The PokéCommunity Forums  

Go Back   The PokéCommunity Forums > The PokéCommunity Archives > ARCHIVED: Battle Center > Competitive Team Help
Sign Up Rules/FAQ Live Battle Blogs Mark Forums Read

Notices

Competitive Team Help Having trouble with your competitive Pokémon team? Be sure to check here if you need any help on it. Any teams intended for in-game and casual play should be posted in the In-Game Team Help sub-forum.


Advertise here

 
 
Thread Tools
  #1    
Old April 29th, 2012, 03:40 PM
SoulRed12
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Gender:
Nature: Modest

Advertise here
I'm open to all comments and suggestions! This is a PO team, so I can make changes rather easily. Thanks for looking!

At a glance:


This time, I tried to put together a halfway decent offensive team. I changed out a bunch of stuff over and over before actually playtesting it, and thus, I won't go into the construction process. But, there are a few problems I've been having with it so I need some creative people to help me out.

So, onward to the details. (note, as it says in the thread title, this is a gen IV team)


Gliscor (M) @ Yache Berry
Trait: Sand Veil
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
- Stealth Rock
- Earthquake
- Taunt
- U-turn

One of my two favorite leads. Faster than Roserade to block both sleep powder and toxic spikes (though nobody on my team really cares much about toxic spikes), though leaf storm hurts despite neutrality. I know Yache Berry seems weird, but it lets me last long enough to KO lead infernape (provided it uses SR first) and then set up SR before the next switch-in KOs me. It could also allow me to survive one lead Machamp ice punch to get some damage on it before going to Rotom for the revenge kill. And since I opted for U-turn to cripple lead Azelf (who will probably taunt me before I can use Taunt myself, or SR) and switch out into Rotom-W for the kill (with the scarf), potentially before he can even get up stealth rocks if he spent the first turn taunting. Similarly, U-Turn breaks Aerodactyl's sash, and then rotom threatens to KO (again, due to its scarf). I just love their synergy.


Rotom-W @ Choice Scarf
Trait: Levitate
EVs: 16 HP / 240 SAtk / 252 Spd
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Trick
- Shadow Ball
- Thunderbolt
- Hydro Pump

As I mentioned above, it serves to provide synergy with Gliscor. It's also my answer to gyarados, who I can switch into on the DD (or after a KO) and outspeed with a thunderbolt. Sadly, Gengar's shadow ball is a OHKO, but if I can get Rotom in after a KO or on some other attack besides shadow ball, it can outspeed with the scarf and OHKO thanks to Gengar's frailty.


Heatran (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Flash Fire
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
- Taunt
- Fire Blast
- Earth Power
- Toxic

Serves as a counter to a wide variety of pokemon that otherwise trouble my team, such as Jirachi, Celebi, and others. Taunt to disable Blissey on the switch-in (as well as to keep bulky waters from coming in and setting up), and Toxic for Blisseys to force 'em out while all they can do is seismic toss for 100HP (which is merely a 3HKO). I can then switch to snorlax to force her out and probably get some massive damage on whatever switches in.


Dragonite (F) @ Life Orb
Trait: Inner Focus
EVs: 252 Atk / 52 SAtk / 204 Spd
Lonely Nature (+Atk, -Def)
- Agility
- Outrage
- Earthquake
- Thunderbolt

I wasn't sure about this one. I needed a late-game sweeper, and this guy does the trick, but it's really irritating how he is weak to SR. Luckily I have the Gliscor/Rotom combo to potentially thwart attempts to set them up, but it won't work against certain leads such as Infernape who doesn't rely on taunt and is faster than Gliscor. Outrage without a DD just doesn't seem as strong as it should be, though I love being able to outspeed scarfed Flygon. Thunderbolt because I need more coverage for bulky waters, and it also fries Skarmory. Earthquake for more coverage against things like Infernape (after an agility, of course).


