Go Back   The PokéCommunity Forums > Off-Topic Discussions > Discussions & Debates

Notices
For all updates, view the main page.

Discussions & Debates The place to go for slightly more in-depth topics. Discussions and debates about the world, current events, ideas, news, and more.



Reply
 
Thread Tools
  #26    
Old August 21st, 2014 (12:57 PM).
elnoor's Avatar
elnoor
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: villege hidden in the leaf
Gender: Male
Nature: Modest
Quote originally posted by Oryx:
What do you find objectionable about figuring out your own way?

Alternatively: why do you believe that an answer can be found on what the afterlife is while you can only interact with people in this life?
Hmm idk? If I was to trying to figure my own path what can I learn about the afterlife? I personally think religion is the only thing that has given answers unless there another source I don't know off. I am looking at it this way, if there is nothing to worry about that means a good person and tyrant who killed many will have same end result. So it would not matter if people held on to moral values and for every to act as they pleased. That doesn't seem fair or logical I mean even in this life we live in decisions people make wether good/bad has an affect so why would this not apply in the afterlife.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #27    
Old August 21st, 2014 (01:05 PM).
Oryx's Avatar
Oryx
CoquettishCat
Community Supporter
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Age: 22
Gender: Female
Nature: Relaxed
Quote originally posted by elnoor:
Hmm idk? If I was to trying to figure my own path what can I learn about the afterlife? I personally think religion is the only thing that has given answers unless there another source I don't know off. I am looking at it this way, if there is nothing to worry about that means a good person and tyrant who killed many will have same end result. So it would not matter if people held on to moral values and for every to act as they pleased. That doesn't seem fair or logical I mean even in this life we live in decisions people make wether good/bad has an affect so why would this not apply in the afterlife.
I think you're looking at it the wrong way. If everyone has the same result, that means literally all that matters is the life we're in now and how happy we are and how happy we make other people. The value of our life has nothing to do with the afterlife in that case, only with this life, and a good person would want to make sure the one life that everyone has is as happy as possible because they know it's all anyone has.

Do you consider someone "good" if they're only good to work towards a reward or to avoid a punishment?

As far as other sources - you just heard a bunch that are just as credible in these posts. Everything taught by religion was originally taught by a person before they died (there is literally not a word in the Bible written by Jesus or God himself, but by a man that was alive at the time), so these people have no experience with the afterlife. No more than you or me. Just because a lot of people believe them doesn't make their beliefs about the afterlife more "facts" than someone else's. Science gives us the answer that who we are is a series of chemical reactions in our brain and thus when we die we cease to exist for the rest of eternity. We don't wait or sit in darkness or transcend because we just don't exist. It's the same way it was before you were born, not something to grieve over. Just because you don't like that solution doesn't mean that it isn't one.
__________________


Theme * Pair * VM * PM

Not all men...

Are all men stupid?

That's right.

Reply With Quote
  #28    
Old August 21st, 2014 (01:17 PM).
elnoor's Avatar
elnoor
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: villege hidden in the leaf
Gender: Male
Nature: Modest
Quote originally posted by Oryx:
I think you're looking at it the wrong way. If everyone has the same result, that means literally all that matters is the life we're in now and how happy we are and how happy we make other people. The value of our life has nothing to do with the afterlife in that case, only with this life, and a good person would want to make sure the one life that everyone has is as happy as possible because they know it's all anyone has.

Do you consider someone "good" if they're only good to work towards a reward or to avoid a punishment?

