The PokéCommunity Forums  

Go Back   The PokéCommunity Forums > Off-Topic Discussions > Discussions & Debates
Sign Up Rules/FAQ Live Battle Blogs Mark Forums Read

Notices

Discussions & Debates The place to go for slightly more intellectual topics. Discussions and debates about the world, current events, ideas, news, and more.


Reply
Click here to go to the first staff post in this thread.  
Thread Tools
  #26    
Old December 6th, 2012, 03:47 AM
Impo's Avatar
Impo
Vital Spirit
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Earth
Gender: Male
Nature: Relaxed
Being gay, it's weird. People'd probably expect those who are gay to feel insulted, but from my perspective... I guess calling me gay is... 'correct'? I don't know. ****** is offensive, and I guess like Curious said, if they pretty much spit the word gay then you know it's being used derogatorily, which is wrong.

On that note my friends use the word gay around me to describe things that are bad, but never derogatorily. I guess it's kind of a word with two meanings, like most of the English Dictionary.
__________________

Vigoroth
3DS FC: 3411-1566-9347
Paired to Naya Rivera
Paired to ShiningRaichu
Reply With Quote
  #27    
Old December 6th, 2012, 04:15 AM
Yoshikkko's Avatar
Yoshikkko
underdog
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Nature: Adamant
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scarf View Post
Using the word "gay" when you mean "stupid" is insulting. I don't care if you didn't mean for it to be insulting. If you wanted to say something was dumb say it was dumb, otherwise you're looking pretty dumb in my eyes.

Really, if you are at all close to someone who is gay you won't use the word except to mean, well, gay. You just won't. That one time you did use it in front of them it was really, really awkward and you realized it was the wrong thing to say even before your friend or relative even called you out on it. Because you're a considerate person, right? I mean, for you to use "gay" to mean "stupid" when you know someone who is gay makes you terribly insensitive.
Speak for yourself. My best friend doesn't care one bit if I or other people use it, it completely depends on the person. You can't just state that something is insulting to everyone just because it is to you. And you can't call people inconsiderate and insensitive towards their friends either if they use it, just because you're offended.
Quote:
Really, if you are at all close to someone who is gay you won't use the word except to mean, well, gay.
This pisses me off. You're undermining my friendship with someone (or whoever else's) and just claim whatever.

Last edited by Yoshikkko; December 6th, 2012 at 04:53 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #28    
Old December 6th, 2012, 10:36 AM
Esper's Avatar
Esper
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: California
@Yoshikkko: Just because someone doesn't feel offended doesn't automatically make something said not insulting. Every gay person I know (and every non-gay person I've talked to about this topic who has gay friends or family) feels that using "that's so gay" and similar phrases is insulting. It's not just me. I'm genuinely surprised that someone would say that their gay friend doesn't mind this kind of talk from their friends.
__________________

deviantart blog pair
Reply With Quote
  #29    
Old December 6th, 2012, 10:43 AM
Yoshikkko's Avatar
Yoshikkko
underdog
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Nature: Adamant
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scarf View Post
@Yoshikkko: Just because someone doesn't feel offended doesn't automatically make something said not insulting. Every gay person I know (and every non-gay person I've talked to about this topic who has gay friends or family) feels that using "that's so gay" and similar phrases is insulting. It's not just me. I'm genuinely surprised that someone would say that their gay friend doesn't mind this kind of talk from their friends.
Just because someone feels offended, doesn't automatically make something said insulting. It works both ways, not just the one you think. Again, you are basing something off your own experience. Nice that every gay person you know and everyone else feels it's insulting, but you can't possibly make statement like this just based on that. It doesn't apply to every person just because it's like that with you and the people around you.
And it also sounds as if you're saying that I just bluffed that my gay best friend doesn't mind because you said you are surprised that I said that. No, you should be surprised (if you should be at all) that he doesn't care at all, and that's true. He doesn't mind it, he uses it himself and he knows the difference and therefore doesn't care.
Reply With Quote
  #30    
Old December 6th, 2012, 11:33 AM
Esper's Avatar
Esper
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: California
It's not just my experience I'm basing my views on, but that of practically everyone I've ever heard speak about this topic. Please excuse my attempt to use an illustrative example. I wasn't attempting to invalidate your friendship, however much it disagrees with what I know. I'd rather not fight about this.
__________________