Celebi @ Life Orb
Trait: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 HP / 220 Def / 36 Spd
Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Calm Mind
- Recover
- Grass Knot
- Hidden Power [Fire]

Another hard choice, but I'm relatively confident this guy fills an important niche in my team. CM over NP to let me viably use the physically bulky EV spread, which protects Celebi somewhat against pursuit. Grass Knot because it can deal with Suicune and to some extent Tyranitar (unless it's scarfed; the 36 speed evs are to outspeed the DD variants), and HP fire over Psychic so Scizor is no threat and so steels can't wall. After 2 CMs, Grass Knot does wonderfully against Vaporeon, too. Celebi also serves as my only water resist, which I know isn't good, but he's done his job pretty well so far. He can CM along with bulky waters, and is generally faster than them so he can get off a CM before he is hit and then recover once the damage he takes is < 50%. He tends to get frozen a lot, though -______-


Snorlax (M) @ Choice Band
Trait: Thick Fat
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 SDef
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Body Slam
- Pursuit
- Crunch
- Earthquake

His pokedex entry should be: "Eats Starmies for breakfast." Starmies are a horrible problem for my team, as they threaten everything else except for Rotom with Hydro Pump + Ice Beam. He provides a valuable ability to switch into ice beam with thick fat, and maims back with pursuit (which has a very good chance of OHKOing) while taking very little from hydro pump, as well. Life Orb variants will surely fall due to the recoil, especially if Snorlax came in on an attack. Admittedly, Pursuit can only be a 2HKO if he doesn't switch out, but Hydro Pump from max SpA Life Orb Starmie fails to 2HKO even after SR with these EVs. If I come in on an ice beam (which is a possibility, as much of my team is weak to ice) then I'm in even better shape due to high special defense plus thick fat. And, of course, I can simply revenge kill it. Choice band so I don't have to drop an attack and waste a turn for Curse.

Threats:
(these pokemon, when playtesting, tend to be problems for my team)
1. SCARFED FLYGON. FUUUU. H8TE. Nobody can outspeed but Dragonite (but he has to get off an agility which means it has to be sufficiently late game so there are no steels in the way), so he can just keep coming in an u-turning. I suppose I need an ice attack somewhere.

2. Will 'o' Wisp Rotom (Snorlax can't pursuit it) - especially Rotom-W since Heatran fears hydro pump.

3. Max speed timid heatran (or heatran in general, since they frequently switch in on mine and I'm not max+ speed so I have to switch out). Snorlax can absorb all of his attacks except explosion, but I have trouble predicting what to do. Snorlax is really important to my team, but so is Rotom, and if I switch to him while the opponent switches to e.g. Scizor I'm screwed.

4. Probably others I haven't encountered yet (or don't remember)

Questions:
1. Should I change rotom to rotom-H and change Heatran to a bulky water, e.g., Suicune? Vaporeon? Suicune's bulk would be useful, but Vaporeon could pass wishes to Dragonite to nullify SR damage. The only problem with this is that I would miss both having a fire immunity with Flash Fire and having a steel type to halve explosion.

2. Is there a way to make Dragonite bulky while preserving his ability to sweep late-game? Or to replace him with someone else to do that job without taking so much from SR? I need something to outspeed scarfgon to KO with outrage, but late game this Dragonite often has to take a hit while he uses agility (so he can then KO back the next turn) so then he's faster than scarfgon when my opponent brings him in.

3. Should I give Celebi HP Ice instead of Fire? Or Earth Power to hit Heatran?

4. Perhaps Zapdos should be on this team?

----

I'm open to all comments and suggestions! Thanks for reading!
__________________
AKA sr12 on Shoddy!

What pokemon are you...?
  #2    
Old April 29th, 2012, 04:51 PM
PlatinumDude's Avatar
PlatinumDude
Nyeh?
Community Supporter
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Canada
Age: 20
Gender: Male
Nature: Hasty
Send a message via Yahoo to PlatinumDude Send a message via Skype™ to PlatinumDude
Heatran is better off with a Timid nature to let it outspeed several slow Pokemon, like Tyranitar. You can also give it a Shuca Berry to let it take an Earthquake or Earth Power.

For Rotom-W, just max out its Special Attack.

For Dragonite, use Dragon Dance over Agility. While DD does provide a smaller Speed boost, it also provides an Attack boost. However, Salamence does it better due to higher Speed, but Dragonite's bulk gives it a niche over it:
-Dragon Dance
-Outrage/Dragon Claw
-Earthquake
-Fire Punch/ExtremeSpeed
Nature: Adamant/Jolly
EVs: 252 Atk/4 Def/252 Spe
Item: Life Orb/Lum Berry

or
-Dragon Dance
-Dragon Claw/Outrage
-Earthquake/Fire Punch
-Roost
Nature: Adamant/Jolly
EVs: 252 HP/44 Atk/212 Spe
Item: Leftovers

If you want to maintain a mixed set, use this. Thunderbolt doesn't provide noteworthy coverage apart from Gyarados or Vaporeon:
-Draco Meteor
-Flamethrower/Fire Blast
-Superpower/Earthquake
-Roost/ExtremSpeed
Nature: Mild/Lonely
EVs: 56 Atk/252 SAtk/200 Spe
Item: Life Orb
__________________

  #3    
Old April 29th, 2012, 04:59 PM
SoulRed12
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Gender:
Nature: Modest
Quote:
Heatran is better off with a Timid nature to let it outspeed several slow Pokemon, like Tyranitar. You can also give it a Shuca Berry to let it take an Earthquake or Earth Power.
I really like this idea. Shuca berry would let it function against its supposed "counters". I'm also considering scrapping Toxic for HP Ice. That would let Heatran stay in and actually do something to Scarfgon.

