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  #1    
Old April 25th, 2013, 05:06 PM
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What do you think of the Atacama humanoid? Quite possibly the first case of an -alien looking- humanoid body that's been out in the public realm, and with solid evidence to back it up.

You won't see much of this in the mainstream media.





From Huffingtonpost:

Quote:
"The mummified remains of what looks like a 6-inch space alien has turned "Sirius" into the most eagerly awaited documentary among UFO enthusiasts."
"Sirius" focuses on the remains of the small humanoid, nicknamed Ata, that was discovered in Chile's Atacama Desert 10 years ago and has, literally, gone through different hands and ownership since then."

"I can say with absolute certainty that it is not a monkey. It is human -- closer to human than chimpanzees. It lived to the age of six to eight. Obviously, it was breathing, it was eating, it was metabolizing. It calls into question how big the thing might have been when it was born,"said Garry Nolan, director of stem cell biology at Stanford University's School of Medicine in California."
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/0...n_3135628.html


Personally, Im actually wondering how something like this didn't get shot down by the governments in power, and their obvious agendas to keep things like this, secret.

For you scientific ones; for the whole load of evidence, indulge yourselves here:
http://siriusdisclosure.com/evidence/atacama-humanoid/


Let me add that I've been watching the two hour documentary, it came out a few days ago. They're taking it down in Youtube and censoring it everywhere it's uploaded, so your best bet to get to see it is via torren- *Shot*
..It's worth it.


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Old April 25th, 2013, 08:08 PM
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As much as I love Georgio Tsukalos & The Ancient Astronaut theory, It looks like an elaborate fake to me. Sequence some DNA and then we shall see.
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Old April 25th, 2013, 08:10 PM
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Old April 25th, 2013, 09:09 PM
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Originally Posted by Livewire View Post
As much as I love Georgio Tsukalos & The Ancient Astronaut theory, It looks like an elaborate fake to me. Sequence some DNA and then we shall see.
Uhh.. I thought doubting was out of the question at these stages.. o.O
Quote:
We obtained excellent DNA material by surgically dissecting the distal ends of two right anterior ribs on the humanoid. These clearly contained bone marrow material, as was seen on the dissecting microscope that was brought in for the procedure. The bone marrow and other material from the skull were obtained under sterile, surgical procedures and placed directly into sterile containers provided by Dr. Nolan.
- See more at: http://siriusdisclosure.com/evidence....INQ4PxC1.dpuf
I mean..
Quote:
Using forensic documentation procedures, this evidence was then hand-delivered by me to Dr. Nolan in Washington DC in October, 2012.

Dr. Nolan proceeded to set up a very detailed protocol needed for examining “ancient” or old DNA. This is a highly specialized area of research and the leading scientists in the world with expertise in this area consulted with Dr. Nolan in this endeavor.

The Atacama Humanoid is a 13 centimeter, or 6 inch, body that is very desiccated but completely intact. The CAT scan clearly shows internal chest organs (lungs and what appears to be the remains of a heart structure).(See CAT scan here) There is absolutely no doubt that the specimen is an actual organism and that it is not a hoax of any kind. This fact has been confirmed by Dr. Nolan and Dr. Lachman at Stanford.
So you didn't read when the scientist himself was analyzing the DNA? Heck did you read anything at all?



I think these guys did the right thing, keeping this off the radar until it was examined enough to publish something of substance.
But, yeah. It's a work in progress, the DNA samples are being studied further. They concluded that it was very close to human DNA, more than chimpanzees, but it is different in it's own way.

There's supposed to be a press conference by Dr. Greer today Friday too, I believe.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Edit: Instead of questioning the validity of the information, which without a doubt is at least acceptable.. The thread instead could go in the direction if the implications of this study. That's where it really starts to get interesting and could make up a good meaty discussion. Say..

Some speculate that the reason behind the Government's desicion to remain these things secret is because of the widespread panic people can display, when the foundation of their beliefs, especially religious ones, is put to the test.