deviantart blog pair
Reply With Quote
  #31    
Old December 6th, 2012, 11:48 AM
Yoshikkko's Avatar
Yoshikkko
underdog
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Nature: Adamant
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scarf View Post
It's not just my experience I'm basing my views on, but that of practically everyone I've ever heard speak about this topic. Please excuse my attempt to use an illustrative example. I wasn't attempting to invalidate your friendship, however much it disagrees with what I know. I'd rather not fight about this.
Yeah I understand because it might not be the opinion anyone'd expect. I totally understand why gay people would be offended/insulted by that term too however way it was used. Maybe it's different here because most of the people I know actually don't mind as much, but here homosexuality is something the majority is very open and relaxed about so maybe that's it. At any rate, I wasn't trying to fight or anything but I did want to defend myself and him too. He is the only one I ever use that term freely with anyway because you can never be sure with other people and it is also not my intention to offend anyone. Having no different opinions would be boring!
Reply With Quote
  #32    
Old December 13th, 2012, 01:45 PM
Ardent's Avatar
Ardent
I'm Alive
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Aoi Sekai
Age: 18
Gender: Male
Nature: Relaxed
Send a message via Skype™ to Ardent
Technically the word gay was originally used as a syn for happy,but like so many words it evolved over time into meaning something else.
I personally don't think that you should put to much stock into a word that's so commonly used,but I can see how some people would get offended.
My opinion might be a bit biased though since I use gay myself. n.n"
__________________



W o r d p l o y.
{The Undaunted}


Reply With Quote
  #33    
Old December 13th, 2012, 05:38 PM
The_Consumer's Avatar
The_Consumer
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Ireland or Leicester
Gender: Male
Just generally try not to offend people so instead of saying "that's gay!" or "how gay" I would replace the word with annoying, stupid, weird or a made up word.

I never call people gay, Idk it doesnt seem right. What if they are? It's as if you're saying they're a crime against humanity for being "gay", and they actually are gay so they're proving your point.

I haven't heard it recently though, surprisingly, so I don't think about it. I do think that it offends boys much more than girls though for the simple reason that being "gay" leaves that stereotype on them that they may dislike because loads of 12 year olds try their best to act as macho as possible. *is not ageist*
Reply With Quote
  #34    
Old December 21st, 2012, 01:08 AM
twocows's Avatar
twocows
Penguin
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Michigan
Age: 23
Gender: Male
Nature: Lax
If some people are legitimately offended by something like that, those people need to grow some thicker skin. People who say stuff like "that's so gay" as an insult probably don't mean anything by it. You want malicious intent, look at WBC. Now there's something to be offended by.

Demonizing people for saying something dumb when it's obvious they didn't mean anything by it is just giving yourself an ego trip. I call it "being a self-righteous jerk."
__________________
Doctors Without Borders: one of the few charity groups you can rely on to actually do real good in the world.

Quote:
The trouble with fighting for human freedom is that one spends most of one's time defending scoundrels. For it is against scoundrels that oppressive laws are first aimed, and oppression must be stopped at the beginning if it is to be stopped at all.
- H. L. Mencken, unsourced

