Community Hack [Pre-production]

[machomuu]

Do we want to include Fakemon?
Do we want to include Gen IV/V Pokemon?

They really depend on the story and basis of the hack. I'd say that, as a community that has general interest in fakemon (as hacks such as Sienna have proven) and the interest in gen IV/V pokemon (as numerous hacks and tutorials have proven), it would be best for us to attempt to add them both if the situation allows for it- so long as we do not remove any, or too many of, the existing pokemon.

[Pink Parka Girl]

Position (multiple if necessary): Head of Story Development
Proof of Ability (if applicable): Pokemon: Super Rising Thunder!
Comments (if applicable): At heart, I am a storyteller. I've been writing and dreaming since I was old enough to pick up a pencil, and even before then; narrating stories to obliging family who would then write them down for me. I'm a writer to this day; slowly developing a fanfic along with the plot of my own hack. While it's certainly true that a game doesn't need a good story if its strengths in other areas make up for this (as in real Pokemon games), it's always been my personal philosophy that a good story can compliment and enrich gameplay - just like a good book, we want to keep playing. We strive to know what happens next! The plot doesn't need to be cliche; even if there's eight gyms and an Evil Team. The player character doesn't need to be a personality-less blank slate of an avatar (and they don't need to have dialogue to achieve this, either). The everyday folk you see wandering about in the towns and cities are deserving of dignity - real human beings don't spend their entire existence discussing nothing but the local fauna, after all - and these NPCs can bring just as much character and life to a map as the tiles and layout themselves. Supporting characters can be people you want to cheer for or people you want to see fall - and sometimes, both. Even "evil" Teams can have moral greys, and motives far deeper and more thought provoking than "take over the world with a legendary." The best story is the one that draws you entirely into its setting via worldbuilding; and makes you think and makes you question even after you've finished playing.

In this role as "head" of Story Development ("head" being in quotations here because even if I were elected to lead; I would still like to work closely with others); I would focus on:

Helping to choose/develop the plot - the good, the bad, and the ugly; from the surface on down. Is this going to be an eight Gyms/Evil Team deal, or something else? Is it set in the past? The present? The future? Old region or new?
Writing/helping to choose dialogue to give character to the setting (ie; worldbuilding)
Writing/helping to choose dialogue to give character to the game (serious, spirited, or humorous as the situation calls for)
Writing/helping to choose dialogue for canon characters from the Pokemon universe - if the community wants them to cameo - and helping to make sure they "stay true" to themselves. For example, if Ash were to appear he should act like Ash, not like a generic NPC. I've seen enough hacks get this wrong that if we do have canon characters cameo, I want us to do it right.
Writing/helping to choose dialogue in general
Assisting with development of the supporting characters and the Hero and/or Heroine. What sorts of people are these?
And the most important: How this plot reveals itself throughout the course of the game. We don't want cutscenes constantly overwhelming the flow of the game and derailing gameplay; but nor do we want the plot to be so tepid that it hardly shows itself at all. This is a game first and foremost; not an interactive novel. If elected to this position I would consult with others to help develop a reasonable "plan" for the story arc - its buildup, conflicts, climax, and resolution from the start of the game to the end; utilizing lessons and criticism I've learned/received while developing Super Rising Thunder.

If not elected to this position, however, I'd be more than happy to help with these sorts of things anyway; perhaps as part of the story "team." My mother-hen help-the-newbies instincts have been long dormant with the death of the Scrapbox, and I'd really love to be involved in this in any way I can to assist and give back to this Pokecommunity that has in turn given me so much.

And on the topic of Fakemon and Gens IV to VI 'mon:

For Fakemon; it depends on the quality of the spriters we have and the quality of the ideas. They can work; but it's really quite chancy. I can't give a straight yes or no to this.
As for Pokemon beyond Gen III, I'm okay with them only if existing 'mon aren't overwritten to make room. Every 'mon is someone's favorite; after all, and no one likes to see a favorite be entirely erased in place of something they might not even like. Given that my favorite is the rather powerless and forgettable Plusle, this has happened to me before and I don't much like it. XD

[11bayerf1]

Hi everyone, might be a bit late to hop on the band wagon, I just saw it now!
Position (multiple if necessary): Head of Graphics

Proof of Ability (if applicable):
http://glidingar.deviantart.com/gallery/ (Collection of sprites I've made)
http://imgur.com/a/Kh8h5 (Screenshots from a hack I'm working on)
http://imgur.com/a/tgKIv (Screenshots of the maps I've made using custom tiles)
http://i.imgur.com/VRSx1x5.png (Collection of fakemon I've made for another hack I'm collaborating on)
http://imgur.com/a/a2qMV (Examples of Trainers I've made for my hack, with a modified Diploma Screen)
http://imgur.com/a/G9PpE (Examples of some Resized gen 4 and 5 sprites, and custom sprites)

