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  #4976    
Old May 21st, 2013, 07:03 AM
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Originally Posted by LycaNinja View Post
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Thank you for thinking and not believing in the worse case scenario... I literally couldn't explain it easier than I had... But I'll still say it again...

The BEST would be what applies... A Fire/Fight attack hitting a Grass/Steel would be considered a Fire type attack, since that's x4 as a fire attack and x2 from Fighting is lower than Fire... Like I had just explained in the previous reply... Same applies to a Normal/Fighting move... Normal isn't effective... Fighting is... So Fighting wins... Even if a Normal type is using it... It gets the STAB of being a Normal type, and the SE from Fighting vs Steel...

This is just an example, hopefully they will do a much better system... Don't strain yourselves trying to come up with the formula... Just wait for GameFreak to talk about it if it even exists... And don't instantly think of the worst possible way to implement something...
then it would become a coverage move which would become very much op. It covers up ROCK,STEEL,ICE,GRASS,BUG,DARK,NORMAL..
Wow, 7 types..!! That would make metagame even more unstable..

Also, when did i produce a formula? I asked u the formula cuz that was your theory. So, u should have a formula to it. Why would we strain our minds fr something which is practically a impossible thing..!

Dual type moves are a bad idea imo..!
  #4977    
Old May 21st, 2013, 07:13 AM
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Once again I stick to my 'one type that counts stab and one type for type effectiveness'-theory. It's very similar to what they're already doing with the special-physical split one some attacks, and it would do no harm to the system.

But you guys can keep going about how bad of an idea this is, sure.


  #4978    
Old May 21st, 2013, 08:37 AM
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Originally Posted by Suicune™ View Post
I think moves should be left untouched, introducing dual type moves would completely change the way attacks work.
Hey, my game idea's making me think several generations ahead here! (I really wish that I could share more of this insanely awesome project, codenamed 'Aeonn' for the region's current name, with you guys, but I really can't since I'm going to ping Nintendo to see if they'll allow GameFreak to give me permission to extrapolate some official code from my current documentation. As such, I should probably stop discussing it at random; if any of you want to get on board with the project, maybe you can send me a personal message and we could eventually meet in person once I get the enterprise's parent company up and running…) Anyhow, I don't think that there's any need to get angry at my suggestion when all it really comes from is my opinion that the move-linking mechanic from the Pokémon Mystery Dungeon games should get some use in the main games in some way, shape, or form. To be honest, I personally think that dual-type moves would be really cool, especially if they foreshadowed or followed from the existence of triple-type Pokémon, but I bet that GemeFreak would phase them in very slowly, if at all.
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  #4979    
Old May 21st, 2013, 08:41 AM
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I wouldn't disagree move linking in things like Double and Triple battles so it's just combining the two attacks. Plus, that'd make for some cool strategies that you'd be able to pull off. It'd probably just have cool visuals too. There'd have to be a set list of what could be combined though, because the games can't just magically combine everything and pull up an animation for it. That'd just be a ridiculously large number of animations to program in.
  #4980    
Old May 21st, 2013, 08:43 AM
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Well, let's not forget that this is a 'kids' game, so, even if GF introduces a dual type move system, it will never be too complicated.
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  #4981    
Old May 21st, 2013, 08:56 AM
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Originally Posted by Zorogami View Post
I have to agree, dual typed moves just seem way to messy!
Especially if you consider how they would handle weaknesses/resistances
Let's say a move like Blaze Kick is both Fire and Fighting, how would it affect a Rock Pokemon?
It could either be SE if considered Fighting, but only not very effective if considered Fire
Maybe the effects would be combined like they are for when a singly-typed move attacks a doubly-typed Pokémon? In that case, the super-effectiveness that the Fighting type has against Rock-type Pokémon might get canceled out by the lack of effectiveness inherent in Fire-type moves used against Rock-type Pokémon, thereby making combined Fire-/Fighting-type moves like the updated Blaze Kick that you proposed, Zorogami, normally effective against Rock-type Pokémon. Then again, that required a lot of thought…maybe this isn't such a good idea after all? I suppose that move-merging could only create more-powerful existing moves with one type out of two different moves if it ever evolved out of move linking.
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  #4982    
Old May 21st, 2013, 09:02 AM
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That is messy, it'll be best to keep it at one type per move to avoid headaches.
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  #4983    
Old May 21st, 2013, 09:44 AM
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Originally Posted by aonshinzo View Post
I know it's kinda irritating whenever people here a new feature that's drastically different for pokemon they automatically shun it.....
Well...I don't think it's necessarily that, per say.

