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Writer's Lounge Need advice? Want to give advice? Come on in and share ideas with your fellow writers. Just remember, all fics go in the main forum.

View Poll Results: Are any of these good ideas?
Yes! 14 93.33%
No! 2 13.33%
Sort of? Some of them? (Reply, plzkthnx.) 3 20.00%
No, seriously, why the crap did you make this poll multiple choice, Jax? 4 26.67%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 15. You may not vote on this poll

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  #26    
Old August 13th, 2011, 08:25 PM
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On the Genre Challenge: Personally, I'm for the no-emblems free-for-all, but I've already voiced my opinions on that. So, yeah, I'm probably not allowed to re-voice my opinions. :(

Quote:
Originally Posted by bobandbill View Post
I love rumours I sure wonder what happens with that isn't this exciting I'm excited you should all be excited.
OH HEY I LOVE RUMORS TOO I WONDER WHO WILL SET UP THE THREAD COULD IT BE SOMEONE AWESOMELY AWESOME AND-- oh wait it's me.

Seriously, one last question before I run around and slap together a thread.

Nominations. Juuuust to clarify, what exactly are we nominating? I mean, I was thinking we could just throw up an anonymous poll of every single fic title and just have people go at voting. Should we have categories that we can toss nominations towards specifically, or are we just narrowing down who will be in the poll?

After that, I can totally throw together the first poll/nominations/thread-like thing ever, and we can cover July's updates or something. (August's FFotM-like thing can be held first week of September.)
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  #27    
Old August 14th, 2011, 01:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JX Valentine View Post
Juuuust to clarify, what exactly are we nominating?
Stories. Weren't you paying attention? :V

I'm not sure how to do this, really. I'm leaning towards having general nominations with stipulations on who can nominate what (no nominating your own story, for example). Otherwise, the poll's going to get eXtremely unwieldy as we try to list every single thread updated in one month. But with nominations, we can tell earlier on what's getting read and what's not, or even if people are reading. Then from there, we can see what got nominated and then throw it up into a poll with hopefully less than twenty-five poll options.

Maybe if things go well, we can have categories, but right now now I don't believe we have a large enough variety to have enough competition for categories, unless there are some categories people would like to see, in which case feel free to prove me wrong.

So yeah, I feel we should nominate before poll.

I have no idea if this makes sense. I got distracted by ponies.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Astinus View Post
As for the Genre Challenge, we could toss it into the mix currently consisting of the SWC, the Reviewing Challenge, and I-swear-there-was-something-else-planned.
The last thing was the general writing challenge, detailed here.

And by SWC, I mean prompt challenges.
  #28    
Old August 16th, 2011, 09:07 PM
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Apologies that I'm absurdly late here, I just have a few random suggestions that might either help or just find a comfortable spot in the dusty corners of the internet.

What about a random chat room get-together once or twice a year? Jax and Astinus have already brought up previously that it's nice to be able to interact with one another every once in a while without being all serious business writer-reviewer flings, and instant messaging might take away some of that formal feel while we still can talk about writer-y things. There's nothing special about it really (well, it could be used for pre-contest/challenge purposes to brain storm) but it would give people a chance to get to know one another. The hard part would be getting everyone in the same spot at the same time. But a big gathering where we can just say what we like without fear of spamming the forums might be good for the community. It won't revitalize the forum directly, but it could help open up more discussion and make new writers feel a little more welcome. IDK, just throwing stuff out. :p

I also like the idea of non-formal genre challenges that are just here for the sake of being fun and a challenge rather than being a 'who gets emblems' thing. There won't be any formal judging structure - everyone can post or comment on anyone's submission, and the challenges are a little more specific, designed to make the writers think more than anything. The overall goal being to just improve your writing or butt heads with other people.

I know this community has a shortage on reviewers, but I think those will come on their own time after the quality of stories goes up. The quality of stories will only go up after we get involved with each other, help each other out, step on each other's toes a little bit, and give each other license to be pushed around/out of our box. It's kind of obvious IMO that most of us are sick of seeing the same thing over and over again (judging by the four page 'what do you hate seeing in stories' thread), and small specific challenges could slowly push us all out of that 'there's nothing original or new in this fandom!' funk.

