![]() |
Stall Team: My First Attempt
I've actually put a little thought into this >:O
Here's the team: Azumarill (M) @ Choice Band Ability: Huge Power EVs: 252 HP/252 Atk/6 Spd Adamant nature (+Atk, -SAtk) - Aqua Jet - Waterfall / Return - Focus Punch - Ice Punch Designed to deal damage, but since it's slow and has max HP, I guess it deserves a spot on a Stall Team. Also can take Flamethrowers aimed at Jirachi. --- Slowbro (M) @ Leftovers Ability: Own Tempo EVs: 212 HP/252 Def/46 SAtk Bold nature (+Def, -Atk) - Surf - Slack Off - Grass Knot - Calm Mind CMBro, 'nuff said. Helps absorb Flamethrowers, Focus Blasts, and other Fire and Fighting type moves. --- Blissey (F) @ Leftovers Ability: Natural Cure EVs: 22 HP/252 Def/20 SAtk/216 SDef Calm nature (+SDef, -Atk) - Thunderbolt - Ice Beam - Softboiled - Aromatherapy Blissey. Thunderbolt is for Gyarados. --- Swampert (M) @ Leftovers Ability: Torrent EVs: 240 HP/212 Def/58 SAtk Sassy nature (+SDef, -Spd) - Ice Beam - Hydro Pump - Earthquake - Roar Takes Electric attacks aimed at Slowbro and Azumarrill and offers additional coverage on taking Flamethrower for Jirachi. --- Jirachi @ Leftovers Ability: Serene Grace EVs: 240 HP/56 Atk/76 Def/136 Spd Impish nature (+Def, -SAtk) - U-turn - Zen Headbutt - Wish - Stealth Rock Absorbs Grass attacks aimed at my Waters and Rhyperior and Wishes to heal my team. --- Rhyperior (M) @ Leftovers Ability: Solid Rock EVs: 132 HP/126 Atk/252 Def Adamant nature (+Atk, -SAtk) - Substitute - Focus Punch - Megahorn - Earthquake Sub-Puncher. Helps absorb Flamethrowers, but repeated abuse hurts. Also absorbs Thunderbolts. My many Waters can take Surfs for it. --- It's my very first time making a Stall Team, and it will probably suck. But, the question is.....is it usable? O_o EDIT: Currently thinking of swapping out Skarmory. I'm thinking of something bulky (especially in the Defensive department), but can also deal out heavy damage. I'm thinking Rhyperior. Since I already have a CBer, I'm thinking of making it a Max DEF, 404 HP, and the rest in Attack Sub-Puncher. While you guys are pondering whether I should do this or not, I'm gonna go ahead and add it for now. EDIT 2: OK, Rhyperior has been added. EDIT 3: Replaced Regice for Blissey. EDIT 4: Hold up, making a threat list now....will be posted soon. EDIT 5: Threat List: Gyarados: Blissey can switch in without much difficulty and can Thunderbolt. Lucario: Swampert can take it, both forms. Hopefully. EQ will do heavy damage. Porygon-Z: Blissey can take it. Electivire: Against Solid Rock Rhyperior it doesn't stand a chance. Gengar: Blissey. Alakazam: Blissey. Heracross: Hopefully Azumarrill can switch in and give it a good Aqua Jetting. That will at least get it to low health. After that, Swampert can come in and Hydro Pump. Salamence: Blissey can take Specs, and Slowbro and Rhyperior should be able to handle CB. Swampert can handle Mixed ones. Garchomp: Azumarrill can "revenge kill", Swampert can Ice Beam. Tyranitar: Swampert can take Boah, DD ones without Ice Beam can be handled by Rhyperior, and those with Ice Beam can be handled by Swampert. This is why I was thinking of giving Swampert just enough Spd EVs to outrun Quiet Tyranitar. Should I? Raikou: Swampert can take it. Azelf: Blissey. Mixed ones can be handled by Swampert, and Jirachi and Slowbro could probably take the Explosion. Heatran: Blissey. Explosion probably won't OHKO it anyway. If anyone thinks I should add a Pokemon to this list, then tell me. |
Raikou 6-0s this team, as does Mixape.
