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  #1    
Old November 1st, 2013, 01:19 PM
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So at this point I'm sure everyone knows what IVs (individual values) are. Basically, they are hidden stats in your Pokemon determined by RNG and you have little control over it.

I'd like to discuss about the importance of IVs and what they bring to the game design. And I'll say it quick, it adds nothing. It is one of the worst design choice to plague the Pokemon series and there's many reasons why.

IVs are the cause of many controversies amongst fans, mostly in the metagame. They are essentially the sole reason the whole "RNG abuse" and "hacking" debates exist in the competitive environment, and it's easy to see why. IVs, for being uncontrollable hidden stats, are hugely crucial in battles. Yes, it is possible to get a Pokemon with perfect IVs, but it is undeniable that it takes hours and the process is extremely tedious that I'm sure no one would like to do it. Had it not been for RNG abuse and hacking, IVs would have caused the Pokemon metagame to move at a snail's pace, and in a competitive environment that is a surefire way to kill it. But the whole cheating thing, regardless of being relative to the IVs situation as a whole, is another matter.

Even outside of the metagame IVs can be a detriment. It can render your Pokemon useless if you're unlucky. You're fighting a friend and your Gyarados has very low attack IVs, that basically means it's useless and you just gave your friend a free win. Now situations like that aren't everyday and if you're a casual you might not notice/care much...but let's say you're a game designer, why would you even add that?

So let's discuss about the importance of IVs. What is the point of them? Do you think they add to anything? Do you think the problem is the fact that it's hard to get a perfect Pokemon?
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Old November 1st, 2013, 01:34 PM
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It was mainly there to determine hidden powers (like, literally), and uniqueness (not necessarily just shininess) of a pokemon. Bonus stats probably were the last thing on the list. It's sole purpose was to make this Rattata be different from that Rattata in one way or another. If anything, it could've been a non-stat related number. But because it was the only way to make such "uniqueness" possible, numbers had to be transmuted into stats.

Competitive users just take advantage of the bonus stats because, well, it exists; and while you do have a slight advantage by having a few higher stats, the majority of the metagame still lies on a strategic game of rock-paper-scissors. Heck, you could survive the current meta without even having to worry about that. Like, at all.

But if you wanna play as competitively as the other players with very little effort, all you have to really worry about is your Speed IV (mostly) or just some EV training or both. That speed IV is probably what affects the meta more than anything. If not, then start relying on brains instead of brawns -- you may have an even higher chance of winning.
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Last edited by molivious; November 1st, 2013 at 01:50 PM.
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Old November 1st, 2013, 02:31 PM
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The most notable purpose for IVs is what molivious mentioned: to bring uniqueness to each Pokémon and to add variety to the 718 that currently exist. And when you take into account the method with which Nintendo single-handedly emulated genetics and, in turn, added a whole extra level of depth to breeding and battling, I can't help but praise the addition.

Really it all boils down to personal values. One can either embrace the heightened level of complexity, or they can shun it. It takes a certain amount of commitment and effort to raise an "perfect" model of any species -- if that is one's intended goal -- but really, IVs just give the player another optional goal to achieve.

Something I've noticed is that the existence of IVs brings about more favor for sweeping* (yet another strategy that can be used or ignored) with little to no gain given to strategic moves. From what I can see, most buffs are brought about via effects or held items, since a Pokémon's actual turn holds such a high demand for delivering the damage necessary to KO the opponent.

Is the overall battling system imbalanced? Yes. Will getting rid of IVs solve this problem? Not in the least.

EDIT:

* Sweeping in regards to single player play-through's.

Last edited by EB; December 2nd, 2013 at 01:54 PM.
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  #4    
Old November 1st, 2013, 02:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spinosaurus View Post
Had it not been for RNG abuse and hacking, IVs would have caused the Pokemon metagame to move at a snail's pace, and in a competitive environment that is a surefire way to kill it.
Hardly. RNG abuse only really came about in Diamond and Pearl, before it was utilised in Emerald etc. afterwards. The competitive metagame has been going strong since the original pokemon games.