As far as other sources - you just heard a bunch that are just as credible in these posts. Everything taught by religion was originally taught by a person before they died (there is literally not a word in the Bible written by Jesus or God himself, but by a man that was alive at the time), so these people have no experience with the afterlife. No more than you or me. Just because a lot of people believe them doesn't make their beliefs about the afterlife more "facts" than someone else's. Science gives us the answer that who we are is a series of chemical reactions in our brain and thus when we die we cease to exist for the rest of eternity. We don't wait or sit in darkness or transcend because we just don't exist. It's the same way it was before you were born, not something to grieve over. Just because you don't like that solution doesn't mean that it isn't one.
I think so yeah I mean are we not all in that category, if laws were not placed in society how would the majority of people act. My question is do you believe Hitler, Pharos, and the average human should all have the same end result with no punishment or responsibility for actions prior to death? And does it sound fair?
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #29    
Old August 21st, 2014 (01:21 PM).
Oryx's Avatar
Oryx
CoquettishCat
Community Supporter
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Age: 22
Gender: Female
Nature: Relaxed
Quote originally posted by elnoor:
I think so yeah I mean are we not all in that category, if laws were not placed in society how would the majority of people act. My question is do you believe Hitler, Pharos, and the average human should all have the same end result with no punishment or responsibility for actions prior to death? And does it sound fair?
Why do you think the afterlife has to be fair? Is it something you want, or something you think is reasonable to believe?
__________________


Theme * Pair * VM * PM

Not all men...

Are all men stupid?

That's right.

Reply With Quote
  #30    
Old August 21st, 2014 (02:00 PM).
elnoor's Avatar
elnoor
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: villege hidden in the leaf
Gender: Male
Nature: Modest
Quote originally posted by Oryx:
Why do you think the afterlife has to be fair? Is it something you want, or something you think is reasonable to believe?
Yes it is something I want. Eternity of happiness with no worries or stress nothing but bliss no filth from this world that is not perfect where everything (literally)has a expiration date. Also no feeling of empty voids that cannot be filled.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #31    
Old August 21st, 2014 (02:20 PM).
Oryx's Avatar
Oryx
CoquettishCat
Community Supporter
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Age: 22
Gender: Female
Nature: Relaxed
Quote originally posted by elnoor:
Yes it is something I want. Eternity of happiness with no worries or stress nothing but bliss no filth from this world that is not perfect where everything (literally)has a expiration date. Also no feeling of empty voids that cannot be filled.
My question was "do you have any proof or do you just want it". If life isn't fair, there's no reason to think the afterlife is fair - it's not fair to the people born during time when the lifespan was 30 years that they were born at that time and die before we do now, but that's how the world works. It's inherently unfair. Why would anyone believe the afterlife is any different and think that idea has any rational foothold? You can believe whatever you want, rational or no, but when you start arguing that your idea makes logical sense and other people should believe it, you have to have more than "wouldn't it be nice?"
__________________


Theme * Pair * VM * PM

Not all men...

Are all men stupid?

That's right.

Reply With Quote
  #32    
Old August 21st, 2014 (03:05 PM).
elnoor's Avatar
elnoor
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: villege hidden in the leaf
Gender: Male
Nature: Modest
I have already stated that religion is proof as without it we would have not ever thought of an afterlife heaven/hell. If you take away belief in a supreme creator than this is what is left which I am sure is the same thought of many nations from before we live then just die and that's it. What proof do you have to be so sure?

Quote originally posted by Oryx:
My question was "do you have any proof or do you just want it". If life isn't fair, there's no reason to think the afterlife is fair - it's not fair to the people born during time when the lifespan was 30 years that they were born at that time and die before we do now, but that's how the world works. It's inherently unfair. Why would anyone believe the afterlife is any different and think that idea has any rational foothold? You can believe whatever you want, rational or no, but when you start arguing that your idea makes logical sense and other people should believe it, you have to have more than "wouldn't it be nice?"
I have already stated that religion is proof as without it we would have not ever thought of an afterlife heaven/hell. If you take away belief in a supreme creator than this is what is left which I am sure is the same thought of many nations from before we live then just die and that's it. What proof do you have to be so sure?
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #33    
Old August 21st, 2014 (03:07 PM).
elnoor's Avatar
elnoor
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: villege hidden in the leaf
Gender: Male
Nature: Modest
I apologize about the double post I started writing and forgot to reply lol.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #34    
Old August 21st, 2014 (03:12 PM).
Oryx's Avatar
Oryx
CoquettishCat
Community Supporter
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Age: 22
Gender: Female
Nature: Relaxed
Quote originally posted by elnoor:
I have already stated that religion is proof as without it we would have not ever thought of an afterlife heaven/hell.
Why in the world do you think that? Before religion, when we are still very young children, we understand the concept of justice. We want things to be fair. It's only logical to come to "people who are bad will get their due eventually", but they don't in life. Thus, it's only logical to come to "people who are bad will get their due after death." This is a logical series of thoughts a child could come up with, not something so clever only religion could think of it.

