesome Road

Keeping time time time

Expect me like you expect Jesus.

used Sacred Fire!

Kiss Me Like It's Do or Die

春野サクラ ♥

"I fight for what I belive in"

Buffalo State College

On that 'Non stop road'

Currently Hacking BW

______

Banned

the princess has awoken while the prince sleeps on

La musica es la fuerza...

the end