Who is the Strongest Starter of All Time?

[KingofCarnage18]

Well I just spent the last half hour adding stats for a system I call

C-Collective
S-Stat
M-Measurement

CSM I feel is fairly accurate but you must always take type, and moves into account. But the victor based purely on stats? Well.. its a surprise. You will see all the pokemon's place at the end. See where your favorite starter stands!

The numbers in ( ) are stats+hp. I don't really count HP as a stat really because defenses make the difference. You can one hit a chansey with a weak attack... So without further speculation or side notes, the results:


Venusaur:1520 (1884)

Charizard:1544 (1900}

Blastoise: 1533 (1895)

Gen1=Charizard Victor

Meganium: 1520 (1884)

Typhlosion: 1544 (1900)

Feraligatr: 1520 (1894)

Gen2=Typhlosion Victor

Sceptile: 1552 (1896)

Blaziken: 1530 (1894)

Swampert: 1497 (1901)

Gen3=Sceptile Base Stat Victor. Swampert HP Victor

Torterra: 1487 (1881)

Infernape: 1550 (1906)

Empoleon: 1524 (1896)

Gen4=Infernape Victor

Serperior: 1537 (1891)

Emboar: 1460 (1884)

Samurott: 1493 (1887)

Gen5=Serperior

1st Place: Sceptile 1552

2nd Place: Infernape 1550

3rd Place: Charizard/Typhlosion 1544 (Tie, even after accounting HP)

4th Place: Serperior 1537

5th Place: Blastoise 1533

6th Place: Blaziken 1530

7th Place: Empoleon 1524

8th Place: Feraligatr (Close with 9th, but hp broke the tie)

9th: Meganium/Venusaur 1520

10th: Swampert 1497

11th: Samurott 1493

12th: Torterra 1487

13th: Emboar 1460

Worst Starter By Stats: Emboar
Best Starter By Stats: Sceptile

[Yuzuru Otonashi]

There is no contest. Blaziken is in Ubers for a reason.

Also, OP didn't factor in movepools, abilities, or sat distribution, which is disappointing. You shouldn't have spent time on JUST that.

[Shootingace]

Blaziken is an Uber, making it the best overall. But it really does depend on movesets and EV's, IV's. With the right strategy, no Pokemon is better than the other.

[KingofCarnage18]

Originally Posted by KingofCarnage18

CSM I feel is fairly accurate but you must always take type, and moves into account. But the victor based purely on stats

The posters clearly didnt bother to read the entire post. You shouldn't just have taken the time to read the stats. Guessing your the type to do homework and forget to write your name at the top?

[jellicentfan1]

Technically Swampert is the strongest in terms of BST. However if you take movepool and hidden abilities likely you will find that Blaziken is the strongest. All starters are basically balanced and it really depends on what type you are facing and your movepool. All starters can be strong.

[Yuzuru Otonashi]

Originally Posted by KingofCarnage18

The posters clearly didnt bother to read the entire post. You shouldn't just have taken the time to read the stats. Guessing your the type to do homework and forget to write your name at the top?

Nah, I read the post, except, ironically, the stats. Just saying you wasted your time on a post when it's clearly nowhere near accurate and doesn't factor in abilities and the like in and of itself. The CSM or w/e is completely pointless and has nothing to do with anything.

I specifically said "You shouldn't have spent time on JUST that," because, unless you're supplying the other stuff, the whole post does nothing but provide misleading info that would actually change the correct answer. That would be Blaziken.

[KingofCarnage18]

Blaziken based on what? Where is the formula to prove this? Let me guess... and over exerted amount of energy planted into figuring out every in and out of making an unbeatable blaziken... Blaziken is one of the most popular fire types. And my second favorite starter. But I promise if I were to put a good amount of time into swampert and maybe even sceptile, they would crush blaziken. And my post is far from misleading I just quoted you the part that said types and moves need to be taken into account. As for abilities. Every gen starter has the same ability.

Seems to me someone just took this post the wrong way.

The strongest pokemon. In terms of stats. BESIDES HP

Is sceptile. Not your favorite? Get over it.

[XanderO]

From personal use. Sceptile and Serperior are two of the worst starters. I tend to use all of them at least once when I get other copies of the games. Gen 3 and Gen 5 were also the only times my brother, who almost always uses Grass Types, did not have a Grass Starter. He started with them at first, but after a short while he resets and chooses the fire starter.

I found Serperior to be shallow and had a serious lack of power, not to mention I kept getting OHKO's from everything and its momma. Sceptile was better, but not by much.

Honestly, this thread tells us that overall stats don't matter much cause this chart is horribly inaccurate.