Other theories, and some of them with startling info, state that they've recovered plenty of these extraterrestrials during the years, hiding the possible technology and leaking it out to the public as it fits their agenda.

There's also the de-classification of UFO files in certain countries, such as the UK.

This could add some validity to the theories of Georgio Tsukalos too.

Last edited by Rain Dancer; April 25th, 2013 at 09:47 PM. Reason: Georgio Tsukalos is awesome.
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Old April 25th, 2013, 11:37 PM
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http://www.ibtimes.com/atacama-human...-photo-1212425

Mutations can go wild. DNA data tells us it's human. The bone structure is wayy too similar to a humans to be an alien. Chimpanzees are 99% similar in terms of DNA, but look at that skull - large cranium, flat face, and the way the cranium fuses looks human. Having missing pairs of ribs doesn't seem out of the ordinary especially with poly- or oligo- dactyly. I've studied in introductory detail how repeating units of an organism's body form, and it isn't out of the question if enough cells didn't properly polarize.

I'm really hoping that the tests on its metabolism turns out to be messed up so we can call it a mummified aborted fetus and get it over with. The bones seem like they're overly-round, not fleshed out and complex like adult bones are. Maybe the bone density could be explained by a mutation, which seems to be more plausible than it living for 6-8 years? The pediatric specialist analyzed bone density based on normal developmental standards which may not apply here. Anyways, it is a Chilean - they know that much.

The government isn't deciding whether this should remain a secret. The scientists involved are going wtf over explaining what it could possibly be. But at least it's a good day for them - they usually don't mess around super novel things like this.

While it's likely this isn't a fake, let's not conflate the mystery around it with it being a conspiracy theory. This could be the modern-day equivalent of Europeans first discovering platypuses.
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Old April 26th, 2013, 12:49 AM
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I'm really hoping that the tests on its metabolism turns out to be messed up so we can call it a mummified aborted fetus and get it over with.
:'(

Well, Im really hoping it's not. It's intriguing if they find out the origin is from afar, or at least anything that's unknown.

The unknowns are exciting, they invigorate our curiosity, makes for a more fulfilling experience, opens us up into possibilities, expand our knowledge. Science came about as a means to satisfy the need to know and understand.

Get it over with? Nah.
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Old April 26th, 2013, 02:00 AM
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Very interesting. Especially since it came from the Atacama desert.

I'm a firm believer in Aliens and what we must remember, is that Aliens are Aliens. If they evolved on a planet similar to ours then they might look like us. Maybe, maybe not. But we can't rule it out.

I'm personally waiting for the day when the Tarantula People of Glarfburke come and crown me their king
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Old April 26th, 2013, 08:07 AM
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Originally Posted by Rain Dancer View Post
:'(

Well, Im really hoping it's not. It's intriguing if they find out the origin is from afar, or at least anything that's unknown.

The unknowns are exciting, they invigorate our curiosity, makes for a more fulfilling experience, opens us up into possibilities, expand our knowledge. Science came about as a means to satisfy the need to know and understand.

Get it over with? Nah.
I made it clear in the last post that they've concluded the remains are human. The DNA results are more similar to humans versus chimpanzees, so it's highly unlikely it's an alien. And by highly unlikely we mean that if we were to treat this specimen as a separate species - but we can't because it's too similar to human DNA. They even got the mtDNA tests done and determined that it's fairly safe to conclude it's a Chilean as well.

Anyways, high bone density and its causes aren't very well studied. Basically if you're above a certain level you're considered normal. This leaves a lot of leeway in explaining why the bones of the specimen are incredibly dense and can discount the hypothesis that it lived 6-8 years.

