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How to Write a RMT Post
I'm seeing more and more often badly written RMT posts, with no thought given to the Pokemon chosen or their moves. So in an effort to help encourage better battling, I give you this guide on how to write a Rate My Team thread.
I will try and make it as simple as possible, because the world of competitive battling is difficult at the best of times. Do not ask people to make you a team. This is pretty basic. The whole point of RMT threads is that they are designed to help you fix your complete team, not for someone to make a team for you. There is a sticky entitled 'Request a team' for that purpose, and all request posts serve is to clutter up the forum. Also, 'Rate My Team' does not mean a rating out of 10. What can a number tell you about how bad or good your team is? Request a Team Now that this is out the way, let me give you an example of how to write a Pokemon's data so it can be rated fairly. Pokemon name @ Item held Ability (if there is more than one ability possible, this choice can sometimes be crucial) EV (for more information on Effort Values, see this sticky - Compiled Guides) Nature - the Pokemon's nature - Move 1 - Move 2 - Move 3 - Move 4 Although this format doesn't need to be followed exactly, something similar to this is both visually appealing and gives the rater all the information they need to properly assess your Pokemon. Trying to squeeze all the information onto one or two lines looks cluttered and is often difficult to read. I will give you an example, here is my Starmie. Starmie @ Choice Specs Ability: Natural Cure EV: 4 HP / 252 SpAtt / 252 Speed Nature: Timid - Surf - Ice Beam - Thunderbolt - Grass Knot This is a pretty clear way of getting your data across, and is the format used by both NetBattle and Shoddybattle. After you have given the basic data of your Pokemon, you can add some notes below as to why you have chosen the combination of moves, item, EVs, nature and ability. Most raters are familiar with at least the standard movesets, so they can often recognise straight away what you are aiming to do with your Pokemon. Commenting on this is usually space wasting. Instead, I encourage you to analyse your move choice. Grass Knot may seem an odd choice for Starmie at first glance, but it is there to give you an easy time with dealing with Swampert (Quagsire and Whiscash are all hurt heaviily by this move too, although they are less commonly seen). You can even comment on your EV choice, if you have access to a damage calculator (I recommend Metalkid's to be pretty accurate, quick and easy to use), you can include some damage formula for attacks, or taking certain attacks from certain Pokemon. Metalkid's Damage Calculator Swampert for example often has EVed it's HP to have 401 exactly, this may seem an odd choice, but this gives you the ability to survive 4 Seismic Toss attacks from Blissey, or 5 with Leftovers as a held item. The fourth (or fifth) attack with always get you to 1 HP, just enough to get that extra sneaky attack in. You can include IVs in your analysis if this is for an in-game wifi team, although this is not necessarily seen it can give an even deeper analysis Say you had 31 IV in Speed for Starmie, you can just go ahead and max it's Speed, or give it enough to just outspeed Gengar, saving you more EV for other purposes. This conservation of EV can often be crucial in giving you extra survivability, or better attack in the case of mixed sweepers. Speaking of which, I should give you a general idea of what a team actually needs. The general concensus of a balanced team suggests you have at least the following: 1 special sweeper 1 physical sweeper 1 special wall 1 physical wall 1 Rapid Spin user A way to deal with Sleep move users, either by Insomnia, Natural Cure, Aromatherapy or Heal Bell, or by using Sleep Talk on a Pokemon and absorb the sleep move for your team. A first strike move like Fake Out, Quck Attack, to deal with low health things which normally outspeed you Some Pokemon can fill multiple roles, for example Forretress can be both a physical wall and a Rapid Spin user. Bronzong can take the role of a tank, which is effectively a wall for both physical and special moves. While we are here, let's define what the roles are: Physical Sweeper: Anything with a high Attack stat, or a way to boost it's Attack stat and attack with massive damage, and often coupled with high Speed to get highly damaging physical moves at your foes. Weavile is an example of a physical sweeper. Special Sweeper: Anything with a high Special Attack stat, or a way to boost it's SpAtt and attack with massive damage, and often coupled with a high Speed ot get highly damaging special moves at your foes. Alakazam is an example of a special sweeper. Mixed Sweeper: Something with the capability of doing heavy damage with both physical and special moves. Infernape is an example of a mixed sweeper. Physical Wall: Anything capable of taking physical hits for your team, in order to give your team some survival or force a switch. Often walls have a health recovery move to give them lasting power. Skarmory is an example of a physical wall. Special Wall: Anything capable of taking special hits for your team, in order to give your team some survival or force a switch. Often walls have a health recovery move to give them lasting power. Blissey is an example of a special