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-   -   New Team OU (https://www.pokecommunity.com/showthread.php?t=124978)

.Aero January 29th, 2008 7:05 PM

New Team OU
 
Gengar@Choice Specs/Scarf/Wide Lense
Timid ~ 252 Special Attack/Speed; 4 HP
Hypnosis
Focus Blast
Thunderbolt
Shadow Ball

~ My lead and special sweeper. Also a nice Hypnosis will keep those who I want to sleep asleep. I may use Wide Lense with Hypnosis, just to almost guarantee a hit, and so that I won’t be stuck on one move. I need a suggestion for another move in its place besides Hidden Power Ice. I don’t feel like IV breeding big time for anything.

Weavile@Expert Belt
Jolly ~ 252 Attack/Speed; 4 HP
Pursuit
Ice Punch
Brick Break/Aerial Ace
Night Slash

~ Even though I have Pursuit, I still want a good STAB move aside from it. I don’t know whether to choose Brick Break to deal with steels and other darks, or Aerial Ace to cover the double Fighting weakness. Obviously it’s my Physical Sweeper and may switch as lead with Gengar.

Infernape@Life Orb
Naïve ~ 252 Special Attack; 232 Speed; 24 Attack
Nasty Plot
Flamethrower
Grass Knot
Close Combat

~ Your standard MixApe. I’ve never used a Mixed Sweeper before and I think it would be nice. It’s also good for handling Suicune and Milotic, along with Swapert and Donphan.

Skarmory@Shed Shell
Impish ~ 252 HP; 156 Defense; 96 Attack; 4 Speed
Spikes
Whirlwind
Drill Peck
Roost

~ I need a Spiker, and a pokemon with a flying attack with STAB to take care of fighting types if I don’t feel safe with Weavile’s Aerial Ace. Also works as my Physical Wall.

Cresselia@Leftovers
Bold ~ 252 HP; 144 Special Defense; 112 Defense
Rest
Sleep Talk
Ice Beam
Thunder Wave/Psychic

~ My Special Wall, RestTalks, so I think it should do fine. I’m kind of wondering if this would work better than the Calm Mind version, but I’ll need some input on it.

Starmie@Leftovers
Timid ~ 216 Speed; 172 HP; 120 Special Attack ~ Natural Cure
Rapid Spin
Recover
Surf
Thunderbolt

~ Spinner. That’s about it.

---------

Comment and help. Especially with Cresselia.

~desu Saba~

sims796 January 29th, 2008 8:50 PM

I do believe Skarmory will do fine with Brave Bird over Drill peck, if your really adamant on doing any damage with it.

Night Slash & Pursuit is redundant. You have Ice Punch for that STAB, & I feel it's enough to take out most things that would want to stay in against Weavile.


I don't really like that rest-talking Cressila idea, especially since it doesn't need to attack with Sleep Talk.

Once Gya gets at least 2 DD's in, you're in trouble.

Ársa January 29th, 2008 11:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sabaku no Gaara (Post 3291489)
[email protected]Choice Specs
Timid ~ 252 Special Attack/Speed; 4 HP
Hypnosis / HP Ice
Focus Blast
Thunderbolt
Shadow Ball

Good, but no Wide Lens please. Only increases Accuracy by 7%, where as you could do some considerable damage with Specs. 70% and 77% aren't that big of a difference...

[email protected]Life Orb / Focus Sash / Choice Band
Jolly ~ 252 Attack/ 224 Speed; 32 HP
Brick Break
Ice Punch
Swords Dance / Aerial Ace
Night Slash / Pursuit

Standard runs 216 Speed, so add 2 extra in Speed just to be safe against other Weavile. Life Orb or Focus Sash if you run Swords Dance, otherwise go with a revenge killer in Choice Band. 1 or the other with the dark attacks thanks.

[email protected] Orb
Naïve ~ 252 Special Attack; 232 Speed; 24 Attack
Nasty Plot
Flamethrower
Grass Knot
Close Combat

Good.

[email protected]
Impish ~ 252 HP; 206 Defense; 44 Attack; 8 Speed
Spikes
Whirlwind
Brave Bird
Roost

Magnezone isn't that common, and Skarm needs Leftovers to help while Spiking. Brave Bird, or else Drill Peck doesn't do anything. (Still does more damage with the less EV's, more defense pl0x)

[email protected]
Calm ~ 252 HP; 144 Special Defense; 112 Defense
Rest
Charge Beam
Ice Beam
Thunder Wave

Please no Sleep Talk, it is hopeless once you run into a DDGyara, as sims mentioned. Charge Beam is helpfull there, and can boost your Sp. Atk. Ice Beam takes Dragons, while T-Wave is pure status, and Rest over Moonlight because in Sandstorm it does jack.