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  #29    
Old August 16th, 2011, 09:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Azurne View Post
What about a random chat room get-together once or twice a year? Jax and Astinus have already brought up previously that it's nice to be able to interact with one another every once in a while without being all serious business writer-reviewer flings, and instant messaging might take away some of that formal feel while we still can talk about writer-y things. There's nothing special about it really (well, it could be used for pre-contest/challenge purposes to brain storm) but it would give people a chance to get to know one another. The hard part would be getting everyone in the same spot at the same time. But a big gathering where we can just say what we like without fear of spamming the forums might be good for the community. It won't revitalize the forum directly, but it could help open up more discussion and make new writers feel a little more welcome. IDK, just throwing stuff out. :p
I second this idea and would like to say we should totally have a massive Skype session or something. Hearing each other's voices would totally not be a terrible idea. Alternatively, AIM/MSN chats are always a fun way to go, or we can see about getting our own IRC chan. I know IRC chans are really gaining popularity these days, so. Not to mention we'd finally have something resembling the FFL for those of us who miss spamming each other with WTFery, so there's that. /massive paragraph with no direction whatsoever


Also, guys, for the people besides the forty who peeked at the thread already, FotM thread is now up. Could use some ironing out here and there, so feel free to drop by and comment. Or nominate so we can actually have something to put on the polls because that is totally a list of more than twenty-five eligible fics right there.
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  #30    
Old August 17th, 2011, 12:15 PM
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Well if people are interested, there are a couple of really easy ways to make an online chatroom. For example here's one I just threw together: http://pcffaw.chatango.com/

It's quick, easy and fulfils a need so feel free to use it if you want
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  #31    
Old August 17th, 2011, 05:20 PM
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I too like the chat together thing as it could be fun discussing all kinds of things. FlaafyFTW's chat we can try out or we can try to get an IRC one. I'm fine either way.

And Jax, real quick I'm a bit busy now but I'll look over the nominations thread later tonight and see what I can do.
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  #32    
Old September 1st, 2011, 08:01 PM
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BUMP

To recap, what we have so far in the (4th? Idk) F&W revitalization project:
  • Fanfic of the Month
  • Writing Challenges
    • Genre Challenge
  • Reviewer Profiles Thread
  • Quick Q&A Thread
  • IRC Channel
All the ones left out either haven't really had the kinks worked out in yet or don't have a potential implementation date, meaning they're floating up there in development hell --the F&W version of it anyway. Feel free to point out if I've missed something, because I'm sure we should have at least hammered out the problems with the IRC thingamabob. I mean, we just don't have a definite date.

In any case, I'm not one for bumping a thread for no reason, so here goes a pretty simple idea for potentially increasing activity that I'm hoping'll work.

Weekly Feature/Featured Fic/Mod's Choice Fic/Fanfic of the Week (<-- The least likely title because Fanfic of the Month is already a contest.)

So yeah, basically a fic sticky in the main forum which changes every week. (Not a thread which links to the fic because no one's gonna check that out, I'm sure.) Simple, no? The fic of the week should either be chosen by a mod or someone who habitually makes an effort to read most of the fics posted in the week. It doesn't need to be a good fic, just a fic that the mod or chooser thinks might deserve a bit more attention. It could even be a random fic. Though... we don't really want an incredibly horrendous, cliched fic littered with grammatical errors up there. Not because I'm prejudiced or anything, but because those fics tend to get reviews just nicely on their own. Just a nicely written fic that might need a smidgeon of help in the right direction or maybe a well-written fic that hasn't got enough attention.