Comments (if applicable):
I generally prefer Spriting in terms of graphics, front sprites, backsprites, OW sprites, you name it. I make sprites from scratch, I can shrink Gen4 and Gen5 sprites to 64x64 style, I merge firered, hg and bw sprites to make custom sprites, so I can pretty much be relied on to either make new sprites for existing pokemon in that way, or shrink sprites that are too big, or even make fakemon if we decide to go in that direction. I have done title screen work which has been successful, I've also made lots of tiles that all seem to work fine and look nice in terms of the HGSS style. I have never done menus, but I'm sure I can pick it up. I have lots of experience with scripting and mapping as well as I have been working on a hack myself (I hope to have a Beta out soon on Pokecommunity). I haven't been particularly active since I've joined, so I may seem like I have come out of nowhere, but I have been hacking fairly continuously for a few years, and have been doing my own personal hack for 2 months now, and have been spriting for much longer. I felt inspired to return to Pokecommunity through working with other hacking websites and seeing the great wealth of resources and hackers over here. Thanks to everyone out there for just listening to my application!

Also in relation the questions posed earlier:

I would say, Yes for fakemon, depending on the skill of design and spriting team.
It would really show how good we are as a pokemon community if we were able to create viable, and popular fakemon.

I would also say Yes for gen4-5 pokemon. There's no reason they should be excluded in all honesty, there are so many tools out there that makes their implementation easy. It also would just be more pokemon inclusive.

[Darkrai Lv.1000]

Wow, so this is really happening!
I'd love to have a kind of small part in this if possible, though not too important because I might not have the spare time. It would be nice to contribute to what is going to be the biggest Pokemon romhack of all time.

I still consider myself a beginner hacker because though I can do a little bit of everything such as mapping, scripting, storyboarding, programming and the like, I haven't consolidated any of it into a single existing romhack yet. Though I do have a progressing hack of my own I'm working on that I plan to post to the forums in the future when it's done. I still don't know ASM though.

[FBI agent]

Originally Posted by machomuu

Regarding Fakemon:
They really depend on the story and basis of the hack.

Originally Posted by Pink Parka Girl

And the most important[/B]: How this plot reveals itself throughout the course of the game. We don't want cutscenes constantly overwhelming the flow of the game and derailing gameplay; but nor do we want the plot to be so tepid that it hardly shows itself at all. This is a game first and foremost; not an interactive novel. If elected to this position I would consult with others to help develop a reasonable "plan" for the story arc - its buildup, conflicts, climax, and resolution from the start of the game to the end; utilizing lessons and criticism I've learned/received while developing Super Rising Thunder.

Wow, " 'mon" is a totally rad short form that I'm gonna use from now on.

Most important of all:
People agree with what I said! I'm not alone in my seemingly un-understandable thought process! :D

Originally Posted by 11bayerf1

Hi everyone, might be a bit late to hop on the band wagon, I just saw it now!
Position (multiple if necessary): Head of Graphics

First good sir, let me tell you that your hack looks like fun! I like the rocket thing and being a spriter has helped you make it look more "believable" in comparison to some of the other rocket hacks.
As for the sprites themselves, they're very inconsistent. It's clear that some of them are old and some of them are new. By that I mean some of the sprites look well done, and others look a little rushed or somewhat "awkward". I know I'm not a good spriter and I have no clue about different shading techniques, but I'm trying to help :P


Anyways, I'm glad to see some more people posting around and applying. Things will get interesting :)

EDIT: Has anyone found this place via my sig?

[Noossab Blue]

Should we use fakemon?

I'm split on this. Fakemon do turn a lot of people away from hacks, but then again, so do other things, like missing certain real pokemon, graphics, gameplay features, etc. I agree that if they were to be implemented they would need to blend in with the others. But with the fantastic artists we will undoubtedly have working on sprites, this hack could definitely pull off fakemon. For that matter, a handful of fakemon could be central to the story. Newly discovered/created mons...blah blah blah...

Also, fakemon would allow us/players to explore new type combinations and possibly other features, which is appealing to me. For example, in my own hack I have 11 fakemon, 9 of which are in starter lines. I created the starter triangle electric/ghost, ground/dark, fighting/flying. The other two are bug/dark and fire/grass. Of course that could also be accomplished by changing the typings/stats on already-created pokemon, which is something else we need to discuss eventually.

Should we use gen4/5 pokes?

I think so, though to what extent is largely dependent on the 649 patch or similar changes. There are enough duplicates between gens that to not change the dex at all seems a waste to me. For example, do you really need pidgey, spearow, hoothoot, tailow, starly, and pidove lines? How about rattata, sentret, zigzagoon, bidoof? Or pikachu, plusle/minum, pachirisu, and emolga?

