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-   -   Please help me with my team. (https://www.pokecommunity.com/showthread.php?t=120031)

gleepdiddly December 19th, 2007 4:17 PM

Please help me with my team.
 
[email protected]
Bold Nature
252 Def., 252 Sp.Def., 6 HP
-Aromatherapy
-Seismic toss
-softboiled
-thunder wave
Natural Cure

[email protected] Shell
Impish Nature
252 HP, 156 Def, 96 Atk.
-Brave Bird
-Roost
-Spikes
-Roar
Keen Eye

[email protected]???
Adamant Nature
252 Atk, 156 HP, 96 Def.
-Stealth Rock
-Earthquake
-Megahorn
-Stone Edge
Solid Rock

[email protected] Specs
Modest Nature
252 Sp. Atk, 252 Spd, 6 Sp. Def
-Flamethrower
-Earth Power
-Dragon Pulse
-Dark Pulse
Flash Fire

[email protected] Orb
Jolly Nature
252 Atk, 252 Spd, 6 Def
-Swords Dance
-Earthquake
-Dragon Claw
-Fire Fang
Sand Veil

[email protected]???
Naive Nature
252 Spd, 128 Sp. Atk., 128 Atk
-Nasty Plot
-Grass Knot
-Close Combat
-Flare Blitz
Blaze

Thanks!

flamehaze94 December 19th, 2007 5:51 PM

Thank you! Someone else who actually does a smart Blissey EV spread. =)
A little nit-pick, but go 20HP / 252Def / 12Spd / 224SpDef. That my friend is the best Blissey spread.


For Heatran, go with Fire Blast>Flamethrwoer to 2HKO Cress. A neutral Fire Blast does more than a supper effective Dark Pulse btw. Stick in a Hidden Power [Grass/Ice/Electric] or Explosion to go out with a bang. 40HP / 216Spd / 252SpAtk is a better EV spread.

Give Rhyperior Leftovers.


Garchomp should have 16HP / 252Atk / 240Spd as the EV spread. It wants Substitute over Fire Fang.


Infernape needs 24Atk / 232Spd / 252SpAtk and with Flamethrower>Flare Blitz. Give it Life Orb.




Gyarados weak.

gleepdiddly December 19th, 2007 5:59 PM

I always thought flamethrower>fire blast because of the inaccuracy. Also, how will I be able to kill a gyarados without changing pokemon?

flamehaze94 December 19th, 2007 6:02 PM

Flamethrower can't guarentee a 2HKO on Cress ;__;. Also, did I mention Fire Blast also 2HKOs Blissey after a Flash Fire boost?


You may chose Stone Edge>Fire Fang on Chomp and Thunder Punch>Nasty Plot on Ape to help.

gleepdiddly December 19th, 2007 6:04 PM

I DO have a lot of fire, so I could go for stone edge on gar. I can easily get f-thrower/fire blast TMs, so I could do some experimenting. Also, why does bliss need speed?

flamehaze94 December 19th, 2007 6:06 PM

Bliss needs Spd EVs because outspeeds other Bliss, bulky Machamp, and the standard Azumarill.

gleepdiddly December 19th, 2007 6:07 PM

Kk. I will be back tomorrow since I have to go to bed, big test tomorrow...

flamehaze94 December 19th, 2007 6:08 PM

Good luck with the test and the team =)

Iceman3k December 19th, 2007 6:13 PM

Quote:

A little nit-pick, but go 20HP / 252Def / 12Spd / 224SpDef. That my friend is the best Blissey spread.
No, that's just lack of sense. HP always comes before defenses, and we BOTH know that Blissey does not need all of that Sp. Defense when it's already running off of 306 SDef to begin with.

Quote:

Originally Posted by gleepdiddly (Post 3182307)
[email protected]
Bold Nature
212 HP / 252 Def / 44 SDef
-Aromatherapy
-Seismic toss
-softboiled
-thunder wave
Natural Cure
Moveset is fine, EVs weren't.

[email protected] Shell
Impish Nature
208 HP / 216 Def / 84 Atk
-Brave Bird
-Roost
-Spikes
-Whirlwind
Keen Eye
Go find yourself a Staravia and breed Whirlwind onto it.

