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  #601    
Old February 13th, 2013, 08:50 AM
Dusk's Avatar
Dusk
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Khawill View Post
The sucker that Snowpeople have to suck on to keep their body temperature balanced, is that required? Like if he refuses to eat it will he die? Or is this a way to make them seem more human?

I mean if it is the first one, then that seems a bit unfair, considering that is like a major, visible, and extremely exploitable weaknesses. (Vampires have water yes, but they are powerful even for Youkai, so I don't think they are included.) The weakness would be fine, but with lycans (who can wreck an entire room and disturb the campus with only a headache and a nap as compensation.) Vampires, (who are supper strong with great reaction time, so strong that they probably could be considered close to Demi-gods) and werewolves (who probably have the same power potential as Lycans) it would be hard enough to compete. Add in this major flaw and suddenly it seems my character's race is obsolete.

I'm not saying we need to nerf Lycans, Werewolves, or Vampires. That isn't at all what I mean, I just think that the other Youkai types may need less obvious or available weaknesses. (A werewolf or Vampire could easily remove the sucker from a snowman, the glasses from a lamia, or a coin from a yasha.)
Hmm... I disagree with you in that you say the power balance between species is off, but I do agree that losing a sucker being your downfall is probably too easy to exploit.

EDIT: So it's not life-threatening? Then it's just a preference? Problem solved! However, I'll still continue to explain.

Let's put these races into perspective:

Vampire

Super Powerful, but their brute strength is drastically reduced by the Rosary. Having your own Rosary to use against a Vampire would count as a weakness toward them, though it's something you likely wouldn't have, unless you were preparing specifically to fight a Vampire. Water, however, is very, very common, and paralyzing your foe is almost instant-win under the right circumstance.

Summary: Powerful, but their weaknesses are common enough to balance out the raw strength. If anything, they might have a slight disadvantage.


Werewolf

Hm... Speed. Their power is speed. I imagine /some/ strength is implied, though. Their ability is only at its most powerful during a full moon, and during the new moon it is entirely nonexistent. I'd worry that speed might be an easily-abused trait, but considering that their only real power is restricted to about half of the time (taking into account the ascending and descending amounts of speed), this relies heavily on situational use and necessity. I assume that during the day (in sunlight, with no moon in sight) their power is, if not gone, diminished to about half of its current potential.

Summary: Situationally, it could be a problem, but their power seems to be weakened more often than not (surprising, actually). If anything, they might also be a little too weak.


Neko

Slashing claw attacks. Weakness... Playable items...? So... You defeat them with catnip and toy mice? Um...

Summary: I don't even...


Crow Tengu

Power of wind. Weaknesses are chosen by the creator of the character... Huh.

Summary: Wind isn't all that powerful of an element, but it could be useful against other elements (by putting out or amplifying fire, negating icy attacks or simply dodging other attacks). A weakness chosen by the player means this can be anywhere from pansy baby to super-mega-god. Seems fair to me.


Mermaid

Power of sucking life out of others by the bite. So... They're immortal if they keep drinking life out of others? No weaknesses listed.

Summary: So... Do they have a weakness or what? I really couldn't tell one way or the other. They might be somewhat overpowered. Luckily no one chose it!


Succubus

Deceptive illusionists who seduce Humans, but not other Youkai? Weakness is chosen by player. Long nails for claw-attacks.

Summary: Again, when the weakness is varied, the result is variable. Since attraction only works on the Human, it's practically irrelevant to the RP (except, of course, that single Human, who was no threat to begin with). Illusions can be very effective, though I imagine less so on a more intellectual race, like the Lycans and Mages/witches.


Snowperson

Ice-elemental creatures who, like other races, uses claw-type attacks, only this time with the element of cold added in. From the description I can only assume that they are able to create their own cold attacks, like icy breath or blizzard or something. They have suckers that lower their body temperatures. Weather plays as a weakness.

Summary: Control of the ice element, albeit snowy attacks or icy claws. Their only weakness is Weather, though I think it'd be safe to assume that fire is a weakness (a deadly one, in fact). Weather, as a weakness, is variable, and can be completely avoided indoors. I believe they might also be slightly below average.

If I may make a suggestion? I believe the temperature of their own body should be a key factor in how much power they have. Therefore, the sucker would be an amplifier for their abilities, as well as a comforting object.


Lamia

15 minutes worth of Mind control, the ability to pin enemies if they've been in Youkai for for 30 minutes or longer. Weakness is sight, they are blinded if glasses are removed.

