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-   -   Gastrodon (https://www.pokecommunity.com/showthread.php?t=106382)

Angelic Diablo September 10th, 2007 6:12 AM

Gastrodon
 
Ok, making a novelty team, because sometimes it's better to play with different pokemon sometimes, anyway this particular team has a place for Gastrodon, but I have no idea how to really use it so I'm here asking for help

I've come up with this so far...

[email protected]
Sticky Hold/Storm Drain
Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
EVs: 252 HP, 124 Def, 88 Sp Atk, 46 Sp Def
-Surf
-Recover/Swallow
-Amnesia/Stockpile
-Mirror Coat/Counter

Hmm quite the choices, I figure it needs one attacking move at least, which is why Surf is there, but the other moves I'm not so sure about

Recover gives me a consistant recovery of HP, where as Swallow is dependant on Stockpile. Amnesia sharply increases Sp Def which would help with Mirror Coat, but Stockpile increases both Defenses making it be able to tank better.

Counter is really only there because I have another on this team that can learn Mirror Coat, and I don't know whether I should have two Mirror Coaters

BlueLucario September 10th, 2007 1:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Angelic Diablo (Post 2871316)
Ok, making a novelty team, because sometimes it's better to play with different pokemon sometimes, anyway this particular team has a place for Gastrodon, but I have no idea how to really use it so I'm here asking for help

I've come up with this so far...

[email protected]
Sticky Hold/Storm Drain
Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
EVs: 252 HP, 124 Def, 88 Sp Atk, 46 Sp Def
-Surf
-Recover/Swallow
-Amnesia/Stockpile
-Mirror Coat/Counter

Hmm quite the choices, I figure it needs one attacking move at least, which is why Surf is there, but the other moves I'm not so sure about

Recover gives me a consistant recovery of HP, where as Swallow is dependant on Stockpile. Amnesia sharply increases Sp Def which would help with Mirror Coat, but Stockpile increases both Defenses making it be able to tank better.

Counter is really only there because I have another on this team that can learn Mirror Coat, and I don't know whether I should have two Mirror Coaters

Gastrodon doesnt need mirror coat due to it's high special defense. So mirror coat wont do much damage, unless the oponent uses a weak grass type move like absorb or bullet seed. Try counter, since physical defense isnt that great,but it can still take any attack thrown at it. Stockpile and Swallow is a waste, why would you need it when you have recover. I suggest you teach it earthquake, considering it's a ground type. I think amnesia is a great idea, giving gastrodon a quick boost in SP DEF. when it's high enough as it is.

Bold nature is horrible for gastrodon. I recommend the following

Modest
Gentle
Mild(i guess)
Calm
Sassy
Quiet nature.

Can you give me gastrodon's lvl and stats. I have a stat and EV calculator software on my pc. so I'll do my best to help.

BTW: If you wanna use Gastrodon in competive battling, I dont think you should have counter/mirror coat, because you can't predict what the opponent is gunna do. This is why noone uses Wobbuffet anymore.


That's all I can Give. If any1 here disagrees with me, thats okay ^_^ I have to be wrong sometime, but at least i tried to help.

Sora_8920 September 10th, 2007 1:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlueLucario (Post 2872351)
Gastrodon doesnt need mirror coat due to it's high special defense. So mirror coat wont do much damage, unless the oponent uses a weak grass type move like absorb or bullet seed. Try counter, since physical defense isnt that great,but it can still take any attack thrown at it. Stockpile and Swallow is a waste, why would you need it when you have recover. I suggest you teach it earthquake, considering it's a ground type. I think amnesia is a great idea, giving gastrodon a quick boost in SP DEF. when it's high enough as it is.

Bold nature is horrible for gastrodon. I recommend the following

Modest
Gentle
Mild(i guess)
Calm
Sassy
Quiet nature.


Can you give me gastrodon's lvl and stats. I have a stat and EV calculator software on my pc. so I'll do my best to help.

BTW: If you wanna use Gastrodon in competive battling, I dont think you should have counter/mirror coat, because you can't predict what the opponent is gunna do. This is why noone uses Wobbuffet anymore.


That's all I can Give. If any1 here disagrees with me, thats okay ^_^ I have to be wrong sometime, but at least i tried to help.

Noob. Um. Those ALL worse then his Nature.

Anti September 10th, 2007 1:45 PM

Actually, you need high special defense in order to use MC effectively. Milotic would be horrible as a mirror coater if it had 30 base special defense. Mirror coat is best on special walls, or anything that can survive one special attack.

Sora_8920 September 10th, 2007 1:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anti-Pop Culture Warrior 13 (Post 2872371)
Actually, you need high special defense in order to use MC effectively. Milotic would be horrible as a mirror coater if it had 30 base special defense. Mirror coat is best on special walls, or anything that can survive one special attack.

[COLOR="Navy"]Just a question: Then Calm would be good then? Otherwise, I don't see anything else that works on his list. [/COLOR [url-inline="showthread.php?t=88965"]go.[/url-inline]

Shiraishi September 10th, 2007 1:55 PM

Relaxed might be good if you're using EQ.

