The PokéCommunity Forums

The PokéCommunity Forums (https://www.pokecommunity.com/index.php)
-   Previous Generations (https://www.pokecommunity.com/forumdisplay.php?f=200)
-   -   4th Gen Diamond and Pearl plot hole? (https://www.pokecommunity.com/showthread.php?t=119041)

MegaMushroom07 December 10th, 2007 8:18 AM

Diamond and Pearl plot hole?
 
Well, as you all know, Pokemon Diamond and Pearl are set at the same time of the Lake of Rage incident from Gold/Silver/Crystal, which are set three years after FireRed/Leafgreen. However, you are able to migrate FR/LG Pokemon via the Pal Park from Kanto, without the use of a Time Machine from G/S/C.
This means that one of the games is not canon; What do you think?

Nacon December 10th, 2007 11:11 AM

how can you confirm the timeline?

what proof exists to show that the story takes place a little later?

Eruption December 10th, 2007 11:17 AM

The games dont have to be in time order anyway.

Its a different place in each game.

MegaMushroom07 December 10th, 2007 1:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nacon (Post 3159332)
how can you confirm the timeline?

what proof exists to show that the story takes place a little later?

In G/S/C, someone mentions that "About 3 years ago, a young boy fought away Team Rocket."

On the TV at the start, there is news of a Red Gyarados in a lake.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skii (Post 3159341)
The games dont have to be in time order anyway.

Its a different place in each game.

However, there are references to every area in D/P.

Yingxue December 10th, 2007 2:41 PM

Red Gyarados being in a lake doesn't mean it happened at the same time as G/S/C.

MegaMushroom07 December 10th, 2007 2:43 PM

It's obviously a reference to G/S/C. D/P has many of them.

Yingxue December 10th, 2007 2:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MegaMushroom07 (Post 3159903)
It's obviously a reference to G/S/C. D/P has many of them.

Examples of these references being...?

jigglyppuff8 December 10th, 2007 2:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ro-ohs (Post 3159889)
Red Gyarados being in a lake doesn't mean it happened at the same time as G/S/C.

Wasn't it specifically stated that the lake the cameraman went to was the lake of rage?

My theory is that the player in the past "releases" their pokemon while still keeping thier ownership of it. 3 years later, the pal park opens and those pokemon are lured there where a new trainer "captures" them.

Umanouski December 10th, 2007 2:54 PM

it could be an old documentary, like what the discovery shows friday nights in my area.

Yingxue December 10th, 2007 3:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jigglyppuff8 (Post 3159937)
Wasn't it specifically stated that the lake the cameraman went to was the lake of rage?

My theory is that the player in the past "releases" their pokemon while still keeping thier ownership of it. 3 years later, the pal park opens and those pokemon are lured there where a new trainer "captures" them.

Heck if I know, I can hardly read the Japanese version I have. :)

jigglyppuff8 December 10th, 2007 3:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ro-ohs (Post 3159918)
Examples of these references being...?

There's a man in hotel grand lake who states:
"Have you heard of the whirl islands in johto? That silver colored pokemon. I must see it in my lifetime."
"Have you heard on the tin tower in johto? That rainbow colored pokemon. I must see it in my lifetime."

There's Jasmine hanging out in sunyshore city.

The colors of the park balls are gold, silver, and blue(crystal).

The hiker in hearthome saying something about Elm's report on pokemon eggs(proof that it takes place in the future)

And the secret potion's bag description mentioning Cianwood city.

Yingxue December 10th, 2007 3:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jigglyppuff8 (Post 3159985)
There's a man in hotel grand lake who states:
"Have you heard of the whirl islands in johto? That silver colored pokemon. I must see it in my lifetime."
"Have you heard on the tin tower in johto? That rainbow colored pokemon. I must see it in my lifetime."

There's Jasmine hanging out in sunyshore city.

The colors of the park balls are gold, silver, and blue(crystal).

The hiker in hearthome saying something about Elm's report on pokemon eggs(proof that it takes place in the future)

And the secret potion's bag description mentioning Cianwood city.