Summary: Hmm... Honestly, this one might be overpowered, depending on the personality of the character (and how they'll act in a fight or flight situation). Things like mind control are very exploitable, to a bunnying/godmodding level. On the other hand, complete blindness is a near-fatal weakness if properly exploited. I imagine there is a resistance to mind control by the intellectual races, however the flower-power sounds like it should be potent on anyone. This race seems overpowered, to me at least.

Another suggestion? After researching a bit about snakes, I've learned some things about them that might be useful in balancing them out. They fear fire, so this may be an exploitable weakness, and an elemental one. The back of a snake's head is a soft spot, hitting it could knock it unconscious. Lastly, they faint when their tails are stepped on. Again, these are only suggestions.


Yasha

A summoner, sending monsters to battle for them. Their summons often fail, bringing about the wrong monster. These summons require a coin, so if the coin is taken, the Yasha is useless.

Summary: They have the flexibility of ability, as they can summon a variety of monsters. Their weakness is the mishap of incorrect summons, and they are practically Human if they don't have the coin to summon with. I think this is fair, if not underpowered a bit, considering how terrible it'd be to lose the coin.


Youko

Fire foxes. Weakness is listed as naivety, though I imagine their powers are gone, if not weakened, by water, rain, etc.

Summary: Pretty much even on pros and cons. Doesn't get much simpler than fire.


Mage

Magic and spells and whatnot. Intellectual, so resistant to mind-based attacks.

Summary: Varied by spells, with seemingly no other weakness than the fact that other Youkai tend to hate them. This seems about even, maybe a bit more powerful, due to a wide array of spells, though it would vary with the character.


Human

Weak and fragile little meatsack with no powers.

Summary: Must be made of Paper Mache, or Raditz.


Lycan

Pure-blooded Wolves with Human forms. Abilities of Telekinesis, which are self-damaging to the user dependent on amount of power used. A double-edged sword, if you will. Weak against magic powers, but resistant to mind-attacking abilities.

Summary: Pretty much even, seeing as they are pretty much free kills once they over-use their powers. However, they are weak against magic, and don't have the greatest defense. A proper beating will fell a Lycan faster than most other races. The upside to this is that they are often lean and flexible, and are able to dodge some attacks. Consider this the Rogue of the Youkai.


Fairy

Puny, magical creatures who make ridiculous deals, and use mirrors to reveal Youkai forms. (Fortunately no one has done this to Ryuu... Yet...)

Summary: Not suitable for battle, more for pissing off Youkai.




FINAL ANALYSIS

I think they're pretty well-balanced altogether, though some of those suggestions might level the playing field more.

I do like the fact that, if you choose to look at it this way, it's pretty much just a type-war, for the most part, as some Youkai are resistant to or weak against the abilities of other races.

I was also gonna make a little chart showing which classes had power over other classes, and weak to others, but seeing as this took me a while, I might hold off on that. (I started this yesterday)



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  #602    
Old February 13th, 2013, 08:55 AM
Lilizuki
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Wind is a very powerful element. Steal somebody's breath and they're pretty much dead.

Also, fairies are more for social manipulation. They're the kind that could bind somebody into a contract of servitude and then fly away/hide with their wings and tiny bodies.
  #603    
Old February 13th, 2013, 09:07 AM
Dusk's Avatar
Dusk
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lilizuki View Post
Wind is a very powerful element. Steal somebody's breath and they're pretty much dead.

Also, fairies are more for social manipulation. They're the kind that could bind somebody into a contract of servitude and then fly away/hide with their wings and tiny bodies.
Cut slack, please, brain died while writing kthxbai

*erherm* I suppose I never looked at wind in quite that way. That you were so quick to come to that conclusion makes me worried that you're actually more terrifying than your characters.

Either way, they seem like the "pranksters" added for comedic interactions.



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  #604    
Old February 13th, 2013, 09:15 AM
Lilizuki
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It's one of many fun ways to use the classic elements. For one, it's actually intimidating...

That's certainly an interpretation. But it's that kind of underestimation that will turn Solo into a barmaid at Timmy's Tavern. d:

Quote:
Originally Posted by shinysweety View Post
"And what's up with 'fan girl' by the way, like anyone would chase you." Hey, im tellin' the truth here. He curses allot, is so stubborn (yea yea im such a hypocrite i know and don't care) and rude not to forget.
I think I'm in love. Anyone know if Kailey's single?