If we use the 386 slots then most of those can be discarded. If we use the 649, then we could still discard a few if we wanted to use fakemon...

[11bayerf1]

Originally Posted by FBI agent

Wow, " 'mon" is a totally rad short form that I'm gonna use from now on.

Most important of all:
People agree with what I said! I'm not alone in my seemingly un-understandable thought process! :D




First good sir, let me tell you that your hack looks like fun! I like the rocket thing and being a spriter has helped you make it look more "believable" in comparison to some of the other rocket hacks.
As for the sprites themselves, they're very inconsistent. It's clear that some of them are old and some of them are new. By that I mean some of the sprites look well done, and others look a little rushed or somewhat "awkward". I know I'm not a good spriter and I have no clue about different shading techniques, but I'm trying to help


Anyways, I'm glad to see some more people posting around and applying. Things will get interesting

EDIT: Has anyone found this place via my sig?

Thanks! I've been working fairly hard on the Rocket hack and hope it'll end up pretty good. I know what you mean about inconsistency, the majority of the deviant art sprites are from last year or earlier, so they don't really reflect my ability at all times. Some of the fakemons that I've done aswell (the not as good ones) are either ones I made earlier or had to do completely blind, without any idea of concepts, colours, shapes etc.
I understand your concern with the inconsistency, but I can assure you that my current style is the more 'high-end' level of my sprites. I've been doing a lot of sprite work recently due to the hack, and have really refined my shading. I now generally don't use dithering, and to tend to focus more on block colours (as is Nintendo in Gen 4 and 5). Even if I don't get picked for Head of Graphics, I would love to participate as an occasional spriter if it is required.
Thanks again for listening.

[Darthatron]

Applications are now closed. Anyone we has submitted already can PM me any new stuff. I now suggest anyone who didnt want to lead should post what they'd like to help work on.

I want compile a list of all involved and allocate positions and stuff. Previous work isn't required, but I'd like it anyway.

[karatekid552]

Originally Posted by Darthatron

Applications are now closed. Anyone we has submitted already can PM me any new stuff. I now suggest anyone who didnt want to lead should post what they'd like to help work on.

I want compile a list of all involved and allocate positions and stuff. Previous work isn't required, but I'd like it anyway.

Awesome, are there going to be votes, or are you going to pick? I can't wait to get this underway!

I would like to be mainly a scripter. If you would like some examples I can send them. Also, I might like to help plan the story or a side quest. Not a huge role in story development, just a tiny part if needed.

[Darthatron]

I was just going to pick. We can have a vote if you all would prefer?

[kj3400]

Up to you, oh fearless leader.
I'd like to help with the world map, and scripting.

[FBI agent]

Originally Posted by Darthatron

I was just going to pick. We can have a vote if you all would prefer?

I want you to pick, I would vote for ones I know/like.

Also, I want to help/work on ASM and scripting.

[Darthatron]

I figured those who want to vote will just vote for their friends anyway. But I have no friends, so I can be the cruel, heartless dictator that this hack needs.

[hinkage]

Voting woof take forever, Darthatron should just pick.

[karatekid552]

Originally Posted by Darthatron

I figured those who want to vote will just vote for their friends anyway. But I have no friends, so I can be the cruel, heartless dictator that this hack needs.

And that's why we picked you, you'll make a great dictator:p

[Anbuja's_BlooDY]

Originally Posted by Darthatron

I was just going to pick. We can have a vote if you all would prefer?

Up to you since you are the Leader of it.

But if everyone else wants to vote then we gotta do this to ourselfes.

I'd sugguest that you chose though, otherwise why did they want a Leader other then doing those desisions :> (And hacking off course <3)

But I have no friends.

But...but I thought were brothers bro

[kj3400]

I've served under many a dictator, this wouldn't be any different XD

[Disturbed]

Too bad I didn't notice this earlier. I'm sad now

The only thing I truly excel at is mapping and I was recognized by the community as a fantastic mapper too back when I was more active. Most of the reason I never got Distant off the ground is because I dread anything that's not related to ... well... mapping.

ANYWAYS, if you're still willing to accept any applications (I know you closed apps, but figured I might as well post) I might go ahead and fill one out. If not, I wish you all good luck . Darthy will make a fantastic leader, I'm sure of it.
(And I'll always be around to help out too, if needed)

[C_r_e_a_m_p_u_f_f]

Eh, I just wanted to say about that voters part.


Fakemon : No need. I don't like Fakemon too much, but maybe we could create alternate forms for the same Pokémon.

Gen IV/V : Yes! Yes need. Okay, maybe that 649 patch stuff would be cool, but if not possible, I think we really need some of 'em.