Questions? Suggestions? I'm not sure if this has been suggested before, but you try finding something on a Vbulletin system with those keywords. >:
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  #33    
Old September 1st, 2011, 08:24 PM
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Not to shoot down an idea (because I personally need to avoid doing that in this particular thread due to the whole "shoving everything off on you lot" mentality"), but I feel like we already cover the idea of showcasing fics with FotM currently. I mean, although it looks like the list of eligible fics is long, the entire process highlights and parades around the best-of-the-best, readers' choice fics of the forum for any given month. Given the current amount of activity in the FF&W, the nominations period alone tends to filter out the fics that wouldn't be material for featured fic anyway. (No offense, guys. AEM hasn't been nominated as of this writing either, so I'm in the same boat.)

Not to mention the whole point of making the FotM a feature focused on member voting was to take pressure off the mods. Having them go through fics every week puts more pressure right back on them. Then, if we go with the idea of having a regular member do it, not only would we have to worry about whether or not that member's judgment about fic quality can be trusted (at least with the FotM, the winning fic is chosen based on a majority vote), but we'd also have to worry about whether or not that particular member would be able to do it consistently from week to week. Anyone who volunteers now might not have much to do in terms of schoolwork at this particular moment, but what about later on in the semester? And never mind trying to balance choosing a fic, reviewing all the others, and keeping up with their own.

So... yeah. Probably best to leave it at just FotM at this point.
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  #34    
Old September 1st, 2011, 08:51 PM
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Not that I don't agree or anything, and they're all pretty much legitimate points to make, but the only problem I've ever had with the FFotM is that fics will only ever get nominations if at least one person notices it, likes it, and then goes on to nominate it for that month, meaning that it is definitely a good enough fic to consider nominating and that it's got at least one enthusiastic enough reader that wants to share it with the rest or give recognition to the writer.

But that's pretty much it.

The FFotM is a way of giving recognition to writers most deserving, but what it doesn't do is bring attention to those middling fics out there that we, as a community, have been ignoring (pretty much), because well... I'm not sure how to put it succinctly into words so I'll do it this way:
A low-quality fic will get latched on to by reviewers like a bloody foot in the amazon.
A high-quality fic will get maybe a few admirers, sometimes depending on how well-known the author is. /sadfact
A middling-quality fic, which isn't so bad, but then again, has a few flaws, is more likely to be ignored and shoved down the pile. It'll have a few nudges here and there, but those are rare because, apparently, we all love pointing out flaws in this community --which is another reason why HQ fics will sometimes also not get any recognition (a lack of flaws).

Aside from that, in my defence, I did say (or maybe imply) that fics could be randomly chosen, just from the first page if need be. I admit, though, the massive sifting through fics really didn't cross my mind while writing the post, so that's a bit of a bummer, but, really, the main point of this is just to randomly pick a fic, not necessarily one you've read or even like, mind, and sticky it up there so people know it exists for reviews and the like. It might work, it might not, but the important thing is that it gets a bit more recognition than it normally would have. Course, skimming through the fics a bit might help, because it's not that hard to spot when a fic is littered with formatting and grammatical errors, so you'll know what fics shouldn't go up there. In any case, I guess the only real flaw (that I as the biased proponent can see), is that it means there's an extra sticky cluttering up the main forums and that it might draw away attention from the FFotM sticky --if there's going to be any.

That's pretty much it for now.
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  #35    
Old September 1st, 2011, 08:54 PM
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Quote:
The fic of the week should either be chosen by a mod
I work full time and barely have time to do much of any thinking. I think bobandbill is back in uni, so he's busy too.

Quote:
someone who habitually makes an effort to read most of the fics posted in the week
Who does that now? And how would anyone decide who gets that lofty position? Their opinion alone would be the basis of the Fic of the Week, and that makes it seem like only their opinion counts. While the way FFotM is now, the community comes together to nominate and vote on fics, so no one person's opinion is higher than the others.

