• Our software update is now concluded. You will need to reset your password to log in. In order to do this, you will have to click "Log in" in the top right corner and then "Forgot your password?".
  • Welcome to PokéCommunity! Register now and join one of the best fan communities on the 'net to talk Pokémon and more! We are not affiliated with The Pokémon Company or Nintendo.
    Register

The Champions League

Status
Not open for further replies.
Ephemeral Euphoria

Ephemeral Euphoria

3,801
Posts
14
Years
  • Age 31
  • Seen Jun 29, 2019
I raped Cynthia's team with Torterra by the time it got to level 67 lol. Who would have thought Wood Hammer and Earthquake would be so deadly together lol. Infernape's not too bad against Cynthia either, takes care of Lucario and Roserade for me with ease so it's cool yeah.

This was during my run in Diamond though with my team being Torterra, Infernape, Steelix, Gyarados, Weavile, and Staraptor all around level 63 to 68 each at the time lol. And yes Milotic was a giant pain in the ass which would have probably beaten me if not for the combined efforts of my Torterra and Gyarados at the time lol. Basically had Gyarados sponge up the Ice Beams for me and by the time it ran out of PP I switched to Torterra, took a Surf, and KO'd with Wood Hammer lol.
 
psyanic

psyanic

pop a wheelie on a zeitgeist
1,284
Posts
12
Years
  • Age 27
  • USA
  • Seen Apr 10, 2023
Her Garchomp is so annoying... I demolished her team with a Scizor and a Gallade, so Gallade could Leaf Blade a few things and Scizor cleaned up. Garchomp was the biggest problem because I couldn't land any Super-Effective hits.
 

miltankRancher

Mega Ampharos is the one.
3,947
Posts
13
Years
Xulek said:
I raped Cynthia's team with Torterra by the time it got to level 67 lol. Who would have thought Wood Hammer and Earthquake would be so deadly together lol. Infernape's not too bad against Cynthia either, takes care of Lucario and Roserade for me with ease so it's cool yeah.

This was during my run in Diamond though with my team being Torterra, Infernape, Steelix, Gyarados, Weavile, and Staraptor all around level 63 to 68 each at the time lol. And yes Milotic was a giant pain in the ass which would have probably beaten me if not for the combined efforts of my Torterra and Gyarados at the time lol. Basically had Gyarados sponge up the Ice Beams for me and by the time it ran out of PP I switched to Torterra, took a Surf, and KO'd with Wood Hammer lol.
Click to expand...

I had nothing decent enough to back up my Torterra. Milotic IIRC outspeeds it, and always OHKO my Torterra. I managed to defeat it when I decided to lose on purpose so I can get out, revamp my WHOLE team [yes, my first playthrough was revamped] dumping two of my players [IIRC, it was a Lopunny and a Drifblim] so I can put in a spot for a previously trained Magnezone and a traded in from my brother's Platinum, an Earthquake Snorlax. When I faced her again, Luxray OHKOed it with a Thunder.
 
psyanic

psyanic

pop a wheelie on a zeitgeist
1,284
Posts
12
Years
  • Age 27
  • USA
  • Seen Apr 10, 2023
I can post new topics right? The other one is as good as dead xD

If all the champions entered in a tournament, who do you think would win?
 

miltankRancher

Mega Ampharos is the one.
3,947
Posts
13
Years
Hmmm... Let's see. Tournaments are not exactly a measure of one's power, since it randomly matches you up with another person. The two strongest champions may be matched up at Round 1, and we end up losing the second strongest, with a weaker one placing second. [Single Elimination Style]

However, if pitted against one another in a Royal Rumble, I am guessing it is a tie between Cynthia and Steven.
 
psyanic

psyanic

pop a wheelie on a zeitgeist
1,284
Posts
12
Years
  • Age 27
  • USA
  • Seen Apr 10, 2023
miltankRancher said:
Hmmm... Let's see. Tournaments are not exactly a measure of one's power, since it randomly matches you up with another person. The two strongest champions may be matched up at Round 1, and we end up losing the second strongest, with a weaker one placing second.
Click to expand...
The tournament was simply an analogy for saying, "Who is the strongest champion?" I didn't want to pose that question, however, looking back, I probably should have. But I despise such generic questions.

