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Competitive Team Help Having trouble with your competitive Pokémon team? Be sure to check here if you need any help on it. Any teams intended for in-game and casual play should be posted in the In-Game Team Help sub-forum.


 
 
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  #1    
Old November 11th, 2012, 09:37 AM
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MellowJello
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Just moved this thread to the correct place. Sorry about that guys XD But here is my team again.

Ok... So currently I am trying to get past the Elite Four so I can get all the power items, pokérus, and all those goodies for EV training so i can get on with building my actual team for competitive. I am kind of new at this stuff, so bear with me. XD So far, this is what my planned team looks like...

Scolipede@Life Orb
Trait: Swarm
Nature: Jolly
EVs:252 speed/252 attack

Megahorn
Rock Slide
Earthquake
Swords Dance



Umbreon@Leftovers
Trait: Synchronize
Nature: Careful
EVs: 252 HP/252 SDef/4 Def

Payback
Toxic
Wish
Protect

Milotic@Leftovers
Trait: Marvel Scale
Nature: Bold
EVs: 248 HP/252 Def/8 Spe

Recover
Scald
Ice Beam
Hypnosis

Reuniclus@Flame Orb
Trait: Magic Guard
Nature: Bold
EVs: 252 Def/252 HP/4 SpDf

Trick
Recover
Focus Blast
Physic



Chandelure@Choice Specs
Nature: Modest
EVs: 120 HP/252 SAtk/8 SDef/128 Spe

Fire Blast
Shadow Ball
Hidden Power (Fighting)
Energy Ball



Ferrothorn@Shed Shell
Trait: Iron Barbs
Nature: Relaxed
EVs: 252 HP/88 Def/168 SDef

Leech Seed
Stealth Rock
Gryoball
Power Whip




Comments? Questions? Thanks guys!!

Last edited by MellowJello; November 12th, 2012 at 10:29 PM. Reason: Revised
  #2    
Old November 11th, 2012, 09:57 AM
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What are your Pokemon's items?

Poison Jab has rather poor coverage on Scolipede; Rock Slide is the better option. Jolly is also preferred on Scolipede to let it outspeed as much as it can.

Umbreon's current is complete Taunt bait. Double Team is frowned upon by competitive players, even though there's nothing wrong with using it in the Battle Subway/World Tournament. It also has better support options out there:
-Wish
-Foul Play/Payback
-Heal Bell/Toxic
-Protect
Nature: Careful
EVs: 252 HP/4 Def/252 SDef
Item: Leftovers

Milotic is better off using a Bold nature with 248 HP/252 Def/8 Spe, since its stats are leaning more towards defense than offense. And in that case, Scald is the better alternative over Surf for the burn chance.

Without Shadow Tag, Gothitelle is seriously mediocre. Musharna is bulkier and stronger, albeit slower:
-Calm Mind
-Psychic
-Signal Beam/Heal Bell/Hidden Power (Fighting)
-Moonlight
Nature: Bold
EVs: 240 HP/252 Def/16 Spe
Item: Leftovers
Ability: Synchronize

or
-Psychic
-Signal Beam/Shadow Ball
-Hidden Power (Ground/Fighting)/Trick Room
-Moonlight
Nature: Modest/Quiet
EVs: 252 HP/252 SAtk/4 Spe
Item: Life Orb
Ability: Synchronize

or
-Psychic
-Moonlight
-Thunder Wave/Baton Pass
-Trick Room/Baton Pass
Nature: Bold
EVs: 240 HP/252 Def/16 SDef
Item: Leftovers
Ability: Synchronize