[email protected]
Timid ~ 216 Speed; 172 HP; 120 Special Attack ~ Natural Cure
Rapid Spin
Recover
Surf
Thunderbolt

Fine.

---------

Comment and help. Especially with Cresselia.

~desu Saba~

Ok, I have tried to help. A little too standard for me, but if it works for you...

Regards,

~T_S

Anti January 30th, 2008 9:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sabaku no Gaara (Post 3291489)
Gengar@Choice Specs/Scarf/Wide Lense
Timid ~ 252 Special Attack/Speed; 4 HP
Hypnosis
Focus Blast
Thunderbolt
Shadow Ball

~ My lead and special sweeper. Also a nice Hypnosis will keep those who I want to sleep asleep. I may use Wide Lense with Hypnosis, just to almost guarantee a hit, and so that I won’t be stuck on one move. I need a suggestion for another move in its place besides Hidden Power Ice. I don’t feel like IV breeding big time for anything.

I'd life orb that thing up...no choice with hupnosis, especially scarf. Energy Ball works, or any decent hidden power (not just ice).

Weavile@Expert Belt / Choice Band
Jolly ~ 252 Attack/Speed; 4 HP
Pursuit
Ice Punch
Brick Break
Night Slash

~ Even though I have Pursuit, I still want a good STAB move aside from it. I don’t know whether to choose Brick Break to deal with steels and other darks, or Aerial Ace to cover the double Fighting weakness. Obviously it’s my Physical Sweeper and may switch as lead with Gengar.

Fine. CB actually gives pursuit some form of power.

Infernape@Life Orb
Naïve ~ 252 Special Attack; 232 Speed; 24 Attack
Nasty Plot
Flamethrower
Grass Knot
Close Combat

~ Your standard MixApe. I’ve never used a Mixed Sweeper before and I think it would be nice. It’s also good for handling Suicune and Milotic, along with Swapert and Donphan.

Alright.

Skarmory@Shed Shell
Impish ~ 252 HP; 156 Defense; 96 Attack; 4 Speed
Spikes
Whirlwind
Drill Peck
Roost

~ I need a Spiker, and a pokemon with a flying attack with STAB to take care of fighting types if I don’t feel safe with Weavile’s Aerial Ace. Also works as my Physical Wall.

Needs more Defense really. Skarm can't wall like it used to.

Cresselia@Leftovers
Bold ~ 252 HP; 148 Special Defense; 108 Defense
Rest
Sleep Talk
Ice Beam / Charge Beam
Psychic / Charge Beam

~ My Special Wall, RestTalks, so I think it should do fine. I’m kind of wondering if this would work better than the Calm Mind version, but I’ll need some input on it.

Charge Beam makes the Resttalker a lot more useful.

Starmie@Leftovers
Timid ~ 216 Speed; 172 HP; 120 Special Attack ~ Natural Cure
Rapid Spin
Recover
Surf
Thunderbolt

~ Spinner. That’s about it.

Sure.

---------

Comment and help. Especially with Cresselia.

~desu Saba~

Physical Infernape kind of destroys you. Skarm needs some backup.

And sims, Pursuit and Night Slash aren't redundant on Weavile. Night Slash is for a powerful STAB move and pursuit is to OHKO Zam, Gengar, etc. with a 100% success rate.

Also, once Gyara gets 2 DDs in, ANY team w/o D-E is in trouble.

sims796 January 30th, 2008 9:47 AM

All while cutting off wat he can possibly hit with two dark moves. Aerial Ace is superior in that aspect, being able to actuall scare Hera. Or any other fighter. Hell, even Nape eats up Wealive without Aerial Ace. That's embarassing.

I don't know what teams YOU fought, but I've stopped my share of Gya. 2 really isn't all too scary, as he doesn't have a reliable way to stop it once Gengar gets stopped. At least without Charge Beam on Cressy.

This is just what I mean.

Anti January 30th, 2008 10:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sims796 (Post 3292403)
All while cutting off wat he can possibly hit with two dark moves. Aerial Ace is superior in that aspect, being able to actuall scare Hera. Or any other fighter. Hell, even Nape eats up Wealive without Aerial Ace. That's embarassing.

Without pursuit you can't really revenge kill well, and without Night Slash, you lose a powerful STAB. Heracross can't really switch into Ice Punch without taking a lot of damage. Infernape can't take a Choice Band Brick Break (or anything) well.

I don't know what teams YOU fought, but I've stopped my share of Gya. 2 really isn't all too scary, as he doesn't have a reliable way to stop it once Gengar gets stopped. At least without Charge Beam on Cressy.

