Do the writers know that if Ash doesn't win the Unova league they're actually

dragon456 said:

Well during the time Ash lost in the Kanto League, Johto wasn't revealed yet, so they created a mini-arc filler region called the Orange Islands for Ash to travel around until Johto >.<

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Whhat Johto was reveled at the very first episode.

Ho-Oh~

I think he'll win the Unova League and then travel the eastern side of Unova, as he trains to battle the Elite Four (the Champion League that was so heavily hinted in the DP Saga) and then lose at the Champion/Last Elite member. After that, Gen VI.

Dooney said:

I think he'll win the Unova League and then travel the eastern side of Unova, as he trains to battle the Elite Four (the Champion League that was so heavily hinted in the DP Saga) and then lose at the Champion/Last Elite member. After that, Gen VI.

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Yeah, and let's just hope they don't screw us over in the Unova League like they did in the Sinnoh League when they had to make Ash's last opponent possess legendaries just to ensure that he lost, even when Pikachu already won against a legendary before (Brandon's Regice). While its good that he at least advanced to Top 4 this time around, rather than be forced to lose in the Top 8 again like Hoenn, we still need to have the Champion League, and depending on whether he even meets the conditions of becoming a Pokemon Master afterwards, or even if he doesn't, have him leave the show. It's getting very irritating that they don't even bother to elaborate much on his goal, and give conflicting evidence towards it. I don't care if it was geared to little kids, that's still no excuse for them to not do so. When I was little, I was rigid in my line of thinking and felt it HAD to be one way, and nothing else.

I'm sure someone had already said this, but there's the possibility Ash could win and have a Gen VI. They could dump him and start anew. In my opinion, they should have dumped him after Sinnoh since Unova is new and all and it's a perfect time to introduce a new character. Besides, it makes sense for them to have a new protagonist. So I won't be surprised if they do end up replacing him after this season and start a filler arc with someone else. Summarized: Ash could win and they'd still have a new generation out.

I really wish Ash could become a Champion and just leave. He's getting annoying with his static personality as well as the 'reset' button. Other shows have replaced the protagonist and they've done well.

weedle_mchairybug said:

Yeah, and let's just hope they don't screw us over in the Unova League like they did in the Sinnoh League when they had to make Ash's last opponent possess legendaries just to ensure that he lost, even when Pikachu already won against a legendary before (Brandon's Regice). While its good that he at least advanced to Top 4 this time around, rather than be forced to lose in the Top 8 again like Hoenn, we still need to have the Champion League, and depending on whether he even meets the conditions of becoming a Pokemon Master afterwards, or even if he doesn't, have him leave the show. It's getting very irritating that they don't even bother to elaborate much on his goal, and give conflicting evidence towards it. I don't care if it was geared to little kids, that's still no excuse for them to not do so. When I was little, I was rigid in my line of thinking and felt it HAD to be one way, and nothing else.

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The Tobias thing did seem like a cheap write off when we could all tell he had the momentum going into the league and then after beating Paul. They never really defined to us what a pokemon master means though, it was always one of those things where they wanted us the views and fans at large to come up with what it means. So for Ash it could mean something different then what we thought. Like you said they really don't elaborate as to what the real goal of Ash is. Even if it is animed at kids I don't see the excuse for making no progression, other children shows show character progression.

psyanic said:

I'm sure someone had already said this, but there's the possibility Ash could win and have a Gen VI. They could dump him and start anew. In my opinion, they should have dumped him after Sinnoh since Unova is new and all and it's a perfect time to introduce a new character. Besides, it makes sense for them to have a new protagonist. So I won't be surprised if they do end up replacing him after this season and start a filler arc with someone else. Summarized: Ash could win and they'd still have a new generation out.

I really wish Ash could become a Champion and just leave. He's getting annoying with his static personality as well as the 'reset' button. Other shows have replaced the protagonist and they've done well.

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I don't really see why him winning would automatically mean they have to start anew with a new trainer. The win could be a point where there is a point of no return and he keeps progressing with no renerfs, then they can introduce new characters and use him as a mentor role as well as a "master trainer" They don't have to keep him staticy if they actually work with him instead of just going about the "Hey new gen lets give him the same noob personality and same noob battler". Whose to say if he does win that they won't do the same to another protagonist for years to come and reset that protag.

Kenshin5 said:

I don't really see why him winning would automatically mean they have to start anew with a new trainer. The win could be a point where there is a point of no return and he keeps progressing with no renerfs, then they can introduce new characters and use him as a mentor role as well as a "master trainer."