Because there is no physical proof of anything in the afterlife, my proof is merely logic, which I already explained to you - it is logical to believe that the afterlife is exactly what the beforelife was and that, as our electrical impulses stop, we stop. It is logical to believe that because literally nothing else in the world is fair, the afterlife would not be either. It's not logical to say that while everything else in the world is unfair, the afterlife must be because we want it to be.
__________________


Theme * Pair * VM * PM

Not all men...

Are all men stupid?

That's right.

Reply With Quote
  #35    
Old August 21st, 2014 (03:16 PM).
Zekrom's Avatar
Zekrom
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: over there
Age: 22
Gender: Female
Quote originally posted by elnoor:
I have already stated that religion is proof as without it we would have not ever thought of an afterlife heaven/hell. If you take away belief in a supreme creator than this is what is left which I am sure is the same thought of many nations from before we live then just die and that's it. What proof do you have to be so sure?
What exactly is this proof of yours? If you make the claim, you have to provide the proof for it, not us, and that is exactly what Oryx has asked you.

Religion doesn't have to be true in order for people to think of an afterlife.
__________________

Avatar by Fairy
My Trade Shop (currently open!)
Reply With Quote
  #36    
Old August 21st, 2014 (03:21 PM).
elnoor's Avatar
elnoor
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: villege hidden in the leaf
Gender: Male
Nature: Modest
Quote originally posted by Oryx:
Why in the world do you think that? Before religion, when we are still very young children, we understand the concept of justice. We want things to be fair. It's only logical to come to "people who are bad will get their due eventually", but they don't in life. Thus, it's only logical to come to "people who are bad will get their due after death." This is a logical series of thoughts a child could come up with, not something so clever only religion could think of it.

Because there is no physical proof of anything in the afterlife, my proof is merely logic, which I already explained to you - it is logical to believe that the afterlife is exactly what the beforelife was and that, as our electrical impulses stop, we stop. It is logical to believe that because literally nothing else in the world is fair, the afterlife would not be either. It's not logical to say that while everything else in the world is unfair, the afterlife must be because we want it to be.
I don't think children know right from wrong or understand the concept of justice these things are taught, you must agree with at least that. Ok if electrical impulses stop then we stop how are they created to be who we are with all the variety in this world?
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #37    
Old August 21st, 2014 (03:28 PM).
elnoor's Avatar
elnoor
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: villege hidden in the leaf
Gender: Male
Nature: Modest
Quote originally posted by Zekrom:
What exactly is this proof of yours? If you make the claim, you have to provide the proof for it, not us, and that is exactly what Oryx has asked you.

Religion doesn't have to be true in order for people to think of an afterlife.
Lol honestly I feel like I am by myself on this. What I am saying is if you take away all religion why would anyone even think of an afterlife. The only thing you would worry about is this life and that's it. So if what Oryx is saying is true then there is no after life whether heaven hell or sleep nothing. But this thought of afterlife period who came up with it?
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #38    
Old August 21st, 2014 (03:42 PM).
Oryx's Avatar
Oryx
CoquettishCat
Community Supporter
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Age: 22
Gender: Female
Nature: Relaxed
Quote originally posted by elnoor:
I don't think children know right from wrong or understand the concept of justice these things are taught, you must agree with at least that. Ok if electrical impulses stop then we stop how are they created to be who we are with all the variety in this world?
But we teach justice whether or not we teach religion. I was not raised with any kind of religion at all and I was talking about fairness as soon as I could speak. Fairness is a value taught by our parents and in our schools with or without religion.