Starmie is a good enough Gyarados counter IMO. I've used it, it rocks. But after two DDs, only some really sturdy stuff can stand up to it (or really fast).

There's very little that can stop a Gyarados with two dragon dances, and not many teams have those pokemon.


This is just what I mean.

Now that really kind of ticks me off. The points I made were perfectly valid; I don't just disagree to disagree. you're acting like I'm doing something wrong here or something, and it offends me in all honesty.

I'm not going to go all Itachi on you, but really, that was pretty uncalled for.

Yeah, answers in bold. People are allowed to disagree :(

sims796 January 30th, 2008 10:43 AM

All the while, anything Scarfed can easily wipe out that Weavile, especially since it lacks versatility.

2 DD's isn't enough to wipe out something as sturdy as Cressy. But it is made easier However, it is easier for me to KO a when it doesn't have a single move to attack back. Thus for, Charge Beam can remedy this. It isnt hard to stop a Gyarados with 2 DD's, as it has been done many, many times.

I don't appreciate getting disregarded as some noob, which has been happening alot on this damn site.

Dark Azelf January 30th, 2008 10:44 AM

The Itachi bit made me lol


Pursuit / Night Slash / Brick Break / Ice Shard on Choice Band Weavile or it fails to scarf chomp =).


Aerail Ace is suckage, it doesnt EVEN OHKO Infernape =/ and what do you hit with it, Breloom ? Heracross ? and Infernape, Ape isnt Ohkod, Breolom gets wasted by Ice Shard, so that leaves just heracross, which in all reality you shouldnt be trying to kill or even stay in against.

But anyways i suggest swords dance weavile for this team, i think its already been posted.



DD Taunt Tyranitar REALLY puts the hurt onto you, it outruns Key members of your team, Starmie and Gengar after a DD aswell as Infernape, lols at Skarm and Cressy with Taunt and DD's some more, Weavile cant switch in.Its then free to Crunch and Earthquake everything, skarm is your only defense, after 3 Dragon Dances, Crunch not being very effective doesnt matter, it wastes skarm after a few dances and along with Taunt the only thing you can do it Drill peck it,or switch, thus giving it free DD's.




This calls for a Bulky ground type.

sims796 January 30th, 2008 10:53 AM

Despite the fact that you are now more easily walled? Especially by the likes of Forretress. Since you have absolutely no way to damage it.

Dark Azelf January 30th, 2008 11:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sims796 (Post 3292508)
Despite the fact that you are now more easily walled? Especially by the likes of Forretress. Since you have absolutely no way to damage it.

So, Aerial Ace doesnt make a difference, everything that walls you with Aerial Ace will wall you without. Brick Break will do more to forry that AA anyways.

AA is only really an option when you are exceedingly Heracross weak and when it gets STAB. Like Gliscor for example.

As i said, it wont even OHKO Infernape. If it cant kill something that weak, it doesnt deserve a moveslot, the only thing it beats is heracross, wow one pokemon in OU. This is where your physical wall comes into play, send that after Hera. The other thing it beats is like breloom, again Ice Shard wrecks it, so your going with a weak move for 1/1.5 OU pokemon.

Pursuit wrecks stuff, guaranteeing a OHKO on gengar, Azelf and Alakazam weather they switch, or not, Wrecks cresselia, uxie, Mesprit, Starmie hell even deoxys E if its choiced into an move and the list continues, even Blissey gets 2hko'd by it.

Pursuit is better, things that dont like taking a Night Slash will switch, thus giving you a free kill as it hits things on the switch HARDER than a choice band Night slash.

sims796 January 30th, 2008 12:27 PM

Which is why I said I don't care for NIGHT SLASH. No idiot will stay in on a Weavile weak, so Pursiut will damn sure have it's usage. I don't see a reason for Night Slash. Although I did underestimate it to a degree, I'll admit, it won't see play as much as Pursuit.

As for Forry, that was a typo. I was looking at him, then e was stuck in my mind for a while.

boo836 January 30th, 2008 12:31 PM

Ok, settle down guys. AA can be used on weavile, but I would prefer bb because if you lead with him, you can switch gengar into CCs and not get harmed.

Anti January 30th, 2008 12:32 PM

I'm not disregarding you as a n00b, that's pretty unfair to assume I am sims. I don't think you're a n00b, and I'm sure as hell not disregarding you. I'm simply disagreeing with you, and I am allowed to do that. It's really unfair to me to assume that, especially since you know you're one of our most respected members.

Weavile has counters, like any pokemon. Forretress eats up Aerial Ace like candy. Brick Break won't even hurt it.

