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Pokémon Gaming Central For topics that aren't necessarily restricted to one game, Pokémon Gaming Central ranges from comparing and contrasting the differences in the gaming generations to discussing the gaming franchise as a whole.

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  #851    
Old November 6th, 2012, 05:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by XanderO View Post
Thanks to Pokemon Special a lot of people are in support that Kris got renamed like "Gold" did. In Special Kris is Lyra and there are a lot of noticible similarities between the two with how similar their clothes are (Not very close but its similar enough to warrent support) and that they have nearly identical hair styles.

Since both May and Brendan were core characters to the beginning of the generation I don't think we'll see them replaced.

Kris, Lyra, and Leaf are add in characters that don't exist in the originals. (possibly why Kris would get the rename and wardrobe change)
I used to think that but according to Lyra's bulbapedia page the one who came up with her said he made her from scratch...

Yeah it'll be too weird if they did drop either of the two considering how iconic they are to us.

So does anyone think the remakes will have PwT seeing how since they are in the past it could've been the last tournament before the Unova one (which might explain why Iris is missing if they do plan to copy and Paste...well if it's 3D than they'll have to update it's design at least...).
I hope they add something to Shoal cave beyond just getting Snorunt and the bell ingredients.
Also does anyone expect any dex changes? Hoenn's and Kanto's have so far been the only one's never changed (with Kanto always having the original 151).
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  #852    
Old November 6th, 2012, 01:11 PM
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Originally Posted by Magmaruby and Aquasapphire View Post
The clothing change will proably be as big as the one's Red and Gold/Ethan had between their originals and the remakes.
Does anyone think either May or Brendan will be replaced like Kris was? I think (and hope) that won't happen, especially seeing how the two were in all three versions unlike Leaf who was in the none of the originals, and Kris who was only in the third.
Why did they replace Kris? She looked cool in the official artwork for the old games, didn't she?

Last edited by RandomDSdevel; November 6th, 2012 at 01:17 PM. Reason: Text Clarification
  #853    
Old November 6th, 2012, 01:12 PM
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No I think the PWT will be a B2W2 exclusive. Like how the original Contests and Secret Bases were exclusive to R/S, how Super Contests were exclusive to D/P/Pt, and how the Pokethon was Exclusive to HG/SS. R/S/E already has the Battle Frontier that they can play around with. They'd most likely just improve on that.

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Originally Posted by RandomDSdevel View Post
Why did they replace Kris? I liked her sprite; it looked cool.
She wasn't the original Character. If you believe that Lyra is Kris like a few in the fandom do, then she just got renamed like Gold did when they started calling him Ethan in HG/SS. If you believe that Kris and Lyra are two different people, then its because Kris isn't the original character from Generation 2. She was a supplemented character to give the players a female choice. Thus making Lyra and Kris the same as Leaf, an unimportant character created for the sake of adding a female role to a game that didn't originally have one.

Last edited by Khrysta; November 6th, 2012 at 01:20 PM.
  #854    
Old November 6th, 2012, 03:56 PM
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I wouldn't be too surprised to see the Battle Dome transformed into the PWT though, you could have also said the BF was Emerald exclusive, although I agree with you about them bringing back the BF, its always good to look at both sides ya know

I think they will bring back the Frontier, but replace the dome with PWT, since their similar and the Dome is missing the Leaders and that's it, people really love the PWT, fantastic addition to the aftergame.



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  #855    
Old November 6th, 2012, 04:27 PM
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  #856    
Old November 6th, 2012, 04:39 PM
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Originally Posted by KingCyndaquil View Post
I wouldn't be too surprised to see the Battle Dome transformed into the PWT though, you could have also said the BF was Emerald exclusive, although I agree with you about them bringing back the BF, its always good to look at both sides ya know

