Team-Building Workshop

Dark Azelf · Mar 1, 2015

I hate to be that guy, but is it superior to MGyara to warrant its use? Unless you're using another mega but yeah just something to think about.

Anyway as its slow Tailwind support might not go amiss. Tornadus-I can probs set up rain too which would probs be really fun to play with to help it wreck even more. Sheer Force LO Gatr Waterfalls in rain with Tail Wind Support! Sounds scary and good lol.

I agree with Mag being a good partner too.

champagnepapi · Mar 2, 2015

Anti said:
Oh yeah, this kinda died so I might as well revive it (omg double post op) with the team that came out of this core since I would describe the team as "very nice but not quite there yet" so it's pretty much in tweak mode but could use a facelift. It's really more geared toward suspect but can kinda-sorta hang with Mega Metagross I guess? Lol.

Many of y'all have faced this team, and if you have then you know I like to play it aggressively as I am not super confident in the defensive core. My suspect ladder record is 31-13 though I think the team's record is closer to 26-8 because I started on suspect with an offense team whose defensive stopper was MegaZard X haha, so you can guess how that went. Anyway, here's what I have:

Slowbro (M) @ Slowbronite
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 80 Def / 176 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Calm Mind
- Scald
- Psyshock
- Slack Off

The old post explains why I like Mega Slowbro so much, but let's just say that he's a really terrifying win condition. I think in practice the only thing I have been annoyed with is that, if he doesn't get Scald burns (which *would* happen to me), breaking iffy pseudo-checks like Ferrothorn and Rotom-W does get a bit more difficult. I have this paired with Healing Wish support (spoiler alert) which allows me to play it very aggressively early on, which is nice. Even though it can be stopped, I kind of find this to be a BS poke tbh. :/

Heatran @ Leftovers
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 248 HP / 12 SpA / 208 SpD / 40 Spe
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Lava Plume
- Stealth Rock
- Earth Power
- Toxic

I tossed in Heatran for SR support, a kinda-sorta Talonflame check, a little status, and much-needed special bulk. I'm not a huge fan of Heatran but he does his job pretty well and closes some gaps on the team. I would be open to a replacement here. Oh, and idek about the EVs. I think they all just made the numbers pretty (like 300 satk or something?) so don't ask.

Tornadus-Therian (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 40 Atk / 252 SpA / 216 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Hurricane
- Superpower
- Knock Off
- U-turn

I actually removed this for a bit because Hurricane's accuracy kept costing me games. No matter: I still love his Speed, utility, and ability to grab momentum, even though I really wish that Hurricane didn't suck. He's a great early game breaker against some teams as well though I wouldn't say it's as good as the mixed Defiant Thundurus I enjoyed spamming in XY. The big thing with Tornadus is that he can safely switch into Serperior and especially Celebi and get me back momentum. It allows me to play Slowbro aggressively and not fear an incoming vegetable mon. sry sims.

Clefable @ Leftovers
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Spe
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Moonblast
- Thunder Wave
- Calm Mind
- Soft-Boiled

I always use this mon lol. It's just too useful. I liked the idea of dual CM with MegaBro, and her utility actually supports Slowbro nicely, especially on the status absorption front. Otherwise, it can spread status, somewhat alleviate the pressure from weak VoltTurns, and checks numerous Pokemon or can at least prevent them from sweeping, because Fairy type is insane. Thunder Wave gets the nod over Flamethrower because I find it more useful defensively and for Heatran, though given how spotty this team is against fast Mega Scizor, I think Flamethrower is a fair choice even though Heatran can check it if it gets paralyzed.

Keldeo @ Leftovers
Ability: Justified
EVs: 248 SpA / 8 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Calm Mind
- Scald
- Secret Sword
- Substitute

Ehhhh I feel like the metagame has started to adapt to this guy a bit (as evidenced by the rise of Celebi, Starmie, etc.) and I find it less effective than I did when ORAS started. Even so, this is my primary stall-breaker (translation: stall is a difficult matchup for me) and still puts pressure on a lot of teams and checks Scizor and Bisharp, though not all that well. I feel like this is where my team building got a tiniest bit lazy.

Latias (F) @ Life Orb
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 2 Atk / 30 SpA / 30 Spe
- Draco Meteor
- Hidden Power [Fire]
- Defog
- Healing Wish

This guy has actually been really clutch and is a great synergy mon. For some reason, I find people to be more careful about coverage moves when playing vs. Latios than Latias, so I've found HP Fire to be a surprisingly effective Scizor/Ferro lure. It provides a *badly* needed Electric resist and a good switch-in to Charizard Y and non-SubMind Keld I guess. The real story here is Healing Wish, which is usually when I make my move in a game and corner my opponent. Often I find that teams can check any one of my CM sweepers but not all that well, so I can weaken them and then come back for round two. This is especially true of MegaBro who can actually beat/severely maim some of its checks 1v1 but is left at really low health (think vs. like LO Thund or something) which effectively kills Slowbro since it's too slow to recover on anything. Healing Wish changes that equation, which is awesome.

Okay so here are the issues I want to have fixed:

- Fairies: For a suspect ladder team you'd think I'd be better against these guys, but nah, Clefable can completely shut me down (Slowbro is not the best Clef check in the world, I'll just say that) and my Mega Diancie check is uhhh Slowbro lol? I can survive, but it's not ideal. Oh, and don't even get me started on Azumarill, who I basically just sacrifice mons to.

