[Spoilers] BWS2 019 - BWS2 024: The Unova League!

[Aerilyn]

This thread will cover the discussion of the Unova League arc from start to finish.

BWS2 019 - Curtain Up, Unova League // The Unova League Higaki Tournament Begins! Ash VS Trip!!
BWS2 020 - Mission: Defeat Your Rival! // Fierce Fighting! Win Your Way Through the Rival Battles!!
BWS2 021 - Lost at the League! // Axew Gets Lost
BWS2 022 - Strong Strategy Steals the Show! // Sawk Enters! Ash VS Stephan!
BWS2 023 - Cameron's Secret Weapon! // Ash VS Cameron! The Hydreigon Secret Weapon!!
BWS2 024 - A Unova League Evolution // Unova League Conclusion! Lucario VS Pikachu!!

At last, the Unova League! After all that work, Ash has finally managed to make it to the Pokémon League. That didn't take too long now did it? Probably could have had a fare few better episodes and plots leading up to it, but so long as we got there, I digress.

To kick off with the first episode, let's get right down to the most shocking part about the episode: They finally said Stephan's name right! I found that to be quite funny.

Overall, a pretty solid episode. I couldn't help but notice the lack of excitement level present, however, compared to previous league episodes in seasons past. It just didn't have that certain spark that the anime has when Ash finally makes it to the region's league tournament. Did anyone else feel this way?

And like most of the Black and White season, the battles were quickly brushed upon. I'm kind of surprised at how quickly Ash and Trip are battling one another, but at the same time I'm okay with it. It kind of proves my point in an earlier thread that the writers really don't care for Trip too much as a rival and just want to wrap up his storyline with Ash as quickly as possible.

If only they had introduced Cameron earlier.

[Yuki's Sword]

This episode disappointed me with its presentation. I never liked how Trip was matched up with Ash first. It would have been better if Ash were matched up with Trip later, honestly. Cameron's unpreparedness was a little annoying, but it was the funny part. Oh and I love how they finally got Stephan's name right. xD That was the best part. I like how he didn't notice at first that Ash said it right--lol.

If I had to rate this on a scale of one to ten I'd give it a 7/10 for some of the things of which I mentioned above.

[Aerilyn]

So, I really wanted Bianca to win. Like, the whole season I was really rooting for her character to be perceived as a total klutz but end up winning the whole darn league. I thought that would have been a cool twist of events. Alas, as we saw, that did not happen.

Actually, the second episode of the league was much better than the first. I still wouldn't call it "good" but it was definitely better. The entire episode was centered around battling, which is how it should always be in episodes like these. My only major complaint is how Pikachu struggled so much against Trip's Serperior, barely landed an attack before, and then managed to win the battle in one hit. Obviously Ash had to win this, but I just felt like the writers really rushed the whole thing and I found Ash's win against Trip hard to swallow. I would say "hard to believe" but this is the anime we're talking about and some pretty wonky things have happened already.

However, props to putting in a move combination. It felt very Hoenn/Sinnoh-esque with all of the focus back then with move combinations for contests. I can't remember last when Ash did that.

I did like the battle between Bianca and Cameron though! I thought that was pretty entertaining to watch. Well, their second battle (Riolu vs. Emboar). Their first round was so terrible what with how quick Bianca's Escavalier fainted from a physical move after getting in three Iron Defenses and dodged all of the other attacks prior to it. It just felt cheap. :\

[jfuze174]

What do you think (if you have seen all of the unova league matches) were the hit and misses of this generations pokemon league my opinion is that the battle scenes were awesome but all the matches felt rushed I felt like the pokemon leagued deserved atleast three -four more episodes before concluding it I won't spoil it if you haven't seen the episodes especially that haven't all aired in the US yet but state your opinions trainers

[Darkrai Lv.1000]

I also feel it was rushed. Ash's Pokemon aren't even fully evolved yet, when most of them will usually be, especially at least one of the starters. The only ones that are evolved are Leavanny and Unfezant.

I also hate the fact that they beat off Trip in the qualifying rounds. I like that Ash finally beat him, but there's supposed to be an awesome full battle where he finally shows the rival his skills, but that one-on-one was weak IMO. And I still don't understand why he was suddenly so nice all of a sudden beforehand without any sort of explanation.

