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Pokémon Gaming Central For topics that aren't necessarily restricted to one game, Pokémon Gaming Central ranges from comparing and contrasting the differences in the gaming generations to discussing the gaming franchise as a whole.


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  #1    
Old November 6th, 2012, 09:18 PM
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Dragons breathing fire is fine...
Psychics learning rock throw is fine (actually makes more sense than rock types doing it)...
Non-ghost types using body slam is fine...

But
Wigglytuff learning Thunderbolt?
Arbok learning Fire Fang?
Azumarill learning Toxic?

Come on Game Freak... this is really annoying. Personally I only teach my Pokemon moves that I could imagine them using. Teaching them inappropriate moves ruins imagination, and playing a Pokemon game without using your imagination is pointless. You might as well be seeing how many times you can tap your thumb against your finger in the space of 2 hours.

This is one of the few bad things from the first generation that has clung on because of all the trading between games, and it's a great shame.
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Old November 6th, 2012, 11:52 PM
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It honestly doesn't bother me. In fact, I enjoy imagining why/how a Pokemon would know an attack of a different type.

Wigglytuff learning Thunderbolt? It's partially based off a balloon. Static electricity, anyone?
Arbok learning Fire Fang? Well he's got the teeth; maybe he can utilize fire in his body somehow to a small degree.
Azumarill learning Toxic? All Pokemon that can utilize TMs can learn Toxic, which brings up a whole other category of conspiracy theories and creepypastas altogether!

It's also mentioned in various sources that Normal-types, while plain, are still able to utilize moves of many different types, which adds to their uniqueness.

Just because a Pokemon has one type doesn't mean it can't utilize other abilities. You even mentioned a good example, with some Psychic-types who may learn Rock Throw. Pretty much all learned moves make sense if you take into account all options and think about it for a bit; at least that's what I've noticed.
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  #3    
Old November 7th, 2012, 12:59 AM
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Wow, I've got to partially agree with both of the posts above me. It's as Rivvon says, part of the fun is imagining why a Pokemon can learn a specific attack. But then again, it is really annoying when you can't think of any reason, for example, Diglett learning Aerial Ace...
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Old November 7th, 2012, 01:07 AM
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No, of course not. Why, it even gives them a lot of advantage over their weaknesses! For instance, Tangrowth - a pure grass-type, is not completely useless against ALL of its weaknesses as it is able to learn Rock Slide - a rock-type move, which counters fire, ice, bug AND flying types.

This does get a tad annoying though as the opponent might come out with a move that can KO your pokemon which is super-effective against it. Surprise surprise. :/

Well, it's a double-edged sword. Use it to its full potential but prepare to face it as well.
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Old November 7th, 2012, 01:34 AM
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One of things I love about this is so Pokemon can have moves that can counter their type disadvantages.

For example, Reuniclus can use Focus Blast to counter Dark-types that would otherwise be immune to its Psychic-type attacks.

Some opponents also love to abuse the diverse movepools to take their competitors by surprise, and Normal-types, despite being plain have amazing movepools to make up for it.
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  #6    
Old November 7th, 2012, 03:00 AM
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I actually posted something about the "toxic" issue on another thread...Let's see where it was...

Quote:
Toxic being spread to all Pokemon is most likely because of animals and objects being able to carry diseases that make you sick. Bites from any wild animal can have rabies or bacteria which causes you to become sick.

The Komodo Dragon are well known for their bites since they have many different types of disease carrying microbes in their mouths that when they bite you, if you don't get some sort of shot right away, you could lose the limb just for that.

Then for the inanimate, you have bacteria that settles on dirty surfaces, when handled improperly you can make yourself sick.

I think that's why Toxic is a Universal TM.

There is only one other move that I can think of that can inflict Badly Poisoned and its strictly to Poisonous Pokemon.
and
Quote:
Most creatures, the poison is a natural part of their biology so they are naturally immune to their own poisons. Toxic doesn't have to be the same toxins for every Pokemon. Medically each Pokemon would produce its own poison with the attack that their bodies are naturally immune to.


Humans are similar with Blood types and donors. Others may not accept the organs or blood safely even being matching types. Auto-immune disease in cases like these aren't as common, but possible.

Then you have genetic illness carriers who are immune to the disease themselves, but still carry the gene that carries it.