- VoltTurn: Oh look, balance is super popular and VoltTurn mons like Rotom-W, Landorus-T, and Mag are really common, and they check the mon I'm building around! BRB I'm going to make myself obnoxiously weak to this strategy.

- Stall: I can outplay this match-up, but it requires really sound execution.

- Mega Pinsir: I have literally not seen a single one of these, but lol.

These flaws haven't been crippling because ~~I am a prodigy~~ they can be played around to various degrees and I have four Pokemon that are really frightening win-cons on their own, which gives me tremendous in-game flexibility. I feel like the build is just a little flabby, meaning that I'm not quite making efficient use of my team slots. I've been stuck on what exactly I should be shifting around. Suggestions welcome etc.

As for Band Scizor I ran him with a few different builds and just found him to be a liiiittle too slow and too frail (or perhaps easy to wear down) than I would have liked, and while the advantages I mentioned were there, I just found it to be iffy on the whole. Oh well not every idea can take off. ;(

you could try a mega scizor with superpower>keldeo and a regular slowbro, that and taunt over EP on heatran should take care of most fairies

m-diancie and m-scizor are still annoying but these pokes are always difficult to defend against on teams like yours but it's possible to play around them, you could try the 252/160/96+ spread on Clefable to take moonblasts better, since Slowbro can take on lopunny. mega gyara might become more annoying if you do that, though

m-diancie has to carry hp fire and predict correctly to beat scizor too, so maybe it isnt that bad a weak

Dark Azelf · Mar 3, 2015

There isnt much to really do with your team anti. I would suggest a ground type over Keld since that appears to be the most replaceable member of your team. Something that might be interesting is Krookodile. Yeah i know its not something you'd usually use but hear me out. It can psuedo check Bisharp still and you can scarf it if you want and rack up Moxie boost Knock off sweeps late game, can even pursuit shit like Celebi if you're feeling frisky which helps bro obv. Scarf or CB or w/e lol. It helps slightly vs volt turn too as in can block volt switches from stuff like Mag and Manectric and i guess from rotom but not really lol.

100% agree with Taunt on Heatran. Then you could either run TrapTran/Taunt+Toxic to lure in shit like Chansey for megabro thus improving your match up against stall whilst also beating fairies better than your current set does.

Karma89 · Mar 9, 2015

I don't exactly have a team in mind or anything, its just that recently i've fallen in love with a few pokes and i was curious to see if anyone could come up with a team that could make them work together.

Lately i've been really enjoying the combo of Mew and Porygon2 in my teams but beyond that i can seem to put something together that flows well.

My typical set up for the two pokes seems pretty standard i think

Mew @ Leftovers
Defog
Will-O-Wisp
Soft Boiled
Knock Off

Porygon2 @ Eviolite
Thunderbolt/Tri-Attack
Ice Beam
Toxic
Recover

I've also been enjoying Umbreon a lot lately but it doesn't need to be in the team. I'm looking for something OU related and really i'm just looking to hear about some teams that might be able to fight the above two pokes in them.

Dark Azelf · Mar 10, 2015

Anti said:
Oh yeah, this kinda died so I might as well revive it (omg double post op) with the team that came out of this core since I would describe the team as "very nice but not quite there yet" so it's pretty much in tweak mode but could use a facelift. It's really more geared toward suspect but can kinda-sorta hang with Mega Metagross I guess? Lol.

Many of y'all have faced this team, and if you have then you know I like to play it aggressively as I am not super confident in the defensive core. My suspect ladder record is 31-13 though I think the team's record is closer to 26-8 because I started on suspect with an offense team whose defensive stopper was MegaZard X haha, so you can guess how that went. Anyway, here's what I have:

Slowbro (M) @ Slowbronite
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 80 Def / 176 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Calm Mind
- Scald
- Psyshock
- Slack Off

The old post explains why I like Mega Slowbro so much, but let's just say that he's a really terrifying win condition. I think in practice the only thing I have been annoyed with is that, if he doesn't get Scald burns (which *would* happen to me), breaking iffy pseudo-checks like Ferrothorn and Rotom-W does get a bit more difficult. I have this paired with Healing Wish support (spoiler alert) which allows me to play it very aggressively early on, which is nice. Even though it can be stopped, I kind of find this to be a BS poke tbh. :/

Heatran @ Leftovers
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 248 HP / 12 SpA / 208 SpD / 40 Spe
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Lava Plume
- Stealth Rock
- Earth Power
- Toxic

I tossed in Heatran for SR support, a kinda-sorta Talonflame check, a little status, and much-needed special bulk. I'm not a huge fan of Heatran but he does his job pretty well and closes some gaps on the team. I would be open to a replacement here. Oh, and idek about the EVs. I think they all just made the numbers pretty (like 300 satk or something?) so don't ask.

Tornadus-Therian (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 40 Atk / 252 SpA / 216 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Hurricane
- Superpower
- Knock Off
- U-turn

I actually removed this for a bit because Hurricane's accuracy kept costing me games. No matter: I still love his Speed, utility, and ability to grab momentum, even though I really wish that Hurricane didn't suck. He's a great early game breaker against some teams as well though I wouldn't say it's as good as the mixed Defiant Thundurus I enjoyed spamming in XY. The big thing with Tornadus is that he can safely switch into Serperior and especially Celebi and get me back momentum. It allows me to play Slowbro aggressively and not fear an incoming vegetable mon. sry sims.