Anyways, having a choice Bander (the total opposite of stalling) on a stall team is a no-no. You also have 3 waters, which defensively cripples you horribly, not to mention Rhyperior which also dies to grass attacks. Also Slowbro has pretty bad SDef, so switching into boosted Flamethrowers and Focus Blasts are still going to hurt a lot. I know it has CM, but you'll take 2 hits before getting one Calm Mind off. That's not good. also about your threat list...no. Explosion on Heatran will OHKO Blissey, especially one with almost no HP EVs. Also I must say that when I saw the "Blissey counters Gyarados" part, I about threw up. 10 base defense vs. an attackinjg machine with a powerful STAB move and Dragon Dance...no. Thunderbolt won't even OHKO and Waterfall will end Blissey. Period. Also Swampert cannot take Raikou if it has HP Grass, and you can't rule that out. Also Swameprt is OHKOed by SD Close Combat from Lucario and SpecsLuke Aura Sphere...I don't have exact calcs, but it will hurt. A LOT. Also Gengar and Zam can threaten you with Specs Focus Blast. While slowbro might seem like a cool switch, but Specs Focus Blasts wear down on something as weak on the special defensive side as Slowbro. The threat list is also very incomplete. One would think it would at least have Skarmory and Blissey. You also lack Infernape, Suicune, Hippowdon, Milotic, Gallade, Vaporeon, Jolteon, Celebi, Jirachi, Swampert, Regice, Donphan, Forretress, Cresselia, Dusknoir, Kingdra, Aerodactyl, Breloom, Bronzong, Spiritomb, Gliscor, Metagross, Machamp, Dragonite, Ninjask, Snorlax, Yanmega, Weavile...yeah. So to answer your question "is it usable," I have to be honest here and say it really isn't. A quad grass weak is no help as well. To fix this dilemma, I think it would be best to scrap the dead weight. Rhyperior and Azumarill just...do nothing. Take them out to help patch up your weaknesses. Honestly CM Slowbro isn't that hot in this instance either, just kind of waiting for Weavile to own you...and with Swampert it doesn't add much. Jir, Pert, and Bliss are cool and all, but the others do not fit (unless you want to change how this team is to operate, but that would be a whole different story and blah blah blah...) You'll want to focus on countering "The Big 5" as I call them. Garchomp, Salamence, Gyarados, Infernape, and Heracross are the 5 sweepers I like to e sure I can counter, though you can really put any awesome 5 sweepers in there. You counter most specials will Blissey, but remember some can beat it so you'll want to be prepared for that. It's best to run Blissey with a ghost to absorb explosion from Azelf, Heatran and friends and they also cover up that fighting weakness. Gengar is a bad choice for this though when we're talking about a stall team. The physical side is much tougher. You'll want to be able to resist major attack types. You'll want a ground immunity, fighting resist (covered by the ghost if you use one to help Blissey), rock resist, normal resist...yeah. You'll also want something to take water attacks from Gyara and Azumarill too. Usually a bulky water works for this unless it's Swampert. Optional stuff is Bug, Steel, and fire...just be sure you can handle Heracross, Metagross, and Infernape okay. It's pretty elaborate to actually cover everything and it's probably impossible, so just counter the most important stuff to you and roll with that. So if you replace the 3 I mentioned, what would you put in? I'm not trying to be the Grinch, just telling you what I see ;) Oh, and for future reference, on Subpunchers, EQ is always a bad choice since it doesn't add to you coverage at all. Rock type moves are more useful, so on Rhyinferior I'd go for Stone Edge over Earthquake in all honesty. Of course, I wouldn't keep it on this team, but just so ya know ;) |
Also, just to add, (I can finally say this) you cant do anything to Nasty Plot Azelf, its a 6- 0 sweep.
