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  #1    
Old March 20th, 2013, 06:07 AM
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You know, I'm a person who sometimes use an emulator to emulate pretty old games like Super Mario World for the SNES, or Legend of Zelda: Majora's Mask for the N64. However, downloading video games in general is pretty much a common law that's broken, and thus, Video Game Piracy is said to be a problem worldwide.

Now, what do you guys think of video game piracy? Do you think that it's a law that should be more investigated, or, since it's common for people to download their video games, do you think that it's not a bid deal? But thinking about this, how much is too much? Are there limits that people should have when it comes to downloading video games?

On a related topic, how would you feel if the current systems were to be more regularly pirated or emulated (even though I hear it's very hard or impossible to emulate the 3DS. I think. Someone can correct me here)? (again, feel free to correct me if I'm wrong here). Any other thoughts? Feel free to share them.
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Last edited by Miss Doronjo; March 20th, 2013 at 06:19 AM.
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  #2    
Old March 20th, 2013, 11:06 AM
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My parents will not buy expensive games.

More games are getting towards prices over 50 dollars. My parents will not pay for it. The only choice I have at times is piracy.

Sometimes, I like to think of piracy as a 'try before you buy'. I don't want to buy a game I will not like. Some games I have pirated I buy later.

I think companies make enough money, with or without pirating at the time.
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  #3    
Old March 20th, 2013, 12:47 PM
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I will buy a game I want, and am pretty sure I will enjoy if I have the money.
I always pay for indie games.
I will rarely pay for a game that cannot be bought physically anymore (not including from ebay and such).

When I have been through a period with not much money I will tend to pirate everything because I simply cannot afford to buy any games.

I will also pirate games I have no intention of ever buying (not good enough for the amount they are asking).

The way I pirate is that no sale is lost because I was never going to give any money in the first place.
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  #4    
Old March 20th, 2013, 01:27 PM
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Video game piracy (and piracy in general) is a matter that's pretty much trivial to me. I don't pirate anything, but I'm not going to judge you if you would get something for free rather than pay for it. My thinking, however, is that if you like a video game, then you want to motivate the developers to make more and the best way to show them that is through sales numbers. Plus it's their jobs and they have mouths to feed, just like anybody else.
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  #5    
Old March 20th, 2013, 03:53 PM
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Unfortunately it doesn't amaze me how major video game companies not only continue to pump out uninspired, repetitive games, but also shamelessly raise the prices for no real reason. Meanwhile some truly creative games such as Limbo and Amnesia sell for 5-15 pounds.

I don't pay for games unless they're console exclusive (and even then I only buy if it's really appealing). The downside is, I don't have access to online play, which is a fairly big part of a lot of games. I've also spent my fair share of money on very disappointing games (Star Wars: ToR, FFXIII...)

I don't lose sleep over the fact that I have little money to spare on anything; so I certainly don't because some rich companies aren't getting my money. This is the whole cause of internet piracy. If you give poor people a means to acquire things for free, they'll do it, and it's only the rich that get upset about it.
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  #6    
Old March 20th, 2013, 08:15 PM
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It is a problem, yes, but I see it as a try-before-you-buy type deal. I downloaded White version once, but I ended up buying it and just transferred my save file over with an adapter. I'm planning to do the same with White 2 when I get it. I've done it before with other games too, like MadWorld and Picross 3D.
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  #7    
Old March 21st, 2013, 02:19 PM
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I pirate PC games for one main reason - the internet connection requirements.

Back when I was dialup, I had bought a game that required Steam. Steam refused to work on dialup. The only support that Steam gave me was pretty much 'haha, **** you, go get better internet."

They didn't want to support me when I was a paying customer - So **** them, I'll pirate the games instead and not have to deal with the IC requirement crap. As for non steam games, if it requires a active internet connection for single player stuff, I'm pirating it.