Clefable @ Leftovers
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Spe
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Moonblast
- Thunder Wave
- Calm Mind
- Soft-Boiled

I always use this mon lol. It's just too useful. I liked the idea of dual CM with MegaBro, and her utility actually supports Slowbro nicely, especially on the status absorption front. Otherwise, it can spread status, somewhat alleviate the pressure from weak VoltTurns, and checks numerous Pokemon or can at least prevent them from sweeping, because Fairy type is insane. Thunder Wave gets the nod over Flamethrower because I find it more useful defensively and for Heatran, though given how spotty this team is against fast Mega Scizor, I think Flamethrower is a fair choice even though Heatran can check it if it gets paralyzed.

Keldeo @ Leftovers
Ability: Justified
EVs: 248 SpA / 8 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Calm Mind
- Scald
- Secret Sword
- Substitute

Ehhhh I feel like the metagame has started to adapt to this guy a bit (as evidenced by the rise of Celebi, Starmie, etc.) and I find it less effective than I did when ORAS started. Even so, this is my primary stall-breaker (translation: stall is a difficult matchup for me) and still puts pressure on a lot of teams and checks Scizor and Bisharp, though not all that well. I feel like this is where my team building got a tiniest bit lazy.

Latias (F) @ Life Orb
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 2 Atk / 30 SpA / 30 Spe
- Draco Meteor
- Hidden Power [Fire]
- Defog
- Healing Wish

This guy has actually been really clutch and is a great synergy mon. For some reason, I find people to be more careful about coverage moves when playing vs. Latios than Latias, so I've found HP Fire to be a surprisingly effective Scizor/Ferro lure. It provides a *badly* needed Electric resist and a good switch-in to Charizard Y and non-SubMind Keld I guess. The real story here is Healing Wish, which is usually when I make my move in a game and corner my opponent. Often I find that teams can check any one of my CM sweepers but not all that well, so I can weaken them and then come back for round two. This is especially true of MegaBro who can actually beat/severely maim some of its checks 1v1 but is left at really low health (think vs. like LO Thund or something) which effectively kills Slowbro since it's too slow to recover on anything. Healing Wish changes that equation, which is awesome.

Okay so here are the issues I want to have fixed:

- Fairies: For a suspect ladder team you'd think I'd be better against these guys, but nah, Clefable can completely shut me down (Slowbro is not the best Clef check in the world, I'll just say that) and my Mega Diancie check is uhhh Slowbro lol? I can survive, but it's not ideal. Oh, and don't even get me started on Azumarill, who I basically just sacrifice mons to.

- VoltTurn: Oh look, balance is super popular and VoltTurn mons like Rotom-W, Landorus-T, and Mag are really common, and they check the mon I'm building around! BRB I'm going to make myself obnoxiously weak to this strategy.

- Stall: I can outplay this match-up, but it requires really sound execution.

- Mega Pinsir: I have literally not seen a single one of these, but lol.

These flaws haven't been crippling because ~~I am a prodigy~~ they can be played around to various degrees and I have four Pokemon that are really frightening win-cons on their own, which gives me tremendous in-game flexibility. I feel like the build is just a little flabby, meaning that I'm not quite making efficient use of my team slots. I've been stuck on what exactly I should be shifting around. Suggestions welcome etc.

As for Band Scizor I ran him with a few different builds and just found him to be a liiiittle too slow and too frail (or perhaps easy to wear down) than I would have liked, and while the advantages I mentioned were there, I just found it to be iffy on the whole. Oh well not every idea can take off. ;(

To expand on my earlier rate, Altaria REALLY hurts this team badly after play testing. Especially Dragon Dance. EQ mix special sets arent much better. Basically the only thing you can do to them is hope for a burn with bro otherwise its a 6-0 you. If it has sub or Facade then you're pretty much done.

Im not sure what the next move would be cos of it obs ruining the synergy. Id probs replace Keld (as i said earlier) and Torn. Those are definitely the weak links here. Krook is doing really well over Keld as it checks stuff like Manectric and softens up bros countes, i.e Celebi etc so its working really well.

Karma89 said:
I don't exactly have a team in mind or anything, its just that recently i've fallen in love with a few pokes and i was curious to see if anyone could come up with a team that could make them work together.

Lately i've been really enjoying the combo of Mew and Porygon2 in my teams but beyond that i can seem to put something together that flows well.

My typical set up for the two pokes seems pretty standard i think

Mew @ Leftovers
Defog
Will-O-Wisp
Soft Boiled
Knock Off

Porygon2 @ Eviolite
Thunderbolt/Tri-Attack
Ice Beam
Toxic
Recover

I've also been enjoying Umbreon a lot lately but it doesn't need to be in the team. I'm looking for something OU related and really i'm just looking to hear about some teams that might be able to fight the above two pokes in them.

You could probably run stall with these two. Porygon-2, Umbreon and Mew seems to be a nice core.

Karma89 · Mar 10, 2015

Dark Azelf said:
You could probably run stall with these two. Porygon-2, Umbreon and Mew seems to be a nice core.

Yeah, i was thinking about that. I ended up going Mega Sableye instead of Umbreon though.

Anti · Mar 11, 2015

Dark Azelf said:
To expand on my earlier rate, Altaria REALLY hurts this team badly after play testing. Especially Dragon Dance. EQ mix special sets arent much better. Basically the only thing you can do to them is hope for a burn with bro otherwise its a 6-0 you. If it has sub or Facade then you're pretty much done.