Creation is outside the scope of this thread but we evolved over tens of millions of years, incrementally getting better until we became who we are today. Just because life is complex doesn't mean it has to be created.

Quote originally posted by elnoor:
Lol honestly I feel like I am by myself on this. What I am saying is if you take away all religion why would anyone even think of an afterlife. The only thing you would worry about is this life and that's it. So if what Oryx is saying is true then there is no after life whether heaven hell or sleep nothing. But this thought of afterlife period who came up with it?
There are a few Christians on PC; however, they tend to be "believe what you want, they're both valid" rather than "I think my opinion makes logical sense". People think of an afterlife because of the concept of time and the concept of life. It's a natural progression. When there is a thing that's finite, people wonder what's beyond the borders. We tested the edges of the "endless sea", we tested the edges of the atmosphere, and we wondered about the edges of mortality. This is a natural curiosity. Humans test boundaries, and life is a boundary, so we test and think. It's natural and logical.
__________________


Theme * Pair * VM * PM

Not all men...

Are all men stupid?

That's right.

Reply With Quote
  #39    
Old August 21st, 2014 (04:07 PM).
Kingdom of Tea's Avatar
Kingdom of Tea
What you lookin' at?
Community Supporter
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Nottingham, England
Age: 18
Gender: Male
Nature: Adamant
Just so you know there is a thing called Philosophy which explores how we were created, how we live, afterlife ect ect. So even without religion there would be Philosophy which would explore the possibility of an afterlife or something after death.

I don't understand why you keep dismissing the idea of thinking for yourself and making your own interpretation of what happens after death, someone like myself who doesn't believe in an afterlife obviously doesn't believe in hell or heaven.

Also, like people have said already children are taught right and wrong at an early age by their guardians or parents, I certainly didn't learn right and wrong from religion because I have never ever been in a religious upbringing but I know right from wrong.
__________________
Lost Christmas
PC Supporter since February 28th, 2014
“The colour of this box is nice, oh Hi there didn't realise you were reading.”
Pair(s) | Sig Credit | Completed Challenges
Reply With Quote
  #40    
Old August 22nd, 2014 (02:54 AM).
Phantom's Avatar
Phantom
Uh, I didn't do it
Community Supporter
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Minnesota
Age: 24
Gender: Female
Nature: Brave
Quote originally posted by elnoor:
Lol honestly I feel like I am by myself on this. What I am saying is if you take away all religion why would anyone even think of an afterlife. The only thing you would worry about is this life and that's it. So if what Oryx is saying is true then there is no after life whether heaven hell or sleep nothing. But this thought of afterlife period who came up with it?
Because it's something people don't understand.

Look at the old religions of the world... the ancient Greek and Egyptians. What did their religions center around? Myths. We call them myths now because they are old and deemed silly.

Properly a myth is a story or parable to explain a natural phenomenon by supernatural and celestial means. How does the sun move across the sky? Why it's lead by a golden chariot lead by Apollo of course! What causes thunder and lightning? Why a great god throws them from the tallest mountaintops then he's angry!

What things boil down to is people are scared of things they don't understand, and that they may never understand. It's a very natural and instinctual response. Death is a scary concept. The idea that one day you will cease to be. That there will be a painful experience that will lead to your end. Pain and the unknown will make many lose sleep at night.

So how do we soften this fear? Eternal life by some means.

You die in this world to go to a better one, a heaven or a hell depending on your actions in life.

You're reincarnated as another creature to life another life on this world.

You achieve peace.

You are now a spirit, watching over all those who still yet live and guide them on their journey.

You will rise again come judgment day. So take what you can with you. Even your cat.