Run [email protected] 40 HP / 252 DEF / 216 SP.DEF Calm Nature Trait : Natural Cure - Thunderwave - Seismic Toss - Softboiled - Aromatheraphy This has never let me down yet. You also lack Toxic Spikes, Spikes, a Spin Blocker and some way to deal with stalling pokemon, namely Cresselia, Suicune Curselax, perish Song is nice to deal with these. There is non- if any residual damage here, which is what stall teams rely on. Ironically, this is another stall teams dream, you are very easily stalled if they get Toxic Spikes up, its GG, you dont even have a Rapid Spinner =/ Tyranitar also loves you, a Life Orb'd/Black Glasses Dragon Danced Crunch decimates Swampert and it then proceeds to Taunt all of your walls....... |
OK, I'm gonna go...um...update everything now......
BTW, I need SOMETHING that can dish out damage. Azumarill and Rhyperior are out of the picture, while Boah's Sandstorm will screw up my team. What should I use? EDIT: I know! MetaBoah! Metagross @ Leftovers Quiet 252 HP, 176 SATK, 82 ATK Meteor Mash Explosion Grass Knot HP Ice MM for STAB, Explosion for immense power, GK for Bulky Waters, HP Ice for Dragons. |
You aren't understanding the purpose of Stall Teams. They don't rely on direct damage like Rhyperior, Azumarill, and Metagross do. Stall teams rely on Toxic, Toxic Spikes, Stealth Rock, Spikes, and weather damage to wear down the opposing team quickly. Sometimes one attacker is okay, but that should be the LAST thing on your mind.
Also Metaboah...no. |
Quote:
Seriously, what do you think your gonna accomplish with Stealth Rock and a metagame weak team. You dont need ANY sweepers on a stall team, just tanks walls and residual damage. Again you still dont have a Rapid Spinner =/ or a PHazer. Ill give you an example of a stall team. Quote:
This is/was my stall team, as you can see, no SWEEPERS. Use this as an example, dont copy it though or i get angry >=[, i would link you to Obi's beastly stall team, but linking to other forums isnt allowed.. |
Mixape does massacre this team, if played right.
I think a good bulky Ghost type with Psychic would help you out bunches. You could try Spiritomb, just jack him up with some Special Attack EVs, run Psychic, Will-O-Wisp, Pain Split, and another move of your choice. It's possible to run Sucker Punch with a -Speed nature (such as Sassy) to not worry about a decrease in power, and the fact that Spiritomb ain't gonna outrun anything it needs to anyways. Running a stall team myself, I've come to a conclusion that a powerful STAB "always strike first" move is virtually required, since anything with Dragon Dance and Taunt will cause massive problems if you can't take them out in two turns (Gyarados comes to mind for this team, much like mine). |
I haven't added this yet, but how's this for changes?
BlissRachPert is staying. 1. 1st Slot is undecided. 2. Cresselia goes over Slowbro. It's much more sturdy, and can take EQ's. 3. The last slot will be a Starmie. It'll be the only fast thing on my team, but it won't be a Sweeper; it'll RS. |
Quote:
|
Quote:
|
How is 85 bulky? That's only 5 up from Salamence, and I don't think it's considered bulky. Let's not forget Starmie has a ton of weaknesses and only 60 base HP =/
|
Quote:
172 HP EVS Give 304 hp and with Base 85 defenses, it can take more hits than you'd expect. Its honestly not frail as you were suggesting in your previous post. |
I've used Starmie, and it takes nuetral hits okay, it isn't fragile like Gengar, but for a "bulky" pokemon it is indeed fragile.
It has so many weaknesses Celebi is laughing and has average defenses and pretty bad HP. It really IS frail if you're considering it "bulky." For a sweeper, it can take a few hits, but let's not kid ourselves here. Any boosted hit WILL take it down, most likely in one hit. That isn't what I would call "bulky." EDIT: The point being that it definitely isn't great for a stall team IMO. Weavile doesn't make its life any easier. EDIT 2: It also depends on how good defensively a pokemon has to be to be "bulky." For me it has to involve having few weaknesses, some useful resistances, and generally good (not average) defensive stats. Swampert is a good example. Pretty good defensive stats and awesome HP, combined with a fire and rock resistance as well as only one weakness (which is an uncommon move type, though it is a 4x weak). Starmie has only okay defensive stats, a ton of weaknesses (to common types too). It does have a few awesome resistances though, like Fighting, fire, Water, and Ice. Still, its defensive stats can get in the way of it using those resistances like a true bulky water, tank, or wall could. I wouldn't say Starmie is fragile in general, but if you look, its defensive stats aren't a whole lot better than those of Azelf, which is not buolky I think we could agree on. |
@ DA, I think Anti's trying to say even if you invest HP EVs on something that is frail, it still Isn't going to be on a stall a team unless It's a LOT more defensive and has the beforementioned moves, Spikes ; SR ; Leech Seed ; etcetera.