Im not sure what the next move would be cos of it obs ruining the synergy. Id probs replace Keld (as i said earlier) and Torn. Those are definitely the weak links here. Krook is doing really well over Keld as it checks stuff like Manectric and softens up bros countes, i.e Celebi etc so its working really well.

first off, thanks for playtesting and giving me in-depth suggestions etc.

will definitely toss on krook and see how it goes, but i really like the suggestion. also quirky and hopefully decently viable :p ginger elf in da building

gotta disagree on torn-t tho, if the version u battled yoshi with is what u playtested, then yeah torn is gonna suck because air slash is just terrible lol. hurricane misses suck but i'd rather roll the dice on it then consistently *never do any damage*. anyway, torn-t is great for grass-types that come in on big bro and unlike heatran, it actually applies pressure to my opponent, and its utility is simply fantastic. gotta say i've had a different playtest exp than u w this one haha.

as for alt it's def a problem. my phys def evs let it come in on return somewhat reliably at full health (28% chance to 2hko with max atk adamant) but it is admittedly shaky at best. even so, altaria is decently easy to pressure though it does restrict my play a lot since keld and lati become major liabilities until it's weakened or killed. i've actually struggled more with mega diancie but same difference lol, usually just sack slowbro to get a scald hit on it and then RK with torn t. often tries to bounce sr back but gets hit with ep from tran. anyway, krook doesn't help with this so much but uhhh i could drop hp fire for psyshock on the lati so i can peed tie diancie and at least put some pressure on altaria. might just be a weakness i have to accept, and hopefully the return of metagross (who btw is a pain, slowbro or not) will lessen those mons' usage. hehe :x

Alfieri · Mar 11, 2015

Hey guys, I'd like to create a doubles rain team with Kabutops as one of my sweepers. However I don't know which Pokemon is best suited for setting up rain and what good abilities besides Swift Swim really take advantage of rain.

Kabutops @ Life Orb
Ability: Swift Swim
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Speed
Jolly Nature
- Waterfall
- Stone Edge
- Aqua Jet
- Protect

Nah · Mar 11, 2015

Alfieri said:
Hey guys, I'd like to create a doubles rain team with Kabutops as one of my sweepers. However I don't know which Pokemon is best suited for setting up rain and what good abilities besides Swift Swim really take advantage of rain.

Kabutops @ Life Orb
Ability: Swift Swim
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Speed
Jolly Nature
- Waterfall
- Stone Edge
- Aqua Jet
- Protect

Swift Swim is the only ability you're gonna be looking at really since it's hard to go defensive on rain in doubles and Hydration/Rain Dish are more of a defensive thing. But Manaphy gets Hydration and could be fun to try out. Politoed is needed on your team since it's the only legal auto-rain summoner:

Politoed @ Leftovers
Ability: Drizzle
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
- Scald
- Encore/Icy Wind
- Encore/Perish Song
- Protect

It's a good idea to have a backup rain maker. Lotta Pokemon can learn Rain Dance, but maybe you could try like Pranskter Thundurus or something, idk. Other Swift Swim/Rain abusers include Mega Swampert, Kingdra, Ludicolo, etc. You'll also probably wanna put in something like Amoongus to keep Grass and Electric attacks off of your Water types, or a more offensive Grass type to directly deal with them, like Mega Venusaur, Breloom, Celebi, etc.

And Rock Slide > Stone Edge on Kabutops because doubles.

Alfieri · Mar 11, 2015

Thundurus sounds like fun. I'll give it a go along with Politoed and maybe Mega Swampert. Are Damp Rocks unnecessary since Double Battles go by faster? And will the reduced spread damage of Rock Slide hinder Kabutops?

Nah · Mar 11, 2015

I'm not sure if Damp Rock is as vital in doubles as it is in singles, but it's still something to consider putting on anyway. As for Rock Slide, mainly what you're hitting with it is stuff like Mega Zard Y and Talonflame, who die if a rock looks at them the wrong way. Most everything else can be dealt with by rain boosted Water STABS. Rock Slide's also a bit more accurate and has a flinch chance, so it makes up for the reduced base power.

Dusclops101 · Mar 12, 2015

So, I'm not very good at building teams, but it's not bad to try, right? I just want to know if my team is good as it is or could use little to lots of working on. Here I go:

Thundurus (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Thunder Wave
- Taunt
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Volt Switch

Sylveon @ Leftovers
Ability: Pixilate
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpA
Bold Nature
- Baton Pass
- Wish
- Hyper Voice
- Calm Mind

Gallade (M) @ Galladite
Ability: Steadfast
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Knock Off
- Drain Punch
- Protect

Ferrothorn @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Iron Barbs
EVs: 252 HP / 88 Def / 168 SpD
Relaxed Nature
- Spikes
- Gyro Ball
- Leech Seed
- Thunder Wave

Gothitelle @ Leftovers
Ability: Shadow Tag
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
- Psychic
- Calm Mind
- Rest
- Heal Bell

Jirachi @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Serene Grace
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Iron Head
- U-turn
- Ice Punch
- Trick

That's my team. If someone would like to make suggestions on my team, then that'd be great. Thanks

PlatinumDude · Mar 12, 2015

Dusclops101 said:
So, I'm not very good at building teams, but it's not bad to try, right? I just want to know if my team is good as it is or could use little to lots of working on. Here I go:

Thundurus (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Thunder Wave
- Taunt
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Volt Switch

Sylveon @ Leftovers
Ability: Pixilate
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpA
Bold Nature
- Baton Pass
- Wish
- Hyper Voice
- Calm Mind