You will be sent to a world of the dead, organized by your life choices to live forever in peace, or to be tormented for all eternity.

...

The question of death is life's oldest question, the heart of philosophy.

Religion is the result of man's curiosity and the desire to make sense of the senseless. Of course, now we explain things with science, and the more we explain with science, the less mystery there seems to be.

But trust me, there are a great many mysteries, questions and answers we never even thought of knowing or asking.

As for my understanding. We die, and there is nothing. No great sleep, no heaven or hell. We simply cease to be.

Religion is merely training wheels to make people feel more comfortable in this crazy ride called life. Once we remove them, we should be able to progress even further, unhindered by the stigma's and dogma of structuralized religions.
Reply With Quote
  #41    
Old August 22nd, 2014 (03:11 AM).
Kingdom of Tea's Avatar
Kingdom of Tea
What you lookin' at?
Community Supporter
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Nottingham, England
Age: 18
Gender: Male
Nature: Adamant
We don't understand religions fully but that doesn't make me scared of them, I don't fully understand all scientific thesis yet I am not scared of them.
__________________
Lost Christmas
PC Supporter since February 28th, 2014
“The colour of this box is nice, oh Hi there didn't realise you were reading.”
Pair(s) | Sig Credit | Completed Challenges
Reply With Quote
  #42    
Old August 22nd, 2014 (03:27 AM).
The Void's Avatar
The Void
Iron hand in a velvet glove
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Holy Roman Empire
Gender: Male
Nature: Calm
Since the first page was all about Pascal's Wager, God's mercy, etc., I'd just like to insert this nice quote from The Kingdom of Heaven:

"God will understand, my lord. And if he doesn't, then he is not God and we need not worry."
__________________
NEMO VIR EST QUI MUNDUM NON REDDAT MELIOREM.
Reply With Quote
  #43    
Old August 23rd, 2014 (03:27 PM).
Lotus the Cat's Avatar
Lotus the Cat
 
Join Date: May 2014
Location: Australia
Age: 28
Gender: Female
I'm atheist, therefore I of course think that when we die, there is nothing. There is no proof to say otherwise. The Bible is not proof of an afterlife, nor is any other religious text or teachings.

The idea of a religious afterlife seems underpinned by the idea of humans possessing "souls". If they exist, why have we not discovered them? If our soul is us, then why can changes to the neural connections or chemical balances in our brains significantly alter our personality?

Morality is not uniquely human. There is growing evidence to suggest that other animals have morals and social rules that allow them to live in communities. Quick search article here.

Quote originally posted by Oryx:
Just because life is complex doesn't mean it has to be created.
As an engineer, the opposite is true for complexity. I would argue that we are too complex to have been intelligently created.
Reply With Quote
  #44    
Old August 23rd, 2014 (07:39 PM).
Phantom's Avatar
Phantom
Uh, I didn't do it
Community Supporter
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Minnesota
Age: 24
Gender: Female
Nature: Brave
Quote originally posted by A Shadow's Soul:
We don't understand religions fully but that doesn't make me scared of them, I don't fully understand all scientific thesis yet I am not scared of them.
I'm failing to see your point.
Reply With Quote
  #45    
Old August 24th, 2014 (05:56 AM).
The Void's Avatar
The Void
Iron hand in a velvet glove
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Holy Roman Empire
Gender: Male
Nature: Calm
Quote originally posted by Phantom:
Religion is merely training wheels to make people feel more comfortable in this crazy ride called life. Once we remove them, we should be able to progress even further, unhindered by the stigma's and dogma of structuralized religions.
I'd like to remind you that a lot of what we see in modern science came from the direct contributions of medieval Christian scholars and the Islamic world. The father of genetics was a monk named Gregor Mendel, and the founder of the big bang theory was a Belgian priest named Georges Lemaitre. Chemistry as a science was institutionalized in the form of alchemy under various Arab scholars during the Fatimid dynasty.