[email protected]Choice Band
Adamant Nature
252 Atk, 252 HP
-Avalanche
-Earthquake
-Megahorn
-Stone Edge
Solid Rock
Rhyperior sucks at Stealth Rock. It's much better as a wrecking ball CB Attacker.

[email protected] Scarf
Timid Nature
252 Sp. Atk, 224 Spd, 32 HP
-Flamethrower
-Earth Power
-Dragon Pulse
-Hidden Power (Electric)
Flash Fire
Heatran is too slow to use Choice Specs. Either Scarf it, or beef it with Defense and HP.

[email protected]Choice Scarf
Adamant Nature
252 Atk, 252 Spd, 6 SAtk
-Stone Edge
-Earthquake
-Dragon Claw / Outrage
-Fire Blast
Sand Veil

[email protected]Expert Belt / Life Orb
Naive Nature
92 Atk / 232 Spd / 184 SAtk
-Nasty Plot
-Grass Knot
-Close Combat
-Fire Blast
Blaze
Better EVs. Needs Fire Blast for Skarmory optimization.

Thanks!

Has the biggest Gyarados weakness in the world. Electivire also poses a threat, and 95% of the time, Gyarados and Electivire are on the same team =(

And you can't kill Gyarados without changing Pokemon. You REALLY can't kill Gyarados if it has a Dragon Dance on its belt.

flamehaze94 December 19th, 2007 7:08 PM

There is no significant difference between 656HP and 714HP. HP is of the least importance to Blissey. My spread, 20HP / 252Def / 12Spd / 224SpDef @ Calm nature, is the best Blissey spread, fact.




Does your EVs stop SpecsLuke Aura Sphere from 2HKOing you? Does it stop Flash Fired SpecsHeatran Fire Blast from 2HKOing you? Does it stop SpecsGar Focus Blast from 2HKOing you? Does it stop Nasty Plot Togekiss Aura Sphere from 2HKOing you? Does it stop MS Zapdos Thunderbolt 2HKOing you? Does it stop Modest Nasty Plot Life Orb Adaptabilty PorygonZ Hyper Beam from 0HKOing you?

Come back and we'll talk whenever your "ideal" EV spread meets those special attacking threats.

Iceman3k December 19th, 2007 8:16 PM

And has it occured to you that even with your SDef EVs, all they'll do is end up using said Metal Sound or Nasty Plot TWICE?

And with no defense or HP EVs, it's not taking Physical Hits very well at all. And tell me one thing, who uses Choice Specs when it doesn't have the Speed OR the Defense to abuse it with?

luke December 19th, 2007 8:26 PM

flamehaze, I'm going to be blunt because it's been made clear to me that those who frequent this section feel the same: your attitude has been far from stellar. We don't doubt you have a vast amount of knowledge on Pokemon Battling. -- We can see that by your usual workable sets with the explanations to back them up. However, there are differing opinions, and you need to accept that. So stop with the:

It's a fact.
The only truth.

You get the picture. Just post your move set, include your explanation and move on. If you continue this attitude, there will be consequences. Thank you.

gleepdiddly December 20th, 2007 1:26 PM

How do I do a formal quote?

[email protected]
Bold Nature
212 HP / 252 Def / 44 SDef
-Aromatherapy
-Seismic toss
-softboiled
-thunder wave
Natural Cure
Moveset is fine, EVs weren't.
Can't decide who's EVs to use...

[email protected] Shell
Impish Nature
208 HP / 216 Def / 84 Atk
-Brave Bird
-Roost
-Spikes
-Whirlwind
Keen Eye
Go find yourself a Staravia and breed Whirlwind onto it.
Is there even a difference between roar and whirlwind?

[email protected] Band
Adamant Nature
252 Atk, 252 HP
-Avalanche
-Earthquake
-Megahorn
-Stone Edge
Solid Rock
Rhyperior sucks at Stealth Rock. It's much better as a wrecking ball CB Attacker.
Okay...
[email protected] Scarf
Timid Nature
252 Sp. Atk, 224 Spd, 32 HP
-Flamethrower
-Earth Power
-Dragon Pulse
-Hidden Power (Electric)
Flash Fire
Heatran is too slow to use Choice Specs. Either Scarf it, or beef it with Defense and HP.
Sorry, bad HP. any other options?