I think they will bring back the Frontier, but replace the dome with PWT, since their similar and the Dome is missing the Leaders and that's it, people really love the PWT, fantastic addition to the aftergame.
If you think about it, 3rd and 4th Gens' battle frontiers are both fundamentally different so each has an exclusive right in each game. While the names of the full frontier are the same, the actual facilities minus the Tower, are different.
  #857    
Old November 7th, 2012, 12:27 AM
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Originally Posted by XanderO View Post
If you think about it, 3rd and 4th Gens' battle frontiers are both fundamentally different so each has an exclusive right in each game. While the names of the full frontier are the same, the actual facilities minus the Tower, are different.
And the Battle Factory (don't forget the battle factory).
It would be nice if the PWT was added into the dome as a different layer challenge. One stage we can battle the normal trainers than the fb for our symbol, the other we battle the gym leaders, and champions...maybe even the E4.
Also I think the unique thing of BWB2W2 is the Subway...that I can't see them adding to Hoenn in anyway. (ps the super contests were simply enhanced contests). Speaking of contests do you think the dress up section will be added into Hoenn's but the appeal system stays the same as the original games (with combo's and such).
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  #858    
Old November 7th, 2012, 12:51 AM
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I think they'd go back to the original version. The Dance version was what separated the Contests and Super Contests. While Gen 4's wasn't written off as "advanced" we accepted that. Gen 4's Super Contests was a play on Gen 3's Contests with a different spin on how it should have been conducted. That's how I see it.

And honestly, I just don't want PWT in the remakes. I'd rather that be an exclusive to B2W2 and maybe added to future Generations. None of the past Remakes had anything major from current games added into them from what I remember. FR/LG got the Tower, but that was an end game bonus. HG/SS's Tower was changed into the Frontier just like R/S's Tower was transformed into the Frontier. Really in HG/SS's case it was an update rather than including something new.

New things we got in past remakes were, New Islands and Mini Games as well as Berry Powder for FR/LG and Newer areas, Safari Zone (Which still existed but was said to have moved in the original one. The old one was still there just closed), and Pokethon. HG/SS didn't even get the Sevii Islands which brings to question if they were really Canon or just an addition to the games as added data to fill up the cartridge.

I'm hoping that the Remakes are close to the original Ruby and Sapphire as much as possible with a few tweaks and additions as possible.

Which brings another question...Will they add Cold Rock, Moss Rock, and highly magnetized area to the remakes or go the way of FR/LG and force you to port over to another game to evolve Eevee into Leafeon/Glaceon and Nosepass and Magneton into Probopass and Magnezone since neither of those evolution methods are in the original games, nor are there areas that fit with possible locations.

FR/LG didn't have a proper time system despite having the "Find a Berry on the ground after x amount of time has passed" and the beach combing on First Island. You had those two time based events but you couldn't evolve Eevee into Espeon or Umbreon since there was no Night and Day system. HG/SS locked away evolution methods as well as breeding methods despite the Basic form of the incense babies being in the game. (The incense babies were not part of the Johtodex from what I remember. and Incenses weren't findable until you had beaten the game and attained Rock Climb.)

Last edited by Khrysta; November 7th, 2012 at 12:57 AM.
  #859    
Old November 7th, 2012, 04:02 AM
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Personally I believe RSe remakes will come for 3DS and still be marketed as a "5th Generation". They would likely just improve on the graphics and make it 3D. Gen 6 is really when 3D improvements will be shown.
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  #860    
Old November 7th, 2012, 10:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by XanderO View Post
Which brings another question...Will they add Cold Rock, Moss Rock, and highly magnetized area to the remakes or go the way of FR/LG and force you to port over to another game to evolve Eevee into Leafeon/Glaceon and Nosepass and Magneton into Probopass and Magnezone since neither of those evolution methods are in the original games, nor are there areas that fit with possible locations.
Theyll add a Moss-Rock-Piece/shard/thingie item some gen anyway.
  #861    
Old November 7th, 2012, 11:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by XanderO View Post
She was a supplemented character to give the players a female choice. Thus making Lyra and Kris the same as Leaf, an unimportant character created for the sake of adding a female role to a game that didn't originally have one.
Well they originally had a female role planned for Gen I but it got cut out due to limitations or something, so I wouldn't really say it's the same case. I doubt they'd change May and Brendan anyway due to them really being the first properly named protagonists(May also was a big part of the anime, unlike the females of the first 2 gens).

