Skip Shot
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Been gone for 3 weeks... someone wanna catch me up to speed on the new tiers and star Pokemon that have come out recently? im out of battling shape lolol
Competitive Battling Chat
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I figured I should start contributing to the "overcentralization" stuff.
Overcentralization is a pathetic arguement. Ok, so that means we're banning Ferrothorn if I am correct? Yeah, I thought so. It's not even a word. If something is used alot, it does not mean it is broken in the slightest bit (Well in Latias's case in Gen 4, it was correct). Also, the Reuniclus arguement also relates how Jirachi is used to also take on Latias, Latios, Gengar, etc. Same thing with Scizor. They both are used to handle a large majority of Pokemon in the current metagame.
Overcentralization is a pathetic arguement. Ok, so that means we're banning Ferrothorn if I am correct? Yeah, I thought so. It's not even a word. If something is used alot, it does not mean it is broken in the slightest bit (Well in Latias's case in Gen 4, it was correct). Also, the Reuniclus arguement also relates how Jirachi is used to also take on Latias, Latios, Gengar, etc. Same thing with Scizor. They both are used to handle a large majority of Pokemon in the current metagame.
Haven't we had the discussion over overcentralization before? It's such a bad argument, but everyone else already explained it better than me so I'll just say tl;dr go read everyone elses.
Also PO server being down = Sad Red Panda
Also PO server being down = Sad Red Panda
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But being used a lot is not overcentralization. Overcentralization is when something is so broken that a team must specifically prepare one/a few pokemon for it, and its counters are few and far between.
no I do not think that overcentralization is a good arguement I'm just pointing this out
Vrai
can you feel my heart?
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But generally overcentralization is associated with usage. When something is used a lot, naturally things change to prepare for it. You can't be overcentralizing if you aren't used is all.
Regardless of definition, 'overcentralization' is not a ban-worthy offense.
Yes. :(
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Oh my god, I'm actually putting something in here. I'll probably forgot I did this and not look again for a week or something like always.
Anyway...there's a difference between being used a lot and something being overcentralizing.
I will use the Ferrothorn example somebody brought up in here. Yes, it is on just about every single team ever made, but it is far from overcentralizing when it is scared off by pretty much anything that COULD have a fire move or a fighting move. Whereas something like Latias really is only scared of random stuff like for example Scaqrf Special Lucario using Shadow Ball or something dumb like that [probably not close to a OHKO, but you get the point].
You basically HAVE to run SpD Jirachi or Scizor, two pokemon that could be 1000X more effective used in a different way, if you don't want your team to get smashed by Specs Latios. THAT, to me, is what makes something overcentralizing. When, no matter how good your team is, you basically NEED to run something in order to not lose to something that is simply a hit and run pokemon. Yeah...that's overcentralization at it's simplest.
Anyway...there's a difference between being used a lot and something being overcentralizing.
I will use the Ferrothorn example somebody brought up in here. Yes, it is on just about every single team ever made, but it is far from overcentralizing when it is scared off by pretty much anything that COULD have a fire move or a fighting move. Whereas something like Latias really is only scared of random stuff like for example Scaqrf Special Lucario using Shadow Ball or something dumb like that [probably not close to a OHKO, but you get the point].
You basically HAVE to run SpD Jirachi or Scizor, two pokemon that could be 1000X more effective used in a different way, if you don't want your team to get smashed by Specs Latios. THAT, to me, is what makes something overcentralizing. When, no matter how good your team is, you basically NEED to run something in order to not lose to something that is simply a hit and run pokemon. Yeah...that's overcentralization at it's simplest.
champagnepapi
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Pretty much this. People hate Ferrothorn because you /need/ a fire or fighting [preferably the former] type attack to beat it, which isn't a huge inconvenience since both of those are already common attacking types. Reuniclus and Latios, or a combo of both are the bane of any battler's existence, as they almost require that you have one of the mons yankee mentioned, or your team gets swept. I'm hoping both will be banned in the near future, as it's not very fun if I have to sacrifice individuality and possibly synergy to make sure that my team isn't weak to these two monstrous Pokemon.
PDC said:
Isn't that a variant on an excerpt from user Haunter's signature?
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champagnepapi
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Instead of just making another postcount+ post like our friend Jakey did here, telling you all to join my tour, I'll bring up yet another cute subject.
With the abundance of weather and Pokemon that become broken through their abilities, complex bans have become a subject of debate. What do you think of Complex bans and what should Smogon's policy be regarding abilities that are only abused by one Pokemon [such as Speed Boost and Sand Veil], should the Pokemon itself be banned, or should the ability be banned?
.Aero
Tell Me I'm A Screwed Up Mess
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I have no problems with complex bans. Mainly because I'd love to see Chomp back in OU and it was sad to see him go away again (even more so this time because I actually got to use him. I joined serious competitive back when Plat was released, so basically I never got to use him).