[AzaleaLightning]

By comparison, Sceptile is definitely farther down on the list compared to some of the others listed.

Basing purely on stats is a poor basis to find the "best starter of all time," which is what you claim to have found.

With 65 in both Defs and 70 Atk, Sceptile is definitely lacking. Both Atks are manageable, with good Speed, though. That doesn't make it anything extraordinary however; Blaziken still sweeps the floor with it.

Also not all starters have the same ability. Previous poster was referring to hidden abilities; Blaziken has access to Speed Boost (which raises its speed every turn) which makes it a huge force to be reckoned with as a revenge killer.

Sceptile doesn't have much to go for it; Serperior has way worse stats but access to an ability (which I can't remember the name of) that boosts its SpAtk for every Leaf Storm it uses, a move that would ordinarily decrease that stat.

Again by comparison, I know that Swampert and Blaziken are definitely better than Sceptile, Infernape is pretty beast as well, and I would say with some sets that even Empoleon could be worth a mention, though not a big one. It's a bit of perspective, some are better in-game while some are better competitively, etc.

tldr; Sceptile doesn't even really belong in the top 5 lololol.

[XanderO]

Originally Posted by AzaleaLightning

By comparison, Sceptile is definitely farther down on the list compared to some of the others listed.

Basing purely on stats is a poor basis to find the "best starter of all time," which is what you claim to have found.

With 65 in both Defs and 70 Atk, Sceptile is definitely lacking. Both Atks are manageable, with good Speed, though. That doesn't make it anything extraordinary however; Blaziken still sweeps the floor with it.

Also not all starters have the same ability. Previous poster was referring to hidden abilities; Blaziken has access to Speed Boost (which raises its speed every turn) which makes it a huge force to be reckoned with as a revenge killer.

Sceptile doesn't have much to go for it; Serperior has way worse stats but access to an ability (which I can't remember the name of) that boosts its SpAtk for every Leaf Storm it uses, a move that would ordinarily decrease that stat.

Again by comparison, I know that Swampert and Blaziken are definitely better than Sceptile, Infernape is pretty beast as well, and I would say with some sets that even Empoleon could be worth a mention, though not a big one. It's a bit of perspective, some are better in-game while some are better competitively, etc.

tldr; Sceptile doesn't even really belong in the top 5 lololol.

Serperior's Hidden ability is Contrary which reverses the stat changes. Negatives become positives and positives become Negatives.

Swagger and Flatter ruin Contrary though XD -2 Atk or -2 Sp. Atk AND Confusion. So even with it, it capitalizes on its own attack while it also has a very abusable weakness with those moves.

[Yuzuru Otonashi]

Originally Posted by KingofCarnage18

Blaziken based on what? Where is the formula to prove this? Let me guess... and over exerted amount of energy planted into figuring out every in and out of making an unbeatable blaziken... Blaziken is one of the most popular fire types. And my second favorite starter. But I promise if I were to put a good amount of time into swampert and maybe even sceptile, they would crush blaziken. And my post is far from misleading I just quoted you the part that said types and moves need to be taken into account. As for abilities. Every gen starter has the same ability.

Seems to me someone just took this post the wrong way.

The strongest pokemon. In terms of stats. BESIDES HP

Is sceptile. Not your favorite? Get over it.

Based on stats is incredibly misleading. There's nothing to get over. In fact, I love Sceptile. Doesn't change how wrong it is.

And not all starters have the same abilities. If you don't know that, why did you make this thread? The Dream World exists.

Blaziken has Speed Boost. It also has access to Swords Dance, Protect, and the like. Second best, at least right now, is Venusaur. Why? Dream World gave it Chlorophyll and Sun Teams can use it well. Difference between Venusaur and Blaziken is the by and large generic nature of Blaziken, as opposed to Venusaur's predominant sun power.

you have to factor in everything when deciding which is strongest. You can't say "here's a stat chart, adhere to it or gtfo."

[jellicentfan1]

Just to add on to what Xander was saying about Serperior and Sceptile. All grass starters are usually thhe worst. They have more weaknesses and hindering movepools. Venasaur is arguably the best Grass starter. It has a great hidden ability and a better movepool. For you to have grass types high on your list is kinda off beacuse you did not take in multiple weaknesses.

[Zupplu]

There is no contest. Blaziken is in Uber for a reason, not because he looks cool, not because he is Smogon's favourite, it's because he is strong. After a couple of turns, he will definitely outspeed all of the other starters, and destroy them if played correctly. One swords dance boosts his attack to 734, and then using Hi Jump Kick, will destroy every other starter just about. He can use protect for that extra boost too.