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Competitive Team Help Having trouble with your competitive Pokémon team? Be sure to check here if you need any help on it. Any teams intended for in-game and casual play should be posted in the In-Game Team Help sub-forum.


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  #1    
Old January 20th, 2013, 03:56 AM
Musica's Avatar
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Ant (Heatran) @ Shuca Berry
Trait: Flash Fire
EVs: 252 SAtk / 20 SDef / 236 Spd
Timid Nature
- Taunt
- Substitute
- Earth Power
- Heat Wave

Rosa (Togekiss) (F) @ Choice Scarf
Trait: Serene Grace
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
Timid Nature
- Air Slash
- Aura Sphere
- Hidden Power [Grass]
- Trick

Spin (Hitmontop) (M) @ Dark Gem
Trait: Intimidate
EVs: 124 HP / 252 Atk / 132 Spd
Adamant Nature
- Fake Out
- Close Combat
- Sucker Punch
- Protect

Reve (Cresselia) (F) @ Chesto Berry
Trait: Levitate
EVs: 240 HP / 240 Def / 28 SDef
Bold Nature
- Rest
- Icy Wind
- Thunder Wave
- Psychic

Mr. Red (Scizor) @ Flying Gem
Trait: Technician
EVs: 148 HP / 238 Atk / 124 Spd
- Acrobatics
- Bug Bite
- Bullet Punch
- Protect

Gems (Gastrodon) @ Rindo Berry
Trait: Storm Drain
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SDef / 252 Def
Bold Nature
- Muddy Water / Surf (Not going to use Scald, since I aim for Paralysis)
- Ice Beam
- Protect
- Recover


So I'm gonna battle with some friends next week with VGC format and have built this team by reading guides, reading RMTs, etc. Any suggestions on how to improve? I've won three battles so far, and I am having problems with Gastrodon, Thundurus, and opposing Heatran with Sub.

I tried Sableye, but I wasn't sure if it was of any use for the team. Latios wasn't doing well neither.

http://pokemonshowdown.com/replay/do...2013dev8128328
http://pokemonshowdown.com/replay/do...2013dev8127592
http://pokemonshowdown.com/replay/do...2013dev8128663
http://www.pokemonshowdown.com/repla...2013dev8574308

Please help, any comment or criticism will be very much appreciated.


Last edited by Musica; January 26th, 2013 at 11:31 PM.
  #2    
Old January 20th, 2013, 01:19 PM
Griffinbane's Avatar
Griffinbane
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FINALLY. The other day I was gonna suggest possible lead combinations depending on what pokemon the other team had. You've swapped your team around though so a lot of those have gone poof. If you still want that, I can work on it later.

First of all, since you already have 2 ice moves, I'd suggest changing HP Ice to HP Grass on Togekiss. I have yet to meet a Gastrodon that could beat my Togekiss without help from its teammate. But then mine is built far bulkier than yours. Nonetheless, the natural bulk on Togekiss is usually enough to allow it to land a devastating hit on Gastro. Just watch out for its partner, whatever it may be. If you want, you can try the ol' bulky Paraflinch Togekiss or Follow Me set. Both work in different ways but both are bulky enough that Gastro, Thundurus and Heatran will have trouble taking it out. Keeping old set but switching HP Ice to HP Grass will help with Gastrodon and any other water types, and Heatran will still have trouble against Togekiss.

Calm Togekiss @ Leftovers
Trait: Serene Grace
EVs: 252 HP|252 SpD|4 Def OR 252 HP|200 SpD|58 Def
~Thunder Wave / Nasty Plot / Body Slam
~Aura Sphere
~Air Slash
~Roost

Standard Togekiss is Standard. EVs depend on whether or not you care about physical hits. Tyranitar will still 2HKO you either way. If you're dealing with a rain team, or NOT dealing with a Trick Room team, then this will work well. 60% chance of making the opposing pokemon do nothing is cool. Unfortunately Gastrodon tanks hits, but if it doesn't carry Icy Wind, then you at least have a chance to flinch it every-so-often. You can switch Thunder Wave for something else since Cress carries it. Careful with throwing paralysis everywhere, because if it turns out your opponent is a Trick Room user, suddenly their pokemon will go first everytime.

Calm Togekiss @ Leftovers/Lum Berry/Sitrus Berry
Trait: Serene Grace
EVs: 252 HP|4 Def|252 SpD
~ Follow Me
~ Air Slash
~ Thunder Wave / Tailwind
~ Protect / Roost

Pulled off Smogon. Special attackers are super common in doubles, and physical attackers are rarer. If it ever comes up that your opponent has 2 special attackers on the field, Togekiss can tank attacks using Follow Me and pull pressure off your other pokemon.

Togekiss @ Choice Scarf
Trait: Serene Grace
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
Timid Nature
- Air Slash
- Aura Sphere
- Hidden Power [Grass]
- Trick

Slightly edited from original set. Now you can hit opposing Gastrodon and Heatran. Heatran will still get Subs off, but it'll go down as soon as it goes up.

