The Incredibly Wandering Thread V3

[Xulek]

I remember my first PVP battle on Diamond where I just barely won against my friend Patrick by the skin of my teeth in a double battle match. Long story short it went down to his Giratina against my Heatran, his Giratina took a Lava Plume hit from Heatran earlier on before it KO'd my Dialga with Dragon Claw, thankfully I was able to get Giratina in the red with Dragon Claw before my Dialga fainted as my Heatran was hit with an Earth Power from the Giratina just barely avoiding a OHKO due to the burn. I finished it off with another Lava Plume and sealed my victory after a grueling bout.

Patrick's team was Giratina, Dialga, Empoleon, and Infernape.

My team was Torterra, Staraptor, Dialga, and Heatran.

Easily one of my closest matches by far. Also another match where I swept through my opponent's Groudon, Kyogre, Giratina, and Heatran with a LO Giratina. I'm dead serious when I say that lol.

[Forever]

Originally Posted by Xulek

Been thinking about trying out LO Mienshao on one of my teams but can't decide between an Adamant or Jolly nature ATM.

I'd go for Jolly SINCE u-turn always outspeeds whatever I have no matter what it is (unless deoxys-s lool) which is totally annoying. :x

Also Netto, this is totally one of the most fun sections here! :(

[Astinus]

Aw, competitive battling. I haven't done that in years. I used to be so involved in it, battling all my friends and EV training and even getting second place in a local tournament.

Now I just don't have the time. Or even anyone to battle against. Darn 3DS doesn't want to connect on the Internet.

Still, I have some interest in competitive battling, so I try to stay current on information.

[Xulek]

Originally Posted by Forever

I'd go for Jolly SINCE u-turn always outspeeds whatever I have no matter what it is (unless deoxys-s lool) which is totally annoying. :x

Mmk, gonna go with Jolly nature and give it the moves Fake Out, U-Turn, Stone Edge, and High Jump Kick when I'm done training it.

Unfortunately though I'm not sure on how to do Pokemon battles online so I usually stick with battles against people I know IRL. That, and I have absolutely no way to check what kind of EV spread I would be using at the time so yeah EV training's definitely not my strongest suit but I'll get the hang of it eventually once I get my hands on an AR.

[Forever]

;__; Clearly the answer is PO, Astinus!

Oh, and battling online is easy, well, on both wifi and on PO. On PO all you need to do is download the program, find a server and challenge someone, whereas on wifi you just connect to wifi, go to a room, click battle and battle the person. :3

[Mr Cat Dog]

I'm too much of a wimp to try competitive battling, unfortunately. The only memory of the stuff I have is battling my brother over a GBA Link Cable. Suffice to say that his defeat put me off the whole business... but it's great that other people get so much enjoyment out of it. More power to you! :D

[Forever]

But there's nothing to fear, CatDog :( It's fun and not that hard after a while!

...okay I think we're all going to get that I'll be trying to promote people to get into it here. XD

[Ooka]

/me helps

No seriously, Pokemon Online is a great program and it's definitely worth checking out, if you haven't. Really easy to build teams and battle people, and the ladder system makes it easy to find opponents with a skill level close to your own.

[Pikapal642]

I only EV train so that I can win in Battle Tower and whatnot. /ForeverAlone xD

I'm not patient enough to do the whole breeding thing to make a perfect team for real competitive battling, also. :\ On the other hand, though, IT SEEMS SO FUN. xD

[Toujours]

Inb4 Nica tells Pika about PO

[Forever]

THAT'S BECAUSE IT IS FUN PIKAPAL! Just get Pokemon Online and you can instantly get that perfect time you'd normally have issues breeding for :)

(Ooka, is it just me or does it feel like only regulars of CBC will be saying "YEAH BATTLE MORE" whereas everyone else will be like "nope never tried!"--that sounds really logical but it isn't. Great plug though!)

...

Toujours you're psychic.

[Pikapal642]

Originally Posted by Toujours

Inb4 Nica tells Pika about PO

Originally Posted by Forever

THAT'S BECAUSE IT IS FUN PIKAPAL! Just get Pokemon Online and you can instantly get that perfect time you'd normally have issues breeding for :)

(Ooka, is it just me or does it feel like only regulars of CBC will be saying "YEAH BATTLE MORE" whereas everyone else will be like "nope never tried!"--that sounds really logical but it isn't. Great plug though!)

...

Toujours you're psychic.