Last edited by Lilizuki; February 13th, 2013 at 09:52 AM. Reason: Your double post has been automatically merged.
  #605    
Old February 13th, 2013, 11:19 AM
Dusk's Avatar
Dusk
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lilizuki View Post
It's one of many fun ways to use the classic elements. For one, it's actually intimidating...

That's certainly an interpretation. But it's that kind of underestimation that will turn Solo into a barmaid at Timmy's Tavern. d:



I think I'm in love. Anyone know if Kailey's single?
And then Lili found a way to enter the Roleplay herself, and it was love at first sight.



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  #606    
Old February 13th, 2013, 11:26 AM
Lilizuki
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Well, it is Wednesday...

So, I know I've been laying the "hate" on thickly, but being serious for a moment...Solo just attempted to murder somebody. By tearing out their throat.
  #607    
Old February 13th, 2013, 11:30 AM
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Aques Keus
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Mermaids are pretty much only relevant in the water, and considering that would be the downside of two (three if cold water) Youkai, and 3 others are not likely to go swimming in the first place, they are definitely balanced.

Water =/= weakness to fire! (Grease fires don't go out with water) Rather fire goes out when cooled or the source is eliminated (or oxygen removed). Considering their body temperature wont change with normal temperature water, nor is their oxygen removed, water is not a solid weakness. So I think it would be safe to say that their weakness would be Snow people (and vice-versa). Maybe even Crow Tengus since they can remove their source. Note that fire>anything with flesh, fur, or clothes.

Humans should probably have the same intellectual advantage as Mages, or in other words resistance to mind control abilities (clutch resistance, it isn't as passive as for a Mage of course.). They are weak to all, even themselves. (Batman is human!)

Nekos are weak to spray bottles, free fish, and swimming waters. I'd say they are both weak and strong (depending on setting) against mermaids.

Vampires are weak to pure water, though small amount wouldn't paralyze them, simply burn or sting them. I think the only time they would be fully handicapped by water would be if they were submerged, drenched, or hosed down by water. (A vampire could easily avoid large water sources, and likely run away before getting hosed down.) I'd say their hard counters are Mages with water spells, Yasha with some kind of aquarius summon, and a fire truck.

Their soft counters would be: A mermaid who catches one off guard, A succubus who manages to fly one into a body of water, and Werewolves who are evenly matched and between half moons.

Snowpeople: Not much to say about them, their powers (in my mind) could range from ice spikes from the ground, ice barriers, ice weapons, to just ice claws and cold resistance. They are basically human in their natural strength and durability, with their only advantage being the above. They are obviously countered by Youkou, (or evenly matched depending on the amount of chemistry we are going to use), Vampires (unrivaled strength and no easy way to get water, Snowpeople need to have the opening attack and location advantage to stand a chance.) and Werewolves (between crescent moons)

Werewolves are very situational, half and half at night. Even then I think they only get stronger by moon cycles, strongest at a full, normal on a a new. Even so, their counters are Vampires, Youkou, and a lucky human with a silver bullet.

Lycans having psychic powers means that even if it causes self harm, you could still potentially eliminate your target before you eliminate yourself. In a 1v1 Lycans have a large advantage, powerful burst potential, and plenty of willpower to last. Though, because of this I believe they are balanced by the fact that they lack the ability to fight multiple people at once, save for being much better physically than them.

I want to say their weakness is a specific counter, but they could easily 1 on 1 any Youkai, given it is a quick fight. Instead I will say that their weakness is anything that groups together, or anything that can resist their abilities long enough for them to handicap themselves.

Yasha: No comment, summoning is great, but getting caught without a summon is fatal. (Play FFX and try to keep Yuna in your party at all times without her dying) Werewolves are a grand counter, considering that they can use their speed to swipe the Yasha's coin. Vampires are very likely to be able to destroy any summon that is brought out. Lycans can just mental burst them as they are just human. A succubus could also be a viable counter with their attraction.

Crow: The potential for godlike is high on this Youkai. The ability to control the thing we need to survive is one thing, but they can also fly (putting them out of reach from almost all other Youkai who are melee, hint: that would be Vampires, Werewolves, Snowpeople, Neko, mermaids, lamia, and humans) They can also disable their air competitors (the succubus) with their air powers. They can disable a Youkou with their air powers. They can effectively make a tornado of water to disable vampires. I mean there isn't much that isn't overpowered about them. Coupled with their lack of an obvious weakness, they are certainly a worthy adversary.

Granted, any Youkai who can hit something in the air from the ground would certainly count as a weakness for them.

