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  #326    
Old March 12th, 2007 (10:27 PM).
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YGO recently switched system to reduce the amount of words. Exiled Force's old text is now reduced now to "Tribute this monster. Destroy a monster on the field."

However some cards simply got so many effects stuck on it that it can't help but have a super long text: Thousand Eyes Restrict >>; not easy to reduce in word length.


Dumping is far stronger than revealing. You dump that Dark Magician of Chaos, and even if the summon still went through, you got a huge gain already. Either you deny the summon (even trade off for your discard), or you just dumped a tribute monster into the graveyard that you can't use immediately and get -1. (Counter Break + Discard) Unless the monster dumped is a monarch or anything that doesn't benefit from dump/revive, it's still exploitable. If it's revealed, then you may cry how you're getting a 8 star monster next turn that you can't use, and you just -1 yourself on top of it (-2 total?.) And, the newly set trap card is guaranteed to be "anything that pwns the DMOC" now. ;

But all in all, I'll gladly take other methods to stop summoning... Twister is causing major hate on anything that stays on the field for longer than one turn, except for snatch steal.


Counter Break
Continuous Magic
Discard a card from your hand. Whenever your opponent normal summons or special summons a monster, you may reveal the top card of your deck. If the revealed card is a monster card and has the same level as the monster summoned, negate the normal summon or special summon and remove the monster from play. Put the revealed card back on top of your deck.

YGO does have the fit with classifying all of its summoning, however... I believe that this is as short as it can get already.
  #327    
Old March 12th, 2007 (10:58 PM).
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Well it's good that they changed things up to make it easier on the eyes, that's for sure.

Yeah, I can't think of ways to cut corners other than "that summon" replacing "the normal summon or special summon" near end of the clause.

Counter Break
Continuous Magic
Discard a card from your hand. Whenever your opponent normal summons or special summons a monster, you may reveal the top card of your deck. If the revealed card is a monster card and has the same level as the monster summoned, negate that summon and remove the monster from play. Put the revealed card back on top of your deck.
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  #328    
Old March 13th, 2007 (09:51 AM).
Forci Stikane Forci Stikane is offline
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Quote originally posted by Kenny_C.002:
Denied. Discarding top card is more exploitable than keeping the card on top. Besides, they see exactly what's coming at them every time they play a monster. You seem to misinterpret that idea as well.

The fact that the card says you may reveal the top card ruins that idea.

IMO the power of the card would be a bit difficult to cost myself, just because I know for certain that it's a very powerful card. But without easy deck manipulation, I don't think it'll be as powerful as you think it is.

And last thing: I don't follow YGO's stupidity in terms of having many words. I make it so that cards have little words, because I know YGO's "many word" cards are intrinsically terrible in design.
You mean "many word" as in TER or as in something like DMOC?

...Yeah, okay, discarding = bad idea...at least, if the top card's a monster. What if it's a Spell, though? With no more Magician of Faith, the only way to get that card back would be losing at least 2 cards from your hand. And discarding a Trap will see your opponent set up anyway with a Twister/MST as soon as you set it.

And a monster discard would see a follow-up of BTH. It's overly broken no matter how you look at it--stuff a deck full of Level 4 monsters with a couple Level 6s and you're blocking most attackers from getting to you. Perhaps...if you had to discard each time, not just when you play it?

Oh, and...did anyone else consider using this thing with Convulsion of Nature? Yes, your opponent knows what's coming so they won't play a matching monster, but it also has a psychological effect to it, especially if you make a deck like I mentioned above.
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  #329    
Old March 13th, 2007 (02:17 PM).
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Here are some custom cards that likely will be banned. Useful for machine decks however. Critize them and suggest improvements based on your opinions please.

T-100, Thief of Darkness
Monster: Machine/Effect/Special Summon only
Atrribute: Dark, seven stars
Atk: 2000, Def: 1800
By either discarding four cards in your hand or paying 1500 Life Points, you can take one card from your opponent's hand or field, and use it until it's destroyed. You can view the opponent's hand by either discarding three cards or paying 1000 Life Points. Once the controlled card is destroyed, send it to the top of the opponent's deck. The opponent's deck is then shuffled.