Gallade (M) @ Galladite
Ability: Steadfast
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Knock Off
- Drain Punch
- Protect

Ferrothorn @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Iron Barbs
EVs: 252 HP / 88 Def / 168 SpD
Relaxed Nature
- Spikes
- Gyro Ball
- Leech Seed
- Thunder Wave

Gothitelle @ Leftovers
Ability: Shadow Tag
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
- Psychic
- Calm Mind
- Rest
- Heal Bell

Jirachi @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Serene Grace
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Iron Head
- U-turn
- Ice Punch
- Trick

That's my team. If someone would like to make suggestions on my team, then that'd be great. Thanks

Thundurus is meant to be played as a utility sweeper. While Volt Switch is good for gaining momentum, Thundurus is one of those Pokemon who would rather stay in to beat on things, so Thunderbolt is the better option.

Gothitelle is meant to be a trapper, eliminating counters that the team comes across, so I don't think it's cut out for support:
-Psychic/Psyshock
-Hidden Power (Fire)/Calm Mind
-Trick
-Rest
Nature: Timid
EVs: 80 HP/176 SAtk/252 Spe
Item: Choice Scarf
Ability: Shadow Tag

or
-Psychic/Psyshock
-Thunderbolt/Energy Ball
-Hidden Power (Fire)
-Trick
Nature: Modest
EVs: 168 HP/252 SAtk/88 Spe
Item: Choice Specs
Ability: Shadow Tag

In that case, give Heal Bell to Sylveon.

Even though Protect allows Gallade to Mega Evolve safely, it's not worth it because it needs the third slot for STAB Zen Headbutt. Without it, it gets walled by Fairies. Close Combat is also preferred over Drain Punch, as it packs more raw power, something Drain Punch lacks:
-Swords Dance
-Close Combat
-Zen Headbutt
-Knock Off
Nature: Jolly
EVs: 4 HP/252 Atk/252 Spe
Item: Galladite

Gyro Ball and Thunder Wave don't mesh well together on Ferrothorn, because the former gets stronger the slower Ferrothorn is than the opponent, while the latter slows down the opponent to be about as slow as Ferrothorn itself, weakening Gyro Ball's power significantly. Drop either one of them for Power Whip (for a secondary STAB) or Protect (to stall for extra Leech Seed/Leftovers recovery).

Bisharp is also an excellent partner to Mega Gallade because it can get rid of the Ghost and Psychic Pokemon that plague it:
-Knock Off
-Iron Head
-Sucker Punch
-Swords Dance/Pursuit
Nature: Adamant/Jolly
EVs: 252 Atk/4 Def/252 Spe or 252 Atk/52 SDef/204 Spe
Item: Life Orb/Black Glasses/Dread Plate
Ability: Defiant

or
-Knock Off
-Iron Head
-Sucker Punch
-Pursuit
Nature: Adamant
EVs: 192 HP/220 Atk/96 Spe
Item: Assault Vest
Ability Defiant

Dusclops101 · Mar 12, 2015

PlatinumDude said:
Thundurus is meant to be played as a utility sweeper. While Volt Switch is good for gaining momentum, Thundurus is one of those Pokemon who would rather stay in to beat on things, so Thunderbolt is the better option.

Gothitelle is meant to be a trapper, eliminating counters that the team comes across, so I don't think it's cut out for support:
-Psychic/Psyshock
-Hidden Power (Fire)/Calm Mind
-Trick
-Rest
Nature: Timid
EVs: 80 HP/176 SAtk/252 Spe
Item: Choice Scarf
Ability: Shadow Tag

or
-Psychic/Psyshock
-Thunderbolt/Energy Ball
-Hidden Power (Fire)
-Trick
Nature: Modest
EVs: 168 HP/252 SAtk/88 Spe
Item: Choice Specs
Ability: Shadow Tag

In that case, give Heal Bell to Sylveon.

Even though Protect allows Gallade to Mega Evolve safely, it's not worth it because it needs the third slot for STAB Zen Headbutt. Without it, it gets walled by Fairies. Close Combat is also preferred over Drain Punch, as it packs more raw power, something Drain Punch lacks:
-Swords Dance
-Close Combat
-Zen Headbutt
-Knock Off
Nature: Jolly
EVs: 4 HP/252 Atk/252 Spe
Item: Galladite

Gyro Ball and Thunder Wave don't mesh well together on Ferrothorn, because the former gets stronger the slower Ferrothorn is than the opponent, while the latter slows down the opponent to be about as slow as Ferrothorn itself, weakening Gyro Ball's power significantly. Drop either one of them for Power Whip (for a secondary STAB) or Protect (to stall for extra Leech Seed/Leftovers recovery).

Bisharp is also an excellent partner to Mega Gallade because it can get rid of the Ghost and Psychic Pokemon that plague it:
-Knock Off
-Iron Head
-Sucker Punch
-Swords Dance/Pursuit
Nature: Adamant/Jolly
EVs: 252 Atk/4 Def/252 Spe or 252 Atk/52 SDef/204 Spe
Item: Life Orb/Black Glasses/Dread Plate
Ability: Defiant

or
-Knock Off
-Iron Head
-Sucker Punch
-Pursuit
Nature: Adamant
EVs: 192 HP/220 Atk/96 Spe
Item: Assault Vest
Ability Defiant

So, it's good for a first time creation?