As for Komodo, they can easily be anything else if the creators want it to be. I can see on as Pure Dragon based on name, Dark due to way they hunt and because of how they are mentally, they could be Water or Grass due to habitat.

Its based on what the creator would want for it.

Most common WOULD be poison. XD Even I made a Poison/Dragon Komodo Fakemon.
Pokemon learning Poison attacks is actually the easiest to explain with those two above.

For others, its affinity. When you think of basic Monsters from RPG there are some that have better affinities than others. In Pokemon's Case Normal types usually have the best affinity and learn a multitude of type attacks to make up for their neutral disposition.

Some moves you have to look past their Anime version or localized/translated namesake. In terms of Aerial Ace or Swallow Return, is based off a Japanese Sword style where they user attacks at a high speed and returns the blade back to its original position quickly. The attack was developed after watchin a Swallow hunt which is where it got its name. The Anime version sorta bastardizes the attack into a high flying never miss attack, but all it is is a quick hit and run attack that's hard to dodge. Even a Diglett could do it by popping underground and attacking the unaware opponent.

Its hard to give it form against a Pokemon with Levitate or one always shown flying, but if you are creative enough it can make sense once you push past what is normally shown since a lot of Pokemon use attacks differently or attacks have changed over the 15 years of Pokemon.

When you are as open with your thoughts like that, no...none of the attacks seem out of place in anyone's move pools at all.

My friend always questioned how a Trapinch was capable of using gust when they are depicted as wingless insects. I usually made the joke that Trapinch had a really powerful burp. XD

Anything can be possible with Pokemon sometimes you can look at it logically sometimes you cannot and have to go the magic route and just accept it.
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Old November 7th, 2012, 03:35 AM
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In red raticate can learn water gun and mankey can learn thunderbolt it didn't bother me i found it hilarious.
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  #8    
Old November 7th, 2012, 06:43 AM
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Pokemon only learning their own STAB moves would kill the strategic aspect of the game completely. A pokemon's movepool is a deciding factor of their battling viability. This is why pokemon like Smeargle and Mew are so fun to use and are actually quite useful despite them being outclassed by other pokemon otherwise.
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Old November 7th, 2012, 10:12 AM
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This doesn't bother me. Some Pokemon are able to learn moves of other types to better handle types that they're weak to. For instance, Dragon Pokemon are able to learn Flamethrower and Fire Blast to cover the Steel Pokemon that would wall them and the Ice Pokemon they're weak to.

Also, as some others said, a Pokemon learning their STAB moves alone will leave them seriously walled by types they're weak to, so they have moves of other types to help hit them neutrally or supereffectively.
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Old November 7th, 2012, 10:32 AM
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Well depends on the logic of the attacks. Like Diglett or Dugtrio using scratch? ..How?
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  #11    
Old November 7th, 2012, 11:07 AM
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I LOVE crazy stuff like that. I relish in it. It gives Pokemon much more moveset diversity and coverage against other types it normally wouldn't have anything to hit it with. I think it's fantastic. :) -hugs Aqua Tail Gligar-
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  #12    
Old November 7th, 2012, 12:22 PM
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Originally Posted by LilJz1234 View Post
Well depends on the logic of the attacks. Like Diglett or Dugtrio using scratch? ..How?
The dug family learns Arial Ace...
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  #13    
Old November 7th, 2012, 08:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sunshinesan View Post
The dug family learns Arial Ace...
I actually really like XanderO's explanation of that a few posts up. I hadn't realized Aerial Ace's Japanese name was Swallow Return; knowing that, it makes a lot more sense as to why Pokemon like Diglett can learn it!

The Japanese names really do help in understanding why some Pokemon learn certain moves...or, reversely, it helps understand more about the Pokemon that is using it. For instance, I couldn't really determine what, besides a humanoid, Jynx could be based off of, but after reading that her signature attack "Lovely Kiss" is "Demon Kiss" in Japanese, the correlation between her and a succubus made a lot more sense.