Quote:
There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there always has been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that "my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge."
- Isaac Asimov, Column in Newsweek (21 January 1980) [source]
Reply With Quote
  #35    
Old December 26th, 2012, 07:05 PM
outfox's Avatar
outfox
in
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Gender: Female
Send a message via Skype™ to outfox
I do avoid using words that carry a lot of baggage, like "f****t" or the "n" word, but I don't believe any word is inherently harmful. We attach hateful connotations if we want to.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #36    
Old December 26th, 2012, 07:22 PM
Kanto_Johto's Avatar
Kanto_Johto
Never glimpse the truth
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: A Silver Sun
Age: 21
Gender: Male
Nature: Bold
I don't find it offensive, and I'm guilty of using it myself IRL. I try not to but it just slips out. Nobody has ever been offended by me saying it though, which is good. Online I never use it though.
__________________
Arrive without traveling
See all without looking
Do all without doing
Reply With Quote
  #37    
Old January 3rd, 2013, 07:08 PM
Moogles's Avatar
Moogles
better than u
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Dalhousie University
Age: 19
Gender: Male
Nature: Bold
I think if gay people use it as word reclaiming it's fine (Just like some do with the word ******) but straight people shouldn't really be saying it because they don't know the true impact of what they're saying.

I really think it's that simple. It's shown to hurt kids so you should grow up and stop using it.
__________________
Quote:
I don't like a lot of LGBT advocates if they express their views in a way that will only serve to eventually reverse the roles of oppressor and victim.
translation: I am a whiny straight person who is afraid of the thought of LGBT people standing up for themselves if it happens to pierce society the way I see it because I currently stand in a privileged light.
Reply With Quote
  #38    
Old January 13th, 2013, 04:34 PM
kelario27's Avatar
kelario27
20% Cooler
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Willow, Alaska
Age: 14
Gender: Male
Nature: Serious
Send a message via Skype™ to kelario27
Quote:
Originally Posted by SwiftSign View Post
'Dumb' originally only referred to as another word for mute, or people who could not speak. So really it's a very similar situation, where a derogatory term for a minority has become the norm and gained a new definition.
What this guy said. I find it insulting, but only when I'm called gay. I'm personally an advocate of sending all the homosexuals to Triton.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #39    
Old January 13th, 2013, 06:20 PM
Skylands's Avatar
Skylands
.
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Amurica
Age: 19
Gender: Female
Nature: Calm
I use "gay" as a substitute for "lame" or "stupid" around people I know who don't mind, but the number of times I actually use the word isn't very high to begin with, and I never use it to describe a person.

I also have a few IRL friends who happen to be truly gay and use the word themselves in that sense. It all depends on the person. You may or may not offend someone, so always be careful.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #40    
Old January 16th, 2013, 07:00 AM
Shiny Bidoof's Avatar
Shiny Bidoof
On fire
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Ohio
Gender: Male
I heard a gay acquaintance of mine say "That's so straight," and it had me rolling XD. I've used if a few time since then.
Reply With Quote
  #41    
Old January 16th, 2013, 09:07 AM
Patchisou Yutohru
Guest
 
It's pretty gay to be offended by the word gay.

Quote:
Originally Posted by twocows View Post
If some people are legitimately offended by something like that, those people need to grow some thicker skin. People who say stuff like "that's so gay" as an insult probably don't mean anything by it. You want malicious intent, look at WBC. Now there's something to be offended by.

Demonizing people for saying something dumb when it's obvious they didn't mean anything by it is just giving yourself an ego trip. I call it "being a self-righteous jerk."
Quote:
Originally Posted by outfox View Post
I do avoid using words that carry a lot of baggage, like "f****t" or the "n" word, but I don't believe any word is inherently harmful. We attach hateful connotations if we want to.
This is exactly how I feel about it. I think it's society's fault for having developed the word used in that way to be interpreted this way, and thus people attach hateful connotations with the word no matter which way it's used. I also believe that people who are actually insulted by someone calling something gay in the stupid sense should grow some thicker skin, as twocows said. I'm not an insensitive person, and I understand that somethings are sensitive to other people, but I generally hold the belief that there are more important things to focus concerns like that on than someone's language.
Reply With Quote
  #42    
Old January 16th, 2013, 09:53 AM
Shiny Bidoof's Avatar
Shiny Bidoof
On fire
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Ohio
Gender: Male
Quote:
Originally Posted by SwiftSign View Post
'Dumb' originally only referred to as another word for mute, or people who could not speak. So really it's a very similar situation, where a derogatory term for a minority has become the norm and gained a new definition.
But people rarely use "dumb" as a way of saying "mute" these days, whereas it's common for homosexuals to be called "gay."

