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A Chance to Open Up Russia?

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There are plenty of reasons to be cynical about Russian President Vladimir Putin's motivation in announcing an amnesty last month for more than 20,000 prisoners, including the dissident punk rockers Pussy Riot, detained Greenpeace activists, some leaders of last year's Bolotnaya Square protests, and most surprisingly, oligarch turned anti-Kremlin icon Mikhail Khodorkovsky, who has languished in prison for more than a decade. Putin is following the old Soviet and tsarist tradition of amnesties to mark major anniversaries – in this case the 20th anniversary of Russia's 1993 constitution – but he is also surely considering the impact on Russia's image in advance of the February Sochi Olympics.

Russia's human rights record still falls far short of European and international standards, and it would be naïve to assume that this amnesty represents any kind of transformation in Putin's thinking about human rights and democracy. Yet at this moment, one vital fact should not be overlooked: real progress has now been made on one of the most persistently contentious items on the Russia-West agenda.

Human rights and political prisoners especially have been an obstacle to pragmatic cooperation on everything from counter-terrorism to trade and investment. The human rights situation was cited among the reasons for the presidents of France and Germany to skip the Sochi games, and was an important backdrop to the Obama administration's frustration with Russia amid the apparent collapse of the "reset" agenda over the past year. It was also the single biggest justification for passage one year ago of the Magnitsky Act, which imposed financial and travel sanctions on Russian officials accused of abuses.

Of course human rights is not the only item on the U.S.-Russia agenda, nor is it the only area of conflict with the Kremlin. There are also tensions over Ukraine, Syria and the wider Middle East, Afghanistan, and Central Asia, to name just a few. But each of these urgent challenges is far more likely to be resolved through effective dialogue and engagement between Russia and the West than via confrontation and isolation. Increasingly, the rift over human rights – which some have termed a "values gap" – has stood in the way of such pragmatic dialogue.

For Western rhetoric about the importance of human rights to be taken seriously, it must also acknowledge and reward Russia when positive steps are taken. Otherwise it is seen merely as a fig leaf for antipathy toward Russia's political leaders, or as part of America's continuing efforts to topple regimes it dislikes around the globe. This view is held not just by Russian political elites but by ordinary people as well.

Offering concrete rewards in exchange for progress on human rights was precisely the sort of conditionality that the European Union has sought to impose on Ukraine's leadership over the imprisonment of Yulia Tymoshenko and other reforms. So far, it has failed to produce the desired outcome in Ukraine. Yet Putin's amnesty is, among other things, an acknowledgment of the rhetorical and political impact of the West's position, and the weight Putin places on international legitimacy, especially when he and Russia are in the spotlight during the Sochi Olympics.

Now is therefore a key opportunity to benefit from such conditionality with Russia by recognizing progress on an important precondition for better relations. One way to do this would be by ratcheting back the punitive rolls of the Magnitsky Act, rather than expanding them as some in Congress have recently advocated.

Another would be for top U.S. and European politicians to visit Russia. To be sure, Russia's restrictive NGO and anti-gay laws will continue to provide a justification for Western leaders not to attend Sochi. Moreover, acute disagreement over the Middle East and Russia's post-Soviet neighborhood will not have faded by February. Yet if last month's amnesty underscores anything it is that Sochi offers a vital chance to engage on the most sensitive issues and to exert influence.

Like Soviet and tsarist amnesties, this is a limited time opportunity. Western leaders will have the most leverage if the prospect of enhanced international legitimacy through high level visits before, during, and after the Sochi games is clearly back on the table. Now is the time for a strong and decisive new push for engagement with Russia.

We criticize and seek to punish Russia all the time for their record on human rights, even when they make changes to their old ways. But should we take this chance to engage Russia and bring it closer to the West? Russia may still occurs to many of us as "bad", but should recognition be made where it is due?

Is there a silver lining to anything Russia does? More broadly, do we unfairly criticize Russia and other countries we don't like, and play our own part in keeping them isolated? After all, friendship and enmity is a two-way road, isn't it?