Anti September 10th, 2007 1:57 PM

The link didn't work...regardless, defense is needed to use counter and SpD to mirror coat, simpole as that. A recovery move is nice as well...

Sora_8920 September 10th, 2007 1:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anti-Pop Culture Warrior 13 (Post 2872415)
The link didn't work...regardless, defense is needed to use counter and SpD to mirror coat, simpole as that. A recovery move is nice as well...

I'm trying to get it to work. How about Recover?

BlueLucario September 10th, 2007 2:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Itachi Uchiha (Post 2872366)
Noob. Um. Those ALL worse then his Nature.

I'm not trying to argue, how is all those natures that bad when they all involve special attack and Special Defense, because that basically what gastrodon needs, I'm just reading this stat calculator i got. it also involves nature and EV's
and stuff.

And please, dont call me a noob, it isnt nice 1st of all, i'll admit i'm giving bad advice, but at least tell me why you disagree.

Oh, BTW can Gastrodon learn Calm mind? Because it would help alot it can. I'm just asking I'm not trying to go off topic.

Anti September 10th, 2007 2:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlueLucario (Post 2872485)
I'm not trying to argue, how is all those natures that bad when they all involve special attack and Special Defense, because that basically what gastrodon needs, I'm just reading this stat calculator i got. it also involves nature and EV's
and stuff.

And please, dont call me a noob, it isnt nice 1st of all, i'll admit i'm giving bad advice, but at least tell me why you disagree.

Oh, BTW can Gastrodon learn Calm mind? Because it would help alot it can. I'm just asking I'm not trying to go off topic.

Not to be a jerk, but if you're giving bad advice, don't give it. Simple as that, especially if you knew you were. You mentioned in that other thread you don't understand EVs and whatnot. Then what's the point of using a stat calculator or IV calculator that uses EVs when you don't understand them? Not trying to be annoying, I was just wondering why. And yes itachi, recover is one of the best recovery moves around. That would be great for a mirror coater.

BlueLucario September 10th, 2007 2:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anti-Pop Culture Warrior 13 (Post 2872518)
Not to be a jerk, but if you're giving bad advice, don't give it. Simple as that, especially if you knew you were. You mentioned in that other thread you don't understand EVs and whatnot. Then what's the point of using a stat calculator or IV calculator that uses EVs when you don't understand them? Not trying to be annoying, I was just wondering why. And yes itachi, recover is one of the best recovery moves around. That would be great for a mirror coater.

No, your not being a jerk.

I didnt know I was giving bad advice. sigh,I'm just read stats calcs, so i can see what stats an individual pokemon has. I'm sorry if I did. I knew right away what gastrodon's stats are since i got one myself. and I knew how to use it.

I'm not saying recover is bad, but doesnt it hurt you in the long run, in case gastrodon take serious damage, like it has 150HP and some pokemon uses a physical attack and it's HP goes down to like 42. If it uses recover it recovers half it's HP, so it recover 75HP. It goes up to 117, but if that pokemon uses the same move, the HP of Gastrodon goes down to lower than the amount a hit points gastrodon had left before it used recover the first time(I'm not making it up, this happened before.Giga Impact?,Earthquake, breave bird?) for Gastrodon's Awesome Defense Power, I think Recover is a great move, not only does it help, it probably will annoy the opponent.

I'm saying this Hypothetically.

I'm curious to know why you give Gastrodon a nature that involves Physical stats, when it's already bad enough. I thought it's a SpecialWall/Special Sweeper, and that's what its good for. Why physical attacks.

Shiraishi September 10th, 2007 2:52 PM

Gastrodon is great in UU/BL because of Recover. If you think hes going to take serious damage, switch em out. No1 really makes him stay on a physical hit anyways.

Anti September 10th, 2007 2:53 PM

I;m no gastrodon expert, so somebady else can help with that. I do know a few things about battling, and can tell you that if your opponents are using giga impact, you must have some pathetic competition. Competitive battling is serious business, especailly with the best battlers like AB.

Sora_8920 September 10th, 2007 2:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlueLucario (Post 2872615)
No, your not being a jerk.

I didnt know I was giving bad advice. sigh,I'm just read stats calcs, so i can see what stats an individual pokemon has. I'm sorry if I did. I knew right away what gastrodon's stats are since i got one myself. and I knew how to use it.

I'm not saying recover is bad, but doesnt it hurt you in the long run, in case gastrodon take serious damage, like it has 150HP and some pokemon uses a physical attack and it's HP goes down to like 42. If it uses recover it recovers half it's HP, so it recover 75HP. It goes up to 117, but if that pokemon uses the same move, the HP of Gastrodon goes down to lower than the amount a hit points gastrodon had left before it used recover the first time(I'm not making it up, this happened before.Giga Impact?,Earthquake, breave bird?) for Gastrodon's Awesome Defense Power, I think Recover is a great move, not only does it help, it probably will annoy the opponent.