Chandelure has stronger STAB options than Hex and Flamethrower in Shadow Ball and Fire Blast. Hex is too unreliable, as it only works to its fullest while the opponent is statused. While Chandelure can status with Will-o-Wisp, the opponent could just switch out and the switch-in will be hit by a rather weak 75 BP (base 50 x 1.5 STAB) attack:
-Substitute
-Fire Blast
-Shadow Ball
-Pain Split
Nature: Modest
EVs: 252 SAtk/4 SDef/252 Spe
Item: Leftovers/Life Orb

or
-Fire Blast/Overheat
-Shadow Ball
-Hidden Power (Fighting)
-Energy Ball/Trick
Nature: Modest
EVs: 120 HP/252 SAtk/8 SDef/128 Spe
Item: Choice Specs

or
-Fire Blast
-Shadow Ball
-Energy Ball
-Trick/Hidden Power (Fighting)
Nature: Timid/Modest
EVs: 252 SAtk/4 SDef/252 Spe
Item: Choice Scarf
Ability: Flash Fire

Power Whip is the preferred option over Seed Bomb on Ferrothorn, since it has higher base power, and Ferrothorn is bulky enough to afford the occasional miss. The preferred EV spread here is 252 HP/88 Def/168 SDef to give Ferrothorn more balanced bulk. Also, what's the point of an Adamant nature if you're not investing in Attack?
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  #3    
Old November 11th, 2012, 02:31 PM
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First of all, thank you so much for the elaborate response!! Never thought of all those different options. As for the investment in Adamant, I was just going to pair it with Seed Bomb. But now that you mention it, Ferrothorn is a stalling wall after all, so i better use its full potential in what its best at rather than trying to balance it the way I did. I can't tell you how easy it is for me to ignore a Pokemon's best stats and focus on other stats. Even though it's a no-brainer, I should definitely focus on them 100%. Thanks. I will edit my post to the new current team after I fully analyze your excellent response By the way, is there a way to give you recognition such as points or something for your efforts? Thanks :D
  #4    
Old November 11th, 2012, 03:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MellowJello View Post
Just moved this thread to the correct place. Sorry about that guys XD But here is my team again.





Milotic
Nature: Modest (+SpAtk/-Atk)
EVs: 252 SpAtk/252...Spd?

Ice Beam
Recover
Toxic
Surf

Bold nature since you have Chandelure and Gothitelle (or Musharna if you're going to follow PtDude) for Special Attacks. Make this one a bulky water instead.

Milotic @ Leftovers
Bold Nature
252 HP 252 Def 4 SpA
-Scald / Surf
-Recover
-Ice Beam
-Toxic [can be disregarded if you run Toxic on Umbreon] / DragonTail [for those set-up sweepers] / Haze [same with DragonTail w/o the Damage]





Ferrothorn
Nature: Adamant (+Atk/-SpAtk)
EVs: 252 Def/252 SpDef

Leech Seed
Stealth Rock
Gryoball
Seed Bomb

Ferrothorn @ Leftovers or ShedShell if you think Magnezone is annoying
Relaxed or Sassy
252 HP 88 Def 168 SpD [This spread gives you a balance on Ferrothorn's defense, however you can play with it depending on your preference if Ferrothorn would be mainly Physically or Specially Defensive]
-Power Whip
-Gyro Ball
-Stealth Rock
-Leech Seed / Protect [Protect has its usefulness too over Leech Seed]

Comments are in bold, others thoroughly explained by PtDude already. Lastly, Scolipede is great, but once it goes down, Blissey/Chansey can come in to stall you for days.
  #5    
Old November 11th, 2012, 09:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Musica View Post
Comments are in bold, others thoroughly explained by PtDude already. Lastly, Scolipede is great, but once it goes down, Blissey/Chansey can come in to stall you for days.
Yes, but thats why I considered Psyshock for Gothitelle ^.^

Darn... I guess Gothitelle just doesn't cut it. I'll go for Musharna, or even Reuniclus. Knowing Reuniclus would obviously be the better option in most situations, I just didn't want another tank pokemon on my team. It's gonna over do it... but oh well. Maybe I should replace Milotic for another water pokemon so i don't overdo it...maybe Vaporeon?