That made me lol. xDD

Anyways, I tried PO I while ago, but I forgot about it. xD I lost repeatedly though. >__> Meh, maybe sometime I'll try it again. xD

[Went]

Nica has had her brain sucked by competitive battling, I don't know if that's good or not XD

[Forever]

Clearly good, Went! You shall soon be converted, too. As will all of PC. /evil face

[Drakow]

Originally Posted by Toujours

Inb4 Nica tells Pika about PO

Trolljours!



I can't take Pokemon battling competitively or seriously anymore. It's just a fundamentally flawed game for two main reasons.

1) Rock Paper Scissors relationship.

As in bad players lose to good players, good players lose to great players but great players lose to bad players. While not strictly true, I believe it generally holds. People try to over predict against bad players and it backfires, potentially costing them the match and stuff like that. It's too easy for that to happen in Pokemon in my opinion.

2) The hax.

The Dark Azelf argument. Even though the hax is usually on my side, it ruins games. If you read the battle log between me and Miss Doronjo recently here, I had no right to win that match. I made too many mistakes and I should have lost but the nature of Pokemon is that even bad players can pull a win out of bullshizzle situations. I don't like playing a game where bad players can win out of their ass due to hax.

I mean yeah, Yu-Gi-Oh suffers from the above two problems but it's nowhere near as bad as Pokemon battling. In YGO, most of the time, the better player will win. Yeah people get sacked at times with lucky top decks (or in the case of Forever, dropping triple Judgment Dragon) and such, but those odds are very slim and that's why in the big YGO tournaments, you often see the same people making the top cut and such. Consistency is such a difficult thing to obtain in Pokemon in my opinion in comparison to YGO.

[Captain Fabio]

That is because YGO is the better game.

And lolol strike ninja.

[Mr Cat Dog]

Originally Posted by Forever

But there's nothing to fear, CatDog :( It's fun and not that hard after a while!

...okay I think we're all going to get that I'll be trying to promote people to get into it here. XD

But that means I have to take an interest in things... and I hate taking an interest in things. Apathy FTW! :D

[Ooka]

Originally Posted by Forever

Stuf

That's because once they try, they become regulars Nica.

Originally Posted by Drakow

Stuff

1) That's why you make safe predictions early on to properly gauge your opponent's skill. It can be hard, and sometimes they'll surprise you by playing loosely early on, then making great predictions later. Just part of the game.

2) Again, part of the game. It's two sided, so it's basically like life points in Yugioh, without them, you wouldn't have a game, but both players get them and sometimes it comes down to those few points that decide the game. In your battle, I feel like the loose predictions early on are what cost the opponent the match, which is more based on gameplay than game functioning, really.



___________________________


But yeah, competitive battling may take a bit to pick up, but then again a lot of enjoyable things are. Now with all the simulators everywhere (A new one being here: http://pokemonshowdown.com , which once it's out of private beta again, you don't even have to build a team to battle) it's very easy to get into competitive battling I think.

[Drakow]

@ Ooka

1) I am very much aware of that strategy believe me. I understand how it's "part of the game" and that is precisely why I claimed the game is "fundamentally flawed" as the basic concepts that make up the game what it is, are flawed. It can't be helped though, I comprehend that.

2) You did not seriously just compare luck (a random factor) to life points (a winning condition) did you? Such a comparison is absurd! You're much better off comparing Pokemon hax to luck of the draw. Anyway I have had a few pokemon battles completely free of hax and those are the best.

[Ooka]

Originally Posted by Drakow

@ Ooka

1) I am very much aware of that strategy believe me. I understand how it's "part of the game" and that is precisely why I claimed the game is "fundamentally flawed" as the basic concepts that make up the game what it is, are flawed. It can't be helped though, I comprehend that.

2) You did not seriously just compare luck (a random factor) to life points (a winning condition) did you? Such a comparison is absurd! You're much better off comparing Pokemon hax to luck of the draw. Anyway I have had a few pokemon battles completely free of hax and those are the best.

1) I honestly don't think that having to know a strategy = flawed, but I understand that's your opinion.

2) The way you were talking before is seemed like you considered hax a winning condition, so I didn't see anything wrong with comparing it to something in the same category. Sorry if I misunderstood.

[Livewire]

Originally Posted by Drakow

hax.

That's the beauty of it. Luck has always been a huge part of the game, no matter how many attempts Smogon makes to try to eliminate it, it's not Pokemon without the hax - the lucky crit or flinch here and there, etc. You can't win them all, no matter how good a player is. It's like a built in handicap to give everyone at least a minimum shot. It's part of the game.