That, and my cynical thoughts are turning to wondering if people are going to complain as to why their fic didn't get chosen for that week. Besides, isn't it easy to see which fics need reviews? Just look down the page and see which thread doesn't have a lot of replies. Hover the cursor over the title and that should give a quick look into what the fic is going to be like. That, or who the OP is. Or one could just open up the thread themselves and quickly scan through to see what the fic is like. And that way, no one person's fic is pointed out other than FFotM, and that can be easily explained as to how it was chosen.
  #36    
Old September 1st, 2011, 09:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Astinus View Post
Who does that now? And how would anyone decide who gets that lofty position? Their opinion alone would be the basis of the Fic of the Week, and that makes it seem like only their opinion counts. While the way FFotM is now, the community comes together to nominate and vote on fics, so no one person's opinion is higher than the others.

That, and my cynical thoughts are turning to wondering if people are going to complain as to why their fic didn't get chosen for that week. Besides, isn't it easy to see which fics need reviews? Just look down the page and see which thread doesn't have a lot of replies. Hover the cursor over the title and that should give a quick look into what the fic is going to be like. That, or who the OP is. Or one could just open up the thread themselves and quickly scan through to see what the fic is like. And that way, no one person's fic is pointed out other than FFotM, and that can be easily explained as to how it was chosen.
Or, you know, replying to the previous post on the bit about fics being randomly chosen would be nice too. Kind of like a, 'random from gallery' thing, except without a computer because Vb doesn't work that way. It's only a way of putting fics up there because people may feel compelled to check them out if they're sure it's not terrible --which, I gather, is one of the many reasons people don't read fanfiction.
Really, I'm not trying to be inconsiderate. A lot of us have lives, I'm sure.

EDIT: And yeah, probably the only problem I'm seeing right now is that it'll draw attention away from the FFotM fics, so I'm starting to have my own doubts. Clearly not very well thought out, but I just thought of it today.
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---

.F a n f i c t i o N.
The Promise I Made to You

SWC 2012 Second Place

Last edited by Mizan de la Plume Kuro; September 1st, 2011 at 09:47 PM.
  #37    
Old September 1st, 2011, 10:08 PM
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Just as a note: it takes me anywhere from five minutes to an hour to write a post (depending on length), and I'm constantly bouncing around tabs in two different browsers. So I didn't respond to your post because I had no idea you posted before I did.

Quote:
which, I gather, is one of the many reasons people don't read fanfiction.
Well, yeah, a lot of people don't read fanfiction because they think all fanfiction is terrible. (I'm reading through comments by a whole group of people who just don't "get" fanfiction.) But you're talking to people who have been reading/writing fanfiction for years and wanting them to review fics. Right now, those who would be reviewing fics and keeping this forum active don't have the time/current mindset to do so. This board is short on reviewers, particularly the ones needed to make this section better. Who are those reviewers? The ones with no time to review. A fic magically being stickied isn't going to create time.

Look, you know what my plan was before life happened? I was going to pick a fic at random, just one a week, and review it. (I'm going to get back to that.) Especially those fics that didn't have any reviews. If people just do that, then it skips the sticky thread mess (which is where my main problem is with this) and more fics get reviewed. Sure, a person might run across a fic riddled with mistakes, but that's what happens with random choice. And it would happen anyhow if any random thread is stickied. Plus, FFotM wouldn't get ignored.
  #38    
Old September 2nd, 2011, 04:11 AM
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Shortie response because I should be heading out the door soon, but...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mizan de la Plume Kuro View Post
Or, you know, replying to the previous post on the bit about fics being randomly chosen would be nice too. Kind of like a, 'random from gallery' thing, except without a computer because Vb doesn't work that way.
...So you're proposing to introduce the potential to showcase the exact fics you want to receive less attention (i.e., the low-quality ones, particularly the ones that are fresh and therefore have less replies and views to begin with and could therefore be mistaken for a middling or high-quality fic if we're filtering eligible ones out by reply/view-count)?

I mean, yeah, the major problem is weeding out the fics that just shouldn't be featured, and that would take time and effort. So, the next major problem is finding someone who can spare both consistently, which we don't have. At least with the FotM, we're recognizing fic that the community agrees should have always been recognized. Once the major awesome players have been weeded out each month, our choices will most likely narrow down to either new fics by the same authors or fics from up-and-coming talent. We just have to wait for the process to take care of the more well-known fics first.
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