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Fifth Generation Are Pokémon slaves to humans? Team Plasma thinks so. Travel the Unova region and prove them wrong in Black & White, hens return two years later in Black2 & White2.


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  #26    
Old September 6th, 2013, 10:38 PM
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I don't see anything wrong with these Pokemon, sure they may not have the best looks in the world but their stats are actually quite impressive. Trubbish line? I know their movepool doesn't make the best use of its stats, and Vanillite's line may have a shallow movepool but learn some strong Ice attacks. And once you find out Vanilluxe's BST is like, on par with Lapras you'd definitely know it's got good stats going for it.

And who doesn't love smiling ice-cream cones? Vanillite's line are among my fave Ice-types as well so you can see what I mean. They're just so cute and they have the stats to fight with too! I don't understand the hate, I mean a Pokemon is a Pokemon.
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  #27    
Old September 6th, 2013, 10:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hikari10 View Post
I don't see anything wrong with these Pokemon, sure they may not have the best looks in the world but their stats are actually quite impressive. Trubbish line? I know their movepool doesn't make the best use of its stats, and Vanillite's line may have a shallow movepool but learn some strong Ice attacks. And once you find out Vanilluxe's BST is like, on par with Lapras you'd definitely know it's got good stats going for it.
Wow, I'm quite surprised, actually. I always thought Vanillite was a crippled Competitive Battler. This does mean that Vanilluxe is a formidable force.
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  #28    
Old September 7th, 2013, 06:44 PM
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I actually find their lines completely adorable. <3
Like, I legit love them so much. >u<
Both are decent in offense (albeit Vanilluxe's shallow movepool), and can hold their own when raised right.
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  #29    
Old September 7th, 2013, 07:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by metalhand View Post
I don't hate Trubbish, only the Vanillite line.
I never really like food/object pokemon, but if it got a design that make it look more than just an object with eyeballs its okay.
Like geodude's arms which make it look like a human, or Swirlix which remind me a dog.
But the Vanillite alaways was... an ice cream with eyeballs, which was really stupied...
I think something a lot of people overlook is the fact that humans tend to connect more with things that they can give human characteristics to. This is exemplified very well in the above post. I was watching a video by the YouTuber "Tamashii Hiroka" and she explained this quite well. The above statement is a lot of the reason why, as a general statement, humans get closer to certain mammal companions that they see as "like them." Now, as a civilized species, we've gotten to the point where we can always overcome these stereotypes and such, and we can get attached to pet fish.

More often than not, though, one would get closer to a dog- a mammal that shows more emotion, more "humanity" than a scaly, underwater, somewhat-derpy looking creature like a fish. This goes for Pokemon, too. Sure, there are plenty of fish Pokemon that people like. So, my last point seems kind of dumb, right?

But here's what I mean. Take the Pokemon Basculin. Its eyes are drawn to be expressive. It looks sort of angry, you could say. While Trubbish also looks to be slightly expressive, it seems more dull than not, and isn't really an animal. Automatically, many people equate it to an object and thus can't find themselves liking it or becoming attached to it. Again, not all people are like this, but many of the haters seem to display this behavior. Of course, their stats and move pools can be a factor- but I'm talking more about the people going after the design-oriented hate. With the Vanilish line, well, they're food. Most people I know don't like to think of something that we consume for dessert as a monster that can be battled with. Sure, we eat cows like Miltank, and fish like Magikarp, but those start out as living animals where as ice cream is a product of human development. The day that I try and fight a bowl of ice cream is not a day that'll be coming anytime soon.

Nostalgia plays a role here too. Most people I personally know automatically hate on newer Pokemon, because that's just the trend. They take what they like from the old days, remember the good stuff, and then they continue on grumbling about how GameFreak is "running out of ideas." While that is a valid opinion, it's an opinion that I cannot respect due to the fact that I believe it to be very ignorant. Every generation has its bad Pokemon. Muk and Grimer are living piles of sludge. Sludge, for those who don't know the technical definition, can be defined multiple ways. Here are some of them.

"1. Semisolid material such as the type precipitated by sewage treatment.
2. Mud, mire, or ooze covering the ground or forming a deposit, as on a riverbed.
3. Finely broken or half-formed ice on a body of water, especially the sea."

Essentially, Muk and Grimer are sentient piles of poop, or mud. And mud? Comes from dead plant and animal matter. Really, they're not exactly the most "creative" if you're going for that. They're just waste and dead stuff. Because they're obviously not made of ice like the third definition there. I like Muk and Grimer, personally, but for the sake of this big ranty statement here, I'm using them as an example.