Haven't got much experience using the others so I can't really help there. Heatran's been a total dud in my team but then again, mine is rain, where he's utterly useless.
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Last edited by Griffinbane; January 20th, 2013 at 05:40 PM.
  #3    
Old January 20th, 2013, 01:39 PM
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Musica, post that on nuggetbridge, because people there are so much better at VGC than me, Griffy or anyone that plays this format on PC.
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  #4    
Old January 20th, 2013, 04:16 PM
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Thank you, Griffy! and Gonz0 is just spamming, not helpful at all... KIDDING! I will do that, Gonz0. :D

I forgot to replace HP Ice on Togekiss. Gastrodon was suppose to carry it though, but I placed Ice Beam instead. I really haven't used it at all, and I was thinking of the Counter-Coat Gastrodon. Togekiss was meant to be the true Special Attacker of this team. I couldn't think of anything else that annoys opponents more than it should.

Heatran isn't really that useful for me, and I don't know if I should keep it or not. Sure Taunt-tran is awesome, but the only synergy I could think of is Gastrodon + Heatran on the field. Gastrodon absorbs any Water-type attack aimed on Heatran, but that's that; it couldn't do anything else when Ground-type attacks comes in. I don't want to lose Scizor, Cress, and Hitmontop on since Cress is the main point of the team and if I remove 'top and Scizor, there won't be anything else that uses Physical moves.

Should I opt for a bit bulkier EV spread for Togekiss?
  #5    
Old January 20th, 2013, 05:40 PM
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Griffinbane
I hate Smeargle.
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Shut up Gonzo.

Moosik, it's your choice for Togekiss. Speed or bulkiness. TBH, I haven't found speed to be useful for Togekiss. Stuff with Prankster will paralyze it or folks will kill it ASAP regardless because the memory of flinchkiss is in their minds.

I dislike using Heatran as well. I tried it a few times and it just doesn't work. At least, it doesn't work on my team. It's fast, sure, but it's a friggin' glass cannon. All you can really do is slap a Focus Sash on it and hope it doesn't die. Taunt isn't too helpful because everything but Tornadus/Thundurus will pretty much be attacking or using Protect. Maybe try using Volcarona? It might be better able to fill the slot that Heatran is in.

Volcarona w/ Focus Sash or Choice Scarf
Nature: Timid / Modest
~ Heat Wave
~ Bug Buzz
~ Hidden Power Ice / Hidden Power Ground / Rage Powder
~ Protect

Sash will allow it to get a hit in, if your opponent doesn't decide to double-target it. You might be able to fit Quiver Dance in there somewhere, if you're confident that you'll be able to get one off. If you're gonna go the scarf route, replace Protect with something else. I think Scarf will work better, because it's guaranteed that you'll get a move off. Volcarona is bulky enough that unless you're dealing with a double-water pair or get double targetted, it should be able deal 2 hits before it goes down. Its special attack is pretty beastly.

Scizor feels off in your team, I can't tell why right now. It's just a feeling. In the meanwhile, try changing some things and see what works and doesn't and if there's any new issues that surface.

Btw, you forgot your item on Hitmontop. If you're tired of spread moves, you can try exchanging Protect with Wide Guard. That'll completely nullify any spread moves, but you lose your guaranteed Protect.
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  #6    
Old January 20th, 2013, 08:08 PM
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No wonder my Hitmontop feels empty. Should I have it carry Normal Gem for stronger Fake Out? I'll switch out some things as well with Heatran and Volcarona. Follow Me on Togekiss + Volcarona seems good to me. I can sure get one Quiver Dance if I get Togekiss to use Follow Me. Heatran is just meh, it's better off on singles. I'm gonna think of this team more later and I'll see if I could fit Virizion instead of Scizor.

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  #7    
Old January 20th, 2013, 08:16 PM
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Griffinbane
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If it was TechniTop, I'd say yes. But since it's not, there's no point doing so since Fake Out is so weak. Give it either a Dark Gem or Life Orb.
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  #8    
Old January 20th, 2013, 09:27 PM
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I thought about Technician, but it won't help Cress much than having Intimidate to get more Physical Bulk. How about a Fighting Gem for stronger Close Combat?
  #9    
Old January 20th, 2013, 09:45 PM
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Fighting gem works too. I didn't suggest it because I thought it would be overkill.
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  #10    
Old January 21st, 2013, 10:52 PM
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Ah, I see where the Dark Gem is needed. I'll play around with Dark Gem. Sucker Punch gives me some of those needed kills sometime. It'll be more assuring to go for a kill when Sucker Punch is boosted.
  #11    
Old January 22nd, 2013, 06:42 PM
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Since Gastrodon is giving this team problems, you could try out Ferrothorn:
-Leech Seed
-Protect
-Gyro Ball
-Power Whip
Nature: Relaxed
EVs: 252 HP/148 Def/108 SDef
Item: Leftovers

I'm not sure where this should go over, though.
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Old January 22nd, 2013, 07:19 PM
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I guess Ferrothorn can be a TR and Rain counter? I can remove Heatran since I'm not having much problems with Fire or Grass Pokemon.
 
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