I also think the Moss rock, Cold rock, etc. will be included. Deep in Shoal Cave could be the location of the Cold Rock, Petalburg Woods could be the location of Moss Rock, and maybe New Mauville for the magnetic evolutions? The problem I see with the last one is how they'd have to prevent you from evolving Magneton(Magnemite are gotten there) if they don't intend on expanding the Dex to include new evos from the start.

As for Day/Night, they could be easily implemented because, although there was no real day/night, they could evolve depending on the time of day.


On another note, I hope the Battle Frontier facilities run in a similar way, just with the needed tweaks to bring it up-to-date.
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  #862    
Old November 7th, 2012, 12:12 PM
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Originally Posted by C Payne View Post
The problem I see with the last one is how they'd have to prevent you from evolving Magneton(Magnemite are gotten there) if they don't intend on expanding the Dex to include new evos from the start.
Lol why wouldn't they?

Had no problem adding Tangrowth, Yanmega, Mamoswine, Lickilicky, Ambipom to Johto-dex.

Unless itd be too strong for when you get to ~30 lvls?? Doubt it since you can get an Alakazam at lv.16 etc....Chargestone cave in BW2 wasnt a problem either.


The only thing that I dont like about this is how Banette doesnt evolve
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  #863    
Old November 7th, 2012, 01:34 PM
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Originally Posted by MiTjA View Post
The only thing that I dont like about this is how Banette doesnt evolve
He's not the only non-legendary Pokémon who doesn't currently evolve, is he? Whichever other Pokémon don't have evolutions should gain them in the RSE remakes or Generation VI.
  #864    
Old November 7th, 2012, 01:52 PM
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Originally Posted by RandomDSdevel View Post
He's not the only non-legendary Pokémon who doesn't currently evolve, is he? Whichever other Pokémon don't have evolutions should gain them in the RSE remakes or Generation VI.
Let me clarify, just in case.. I said Banette, because its counterpart, Dusclops, got an evolution after RSE.
The only other one from Hoenn this has happened to is, Skarmory not getting a "Mantyke", but Mantine was not found in RSE so it doesn't matter in this case.


Just remembered Roserade <3
Roselias would actually be useful for a Hoenn journey with that!
  #865    
Old November 7th, 2012, 02:10 PM
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That's if they don't keep those locations locked up...like say a secret part of the Petalburg woods we can't access until post game, etc. Though again Eevee isn't even a Hoenn pokemon so that'll be how it'll work (strangely B2W2 had the locations restricted until post game places despite all eeveelutions being in the dex). If anyone is added it'll proably be Magnezone. Roselia proably won't be able to get the stone needed until post game...
Also does anyone think there'll be a mission post game to trade with BWB2W2 like there was one with FrLG and RS. It's possible seeing how Unova is so far away...they could make us establish a far distant link using a Black Stone and White stone etc.
Also I wonder how we'll get the DNA Splicers in game for the new Kyurem forms...I guess Drake could give them to us, or perhaps they'll be in Meteor falls in a secret room (the last one seems most possible to me), maybe Kyurem can be in game too through an event like how DPG can be obtained through the Arceus event.
Ps: Does anyone see GF adding any new forms? FrLg were the only remakes thus far to introduce a new form (Deoxys A and D forms) so it might happen again...though I heavily doubt it.
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  #866    
Old November 7th, 2012, 07:23 PM
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If they do make RS remakes, they should include E too.

I also think they should add the battle frontier from the anime, changed up a bit.
The battle frontier that is actually in the game, although a good idea, its not incorporated very well. The way it worked in the anime was better imo
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  #867    
Old November 7th, 2012, 08:11 PM
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Originally Posted by XanderO View Post
I don't think Gamefreak wants to do one massive game. They've put it off and even told fans that they had no intent on making one, when it was brought up as a home game issue. Even if the storage capacity is higher they'd probably have to sacrifice a lot to be able to fit more than 2 region into the game carts. Given that there is a lot of codin that has to go along with the region itself.