Though I commend them for trying something different instead of the same league formula: Ash eventually beats the main rival about halfway in, which is the whole point/height of the arc, then loses to the friend he met last who may go on to win the league. With this, though I haven't seen the episodes yet, my prediction is that Ash will lose to Cameron, who will either win the league or lose to Vergil right after beating Ash, who will win the league.

[Razor Leaf]

There's an Unova League thread already, so I'll merge this into that one since they can be covering the same stuff. :]

[Aerilyn]

Originally Posted by Darkrai Lv.1000

I also feel it was rushed. Ash's Pokemon aren't even fully evolved yet, when most of them will usually be, especially at least one of the starters. The only ones that are evolved are Leavanny and Unfezant.

I also hate the fact that they beat off Trip in the qualifying rounds. I like that Ash finally beat him, but there's supposed to be an awesome full battle where he finally shows the rival his skills, but that one-on-one was weak IMO. And I still don't understand why he was suddenly so nice all of a sudden beforehand without any sort of explanation.

I'm actually a bit surprised that Ash's Tepig hasn't evolved into an Emboar by this time. Not just because it's become sort of expected for him to have at least one fully evolved starter around this time, but because the overall opinion of Tepig is pretty unpopular and the anime serves to advertise and commercialize, hence why Oshawott hasn't evolved yet and probably never will.

As for Trip, I took it as a way of the writers recognizing he was pretty much a failure of a rival and wanted to get rid of him as soon as possible. Also why they could have introduced Cameron albeit a little too late.

About today's episode, "Lost at the League." You know, it makes sense for trainers to get a day for a little R&R in the middle of the league. However, this is television and television aims to entertain. Putting in a filler in the middle of an already disappointing league wasn't very wise on the writer's part. It distracts the audience from the main focus of the league. On top of that, the writers already had to rush this league before the N Episodes started, so why they decided to add in a filler episode right in the middle rather than milk the league as much as they can, I will never know.

That being said, it was an alright episode. I'm usually fond of the episodes that will put more focus on the Pokémon's little adventures at times. This one was no exception other than being oddly placed.

[EternallyAnna]

You know, I'm kind of confused as to why everything's being rushed when we're getting a filler arc that doesn't seem to even last till the release of XY. This all could have been done so much better but they're just barrelling through for no good reason as far as I can tell?

Going to have to agree on the weirdness of Lost At The League. It was... not that great and just kind of made me think "why? what is the reason for this happening? :|"

[Aerilyn]

"Strong Strategy Steals the Show!" has probably been the best installment of the Unova League arc thus far. It was the most battle centric, little to no distractions, and it was engaging enough to really sit down and enjoy. By no means was it the best league episode ever done, but considering what we've been given so far, it has definitely been the best at this point.

What was probably the most refreshing was that the writers finally focused in on the battling, which has been lacking a lot this entire saga. Basically none of the battle scenes between Ash and Stephan were cut too short. It was also a satisfying end to their pseudo-rivalry against one another.

A few things I'd like to point out though:

- The VA of the referee is the same person who voices James. I meant to point that out last week, but I forgot.

- Why are the writers forgetting that after a Pokémon uses a move like Hyper Beam or Giga Impact, they have to rest the next turn? They've done this a number of times this season. All I'm saying, Liepard should not have been able to use Double Team or Shadow Claw immediately after Hyper Beam. Not cool, writers.

- Leavanny getting some great screen time! I appreciated the writers letting it have a good fight. Same goes for Palpitoad. My only complaint? Palpitoad supposedly learned a new move from the time of its capture till now and Ash commented on how he's been training Leavanny to be more agile. It would have been nice to see these two things being done on screen.

Overall a good episode! I look forward to next week and seeing Cameron and Ash go head to head. Also, lol at Cameron camping out on the field so he's not late. Is that even legal?

[EternallyAnna]

- oh oh I forgot! I really liked seeing how far Scraggy has progressed! He's gone from weakling battles with Axew to taking out Pokémon at League level I mean wow well done! And it's been shown over the course of the series, too- he's not just randomly powered up just for plot convenience.