I also thought Cynthia would probably be at the top, probably followed by Red or Steven.
 
psyanic

psyanic

pop a wheelie on a zeitgeist
1,284
Posts
12
Years
  • Age 27
  • USA
  • Seen Apr 10, 2023
I actually consider Wallace to be one of the weakest champions. His team isn't that much of a threat and his battling prowess is a bit hindered since he's a big supporter for Contests and focuses on beauty rather than power and he's also a Gym Leader, though that doesn't necessarily drag him down at all. The only real "powerhouse" on his team is Milotic, and maybe Gyarados to an extent.

And I'm wondering where Lance is on the list, since he got beat by both Red/Blue so that already places him pretty far down in terms of the Champions. Though, in context to the anime, I'd consider him to be one of the strongest. Although this isn't a fair measurement since he got a lot of screen time in Johto, whereas Steven had an episode and Wallace only appeared for a contest.
 

Sector

Banned
2,331
Posts
12
Years
  • Age 33
  • Ohio
  • Seen Oct 10, 2016

Name: Sector Revenge
​

Friend: Cynthia
​

Partner: Milotic​

Reason for Joining: Big fan of Lance, and LOOOOVEE Cynthia. Champions are the best!


I'm honestly surprised you didn't add the champion Pokemon from the older Pokemon Games...Blue also had Magneton, the three Eeveelutions of Jolteon, Vaporeon & Flareon, Sandslash, Ninetales, & Cloyster from Pokemon Yellow

Lance had Salamence, Garchomp, Altaria as rematches in HeartGold/SoulSilver. In Pokemon Stadium 2 he also uses Tyanitar & Steelix for round 1, as for round 2 he uses Feraligatr, Arcanine & Kangaskhan.
​
​
 

Cosmotone8

silhouette of the past
1,758
Posts
12
Years
Sector Revenge said:

Name: Sector Revenge
​

Friend: Cynthia
​

Partner: Milotic​

Reason for Joining: Big fan of Lance, and LOOOOVEE Cynthia. Champions are the best!


I'm honestly surprised you didn't add the champion Pokemon from the older Pokemon Games...Blue also had Magneton, the three Eeveelutions of Jolteon, Vaporeon & Flareon, Sandslash, Ninetales, & Cloyster from Pokemon Yellow

Lance had Salamence, Garchomp, Altaria as rematches in HeartGold/SoulSilver. In Pokemon Stadium 2 he also uses Tyanitar & Steelix for round 1, as for round 2 he uses Feraligatr, Arcanine & Kangaskhan.
​
​
Click to expand...
Welcome! I will add those when I get around to it.
 
Ephemeral Euphoria

Ephemeral Euphoria

3,801
Posts
14
Years
  • Age 31
  • Seen Jun 29, 2019
To answer the question I believe that Cynthia would end up winning the rumble although Steven would come in a close second imo.
 
Hann

Hann

What's all the Buzz about...
352
Posts
12
Years
  • Age 28
  • Seen Oct 8, 2020
It would be a close call between Cynthia and Steven, but Cynthia would probably win. Her Pokémon only share two types twice, Water and Ground. Steven has three rock types, three steel types and two psychic types. They are combined with other types but still.
 

Sector

Banned
2,331
Posts
12
Years
  • Age 33
  • Ohio
  • Seen Oct 10, 2016
Buzz Buzz said:
It would be a close call between Cynthia and Steven, but Cynthia would probably win. Her Pokémon only share two types twice, Water and Ground. Steven has three rock types, three steel types and two psychic types. They are combined with other types but still.
Click to expand...
That is a good observation.(Although Gastrodon is a joke, they could had given her Magnezone instead! lol) But Garchomp could handle half of Steven's Pokemon. Aggron would get 1HKO'd, Metagross would get jeopardize by it. Elecktross has flamethrower, there goes the Steel types. Lucario's Aura Sphere could easily knock out half the part as well, especially those two fossil Pokemon. Spiritomb could fend off Claydol.