Last edited by MellowJello; November 11th, 2012 at 10:13 PM. Reason: Your double post has been automatically merged.
  #6    
Old November 11th, 2012, 11:00 PM
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Psyshock won't even come close.

252SpAtk Gothitelle (+SAtk) Psyshock vs 0HP/0Def Leftovers Blissey (+Def): 68% - 80% (447 - 526 HP). Guaranteed 2HKO.

Although the calculation above is somehow meaningless, it just shows that Blissey won't even fudge with Psyshock from Gothitelle.

252SpAtk Gothitelle (+SAtk) Psyshock vs 252HP/252Def Leftovers Blissey (+Def): 29% - 34% (210 - 247 HP). Guaranteed 4HKO.

Not even Musharna, though.
252SpAtk Musharna (+SAtk) Psyshock vs 252HP/252Def Leftovers Blissey (+Def): 31% - 37% (228 - 268 HP). Guaranteed 4HKO.

What takes Blissey down is a super-effective move or STAB from a Pokemon with a humungous attack stat.

Vaporeon is basically the same as Milotic, plus the Wish. And with Umbreon around, there would be too much cats running wild. Reuniclus is good, but very hard to control since it is very slow. Something like Alakazam is nice, but too fragile. Since you do not like something that is OU, may I suggest Uxie or Azelf? Uxie = decent speed, great defenses, however, poor typing. Azelf = great speed, great offenses, and, again, poor typing. However, with a wide movepool, they can be a great help to your team.
  #7    
Old November 11th, 2012, 11:33 PM
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MellowJello
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Musica View Post
Psyshock won't even come close.

252SpAtk Gothitelle (+SAtk) Psyshock vs 0HP/0Def Leftovers Blissey (+Def): 68% - 80% (447 - 526 HP). Guaranteed 2HKO.

Although the calculation above is somehow meaningless, it just shows that Blissey won't even fudge with Psyshock from Gothitelle.

252SpAtk Gothitelle (+SAtk) Psyshock vs 252HP/252Def Leftovers Blissey (+Def): 29% - 34% (210 - 247 HP). Guaranteed 4HKO.

Not even Musharna, though.
252SpAtk Musharna (+SAtk) Psyshock vs 252HP/252Def Leftovers Blissey (+Def): 31% - 37% (228 - 268 HP). Guaranteed 4HKO.

What takes Blissey down is a super-effective move or STAB from a Pokemon with a humungous attack stat.

Vaporeon is basically the same as Milotic, plus the Wish. And with Umbreon around, there would be too much cats running wild. Reuniclus is good, but very hard to control since it is very slow. Something like Alakazam is nice, but too fragile. Since you do not like something that is OU, may I suggest Uxie or Azelf? Uxie = decent speed, great defenses, however, poor typing. Azelf = great speed, great offenses, and, again, poor typing. However, with a wide movepool, they can be a great help to your team.
Eh...I can live with Reuniclus. Just edited my team. How is this?
  #8    
Old November 12th, 2012, 05:18 AM
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Dragon Pulse and Ice Beam are redundant. They are just used mainly for Dragon types. Dragon Pulse is cool, but only hits super effective on Dragons. Just use Ice Beam, since it hits Grass types for a super effective damage too. Just run Recover over D.Pulse.

On Reuniclus, it should not run Dual Screens because it is very slow. Faster Pokemon like Cresselia can run a Dual Screener set. Reuniclus can be more like a set-up sweeper with Calm Mind.

Reuniclus @ Leftover (survivability) or Life Orb (More raw power)
Nature: Bold [to take physical hits better while it gets some boosts]
Magic Guard
252 HP 252 Def 4 SpD or 4 SpA
-Calm Mind
-Psyshock
-Focus Blast
-Recover

Why not also try an annoying Trick Reuniclus set?