Tiles change with time and weather, individual grass movement, music, Pokemon spawns, and individual region events, not to mention they'd have to start adding in a lot of new information to make up for the lack of story for each region and have to give everyone a valid reason to attend each region.

By the time you are through half of the third region, you also have a high chance of being level 100, which leaves the 4th and 5th region with nothing but level 100s which isn't very appealing to everyone.

You also have gamefreak's signature reason for making games to consider. We'd get 2 games missing a lot of Pokemon from one game to keep connectivity between the two games. Gamefreak will pull out a lot of pokemon to force players to trade between games and that could become an unappealing part of the game itself.

There is too much to think about when it comes to merging all the regions into one that in the end its too much work for little possible prize.

Home Consol, MMO, Mash up of the regions is an idea that all fans have had in the past, but its an idea with a lot of potential to kill the franchise only in the it gets harder to update department because if they release a new region they have to re-release the master game with all the new Pokemon, attacks, items, character, music, events (or even more new events).

Too much hassle, not enough positive feedback on it.
I definitely understand why they wouldn't want a home console release, and they probably wouldn't utilize all regions in one game, but it is possible to include 2-3 regions and still not have the opposing Pokemon be all at LV100 (which I also realize is a huge obstacle in creating these huge "mash-up" games). As for pulling out Pokemon for the "two-game" feature, people already find that either great or horrible, and I don't think their opinion would change too much, especially when having fun running from region to region.

The "lack of story," though, is exactly the reason why I bring up that possibility. Having more regions will allow for more experiments with the story, which is honestly what the franchise needs right now.

And as for "rereleasing the master game" when an update happens, the 3DS is compatible with DLC. I'm not entirely sure how that would work, because as you've said they would be pushing it in terms of data space, but it's certainly not an impossible thing.

I really wouldn't be surprised if we saw a new game with Hoenn as an extra region, with that in itself serving as our remakes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Heracles4 View Post
If they do make RS remakes, they should include E too.
All remakes we've had so far are actually the third version remade but with the version differences of the first two games applied to them. For instance, the Eusine and Suicune sub-plot in HGSS.

As to how that will work with RS remakes, I don't know, but it's almost certain we will see some elements of Emerald in there as well.

Last edited by Rivvon; November 7th, 2012 at 08:22 PM.
  #868    
Old November 7th, 2012, 09:41 PM
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Originally Posted by Rivvon View Post
I definitely understand why they wouldn't want a home console release, and they probably wouldn't utilize all regions in one game, but it is possible to include 2-3 regions and still not have the opposing Pokemon be all at LV100 (which I also realize is a huge obstacle in creating these huge "mash-up" games). As for pulling out Pokemon for the "two-game" feature, people already find that either great or horrible, and I don't think their opinion would change too much, especially when having fun running from region to region.

The "lack of story," though, is exactly the reason why I bring up that possibility. Having more regions will allow for more experiments with the story, which is honestly what the franchise needs right now.

And as for "rereleasing the master game" when an update happens, the 3DS is compatible with DLC. I'm not entirely sure how that would work, because as you've said they would be pushing it in terms of data space, but it's certainly not an impossible thing.

I really wouldn't be surprised if we saw a new game with Hoenn as an extra region, with that in itself serving as our remakes.



All remakes we've had so far are actually the third version remade but with the version differences of the first two games applied to them. For instance, the Eusine and Suicune sub-plot in HGSS.

As to how that will work with RS remakes, I don't know, but it's almost certain we will see some elements of Emerald in there as well.

DS games were compatible with DLC. Pokemon B/W and B2W2 Has Downloadable content. If you mean data added to the game that didn't exist in the original game like say Hearthfire or Dawnguard for Skyrim, I don't think they are that compatible as force feeding new data into a chip like that corrodes the data unlike a disc where the save files are stored separately and the DLC doesn't effect the original game data at all. I haven't seen any DS or 3DS games with full DLC that wasn't already programmed into the games in some way shape or form and just needed the DLC to unlock items or creatures to fully activate them, like all of the Pokemon Downloads from B/W/D/P/Pt/HG/SS.