Essentially you're using a word for a person's sexual orientation to describe things that are unpleasant. It sort of connects the two and gives the more common use of the word some really negative connotations.

When you describe things negatively as "gay," it sends the message "gay is not a good thing, it's a bad thing." That's why so many people are offended when others use it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kelario27 View Post
What this guy said. I find it insulting, but only when I'm called gay. I'm personally an advocate of sending all the homosexuals to Triton.
Why is being gay a bad thing? Personally, I don't care if someone thinks I'm gay. I'm very secure in my sexuality.

Last edited by Shiny Bidoof; January 16th, 2013 at 09:56 AM. Reason: Your double post has been automatically merged.
Reply With Quote
  #43    
Old January 16th, 2013, 10:14 AM
KogiTheFox's Avatar
KogiTheFox
Unhatched Egg
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Gender: Male
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scarf View Post
Using the word "gay" when you mean "stupid" is insulting. I don't care if you didn't mean for it to be insulting. If you wanted to say something was dumb say it was dumb, otherwise you're looking pretty dumb in my eyes.

Really, if you are at all close to someone who is gay you won't use the word except to mean, well, gay. You just won't. That one time you did use it in front of them it was really, really awkward and you realized it was the wrong thing to say even before your friend or relative even called you out on it. Because you're a considerate person, right? I mean, for you to use "gay" to mean "stupid" when you know someone who is gay makes you terribly insensitive.
To be honest I just think everyone is culturally oversensitive. I'm gay and don't care if someone uses it as a derogatory term around me; it's not awkward in the least. Hell, I say f****t all the time, you don't see my boyfriend getting offended.
__________________
Pretty please check out my piano videos~ <3

http://www.youtube.com/user/kogithefox
Reply With Quote
  #44    
Old January 16th, 2013, 10:17 AM
Patchisou Yutohru
Guest
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shiny Bidoof View Post
Why is being gay a bad thing? Personally, I don't care if someone thinks I'm gay. I'm very secure in my sexuality.
Because people who are concerned with being called gay aren't secure in their sexuality and thus get overly offended when someone calls them gay.

Such concerns are generally found in secretly insecure individuals and small-minded jocks (I say small-minded because obviously not all jocks are like that) found in high school who often have hypermasculine behavior to discern people from thinking and saying things like that about them.
Reply With Quote
  #45    
Old January 16th, 2013, 10:17 AM
Shiny Bidoof's Avatar
Shiny Bidoof
On fire
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Ohio
Gender: Male
Quote:
Originally Posted by KogiTheFox View Post
To be honest I just think everyone is culturally oversensitive. I'm gay and don't care if someone uses it as a derogatory term around me; it's not awkward in the least. Hell, I say f****t all the time, you don't see my boyfriend getting offended.
It's different if you know the person is cool with it though. There are a lot of people who aren't.

A lot of my friends are cool with it and some of them say it, but personally I still avoid using it simply because of the implications.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Patchisou Yutohru View Post
Because people who are concerned with being called gay aren't secure in their sexuality and thus get overly offended when someone calls them gay.

Such concerns are generally found in secretly insecure individuals and small-minded jocks found in high school.
It's such a weird cultural anxiety we created, like being homosexual is somehow lesser, so we must avoid seeming homosexual at all costs. If you put it into perspective it just makes no sense.

One of my personal pet peeves.
Reply With Quote
  #46    
Old January 16th, 2013, 10:21 AM
Patchisou Yutohru
Guest
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shiny Bidoof View Post
It's such a weird cultural anxiety we created, like being homosexual is somehow lesser, so we must avoid seeming homosexual at all costs. If you put it into perspective it just makes no sense.