The remains have a pretty solid context in human biology at the moment. If anything is unknown or exciting, it's what slew of genetic disorders/mutations caused the specimen to turn out the way it did. I just came up with another hypothesis - what if the mutations caused rapid aging in the fetus which would explain why the bone density is so high? Eventually the abnormal growth caused the fetus to be aborted. If you read the letter of the MD who investigated the bone density, he does point out progeria (rapid aging) to be a possible cause but in his opinion it's of low probability. I'll keep that option open - even though I'm not a pediatrician - because I find it to be more unlikely that it actually lived for years.

http://siriusdisclosure.com/wp-conte...man-report.pdf

Just to add, the skull is pretty clearly that of a crushed human. The foramen magnum (where the spinal cord exits the skull) is not attached to the spine.
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Old April 26th, 2013, 08:37 AM
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After reading this I'm going to go out on a limb and say that it most likely a human mutation or previously unknown ape that has long since died out. I highly doubt any alien life form we discover will be anything like us (although I admit it is possible).

My opinions will possibly shift after reading what BahISuck linked I'll get back to you.
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Old April 26th, 2013, 12:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rain Dancer View Post
What do you think of the Atacama humanoid? Quite possibly the first case of an -alien looking- humanoid body that's been out in the public realm, and with solid evidence to back it up.
It may be alien-looking, but the DNA is human. So, it is human. (Although, I think the report said the analysis is incomplete?)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rain Dancer View Post
You won't see much of this in the mainstream media.
Because it has nothing to do with anything. It's rather niche. It'll be relatively big news within cryptozoology circles, but not elsewhere. Same way more... traditionally recognized yet somewhat vaguely related scientific fields don't get broad coverage of things like uncontacted tribes or say, homo floresiensis.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rain Dancer View Post
Personally, Im actually wondering how something like this didn't get shot down by the governments in power, and their obvious agendas to keep things like this, secret.
I don't follow you. What would they gain by keeping these kinds of things secret? And what do they lose when they don't? Nothing and nothing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rain Dancer View Post
Let me add that I've been watching the two hour documentary, it came out a few days ago. They're taking it down in Youtube and censoring it everywhere it's uploaded, so your best bet to get to see it is via torren- *Shot*
..It's worth it.
There's plenty on YouTube when you search for it. The new documentary may not be there because being such a niche thing, the creators stand to suffer a greater financial loss if it is available on YouTube - rather than purchased through them.

My view overall is inline with what BlahISuck is saying. Interesting, but many more plausible earthly explanations
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Old April 26th, 2013, 12:56 PM
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Oh god.. I can picture those things attacking like a pack of Procompsognathus...



Looks a bit fake to me but.. egh.. ya never know. Um.. did they not run a carbon analysis to know when this was alive..? Or did I skip that bit?
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Old April 26th, 2013, 02:35 PM
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Well that is one alienesque looking human 0_o

Different human species have been discovered so I see this as not being that different to those kinds of discoveries.It does look strange though like something out of an alien movie.
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Old April 26th, 2013, 04:25 PM
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I actually left out an explanation. There could be environmental factors, like a toxin the mother ingested while she was pregnant. Certain toxins are able to cause the same abnormality even across many different species, like goats, cows or cats. I have one in mind, but I'm not going to post it because the first time I saw it I got nightmares, but feel free to PM me about it. The point is that plants can create compounds that do nasty things to a developing fetus.

Since toxins are created by proteins, and mutations in the genetic code cause these proteins to change, the mother could have eaten a plant that had a mutation which created the toxin causing the deformity as we observe it right now. What's worse is that plant might not even be around anymore - it might've been a one-in-a-million mutation that survived maybe for a couple generations. And that probably wouldn't even be testable because the toxin would be in such low concentrations that any detectable amount of it might have degraded over time. And if we haven't characterized the toxin yet, then we can't even test it to begin with. So if everything turns out to be normal on the genetics side, environmental factors could be a plausible explanation, although one we probably can't test for.
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Old April 26th, 2013, 08:04 PM
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Hm, so.. Messed up results or a glitch, doubts regarding the scientific measurement techniques used on bone marrow nowadays, and striking the mutation lottery are your points?
You can't test the latter, so it's mostly the fake/erroneous results theory.