Your Jirachi is a good example of a stall pokemon. Ludicolo is one of the best, if not, the best stall pokemon, Crobat is pretty good at stalling as well, especially with the set DA has been spreading around. :O EDIT: And something that has common weaknesses Isn't too good as well, like Anti mentioned above. |
Quote:
|
Quote:
|
Quote:
|
Quote:
Attack: 75 XD Defense: 85 Descent SpAtk: 100 good SpDef: 85 descent Speed: 115 Very good. Not frail. This is what you call frail , Dugtrio : - Base 35 hp / Base 55 def / Base 70 sp.def =/ BIG Difference, as you can see. @Anti, The thing im getting at, is that you said here Quote:
But is it just me or is he taking no notice of advice, still no spinner, unneeded replacements and just general lack of any walling power to common threats. Which all in all is fail tbh. Quote:
Seriously flawed threat list. I love how you missed Weavile and some other common threats out aswell........ Quote:
Yep use this threat list, it has most things on there. Im not suggesting you counter everything, its practically impossible but at least counter most of this stuff, that is entirely possible. At the moment this team cant take most of those threats, IT needs ALOT of help. So what i suggest, it that you go through the above threat list and replace pokemon which can take most things and not rack up weaknesses together. EDIT : - The definition of a counter is a pokemon that can switch into another pokemon and take little or no damage and have and be able to ohko the other pokemon, or at least cause a switch. |
85 Defense is average, and Isn't really enough to be on a stall team, it also has no stalling move of any sort, which is also what Anti is implying. 85 Defense is NOT decent. Tyranitar is an example of a bulky physical attacker. 110 Defense and 100 Special Defense IS decent.
|
Quote:
85 Defenses are decent, but in T-Tars case its defenses are above average. |
Quote:
|
Quote:
85 base defence last time i checks is not "zomgsuxorz n shud nevar be used evar". its actually decent. Dugtrios defenses are phail however, there is a monumental difference here. Above average actually means great or good. You also said that it doesnt have a "stall move" so doesnt fit on a stall team, Richard Steel runs a stall team and he used a Metagross =/. |
Quote:
|
Frankly, this doesn't look like a stall team at all. Actually, other stall teams will stall the hell out of you. I support getting rid of Slowbro for Starmie, as it gives a better answer to some of the common threats, and you really need the speed. You can consider using a Scarf Starmie if you're that afraid of Weavile, but I wouldn't do this.
|
Quote:
Dugtrios defenses are bad for example, but starmies, definitely not. My main point is that its good on stall teams, its a Garchomp, Gyarados, Mixape counter, which stall teams have great problems with and it can spin, no other pokemon can counter those aforementioned threat and spin with the same moveset. |
| All times are GMT -8. The time now is 6:08 AM. |
![]()
© 2002 - 2018 The PokéCommunity™, pokecommunity.com.
Pokémon characters and images belong to The Pokémon Company International and Nintendo. This website is in no way affiliated with or endorsed by Nintendo, Creatures, GAMEFREAK, The Pokémon Company or The Pokémon Company International. We just love Pokémon.
All forum styles, their images (unless noted otherwise) and site designs are © 2002 - 2016 The PokéCommunity / PokéCommunity.com.
PokéCommunity™ is a trademark of The PokéCommunity. All rights reserved. Sponsor advertisements do not imply our endorsement of that product or service. User generated content remains the property of its creator.
Acknowledgements
Use of PokéCommunity Assets
vB Optimise by DragonByte Technologies Ltd © 2023.