[email protected] Scarf
Adamant Nature
252 Atk, 252 Spd, 6 SAtk
-Stone Edge
-Earthquake
-Dragon Claw / Outrage
-Fire Blast
Sand Veil
this guy was supposed to be physical, so why FB?

[email protected] Belt / Life Orb
Naive Nature
92 Atk / 232 Spd / 184 SAtk
-Nasty Plot
-Grass Knot
-Close Combat
-Fire Blast
Blaze
Better EVs. Needs Fire Blast for Skarmory optimization.
Kay.

Dark Azelf December 20th, 2007 1:36 PM

Infernape cant use fire blast well, if it misses its screwed basically and Flamethrower will ohko Skarmory regardless =/

[email protected] Orb
Naive Nature
252 SP.ATT / 232 SPEED / 24 ATT
- Nasty plot / Hidden power Ice / Hidden power Electric
- Flamethrower
- Grass Knot
- Close Combat

Ohkos Skarmory and Blissey.


Now for fire blast on Garchomp (who is bulky enough to miss and doesnt get STAB therefore Fire blast is better than Flamethrower), its there for steels who resist your main move, outrage, it allows you to get rid of them and sweep and does more to Skarmory and Forretress than fire fang will.

gleepdiddly December 20th, 2007 1:54 PM

Ok. Here's how my team goes now...

[email protected]
Bold Nature
212 HP / 252 Def / 44 SDef
-Aromatherapy
-Seismic toss
-softboiled
-thunder wave
Natural Cure

[email protected] Shell
Impish Nature
208 HP / 216 Def / 84 Atk
-Brave Bird
-Roost
-Spikes
-Whirlwind/roar(no difference)
Keen Eye

[email protected] Band
Adamant Nature
252 Atk, 252 HP
-Avalanche
-Earthquake
-Megahorn
-Stone Edge
Solid Rock

[email protected] Scarf
Timid Nature
252 Sp. Atk, 224 Spd, 32 HP
-Flamethrower
-Earth Power
-Dragon Pulse
-Explosion
Flash Fire

[email protected] Scarf
Adamant Nature
252 Atk, 252 Spd, 6 SAtk
-Stone Edge
-Earthquake
-Dragon Claw
-Fire Blast
Sand Veil

[email protected] Orb
Naive Nature
92 Atk / 232 Spd / 184 SAtk
-Nasty Plot
-Grass Knot
-Close Combat
-Fire Blast
Blaze

boo836 December 20th, 2007 1:55 PM

Actually whirlwind can switch while roar can't on pokes with soundproof.

Shiraishi December 20th, 2007 1:58 PM

Gyarados screws this team over :/ May I suggest Swampert w/ Stone Edge or Mixpert with HP [Elec] instead of Rhyperior?

Samson December 20th, 2007 2:04 PM

yah that rhyperior just doesn't fit. it's gotta go.

Dark Azelf December 20th, 2007 2:09 PM

Sort out Infernapes evs. Its made primarily for sp.sweeping and close combat is for special walls only.

24 ATT / 252 SP.ATT / 232 SPEED.

24 att evs is all it needs to OHKO BLISSEY AND SNORLAX.

gleepdiddly December 20th, 2007 2:21 PM

Kk. I have an almost finalized team right now. Thanks for you guys' help!

Iceman3k December 20th, 2007 9:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dark_Azelf (Post 3184086)
Sort out Infernapes evs. Its made primarily for sp.sweeping and close combat is for special walls only.

24 ATT / 252 SP.ATT / 232 SPEED.

24 att evs is all it needs to OHKO BLISSEY AND SNORLAX.

84% Minimum Damage to Blissey w/252 Def and 212 HP EVs, and doing only the minimum damage sucks horribly. And since there's no need for ALL of that Sp. Attack in the first place, especially when you're running Nasty Plot, then I invest EVs into Attack to further ensure that Close Combat will do a bigger damage range.

Against Snorlax, you only get as far as 92% Damage. Maybe I'm just insane for coverage and power, but if I'm going to let them live the bare minimum, just to get paralyzed, I'd rather not attack in the first place.