Now, none of what I said up here is meant to offend anyone, nor is it meant to fully dismiss any opinions, but to give my take on this whole situation. Sorry for the eyeball burning rant everyone. I also don't intend to generalize as much as it seems, I'm well aware that people can have many varied reasons for liking/disliking certain Pokemon beyond these reasons.
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Last edited by PokemonCollector-N; September 7th, 2013 at 07:16 PM.
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  #30    
Old September 7th, 2013, 07:20 PM
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Haters gonna hate? I actually like Trubbish and his evolved form. I'm not a big an of Vanillite and the others but I still tolerate them. I guess some people are just bothered that Gamefreak bases Pokemon on all kinds of things rather than just animals.
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  #31    
Old September 8th, 2013, 07:49 PM
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I don't mind if people hate these pokemon. I just dislike it when I hear my genwunner friends, who stopped playing a long time ago, state these as their main argument for why the games are no longer good and as the reason why they stopped playing.

You only need to have 6 pokemon in your team. I'm certain that, when they were younger, not every pokemon in the RBY jumped out at them as something they would personally train. So long as you can find 6 pokemon you like, you can just enjoy defeating in battle or perma-box all the ones you don't like. And it's not like these pokemon are very common anyways.

Okay, so you hate the garbage and ice cream pokemon. That leaves another 151 out of 156 in this current generation for you to find reasons to dislike. I don't think there's anything wrong with people saying they no longer want to play the games, or that they dislike Gen V compare to other gens, as there are many legitimate reasons. I just think that, by itself, this is a pretty flimsy reason.
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  #32    
Old September 20th, 2013, 01:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ★Hoenn★ View Post
. . . because in Sinnoh, no derp Pokémon existed. . .
Sinnoh had no derp pokemon? Really, koff~?

Croagunk and Bidoof? Likilicky and Magmortor? Magnezone and Probopass? The ridiculous horror that is Rhyperior? These are but a handful of the fourth generation's failures. I like it when they can go back and evolve certain pokemon (Porygon is a wonderful example), but when they take a monster like Rhydon and 'demote' it by evolving it into a heap of orange poo-mess, that just makes no sense at all.

People like to talk at how uninspired the fifth generation is. Pish-posh. All the 5th generation pokemon are brand new! The fourth generation had more than 20 evolutions and pre-evolutions linking to past games. For shame, those that label the fifth generation 'uninspired', koffi~
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  #33    
Old September 20th, 2013, 02:57 PM
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I kinda hate Vanillite because it was the only line (that I know of) in the Unova region that was designed by an American. We coulda had the chance to make our mark and make the ultimate patriotic Pokemon that would rival the likes of Braviary but instead we made ice cream.
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  #34    
Old October 8th, 2013, 10:53 PM
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I finally got back to reading this, koff~

I'm actually satisfied with the Pokemon designed by James Turner (Vullaby, Mandibuzz, Golett, Golurk, Vanillite, Vanillish, and Vanilluxe), who is a Brit by the way. I'm sure we as Americans will have our shot at creating the ultimate piece of patriotic destruction ever: Flaggistave, the Patriotic Flag Pokemon, koffi~
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  #35    
Old October 17th, 2013, 03:55 PM
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I just don't like pokémon that are based on man-made objects, I guess. Rotom's formes have explanations, Magnemite is borderline and Honedge and Banette are ghosts possessing discarded/old items, so. But an ice-cream. That's food. That's a bit too silly. Just my opinion :)
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  #36    
Old October 17th, 2013, 08:24 PM
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The Vanillite line is okay to me, and so is Trubbish. But Garbodor just looks a bit... eew...
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  #37    
Old October 17th, 2013, 08:45 PM
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I also see genwunners mention these Pokémon a lot just because they're the easiest to attack and to compare unfavorably to the old Pokémon.

Take a French vlogger Cyprien for instance. In one of his videos which was a series of rants about different videogame franchises, he mentioned Pokémon, saying something like "what happened to the designs?", showed a Rattata saying "We used to have this", then showed a Garbodor and said "How we have ridiculous stuff like this". Quite an unfair comparison, if you ask me.
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  #38    
Old October 26th, 2013, 11:34 PM
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I actually really like their unique designs and premises, but certainly not at first. Most of the Generation V Pokémon were waaay jarring when they were unveiled, but they really grew on me once I started actually playing White, and now, specifically because of bizarre Pokémon like Vanilluxe and Garbodor, Generation V is my favorite design-wise, if only because they're so unusual.

