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-   -   4th Gen Legends - Real or not? (https://www.pokecommunity.com/showthread.php?t=114650)

Live in Color November 10th, 2007 4:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Midnight Winged (Post 3065008)
Latios had a father in the movie if Im corect, meaning not legendaries, just powerfull and rare.

And yet they are classified as legendary.

Also didn't one of the Frontier Brains use an Articuno to battle Ash's Charizard? Would that have been a second Articuno, because I doubt it can fly fast enough to get around the world in seconds...

Xoo November 10th, 2007 5:12 AM

Me too, but I'm kinda leaning toward two Articuno. But, there have been multiple Latios before, so...

MegaMushroom07 November 10th, 2007 7:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EmpoleMew (Post 3063860)
Okay, my theory is this:

Spoiler:
When the universe came to be, Arceus was hatched from this aforementioned egg. It created Mew to create all other Pokemon. From Mew and Arceus decended Dialga and Palkia to start time flow and shape the planets of the universe. From Dialga decended Celebi who travels through time to keep things in balance and if it meets a pure-hearted person, give them a chance to fix a tragedy. (Reference-Pokemon Chronicles episode Celebi and Joy!) From Palkia decended Groudon and Regigigas. Groudon shaped the land of the earth while Regigigas broke them apart into continents. (Possible Pokemon explaination for the Continental Drift.) Kyogre was created as an opposite to Groudon so that the ocean could be. From Kyogre decended Lugia and Manaphy. After Kyogre and Groudon's struggle for power, when they fell into their sleep, Lugia took over as the ruler of the sea. Manaphy in turn, became next in line in case Lugia were to fall incapable of its job. (Thus the title Prince of the Sea) After this turn of events, Regigigas created Regirock, Registeel, and Regice as beacons if one of these beings were to awaken and overpower the other. Regigigas in turn, fell into a petrified state and could only be awakened by the beacons assembling around him. The Regi trio was scattered in Hoenn's off locations where a disturbance could be detected through that 1/3 of the area. From the power of the beacons, Rayquaza was born as the balance keeper. The Regi trio would send a telepathic alert to Rayquaza if Kyogre and Groudon would fight again. From the Regi trio decended the Legendary Birds and Dogs. Though not serving the same purpose as the beacons, these trios served their own role. The birds would awaken the ruler of the sea, Lugia, if the balance in nature was disrupted. The dogs would awaken Ho-oh if the world should be tainted with evil on an enormous scale. (Colloseum plot anybody?) Ho-oh decended from Mew and Arceus as ruler of the sky and keeper of peace in the world. Thus, the peace keeper Pokemon themselves, the Togepi family line decended from Ho-oh. From Mew decended Cresslia and from Arceus, Darkrai to control the phases of the moon. Cresslia was given the power to create plesant dreams while Darkrai gives out nightmares. Darkrai sometimes got carried away and put people in endless nightmares to please itself. Only Cresslia's Lunar Wing had the power to expel these bad dreams. Heatran was once a common Pokemon but has recently died out and few still exist. (Explaination for Heatran having a gender. However, it was unable to produce eggs due to its species becoming extinct. Ditto could not breed with it because of its akward organ posistions. O.O) At one point, Dialga and Palkia got out of control and the Psy Bros were created as Mew's children. They also represent the greatest qualities of human and Pokemon existance. (Willpower, Wisdom, and Emotions.) Shaymin was created to bring plants into the world. From Shaymin decended the grass type population. Giratina was created to rule the afterlife. When all Pokemon die, their spirits go to Turnback Cave and live in the alternate dimension. From Giratina and the souls of deceased Pokemon decended the ghost type. Mewtwo was one of the two human-made Pokemon, the other being Porygon and its upgrades. (Pun intended)


I may have missed a few but that's my theory.

I'm sure that this is from gamespot...

Shiny Umbreon November 10th, 2007 7:45 AM

OK. This is a little offtopic. Rather than just defining each legendary's supposed occupation, we should be doubting about some.

For example, I don't know if Manaphy can do something special, but I think it can't. And Lugia is, well, a Psychic-type with Water-type moves but not really something important for the sea. On the other hand, I do believe Kyogre has control over the water. We've seen a lot in R/S/E.

MegaMushroom07 November 10th, 2007 7:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shiny Umbreon (Post 3066710)
OK. This is a little offtopic. Rather than just defining each legendary's supposed occupation, we should be doubting about some.