wall. Tank: Something able to absorb hits from both physical and special hits. Bronzong is an example of a tank. Cleric: Something with the ability to support the team with healing and recovery moves, more specifically Wish, Heal Bell and Aromatherapy. Blissey is an example of a Cleric. Those are the general roles a team member can play. As for the case of Rapid Spin, a common selection of moves are Spikes, Stealth Rock and Toxic Spikes, which can do serious damage over time (especially if you are forced to switch). The use of Rapid Spin can be negated if you have a way of dealing with these moves. Steels and Poison types can come in on Toxic Spikes, Flying types and those with Levitate can ignore Spikes. Steelix for example has a 4 x resistance to Rock which significantly reduces the damage done from Stealth Rock. By keeping these three moves in your mind, you may not need Rapid Spin if you balance your team right, but it's much easier to get rid of them so you can get certain things in. Ninjask for example has a 4 x weakness to Rock, so in order to get him in safely you need a Rapid Spinner to eliminate Stealth Rock, otherwise he loses half his health just by switching in. Tiers While we may not like to admit it, some Pokemon are far better than others when it comes to battling. This is where the idea of tiers come in. A tier is a group of Pokemon that can battle each other fairly, and not generally be completely outclassed by others in the same tier. The most common tier in battling is OU, or overused, although there are many other tiers which are used to give all fully evolved Pokemon an environment in which they can battle without fear of being hopelessly outclassed. The list of main tiers are below: OU - Overused pokemon, pokemon that have very good stats, yet aren't uber BL - Borderline pokemon, pokemon in the crossfire between OU and UU UU - Underused, pokemon that aren't seen commonly NU - Not Used, pokemon that are almost never used on teams There is also another tier, called the uber tier. This is where the most powerful legendaries battle on a level playing field, so you can give your Mewtwo or Deoxys some love without fear of being told not to use it, since your opponent also has them too. Some non-legendary Pokemon are seen in ubers which are generally not seen in the OU tier (Shedinja for example), but many of these take advantage of the Drought and Drizzle abilities of Groudon and Kyogre (using Swift Swim or Chlorophyll). Just to be clear, here is a list of what legendary Pokemon are considered uber, and what are considered OU. Uber legendaries: Mew, Mewtwo, Lugia, Ho-oh, Latias and Latios (if holding the item Soul Dew, OU otherwise), Groudon, Kyogre, Rayquaza, Deoxys (all forms), Dialga, Palkia, Darkrai, Arceus, Manaphy OU legendaries: Articuno, Zapdos, Moltres, Entei, Suicune, Raikou, Celebi, Regirock, Regice, Registeel, Jirachi, Azelf, Uxie, Mesprit, Heatran, Regigigas, Phione, Shaymin Not all legendaries are too powerful to be used in normal (OU) battles, but some are. So, you can use some legendaries, and they can use them on you and they won't be overpowered compared to the non-legendary Pokemon with similar or higher stats (Tyranitar, Salamence, Dragonite for example). What NOT to use This section is for the things you think are a good idea, but will not work in competitive battliing. These are not just idle choices, they are either easy to exploit choices, or just plain bad ones. For example, let's start with the most common one I see: Two moves of the same type This seems like a good idea at first, right? Say I have a Ninetales with both Flamethrower and Fire Blast. Since both moves are getting STAB they are bound to do more damage, right? Well, sure over somethng without STAB. But a Pokemon can only learn four moves. Giving a Pokemon at least one STAB move is a good idea since you can get more damage out of it, but why would you need a second one? For extra PP? Not really, you are more likely to be KOed than run out of PP, unless you are facing a stall team. For extra power? Well, the things weak to Fire Blast are the same things that are weak to Flamethrower. Generally, the idea of two moves of the same type are redundant. Ninetales doesn't need two Fire moves, it can do fine with just one. Because you have a limited move selection, you want to maximise your move choice and cover all the things that can hurt Ninetales significantly. There are a few special cases, in the case of trapping moves like Magma Storm, Whirlpool, Fire Spin, etc, you want the other move for the trapping effect rather than the damage, so it is ok to have a second STAB move to do damage. Also, having status moves is a good idea with an offensive attack. You can have Jolteon with Thunder Wave and Thunderbolt, for example, both electric moves but accomplishing different things. Also, it is generally the best idea to pick the most damaging attack, although you want to get as close to 100% accuracy as you can. It's no good having an attack if it misses a lot. So, Confusion is a bad choice on Alakazam, as is Psybeam, but Psychic is the most powerful, and is 100% accurate. The choice between power vs accuracy is a difficult one to answer, because there are many situations where either move is better. For example, something with low SpAtt would want Fire Blast to compensate, despite the accuracy. Many mixed sweepers tend to focus on one of the attacking stats