Reuniclus @ Toxic Orb / Flame Orb [Toxic Orb wears down those Special Attackers / Walls, while Flame Orb is good for those Physical Attackers not named Conkeldurr or Heracross]
Nature: Bold
Magic Guard
252 HP 252 Def 4 SpD or SpA
-Trick
-Calm Mind / Focus Blast
-Psyshock / Psychic
-Recover

Rocky Helmet on Ferrothorn might seem nice on paper, but actually it is not. Some Ferrothorn counters like Magnezone would hapilly come in as it resists everything Ferrothorn can use. An all-out attacker Heatran can easily come in and can use Fire Blast for Ferrothorn or Scolipede, Earth Power on Chandelure, or just set-up Stealth Rocks while you do the switch. It can also come in on Chandelure's Fire attacks. Those two are the current threats for your team if ever Scolipede is gone. Air Balloon Heatran can easily come in on Scolipede's EQ, you pop the Balloon on the next attack, it Fire Blasts everything. However, Heatran can be walled by Milotic all day even if it does carry HP Grass / Electric.

252SpAtk Flash Fire Heatran (Neutral) Hidden Power (Grass) vs 252HP/0SpDef Marvel Scale Milotic (Neutral): 31% - 38% (126 - 150 HP). Guaranteed 4HKO.

Magnezone can be a problem as it kills Milotic immediately.

252SpAtk Choice Specs Magnezone (+SAtk) Volt Switch vs 4HP/0SpDef Marvel Scale Milotic (Neutral): 93% - 110% (312 - 368 HP). Guaranteed 2HKO. 64% chance to OHKO.

It can also carry HP Fire to kill Scolipede on the switch. But Scolipede's speed and Earthquake can kill it if you choose to revenge kill.

252Atk Life Orb Swarm Scolipede (Neutral) Earthquake vs 252HP/0Def Magnezone (Neutral): 113% - 136% (392 - 468 HP). Guaranteed OHKO.

Last edited by Musica; November 12th, 2012 at 05:34 AM.
  #9    
Old November 12th, 2012, 02:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Musica View Post
Dragon Pulse and Ice Beam are redundant. They are just used mainly for Dragon types. Dragon Pulse is cool, but only hits super effective on Dragons. Just use Ice Beam, since it hits Grass types for a super effective damage too. Just run Recover over D.Pulse.

On Reuniclus, it should not run Dual Screens because it is very slow. Faster Pokemon like Cresselia can run a Dual Screener set. Reuniclus can be more like a set-up sweeper with Calm Mind.

Reuniclus @ Leftover (survivability) or Life Orb (More raw power)
Nature: Bold [to take physical hits better while it gets some boosts]
Magic Guard
252 HP 252 Def 4 SpD or 4 SpA
-Calm Mind
-Psyshock
-Focus Blast
-Recover

Why not also try an annoying Trick Reuniclus set?

Reuniclus @ Toxic Orb / Flame Orb [Toxic Orb wears down those Special Attackers / Walls, while Flame Orb is good for those Physical Attackers not named Conkeldurr or Heracross]
Nature: Bold
Magic Guard
252 HP 252 Def 4 SpD or SpA
-Trick
-Calm Mind / Focus Blast
-Psyshock / Psychic
-Recover

Rocky Helmet on Ferrothorn might seem nice on paper, but actually it is not. Some Ferrothorn counters like Magnezone would hapilly come in as it resists everything Ferrothorn can use. An all-out attacker Heatran can easily come in and can use Fire Blast for Ferrothorn or Scolipede, Earth Power on Chandelure, or just set-up Stealth Rocks while you do the switch. It can also come in on Chandelure's Fire attacks. Those two are the current threats for your team if ever Scolipede is gone. Air Balloon Heatran can easily come in on Scolipede's EQ, you pop the Balloon on the next attack, it Fire Blasts everything. However, Heatran can be walled by Milotic all day even if it does carry HP Grass / Electric.