Some games I intend to buy legit copies of, if I ever get regular dsl, for multiplayer.
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  #8    
Old March 21st, 2013, 08:17 PM
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I'm always of the belief that when a company stops supporting a console (Genesis, N64, GBA, etc.), it should be free reign on emulating and distributing games. Any sort of pirated PC games or even DS/3DS ROMs I'm not a big fan of- but it doesn't bother me at all if someone else wants to use them (although I do understand the concept of trying it before buying it, similar to game demos). The only game I can honestly say I've pirated is the original Sims, and that was only because our game disc got too scratched up over time, and couldn't be read.
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  #9    
Old March 27th, 2013, 12:31 AM
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The games are really expensive here, and the prices never drop. Pokemon Diamond, for example, still costs ~50$, and BWB2W2 are just 10$ higher. With the average wages here, it's way to expensive. That's why piracy is the only option to actually play games. If people wouldn't pirate the games, then they probably wouldn't buy it anyway, so it's not really a loss for the game company. Doesn't change the fact that it's still illegal, but it's not hurting the company.

I was really happy when I managed to find used Pokemon HeartGold and Diamond for ~13$ each. It's definitely not the same buying and pirating it. You cherish bought games more than pirated. I remember back in the SNES days, I'd play the games for months. You definitely spend more time on a bought game (unless you buy new games every day haha). That's what I really miss.
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  #10    
Old March 27th, 2013, 08:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZetaZaku View Post
The games are really expensive here, and the prices never drop. Pokemon Diamond, for example, still costs ~50$, and BWB2W2 are just 10$ higher. With the average wages here, it's way to expensive. That's why piracy is the only option to actually play games. If people wouldn't pirate the games, then they probably wouldn't buy it anyway, so it's not really a loss for the game company. Doesn't change the fact that it's still illegal, but it's not hurting the company.

I was really happy when I managed to find used Pokemon HeartGold and Diamond for ~13$ each. It's definitely not the same buying and pirating it. You cherish bought games more than pirated. I remember back in the SNES days, I'd play the games for months. You definitely spend more time on a bought game (unless you buy new games every day haha). That's what I really miss.
Couldnt agree more.
As i pirate most of my games(Prepare to see my game collection,the most games i have are for the original GB)i tend to get bored of them faster in contrast with the physical copies in which i actually bother find all the acheivements.
I dont know why but i feel nice that the 3ds cant be pirated.Weird.....
Nothing beats the real thing.
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  #11    
Old March 27th, 2013, 09:07 AM
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I like most others use it as a try-before-you-buy scheme, but it is highly taken advantage of. I agree that game prices lately have been outrageous, but there's not much you can do.

Personally, I do not think downloading old games should even count as piracy anymore. Unless you still have your old systems, finding a great condition SNES or N64 can be pricey, especially if you're looking for the games also. So no, I do not feel bad for owning a Pokemon Red or Stadium file (especially since I've owned both previously).

Lastly, I also do not think it counts as Piracy if you plan on buying the game. This goes back along with the try-before-you-buy situation. It's like downloading a song when it leaks before it's officially release.

I guess I'm kind of rambling now but I do think it's a big problem... Though nothing will probably ever be done about it legally, that'd be too much work for our government.
The only thing that will be done will be the ever growing difficulty it is to emulate the games, like said above about it being nearly impossible to emulate the 3DS.
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  #12    
Old March 27th, 2013, 09:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Magykx View Post
I like most others use it as a try-before-you-buy scheme, but it is highly taken advantage of. I agree that game prices lately have been outrageous, but there's not much you can do.

Personally, I do not think downloading old games should even count as piracy anymore. Unless you still have your old systems, finding a great condition SNES or N64 can be pricey, especially if you're looking for the games also. So no, I do not feel bad for owning a Pokemon Red or Stadium file (especially since I've owned both previously).
You know, I feel exactly the same way.

Like I've said on the OP, I'd use an emulator to play really old games like, the ones for the NES, and maybe the SNES, all the way up to the N64. These kinds of games are getting rarer, and rarer, and, well, this is only speaking to where I live, but, they seem to be getting pricer and pricer. Hence, the only reason why I use emulators.