and cover the other side with a high powered, low accuracy move, to get heavy damage on both sides. A Primeape with both Cross Chop and Overheat is an example of this. Also be sure to check whether a move is physical or special. Some Pokemon have high Att but low SpAtt, and the other way around, so they can use some attacks effectively for high damage but not others. For example, Gyarados has high Att but low SpAtt, so the idea is to use physical Water moves on him to get more damage. Waterfall is a good choice, as is Aqua Tail, since they are both physical and have high base power. Surf and Hydro Pump are bad choices, since they are special attacks, so don't use them despite the higher power. Hyper Beam type moves There are many moves which do extremely high damage, but force you to skip your next turn. These moves are: Hyper Beam, Giga Impact, Frenzy Plant, Blast Burn, Hydro Cannon and Roar of Time. All of these moves have base power 150, accuracy 90, but force you to skip the turn after using them. Let me put this in bold so you are absolutely clear: These are BAD moves! Now, at first glance 150 power seems like a good idea right? That's almost twice the power of a standard move, like say Flamethrower, so you should do loads of damage with them. Right? Well, actually no. Since you are forced into delaying your next turn, you are in effect doing 75 base damage each turn (150/2). Flamethower has a power of 95, which compared with two attack of Flamethrower vs one attack of Blast Burn, the opponent is suffering a lot more damage: 95 x 2 = 190. There. 190. One hundred and ninety. Almost a third EXTRA DAMAGE than what Blast Burn would do in the same number of turns. Also, since you are forced to just sit there for one turn and do nothing, you give your opponent a free turn to play with. He could do more damage to your Pokemon while you just sit there, he could switch to an appropriate counter for that Pokemon, he could use support moves like Wish to give his team extra healing. Granting your opponent time to do things like heal is a bad thing, since if you'd just attacked he may not have had the time to heal. Fly, Dig and Dive For the same reasons as given in the last paragraph, these three moves are also bad moves. You give your opponent a free turn, he can do more than you can. Also, these moves don't have the power (Fly being the obvious exception at base 90 power, but still makes you waste a turn) to do significant damage like some other moves (Earthquake is more damaging than Dig for example). These moves give your opponent more than ever an opportunity to switch to a counter, or something that resists or is immune to your attack. Also, there are moves that do more damage while you are wasting your turn, Thunder and Sky Uppercut for example does more damage to you while you are using Fly. Items Ok, there are a lot of items to choose from, but what are the best ones for my Pokemon? Charcoal? Fist Plate? How about a Occa Berry for my Forretress to reduce Fire damage? Well, the first thing is to see what not to use. This includes: Any Plate items (except in the case of Arceus, if/when he is ever released). These provide a 20% boost to one attack type, which gives you poor coverage with the other three moves. Boosting items like Charcoal, Miracle Seed. Thses give you a 10% boost to one attack type, which is worse than the Plates. Generally you want to match the item to what your Pokemon's role is. Walls or tanks usually need Leftovers, or if you are using Item Clause rules, Black Sludge, to give them extra healing and lasting ability. Physical attackers can make use of Choice Band, Special attackers can make use of Choice Specs, and both can make use of Choice Scarf. Many berries can be used. Life Orb is useful for giving you variety of moves with extra power, although it does have another drawback, you suffer 10% recoil damage. Wide Lens can give you extra accuracy if you want to get more use out of low accuracy, high power moves like Focus Blast, orlow accuracy status effects like Hypnosis. Muscle Belt gives you extra damage for physical attacks, and Wise Glasses does the same for special moves. Expert Belt gives you extra damage on supereffective hits. Toxic Orb and Life Orb give you a status effect straight away, which may seem useless at first but gives you instant use of abilites that are affected by status like Guts. On the case of Flame Orb, there is a common misconception. While the Burn status reduces your attack, Guts raises your attack while you suffer from status. In the previous generation the attack drop from Burn was negated and you just got the attack boost from Guts, but in D/P this is not the case, the two merely cancel each other out. Finally on the subject of items, let's talk about moves that affect items, namely Trick and Switcheroo. Both of these moves swap your held item with that of your opponent. The idea is to give your opponent an item that will render it either useless or severely hampered. Alakazam is a noted user of this move, because it is fast, and can sometimes be seen holding a Choice Band (a strange choice at first since he has low Att but high SpAtt). The idea is to get something that needs to use all of its moves to effectively work, and give it the Choice Band using Trick while they lose their held item. This forces for example Blissey to become useless, since it has lost it's Leftovers and cannot switch between