I don't see everyone's issue with IV's. Yes, in previous games it was extremely difficult to get perfectly bred pokemon - but why is it that everyone wants to have something at their fingertips? I can tell you I felt infinitely more accomplished when I bred a 4x31 IV pokemon in D/P as opposed to how easy it is to get a flawless pokemon in X/Y.

Anyone who is remotely into the competitive aspect of pokemon is then willing to invest time and effort into it. This is just another aspect to it - and helps separate what you may have done to someone elses. Without IV's, the online metagame would be stagnant because each Gengar (for example) would be exactly the same.

If you remove IV's, the next step is removing EV's, and then any form of competitive aspect goes out the window.
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Old November 1st, 2013, 02:51 PM
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IVs are a nice little bonus and all, but they don't determine a battle. Even if you've average overall IV stats, it doesn't really matter when you're up against someone with good or perfect IVs. Battle situation, type match-up and base stats still plays a huge role.

I've played against a lot of people who claimed that they've perfect IVs and I still held my own against them and even won against some of them.
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Old November 1st, 2013, 06:22 PM
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For competitive play and to add another aspect of gameplay for those "hardcore" gamers. For me personally, I'm just OCD, so I have to to get near perfect IVs.
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Old November 29th, 2013, 09:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by molivious View Post
It was mainly there to determine hidden powers (like, literally), and uniqueness (not necessarily just shininess) of a pokemon. Bonus stats probably were the last thing on the list. It's sole purpose was to make this Rattata be different from that Rattata in one way or another. If anything, it could've been a non-stat related number. But because it was the only way to make such "uniqueness" possible, numbers had to be transmuted into stats.

Competitive users just take advantage of the bonus stats because, well, it exists; and while you do have a slight advantage by having a few higher stats, the majority of the metagame still lies on a strategic game of rock-paper-scissors. Heck, you could survive the current meta without even having to worry about that. Like, at all.

But if you wanna play as competitively as the other players with very little effort, all you have to really worry about is your Speed IV (mostly) or just some EV training or both. That speed IV is probably what affects the meta more than anything. If not, then start relying on brains instead of brawns -- you may have an even higher chance of winning.
^This pretty much. I think that main values of IV are to help determine the Hidden Ability of pokemon. While these can be manipulated by simulators, in the games it takes a lot of skills to get pokemon to have the exact values that you want.

IVs are so supposed to be the equivalent to genes in pokemon. :p
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Old November 30th, 2013, 12:01 AM
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I want them gone. Breeding/Soft Resetting for IV's isn't fun. It doesn't take much skill either it's just time consuming.
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  #9    
Old November 30th, 2013, 01:01 AM
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I think IV is an essential element for the Pokemon series. It acts as a DNA for pokemon and is the only motivation for players to do some breeding. Without IV, there will be no Pokemon Video Game Championship in the past and the series will not be continued due to lack of support for the game due to the dull mechanic formula. It makes the game feel more competitive and unique compared to other rpg.
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Old December 2nd, 2013, 12:33 PM
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What kind of game would it be if every Pokemon of the same species and the same level were identical? It's just something that makes each Pokemon unique. If you don't enjoy farming for perfect IV's (which I don't) then you really don't need to (which is why I don't). A Pokemon with a perfect IV in a particular stat has a nice little bonus, but it's hardly make or break. What makes the biggest difference is the right moveset, a carefully thought out EV spread, and the skill of the player.

To break it down, having a perfect IV in a particular stat only gives it 31 extra points at level 100 (which means 15 at level 50, 7 at level 25, etc.) Not that significant, when you really get down to it. EV's, on the other hand, add a potential 63 points to a stat, and you have far greater control over it. Moral of the story being, be happy that your Pokemon has good IV's, but don't sweat it when it has bad ones, because it's really not that big a deal.

Overall, I like them. Adds another dimension of depth to the game. And in general more depth is preferable to less, in my opinion.

If we take out IV's, what's to stop us from going to the extreme and removing EV's, and just making every Pokemon the exact same species with the exact same type and the exact same moveset? No fun in that. It's funner fighting with something that's unique from what everyone else has.
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