The only thing Cynthia has to worry about from Steven is Claydol..I don't see how Steven is so close to Cynthia. Steven's party is way to mono-typed up to even be considered a close call with her. Cynthia has been the most difficult of the champions I've ever faced. Steel is has the most resistences yes, but Cynthia has many ways to defeat them, such as Garchomp, Lucario, Eelektross and Togekiss(if he could learn Flamethrower as well). That's just my third degree..
 
psyanic

psyanic

pop a wheelie on a zeitgeist
1,284
Posts
12
Years
  • Age 27
  • USA
  • Seen Apr 10, 2023
Sector Revenge said:
Steel is has the most resistences yes, but Cynthia has many ways to defeat them, such as Garchomp, Lucario, Eelektross and Togekiss(if he could learn Flamethrower as well). That's just my third degree..
Click to expand...
Lucario's Aura Sphere won't take down Armaldo because it's a Rock-type; it's also part Bug-type so that weakness ceases to exist. Its only weaknesses are Rock and Water, I believe, so Garchomp wouldn't take it down either.

I'll rephrase the question since we're all talking about the games and ignoring every other source of media, like the manga/anime. If Steven had that full team in other media as did Cynthia, who would win? Actually, if all the Champions had their in-game teams in other media, who would be victorious?
 
Hann

Hann

What's all the Buzz about...
352
Posts
12
Years
  • Age 28
  • Seen Oct 8, 2020
The only thing Cynthia has to worry about from Steven is Claydol..I don't see how Steven is so close to Cynthia.
Click to expand...

I was thinking about my own experience with Steven for a moment. Apart from Cynthia I had the most trouble with him, in Emerald I mean. Probably because my Pokémon were at least twenty levels behind.

Lucario could take down Armaldo with Stone Edge in Platinum. In Diamond and Pearl he doesn't have that move yet but Gastrodon does. Milotic and Gastrodon would both be able to take it down with Surf and Muddy Water respectively. Armaldo is also weak to Steel type attacks, but Cynthia's pokémon don't have those, so Water and Rock should do for now.

If Steven had that full team in other media as did Cynthia, who would win? Actually, if all the Champions had their in-game teams in other media, who would be victorious?
Click to expand...

This is such a difficult question. If we talk about the anime, anything could happen. We saw Cynthia's Garchomp sweep entire teams, even those of Sinnoh's own Elite Four. We also saw that same Garchomp almost defeated by Paul's Torterra, Chimchar and Sneasel.
It all comes down to strategy, good trustworthy Pokémon and believe it or not, a good dose of luck. You need to be able to pull off the right moves at the right time.
You also have to take into account that moves work differently in the anime and levels and abilities don't count (for the most part).
In short, I have absolutely no idea who would be the strongest in the anime (I don't really know about the Manga though). Anyone could win, even Alder (though I still vote for Cynthia).
 
psyanic

psyanic

pop a wheelie on a zeitgeist
1,284
Posts
12
Years
  • Age 27
  • USA
  • Seen Apr 10, 2023
Buzz Buzz said:
This is such a difficult question. If we talk about the anime, anything could happen. We saw Cynthia's Garchomp sweep entire teams, even those of Sinnoh's own Elite Four. We also saw that same Garchomp almost defeated by Paul's Torterra, Chimchar and Sneasel.
Click to expand...
Boo, cop-out answer. The point of the question was to get you to stop thinking so close to in-game, all about weaknesses and moves, and think more logically. I find that the anime battling world and the manga battling world is a lot more interesting to debate about. Not because anything can happen, since there is some clear canon involved and you can assume a lot, except for those champions that barely got a mention. Like Steven for instance. Abilities do count a lot in battles, so I don't know where you're getting that from. Moves do virtually the same things, except more because they more depth to work with.

And that Garchomp destroyed Paul, every time. I have no idea where you got the connotation that it would faint at all, except for maybe against his Torterra. Cynthia allowed it to take the hits and it redoubled and demolished Paul.
 
Hann

Hann

What's all the Buzz about...
352
Posts
12
Years
  • Age 28
  • Seen Oct 8, 2020
Boo, cop-out answer. The point of the question was to get you to stop thinking so close to in-game, all about weaknesses and moves, and think more logically. I find that the anime battling world and the manga battling world is a lot more interesting to debate about. Not because anything can happen, since there is some clear canon involved and you can assume a lot, except for those champions that barely got a mention. Like Steven for instance. Abilities do count a lot in battles, so I don't know where you're getting that from. Moves do virtually the same things, except more because they more depth to work with.
Click to expand...