Seismic Toss and Softboiled to stay alive and attack. The move Knock Off removes your opponents held item for the rest of the battle, so it always a useful move to consider. Threat elimination This section is possibly the most important when considering your team selection and moves etc. You need to know what you are facing so you can effectively prepare your team to beat it. Vaporeon for example cannot do much damage to Gyarados normally, and with it's usual selection of support moves it can be Taunted and make Vaporeon quite useless against Gyarados. However, Gyarados has a 4 x weakness to Electric, so if you give the move Hidden Power to Vaporeon with the Electric type, it can turn the tables. Not only will you hurt Gyarados significantly (a two-hit knock-out from full health, or abbreviated to 2HKO), but you will likely make Gyarados waste his turn by using Taunt on you while you attack. Or if he decided to attack rather than taunt, Vaporeon has nice HP and his Defence can be brought up with nature and EVs so he can even come in on a Dragon Danced Gyarados and do the same trick. Breeding for Hidden Power types at a good power level is a pain, so I would post in the Breeders Corner if you have trouble with that. Here is a list of common threats for you to consider. I've only listed the 50 most common, but there are plenty of others to bear in mind: 1-5: Blissey, Garchomp, Gyarados, Gengar, Tyranitar 6-10: Salamence, Weavile, Heracross, Metagross, Skarmory 11-15: Forretress, Starmie, Infernape, Bronzong, Cresselia 16-20: Swampert, Gliscor, Dusknoir, Heatran, Lucario 21-25: Breloom, Electivire, Togekiss, Hippowdon, Scizor 26-30: Yanmega, Donphan, Porygon-Z, Azelf, Weezing 31-35: Snorlax, Magnezone, Jirachi, Vaporeon, Mamoswine 36-40: Jolteon, Machamp, Milotic, Spiritomb, Abomasnow 41-45: Umbreon, Dragonite, Alakazam, Ambipom, Suicune 46-50: Ninjask, Zapdos, Crobat, Staraptor, Tangrowth Yes, it's a large list, but there are a large variety of Pokemon out there, so it's worth your while to consider as many threats to your team survival as possible. This list is based on shoddybattle Pokemon usage, so I take no credit in bringing you this list, it is here for reference. Basic idea when considering a threat is to look at what it can potentially do. The number one beast out there Blissey, can learn quite a wide variety of moves, including Softboiled or Wish for healing, Aromatherapy and Heal Bell for cleric duty, Stealth Rock, Seismic Toss for good all round damage against most things, many status inflicting moves including Sing, Toxic, and Thunder Wave. Also bear in mind it's base stats. Obviously you want to hurt it with a physical move since it has a base Defence stat of 10, but this can be increased to up to 130 with max Defence IV, EV and a defence boosting nature. 130 may not seem like much for a L100 Pokemon, but with Blissey's huge HP (255 base, or 714 maximum possible), it can give Blissey some survival against many physical hits. So, you'll want to hit it with a physical Fighting move, which it is weak to. However, as soon as Blissey even get the hint that you have a fighting move and are about to use it that turn, the smart thing to do would be to switch to a physical wall like Skarmory (the infamous Skarmbliss combo at it's basis) or something that resists Fighting and this rescues Blissey to come back later and be annoying. So, what to do? Many physical walls are weak to Fire (most being Steel type) and often have low Special Defence, so consider using a fire move on a Pokemon, even if it seems an odd choice like Machamp. With Fire Blast, Machamp can do serious damage to Skarmory as well as Blissey if you predict the switches right. Of course anything with both high SpAtt and Att is best for this role, especially combined with high Speed, and this is why mixed sweepers like Infernape and Electivire see great use in breaking the defensive walls of a team. The other thing to consider with team threats is how your team covers each other against specific threats. Say you have Magnezone, who is weak to Fire. The opponent sends in Salamence, who you know is faster, has Fire Blast and is holding a Choice Specs, easily killing Magnezone in one shot. If it hits. Of course you don't want to take that risk, so you switch to Houndoom, who has Flash Fire. Great! Now all Salamence can do is either use Fire Blast again or switch, leaving Houndoom to use Nasty Plot or attack whatever is switched in (also he has a boosted Fire attack from Flash Fire until Houndoom switches, which is a good reason to use Flash Fire). This is an example of teams working together. The main idea of a Pokemon team is they are a TEAM, you can't just throw six Pokemon together with a bunch of moves and some items and hope for the best, you need to get your Pokemon to cover each other's backs, so to speak. I hope this guide is helpful and informative to those writing a team, and good luck in all your future battles. Credit to Anti-Pop Culture Warrior13 and Azonic for contributing to this. |
Good Guide, but its also nice not to just see people including me who i guess dont write good formats, but also have "CONTRUCTIVE" Critizim, im tired of see'ing people post nothing but crap in these rate threads including mine they post stuff the poster already stated they said they know, and they post like a 4 word sentance with useless stuff. They critize but they dont help the user on the subject..