I don't see the problem. :P Seems like the majority of the reason they're not doing complex bans is based on precedent. It think that's a terrible reason to be honest. New generation, new rules, at least that's my views. (inb4 rejected by majority of community).
I don't see the problem. :P Seems like the majority of the reason they're not doing complex bans is based on precedent. It think that's a terrible reason to be honest. New generation, new rules, at least that's my views. (inb4 rejected by majority of community).
To add another discussion topic, i was wondering what are some of the major advantages and disadvantages of OU pokemon.
a disadvantage i think is that with OU pokemans is that it can be fairly easy to predict what set is being used on a particular pokemon, making the prediction aspect of the battle a lot easier for the opponent.
anyways, what do you all think about my question above?
a disadvantage i think is that with OU pokemans is that it can be fairly easy to predict what set is being used on a particular pokemon, making the prediction aspect of the battle a lot easier for the opponent.
anyways, what do you all think about my question above?
Conjurer
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I don't mind complex bans either, lol. I seriously don't get why there's WoT of debate on this. We had to deal with Soul Dew and Brightpowder bans; why complain now?
As to answer dreyko's question, this is basically predictability vs. power. Personally I prefer the latter, since I only play on PO, where if I don't know such and such about a certain Pokemon I'm facing I can just open up Smogon. :P
As to answer dreyko's question, this is basically predictability vs. power. Personally I prefer the latter, since I only play on PO, where if I don't know such and such about a certain Pokemon I'm facing I can just open up Smogon. :P
Advantages of using OU pokemon: they win.
Disadvantages of using OU pokemon: end list.
There is no disadvantage to using an OU pokemon, hence why its OU. I don't battle anymore or really even visit this site, (I just stopped by to see whats up, seems like ya'll are pretty busy and I guess D_A quit? anyway....) but I know that the general formula if you will for competitive Pokemon is the same. OU pokemon are OU for a reason: they check the stronger pokemon or they are the stronger pokemon. That's why they are desirable. Realistically, if you wanted to use Foretress instead of the new grass/steel version you probably could, but why would you? They are basically identical, but the new one has leech seed and better offensive skills making it a more desirable pokemon. You could use Altaria instead of Salamence, but Salamence a better choice because it has better stats and stuff.
Also, on the argument of "over-centralization requires a ban" I don't think it does. If that was true, then all dragon types except like dratini and altaria (because they are about equally as strong) would be ubers, because being Dragon-type or /Dragon-type is automatically over-centralizing. When only 1 type in the game resists said type and said type only has 2 less than prevalent weaknesses and an entry hazard can be set up to cripple any pokemon with the type of said weakness by taking away as little as 12.5% and as much as 50% upon entry, it's going to be the dominant type. Gamefreak basically screwed competitive battling by over-saturating games with about 250 new dragon-type pokemon every game, and since they usually come with ridiculously good stats relative to everything else, they are going to be used a lot. I mean, honestly its not steel-types that are too common, you wouldn't see them nearly as much if dragon's were less common, its that dragons are too common and too big of a threat, so if you don't have something you're going to get dominated.
If I could make a parallel to another game, it's like Call of Duty, its not that Assault Rifles are too good, its that they are very good. So if you don't use an Assault Rifle or an SMG, you are basically crippling yourself. Same thing goes with Dragon-types.
Also, I wanna make a disclaimer that I know next to nothing about Gen 5 competitive (or noncompetitive) pokemon, but I'm pretty confident nothing has changed too drastically.
P.S. hi everyone.
champagnepapi
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New Topic time~
So, for those of you who have watched and actually paid attention to the most recent Smogcast [I look at you, Vrai], you may have caught the tidbit about Wobbuffet. For those who didn't, the panelists pretty much said it was Antimetagame and is still very threatening even with Encore getting nerfed and should be deserving of a ban mainly because it takes away a player's ability to switch.
So, what are everyone's thoughts on the big, blue punching bag? How threatening do you find it? Is it worthy of a ban?
So, for those of you who have watched and actually paid attention to the most recent Smogcast [I look at you, Vrai], you may have caught the tidbit about Wobbuffet. For those who didn't, the panelists pretty much said it was Antimetagame and is still very threatening even with Encore getting nerfed and should be deserving of a ban mainly because it takes away a player's ability to switch.
So, what are everyone's thoughts on the big, blue punching bag? How threatening do you find it? Is it worthy of a ban?
Perriechu
i make this look easy tik-tik boom like gasoline-y
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I've never actually used Wobbuffet myself. But I have faced them and they're not that hard to get rid of, if you play your cards right. Not being able to switch is pretty annoying but with the team preview I always knows that I have Wobbu to deal with and play cautiously.
I say keep it in OU or UU Idk what it's in atm. I rarely see them, anyway,
I say keep it in OU or UU Idk what it's in atm. I rarely see them, anyway,
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