[Darthatron]

Originally Posted by Disturbed

Too bad I didn't notice this earlier. I'm sad now

The only thing I truly excel at is mapping and I was recognized by the community as a fantastic mapper too back when I was more active. Most of the reason I never got Distant off the ground is because I dread anything that's not related to ... well... mapping.

ANYWAYS, if you're still willing to accept any applications (I know you closed apps, but figured I might as well post) I might go ahead and fill one out. If not, I wish you all good luck . Darthy will make a fantastic leader, I'm sure of it.
(And I'll always be around to help out too, if needed)

I'm sorry Disturbed! If you had have got your application in on time, it would have been awesome, but I don't think it would be fair on the other applicants at this point.

Thanks for the kind words, anyway. And I'm sure we will need you to make some awesome maps!

___________

Okay guys, I added up all votes for Fakemon/Gen>3 and this is how it's looking at the moment.

100% of voters do want Generation 4 and 5 Pokemon to be included in some way. Some of these voters mentioned not wanting any of the Gen 1/2/3 Pokemon to be removed from the game. Preferably all Pokemon would remain and all new Pokemon would be added.

55% of voters do not want Fakemon to be included in any way. The remaining 45% were either indecisive or wanted Fakemon to be included.

This vote still isn't closed, so please keep posting. I just thought I should let you all know what's going on.

[FBI agent]

Originally Posted by Darthatron

I'm sorry Disturbed! :( If you had have got your application in on time, it would have been awesome, but I don't think it would be fair on the other applicants at this point.

Thanks for the kind words, anyway. :) And I'm sure we will need you to make some awesome maps!

___________

Okay guys, I added up all votes for Fakemon/Gen>3 and this is how it's looking at the moment.

100% of voters do want Generation 4 and 5 Pokemon to be included in some way. Some of these voters mentioned not wanting any of the Gen 1/2/3 Pokemon to be removed from the game. Preferably all Pokemon would remain and all new Pokemon would be added.

55% of voters do not want Fakemon to be included in any way. The remaining 45% were either indecisive or wanted Fakemon to be included.

This vote still isn't closed, so please keep posting. I just thought I should let you all know what's going on.

55% to 45% is pretty close, considering we have a small sample. I'm wondering, if along the road we will be able to make this vote again. Surely before we start (without a story/setting), it's hard to determine whether or not we need/want Fakemon. As such, it's a wise decision to come back to this question AFTER the story is complete. That way we can come to a consensus having more background on the hack (and knowing if fakemon are sensible in the context of the story).

By the way, how long will it be until you're going to release the results of the applications?
As a request, when you reveal who is doing what please include why. I'm actually curious to see your thought process and method of selection.

[miksy91]

I could say my opinion on the for these two as well:

Gen IV & V Pokemon:
If they're implemented correctly (right movesets, base stats, TM learning datas and all that), I don't see why not to add them in the hack. If you're going to go with Jambo's patch there, sure have more added in.

Fakemon:
Depends on the situation really. If there is no need for adding fakemon in the hack, it's not like adding them would make a difference to the gameplay unless they're implemented really well (and so it would be fun to have some in). So in this case, I just don't see a point in starting to add them because that would be just pushing the spriters to do a lot of work for no reason really.

But in some hacks (for instance Ruby Destiny series), there are "fakemon" because of a reason behind having them. If the storyline is built so that non-pokemon creatures should exist, the hack would require these "fakemon" to be there. In this case, I wouldn't consider these new creatures even being fakemon, as they are no way "fake" (or maybe properly "made") at all.

So what I would vote for is that don't bother adding fakemon if there is no purpose for adding them. Otherwise, it would just feel weird to have them around (unless all the pokemon were fakemon).

[11bayerf1]

Originally Posted by FBI agent

55% to 45% is pretty close, considering we have a small sample. I'm wondering, if along the road we will be able to make this vote again. Surely before we start (without a story/setting), it's hard to determine whether or not we need/want Fakemon. As such, it's a wise decision to come back to this question AFTER the story is complete. That way we can come to a consensus having more background on the hack (and knowing if fakemon are sensible in the context of the story).

By the way, how long will it be until you're going to release the results of the applications?
As a request, when you reveal who is doing what please include why. I'm actually curious to see your thought process and method of selection.

I think this a very good idea. Due to the closeness of the Fakemon issue at this point, it would possibly good to continue or revote at a later date once a story has been fleshed out. I think it would be better to have a story and then see if we can fit in Fakemon or if they're not needed rather than creating a story that specifically requires or forbids the inclusion of Fakemon.

[hinkage]

We should include Fakemon only if is one of them

[Aryan143]

Do we want to include Fakemon?: Not at all. I want this hack with real pokemon.
Do we want to include Gen IV/V Pokemon?: Yes it would inspire other hackers to include them into their hack.

And are the entries closed? I would like to apply.