If your asking for help then please help, dont post stuff to degrade someone else without actually posting why |
This is a point to raise with those people who rate teams. I do agree with you, there is a lot of negative criticism on many teams, which is part of the reason why I made this guide, if you take Pokemon seriously, or at least competitive battling, team raters will take you seriously. Many if not all team raters are good battlers themselves, and as a result this can often lead to a superiority complex. Not everyone can learn quickly, and not everyone has been battling for a while. Even I made the common mistakes when first starting, so we can all be newbies once. The difference is people can learn, so I urge any team raters in the future to bear that in mind instead of going 'omgzors you sux' or words to that effect.
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In addition to the whole Sweeper Explanation, I'd also like to say it helps to have a Clean-Up Sweeper. Basically something to come in and wreck the remaining units after they've been weakened enough. But they also have to be able to take at least one hit. Dragon Dancers and Choice Scarfers withhold that role.
I really like this guide too. Personally, I think it should be stickied, and applied as rules. |
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Great guide, Toothache. You should add the optional roles, like Spiker/Stealth Rocker, Phazer, etc. See, I gave him constructive critisism. Is he gonna get upset & cry? No. He's not a noob. |
I tried to keep it to the basic roles, I didn't want to get too in-depth and technical with Clean-Up Sweepers and so on, just to get the new battlers into the idea that each Pokemon can do a specific job for your team, and scare them off with too much at first. A lot of people who need this are those who are usually new to the idea of competitive battling so are going to make the common mistakes, hopefully people will read this and it will make them think twice, or at least think.
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Thats the biggest problem-rookies refusing to learn. There has been many new members-all banned-because they couldn't get over the fact that their oh so good teams wasn't so great.
We also need a team rater's guide. I saw one on Smogon-perfect. I especially liked the rule "If you aren't experienced, don't give advice". This is a growing problem. I've seen too many people give out horrible advice, & just not care that they are hurting someone with it. |
i just gotta say 1 thing THANK YOU SO MUCH
it gets kinda annoyign when people don't use the standard format edit: yeah sims is right i've been seeing a lot of n00bs going up to "beginiers" and tellin then to use hyper beam cauz its base 150 power is pwnage... |
Ok, does someone else want to work on a team-rater's guide, I'm all typed out for now.
People cannot handle the truth, sad to say, but cushioning the blow sometimes gives people incentive to realise why certain things are bad. And yes, Dragonzilla25 I was getting sick of it too. EDIT: Edited the first section with the line: Also, 'Rate My Team' does not mean a rating out of 10. What can a number tell you about how bad or good your team is? I see that a lot too, and a rating out of a number does not help your team any. |
I'll do that tommorrow.
I guess I can try softening the blow...somewhat. |
this is a really good format thing. I hate it when people just list their pokemon and dont say anything else, and then wonder why no one rates their team well. Idiots are far too common, hopefully they read this post to get something better out of it
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eternalglory, I'm putting that post in my sig. That was beautiful.