I don't rely on reviews so much, hence why I like the try-it-before you buy it ordeal, but... it's getting harder to come by. D=
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  #13    
Old March 29th, 2013, 02:08 PM
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I don't pirate. I don't find games expensive at all. I find them at a good price. not saying I buy 6 new games every week mind you but I find them fair enough to buy. At least over here in the USA
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Old March 30th, 2013, 10:47 PM
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I mainly use it as pseudo-renting. The only other times I would do it is if the game is out of print with no new cycle in sight (especially older games), and games that are rare, hard to import, and/or for playing hacks.
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  #15    
Old March 30th, 2013, 11:11 PM
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I used to pirate everything because I never had money and had restrictive parents.
Now that I can actually get games legitimately now, I buy them. I have spent thousands of dollars on games. If I want a game that I can't buy, or has really restrictive DRM, I may or may not occasionally resort to Usenet and Torrents. (Though I actually haven't done this for years now that I think of it.)

I don't think Piracy is really a problem since usually the people who pirate games are the kind of people who wouldn't buy them anyway, so no money is really lost. There is no scarcity when it comes to digital copies of anything, because copying things pretty much costs nothing. Piracy can also work like advertising if developers are smart about it. (Such was the deal with Minecraft...) Piracy can also be a political thing if a company does something that is terrible. (Vote with your wallets.)

For example, I will actively support developers that I like with my wallet, even if I don't like one or two of their games. They have mouths to feed, and they need a paycheque like any other person. But I also want people to discourage things like the whole SimCity DRM deal from ever happening again by not buying games that have such horrible service with such a disregard for legitimate customers. I will actively avoid those games, I don't want any of my money going into the development of things that annoy legitimate customers. If they don't want legitimate customers, I certainly won't be one of them.

If something is incredibly bad it's not even funny, I may even help pirates because I want higher-ups in the companies that already have nasty service to put in the most magnificently horrible DRM ever on the next thing they make so that it falls flat on its face in such a magnificent manner as to discourage it from ever happening again and to get the person who decided it was a good idea fired.

Last edited by Archenoth; March 31st, 2013 at 12:06 AM.
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  #16    
Old March 30th, 2013, 11:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZetaZaku View Post
You cherish bought games more than pirated. I remember back in the SNES days, I'd play the games for months. You definitely spend more time on a bought game (unless you buy new games every day haha). That's what I really miss.
I honestly can't say this is entirely true, because I tend to trade in games with little remorse, and the difference in my playtime between bought and pirated games is negligible; however, I can say that the "try before you buy" philosophy in sects of piracy has definitely influenced my buying decisions. I've spent a ton of time playing a pirated Etrian Odyssey III, but it's what drove me to buying Etrian Odyssey IV.

If I didn't like it, it would have been a waste of my money to have bought it, and I'd have been (in the big picture) furthering development of a game I didn't enjoy.

I also use piracy for things that will never leave Japan, at least where Nintendo consoles are concerned. Bleach: Vs Crusade, Tales of Innocence, etc. At least the PS3 isn't region-locked, and it's possible to have accounts for multiple regions. (The only issues left there are importing games and/or getting region-appropriate PlayStation Store cards, and... y'know, understanding Japanese. |D ... Oh, and the Vita. Sony took some amazing potential and pulled a bunch of crap with the firmware. Gotta freakin' reformat the Vita every time you change regions, and memory cards are account-locked to my knowledge.)
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  #17    
Old April 2nd, 2013, 08:04 AM
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I'm personally not against it. I just find the "it's ok for old games" arguments somewhat interesting, since you can "usually" find re-release, VC, or Collection titles with alot of the popular old titles, and they really arn't expensive. I really find it interesting that people think 5.00 is to much to spend on a NES Game. I mean I'm not rich, but I'll gladly drop a few bucks just to play a title legit. I have used emulation, but it's usually if the game is impossibly rare or expensive, or in alternative, I want to play it with a keyboard and I already own the title. (Pokemon Yellow mainly) I've emulated games like Earthbound and Fire Emblem: The Sacred Stones. In both cases the developer is not getting money, but I'm still paying 50-60 bucks for the game.

I guess in the end my answer comes down to the the fact that I rather pay developers then pawn shops.
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Old April 4th, 2013, 05:35 PM
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In my opinion, pirating currently available retail games equals stealing (like shoplifting), since they are still available for purchase.