Quote:
For Dragonite, use Dragon Dance over Agility. While DD does provide a smaller Speed boost, it also provides an Attack boost. However, Salamence does it better due to higher Speed, but Dragonite's bulk gives it a niche over it:
Isn't Salamence uber now? Anyway, I'll go a few rounds with each of those sets you provided and see which one works best for me.

Thanks for the response, you're awesome how you respond to almost all the RMT threads and have great ideas each time.
__________________
AKA sr12 on Shoddy!

What pokemon are you...?
  #4    
Old April 29th, 2012, 05:22 PM
PlatinumDude's Avatar
PlatinumDude
Nyeh?
Community Supporter
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Canada
Age: 20
Gender: Male
Nature: Hasty
Send a message via Yahoo to PlatinumDude Send a message via Skype™ to PlatinumDude
Quote:
Originally Posted by SoulRed12 View Post
I really like this idea. Shuca berry would let it function against its supposed "counters". I'm also considering scrapping Toxic for HP Ice. That would let Heatran stay in and actually do something to Scarfgon.


Isn't Salamence uber now? Anyway, I'll go a few rounds with each of those sets you provided and see which one works best for me.

Thanks for the response, you're awesome how you respond to almost all the RMT threads and have great ideas each time.
Whoops, I forgot Salamence was Uber in Gen IV. My bad.

Oh, and if you want to have Dragonite deal with Scarfgon with any of the listed Dragon Dance sets below, you'll have to DD up twice to outspeed it.
__________________

  #5    
Old May 2nd, 2012, 04:21 AM
tj4bigred's Avatar
tj4bigred
Instant Classic
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Omaha, Nebraska
Gender: Male
Nature: Quiet
Assuming you can keep the rocks away, Dragonite has the bulk to set up DDs easier.

And if Celebi is frozen, just switch out. Its ability is really useful. =P

Last edited by tj4bigred; May 2nd, 2012 at 09:44 AM.
  #6    
Old May 2nd, 2012, 02:40 PM
SoulRed12
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Gender:
Nature: Modest
Quote:
Originally Posted by tj4bigred View Post
Assuming you can keep the rocks away, Dragonite has the bulk to set up DDs easier.

And if Celebi is frozen, just switch out. Its ability is really useful. =P
Haha. To be honest, when this happened, I totally forgot about his ability >_< But, I was at +2, so, I was continually hoping he would thaw out and KO a stupid ludicolo on a rain dance team I was battling. I love obliterating rain dance teams so it was doubly disappointing lol

On another note, I noticed that none of my pokemon meet the base 100 speed benchmark (except Celebi, but she's not EV'd in speed so...) and thus I am considering changing Celebi to the tinkerbell support set with thunder wave (t-wave / leaf storm / HP fire / Recover). Does that sound like a good idea or should I keep the CM version for a bulky special sweeper (or go for the NP version, for a straight up special sweeper)?
__________________
AKA sr12 on Shoddy!

What pokemon are you...?
 
Quick Reply

Sponsored Links


Advertise here
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Minimum Characters Per Post: 25



All times are UTC -8. The time now is 03:24 AM.


Style by Nymphadora, artwork by Sa-Dui.
Like our Facebook Page Follow us on Twitter © 2002 - 2014 The PokéCommunity™, pokecommunity.com.
Pokémon characters and images belong to The Pokémon Company International and Nintendo. This website is in no way affiliated with or endorsed by Nintendo, Creatures, GAMEFREAK, The Pokémon Company or The Pokémon Company International. We just love Pokémon.
All forum styles, their images (unless noted otherwise) and site designs are © 2002 - 2014 The PokéCommunity / PokéCommunity.com.
PokéCommunity™ is a trademark of The PokéCommunity. All rights reserved. Sponsor advertisements do not imply our endorsement of that product or service. User generated content remains the property of its creator.