One of my personal pet peeves.
I think it more-so deals with the male ego than anything else. Not only does it relate to people being comfortable in their sexuality, but people being comfortable with their gender identity and secure in their masculinity as well. I haven't seen any females with concerns like that, which is why I think it deals more with the male ego than anything else. Probably because lesbianism is generally associated with butch in society rather than femininity. Not sure why that is either, but I think the two relate somehow.
Reply With Quote
  #47    
Old January 16th, 2013, 11:05 AM
Shiny Bidoof's Avatar
Shiny Bidoof
On fire
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Ohio
Gender: Male
Quote:
Originally Posted by Patchisou Yutohru View Post
I think it more-so deals with the male ego than anything else. Not only does it relate to people being comfortable in their sexuality, but people being comfortable with their gender identity and secure in their masculinity as well. I haven't seen any females with concerns like that, which is why I think it deals more with the male ego than anything else. Probably because lesbianism is generally associated with butch in society rather than femininity. Not sure why that is either, but I think the two relate somehow.
Lesbianism has sort of been normalized more because of the male attitude towards it, it think. There's still a lot of hatred towards lesbians, but the cultural climate has changed a bit more because of the way men represent lesbian and bisexual women in the media.

Not that this doesn't come with its own host of problems (it's common for men to look at lesbians and bisexual women through the lens of sexual fantasy and treat them as such).

As for the gender identity concept, historically claims of homosexuality have been used to pressure men and women into traditional gender roles, which is where a lot of the stereotypes come from (examples: "you're baking cookies? Don't be gay, dude. Women should bake things, not men" or "You like Sarah McLachlan? Gay!"). Homosexuality has lost a lot of its stigma, so the stereotypes are also fading, but they're still noticeable in our culture and media.

This also work vice-versa, where being gay is bad because it is not part of your gender role.

My theory anyway.
Reply With Quote
  #48    
Old January 16th, 2013, 06:44 PM
vaporeon7's Avatar
vaporeon7
My life would suck without you
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Preparing for trouble and making it double.
Gender: Male
Nature: Adamant
Send a message via Skype™ to vaporeon7
To be honest, when I was a lot younger, I did use gay as a synonym for bad. Now, I have grown out of that completely, and think it is wrong of people to use it that way. Besides gay people are the funnest to serve at work, they always tell the funniest jokes and have really funny stories.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #49    
Old January 16th, 2013, 07:27 PM
QuilavaKing's Avatar
QuilavaKing
(>^.(>0.0)>
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Oregon
Age: 22
Gender: Male
Nature: Careful
Send a message via Skype™ to QuilavaKing
Nah, I don't find f** offensive either... or really anything at all for that matter. I mean, even if it was used as an insult, I wouldn't really care. =/
__________________
#156 :: Quilava

The Volcano Pokemon



Reply With Quote
  #50    
Old February 1st, 2013, 11:58 AM
Vader's Avatar
Vader
League Champion
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Blackthorn City
Gender: Male
Nature: Adamant
Send a message via Skype™ to Vader
I personally would not be upset if a derogatory, racial or sexuality-based epithet was thrown my way. But then again, there really isn't one for straight white people, and they (white people of social privilege) tend to be the ones throwing out the hateful dialogue anyways. But I can certainly understand why people would be offended by such terminology.
__________________
Reply With Quote
Reply
Quick Reply

Sponsored Links


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Minimum Characters Per Post: 25



All times are UTC -8. The time now is 11:52 PM.


Style by Nymphadora, artwork by Sa-Dui.
Like our Facebook Page Follow us on Twitter © 2002 - 2014 The PokéCommunity™, pokecommunity.com.
Pokémon characters and images belong to The Pokémon Company International and Nintendo. This website is in no way affiliated with or endorsed by Nintendo, Creatures, GAMEFREAK, The Pokémon Company or The Pokémon Company International. We just love Pokémon.
All forum styles, their images (unless noted otherwise) and site designs are © 2002 - 2014 The PokéCommunity / PokéCommunity.com.
PokéCommunity™ is a trademark of The PokéCommunity. All rights reserved. Sponsor advertisements do not imply our endorsement of that product or service. User generated content remains the property of its creator.