I see. Those are interesting! :D

Umanouski December 10th, 2007 3:17 PM

so look at it this way, its further in the future than G/S/C and besides it's not a plothole just the fact that you can transfer pokemon.

Shadow December 10th, 2007 5:00 PM

As stated, the documentary could be a rerun.

Or, only the hero you play as knows for certain about the Lake of Rage incident (outside of Team Rocket). Everyone else just "heard about a strange Gyarados" or "thought they saw an odd colored Pokemon" in the Lake of Rage, so it could have evolved into something like Bigfoot, which they are still looking for to this day (note, the title of the show in D/P was "In Search of the Red Gyarados" as in they were looking for clues about it or a sighting, not that it was a video of the battle against it in G/S/C).

And also, all Shiny Gyarados are red. So the one you fought in Lake of Rage wasn't the only shiny Gyarados in the world (or even the Lake of Rage). And there's no telling how long ago G/S/C was story-wise, or if the radio waves Team Rocket used in their Lake of Rage experiments had any long term effects on the Magikarp population there.

And as for the Pal Park migration, I seriously doubt that is canonical. It was just a feature added in so you could keep your older Pokemon. I don't know anyone who would release their own Pokemon in a park on the opposite side of the nation for another trainer to "re-catch" and use as their own forever.

Umanouski December 10th, 2007 5:24 PM

i really did not pay attention to it. It means nothing. When i first saw it i said to myself...Ah, cool, but otherwise it means nothing.

Myoko-chan December 10th, 2007 5:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MegaMushroom07 (Post 3159903)
It's obviously a reference to G/S/C. D/P has many of them.

Still, that doesn't mean that the Red Gyrados is the same one in G/S/C and D/P takes place the same time as it.


Plus, the Pal Park theory was just ridicolous, the Pal Park was just a feature, it's obviously not canon. Plus, theres a difference, correct me if I'm wrong, but in G/S/C, you TRADE with the older games, not have the older games transfer Pokemon, which is you don't give something in return.

SytheXP December 10th, 2007 5:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MegaMushroom07 (Post 3159106)
Well, as you all know, Pokemon Diamond and Pearl are set at the same time of the Lake of Rage incident from Gold/Silver/Crystal, which are set three years after FireRed/Leafgreen. However, you are able to migrate FR/LG Pokemon via the Pal Park from Kanto, without the use of a Time Machine from G/S/C.
This means that one of the games is not canon; What do you think?

Theres no plot hole they never said @ the lake of rage so yea and how do we know it was a live report maybe it was an old documentary or a rerun on pokedicover(pokemon discovery channel) or maybe a taped show.....Just because its also in G/S/C doesnt mean they are during the same time.

And I agree with an above post about the pal park feature which has angered me >.< I reset ds clock and now have to wait 24 hours to migrate again dangumit anyway The reason for this feature was mant people were angered when losing G/S/C pkmn so Im guessing they didnt want angry trainers so they made it possible to retrieve your pokemon.

Shiny Umbreon December 10th, 2007 6:14 PM

OK. For the ones that don't know, D/P does happen near G/S/C because someone (in Hearthome, I think) mentions Prof. Elm, from Johto, recently discovered Pokémon come from eggs. Who helped him? Gold. And that was after getting his first badge, so you can deduce. If it wasn't for that, I'd say it happens a bit after or before G/S/C because you see Jasmine and Oak while they should be in Johto.

I like your thought about the time machine. However, you don't directly trade with people from the past, so I accept jigglypuff's theory about Pal Park, or any similar one.

SytheXP December 10th, 2007 6:34 PM

im not 100% sure on any of it But the closest assumption I can mke is that it takes place in the future after Johto starts but along the same timeline, and yes there are alot of references to Johto in D/P which is um awesome as it may lead to a new johto game or a third game taking you to a part of a remade if not the entire region of johto.