[Drakow]

Originally Posted by Ooka

1) I honestly don't think that having to know a strategy = flawed, but I understand that's your opinion.

2) The way you were talking before is seemed like you considered hax a winning condition, so I didn't see anything wrong with comparing it to something in the same category. Sorry if I misunderstood.

1) I don't mean the overall strategy. If anything, I refer to tactics. It's just like sometimes people play "badly" (this obviously depends on the point of view) but they manage to come out on top. Sometimes you can argue whether their playstyle was so "bad" but other times I am just like "what the hell is this bull crap!?!"

2) Oooh yeah I can understand why you thought that. That wasn't primarily my intention but it can be the case that hax decides games. It's just in any game, the random factor should be reduced as much as possible so that the people who win are the ones who outplayed / deserve the win. Sometimes it can't be helped like in any card game for example. You will sometimes draw bad hands etc etc, that cannot be controlled. But in Pokemon, they really should have changed the game mechanics to not include hax or reduce it as much as possible. "But then it's not Pokemon." YOU'RE RIGHT. IT WOULD BE A MUCH BETTER GANE THAN WHAT POKEMON CURRENTLY IS!

@ PC Arch Nemesis

There should not be a "built in handicap" for any game really - especially one which in nature cannot be determined or controlled. The people who win should be the people who played better not who had greater luck. An extremist example I know but it illustrates my point clearly, which is why I used it. What you refer to as beauty, I call disgusting.

"If you don't like the game, then don't play it?"

I agree with that sentiment. In fact until recently I hadn't played in months. I found motivation to play a bit more though.

[AlexOzzyCake]

On the topic of hax, it's partly strategy making them happen. Eg choosing to use scald over the more powerful surf because you want the burn chance. Or choosing thunder over thunderbolt because you don't mind the risk of extra power. However that strategy side of it does wear out when it comes down to critical hits and 10% effects since most of the time these aren't actually intended to happen but leave a huge impact on the foe...

[Nashton]

The way I see it is that crits, flinches, and status % chances are just lucky hits, game changers, a Divine Breath. :/

I think a good battler would know how to come out of that situation 'cause odds are its just one pokemon that's out of commission. yeah i understand that it is completely crippling, but if you can put out of that and still win victory come out tasting so much sweeter.

but that bring up the ability serene grace with its boost of those some haxs. Some trainers whole team is base on that with the hax items too. (once i fought some noob with a foucs band that pulled off twice. TWICE! *facepalm*)

And then also moves like metronome and assist. I have a clafable that pulled of dark void twice back-to-back then used shadow force. i was stunned. then she would pull of moves like tail whip and wrap... the hax goes both ways

Pokemon is like chess mixed where everything is planed, executed, and predicted, but there just that bit of poke' bulls***, and if your good, you can deal with it well.

[Forever]

Originally Posted by Mr Cat Dog

But that means I have to take an interest in things... and I hate taking an interest in things. Apathy FTW! :D

AND YOU WILL ENJOY TAKING AN INTEREST IN THIS.

Originally Posted by Ooka

That's because once they try, they become regulars Nica. ;)

SO TRUE.

Originally Posted by Live_Wire466

That's the beauty of it. Luck has always been a huge part of the game, no matter how many attempts Smogon makes to try to eliminate it, it's not Pokemon without the hax - the lucky crit or flinch here and there, etc. You can't win them all, no matter how good a player is. It's like a built in handicap to give everyone at least a minimum shot. It's part of the game.

Except Focus Miss/Stone Miss, aka if the server hates you that they they keep missing :3

Originally Posted by AlexOzzyCake

On the topic of hax, it's partly strategy making them happen. Eg choosing to use scald over the more powerful surf because you want the burn chance. Or choosing thunder over thunderbolt because you don't mind the risk of extra power. However that strategy side of it does wear out when it comes down to critical hits and 10% effects since most of the time these aren't actually intended to happen but leave a huge impact on the foe...

Pfft no, Thunder = reserved for rain, I don't think anyone uses Thunder outside of rain, afaik, knowing how common rain is in the metagame. :x And technically if they do, they're taking too much of a risk imo!

Originally Posted by Nashton

And then also moves like metronome and assist. I have a clafable that pulled of dark void twice back-to-back then used shadow force. i was stunned. then she would pull of moves like tail whip and wrap... the hax goes both ways

Pretty sure nobody uses those seriously competitively :x