T-101, Robot of the Flame
Monster: Machine/Effect/Special Summon only
Atrribute: Fire, six stars
Atk: 1800, Def: 1200
By tributing up to five monsters from your side of the field or your hand, you can activate it's effect. Directly inflict 700 damage times the number of monsters tributed. If an effect or spell/trap card negates this, increase the attack or defence of this monster by 1000 points.

T-102, Robotic Master of Wind
Monster: Machine/Effect/Special Summon
Atrribute: Wind, seven stars.
Atk: 1600 Def: 2400
Flip: Once this creature is flipped, summon up to four wind, machine, or winged beast cards from your deck. In return, remove one card in your deck with an attack more than 2000 from play (if there isn't a card with an attack that high, pay 1000 life points). Put the card back into face-down defence position. This effect can only be activated every 5 turns.

T-103, Aquatic Wizard
Monster: Machine/Effect/Special Summon
Atrribute: Water, six stars.
Atk: 1700 Def: 2000
By tributing three machine monsters (and removing one from play) you can remove from play up to two cards cards on your opponent's side of the field, or hand.

Robotic Tournament
Spell
Draw up to 8 machine cards from your deck (the number of drawn cards has to be even). Give half and keep 4. All current monsters on the field will be then put into the graveyard. Once your given set of machine cards are destroyed, then you may put another card down on the field again.

Factory of Power
Spell
Pay 500 life points to activate this. Remove one machine card from play, to special summon all cards with "T-10x" in their name. X is a variable.

Malfunction
Trap
All cards on the opponent's side of the field lose 150 ATK and DEF for each time a coin is flipped out of four times.

Evasion Microchip
Trap
This card can only be used when your opponent targets a monster. The selected monster can evade the attack.

Insert Machinery Into Group
Spell
For three turns, all monsters in your hand and the field become machine types.

Metal Hurricane
Trap/Equip
Tribute upto three monsters in your hand in order to destroy a monster on your opponent's side of the field. Equip this afterwards to a machine card to add 250 ATK or DEF per monster destroyed/tributed.
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  #330    
Old March 13th, 2007 (08:10 PM).
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Quote originally posted by Ichapokemr:
You mean "many word" as in TER or as in something like DMOC?

...Yeah, okay, discarding = bad idea...at least, if the top card's a monster. What if it's a Spell, though? With no more Magician of Faith, the only way to get that card back would be losing at least 2 cards from your hand. And discarding a Trap will see your opponent set up anyway with a Twister/MST as soon as you set it.

And a monster discard would see a follow-up of BTH. It's overly broken no matter how you look at it--stuff a deck full of Level 4 monsters with a couple Level 6s and you're blocking most attackers from getting to you. Perhaps...if you had to discard each time, not just when you play it?

Oh, and...did anyone else consider using this thing with Convulsion of Nature? Yes, your opponent knows what's coming so they won't play a matching monster, but it also has a psychological effect to it, especially if you make a deck like I mentioned above.
Wave motion cannon can do the same pressure, yet does not rely on combo to do it. Plus, there's card dump everywhere today that it's rather hard to prevent dump/revive in comparison to summon from hand. Dump/revive can be done by so many methods, and you don't know when it's going to be coming. The spell/trap revival card can stay on the hand for as long as ever, and worse of all, it can revive another card instead of the card that got dumped (say you're at 1800 LP, and you are expecting the dumped DMOC, but then it turns out it's premature card trooper pumping itself up to 1900 for the win, yet dodge the BTH that you set for DMOC.)

If it's stuck in your hand however, you really got to get rid of it asap before it clogs you up even further. Then, you're just rushing yourself for the pit, literally.

The card won't last on the field more than once... trust me, twister will see play with Mobius >>;

I honestly don't think that the card is that strong at all, even if it's discard... cause essentially card trooper can discard at a much faster speed and paid for itself with draw/damage. If I want to negate summons, it's best done through traditional methods of traps... Yes that can't stop Jinzo short of Solemn Judgmnet and friends, but one monster is not going to make me play a much weaker card for the sake of that one monster that's not overly popular.
  #331    
Old March 13th, 2007 (09:55 PM).
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Quote originally posted by Ichapokemr:
You mean "many word" as in TER or as in something like DMOC?
Rule of thumb: if there is no space in the text box for more words, it has too many words.