Shiny Umbreon December 10th, 2007 6:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SytheXP (Post 3160738)
im not 100% sure on any of it But the closest assumption I can mke is that it takes place in the future after Johto starts but along the same timeline, and yes there are alot of references to Johto in D/P which is um awesome as it may lead to a new johto game or a third game taking you to a part of a remade if not the entire region of johto.

Since when was an entire regions introduced in a third game? Yellow did not. Crystal did not. Emerald had the Battle Frontier, but it was just an extension of the Battle Tower. So Opal (or whatever it is called) won't.

SytheXP December 10th, 2007 8:31 PM

In the G/S/C games it contained the Kanto and Johto regions I was thinkingg of something along that line

lightdash December 10th, 2007 8:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SytheXP (Post 3160942)
In the G/S/C games it contained the Kanto and Johto regions I was thinkingg of something along that line

Then it contradicts what your last statement said. Johto has not even once been reformatted.

MegaMushroom07 December 11th, 2007 7:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shiny Umbreon (Post 3160653)
OK. For the ones that don't know, D/P does happen near G/S/C because someone (in Hearthome, I think) mentions Prof. Elm, from Johto, recently discovered Pokémon come from eggs. Who helped him? Gold. And that was after getting his first badge, so you can deduce. If it wasn't for that, I'd say it happens a bit after or before G/S/C because you see Jasmine and Oak while they should be in Johto.

I like your thought about the time machine. However, you don't directly trade with people from the past, so I accept jigglypuff's theory about Pal Park, or any similar one.

I conclude the G/S/C are not canon, but when Nintendo re-make them (Duh, it's gonna happen), we can fit it all together.

SytheXP December 11th, 2007 8:14 AM

I think its leading to something speacial about or 2nd gen games either the next version possibly having a small part of Johto or a remade Johto for you to travel to or possibly leading to a remake of them Like FR/LG I mean the G/S/C is the only one they have yet to remake, So its highly propable if not for them to add Johto into the 3rd but possible that they are hinting to about 2 or 3 remakes. This is how I conclude it they make ALOT of referances to the Johto areas, In text as well in items and Jasmine the Gym Leader so therefor we now know theyve remade one if not all the gymleaders and they also made the secret potion/medacine or w/e its called for the D/P version or maybe they are just easter eggs for us to cry over IMO D/P raises many mysteries.

MegaMushroom07 December 11th, 2007 8:18 AM

Perhaps Johto suffers from time problems (Hence Celebi), and must use a Time Machine to connect to other lands.

Shadow December 11th, 2007 2:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MegaMushroom07 (Post 3161538)
Perhaps Johto suffers from time problems (Hence Celebi), and must use a Time Machine to connect to other lands.

Except you can go between Johto and Kanto by both boat and bullet train in G/S/C...

wakachamo December 11th, 2007 2:25 PM

Just because there are tiny little hints at G/S/C from D/P, it doesn't mean there's an actual timeline. Therefore, there's no such thing as a plot hole.

MegaMushroom07 December 12th, 2007 8:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shadow (Post 3162115)


Except you can go between Johto and Kanto by both boat and bullet train in G/S/C...

I meant between other games; My mistake, but you should be able to guess that.


All times are GMT -8. The time now is 11:00 PM.


Like our Facebook Page Follow us on Twitter © 2002 - 2018 The PokéCommunity™, pokecommunity.com.
Pokémon characters and images belong to The Pokémon Company International and Nintendo. This website is in no way affiliated with or endorsed by Nintendo, Creatures, GAMEFREAK, The Pokémon Company or The Pokémon Company International. We just love Pokémon.
All forum styles, their images (unless noted otherwise) and site designs are © 2002 - 2016 The PokéCommunity / PokéCommunity.com.
PokéCommunity™ is a trademark of The PokéCommunity. All rights reserved. Sponsor advertisements do not imply our endorsement of that product or service. User generated content remains the property of its creator.

Acknowledgements
Use of PokéCommunity Assets
vB Optimise by DragonByte Technologies Ltd © 2023.