- I love love love MustardShipping Ash and Stephan's relationship. They're good friends outside of battle but take each other seriously and wow they're just really fun together and the match was fantastic because of that! Well, not just because of that. But a good part of it~

- There are just way too many explosions for no reason. Still. Always. Why. :|

- I wish we could have seen more training. I feel like we haven't actually seen Ash training his Pokémon much? idk

- Bulk Up is forever creepy-looking.

- Did anyone else notice Katharine and her demanding Gothorita hanging around? And Dino from the Club Battle? Them showing up even in the background makes me happy. :D

- Can we talk about the fact the Cilan made Ash's favourite meal as a congratulations and was super happy for him and excited to give his present? No? Okay I'll just... wander off...

All in all, Ash VS Stephan was an absolutely gorgeous battle. The spark came back for this one, certainly. There was creative use of moves and Pokémon and a lack of stock animation which made for a unique and satisfying... oh crap I really was about to say 'taste' there and wow ok too much Cilan time for Anna. Anyway. It was intense and beautiful and amazing and wow more like this please.

Originally Posted by Shivi

Also, lol at Cameron camping out on the field so he's not late. Is that even legal?

Probably not lmao but he doesn't seem to be aware of things like laws. Or rules. Or time. Or much, really. What a scatterbrained dork. ♥

[alienhunterx]

I am still surprised to see who is going to win the Unova league and I also agree with Yuki's Sword why they choose Ash to battle Trip on the very first round. This is so unfair

[Aerilyn]

Finally watched the latest episode since I got back home yesterday, and wow, talk about an all out attack. Both Cameron and Ash kept yelling out attack after attack so quickly. They surely wasted no time in deciding what to do next. Which is kind of odd for Ash, because as far as I can recall, I've never really seen him battle that way before. Not saying he's always thought out his next move, but he's never really been so quick to respond like he was in "Cameron's Secret Weapon."

Speaking about the Dub title, it's kind of ironic isn't it? Cameron's secret weapon was supposed to be Hydreigon, but turned out to really be Lucario in the end. Even he was surprised! I thought that was kind of funny and quite creative of the writers.

I don't really have much to say about this episode though. It was fun and it definitely moved along quickly. At times I actually kept thinking, "I wish they'd slow down a bit." I wasn't really keen on both Cameron and Ash knocking out multiple Pokémon in a row. It didn't really give some of their respective Pokémon enough to time shine in battle when you think about it. And does Ash always have to use his "weaker" Pokémon so late in the competition. This isn't the first time the writers have decided to give Ash his lesser used Pokémon for final battles. All I'm saying is, Krookodile should have been one of his Pokémon used here rather than in the battle before.

[alienhunterx]

Originally Posted by Aerilyn

Finally watched the latest episode since I got back home yesterday, and wow, talk about an all out attack. Both Cameron and Ash kept yelling out attack after attack so quickly. They surely wasted no time in deciding what to do next. Which is kind of odd for Ash, because as far as I can recall, I've never really seen him battle that way before. Not saying he's always thought out his next move, but he's never really been so quick to respond like he was in "Cameron's Secret Weapon."

Speaking about the Dub title, it's kind of ironic isn't it? Cameron's secret weapon was supposed to be Hydreigon, but turned out to really be Lucario in the end. Even he was surprised! I thought that was kind of funny and quite creative of the writers.

I don't really have much to say about this episode though. It was fun and it definitely moved along quickly. At times I actually kept thinking, "I wish they'd slow down a bit." I wasn't really keen on both Cameron and Ash knocking out multiple Pokémon in a row. It didn't really give some of their respective Pokémon enough to time shine in battle when you think about it. And does Ash always have to use his "weaker" Pokémon so late in the competition. This isn't the first time the writers have decided to give Ash his lesser used Pokémon for final battles. All I'm saying is, Krookodile should have been one of his Pokémon used here rather than in the battle before.

I must budge in to say that maybe the pressure of loss might be coming upon him. You know he always lose an important match whenever he comes closer to the victory

[Aerilyn]

There we have it folks, the last leg of the Unova League. It sure was a ride, wasn't it?

I appreciate that even though Pignite is Ash's only evolved Unova starter [thus far], they saved Snivy for last and continued to show its strengths even to the last bit of strength she had against Cameron's Lucario.