As for the power of the card and what not, I don't study YGO anyway, so you guys can continue your debate from here on.
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  #332    
Old March 14th, 2007 (12:58 PM). Edited March 15th, 2007 by Forci Stikane.
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Quote originally posted by Kenny_C.002:
Rule of thumb: if there is no space in the text box for more words, it has too many words.
See, that's not fair, as you can have varying text size to fill up the space (TER vs DMOC).

The answer also hit me this morning as far as cost goes, but that's an old discussion, as we have more carrds here now...

Quote originally posted by AngelicExcalibur:
T-100, Thief of Darkness
Monster: Machine/Effect/Special Summon only
Atrribute: Dark, seven stars
Atk: 2000, Def: 1800
By either discarding four cards in your hand or paying 1500 Life Points, you can take one card from your opponent's hand or field, and use it until it's destroyed. You can view the opponent's hand by either discarding three cards or paying 1000 Life Points. Once the controlled card is destroyed, send it to the top of the opponent's deck. The opponent's deck is then shuffled.

...Meh.

T-101, Robot of the Flame
Monster: Machine/Effect/Special Summon only
Atrribute: Fire, six stars
Atk: 1800, Def: 1200
By tributing up to five monsters from your side of the field or your hand, you can activate it's effect. Directly inflict 700 damage times the number of monsters tributed. If an effect or spell/trap card negates this, increase the attack or defence of this monster by 1000 points.

Same.

T-102, Robotic Master of Wind
Monster: Machine/Effect/Special Summon
Atrribute: Wind, seven stars.
Atk: 1600 Def: 2400
Flip: Once this creature is flipped, summon up to four wind, machine, or winged beast cards from your deck. In return, remove one card in your deck with an attack more than 2000 from play (if there isn't a card with an attack that high, pay 1000 life points). Put the card back into face-down defence position. This effect can only be activated every 5 turns.

Broken, and yes, will be banned almost immediately.

T-103, Aquatic Wizard
Monster: Machine/Effect/Special Summon
Atrribute: Water, six stars.
Atk: 1700 Def: 2000
By tributing three machine monsters (and removing one from play) you can remove from play up to two cards cards on your opponent's side of the field, or hand.

...Okay.

Robotic Tournament
Spell
Draw up to 8 machine cards from your deck (the number of drawn cards has to be even). Give half and keep 4. All current monsters on the field will be then put into the graveyard. Once your given set of machine cards are destroyed, then you may put another card down on the field again.

"Give" half?

And...the last sentence makes little sense, to be blunt.

Factory of Power
Spell
Pay 500 life points to activate this. Remove one machine card from play, to special summon all cards with "T-10x" in their name. X is a variable.

Removed from where?

And you can cover the variable by just saying "monster whose name starts with 'T-10'". Better-sounding, that's all.

Malfunction
Trap
All cards on the opponent's side of the field lose 150 ATK and DEF for each time a coin is flipped out of four times.

There's already a card named Malfunction.

Evasion Microchip
Trap
This card can only be used when your opponent targets a monster. The selected monster can evade the attack.

..."Targets the monster"? With an attack or effect?

Insert Machinery Into Group
Spell
For three turns, all monsters in your hand and the field become machine types.

Bettter name, please? No offense, but it just doesn't fit...

Metal Hurricane
Trap/Equip
Tribute upto three monsters in your hand in order to destroy a monster on your opponent's side of the field. Equip this afterwards to a machine card to add 250 ATK or DEF per monster destroyed/tributed.

Usually monsters are discarded from the hand, but otherwise okay.
You might want to word some of those better...

...Ah, yes, I forgot my reason for coming here: another card.

Fusion Memory
Equip Spell
You can only equip this card onto a Fusion Monster that was successfully Fusion Summoned. The equipped Fusion Monster gains the effects of any monsters used to Fusion Summon it as long as they are in your Graveyard.
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  #333    
Old March 15th, 2007 (11:47 AM). Edited March 15th, 2007 by Naito.
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Here's a few more custom cards. Like before, offer improvements and rate them if you want.

Tribe of the Dark
Continious Spell
For five turns, search through your deck for a darkness monster with an attack power equal to or less than 2500, and a defence power equal to or less than 2000. After the five turns, remove Tribe of the Dark from play and shuffle your deck.