Anti · Mar 23, 2015

Dusclops101 said:
So, I'm not very good at building teams, but it's not bad to try, right? I just want to know if my team is good as it is or could use little to lots of working on. Here I go:

Thundurus (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Thunder Wave
- Taunt
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Thunderbolt

What PlatDude said.

Sylveon @ Leftovers
Ability: Pixilate
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpA
Bold Nature
- Baton Pass
- Wish
- Hyper Voice
- Calm Mind

Sylveon really has two viable roles: WishPasser and Choice Specs attacker (and a lot of players will tell you that Clefable is better as a WishPasser, and they're pretty much right). Specs is cool though. I don't have EVs for you, but the set is Specs@Hyper Voice/Shadow Ball or Psyshock/Hidden Power [Ground or Fire]/Baton Pass. Baton Pass is used for momentum, though using the move from the second slot that you passed up isn't indefensible since you're mostly going to be attacking once you get it in.

Gallade (M) @ Galladite
Ability: Steadfast
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Knock Off
- Close Combat
- Zen Headbutt

I personally think this mon kinda blows (just an "eye test" thing - never been pressured by it in battle the way other mons like ZardX, MMeta, or MScizor will) but it's perfectly usable. Take advantage of its high base power STAB though.

Ferrothorn @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Iron Barbs
EVs: 252 HP / 88 Def / 168 SpD
Relaxed Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Gyro Ball
- Leech Seed
- Power Whip

Spikes are a luxury; Stealth Rock is a NECESSITY on EVERY competitive team. I put Power Whip over Thunder Wave to help with Mega Gyarados and Manaphy, who are big threats to your team.

Gothitelle @ Leftovers
Ability: Shadow Tag
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
- Psychic
- Calm Mind
- Rest
- Heal Bell

Use PlatDude's set, though I would honestly just use a different Pokemon. Gothitelle is kind of frowned upon since most players think that Shadow Tag removes a skill element from the game, though it is perfectly legal. Anyway, dumb poke; I'd put in something like Latias that can do some cool things like Healing Wish and otherwise be more useful defensively.

Jirachi @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Serene Grace
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Iron Head
- U-turn
- Ice Punch
- Trick

Can't say I see this often but seems reasonable enough. Not sure what Jolly is outrunning though, so you might as well run Adamant, unless you're really worried about Mega Gardevoir post-Trick.

That's my team. If someone would like to make suggestions on my team, then that'd be great. Thanks

And yes, it is good for a first time. :P

So, I also have my own idea I want some help with. I am in a big team-building rut but have really been intrigued by Klefki lately:

Klefki @ Leftovers
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 248 HP / 100 Def / 160 SpD
Careful Nature
- Spikes
- Thunder Wave
- Play Rough
- Magnet Rise / Toxic

Basically, in large part because of the ridiculous power creep of some top megas (glad we didn't ban Metagross!!!!), the metagame has gotten fairly bulky. A lot of popular balance mons like Heatran, Hippowdon, Slowbro, and especially Ferrothorn are ground-bound, making Spikes a very legitimate option to wear them down. Klefki has a nice match-up against Lati@s, the most common Defoggers, while Magnet Rise can let Excadrill wear itself down with Life Orb recoil. Starmie can be Pursuited or lured, and defensive Defoggers' passivity can be taken advantage of in the remaining 5 team slots. (I want this team to be bulky offense, so fairly aggressive.)

Meanwhile, Klefki eases team-building by providing a safety valve against dangerous set-up sweepers (and Metagross, lol) as well as a nice switch into Fairies, though it has to tread carefully. Steel/Fairy is excellent defensive typing and covering so much while simultaneously executing a strategy makes Klefki appeal a lot to me. Also, it's super unique and sounded cool.

The EVs always avoid a 2HKO from Mega Gardevoir's Focus Blast, and the rest are tossed into physical defense to take Psyshock from Lati@s better. I'll mess with them more later.

In terms of partners, I thought it might be cool to pair it with:

Charizard @ Charizardite X
Ability: Blaze
EVs: 72 HP / 252 Atk / 184 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Dragon Dance / Earthquake
- Flare Blitz
- Dragon Claw
- Roost / Earthquake

Zard-X seems like it's constantly underrated, so I thought he'd be cool to try out. Hippowdon, Slowbro, Rhyperior, Mega Altaria, Mega Diancie, etc. all really do not like Spikes (which will of course be paired with SR). The EVs outspeed Scarf Landorus-T (and Scarf Exca too I guess) after a DD. This mon is very self-explanatory.

And now I've hit a snag in building. Lots of mons have come to mind - Weavile seems like a really cool offensive partner for Zard while bulky SR Garchomp completes the hazards core and further helps with Exca - but it's all somewhat embryonic. Also, Zard pretty much requires a Spinner - and not a Defogger given Spikes - so that's a bit of a strain.

Hit me up with ideas. :)

Dark Azelf · Mar 23, 2015

Having used Klefki, play rough actually sucks on it. It doesnt hit sableye for relevant damage and not being shat on by Excadrill helps every time you go for spikes, also doesnt hit starmie for any damage. Foul Play is so much better imo. I kinda prefer Toxic over Wave too but thats just me.

Magnet Rise is amazing though so id keep that. Seeing Landorus and friends go oh shit and give up momentum against you is hilarious.

As for Spinners you're basically stuck with Starmie and Excadrill offensively lol. Unless you wanna run Tentacruel (rofl) or Cloyster (lool).

Dusclops101 said:
So, it's good for a first time creation?