See, when something new is introduced into the games, it creates some sort of...controversy, so to speak. Not always, but it really honestly depends on what it is. It seems that, garnering from the reactions, that Pokemon has some sort of formula to it, know what I mean? You add some new ingredient to the formula, and who knows what could happen. It could a) ruin the entire thing or b) make it even better or c) have no effect at all. People are more or less afraid of option "A" happening more than anything else, though.
  #4984    
Old May 21st, 2013, 10:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shubham2207 View Post
then it would become a coverage move which would become very much op. It covers up ROCK,STEEL,ICE,GRASS,BUG,DARK,NORMAL..
Wow, 7 types..!! That would make metagame even more unstable..

Also, when did i produce a formula? I asked u the formula cuz that was your theory. So, u should have a formula to it. Why would we strain our minds fr something which is practically a impossible thing..!

Dual type moves are a bad idea imo..!
That's why its just an example... See...

I said don't worry about it yet here you are worrying about it... I said if they are implementing it they will do so because it makes sense and they worked it out in some series of freaking numbers to make it work... I don't need to invent my own damn formula for an example...


  #4985    
Old May 21st, 2013, 10:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LycaNinja View Post
That's why its just an example... See...

I said don't worry about it yet here you are worrying about it... I said if they are implementing it they will do so because it makes sense and they worked it out in some series of freaking numbers to make it work... I don't need to invent my own damn formula for an example...
Thats wt i m trying to say. Look, i m nt making a pt that ur idea is bad but Sumthing that doesn't work will nvr wrk at all.. Even if gf tries that sumthing. They r nt superhumans or god.
  #4986    
Old May 21st, 2013, 11:07 AM
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Originally Posted by shubham2207 View Post
Thats wt i m trying to say. Look, i m nt making a pt that ur idea is bad but Sumthing that doesn't work will nvr wrk at all.. Even if gf tries that sumthing. They r nt superhumans or god.
Not sure what you are trying to say... But you don't need to be a superhuman or god to do math...


  #4987    
Old May 21st, 2013, 11:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pokestick, good times. View Post
Once again I stick to my 'one type that counts stab and one type for type effectiveness'-theory. It's very similar to what they're already doing with the special-physical split one some attacks, and it would do no harm to the system.
So then, if I had a Water-type Pokemon with a Water/Ice dual move used against a Normal/Flying Pokemon I would get STAB and type effectiveness? And if the move were the other way around, an Ice/Water move I would not get STAB nor type effectiveness? Interesting idea. It would give Pokemon with type disadvantages an ace up their sleeve depending on how many combination movies there were and how spread out they are among different Pokemon. That would certainly change things around a bit, but I don't see it as game-breaking either.

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  #4988    
Old May 21st, 2013, 12:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Scarf View Post
So then, if I had a Water-type Pokemon with a Water/Ice dual move used against a Normal/Flying Pokemon I would get STAB and type effectiveness? And if the move were the other way around, an Ice/Water move I would not get STAB nor type effectiveness? Interesting idea. It would give Pokemon with type disadvantages an ace up their sleeve depending on how many combination movies there were and how spread out they are among different Pokemon. That would certainly change things around a bit, but I don't see it as game-breaking either.
It would be both an interesting addition and a disaster, depending on what moves you're talking about. If Drain Punch was, say, Fighting/Electric (since it has the chance of paralysis), then it would no longer affect Pokemon like Excadrill, as well as many other Rock/Ground Pokemon, mainly because of the secondary Electric typing, really.

But Drain Punch is just one out of many fighting moves, of course. But that's still an example of how moves can suddenly become useless with an additional type.
  #4989    
Old May 21st, 2013, 12:15 PM
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Originally Posted by LycaNinja View Post
Not sure what you are trying to say... But you don't need to be a superhuman or god to do math...
You mean I'm not a superhuman? My world is shattered.

FTR, I still think dual-typing moves is a horrible and confusing concept that would never work.

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  #4990    
Old May 21st, 2013, 12:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Twilight Sky View Post
It would be both an interesting addition and a disaster, depending on what moves you're talking about. If Drain Punch was, say, Fighting/Electric (since it has the chance of paralysis), then it would no longer affect Pokemon like Excadrill, as well as many other Rock/Ground Pokemon, mainly because of the secondary Electric typing, really.