252SpAtk Flash Fire Heatran (Neutral) Hidden Power (Grass) vs 252HP/0SpDef Marvel Scale Milotic (Neutral): 31% - 38% (126 - 150 HP). Guaranteed 4HKO.

Magnezone can be a problem as it kills Milotic immediately.

252SpAtk Choice Specs Magnezone (+SAtk) Volt Switch vs 4HP/0SpDef Marvel Scale Milotic (Neutral): 93% - 110% (312 - 368 HP). Guaranteed 2HKO. 64% chance to OHKO.

It can also carry HP Fire to kill Scolipede on the switch. But Scolipede's speed and Earthquake can kill it if you choose to revenge kill.

252Atk Life Orb Swarm Scolipede (Neutral) Earthquake vs 252HP/0Def Magnezone (Neutral): 113% - 136% (392 - 468 HP). Guaranteed OHKO.
So if your suggesting that I don't use rocky helmet, then what else? Regardless of Heatran or Magnezone (which I understand how common they are), rocky helmet would still be the best item to use for it, wouldn't it? It's pretty much a staple for Ferrothorn. And thanks for the Trick Reuniclus suggestion. Love it. But in that case, should I then make Umbreon a passer for more setup? Thanks Check out the changes I made now.

Last edited by MellowJello; November 12th, 2012 at 02:58 PM.
  #10    
Old November 12th, 2012, 02:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MellowJello View Post
So if your suggesting that I don't use rocky helmet, then what else? Regardless of Heatran or Magnezone (which I understand how common they are), rocky helmet would still be the best item to use for it, wouldn't it? It's pretty much a staple for Ferrothorn. And thanks for the Trick Reuniclus suggestion. Love it. But in that case, Im gonna tweak with Umbreon for more setup so they can work together. Check it out to see how it looks Thanks
Shed Shell is another alternative for Ferrothorn to use so that it can escape from Magnet Pull and Arena Trap Pokemon.
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Old November 12th, 2012, 03:09 PM
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Ok. And what about Lagging Tail for setup Reuniclus?
  #12    
Old November 12th, 2012, 03:26 PM
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Yea, Lagging Tail sounds good too. But we'd want to abuse Reuniclus' Magic Guard. It's going to be a bit troublesome when something like Whimsicott uses Stun Spore on it or something else uses Spore to make it sleep. It's that easy to outspeed it. However, I do not think Lagging Tail is a bad idea; more like a situational option.

Last edited by Musica; November 12th, 2012 at 03:48 PM.
  #13    
Old November 12th, 2012, 06:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Musica View Post
Yea, Lagging Tail sounds good too. But we'd want to abuse Reuniclus' Magic Guard. It's going to be a bit troublesome when something like Whimsicott uses Stun Spore on it or something else uses Spore to make it sleep. It's that easy to outspeed it. However, I do not think Lagging Tail is a bad idea; more like a situational option.
Ok. I guess im going with flame orb then for Reuniclus since it has bold nature, and also Umbreon can take care of the special walls since it has toxic. Thank you both for your great help. Honestly, i never though i would get such great responses. Overall then, now that i just updated my team accordingly to your advices, what would you rate my team in a score of 1-10 with 1 being no chance for competitive and 10 being a very good team for competitive. Im honestly not going for the 10, but please do be honest. ^.^ Thanks
  #14    
Old November 12th, 2012, 07:58 PM
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Final comments:

Umbreon
Wish over Mean Look (a must for every support healer)

Ferrothorn
Shed Shell or Leftovers over Rocky Helmet (not all Ferrothorn counters are going to touch it, meaning Special Attacks do not activate Iron Barbs nor Rocky Helmet)

Overall, I think the team is good. It just depends on how you play with your Pokemon with switches and lucky predictions. There is no such thing as proper prediction. It should more like analysis. I'll give it a 7.
  #15    
Old November 12th, 2012, 10:28 PM
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Hooray!! :D lol Thanks so much! And yeah, i get what you mean with ferrothorn. Thanks
 
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