First of all, I didn't mean abilities didn't count. I probably worded it quite bad, but some abilities do in the anime what should be logical. Take Froslass for example, one of its abilities in-game is Snow Cloak (yes, I know I'm thinking about the games again, sorry) which raises its evasion in hail. When it starts snowing in the anime it is not more than logical Froslass won't be visible, same with Garchomp and Sand Veil and other Pokémon. Most abilities do get used, abilities like Run Away and others don't really count in my opinion because they aren't used in the anime and there's no need for them (as far as I know).
Moves do indeed get more depth, some don't and even lose some of their depth. The most famous example being Dig which can be used while surfing in the games and clearly cannot be used in the anime like that.
As for Garchomp vs. Paul I need to apologize again for my bad wording. I merely meant that Paul being fairly 'lower' than Cynthia managed to deal at least some damage to Garchomp. I know that Paul already traveled Kanto, Johto and Hoenn but Cynthia is the champion and Paul did mention he didn't win anything in those regions. Cynthia allowing Garchomp to take hits can be true, but one has to admit she didn't expect Paul to use his Torterra like that. She was genuinely surprised.

I agree that anime battling (don't know about the manga) is a lot more interesting to talk about than game battling. When I write out Pokémon battle scenes for stories I always use the anime, never the games, just because there is so much depth.
I would go in great detail and analyze every champion vs. champion battle in anime style if I didn't think it would take up too much space.

One thing I don't really get is how 'logical' would differ so much from thinking about 'moves and weaknesses'. To me weaknesses and moves mean Fire loses to Water due to Pokémon X using Water Gun on Pokémon Y. Logical simply means (to me) that a trainer would use Water Gun and not some Grass type move on a Fire Pokémon. Unless you mean to think about setting too. Like how you shouldn't be able to battle with a Fire Pokémon while surfing because he'd simply not be able to stand the water and faint instantly.

Sorry for apparently not answering the question. I hope this explained what I meant a bit, but if it didn't feel free to say so (or if I said something completely and horribly wrong)
 
psyanic

psyanic

pop a wheelie on a zeitgeist
1,284
Posts
12
Years
  • Age 27
  • USA
  • Seen Apr 10, 2023
Buzz Buzz said:
Most abilities do get used, abilities like Run Away and others don't really count in my opinion because they aren't used in the anime and there's no need for them (as far as I know).
Click to expand...
And the number of abilities like Run Away, Pick-up, and Gluttony are hardly common, so there isn't much of them at all. So you said earlier, "Most abilities don't count", and I had a bone with that. Yeah, a wording issue on your part.

However, moves still get depth. Now that there is more logic involved, of course some moves can't be used in specific situations. But you're still ignoring the fact that when you use Dig, it doesn't necessarily mean you have to attack. For example, in the battle against Paul in the Lily of the Valley Conference, Ash had Infernape use Dig and Flare Blitz so that the toxic spikes were neutralized. The example you used isn't about depth; it's about adding in some logic.

And of course Paul would land a hit on Garchomp. I think that Torterra had one good, clean hit on it that whole battle, and it still wasn't enough to actually do any substantial damage. Garchomp still demolished his team. That doesn't speak much about Cynthia, except that she'll destroy any kid's team. This is useful for a comparison, mainly Alder. Alder used a Bouffalant against Ash's Pikachu. True, Bouffalant pretty much went on its own instincts and held its own against Pikachu, but never went so far as to defeat it. It was pretty evenly matched and I can only imagine Bouffalant would have beat it if Alder didn't decide to take a nap. Either way, it's hard to debate about a possibility, but I still consider Alder to be weaker than Cynthia. I fully believe Garchomp would have beat Pikachu in that same situation.

Weaknesses are different in the anime. Why? Because so many battles were played with a type advantage, but they still lost. Or conversely, a Pokemon with the type weakness still won. Pikachu uses Thunderbolt on countless Pokemon despite them being immune to it, specifically Ground-type Pokemon. And this does occur with other Pokemon. So weaknesses play a much less significant role in battling, even if it is a factor. Actually, it still is a factor but not as large.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top