For example, I don't know if Manaphy can do something special, but I think it can't. And Lugia is, well, a Psychic-type with Water-type moves but not really something important for the sea. On the other hand, I do believe Kyogre has control over the water. We've seen a lot in R/S/E.

I think that Kyogre made the water, Lugia controls the sea, whilst Suicune is responsible for purifying it.

Nacon November 10th, 2007 11:19 AM

I still don't get why you guys feel or think that all the legends tie into a global think in the pokemon universe....

I still really feel that these legends are regional.

Shiny Umbreon November 10th, 2007 12:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nacon (Post 3067448)
I still don't get why you guys feel or think that all the legends tie into a global think in the pokemon universe....

I still really feel that these legends are regional.

Well, that's not applicable in some cases. How can Kyogre create only part of the sea (the one in Hoenn). If he made the sea, who made the rest of the sea?

That's just an example. But I agree that in some cases, Pokémon can't take care of all the world.

Nacon November 10th, 2007 12:05 PM

regions= different mythologies.... why would Kyogre be so important in R\S\E and yet not mentioned in LGFR or D\P

Shiny Umbreon November 10th, 2007 12:11 PM

Good point.

But does this mean that, if nobody in Kanto mentions Kyogre, it's not true that it really made the sea?

So Kyogre and Groudon's powers are most likely just imaginary.

Nacon November 10th, 2007 12:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shiny Umbreon (Post 3067664)
Good point.

But does this mean that, if nobody in Kanto mentions Kyogre, it's not true that it really made the sea?

So Kyogre and Groudon's powers are most likely just imaginary.

if you want to get scientific about it.....

Kyogre and Groudon are a physical depiction of the constant changes in the land and sea.
Erosion makes oceans seem bigger at the expense of land, and land has constant eruptions and tectonic movements that alter the land masses. In my opinion, because of their powers and abillities, people (of the Hoenn region) feel that they are godlike.

Groudon, like I said, represents changes in landmass, his abillity causes Sunny Day to go into effect, and we all know that hot sunlight evaporates water. Its moveset and abillities go to show that it can impact the land... but even a Diglett impacts the changes in land with the tunnels it digs...

Kyogre represents changes in oceanfront, and his abillity causes it to Rain constantly. We all know how rain redistrubutes moisture and creates puddles in the land. Its moveset even goes to show that it impacts changes in the water, but all it really does in terms of the water is shift it around... but even a Magikarp shifts the water when it splashes.

Groudon and Kyogre are a check and balance to eachother, and as a result, depict the cycle of land mass changes and oceanfront changes.

Rayquaza, I know I have to mention him to get this to work, is a powerful depiction of the constantness of SKY.... not matter how much it rains, volcanic eruptions, earthquakes... no matter how these things change the surface, the SKY still looks the same. Rayquaza is a powerful pokemon that depicts the constant steadiness of the sky. When it battled with Deoxys, it was battling an extraterrestial being, and that is similar to how our planet's atmosphere burns down meteors, and even deflects them. Its moveset revolves around elemental aspects of the sky. And besides... even if it is raining, if one was to go further up, ABOVE the clouds, the skies are clear.

I mean, in the literal sense... what are Groudon, Kyogre and Rayquaza? They are an Armadillo, a Whale, and a Chinese Dragon (the snake like, flying appearance versus the Medieval Europe Lizard like appearance similar to Salamence). These creatures themselves are capable of things out of the typical. I know that comparing a Chinese Dragon in terms of realism fails because it is a mythological creature, but an Armadillo... it's a very durable animal that can survive in various conditions, and a Whale, well... it's a mammal that lives at sea, it is vast in terms of its appetite, and it constatly travels all over the world.


Mythology and Religion create explanations to things that we don't quite understand until science comes into effect and these pokes are so powerful that the ancestors felt they were godlike.... and we definitely saw that when they battled, the way it impacted that part of the world.



In the real world, some religions feel that certain animals are depictions of things, sacred, and possess holy abillities..... like Cats in Egypt being guardians of the underworld... Cows possessing the womb of life... and so on... and yet, once again, these were regional beliefs.... in one part of the world, we're slicing up cows to make meats, in another part, we pray to them... hmm....

Shiny Umbreon November 12th, 2007 5:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nacon (Post 3067782)
if you want to get scientific about it.....

Kyogre and Groudon are a physical depiction of the constant changes in the land and sea.
Erosion makes oceans seem bigger at the expense of land, and land has constant eruptions and tectonic movements that alter the land masses. In my opinion, because of their powers and abillities, people (of the Hoenn region) feel that they are godlike.