To the point, it seems like most can't get past the weirdness of the Generation V designs, which is best exemplified by these two specific evolutionary lines, along with others like Stunfisk or Throh and Sawk. It's totally understandable, of course, especially given Generation IV's prominent amount of cool Pokémon like Lucario or Gallade or Luxray, which frankly aren't my cup of tea, but they're the cool ones for a reason, so it makes a lot of sense why there would be such a backlash against Trubbish and Vanillite...
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  #39    
Old October 27th, 2013, 02:16 AM
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I think these two lines are just what comes to mind when someone says 'Worst Pokemon designs' because it has been reinforced so much through memes etc. The whole genwunner thing kinda gave them a bad name as well.
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  #40    
Old October 27th, 2013, 08:03 AM
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Garbodor...uninspired and bland? **** that noise!

Spoiler:




Is YOUR favorite Pokemon inspired by Totoro? No? Then you have no rights to call Garbodor bland.


The Vanilite line is **** though. James Turner did very well with Golurk, but man the Vanilite line...
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  #41    
Old October 27th, 2013, 12:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spinosaurus View Post
Is YOUR favorite Pokemon inspired by Totoro? No? Then you have no rights to call Garbodor bland.
Hoooly lord I never noticed that! I always knew Garbodor was unconventionally adorable, but this is news to me!
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  #42    
Old October 27th, 2013, 01:43 PM
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Originally Posted by Fitzsy View Post
Hoooly lord I never noticed that! I always knew Garbodor was unconventionally adorable, but this is news to me!
People hate the Trubbish line for all the wrong reasons. They look at it once, see it's chubby and a representative of "trash" and judge from there. It's like why people don't like Wario; it's because he's fat, completely ignoring his charm and personality.
When I found out the connection to Totoro I loved Garbodor even more. To me, gen 5 was full of mediocrity, and yet, one of the few Pokemon I really love from that gen ends up the one being most hated on. He's right on par with Scrafty, Ferrothorn and Golurk in having a creative design idea (what most gen 5 pokemon have, actually) and just the right execution in the design. (what most DON'T have.)

People should give this a read. Highlights the genius and charm of the Trubbish line.
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  #43    
Old November 9th, 2013, 11:05 AM
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It's generally agreed that these two lines are poorly designed. It's not so much that they're based off of objects, but instead it's because people don't like the designs. I mean, Chandelure is based off of an object, yet it is generally liked because it has a cool design.
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  #44    
Old November 15th, 2013, 05:10 PM
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I don't hate Vanillite line (they make me want to heat Pokemon). I understand the hate about the Trubbish line though. Garbodor is hideous and disgusting. Not something you want to be using.
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  #45    
Old November 15th, 2013, 07:04 PM
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Despite not using either of these Pokémon in an actual playthrough (for my laptop is too slow to run Desmume well and playing through on your DS is just way too mainstream, I kid of course) I actually have really grown on both of their designs. The Trubbish line makes sense because in a ciy as urbinated as Unova, of course waste disposal will be a problem and as a result this line have been created. Trubbish is just so god damn adorable and ain't nobody gonna mess with a Garbador. The Vanillite line is cool to me mainly because of the Ice typing, Ice is an extremely cool (geddit?) type, and I like a majority of these Pokémon, plus they're not half bad in battle!
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  #46    
Old November 16th, 2013, 06:04 AM
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Well its not their worst at least. I mean the Vanillite is actually pretty cool. The only reason Trubish got hate was because well..... he is a garbage bag..... Well we wanted nintendo to be creative right. They sorta did that , however i think they are great. Both of them.
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  #47    
Old November 17th, 2013, 11:29 AM
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They deserve the hate ~nuff said
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  #48    
Old November 17th, 2013, 11:36 AM
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I love Vanillite's line. Sure, I may not be overly partial to ice types, but I don't really see issues with them. I admit, though, that I don't really like Trubbish's line at all. The designs are unappealing. But that's just me; I like my pokemon cute and powerful.
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  #49    
Old November 17th, 2013, 11:45 AM
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The only reason I like Grimer and Muk is because of there abilities as sludge to mould and change shape and stuff. I only like them for that.
There are Pokemon in each generation I dislike (I'm saying this so you can't point out how there are other bad Pokemon with similar bad designs), and in generation 5, those Pokemon are Trubbish, Vannilite, Litwick, Gothita and their evolutions. Their designs are just unappealing to me.
That's all I'm saying.
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  #50    
Old November 17th, 2013, 04:37 PM
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Even though they are great Pokemon and I even enjoy both of their designs. Genwunners just LOVE to complain about anything! The fact one is trash and the other is ice cream is awesome! I mean gen one there were sludge Pokemon and a pink pile of *** (ditto).
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