(Screw Fairies) Finally the Lamia. Basically the psychic power of Lycans, but with more staying power and much more refined. Lamia's ability to control minds of Youkai in their Youkai forms are strong, making the only counter to stay in your weak human form, be human, or be immune to the powers. This makes most of the Youkai obsolete in a fight against them. Additionally they only have the glaring weakness of being blind without glasses, (coincidentally the weakness of Velma from scooby-doo, and that weakness really helped the bad guys). I can say this Youkai is overpowered, unless they could only use their powers when they can see the person. Additionally the person has to make eye contact (no matter how brief) in order for them to be useful. Also they should have the ability to influence decisions rather than out-right control them. At least for the sake of this RP. Currently they share a weakness with Lycans, only being relevant in 1v1s though (or possible 2v1 if they can get the two people to attack each other)

The Youkai are very loosely balanced, and imagination is the real power that will make a Youkai seem overpowered. But by pure analysis I would like to stand by the fact that it is not (and will not be) perfectly balanced.
  #608    
Old February 13th, 2013, 11:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lilizuki View Post
Well, it is Wednesday...

So, I know I've been laying the "hate" on thickly, but being serious for a moment...Solo just attempted to murder somebody. By tearing out their throat.
As is protocol for survival, right?

This is part of the idea behind Solo as a character. As is the first thing a wolf would do in a life-threatening situation if unable to flee. However, a Werewolf is probably too thick-skinned and muscular to actually die from a neck bite unless the throat was actually ripped out.



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  #609    
Old February 13th, 2013, 11:36 AM
Lilizuki
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Oh, so he was only trying to murder him a little bit. That's fine, then.
  #610    
Old February 13th, 2013, 11:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lilizuki View Post
Oh, so he was only trying to murder him a little bit. That's fine, then.
Who said it was fine? Though to be fair, They attacked first, and outnumber him.

How will this play out for punishment? No clue. But that's the fun part. Assuming he actually gets out of the situation.



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  #611    
Old February 13th, 2013, 12:18 PM
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HAHAH KAILEY IS AWESOME!!

now, to the real matter c:

I'm sorry Khawill but... I think the Youkai's are balanced pretty well. Hmmm... i'll have to change Mermaids and Lamia a little though ;; but futher I don't think there are more over-powered Youkai. I'm very sorry you feel that way, but I can't really change much because other RPers might not agree with the idea of their Youkai's becoming even more weaker. The Youkai have just as much weaknesses as power, and I have someone who agrees to this.

It's the RPer who make them SEEM stronger, it doesn't mean they really are. Everyone is equal afterall.

But, I do agree with the Lamia fact and the mermaid matter.

Mermaids don't really have a weakness and i'll change that right now. As for Lamia's, from now on their weakness is also Fire (My apologies Genevieve)
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  #612    
Old February 13th, 2013, 12:39 PM
Lilizuki
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WolfOfEve View Post
Who said it was fine? Though to be fair, They attacked first, and outnumber him.

How will this play out for punishment? No clue. But that's the fun part. Assuming he actually gets out of the situation.
No, they didn't attack first; it was revenge for something Solo initiated the day before.

How it should play out for punishment is Solo getting arrested and living out the rest of his days behind bars. 'Cause y'know. Murder.
  #613    
Old February 13th, 2013, 12:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lilizuki View Post
No, they didn't attack first; it was revenge for something Solo initiated the day before.

How it should play out for punishment is Solo getting arrested and living out the rest of his days behind bars. 'Cause y'know. Murder.
That depends on where you shift blame in situations like this, but I'd rather not start any argument on the matter, seeing as the fight is probably about over now.

Technically the fight on the first day was equal blame to both parties, though, Solo just won. Not so much this time, but others came to help.

No one died, though; Solo was more likely to die in that battle anyways.

The headmaster is probably laughing his ass off right now.



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  #614    
Old February 13th, 2013, 12:46 PM
Lilizuki
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If the headmaster is laughing his ass off about attempted murder, then every rule of the Academy is worthless.

Of course, no repercussions will come of it, because we can't possibly have characters suffering for their actions! No, just a verbal warning. "Murder isn't good, kids! Now, off you go."

Ridiculous. Utterly ridiculous.
  #615    
Old February 13th, 2013, 12:54 PM
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He seems pretty f***ed up about that sort of thing.

Still too soon to say what the repercussions will be, but it's too soon to say there won't be any.



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  #616    
Old February 13th, 2013, 12:59 PM
Lilizuki
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There won't be any repercussions because, if there were, Solo wouldn't be in the game. "Getting beaten up" certainly doesn't count.