Groudon, like I said, represents changes in landmass, his abillity causes Sunny Day to go into effect, and we all know that hot sunlight evaporates water. Its moveset and abillities go to show that it can impact the land... but even a Diglett impacts the changes in land with the tunnels it digs...

Kyogre represents changes in oceanfront, and his abillity causes it to Rain constantly. We all know how rain redistrubutes moisture and creates puddles in the land. Its moveset even goes to show that it impacts changes in the water, but all it really does in terms of the water is shift it around... but even a Magikarp shifts the water when it splashes.

Groudon and Kyogre are a check and balance to eachother, and as a result, depict the cycle of land mass changes and oceanfront changes.

Rayquaza, I know I have to mention him to get this to work, is a powerful depiction of the constantness of SKY.... not matter how much it rains, volcanic eruptions, earthquakes... no matter how these things change the surface, the SKY still looks the same. Rayquaza is a powerful pokemon that depicts the constant steadiness of the sky. When it battled with Deoxys, it was battling an extraterrestial being, and that is similar to how our planet's atmosphere burns down meteors, and even deflects them. Its moveset revolves around elemental aspects of the sky. And besides... even if it is raining, if one was to go further up, ABOVE the clouds, the skies are clear.

I mean, in the literal sense... what are Groudon, Kyogre and Rayquaza? They are an Armadillo, a Whale, and a Chinese Dragon (the snake like, flying appearance versus the Medieval Europe Lizard like appearance similar to Salamence). These creatures themselves are capable of things out of the typical. I know that comparing a Chinese Dragon in terms of realism fails because it is a mythological creature, but an Armadillo... it's a very durable animal that can survive in various conditions, and a Whale, well... it's a mammal that lives at sea, it is vast in terms of its appetite, and it constatly travels all over the world.


Mythology and Religion create explanations to things that we don't quite understand until science comes into effect and these pokes are so powerful that the ancestors felt they were godlike.... and we definitely saw that when they battled, the way it impacted that part of the world.



In the real world, some religions feel that certain animals are depictions of things, sacred, and possess holy abillities..... like Cats in Egypt being guardians of the underworld... Cows possessing the womb of life... and so on... and yet, once again, these were regional beliefs.... in one part of the world, we're slicing up cows to make meats, in another part, we pray to them... hmm....

That'd be okay if we had seen cats or cows do something special in the real world. They don't summon rain or sunlight, right?

Nacon November 12th, 2007 5:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shiny Umbreon (Post 3076185)
That'd be okay if we had seen cats or cows do something special in the real world. They don't summon rain or sunlight, right?

yea... last time I checked....none of my 3 cats did much of ANYTHING.. except puke, purr, vomit, eat and sleep....

I figured I'd use those as examples to support the region- based mythology theory.

Shiny Umbreon November 12th, 2007 5:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nacon (Post 3076190)
yea... last time I checked....none of my 3 cats did much of ANYTHING.. except puke, purr, vomit, eat and sleep....

I figured I'd use those as examples to support the region- based mythology theory.

OK. I agree with that. Probably Sandslash doesn't get that much attention in Kanto but Groudon is a god-like beast in Hoenn. Except that Groudon does have some sort of power.

But I'm thinking about Latias. It could supposedly become invisible and everything, but it's just a special something (what was it? down?). Maybe Kyogre and Groudon do have some power (they're big and powerful, at least) and people have started to exaggerate about it and treat them as what the legends say they are.

Nacon November 12th, 2007 5:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shiny Umbreon (Post 3076209)
OK. I agree with that. Probably Sandslash doesn't get that much attention in Kanto but Groudon is a god-like beast in Hoenn. Except that Groudon does have some sort of power.

But I'm thinking about Latias. It could supposedly become invisible and everything, but it's just a special something (what was it? down?). Maybe Kyogre and Groudon do have some power (they're big and powerful, at least) and people have started to exaggerate about it and treat them as what the legends say they are.

yea very true... because legends are founded on some truth... time does have a tendency to distort things.

think about in our world, how Achilles was such a great, seemingly invincible warrior.

Shiny Umbreon November 12th, 2007 5:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nacon (Post 3076219)
think about in our world, how Achilles was such a great, seemingly invincible warrior.

Sorry, what's that? I don't know.