In the present day, organized religion tends to delve deeper into science as well. The Vatican has its own Pontifical Academy of Sciences, and the Dalai Lama spends a lot of time with scientists and even wrote: "My confidence in venturing into science lies in my basic belief that as in science, so in Buddhism, understanding the nature of reality is pursued by means of critical investigation. If scientific analysis were conclusively to demonstrate certain claims in Buddhism to be false, then we must accept the findings of science and abandon those claims."

Quote originally posted by Lotus the Cat:
The idea of a religious afterlife seems underpinned by the idea of humans possessing "souls". If they exist, why have we not discovered them? If our soul is us, then why can changes to the neural connections or chemical balances in our brains significantly alter our personality?
What do you mean by "discover"? Almost every faith describes soul as immaterial, and thus unobservable by physical technology. The soul is more than just consciousness and psychological behavior -- it is the person's actuality, essence, and psyche.

Quote originally posted by Lotus the Cat:
Morality is not uniquely human. There is growing evidence to suggest that other animals have morals and social rules that allow them to live in communities. Quick search article here.
I refute this conclusion: you cannot say that morality is not unique to humans when there is no absolute proof that animals have morals. There is no verdict from the scientific community as a whole, and it is possible that animals observed to have shown actions similarly agreeable to human morality could be a mere combination of instinct and emotions, which do not necessarily equate to morality.

Quote originally posted by Lotus the Cat:
As an engineer, the opposite is true for complexity. I would argue that we are too complex to have been intelligently created.
Interesting statement; would you mind expounding a bit?
__________________
NEMO VIR EST QUI MUNDUM NON REDDAT MELIOREM.
Reply With Quote
  #46    
Old August 25th, 2014 (02:26 AM).
Lotus the Cat's Avatar
Lotus the Cat
 
Join Date: May 2014
Location: Australia
Age: 28
Gender: Female
Quote originally posted by The Void:
What do you mean by "discover"? Almost every faith describes soul as immaterial, and thus unobservable by physical technology. The soul is more than just consciousness and psychological behavior -- it is the person's actuality, essence, and psyche.
I don't understand how the soul can make sense as the essence of a person without a direct relationship to someone's personality. If they are separate, what is a soul? If your soul goes somewhere after death, but is not your personality, what is it? What exactly do you mean by essence?

The word psyche does not make any sense here. It either translates to soul (so cannot be a descriptor for soul), or as mind. As mind it is also subject to alteration from physical and chemical changes in the brain.


Quote originally posted by The Void:
I refute this conclusion: you cannot say that morality is not unique to humans when there is no absolute proof that animals have morals. There is no verdict from the scientific community as a whole, and it is possible that animals observed to have shown actions similarly agreeable to human morality could be a mere combination of instinct and emotions, which do not necessarily equate to morality.
There is only no absolute proof because that would require being capable of talking to animals. Observation is all that is available to us. The examples provided in the article suggest moral behaviour to me. If you want to argue, feel free to provide counter arguments for coincidence of behaviour using the cases mentioned in my link.

Quote originally posted by The Void:
Interesting statement; would you mind expounding a bit?
I won't pretend to be a biologist, so it is not the details of the biology I will comment on, but the argument. Intelligent design produces the simplest means to achieve a goal: not the most complex. Arguing that there must be a god because of the complexity of the human eye argues against itself. The complexity of the eye is due to an imperfect process: i.e. evolution.
Reply With Quote
  #47    
Old August 25th, 2014 (06:27 AM).
Juno's Avatar
Juno
the price of freedom
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Canada, where the moose are
Age: 20
Gender: Female
I am completely ignorant to all things related to any religion, so based on what I do know about the concepts of Heaven and Hell, I don't believe in, nor do I want an afterlife. By that, I don't mean "please don't give me eternal bliss and peace", I just have no problem believing there is nothing after death - the life I have now is good; it's enough, and I intend to make the best and most of it.