As for thirds always appearing in the remakes, that isn't completely true. Even though Yellow was a Fourth title in Japan it is acknowledged to be the Third Title to Pokemon everywhere else and none of the extra changes from Yellow were added into FR/LG.

While I do support that Emerald's Magma Hideout and Rayquaza being able to stop the fight should be added, we don't have definitive proof that they will be there. Gamefreak can always just ignore the events of Emerald since they are already identical to the events in Ruby and Sapphire.
  #869    
Old November 7th, 2012, 09:45 PM
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"All remakes we've had so far are actually the third version remade but with the version differences of the first two games applied to them. For instance, the Eusine and Suicune sub-plot in HGSS.

As to how that will work with RS remakes, I don't know, but it's almost certain we will see some elements of Emerald in there as well."

It will probably be similar to HGSS. Where all three legendaries are available in the game but you can only capture the version mascot before the Elite four and the other 2 after. The only thing I want to see is an expanded upon aftergame, I think Emerald's aftergame left much more to be desired then the Battle Frontier.
  #870    
Old November 7th, 2012, 10:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rivvon View Post
I definitely understand why they wouldn't want a home console release, and they probably wouldn't utilize all regions in one game, but it is possible to include 2-3 regions and still not have the opposing Pokemon be all at LV100 (which I also realize is a huge obstacle in creating these huge "mash-up" games). As for pulling out Pokemon for the "two-game" feature, people already find that either great or horrible, and I don't think their opinion would change too much, especially when having fun running from region to region.
Random idea, but if we want a new console pokemon game then Bethseda should make it. Admit it, you think it would be epic too.



Quote:
All remakes we've had so far are actually the third version remade but with the version differences of the first two games applied to them.
I never noticed any Yellow elements in FR/LG.
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  #871    
Old November 7th, 2012, 10:05 PM
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Originally Posted by XanderO View Post
DS games were compatible with DLC. Pokemon B/W and B2W2 Has Downloadable content. If you mean data added to the game that didn't exist in the original game like say Hearthfire or Dawnguard for Skyrim, I don't think they are that compatible as force feeding new data into a chip like that corrodes the data unlike a disc where the save files are stored separately and the DLC doesn't effect the original game data at all. I haven't seen any DS or 3DS games with full DLC that wasn't already programmed into the games in some way shape or form and just needed the DLC to unlock items or creatures to fully activate them, like all of the Pokemon Downloads from B/W/D/P/Pt/HG/SS.


As for thirds always appearing in the remakes, that isn't completely true. Even though Yellow was a Fourth title in Japan it is acknowledged to be the Third Title to Pokemon everywhere else and none of the extra changes from Yellow were added into FR/LG.

While I do support that Emerald's Magma Hideout and Rayquaza being able to stop the fight should be added, we don't have definitive proof that they will be there. Gamefreak can always just ignore the events of Emerald since they are already identical to the events in Ruby and Sapphire.
Okay, I didn't realize that about the DLCs corroding data on a cartridge. Scratch my idea for the time being, then.

As for Yellow Version, I do understand that it's recognized as the "international" third version, but I don't think Game Freak was considering that too much, or else we would have gotten "AquaBlue" and not "LeafGreen." Also realize that at the end of the day, Yellow Version is really an anime spin-off done in the style of the main series of games. Because of that, its canonity is debated among fans and probably did not get as much focus from Game Freak as Blue Version when working on FireRed and LeafGreen.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Emrald View Post
"All remakes we've had so far are actually the third version remade but with the version differences of the first two games applied to them. For instance, the Eusine and Suicune sub-plot in HGSS.

As to how that will work with RS remakes, I don't know, but it's almost certain we will see some elements of Emerald in there as well."