I'm saying this Hypothetically.

I'm curious to know why you give Gastrodon a nature that involves Physical stats, when it's already bad enough. I thought it's a SpecialWall/Special Sweeper, and that's what its good for. Why physical attacks.

This is a good moveset:

Gastrodon @:Leftovers
Trait: Sticky Hold
Bold/Relaxed Nature
Surf
Ice Beam/Earthquake
Recover
Mirror Coat two moves for Stab, (Earthquake and Surf). Recover and Mirror Coat are obvious. Well just to show an example of strategy.

Shiraishi September 10th, 2007 2:57 PM

150 base power will still make Gastro do some damage.

Samson September 10th, 2007 3:02 PM

Gastrodon @ Leftovers/Lum Berry
Bold Nature
Ability: Stick Hold
252 HP/88 SP ATK/168 DEF
-Surf
-Yawn
-Protect
-Counter

yawn + protect to force a switch or induce sleep, an the rest is self explanatory.

really a lousy poke.

BlueLucario September 10th, 2007 3:19 PM

That still doesnt answer my question as to why Gastro is being givin natures involving physical stats, which is not what it's built for. But isnt it's SP DEF to high for mirror coat to be useful

Sora_8920 September 10th, 2007 3:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlueLucario (Post 2872766)
That still doesnt answer my question as to why Gastro is being givin natures involving physical stats, which is not what it's built for. But isnt it's SP DEF to high for mirror coat to be useful

go. Go there, please. It's for nature help.

Anti September 10th, 2007 3:27 PM

You aren't listening. To use mirror coat, you MUST have at least decent special defense. For the millionth time, you'll get OHKOed if you don't give it special defense. EQ with STAB is still decent, 150 base power, as Cakekun said. We have answered your question, you just aren't listening to the answer. Let's say you have a pokemon similar to steelix, only with amazing special defense. It has 200 HP, and 400 Special defense. Your opponent sends out specsmence...joy. Yopu choose mirror coat, which always attacks last. Mence uses draco meteor, putting you down to 30 HP (this isn't exact BTW). You then use mirror coat, OHKOing Specsmence inflicting 340 HP, double that of the 170 damage inflicted. However, if you have 250 Special defense, you get OHKOed. There's my example. THAT is why mirror coat needs a special defense poke, like milotic.

Sora_8920 September 10th, 2007 3:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anti-Pop Culture Warrior 13 (Post 2872823)
You aren't listening. To use mirror coat, you MUST have at least decent special defense. For the millionth time, you'll get OHKOed if you don't give it special defense. EQ with STAB is still decent, 150 base power, as Cakekun said. We have answered your question, you just aren't listening to the answer. Let's say you have a pokemon similar to steelix, only with amazing special defense. It has 200 HP, and 400 Special defense. Your opponent sends out specsmence...joy. Yopu choose mirror coat, which always attacks last. Mence uses draco meteor, putting you down to 30 HP (this isn't exact BTW). You then use mirror coat, OHKOing Specsmence inflicting 340 HP, double that of the 170 damage inflicted. However, if you have 250 Special defense, you get OHKOed. There's my example. THAT is why mirror coat needs a special defense poke, like milotic.

Ev's: 232 sp. def/116 def/152 hp.

Anti September 10th, 2007 3:33 PM

Wait, that was a hypothetical example...or are you talking about gastrodon? If you want to use the best mirror coater, use milotic, or even blastoise works. Don't forget about cradily...but please read my last post...

Sora_8920 September 10th, 2007 3:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anti-Pop Culture Warrior 13 (Post 2872870)
Wait, that was a hypothetical example...or are you talking about gastrodon? If you want to use the best mirror coater, use milotic, or even blastoise works. Don't forget about cradily...but please read my last post...

Yeah. I was talking about Gatrodon's ev's. Cradily: Careful Nature Ev's 216 hp/156 def/128 sp.def

Samson September 10th, 2007 3:40 PM

i don't understand what you guys are arguing about. gastrodon has the stats to pull off mirror coat, but it doesn't have the typing. it can't survive an energy ball/grass knot regardless of how many evs it's given. it's typing does make it a formidable physical tank however, and with enough evs in the right places, it can survive a Close Combat from Scarf Cross and Counter it.

that's the whole idea to counter on Gastrodon. you bring it in after one of your pokes faint from a physical sweeper and bring it in with the intention of countering.

Gastrodon can utilize Choice Band/Specs if you're desperate to use it, but otherwise, what i posted is all it can really do.

Anti September 10th, 2007 3:40 PM

Cradily's EVs depend greatly on its moveset. The special wall cradily is my favorite, but mixed wall crad works great as well.

EDIT: I'm trying to show him why special defense is needed to pull off mirror coat at the moment. One grass attack and BOOM! You're right Samson...I'd just use something else if I were him.

Azonic September 10th, 2007 5:30 PM

Stockpile moves suck. Just use Recover, it uses two turns to restore FULL HP, while Stockpile/Swallow takes 4 turns to restore full HP


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