Also, to me, the concept of Heaven and Hell just sounds like a way of persuading and scaring people into staying in line and being moral during their lives. I don't need that - I will and can be a good person without the promise of a prize or fear of punishment at the end of my life.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #48    
Old August 25th, 2014 (12:01 PM).
elnoor's Avatar
elnoor
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: villege hidden in the leaf
Gender: Male
Nature: Modest
Quote originally posted by Lotus the Cat:
I don't understand how the soul can make sense as the essence of a person without a direct relationship to someone's personality. If they are separate, what is a soul? If your soul goes somewhere after death, but is not your personality, what is it? What exactly do you mean by essence?

The word psyche does not make any sense here. It either translates to soul (so cannot be a descriptor for soul), or as mind. As mind it is also subject to alteration from physical and chemical changes in the brain.




There is only no absolute proof because that would require being capable of talking to animals. Observation is all that is available to us. The examples provided in the article suggest moral behaviour to me. If you want to argue, feel free to provide counter arguments for coincidence of behaviour using the cases mentioned in my link.



I won't pretend to be a biologist, so it is not the details of the biology I will comment on, but the argument. Intelligent design produces the simplest means to achieve a goal: not the most complex. Arguing that there must be a god because of the complexity of the human eye argues against itself. The complexity of the eye is due to an imperfect process: i.e. evolution.

Can you explain to me how it argues against itself exactly. This specific complexity of the eye alone should be more then enough proof. Are you saying it was an accident we came into existence or that our sight was an accident realistically what is the possibility of that happening. Also it is called the evolution theory not evolution fact. I could also argue to say that this is a weak explanation as this specific theory came to be as a way to explain something that could not be understood by the scientist so this is their speculated answer.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #49    
Old August 25th, 2014 (12:19 PM).
Zekrom's Avatar
Zekrom
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: over there
Age: 22
Gender: Female
Quote originally posted by elnoor:
Can you explain to me how it argues against itself exactly. This specific complexity of the eye alone should be more then enough proof. Are you saying it was an accident we came into existence or that our sight was an accident realistically what is the possibility of that happening. Also it is called the evolution theory not evolution fact. I could also argue to say that this is a weak explanation as this specific theory came to be as a way to explain something that could not be understood by the scientist so this is their speculated answer.
The thing about complexity that Lotus was talking about is that an intelligent being usually finds the simplest way to do or make something. So if there is a God, why would it bother with making something complex like the human body? Why not do something simpler and more efficient?

Also....there's a difference between the use of the word "theory" in science and by the average person. A scientific theory is:

Quote:
A scientific theory is a well-substantiated explanation of some aspect of the natural world that is acquired through the scientific method, and repeatedly confirmed through observation and experimentation.
Whereas the layman's definition of a theory is basically an educated guess.
__________________

Avatar by Fairy
My Trade Shop (currently open!)
Reply With Quote
  #50    
Old August 25th, 2014 (01:14 PM).
elnoor's Avatar
elnoor
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: villege hidden in the leaf
Gender: Male
Nature: Modest
Quote originally posted by Zekrom:
The thing about complexity that Lotus was talking about is that an intelligent being usually finds the simplest way to do or make something. So if there is a God, why would it bother with making something complex like the human body? Why not do something simpler and more efficient?

Also....there's a difference between the use of the word "theory" in science and by the average person. A scientific theory is:



Whereas the layman's definition of a theory is basically an educated guess.

Ok DNA in all living organisms are made of the same four nucleotide, this provides simplicity and organization that is impossible to argue as a mistake. The human body is made of trillions of these much simpler cells that implement this DNA. As for the theory lets go with the scientific use of it, how was evolution tested and proved over and over? Why did all the monkeys all of a sudden stop evolving. Why can we not get a talking Ceaser.
__________________
Reply With Quote
Reply
Quick Reply

Sponsored Links
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Minimum Characters Per Post: 25



All times are UTC -8. The time now is 09:51 PM.