That's how I feel about it, but hey, I'm in my own league, and you guys are in yours. How you use Infernape is your business.

Archer December 20th, 2007 10:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iceman3k (Post 3184621)
84% Minimum Damage to Blissey w/252 Def and 212 HP EVs, and doing only the minimum damage sucks horribly. And since there's no need for ALL of that Sp. Attack in the first place, especially when you're running Nasty Plot, then I invest EVs into Attack to further ensure that Close Combat will do a bigger damage range.

Against Snorlax, you only get as far as 92% Damage. Maybe I'm just insane for coverage and power, but if I'm going to let them live the bare minimum, just to get paralyzed, I'd rather not attack in the first place.

That's how I feel about it, but hey, I'm in my own league, and you guys are in yours. How you use Infernape is your business.

Which Stat Calculator are you using? I got 92%(min) with Life Orb and the aforementioned EVs. But, yeah, he needs more attack. 56 Should do it from memory. Correct me if I'm wrong.

Iceman3k December 21st, 2007 3:59 AM

I used MetalKid's Damage Calc. Expert Belt for the item is what I used.

Sora_8920 December 21st, 2007 8:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gleepdiddly (Post 3182307)
[email protected]
Bold Nature
252 Def., 252 Sp.Def., 6 HP
-Aromatherapy
-Seismic toss
-softboiled
-thunder wave
Natural Cure

[email protected] Shell / Leftovers
Impish Nature
252 HP, 156 Def, 96 Atk.
-Brave Bird
-Roost
-Spikes
-Roar
Keen Eye Put Sub in there somewhere.

[email protected]??? Leftovers
Adamant Nature
252 Atk, 156 HP, 96 Def.
-Stealth Rock / Avalanche
-Earthquake
-Megahorn
-Stone Edge
Solid Rock

[email protected] Scarf
Modest Nature
252 Sp. Atk, 252 Spd, 6 Sp. Def
-Flamethrower
-Earth Power
-Dragon Pulse
-Dark Pulse / Flash Cannon / HP [GRASS] Scarf Set is SO much better, and the the only pokemon on your Team that are speedy are Garchomp and Infernape.
Flash Fire

[email protected] Orb
Jolly Nature
252 Atk, 252 Spd, 6 Def
-Swords Dance
-Earthquake
-Dragon Claw
-Fire Fang
Sand Veil

[email protected]??? Focus Sash
Naive Nature
252 Spd, 128 Sp. Atk., 128 Atk
-Nasty Plot
-Grass Knot
-Close Combat
-Flare Blitz /Flamethrower if you're going with Nasty Plot.
Blaze Looks good. Just added in the Item.

Thanks!

Comments in bold. Porygon-Z screws Blissey with Hyper Beam, believe it or not, then Skarmory with Thunderbolt, Garchomp wth Ice Beam. (If It's holding Choice Scarf.) Rhyperior with Ice Beam. 4 member. Not a good sign. Maybe a bolt-Beam resistor would be sufficient. since you're playing in OU's, (Lanturn wouldn't fit on a OU Team.) Magnezone would be beneficial for that.

shedinjask December 21st, 2007 8:33 AM

Lanturn can fit in OU. It just takes a bit of work and there are usually better things.

Sheddy for Boltbeam resist. Now.

Or, since you have a massive Gyara weak, you can use Porygon2, Mesprit, or Gardevoir.

Dark Azelf December 21st, 2007 8:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iceman3k (Post 3184621)
84% Minimum Damage to Blissey w/252 Def and 212 HP EVs, and doing only the minimum damage sucks horribly. And since there's no need for ALL of that Sp. Attack in the first place, especially when you're running Nasty Plot, then I invest EVs into Attack to further ensure that Close Combat will do a bigger damage range.

Against Snorlax, you only get as far as 92% Damage. Maybe I'm just insane for coverage and power, but if I'm going to let them live the bare minimum, just to get paralyzed, I'd rather not attack in the first place.

That's how I feel about it, but hey, I'm in my own league, and you guys are in yours. How you use Infernape is your business.


I was going on 148 HP / 252 DEF / 4 SP.DEF / 104 SP.ATT Blissey which is extremely common when people want to pack more damage on Ice Beam.