Emerald Dragon
Monster/Light/Effect
Dragon, six stars.
Attack: 2500
Defence: 1700
This card can only be put into face-downdefence position. When flip summoned, special summon a monster with a level less than six.

Ruby Dragon
Monster/Light/Effect
Dragon, six stars.
Attack: 2300
Defence: 1900
This card can only be put into face-down defence position. When flip summoned, place a spell or trap card on the field.

Sapphire Dragon
Monster/Light/Effect
Dragon, seven stars.
Attack: 2400
Defence: 2300
This card can only be put into face-down defence position. When flip summoned, destroy one monster or trap card on your opponent's side of the field.

Gem's Fire
Spell
When Emerald Dragon, Ruby Dragon, and Sapphire Dragon is on the field at the same time, activate one of the two effects.
-Raise the three dragons' attack power to 3200.
-Inflict 1200 damage to your opponent's life points.

Tsunami
Spell/Quick-Play
While your side of the field is water-elemental, activate one of the following:
-Inflict 400 damage to your opponent's life points for each water monster on the field.
-Tribute one non-water monster to destroy a non-water monster on your opponent's side of the field.
-Decrease the attack or defence of a monster by 500 points.

Red-Eye Blue-Eye Grey Dragon
Monster/Dark/Fusion
Level 8, Dragon.
Attack: 3500
Defence: 3500
Red Eyes Black Dragon + Blue Eyes White Dragon
When fusion summoned, search in your deck for a Blue Eyes White Dragon, Toon Blue Eyes White Dragon, Red Eyes Black Dragon, or Red Eyes Black Chick, and special summon it regardless of conditions. Shuffle your deck afterwards.

Shuffle
Spell
For five turns, each player will shuffle their deck per turn.
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  #334    
Old March 15th, 2007 (02:45 PM).
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Icha: Oops. I forgot to mention "largest font only". :3

This is an attempt to play around with end phase, I guess.

Spell Flare
Continuous Trap
Your maximum hand size is 2 cards.
At the beginning of each end phase, if you played spell cards that turn, draw a card.

Something to chew on I guess. Nothing really that fancy, except for some potential exploits that may be rather broken. So you guys would probably have to check things out there.
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  #335    
Old March 15th, 2007 (02:57 PM). Edited March 15th, 2007 by Frostweaver.
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Depends on what do you mean by "Maximum hand size is two"... before draw, or are we talking about how the user of this card is constricted to a max of 2 cards in hand at all times?

AngelicExcalibur: a lot of your cards need some details... as much as "a lot of text in a card" sucks just like TER, sometimes you just have to have them... search a monster than do what with it? Special summon a monster from where? Deck or hand or graveyard? Also, it's a bit lazy to just write "/special summon"... are you trying to say nomi or something? Try to use the proper YGO format by referencing to real cards and see how they type up their text.

Ah let's just throw something out there...



Slow Reaction- Continuous Trap
While this card is face-up on the field, negate the effects of all quick-play spell cards on the field. The activation of this trap card cannot be chained to by a quick-play spell card.

Divinity of the Sanctuary- Counter Trap
You can only activate this card if "A Sanctuary in the Sky" and a Fairy-type monster are on your side of the field. Negate the Normal Summon or Special Summon of an effect monster, and destroy it.
  #336    
Old March 15th, 2007 (08:32 PM).
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Quote originally posted by Frostweaver:
Depends on what do you mean by "Maximum hand size is two"... before draw, or are we talking about how the user of this card is constricted to a max of 2 cards in hand at all times?
Maximum hand size is defined by the number of cards you must discard to during end phase. The normal maximum hand size is 6, is it not?
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  #337    
Old March 15th, 2007 (09:05 PM).
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Yes, but there's still complication such as... when you already got 2 card entering the main phase, do you get to draw then discard a card, or do you just skip your draw from Spell Flare? etc etc... details like that.
  #338    
Old March 15th, 2007 (09:19 PM).
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There is no discard trigger. Because of that, the ability would activate, and you draw a card. At the end of the end phase, you discard. It's because there is no discard trigger that the order is clearly defined. Also, this is why I said "beginning of end phase", not "end phase".
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  #339    
Old March 15th, 2007 (09:24 PM).
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Ah I see... well, you're mostly MTG player, and I've heard that MTG (being mother of many trading card game in english really) is already very familiar with card cycling.... it's no big deal if it's there, and nothing out of the ordinary if it happens.