Other thoughts?

source: http://globalpublicsquare.blogs.cnn...amnesty-is-an-opening-for-the-west/?hpt=wo_c2
 

Silais

That useless reptile
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Russia is a terribly disenfranchised country suffering beneath the rule of a government that does not care for human rights whatsoever. Perhaps becoming more involved with Russia would provoke more discussion on human rights and incite change. It does not necessarily have to be the United States; it can be any "1st world" country.
 

zakisrage

In the trunk on Highway 10
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I think Western criticism only makes things in Russia worse, coupled with Russia's corrupt leadership and massive social inequality. I mean, there's a sharp divide between wealthy Russians who can afford expensive vacations abroad and poor Russians who can barely get by. But getting back to the Western world...first world countries tend to be very critical of other countries, seeing them as beneath them due to poorer human rights. The British and the Americans are masters at bashing non-first world countries.

In addition to human rights, Russia is not trusted due to its prior history as a communist state and because Russians in general are stereotyped as cold-hearted, stoic, racist people. I wish that people would look at Russia as a country instead of a villain on the world stage. Entire countries can't be evil.
 
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14,092
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I think so long as Putin remains in power, opening up Russia to the west is damn near impossible. He's far too aggressive with the U.S. and Obama, in particular, for that to happen. That, and he has a stranglehold on power there. Russia will need to literally de-putinize for any real progress to be made in that regard.
 

Beloved

Fictionally Destructive
253
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I love Russia, and would love to see the US have more ties to them, but only after they rid themselves of the anti-gay law that prevents me and my boyfriend from going there and being seen together.

And honestly, its not really Puppe-I mean Putin, but instead the puppet masters in the Orthodox Church that are causing all these human rights violations to occur. They are too powerful in their government. Personally, I think Putin is cute, but that is just me.

I have nothing against most Russians, just those who are in fact homophobic.
 

LoudSilence

more like uncommon sense
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I think it's rather unfair that the West can criticise anyone on human rights when we're so bad at upholding them ourselves. I'm sure Russia is terrible in this regard, but for Obama and European leaders to act as if they stand on some higher moral ground or are the standard for justice is laughable. We exploit rights and lives wherever we see fit, Russia is no different.

We only put the pressure on because there's some benefit to doing so. Our hyperpower status is the only thing that makes that pressure potent and our opinion relevant, and we play that to great effect.
 

Lord Kraith 2

Старый Сергей
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10
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From what I see, because I from Russian controlled Republic of Buryatia, my views will be different than Western people on this issue. Russia is not bad country, but I think my country is neutral. Equal amount of bad and good.

Human rights issue I think isn't as bad as what people in America or other western countries think. Exception for the anti-gay mobs and random assassinations before. Russia is new to democracy, we have thousands of years of dictatorships. So the current governement now is big step towards freedom and democracy. Eventually, Russia will become similar to America, but for now it is not used to American style Democracy yet. Human Rights is currently getting better.

I think Americans are being too harsh on Russia. We are actually participating on the war on terrorism by taking down terrorists in Chechnya, Kazakhstan, Kyrgzstan, and other parts of Central Asia. We are trying our best to weaken Islamic radicals. The anti gay policies in Russia comes from tradition. Although I don't like the rules and the violent anti gay mobs, but gay is seen as bad in Russia. Russia keep 80 year old beliefs. I myself think that gays should not be discriminated, but there are just many people there that don't like gay people because of tradition.

If America keeps closing to Russia, they will lose potential ally that would help them on the War on Terror. They seem to forgot that we helped them on the Boston Bombing case. Also Russia today is closer to America than any time in Russian history.
 

Beloved

Fictionally Destructive
253
Posts
16
Years
From what I see, because I from Russian controlled Republic of Buryatia, my views will be different than Western people on this issue. Russia is not bad country, but I think my country is neutral. Equal amount of bad and good.

Human rights issue I think isn't as bad as what people in America or other western countries think. Exception for the anti-gay mobs and random assassinations before. Russia is new to democracy, we have thousands of years of dictatorships. So the current governement now is big step towards freedom and democracy. Eventually, Russia will become similar to America, but for now it is not used to American style Democracy yet. Human Rights is currently getting better.