Id use CM Clefable with MGuard over Sylveon. That is just asking to be burned and worn down and then crushed by MSable which your whole team is otherwise.

Detox · Mar 31, 2015

What's up thread. Today I had the idea of building a Diancie-Mega squad. I settled on the standard all out attacker set and was wondering where you guys thought I should go from here. I added a bulky Stealth Rock Garchomp because it's a cute way to get up rocks and check a few things that Diancie doesn't want any part of. Anyways, suggestions are appreciated. A few of the other pokemon I have considered using are Hetran, Magnezone, Rotom - Wash, and Ferrothorn. The current setup is below:

Garchomp @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Rough Skin
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Atk / 160 Def / 92 Spe
Impish Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Earthquake
- Dragon Tail
- Fire Blast

Diancie @ Diancite
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 16 Atk / 240 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Protect
- Moonblast
- Diamond Storm
- Earth Power

Anti · Mar 31, 2015

Dark Azelf said:
Having used Klefki, play rough actually sucks on it. It doesnt hit sableye for relevant damage and not being shat on by Excadrill helps every time you go for spikes, also doesnt hit starmie for any damage. Foul Play is so much better imo. I kinda prefer Toxic over Wave too but thats just me.

Magnet Rise is amazing though so id keep that. Seeing Landorus and friends go oh muk and give up momentum against you is hilarious.

As for Spinners you're basically stuck with Starmie and Excadrill offensively lol. Unless you wanna run Tentacruel (rofl) or Cloyster (lool).

Thanks for this. I didn't ignore, just got busy and wanted to test the current version which you've no doubt seen by now.

So, I have actually appreciated Play Rough in random situations like "I just need a hit on Mega Diancie to put it into Weavile KO range" or "this is the only thing that stands up to this Gardevoir and I need to hit it." Anecdotal, but it has its uses. Nevertheless, I will test Foul Play, especially if some of the stuff that Play Rough hits are handled by the team a little better than they are now.

I have enjoyed Charizard X, and for once, I have seen my team-building strategy actually playing out in real battles which is always neat, but I dislike that Charizard X compounds some of Klefki's weaknesses (Heatran, Exca) and forces me to run hazard control, which I don't want to have to run. I'll be experimenting with other megas that enjoy Spikes. Some ideas so far have including Mega Lopunny, Mega Gyarados, and Mega Gardevoir. (In terms of non-megas, Gegnar seems to be an excellent candidate as well!) If any particularly nice offensive cores come to mind I'm willing to hear them, as I want to run a bulky offense build here.

Oh yeah, and I've definitely missed Toxic at times, though I like the extra freedom Thunder Wave gives both in-battle (can play more aggressively) and in building (failsafe to some set-up sweepers). If anything I'd replace Magnet Rise even though it is pretty hilarious as you mentioned.

I'll keep you posted on the progress. Trying to iron out Lopunny at the moment and seeing if it will yield the results I want.

King Syn said:
What's up thread. Today I had the idea of building a Diancie-Mega squad. I settled on the standard all out attacker set and was wondering where you guys thought I should go from here. I added a bulky Stealth Rock Garchomp because it's a cute way to get up rocks and check a few things that Diancie doesn't want any part of. Anyways, suggestions are appreciated. A few of the other pokemon I have considered using are Hetran, Magnezone, Rotom - Wash, and Ferrothorn. The current setup is below:

Garchomp @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Rough Skin
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Atk / 160 Def / 92 Spe
Impish Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Earthquake
- Dragon Tail
- Fire Blast

Diancie @ Diancite
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 16 Atk / 240 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Protect
- Moonblast
- Diamond Storm
- Earth Power

Diancie is a beast lol.

Run Naive on it so you don't weaken Diamond Storm. (Naive over Hasty for Lati Psyshock/EQ and Brave Birds etc.)

That tweak aside, before adding supporting pieces like Heatran, Rotom, Ferro, etc., I would try to form an offensive core with Diancie.

One poke that might be cool is mixed Thundurus. Its Knock Off is really nice for weakening Ferrothorn and a lot of Diancie's soft checks like Celebi, Hippowdon, and even Clefable (though you can just mow this poke down it's always nice to weaken it no matter what you're running lol). Its Speed tier is also very nice so you don't have to risk Diancie to a Speed tie in a pinch. Thundurus in general is good for softening up cores and can form a powerful duo with Diancie.

If you wanna go a little hipster, I think a Victini could be neat, though it will reinforce some defensive weaknesses. It checks/pressures all of Diancie's checks. Scarf or Band could both work. An offensive Heatran could also fill this function, and I actually like the Magma Storm set's offensive synergy as it can help remove Chansey in stall match-ups. It has similar problems with Victini defensively though. And then you mentioned Mag. Very self-explanatory. It works. Use it if you want. :P

If you want to go a bulkier route, then I think Keldeo is a very standard but solid option, mostly because it can help with Mega Scizor and Ferrothorn. If you ran it, I would definitely go Specs, as I think the immediate power and breaking ability would support Diancie well.

Nah · Apr 13, 2015

Felt like making another OU team but then realized I can't make OU teams worth a shit so I need some help ~~again~~.

Black Kyurem @ Leftovers/Life Orb/Expert Belt/some other shit
Ability: Teravolt
EVs: 56 Atk / 252 SpA / 200 Spe
Mild Nature
- Ice Beam
- Fusion Bolt
- Earth Power
- Hidden Power [Fire]/or something

Like the previous team I posted about in here this one has Cube in it.....idk i just like it for some reason despite the fact that it's part Ice and has bleh Speed. Not sure what to do with the last move slot or the item though.