However, it's a completely different case for retro games that are no longer available (ex. GBA, NES), because regardless of how you get them (eBay, amazon, downloading ROMs, other yada-yada) the developers won't be making/losing any money from them.
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Old April 4th, 2013, 06:12 PM
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I think that emulation is legitimate, and is not considered piracy in a few situations:
1. You own/have owned the physical game.
2. You own the physical game, and cannot play it due to restrictions in the game code. (PC games are a typical offender in this situation with some DRM schemes requiring active connections to the internet)
3. The game is no longer being sold new in retail outlets.
4. The game is not made available in your region, and laws, trade restrictions, technical limitations or tariffs/shipping make the game impossible to import and play on your own system.
5. The game is priced beyond a fair value in the retail market. This means games should not excessively exceed the average game price unless you're getting more than just a game in the deal.
6. The game has been released for longer than 5 years and is no longer commonly found in retail outlets, even if still sold. Meaning the manufacturer of the game has probably stopped making new copies, but they're still in stores stocks if this situation is present.

Piracy is the act of obtaining a game for free, IF NONE OF THE ABOVE SITUATIONS EXIST IN YOUR CASE. The above situations no longer apply if you begin to distribute the game and profit from that distribution somehow, except for #3 and/or #6 if you've legitimately bought and paid for the copies you've sold somehow.

I believe Piracy should not be encouraged, however I find that it is the responsibility of the rights holder, who originally created the game, to deter the piracy and make their product more readily available to anyone who might be encouraged to pirate the game. This means that DRM should not be disruptive, nor rely upon something like an internet connection. If you refuse to support a customer's particular situation for whatever reasons, then they too have a right to refuse to support your development if they're already a paying customer.

It would be easier for all if they made legitimately obtaining a copy more attractive and easy than pirating one, through gentle piracy prevention controls like license keys or seamless encryption which unlocks to the user who bears it's key, and making the game easily available to anyone wishing to obtain it. It should be reasonably priced and never should a paying customer be able to find themselves in a situation where they're locked out of a product they paid for.
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Old April 7th, 2013, 10:09 PM
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I'm always moving from one game to another, and most games I play only once. So the buy-the-game-and-play-it-forever model as it is now doesn't help me. But Steam sales over 75% off sure do.


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  #21    
Old April 9th, 2013, 02:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pachy View Post
I think that emulation is legitimate, and is not considered piracy in a few situations:
1. You own/have owned the physical game.
2. You own the physical game, and cannot play it due to restrictions in the game code. (PC games are a typical offender in this situation with some DRM schemes requiring active connections to the internet)
3. The game is no longer being sold new in retail outlets.
4. The game is not made available in your region, and laws, trade restrictions, technical limitations or tariffs/shipping make the game impossible to import and play on your own system.
5. The game is priced beyond a fair value in the retail market. This means games should not excessively exceed the average game price unless you're getting more than just a game in the deal.
6. The game has been released for longer than 5 years and is no longer commonly found in retail outlets, even if still sold. Meaning the manufacturer of the game has probably stopped making new copies, but they're still in stores stocks if this situation is present.

Piracy is the act of obtaining a game for free, IF NONE OF THE ABOVE SITUATIONS EXIST IN YOUR CASE. The above situations no longer apply if you begin to distribute the game and profit from that distribution somehow, except for #3 and/or #6 if you've legitimately bought and paid for the copies you've sold somehow.

I believe Piracy should not be encouraged, however I find that it is the responsibility of the rights holder, who originally created the game, to deter the piracy and make their product more readily available to anyone who might be encouraged to pirate the game. This means that DRM should not be disruptive, nor rely upon something like an internet connection. If you refuse to support a customer's particular situation for whatever reasons, then they too have a right to refuse to support your development if they're already a paying customer.