Without Pursuit, Weavile can't revenge kill (at least not nearly as well as its competition, mostly ScarfChomp and Dugtrio). Weavile isn't going to stay in on something that can outspeed it, and Ice Shard can take care of that problem also (it wastes Aerodactyl.)

Aerial Ace adds no extra coverage...it won't OHKO Nape it seems, and Breloom can't take ice shard or ice punch. Weavile won't even bother with Scarfcross since it's faster, and CBcross is rare (and will take a beating from ice punch if it's at low health).

also, I'd like to point out that with 2 DDs and the possibility of a flinch from waterfall or that the Gyara has a wacan berry, Cressi will have a really tough time beating Gyarados...and if it does, it'll be at low enough health to be wasted by a revenge killer.

As for the team, Cresselia just won't do it as a special wall without more SDef (or light screen). Especially with stuff that threatens Dark Pulse and Shadow Ball, you're in trouble.

Actually, a resttalk Snorlax would fit in here pretty well, just watch out for Porygon-Z. Also, watch out for Weavile, which can waste half of your team. Honestly, something that better walls weavile over Skarmory would probably be better IMO, like Forretress...which would free up a slot since Starmie wouldn't really be needed.

Team isn't too bad, but there are quite a few attackers out there that have their way with this team.

EDIT: Night Slash is your best against something that probably won't switch out, but you can waste anyways. Also, stuff like U-Turn Celebi will try to beat you, and a Night slash in their face will hurt. Since Ice Shard is usually used over Ice Punch, you also need a STAB move with a higher base power than 40.

As for Aerial Ace, it's pretty useless unless a CBcross (which will switch out anyways) is something you fear.

boo836 January 30th, 2008 12:41 PM

Also, as a side note, you could go hp [ice] over shadow ball to mock bolt-beam. Either coverage or stab, it's your choice.

.Aero January 30th, 2008 12:49 PM

This thread is turning into a fight. *sigh*

Anyway, I actually have a finished Forry that I could use in this team. It's standard like most pokemon I try to use (aside from my pwnsome Noctowl. xD)

Quote:

I need a suggestion for another move in its place besides Hidden Power Ice. I don’t feel like IV breeding big time for anything.
Ice Punch > Ice Shard in my opinion too.

~desu Saba~

boo836 January 30th, 2008 12:53 PM

Sorry, I keep thinking that this is a shoddy team.

Syaoran January 30th, 2008 1:02 PM

Losing STAB Shadow Ball in favour of HP ice? REALLY not worth it.


Any DDtar who isn't jolly won't outspeed Starmie after a DD, so you can still Surf him and kill after he has taken some damage.

If you're leading with Gengar then make it hold a Choice Scarf, you don't wanna die when they lead with Weavile, one of the most common leads.

Infernape is gonna be hard to switch in, especially when it takes recoil damage from Life Orb. I think you should switch it for something like Garchomp, because your team lacks a good Earthquake.

Also, Weavile must have Ice Shard if you wanna revenge kill stuff like DD Dragonite / Salamence. Having a priority move never hurts.

flamehaze94 January 30th, 2008 3:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sabaku no Gaara (Post 3291489)
Gengar@Choice Specs/Scarf/Wide Lense
Timid ~ 252 Special Attack/Speed; 4 HP
Hypnosis
Focus Blast
Thunderbolt
Shadow Ball

Life Orb.

Weavile@Expert Belt
Jolly ~ 252 Attack/Speed; 4 HP
Pursuit
Ice Punch
Brick Break/Aerial Ace
Night Slash

lol'd at AA
CB it


Infernape@Life Orb
Naïve ~ 252 Special Attack; 232 Speed; 24 Attack
Nasty Plot
Flamethrower
Grass Knot
Close Combat

k

Skarmory@Shed Shell
Impish ~ 252 HP; 156 Defense; 96 Attack; 4 Speed
Spikes
Whirlwind
Drill Peck
Roost

???
no, Smogon EVs are crap
252HP / 20Atk / 4Spd / rest in Def


Cresselia@Leftovers
Bold ~ 252 HP; 144 Special Defense; 112 Defense
Rest
Sleep Talk
Ice Beam
Thunder Wave/Psychic

lol, just ignore people who said not to run ReSTalk
Thunder Wave>Psychic since Star already counters Ape
204HP / 252Def / 56SpDef as evs


Starmie@Leftovers
Timid ~ 216 Speed; 172 HP; 120 Special Attack ~ Natural Cure
Rapid Spin
Recover
Surf
Thunderbolt

Pump>Surf.

Taunt DDTar weak as mentioned before. Try to fit Steel Wing on Skarm then.


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