24 ATT EV Life Orb Infernape

Defender HP: 358
Damage: 334 - 393
Damage: 93.30% - 109.78%

On 148 Hp /252 DEF Blissey

Thats what i got, you actually are meant to Nasty Plot, withdraw when their sp.wall comes out and send it back in, next turn Flamethrower when they send their sp.wall at you from seeing the earlier Nasty Plot so they think you are fully special and so they dont switch and Close Combat them which is a ohko after Flamethrower or Stealth Rock damage.

Mix Ape is also meant primarily for sp.sweeping , and it needs max sp.att to hope to 2hko Gyarados with Grass Knot, Ohko Hippowdan,Donphan, Rhyperior <Insert wall weak to Grass Knot here>. Flamethrower also cannot ohko Bronzong without max or close to max sp.att investments.

I apologize for not explaining myself earlier

Sora_8920 December 21st, 2007 8:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shedinjask (Post 3185462)
Lanturn can fit in OU. It just takes a bit of work and there are usually better things.

Sheddy for Boltbeam resist. Now.

Or, since you have a massive Gyara weak, you can use Porygon2, Mesprit, or Gardevoir.

Ah. Ok. Thanks for that. But what's Sheddy? Edit: Is it Shed Shell?

shedinjask December 21st, 2007 8:43 AM

Shedinja lols. It's hard to use and requires the right team, and I doubt it would work with this one. But it's great fun.

Sora_8920 December 21st, 2007 8:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shedinjask (Post 3185493)
Shedinja lols. It's hard to use and requires the right team, and I doubt it would work with this one. But it's great fun.

Oh. That's that what you meant. Lol. It would be kinda obvious. But you're right on the most part, however, fun fun fun. XD.

Anti December 21st, 2007 10:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Itachi 2007 (Post 3185438)
Comments in bold. Porygon-Z screws Blissey with Hyper Beam, believe it or not, then Skarmory with Thunderbolt, Garchomp wth Ice Beam. (If It's holding Choice Scarf.) Rhyperior with Ice Beam. 4 member. Not a good sign. Maybe a bolt-Beam resistor would be sufficient. since you're playing in OU's, (Lanturn wouldn't fit on a OU Team.) Magnezone would be beneficial for that.

What? Sub on a shed shell skarm = no. The whle point of sub is to beat magnezone.

Nobody uses hyper beam Pory Z. Anybody who does will just get their Pory Z OHKOed anyways. So it wouldn't destroy the whole team, just blissey. Besides, Rhyperior shrugs off ice beam and nails that puppy with EQ.

The real problem on this team is the lack of heracross coverage. Skarm handles scarf variants, but CB can be a rough ride. Since fighting attacks demolish your team, trouble awaits. Also, Vire can be a nasty pain. But I wouldn't worry about that one since Rhyinferior covers it.

shedinjask December 21st, 2007 11:10 AM

Quote:

Besides, Rhyperior shrugs off ice beam
From Porygon-Z? I hate rules there are absolutely no point to.

Anti December 21st, 2007 11:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shedinjask (Post 3185820)
From Porygon-Z? I hate rules there are absolutely no point to.

Believe me, it does. Solid Rock helps...unless I ran those clacs wrong :0

shedinjask December 21st, 2007 11:17 AM

I think you did. Max HP/SDef Rhyperior takes 63.36% - 74.65% from Specs Timid Ice Beam.

Except I just realized that Metalkid's calc is ignoring Solid Rock. To Serebii!

EDIT: Serebii is being cheap as hell and only gives the formula. To Psypokes!

EDIT: Well Psypokes has a **** calc. Know of any others?

EDIT: I have conquered the monstrosity that is Psypokes damage calc. Min is 57.2%. Pwned.

Anti December 21st, 2007 11:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shedinjask (Post 3185832)
I think you did. Max HP/SDef Rhyperior takes 63.36% - 74.65% from Specs Timid Ice Beam.

Except I just realized that Metalkid's calc is ignoring Solid Rock. To Serebii!

though Pory Z almost never has specs, I always see scarf 9which was what I was refering to, I should have clarified)

shedinjask December 21st, 2007 1:49 PM

ScarfgonZ won't OHKO Bliss though. :O


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