I think Americans are being too harsh on Russia. We are actually participating on the war on terrorism by taking down terrorists in Chechnya, Kazakhstan, Kyrgzstan, and other parts of Central Asia. We are trying our best to weaken Islamic radicals. The anti gay policies in Russia comes from tradition. Although I don't like the rules and the violent anti gay mobs, but gay is seen as bad in Russia. Russia keep 80 year old beliefs. I myself think that gays should not be discriminated, but there are just many people there that don't like gay people because of tradition.

If America keeps closing to Russia, they will lose potential ally that would help them on the War on Terror. They seem to forgot that we helped them on the Boston Bombing case. Also Russia today is closer to America than any time in Russian history.

This is all true, and as I have said before, I love Russia. Your culture is quite breathtaking. I mean, St. Petersburg Square alone is worth going to see. Add in the countrysides, and the beautiful blending of tradition and modern day, its one of the top places I want to visit some day. Its just, being gay kind of makes that a bit dangerous, as does being an American. While I understand that it isn't all Russians who think like Tesak, its just uncomfortable to think that if I held my boyfriend's hand in public, we'd both have a chance to be beaten and deported. That is the only issue I have with Russian society today. And I get that it isn't the fault of the younger generations, its the fault of the older generations and those in power.
 
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This is all true, and as I have said before, I love Russia. Your culture is quite breathtaking. I mean, St. Petersburg Square alone is worth going to see. Add in the countrysides, and the beautiful blending of tradition and modern day, its one of the top places I want to visit some day. Its just, being gay kind of makes that a bit dangerous, as does being an American. While I understand that it isn't all Russians who think like Tesak, its just uncomfortable to think that if I held my boyfriend's hand in public, we'd both have a chance to be beaten and deported. That is the only issue I have with Russian society today. And I get that it isn't the fault of the younger generations, its the fault of the older generations and those in power.

Are you sure it's only the older generation? Iirc the people conducting all the sexual and physical abuses of gays in Russia are youth.
 

Beloved

Fictionally Destructive
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Are you sure it's only the older generation? Iirc the people conducting all the sexual and physical abuses of gays in Russia are youth.

Guided by those older than them. Youths are impressionable, and if they desire the attention or praise of someone, will go to great lengths to get it. That is why gangs put people to such extreme tests in order to let someone in. If the person wants their idol, or whatever they are, to notice them, they will do nearly anything.
 

LoudSilence

more like uncommon sense
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Guided by those older than them. Youths are impressionable, and if they desire the attention or praise of someone, will go to great lengths to get it. That is why gangs put people to such extreme tests in order to let someone in. If the person wants their idol, or whatever they are, to notice them, they will do nearly anything.

Are you speculating, or do you know this for sure? Couldn't it be that there are just some prejudiced youth as well?

Not that it should mean anything either way. It's not a problem with Russian society, it's a problem with some people who happen to be Russian. You cannot fault an entire nation's citisenry because of an unsanctioned problem, no matter how widespread.
 

Beloved

Fictionally Destructive
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Are you speculating, or do you know this for sure? Couldn't it be that there are just some prejudiced youth as well?

Not that it should mean anything either way. It's not a problem with Russian society, it's a problem with some people who happen to be Russian. You cannot fault an entire nation's citisenry because of an unsanctioned problem, no matter how widespread.

Tell me, where do kids learn 90% of what they believe? From their parents. That is why racism still exists in the USA, as well as every other country in the world. The parents, teachers, or whoever the child looks up to slanders an entire group of people, and the child imitates it later in life. We can attempt to show them that racism and hatred is wrong, but if teachers only spend 40 hours a week with the kids, while the parents spend so much more time with them, which behavior is more likely to stick?