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You arent getting what i said... Im not talkin about a insy wincy problem. Im saying they need to say something to back what there saying. You cant just say oh Your moves suck, oh dont even use this pokemon, oh your IV's suck, oh your team sucks. Things like this iv seen alot off and this is what im talkin about. People say these things and yet they dont have anything else to say. They are critics and yet they dont give helpfull info to back it up ? Thats my problem. Being new to a forum doesnt mean diddly sqwat lol you saying cuss they are new to this forum that means they are new to the game or pokemon or breeding or making teams ? Your flat out wrong there. Some people yes cant handle it, i myself can to a point but when people post crap in my threads i get pissed off cuss your waisting my time. This is what im talkin about. I hope you understand now what i ment ? When people post there suggestions, and then someone else quote's it and says OH your wrong !. That makes you right lol ? People are to full of themselves sometimes like toothache said. A good example of this is what iv seen people say to me or others. MY RECORD IS 33 WINS 9 LOSES. Because i have more wins then loses this means i know all. This is what people say sometimes lol. Those people are idiots. Or someone saying I can beat you, or he can beat you in a battle you suck... lol right... you see what im saying ? |
That last sentence was a bit confusing, but I get the jist of it. The grammer was off, so I couldn't understand it.
I was being sarcastic when I said iitsy bitsy or whatever. It was an example of how we need to butter things up for new users. No where in that post did I say if your new to the forum, your new to the game at all. I agree, I've seen users just say "this team sux" without any proper rate. Its annoying indeed. |
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Another Role is this:
This is actually what a Tank is; Bronzong is actually a Mixed Wall. A Tank has high HP, ATK, DEF, and, preferably, decent SP DEF. Tyranitar and Metagross are good examples. |
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This thread should be sticky. so many noobs just blurt out huge lists of text and this could stop the pain to my eyes :)
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just need to add nickname to the pokemon format thing. and mods sticky!
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Toothache, can you please include the fact that grammar is important. Entries that are difficult to decipher due to poor spelling, punctuation, etc. leave one irritated and incapable of giving an effective rate of the team.
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Very nice job, Toothache. Though I must point out that you have forgotten a few roles.
PHazer / Hazer Baton Passer Annoyer(so-so) Although, I would like to point out that the Format of RMT was already stated here by aragornbird in the Strategies and Movesets Rules. In addition to the Guide, I'm going to add some basic things that probably would help trainers that are just starting competetive battle. Hyperbeam - Hyperbeam and all other forms of Hyperbeam (Roar of Time, Hydro Cannon, Frenzy Plant, etc.) are not to be used. Sure, 150 power seems like a lot of damage but when you do the math, Hyperbeam turns out to be one of the weaker moves out there. Lets see, Hyperbeam needs two turns to complete - One to attack + One to recharge. That means Hyperbeam is inflicting only 75 damage each turn since it takes two turns to complete. 150 Power divided by the number of turns (2) equals 75. 75 Power is not very impressive. Moves like Return, Surf, and Flamethrower will have a much higher power than Hyperbeam will. Note - Hyperbeam is still not to be used even on Slaking. Hyperbeam's second turn of recharging cannot be avoided. That means that you are trapped on the field. In this case, the turn you are trapped and immobile - the opponent can switch out into a Skarmory, Garchomp, or any terrible threat that sets up and sweeps through Slaking. Fly, Dig, and Dive - Fly, Dig, and Dive seem pretty good right? It leaves the opponent miss and lets you inflict a good powered move the next turn, right? WRONG. If the opponent predicts well, or on the chance that the opponent is using a faster pokemon, the opponent can utilize that free turn for benefits. For instance, it can pound your field with Stealth Rock, Recover to heal HP, switch out to a pokemon that poses as a threat to yours, THE POSSIBILITIES ARE ENDLESS. Avoid moves like Fly, Dig, and Dive. Items - There are a huge variety of items. But there are items that should never be used. They are items like Miracle Seed, Draco Plate, Charcoal, etc. I must point out that items like those only offer a 10% boost to one move(if you are using your movesets correctly). Items with "Plate" in their name only offer a 20% boost. That boost is very minimal and therefore should be scrapped for items that are useful. Leftovers, Life Orb, etc are good examples of items. Also, I've noticed Mullet's guide only includes the 3rd Generation. So I've done the fourth Generation. **Curselax (Snorlax @:Leftovers Trait: Thick Fat Adamant/Careful Nature -Curse -Earthquake/Crunch/Return -Rest/Crunch/Earthquake/Return -Sleep Talk/Return/Crunch/Earthquake Agil-gross - Metagross @:Leftovers/Life Orb Trait: Clear Body Adamant Nature -Agilty -Thunderpunch -Meteor Mash -Earthquake/Explosion Scarfcross - [email protected]:Choice Scarf Trait: Guts Adamant Nature -Pursuit/Earthquake -Close Combat -Megahorn -Stone Edge McIceGar - [email protected] Orb Trait: Levitate Timid Nature -Thunderpunch -Hypnosis/Will-o-Wisp/Shadowball -Substitute -Focus Punch. Specsmence - [email protected] Specs Timid 252 Spd/252 Sp atk -Draco Meteor -Flamethrower -Hydro Pump -Dragon Pulse. Common Pokemon Breloom @:Toxic Orb Trait: Poison Heal Jolly Nature -Substitute/Spore -Focus Punch -Leech Seed -Seed Bomb. Jumpluff @:Leftovers Trait: Chlorophyll Timid Nature -Leech Seed -Sleep powder -Sunny Day -Solarbeam. Electrivire @:Leftovers Trait: Motor Drive Jolly -Thunderbolt -Earthquake -Ice Punch -Cross Chop/Brick Break. [email protected] Trait: Intimidate Nature: Jolly -Dragon Dance -Taunt -Waterfall -Earthquake [email protected] Band Trait: Intimidate Jolly Nature -Earthquake -Aerial Ace -Dragon Claw -Stone Edge [email protected] Specs Trait: Synchronize Timid Nature -Psychic -Focus Blast -Shadow Ball -Energy Ball [email protected] Shell Trait: Keen Eye Impish Nature -Drill Peck -Roost -Spikes -Roar [email protected] Sash Trait: Speed Boost Adamant Nature -Protect -Swords Dance -Baton Pass -X Scizzor [email protected] Trait: Natural Cure Timid Nature -Surf -Ice Beam -Thunderbolt -Rapid Spin [email protected] Trait: Solid Rock Adamant Nature -Earthquake -Megahorn -Stone Edge Avalanche/Substitute/Rock Polish Eeveelution-An evolution of Eevee Duggy-Dugtrio Forry-Forretress Vire-Electivire Zam-Alakazam CMcune-Suicune with Calm Mind (tank) Mence-Salamence Eeveelution-An evolution of Eevee Duggy-Dugtrio Forry-Forretress Vire-Electivire Zam-Alakazam CMcune-Suicune with Calm Mind (tank) Mence-Salamence DD-Dragon Dance EQ-Earthquake WoW-Will-o-Wisp CM-Calm Mind DT-Double Team AA-Aerial Ace HP (type)-Hidden Power SD-Swords Dance SR-Stealth Rock Tiers OU - Overused pokemon, pokemon that have very good stats, yet aren't Uber BL - Borderline pokemon, pokemon in the crossfire between OU and UU UU - Underused, pokemon that aren't seen commonly NU - Not Used, pokemon that are almost never used on teams. Legendaries - pokemon aren't uber - still allowed in competetive Moltres Celebi Jirachi Regigagas Registeel Regice Regirock Articuno Zapdos Entei Suicune Raikou Shaymin Heatran Phione Uxie Mesprit Azelf Uber Pokemon Rayquaza. Mewtwo. Mew Arceus. Darkrai Dialga Palkia Deoxys(Attack) Deoxys(Defense) Deoxys(Speed) Groudon Kyogre Ho-oh Lugia Wobbuffet Manaphy ***I give some credit to Anti-Pop Culture Warrior 13 for writing this too. |
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Italtic and Underline is why did you post those twice?? |
Could you also add the common misperception between Toxic Orb and Flame Orb? Gut's cancels out the attack drop. So basically, Flame Orb=Guts users, Toxic Orb=Quick Feet users.
Also one between Black Sludge and Leftovers. Leftovers>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Black Sludge, all the way. |
yeah and then NOOBish people who still think that just because a pokemon is legendary its uber.
PEOPLE NOT ALL LEGENDARIES ARE UBER!!!!!! |
flamehaze, why do you insist on saying that Leftovers are better than Black Sludge. Black Sludge does the SAME THING on Poison types as Leftovers. Why does it matter? Please explain yourself.
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For the most part, people use Black Sludge because of Trick/Switcheroo stuff like Alakazam and Loppuny. They say,"Oooh, look Black Sludge will hurt them if they try to Trick/Trickeroo it into them." Well, wrong! They can Trick/Trickeroo that Black Sludge into one of your walls to ultimately kill it. So in the end they win, they give both the Choice idem and Black Sludge to two of your Pokemon. They win.