Overall though, this was a bit of a disappointing end to Ash's larger arc in Unova and it was a bit anticlimactic. Where was all the big explosions and Pikachu lighting up the entire field with a massive Thunder Bolt before its final fall? It certainly didn't live up to the Sinnoh League in my opinion. I mean, sure, Ash losing to Tobias' legendary Pokémon was a total sellout, but I found him losing to Cameron and his recently evolved Lucario to be cheap. Cameron, as much as I like the character, was kind of a mess so it's hard to believe he would beat Ash like that. Also, I didn't feel like there was enough build up to these episodes. In Sinnoh, you felt the built up with Ash and Paul's rivalry, but here, we've only gotten to know and see Cameron for such a short period of time and Trip was gone early, so there really wasn't much hype.

It was kind of funny how Cilan, Bianca, and Stephan kept underestimating Ash's Pikachu though. Like, I just kept thinking, "If they only knew what Pikachu has been up against already. If they only knew."

Also, I'm upset Ash and Virgil never got to battle. The writers had implied that they would, but never did. Maybe they forgot (lol). It's also a bit disappointing Ash didn't make it back into the Top 4. He got pushed back to the Top 8 which is a first. He's either always matched his prior place or moved up a tier.

Anyway, I'm complaining too much and this is getting lengthy. I need to say something positive. Um...Oh! I liked the extended version of the opening theme song and I did like the short montage of Ash looking back at his travels in Unova. That was nice.

All in all, I didn't really care much for this league conference. I look forward to us finally moving onto the N Episodes.

[Lapras*]

I thought the entire league was disappointing. Instead of focusing on a bunch of different battles that people were having, they only showed snippets of those that weren't Ash's or Cameron's. Half of one episode was also people talking in the hot springs when they could have used that time to extend the battles. And even when they happened, the battles seemed rushed and the only exception to me was Pikachu & Snivy vs Lucario. I was also excited to see all of Virgil's eeveelutions but I guess not?

I'm just mainly disappointed because watch, for example, Hoenn's league conference, and then Unova's.

[EternallyAnna]

The league was... shockingly lacking in decent content tbh. I really don't thibk there was enough focus on these battles that should have been really good. And also they were really lacking in depth and strategy... it felt very much like how the gameplay goes rather than a dynamic and creative battle. I'm very disappointed. :( This has been a problem throughout Unova but still, this is kind of the Thing Everything Leads Up To and it could and should have been better.

[alienhunterx]

Originally Posted by Aerilyn

There we have it folks, the last leg of the Unova League. It sure was a ride, wasn't it?

I appreciate that even though Pignite is Ash's only evolved Unova starter [thus far], they saved Snivy for last and continued to show its strengths even to the last bit of strength she had against Cameron's Lucario.

Overall though, this was a bit of a disappointing end to Ash's larger arc in Unova and it was a bit anticlimactic. Where was all the big explosions and Pikachu lighting up the entire field with a massive Thunder Bolt before its final fall? It certainly didn't live up to the Sinnoh League in my opinion. I mean, sure, Ash losing to Tobias' legendary Pokémon was a total sellout, but I found him losing to Cameron and his recently evolved Lucario to be cheap. Cameron, as much as I like the character, was kind of a mess so it's hard to believe he would beat Ash like that. Also, I didn't feel like there was enough build up to these episodes. In Sinnoh, you felt the built up with Ash and Paul's rivalry, but here, we've only gotten to know and see Cameron for such a short period of time and Trip was gone early, so there really wasn't much hype.

It was kind of funny how Cilan, Bianca, and Stephan kept underestimating Ash's Pikachu though. Like, I just kept thinking, "If they only knew what Pikachu has been up against already. If they only knew."

Also, I'm upset Ash and Virgil never got to battle. The writers had implied that they would, but never did. Maybe they forgot (lol). It's also a bit disappointing Ash didn't make it back into the Top 4. He got pushed back to the Top 8 which is a first. He's either always matched his prior place or moved up a tier.

Anyway, I'm complaining too much and this is getting lengthy. I need to say something positive. Um...Oh! I liked the extended version of the opening theme song and I did like the short montage of Ash looking back at his travels in Unova. That was nice.

All in all, I didn't really care much for this league conference. I look forward to us finally moving onto the N Episodes.

Bro you stole the exact words from my mouth. Really disappointed too after Ash's loss to Cameron. Man why the heck. At Ash should could battle Virgil in the final round