It would be easier for all if they made legitimately obtaining a copy more attractive and easy than pirating one, through gentle piracy prevention controls like license keys or seamless encryption which unlocks to the user who bears it's key, and making the game easily available to anyone wishing to obtain it. It should be reasonably priced and never should a paying customer be able to find themselves in a situation where they're locked out of a product they paid for.
I really do second this, although I will add a addendum to this: I think that game developers should take note of piracy and find out why people are pirating other than them being dirty cheapskates *cough*drm*cough*.
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  #22    
Old April 11th, 2013, 09:49 PM
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I only really pirate Nintendo 64 games and GBA games, because I see it as anywhere I'm going to be buying it from won't be paying out dividends to the creators, as it's going to be second hand.
That said, I do sometimes pirate games that I'm thinking of buying, like Skyrim, then if I actually like it I'll go and buy it.
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Old April 11th, 2013, 10:41 PM
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I personally don't support piracy during the launch window of a Game's release. But, I don't consider it an act of stealing. Stealing is taking something and preventing the original owner from keeping it. You're not necessarily doing that with piracy. The owner of works usually want to prevent piracy so that they could get more money, and some companies are definitely money hungry when they release broken games and wonder why people don't want to pay for the games(i.e; E.A and Capcom.). I don't have enough posts to link to a video that explains it better than I can.
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  #24    
Old April 11th, 2013, 10:58 PM
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As others mentioned, I see pirating as a "try before you buy" deal. If I don't like the game, I won't buy it, and the "pirated" copy was more of a "demo" than anything. If I do like it, chances are I'll buy it if I can. For example, at one point it was hard to get a copy of Tales of Vesperia for '360. I pirated it and played it, but as soon as I saw it at 20$ at EB Games, I bought an actual copy - because it was worth it.

Going on that last statement, one game that I will play and I will never buy is The Sims games, expansions and stuff packs. They want an absurd amount of money to complete the game, and then some for Sim Store items. The base game was 60$ and all stuff / expansion packs are another 25$/ea for flimsy items, esp. since I only use a handful in the pack itself. Expansions are a little more worth while, but imo some things in these expansions should've been base-game included, and they're just trying to milk a recycled idea as best as they can. Well, not me. I love The Sims. But to have to pay 400$+ to "complete" the game with expansions like university, seasons and pets, well, no thanks.

Another cash cow is EA Sports games (and other companies' sports games, really). Every year they come out with a new version of FIFA or PES, and for what? Team adjustments? A little better graphics? A slight play tweak? You can't say that that crap is worth 70$ (yes, 69,99$ unlike most games, which are 59,99$ at release - not including 15% tax), compared to games like Resident Evil VI or Dragon's Dogma, Skyrim, Tales of Vesperia, etc. which are actually innovative, new and better-looking and are sold cheaper. Not to mention, the price never drops from 69,99$ until the new one is released - then it drops to 39,99$ or 49,99$, but then everyone buys the new one and the old one is never played online anymore. Wth! Again, EA is a culprit of multiple cash cows.

Some people might see pirates as wrong because what they're doing is more or less "stealing" in the law's eyes. Well, overcharging for a poorly designed game or recycled idea in an attempt to milk a franchise is stealing from the public. Plus, with all the music pirates out there, it's obviously not hurting anyone's salaries! You don't see Red Jumpsuit Apparatus or Eminem begging for food on the streets, and needless to say their stuff has been mass Torrent'ed or Frostwire'd.

It's not hurting anyone. It's not good to make the rich richer anyway. I don't really believe in capitalist dreams. If there was a way to implement Marxism, without deterring inventions or work habits (due to earning more or less the same regardless), I'd be all for it. Living well and healthy is better than living too rich or too poor.

As for games that can't be bought "New" anymore i.e. Epic Mickey for Wii (according to Videotron), there's no issue in pirating it instead of just second-handing it, simply because the developers already got their share for that title. Now it's just second-hand shops like EB Games and random pawn dealers that are making money off of it. What I really don't get in that situation is why the game is taxed again. The government already received their tax money for importing that product; why are they requesting more, if the due has been paid? Silly.
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Last edited by Yusshin; April 11th, 2013 at 11:12 PM.
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Old April 12th, 2013, 07:05 AM
Nuke
 
Community Supporter
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Gateshead, England.
Age: 18
Gender: Male
Nature: Relaxed
I personally emulate old games if I need to play them or if it's a PC game I might download it illegally before purchasing it (rare occurrence since I'm not usually interested in any PC games).

The one exception to this is that I currently have a ROM for White 2 because I sold my DS when buying a 3DS then sold that because it was crap, so I'd rather play it illegally now and buy it when I get a 3DS for X&Y than waste £50 on a regular DS just to play it the fair way now.
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