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Actually, winning would prove his development. It would mark his improvement from the first league he entered, where he lost because he couldn't get his Charizard to listen to him. His development is very minimal, but it's still there. He can still battle and train; it's his brain that's a bit knocked up and he gets forgetful. So winning is clear progression and marks Ash's 'maturity' in a sense, or at least as a trainer. And I just realized that pretty much agreed with your point.

However, I'd imagine Champions have other duties, though they could still travel. Unless they have a filler arc with Ash training some kid, I think it's safe to say that they'll stick with the old formula and keep a journey thing going on. That's probably the best way to spotlight new Pokemon and new Gyms, with Ash not really going to battle them since he'd be stuck in Unova. At least, that's just how I see Champions. I mean, you wouldn't expect to see Cynthia in Kanto, do you?

Odds are, they'd do the same to a new protagonist, but at least their personality would be different with a different cast. There's only so much Pikachu I can take, anyway. Hopefully, though, the writers might have learned a thing or two by now and decided to actually put in development, which might in turn start a trend where they start with a new protagonist every region and with that comes character development, etc. Hell, Jimmy from Raikou: Legend of Thunder! was an interesting character, even though he didn't have much development and I'd still prefer to watch him than Ash.

psyanic said:

Actually, winning would prove his development. It would mark his improvement from the first league he entered, where he lost because he couldn't get his Charizard to listen to him. His development is very minimal, but it's still there. He can still battle and train; it's his brain that's a bit knocked up and he gets forgetful. So winning is clear progression and marks Ash's 'maturity' in a sense, or at least as a trainer. And I just realized that pretty much agreed with your point.

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He assuredly developes no doubt about that since he has had gradual improvement in every league he has entered in and he has grown as a trainer getting his pokemon to listen. What I was trying to get out is yes this is a clear sign, but what will the writers do with this moment? Will they make him a noob once again, will they set him on a path to being a world champ(if they have that), will he compete in Champions Leagues? The road for his future seems unclear but the progression he has made is definitely not.

psyanic said:

However, I'd imagine Champions have other duties, though they could still travel. Unless they have a filler arc with Ash training some kid, I think it's safe to say that they'll stick with the old formula and keep a journey thing going on. That's probably the best way to spotlight new Pokemon and new Gyms, with Ash not really going to battle them since he'd be stuck in Unova. At least, that's just how I see Champions. Imean, you wouldn't expect to see Cynthia in Kanto, do you?

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They will definitely stick with the old formula since it has proved marketable in the past, and as definitely a great way to showcase the new region and pokemon in it. But I would like too see them throw a wrench into it like they did with the games and change things up a bit. I think Conference Champion and Regional Champ differ a bit. From what I understand the Conference Champ has earned the right to face the Elite 4, but isn't apart of the Elite 4. That means they are not bound to the duties of the Pokemon League of that region if that is the case. And Champions travel all the time in games and anime. Look at Lance he is part of the Pokemon G Men traveling to Hoenn and I am sure other places on top of traveling abroad in Johto. Cynthia travels a multitude of places in the game such as Johto and Unova outside of Sinnoh. So it's not like the Champions are stationary they just have the option to move around. Now if Ash took a Frontier Brain position then that may have actually be a bit travel restrictive though, but winning the conference doesn't really seem that way too me.

psyanic said:

Odds are, they'd do the same to a new protagonist, but at least their personality would be different with a different cast. There's only so much Pikachu I can take, anyway. Hopefully, though, the writers might have learned a thing or two by now and decided to actually put in development, which might in turn start a trend where they start with a new protagonist every region and with that comes character development, etc. Hell, Jimmy from Raikou: Legend of Thunder! was an interesting character, even though he didn't have much development and I'd still prefer to watch him than Ash.

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I am sure they would knowing they have done it for the past 14 years. No Pikachu would be great, I think that's the best fanservice a repeat watcher could get. I would have loved what you suggested, but are they willing to implement it is the real concern and question. Honestly though at this point I think they could gamble with a new style or two shows(they probably have enough staff for two) that they run the same generic wash rinse and repeat stuff then they show a new type with new protagonists and new fresh story lines each generation.

Think about it:
He was in the top-16 in the Johto League
He was in the top-8 in the Hoenn League.
He was in the top-4 in the Sinnoh League, which he could have won if that overpowered guy wasn't there.
I assume the will be in the finals in the Unova League and will win the next league in the next generation.

I'd rather have Brock back, but I think it's ok if they keep Cilan.

ash loses the league then the show focuses on ash and the others taking on team plasma n and ghetsis

Please don't revive threads that have been dead for over a month. Thanks.

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