It will probably be similar to HGSS. Where all three legendaries are available in the game but you can only capture the version mascot before the Elite four and the other 2 after. The only thing I want to see is an expanded upon aftergame, I think Emerald's aftergame left much more to be desired then the Battle Frontier.
You could catch both mascots in the original Gold and Silver, so I don't think that was specifically brought in from Crystal.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. X View Post
I never noticed any Yellow elements in FR/LG.
Yellow is a spin-off of the anime, and the fourth game of generation 1. Blue is the third version of gen 1, and all it really changed were the sprites and some in-game trades.

Last edited by Rivvon; November 7th, 2012 at 10:08 PM. Reason: so many quotes
  #872    
Old November 7th, 2012, 10:18 PM
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With how they were released, its hard to determine.

I think it was Red and Green for Japan, and Red and Blue for the US.

In the release countries, same day release. So, following 3rd release then Blue would be it for Japan, yet Yellow would be it for the US.

For the US, Yellow is technically the 3rd gen 1 game since Green was never released in the US.

...We need a Yellow remake now that I thinks of it.
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  #873    
Old November 7th, 2012, 10:23 PM
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Gamefreak do acknowledge it as a third though. They do call it a third as Blue is Japanese Third and Yellow is International third. There also isn't any difference at all between Red, Blue, or Green so you can't really say that they added the third game to the first two for the remakes when all three were exactly the same.

I didn't see the responses to some of the earlier questions I asked about evolution. Incense babies were specifically not in the HG/SS Pokedex while their Evolutions were. There were also some that evolved by specific stones that weren't in the main story either.

I think Gamefreak is probably going to do the same thing. Those with extra evolutions won't have their evolutions part of the main game Pokedex and will be added National dex, this is like Dusknoir since the Reaper Cloth isn't native to Hoenn. Same for Roselia not getting either her Baby nor her evolution since both items needed and the Pokemon were added in Generation 4.

Togetic couldn't evolve into Togekiss (or at least Togekiss wasn't part of the Pokedex in HG/SS), Wynaut wasn't in HG/SS, Couldn't evolve Magneton into Magnezone (You had to trade Magneton to D/P/Pt in order to evolve it into Magneton same as Eevee in FR/LG), Couldn't get Electivire or Magmortor in HG/SS until you got National Dex either. There are a lot of others like this...

So I'm gunna go with since they aren't originally part of the original game, Moss Rock, Icy Rock, and Magnetic area won't be in the remakes.

As for Eevee thing, R/S/E had a time system. You had to trade Eevee to them to evolve it into Espeon/Umbreon. I brought that up cause it was impossible to evolve eevee in FR/LG because the original R/G/B/Y Didn't have a time system so they didn't add one in the remakes. Apparently Eevee can't evolve into Glaceon or Leafeon on HG/SS either...
  #874    
Old November 8th, 2012, 02:37 AM
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Well you couldn't evolve Magneton to Magnezone in HGSS and Magnemite was included in the Johto dex, the only two which I think you will be able to evolve is Nosepass & Roselia which seems pretty reasonable considering they have quite low stats before they evolve. Maybe you could level Nosepass up at Meteor Falls or something and with Roselia you obtain a Shiny Stone at a later point in the game say Victory Road? or somewhere Post-storyline.
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Old November 8th, 2012, 06:00 AM
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MiTjA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rivvon View Post
All remakes we've had so far are actually the third version remade but with the version differences of the first two games applied to them. For instance, the Eusine and Suicune sub-plot in HGSS.

As to how that will work with RS remakes, I don't know, but it's almost certain we will see some elements of Emerald in there as well.
The extras of Crystal and Emerald are not the same logic.

Conceptually
In Gen II, they added a random forced plot with Suicune for C
In Gen III, they excluded Rayquazas plot for RS
So Crystal was probably decided after GS, whereas they planned RSE with the third version already in mind.

If that makes any sense... GS were complete, with C just adding extra stuff, whereas RS were intentionally lacking the prepared full plot, so E could be the proper version.

My point being that based on
"theyve just added the 'extras' to the initial games for the previous remakes"
you cant assume they will keep this approach, because it is not the same problem.

Id be less surprised really if they decided to remake the third version TOO this time, than if they forced the Rayquaza plot where it doesnt belong.
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