In YGO, there's probably at best 4 cards that can do that. 2 of them (Graceful Charity, Mirage of Nightmare) are banned. Card cycling a rarity and totally unexplored, basically.
  #340    
Old March 15th, 2007 (09:59 PM).
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Well yeah, the ability to draw cards is common in mtg. It's also very natural inexecution most of the time. Funny thing is that there is such thing as "crappy drawing" in mtg as well. Though it seems that two cards "Jar of Greed" and the goblin merchant would get that honour. lol

Anyway, I think it's because YGO lacks a resource system, which causes card drawing to be disperportionally strong. And the problem is that payment usually comes from either discard, tribute, etc. in which n...idea.

Free Will
Quick Magic
If a monster you control is to be placed into the graveyard from battle, you may instead remove it from the game. If you do, draw 2 cards.

Might be too powerful, yes. It's like a limited pot, yes. It will be restricted to 1, yes. It doesn't work with current YGO game mechanics, yes. lol
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  #341    
Old March 16th, 2007 (11:57 AM).
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Undead Infection
Spell
All monsters on your side of the field become zombie types. If they already are zombies, each one will gain 300 attack points.

Re-Powered Machinery
Spell
If a machine type monster is in your graveyard, special summon it back to your side of the field.
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  #342    
Old March 16th, 2007 (05:05 PM).
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Quote originally posted by AngelicExcalibur:
Undead Infection
Spell
All monsters on your side of the field become zombie types. If they already are zombies, each one will gain 300 attack points.

Re-Powered Machinery
Spell
If a machine type monster is in your graveyard, special summon it back to your side of the field.
I thinkUndead Infection probably makes more sense (well, in how Yugioh plays) without the "If they are already..." and either as a Continuous Spell or Field card.

Re-Powered Machinery needs a price on it, most likely through life points, and i forget what other prices there are on bringing cards back from the graveyard XD


Quote originally posted by Kenny_C.002:
Free Will
Quick Magic
If a monster you control is to be placed into the graveyard from battle, you may instead remove it from the game. If you do, draw 2 cards.
Um, is this like Last Will, and can only be used for one monster?
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  #343    
Old March 16th, 2007 (05:09 PM).
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Free Will is more like Pot of Greed with neglectable activation =x Current YGO tries to dump monster into the graveyard to remove them all from game for a RFTDD swarm anyway.

Undead Infection is useless... cause DNA surgery exist with similar effect and nobody uses it.

Repowered Machine is just overpowered? Who doesn't run machine in a deck now... To make it worse, surely there's loopholes out there for this card with Cyber Twin Dragon o.O;
  #344    
Old March 16th, 2007 (08:10 PM).
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Summoning of a Vampire
Spell
Pay 1000 life points special summon any card containing "Vampire" in it's name from the deck or hand to your side of the field.

Distract and Heal
Quick-Play Trap
When your opponent attacks your monsters or life points, activate this card. When activated, have your opponent select a card from your hand. If it's a trap or spell card, your opponent will earn 300 life points. If it's a monster card, your opponent will earn 500 life points. The card selected by your opponent will then be send to your graveyard.

Reincarnation
Spell
Remove a monster from play on your side of the graveyard in order to special summon a monster that is the same level as the removed monster from your hand.
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  #345    
Old March 16th, 2007 (10:59 PM).
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Sounds like the card might be a bit broken. The only other way I can think of is this only being able to activate when the monster dies of spell cards or something.

Digi: quick spell = 1 timer.
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  #346    
Old March 17th, 2007 (12:49 AM).
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Just change it from quick play to either trap or normal spell should balance it... if it's trap, then the opponent has time to destroy the back row before the battle phase to prevent the +1, and if it's normal spell, then it means you have to suicide ram (not too uncommon in YGO) or a compensation if the opponent uses shrink in your battle phase.
  #347    
Old March 17th, 2007 (05:39 AM).
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Sounds fair, though it's kinda unfortunate that the idea of quickly turning your dead good stuff into card drawing is too powerful. :-/
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  #348    
Old March 17th, 2007 (07:13 AM). Edited March 17th, 2007 by Alter Ego.
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Nyu, there are like...people here again. Yay! For that, a couple of cards. :3

Envoy from the Different Dimension

Warrior/Effect
4 Star/Dark
1500 Atk / 1200 Def

By removing this card in your hand from play add one 'Dimensional Fissure' card from your deck to your hand.