Another example of that would be Hoppip learning Splash. Some people might think that it doesn't make sense, but its Japanese name is actually "Hop."
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  #14    
Old November 8th, 2012, 10:07 AM
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I don't really think of it like "Would it be possible?", I just think of it on how useful I think I'll find that Pokémon having that move. "Fang" moves in general I like, it's a way of Pokémon with fangs (or just teeth) to learn some moves from other types. Same goes for the "Punch" moves. So no, it doesn't really bother me.
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Old November 8th, 2012, 01:50 PM
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I don't think that it really bothers me per se, but I always found it more interesting than anything when a Pokemon can learn moves that are of it's type disadvantage. For example, I always though it was funny when I had a Lombre that knew Fire Punch and Ice Beam on Emerald, even though it was a Water/Grass type Pokemon.
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Old November 8th, 2012, 06:32 PM
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There's just something about looking at a moveset full of different colors that makes me happy. So yeah I definitely like the fact that Pokemon can be diverse, for the most part. I actually wish that some of the other Pokemon had more diverse movesets, i.e. most of the Grass types. :P
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Old November 8th, 2012, 06:44 PM
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No. Not at all. Pokemon should be able to learn what they are supposed to learn based on their typing (true) and their looks/species.
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Old November 8th, 2012, 06:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rivvon View Post
I actually really like XanderO's explanation of that a few posts up. I hadn't realized Aerial Ace's Japanese name was Swallow Return; knowing that, it makes a lot more sense as to why Pokemon like Diglett can learn it!

The Japanese names really do help in understanding why some Pokemon learn certain moves...or, reversely, it helps understand more about the Pokemon that is using it. For instance, I couldn't really determine what, besides a humanoid, Jynx could be based off of, but after reading that her signature attack "Lovely Kiss" is "Demon Kiss" in Japanese, the correlation between her and a succubus made a lot more sense.

Another example of that would be Hoppip learning Splash. Some people might think that it doesn't make sense, but its Japanese name is actually "Hop."
Yep, it's like Mr.Mime's name. His Japanese name is Barrierd, but in the English version he's called Mr.Mime because during Gen I, they didn't implement genders with the Pokemon yet.
But Diglett using scratch?? haha '
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Old November 9th, 2012, 06:48 AM
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It bothers me that they don't have some of the more improbable combinations in the anime, to be honest. I would LOVE to see a Gastly in the anime use any kind of punch attack...or, better yet, a Gastly that knows nothing but punch moves and can't use any of them, leading to no end of frustration. It's amusing trying to imagine it, and it'd be very boring if they couldn't use different elemental moves.

The only time it bothers me, to be honest, is when it catches me out. Thinking you've got it covered, and then all of a sudden you're getting hit by a move of a different element that just happens to be super effective, and down you go. That's more than a little irritating.
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Old November 10th, 2012, 11:37 AM
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It gives Pokemon more versatility.
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Old November 10th, 2012, 04:06 PM
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While there are a few isolated incidents that make me go 'huh?' when I learn that a Pokemon can learn a certain move (e.g. Rhydon/Rhyperior and Surf), for the most part, I revel in the wider movepools and try to exploit them whenever possible. Hikari mentioned Reuniclus and Focus Blast, which is a great example of a move that seems illogical on the face of it, but makes a great deal of sense when you think about it in greater detail. The other points about limiting potential strategies have already been mentioned, but I also agree with them as well. Also, in any event, isn't it kinda fun when you learn that something like Octillery can learn Flamethrower? That's just awesome to me. :D
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Old November 10th, 2012, 10:42 PM
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Torros can learn 14 of the 17 types. He is the Son of Arceus.

I think becaus EVERY Pokemon can learn Toxic, and becasue Toxis is STRONGER than regular poisoning, that Toxic is an artifical poison applied to the Pokemon. Even Manemite can Toxic, he isn't making his own, his trainer is painting him in poison.
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Old November 10th, 2012, 10:57 PM
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I can't say that it bothers me that much except a few mentioned above.But yesterday i was playing pokemon when battling a random swimmer my pokemon used dig..while on water...wouldn't that technically be dive?
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Old November 10th, 2012, 11:09 PM
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It doens't bother me at all. Without the move diversity, then battles would be boring, and really predictable. I think having a variety of moves, and having Pokemon learn moves not necessarily of their type enables them to cover their weakness and exploit others'.
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Old December 9th, 2012, 07:02 AM
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I tend to look at it as a "hidden potential" kind of. Like it was mentioned in the OP, Arbok using fire fang. Arbok realized it can use its venom in such a way that it feels like it's burning, without causing any poison damage to its foe.
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