That seems a bit unlikely. Almost as much as extraterrestrial origin theory in itself!


For one, no one has yet to document alien DNA, so how would we know what is alien? Perhaps there's humanoid aliens out there sharing our DNA like some theories say.

Also, nothing has been said about the DNA of the father. Perhaps this is what they could rely on to link extraterrestrial origin. Still, with so many unknowns regarding DNA in itself, it's going to be pretty hard to confirm this. Perhaps discoveries will be made?



I call it humanoid/human for the time being, until further developments come to light.

Kura: It supposedly dates around a thousand years ago, where this thing was said to have lived up to the age of eight. o.O

Last edited by Rain Dancer; April 26th, 2013 at 08:10 PM.
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Old April 26th, 2013, 09:02 PM
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If you understood my previous posts, you'd see that I meant that they are using developmental standards that apply to the whole population. If I tested a six-year-old with osteoporosis and conclude that the bone density is like that of an 80 year old woman, do I conclude that the six-year-old is an 80 year old woman? No, because she has osteoporosis and so my test is not relevant. It's kind of similar to how athletes can't have their health determined by their BMI. It doesn't appear to hard to measure bone density anyways - all you have to use is medical imaging technology like MRI's or CT's.

And while it's unlikely, it's plausible. You're conflating the two ideas - of course genetic disorders or mutations are unlikely or else we'd all have them! - but it's still a plausible explanation because you're using the known to explain the known and hopefully come to some conclusion about the unknown. If you're going for an alien DNA thesis then you're assuming the unknown, which doesn't explain what's known so how can you come to a reasonable conclusion about what you don't know? Alien theories aren't plausible to begin with - but we know mutations cause deformities. That's all I think I need to say about the strength of the earthly human argument.

I wouldn't say my theories are untestable in general - just that in this particular situation it might be difficult. Before we even go there, the researchers - and I as well - agree that the specimen is human. The anatomy and the genetics scream human. Context include mtDNA of a Chilean, anatomy of a human body, DNA "closer to humans than chimpanzees". That's scientist talk for "my years of experience and expertise say it's human, but I'm still a scientist so I can't say 100% unless I've ruled everything else out". They are testing for mutations right now, and hopefully they'll come up with some data useable enough to flesh out how the morphology of the specimen can be explained.

91% of the DNA correspond to a reference genome. The 9% that doesn't is in acceptable errors and doesn't mean anything out of the ordinary. This is firmly in a scientific context, so it's not up to anybody's whim to say "well, 9% seems like a lot, I guess I'll conclude it's not human". Inaccuracy, DNA degradation, or not actually having a match in the genetic database are all possible and expected. That's why they're going to do more reads on more genetic databases, preferably those taken from Chileans or at least related populations to come up with more matches. This is the report from which I'm getting this information:

http://siriusdisclosure.com/wp-conte...PN-Summary.pdf

The body most certainly went through some damage before we found it, otherwise the skull would be still attached to the spine where it should. I posted this two posts before, but I guess details aren't important...

Edit: Here's a wiki page that explains my previous post if you don't believe me:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Teratogen
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Old April 26th, 2013, 09:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Rain Dancer View Post
Uhh.. I thought doubting was out of the question at these stages.. o.O


I mean..

So you didn't read when the scientist himself was analyzing the DNA? Heck did you read anything at all? :P
Why should it be? Or are we forgetting to be skeptical/rational because this is an area of interest, where out judgement might be a bit clouded?

And no, I didn't see any need. Read the HuffPo article a week ago and didn't click the links. Again, while I love this area of discussion and aliens/Tsukalos+Daniken/AA theory, I can't help but feel a little underwhelmed by this one. Looks like a stunt and a way to make some $ from a documentary.
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Old April 27th, 2013, 11:43 AM
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It's a mutated humanoid. Rare, but hardly evidence of anything other than a side-branch in human evolutionary history. Sorry, Mulder; I want to believe, but this ain't enough.
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