Bisharp @ Assault Vest
Ability: Defiant
EVs: 192 HP / 220 Atk / 96 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Iron Head
- Knock Off
- Sucker Punch
- Pursuit

Then I thought that maybe I could do a little Dragon/Steel/Fairy core (that is a thing right?) so I put in Bisharp. Went with the AV set because base 70 Speed doesn't sound like it's gettin' anywhere fast even with max investment (it has Sucker Punch anyway) and I never liked how the non-bulky versions die so fast.

Gardevoir (F) @ Gardevoirite
Ability: Trace
EVs: 24 Def / 232 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Hyper Voice
- Psyshock
- Focus Blast
- Taunt

And then threw in Garde because you're not gonna get very far if you don't have something to deal with stall/defensive cores and Garde does a pretty good job at dealing with that and 4x resists Fighting.

But idk where to go from here. There's some obvious things like SR and hazard control but idk what'd be the best fit. I probably could complete the team myself but that'd probably result in some really meh team that'll just end up getting stuck in the low 1400s on the ladder like all my OU teams tend to do. None of the above stuff absolutely has to stay on the team, and I don't care if it becomes a HO or a semi-stall team or whatever (just not balance or full stall pls). I suppose that what I'm really getting at is that after doing this for nearly 4 years now I need to learn how one builds a good team because I never really know wtf I'm doing when I make teams and need people to enlighten me. Even though that's probably asking a lot of y'all.....

Anti · Apr 13, 2015

Zekrom said:
Felt like making another OU team but then realized I can't make OU teams worth a muk so I need some help ~~again~~.

Black Kyurem @ Leftovers/Life Orb/Expert Belt/some other muk
Ability: Teravolt
EVs: 56 Atk / 252 SpA / 200 Spe
Mild Nature
- Ice Beam
- Fusion Bolt
- Earth Power
- Hidden Power [Fire]/or something

Like the previous team I posted about in here this one has Cube in it.....idk i just like it for some reason despite the fact that it's part Ice and has bleh Speed. Not sure what to do with the last move slot or the item though.

Bisharp @ Assault Vest
Ability: Defiant
EVs: 192 HP / 220 Atk / 96 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Iron Head
- Knock Off
- Sucker Punch
- Pursuit

Then I thought that maybe I could do a little Dragon/Steel/Fairy core (that is a thing right?) so I put in Bisharp. Went with the AV set because base 70 Speed doesn't sound like it's gettin' anywhere fast even with max investment (it has Sucker Punch anyway) and I never liked how the non-bulky versions die so fast.

Gardevoir (F) @ Gardevoirite
Ability: Trace
EVs: 24 Def / 232 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Hyper Voice
- Psyshock
- Focus Blast
- Taunt

And then threw in Garde because you're not gonna get very far if you don't have something to deal with stall/defensive cores and Garde does a pretty good job at dealing with that and 4x resists Fighting.

But idk where to go from here. There's some obvious things like SR and hazard control but idk what'd be the best fit. I probably could complete the team myself but that'd probably result in some really meh team that'll just end up getting stuck in the low 1400s on the ladder like all my OU teams tend to do. None of the above stuff absolutely has to stay on the team, and I don't care if it becomes a HO or a semi-stall team or whatever (just not balance or full stall pls). I suppose that what I'm really getting at is that after doing this for nearly 4 years now I need to learn how one builds a good team because I never really know wtf I'm doing when I make teams and need people to enlighten me. Even though that's probably asking a lot of y'all.....

I would pick two of the above Pokemon. All three of them together are compounding weaknesses. The biggest one, as weird as it sounds, is just how slow they are overall. Speed is nice in its own right, as it gives you flexibility dealing with threats you simply do not have if you (and your opponent) know that you have to take a hit first. Sucker Punch has some nice utility but can be used as set-up bait. They also just don't cover that much, so you'll have to cram checks to a lot of threats into the last three slots (Altaria, Zards, Metagross, etc.) which will basically force you to run a balance.

I'll focus on the Gardevoir. Gardevoir is a very nice breaker Pokemon, and its team support is pretty much just "pressure Ferro/Tran and have switch-ins to Metagross and Scizor." Kyurem-B is a nice way to wear down Ferrothorn, and even getting chip damage on non-mega Scizor is nice. I like it better than AV Bisharp here, so I'd make Bisharp the one you replace.

The best Pokemon in terms of offensive synergy for Gardevoir is probably Choice Specs Keldeo. It gives a decent rush of Speed (albeit less, relatively speaking, than in XY) and rips up Ferro/Tran/Scizor. Finding offensive checks for Metagross is a pain, but it can be done. I think. I'm going to go douse myself in kerosene, so give me a minute.

I think a Garde/Keld/Cube core looks much more sound offensively. (I also like that Celebi is easy pickings for the Cube.) You'd need something for Fairy-types and Metagross, so you could run a sand core with it or go with a more conservative backbone, but it sounds like you want something more aggressive. Excadrill would actually fit nicely, providing Rapid Spin support and a failsafe against numerous sweepers while Tyranitar could fill Bisharp's shoes nicely.

If you want aggressive but not sand, Jirachi is a very nice fit. You'll need backup against Metagross still (hnng) but can provide SR, a check to Fairy-types, and status, momentum...really, whatever you want it to. Fire Punch can even lure Scizor, which is a nice bonus.

If you don't like those options I can come up with others. GL.

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