Chaos Exchange
Normal Spell

This card can only be activated when you have four or more cards removed from play. Remove from play this card and two other cards in your hand in order to select one of your cards removed from play and add it to your hand.

D.D. Explosive
Normal Spell

Whenver this card would be sent to your graveyard, you may pay 500 life points to remove this card from play instead. When this card is removed from play as the result of your opponent's card effect, inflict 1000 points of direct damage to your opponent.

D.D. Detonator
Normal Spell

When this card is removed from play, inflict damage to your opponent's life points equal to 1500 x the number of your 'D.D. explosive's removed from play, then add all of your 'D.D. Explosive's removed from play to your graveyard.

Strategic Retreat
Quick-play Spell

This card can only be activated when there are two or more non-token monsters on your field. Shuffle all non-token monsters from your field to your deck then pick up the same number of cards that you added to your deck from the top of your deck. Special Summon any Monster Cards of Level 4 or lower among them on the field in face-up Attack Position or face-down Defense Position then add the rest of the cards to your hand.
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  #349    
Old March 17th, 2007 (11:55 AM).
Frostweaver's Avatar
Frostweaver Frostweaver is offline
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Quote originally posted by Kenny_C.002:
Sounds fair, though it's kinda unfortunate that the idea of quickly turning your dead good stuff into card drawing is too powerful. :-/
Because in MtG, if your opponent got a +2 card advantage on you, it's not too late to play better and catch up on the card advantage. If you got a +2 in YGO in the championship level, your opponent is beyond save except for "Heart of the Cards" getting you a topdecking snatch steal or something like that. It's still very possible to win if you're on -2 of course, but YGO there's only so few cards that will promise card advantage that it's difficult to catch up unless the opponent makes a mistake to balance it for you. That's why if Deck Devastation Virus goes off in the hands of a pro, it's basically instant win.


Envoy from the Different Dimension: fair enough, but kinda crazy how reinforcement of the army can basically search out Dimensional Fissure then XD; (and that's the same tutor for D. D. Survivor itself too)

Chaos Exchange- -2 for retrieving game breaking cards... but then it's hard to get spells in the removed pile unless there's Dimensional Fissure. Situational, but not useless either.

D. D. Explosive- not useful... you need your opponent to play Dimensional Fissure in order to do the 1000 damage, which means that I'll just happily use D. D. Detonator (the real one) if I need RFG-Burn, or just classical burn stuff...

D. D. Detonator- we got a card with the same name... either way, guess this gives D. D. Explosives some usefulness, but while it's in the hand, both of them are dead cards... there may be a few ways to exploit them, but it's just far too slow, and the possibility of them in your opening hand is just terrible.

Strategic Retreat- excellent card... or even slightly too good (not sure). Quick play means that this is going to be used to counter incoming destructive spells... or turning a bunch of Nimble Momongas and other recruiters into cards again. (and surely Asura Priest will cry if it tries to sweep up Hydroggedon and they all turn into bigger monsters again.)
  #350    
Old March 18th, 2007 (12:26 PM).
Kenny_C.002's Avatar
Kenny_C.002 Kenny_C.002 is offline
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Quote originally posted by Frostweaver:
Because in MtG, if your opponent got a +2 card advantage on you, it's not too late to play better and catch up on the card advantage. If you got a +2 in YGO in the championship level, your opponent is beyond save except for "Heart of the Cards" getting you a topdecking snatch steal or something like that. It's still very possible to win if you're on -2 of course, but YGO there's only so few cards that will promise card advantage that it's difficult to catch up unless the opponent makes a mistake to balance it for you. That's why if Deck Devastation Virus goes off in the hands of a pro, it's basically instant win.
Depends on the circumstances. I can safely say that a +2 CA on beatdown doesn't mean anything, though. But it's good to know that I didn't pick YGO as my game of choice, though, seeing all these problems arise.
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