But hey, advantage for me. It means Elene can pimp slap teachers and get away with it.

  #617    
Old February 13th, 2013, 01:35 PM
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machomuu
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The whole "no repercussions about fights" thing seems to be born from a trope I like to call the "Demon School" trope, most commonly seen in anime, manga, and games (though also seen in Western media) that follow the exploits of a school (or a world, if put in a more subtle context) of inhuman or semi-human creatures...which happens quite a bit.

I think Disgaea 3, which in this case is the trope namer, is the best example of this. The teachers don't give a crap about whether the students act bad (though in that case, the teachers don't really give a crap about most things, such as teaching and rules and the like). Other things tend to do this as well, sort of implying that because they are not human, they are innately ferocious, and because of that, the teachers are far more lenient.

...Though I don't think that this is the best place for that trope. You'd think that the teachers would be far more strict (and far more adept) given the range of abilities and the natural strengths of the students, as well as their weaknesses to each other. Plus because...well...humans don't have powers or the natural strength that many youkai have, and since the youkai are learning to be human, you'd think the teachers would staunch and restrict such callous use of their powers for the sake of discipline.
  #618    
Old February 13th, 2013, 01:39 PM
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THIS IS NOT FUNNY! IT LOOKS LIKE TAIGA IS ***** SLAPPING HIGOROSHI-SENSEI!! (he looks like him ;^; )

The headmaster doesn't laugh when someone dies. He isn't happy right now anyway and you'll find out in the next Ryuu post… which will be tomorrow, I originally planned to post it tonight but I reconsidered because I also have to post as Nami. It's 10:37 pm right now and the posts together will take me a hour. So I hope you guys don't mind… (Only 4 hours of school tomorrow so it'll be in the early evening)
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  #619    
Old February 13th, 2013, 01:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PinkSapphire View Post
THIS IS NOT FUNNY! IT LOOKS LIKE TAIGA IS ***** SLAPPING HIGOROSHI-SENSEI!! (he looks like him ;^; )
I think that's hilarious, personally.



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  #620    
Old February 13th, 2013, 01:53 PM
Lilizuki
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The problem is that, given his other interests, Ryuu would probably enjoy it. :x

I don't mind waiting for a decision on this. But if somebody can get away with attempted murder, then I'd expect it to affect the story and setting. Students will slowly stop caring about any of the rules, which would eventually lead to anarchy.

I know it seems like I'm singling out for persecution, but there's a reason I've made Elene be very careful about what she does in public. I'd expect the same for her, should she ever...snap somebody's neck or something.
  #621    
Old February 13th, 2013, 01:56 PM
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Does that include throwing knives close to peoples' heads? One slip up...



*
  #622    
Old February 13th, 2013, 01:58 PM
Lilizuki
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Intent is the big difference between them, and Elene would not slip up. Even if she did, it would likely be considered manslaughter instead of murder.

Also, need I point out that it was Solo throwing about one hundred knives and assorted cutlery, and people, at once? :x
  #623    
Old February 13th, 2013, 02:02 PM
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That is deadly, but the whole scream wasn't an intentional choice of his. he was overcome with blinding rage and that was how it let itself out.

In this situation, Solo isn't attempting murder, he's trying to defend himself.

If others hadn't come, he'd probably have died.



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  #624    
Old February 13th, 2013, 02:10 PM
Lilizuki
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They'd be classified as crimes of passion.

"A crime of passion, or crime passionnel, in popular usage, refers to a violent crime, especially murder, in which the perpetrator commits the act against someone because of sudden strong impulse such as sudden rage or heartbreak rather than as a premeditated crime."

Again, the difference is his intent. By going for this person's throat, he was attempting to murder them.

This is disregarding the fact that he's proven himself a blatant threat to the school as a whole already, in what's meant to be civilized lands. A fight on the first day, almost killing people with uncontrolled telekinesis on the next, and intending to kill another a few short minutes later. At the very, very least, I'd give him a device that inhibits his powers and have a powerful Youkai constantly at his side.
  #625    
Old February 13th, 2013, 02:14 PM
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I'm really starting to think we're going to have a problem; I don't think I've seen you complain about anything anyone else has done, it seems always directed at me.

Still don't want to make enemies, but I dislike having to defend myself at all times (I had quite enough of it growing up).

If there's some issue you have with me personally, then at the very least it should be at the very least brought to light, and solved so that it does not cause any future problems.



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