Nacon November 12th, 2007 5:36 PM

a great warrior, the Hero of the Trojan war:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Achilles

"Achilles has the attributes of being the most handsome of the heroes assembled at Troy,[1] as well as the quickest. Central to his myth is his relationship with Patroclus, characterized in different sources as either deep friendship or passionate love.

Later legends (beginning with a poem by Statius in the first century AD) state that Achilles was invulnerable on all of his body except for his heel. These legends state that Achilles was killed in battle by an arrow to the heel, and so an Achilles' heel has come to mean a person's only weakness. Achilles' death came in retribution for a sacrilege he had previously committed, his decapitation of Troilus upon an altar-omphalos of Apollo."


Greek Mythology.... some of my favorite... lol.

Shiny Umbreon November 12th, 2007 5:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nacon (Post 3076236)
a great warrior, the Hero of the Trojan war:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Achilles

"Achilles has the attributes of being the most handsome of the heroes assembled at Troy,[1] as well as the quickest. Central to his myth is his relationship with Patroclus, characterized in different sources as either deep friendship or passionate love.

Later legends (beginning with a poem by Statius in the first century AD) state that Achilles was invulnerable on all of his body except for his heel. These legends state that Achilles was killed in battle by an arrow to the heel, and so an Achilles' heel has come to mean a person's only weakness. Achilles' death came in retribution for a sacrilege he had previously committed, his decapitation of Troilus upon an altar-omphalos of Apollo."


Greek Mythology.... some of my favorite... lol.

Lol, I knew about him. Just that I couldn't identify the name in English. At first, I thought it was an animal or something. XD

Nacon November 12th, 2007 5:39 PM

oh alrighty... haha... it happens....

that's another example in terms of legends.... mistranslations can turn a "mighty" warrior into a "descendant of God" warrior

Shiny Umbreon November 12th, 2007 5:44 PM

Okay, then should we accept that Kygore and Groudon (and Rayquaza maybe) have some sort of scientifically-provable power that everyone in Hoenn think is some sort of divine powers? And I guess this can be true for some others, too.

Nacon November 12th, 2007 5:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shiny Umbreon (Post 3076269)
Okay, then should we accept that Kygore and Groudon (and Rayquaza maybe) have some sort of scientifically-provable power that everyone in Hoenn think is some sort of divine powers? And I guess this can be true for some others, too.

you know what... yea... I agree with that..

These 3 pokes have power and strength that can impact the land and water while I still feel strongly that Rayquaza depicts the constantness of the skies.

besides... the word Divine does not necessarily mean "godlike"... it can
also mean "of superhuman or surpassing excellence"... that's what the dictionary states.

these pokemon are significantly powerful, more powerful than humans and a capable of free-thought, or at least not giving into human requests.

EvanMiesterX November 13th, 2007 2:18 PM

well here is my idea on arceus and its plates... well, arceus apparently created the universe with its thousand arms. maybe arceus had a thousand arms, maybe it was more powerful, and maybe it had enough power to create the universe, but it was too powerful. it had to stop itself from becoming too powerful, because power leads to evilness (i think) and so it took its power and transferred them into plates, which enchanted them. one plate for every type, one plate for every thing that he created. so it might have, at one point, been every type, much stronger, and much more powerful. as for mew and arceus, maybe mew created arceus at the same time arceus created the universe. it would have been like this: mew creates arceus as arceus creates mew, along with the universe. thats just what i think...

Shiny Umbreon November 13th, 2007 2:23 PM

"Power leads to evil"? That's true for humanity only, I think.

I'm not sure if Arceus and Mew can exist in the same theory, but, really, Arceus making the world? There's no such thing. I know its power it's now divided in plates but it's just something that will never happen, in my opinion.

Pokemon Diamond November 13th, 2007 2:25 PM

Palkia, Dialga, and the 3 Spirits would go into space and make a real Pokemon world. Day by day, children/adults/seniors would go to the Pokemon Island to start a pokemon journey.

Shiny Umbreon November 13th, 2007 2:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pokemon Diamond (Post 3078517)
Palkia, Dialga, and the 3 Spirits would go into space and make a real Pokemon world. Day by day, children/adults/seniors would go to the Pokemon Island to start a pokemon journey.

Sorry, but what are you talking about?

MegaMushroom07 November 13th, 2007 3:06 PM

Mmmm......I think Arceus' plates have some significance...as if it's power was shattered...

Pokemon Diamond, I don't understand. Your post makes no sense at all.


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