But Drain Punch is just one out of many fighting moves, of course. But that's still an example of how moves can suddenly become useless with an additional type.
I think you're thinking of Force Palm =P But regardless, that wouldn't matter much, since there are other ways of causing paralysis other than electricity. But for the sake of that example, then that'd go from super effective to immune, which is just a giant change. Just seems like a really large jump that I don't think they'd be likely to make, regardless of what they can and can't do.
  #4991    
Old May 21st, 2013, 02:26 PM
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If this two type moves somehow does end up being real, which I doubt, Kyurem's signature moves will probably become Ice/Electric and Ice/Fire respectively...if any moves should be double type I'll like it for it to be those as it makes sense in context of those moves.
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  #4992    
Old May 21st, 2013, 03:48 PM
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My view on how dual-type moves should be done if they happen at all (and I explained this once before on the Showdown server) is this:

Moves have two types. A primary type and a secondary type. Take the move Scald for example. Its primary type would be Water which determines STAB and effectiveness against other pokemon in terms of damage. Its secondary type would be Fire because of the move's 30% burn chance. However this burn chance would be amplified or diminished by type effectiveness as well. Pokemon who resist fire would have a 15% chance of getting burned, and those weak to it would have a 60% chance. Those that are 4x weak / 4x resist would continue in such a fashion (although I feel like a 120% chance to burn against stuff like Scizor could be a bit ridiculous but it actually sounds like it could help balance him out a bit and knock him down a peg). Maybe it wouldn't be that simple for effects, but that's how I see it working.

It seems like the best solution to dual-type moves without introducing too many confusing mechanics such as the way STAB would work and immunities in terms of damage effectiveness.
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  #4993    
Old May 21st, 2013, 04:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by .Aero View Post
My view on how dual-type moves should be done if they happen at all (and I explained this once before on the Showdown server) is this:

Moves have two types. A primary type and a secondary type. Take the move Scald for example. Its primary type would be Water which determines STAB and effectiveness against other pokemon in terms of damage. Its secondary type would be Fire because of the move's 30% burn chance. However this burn chance would be amplified or diminished by type effectiveness as well. Pokemon who resist fire would have a 15% chance of getting burned, and those weak to it would have a 60% chance. Those that are 4x weak / 4x resist would continue in such a fashion (although I feel like a 120% chance to burn against stuff like Scizor could be a bit ridiculous but it actually sounds like it could help balance him out a bit and knock him down a peg). Maybe it wouldn't be that simple for effects, but that's how I see it working.

It seems like the best solution to dual-type moves without introducing too many confusing mechanics such as the way STAB would work and immunities in terms of damage effectiveness.
That is pretty much the only way I can see it working. But omg that freeze hax that'll happen.
  #4994    
Old May 21st, 2013, 05:08 PM
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Originally Posted by CycloneGU View Post
You mean I'm not a superhuman? My world is shattered.

FTR, I still think dual-typing moves is a horrible and confusing concept that would never work.

Cyclone
Thats what i was trying to say @lycaninja.
  #4995    
Old May 21st, 2013, 06:07 PM
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Now, now kids let's not go grabbing at one another's throats if we don't understand each other's opinions. There's no need to get rowdy or be rude to one another if we don't see the point other's are trying to make. Let's keep it lax, cool? This is just a friendly warning so it doesn't happen in the future.

PS. Dual-type moves are a terrible idea. Let's not ever go there, GameFreak.
  #4996    
Old May 21st, 2013, 07:09 PM
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Instead of discussing, we started debating.. Sry fr dat..! Dual types are rly a bad idea..!

Anyways, back to topic. About fletchling, it can learn flame charge. So, can we xpect a fire version of sky attack?

Last edited by shubham2207; May 21st, 2013 at 07:32 PM.
  #4997    
Old May 21st, 2013, 10:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shubham2207 View Post
About fletchling, it can learn flame charge. So, can we xpect a fire version of sky attack?
Would be pretty nice, although i hope for Fletchling to turn into a Fire/Flying Pokemon when he evolves :D
I know the early bird Pokemon of every Gen always keeps his Normal/Flying typing, a change would be pretty neat

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  #4998    
Old May 21st, 2013, 11:17 PM
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Indeed. I'd say at this point that the more twists to the usual formula, the better.
And looking at the Pokédex image, Zigzagoon (and possible Pidgey?) seem to be available early on in these games. So if they can bring in early normal types from previous gens, making a bird fire type can't be a big stretch!


  #4999    
Old May 21st, 2013, 11:28 PM
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Flying / Fire for an early bird would be neat. There have always been a lack of fire pokemon within each game except in Hoenn (there were quite a few thanks to the volcano landscape). However I wouldn't go and say Fletchling's evolutions are going to Flying- / Fire-type just based on the fact that it can learn Flame Charge. After all, Blitzle and Zebstrika both learn it. It's color scheme certainly lends it to becoming that type though, which I look forward to. :]
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  #5000    
Old May 21st, 2013, 11:40 PM
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If Sound and Light are the new types I can thing of two perfect version exclusives...

With Xerneas being part Light and Yveltal being part Sound, Volbeat could be a X exclusive as a Bug/Sound type and Illumise could be a Y exclusive as a Bug/Light type.


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