Perfect example, and sorry for going off subject, is me. My dad was always working, rarely ever home, so I barely knew the man. To me, when I was 13, shaving my legs was natural. Getting rid of body hair was acceptable, and expected, simply because I watched my mom as a kid shave her legs after a shower, with a towel on of course. The thought of a guy wearing eyeliner always seemed natural, so when my dad was home early one day, and saw me with it on after school and freaked out, I was confused.

Its more psychological and cultural than anything else. Traditions normally are.
 
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I think there might have been an undercurrent of homophobia throughout Russian society that even the Soviets couldn't root out. I'm nowhere near an expert on Russian society though.
 

Sopheria

響け〜 響け!
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We criticize and seek to punish Russia all the time for their record on human rights, even when they make changes to their old ways. But should we take this chance to engage Russia and bring it closer to the West? Russia may still occurs to many of us as "bad", but should recognition be made where it is due?

Is there a silver lining to anything Russia does? More broadly, do we unfairly criticize Russia and other countries we don't like, and play our own part in keeping them isolated? After all, friendship and enmity is a two-way road, isn't it?

Other thoughts?

source: http://globalpublicsquare.blogs.cnn...amnesty-is-an-opening-for-the-west/?hpt=wo_c2

Whether or not they want to join the rest of the civilized world is up to them. It's a bit arrogant to think that our fairness and concern for human rights will just rub off on other nations if we're nice to them. They're an entire country with their own history and culture who make their own decisions. If they don't want to change, then let them remain isolated. If they want to join the rest of the civilized world, the onus is on them to change.
 

Lord Kraith 2

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I think there might have been an undercurrent of homophobia throughout Russian society that even the Soviets couldn't root out. I'm nowhere near an expert on Russian society though.

I believe that modern Russia is more open than during Soviet times. It's just that homophobia is part of their culture still. America used to be homophobic but eventually was gone. Russia is going through the same process but just slower and more later in history.
 
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American homophobia gone? Not by a long shot. It's alive and well and government supported, and I dare say, even funded. A number of politicians in the U.S. have even spoken up in support of the Russian law that prohibits "gay propaganda".
 

Lord Kraith 2

Старый Сергей
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American homophobia gone? Not by a long shot. It's alive and well and government supported, and I dare say, even funded. A number of politicians in the U.S. have even spoken up in support of the Russian law that prohibits "gay propaganda".

Sorry, I didn't notice that, but it could be that there are more people that accepts gays in America than Russia.
 

Beloved

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American homophobia gone? Not by a long shot. It's alive and well and government supported, and I dare say, even funded. A number of politicians in the U.S. have even spoken up in support of the Russian law that prohibits "gay propaganda".

Ain't that the truth. Sad part is that Rob Portman, a great man, will probably never run for President, simply because he would be too tied up in red tape and politics to make any real progress on the matter.
 

LoudSilence

more like uncommon sense
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Tell me, where do kids learn 90% of what they believe? From their parents. That is why racism still exists in the USA, as well as every other country in the world. The parents, teachers, or whoever the child looks up to slanders an entire group of people, and the child imitates it later in life. We can attempt to show them that racism and hatred is wrong, but if teachers only spend 40 hours a week with the kids, while the parents spend so much more time with them, which behavior is more likely to stick?

Yes but then you could say the same thing about their parents. Cultural influence had to have taken a part at some point.

Whether or not they want to join the rest of the civilized world is up to them. It's a bit arrogant to think that our fairness and concern for human rights will just rub off on other nations if we're nice to them. They're an entire country with their own history and culture who make their own decisions. If they don't want to change, then let them remain isolated. If they want to join the rest of the civilized world, the onus is on them to change.

What is the "civilised world"? What is the standard for civility, modernity? For fairness?

And I dunno, Guantanamo, Abu Ghraib, proxy wars, support of Israeli occupation, etc...whatever being "concerned" is, we certainly aren't -- we are instead pretty selective in where we think rights ought to be upheld.

Sorry, I didn't notice that, but it could be that there are more people that accepts gays in America than Russia.

It doesn't make Russia any better or worse than America, though. There are both prejudiced people and sensible people the world over. I dunno why we're comparing them as if America is the standard for everything.
 
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