May be a little bit confusing, and unimportant. I can't explain it well enough, but it's just one of the other common misperceptions kinda like Flame Orb and Toxic Orb A good example should be in here: http://www.pokecommunity.com/showthread.php?t=115430 Please read the last post. I have just proven him wrong with what I just stated. ^__^ |
In all honesty, I would say I've seen the Trickspecs technique 10 out of the hundreds of battles I've fought. I only suggest Black Sludge because some fight with Item Clauses, so it helps to have an item that has the same effect, but surpasses the Item Clause.
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It may seem unimportant and stupid, but you will fare better when the time comes :P
Edit: I faced one on Shoddy just a few hours ago. |
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Anyways, it should be stickied. Do i like pm the mod err something O_o |
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Have updated the guide with tier information, advice on items, and moves (thanks to Azonic and Anti-Pop Culture Warrior 13 for contributing). I've reworded your contributions to fit with the guide, but I appreciate the effort, and added a couple of things on top (such as Trick for the items section).
Any other suggestions you may think need adding? I don't want to put newbies off too much with a lot to learn, but there IS a lot to learn, so I want to give them only the info that will help at first. |
So it should be separated, in a walkthrough guide. As in the begginers, advance, & expert.
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I think (this is more of an opinion though) that positive attitude is important too. But yeah, glad this was stickied.
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Actually pretty useful, I just noticed this anywho o_o
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Also, include the Battle Sims like Shoddy and NetBattle?
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I noticed some things.
1)Some roles aren't necessary, but very much recommended. Rapin Spinners, Clerics, & the like aren't needed, but helpful. The basics are Physical Sweeper Special Sweeper Phy.Wall Sp.Wall The others are optional, to your taste. Also, a TANK is a pokemon that can take hits, & deliver them back, like Torterra, for example. A DUAL(Mixed) WALL are those meant to absorb both types of moves. |
I'd actually disagree sims. While you could get away with not having a spinner in ADV, you really kind of need one in 4th gen or SR will be a nuiscance. *loling at my spelling*
Same with cleric, except I've always thought this thing was necessary after a toxic blissey loled ay me. Though you can get by without a PHazer IMO, I just always liek to have one so ninjask doesn't... But that's just me ;) |
Ah, but I speak from experience. I've seen many teams without Rapid Spin, and a HUGE amount of battlers without Clerics. They get along perfectly fine without them.
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Rapid Spin is probably only needed if you have several pokemon weak to Rock. Clerics are one of the minor roles, they aren't necessarily needed.
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Well, I play ADV, VERY different strategically, so I guess we SHOULD disagree ;)
But I like running a pokemon just to pump random status conditions into foes that don't have clerics. 95% success rate ;) But again, ADV and D/P are oh so different. you know my stance on that ;) Um, you DO need a spinner in D/P though...I mean, my god is SR a pain in the behind. And skarm spiking you half to death is no fun either... |
Take it from the people who plays D/P. It is extremely useful, but not needed. We know what to expect when Skarm comes, & a team (Richard, Name, for example) is set to handle Spikes/SR without it. My team cannot, so I must use Rapid Spin.
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In ADV, magneton could be a pseudo-spinner. Skarm and Forry were the only widely used spikers, and Magneton destroyed both, so no spinner was really used with magneton. How times have changed...
But I recommend using status inducers on D/P teams. VERY effective strategy. But yeah, I guess I see your point. Geez, I'm so used to one metagame and yeah...lol |
Hey toothy I've asked this before but may you add the hax items to your page? Eg:King's rock, razor claw.
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I never got chance to thank you, Toothache, but thanks for writing this guide. :P
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Oh good. Finally someone puts up a Post a Team format. ;)
(I haven't been on here till today. Saw this thread, and... yay!) |
NetBattle - 3rd Generation Battle Simulator. Software used to imitate real battling, only over the internet. Battling comes with all the 3rd Generation calculations, moves, Pokemon, items, values, and base move powers. Comes with Team Builder. [FREE] Click Here To Get NetBattle
+ More user friendly + Easier to save logs - Only one Generation Shoddy Battle - 4th Generation and 3rd Generation Battle Simulator. Software used to imitate real battling, only over the internet. Battling comes with all the 4th generation calculations, moves, Pokemon, items, values, base move power, and 4th Generation additions. Comes with Team Builder. [FREE] Click Here To Get Shoddy Battle + Both Generations + Updated additions - Less user-friendly |
Shoddy can do third gen as well.
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I don't know how but it's advertised as such and no one has complained about not being able to do it. Ask around on the forums.
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