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Zaikiro November 30th, 2005 4:56 PM

True. But I did'nt give it that rating because someone won a toureny with it -__-;;

Mullet November 30th, 2005 4:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zaikiro
True. But I did'nt give it that rating because someone won a toureny with it -__-;;

Yes but you gave it a higher rating after the Tourney, which makes no sense.:\

Zaikiro November 30th, 2005 4:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mullet
Yes but you gave it a higher rating after the Tourney, which makes no sense.:\

True, but it has it's points. It's plability,combos like I said, etc.

Frostweaver December 1st, 2005 3:09 PM

Since we just went over an old card, let's stay within that era of YGO time ^_^

http://www.yugioh-cards.net/Merchant2/graphics/00000001/tp5/TP5-EN005.jpg

Used to be one of the most expensive cards ever... how about now? Can Yugioh finally make a deck-out type without using exchange of the spirits, or is it just a fuzzy little useless worm?

Mullet December 1st, 2005 3:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frostweaver
Since we just went over an old card, let's stay within that era of YGO time ^_^

http://www.yugioh-cards.net/Merchant2/graphics/00000001/tp5/TP5-EN005.jpg

Used to be one of the most expensive cards ever... how about now? Can Yugioh finally make a deck-out type without using exchange of the spirits, or is it just a fuzzy little useless worm?

Well this did come out before Exchange of Spirts so deck out was thought of with this card first.

It's a good card in a mill deck. In fact really good in mill. Problem is if you run three and it get's hit by Nobleman (which has been limited to one, so it will be hard to Nobleman this little critter), then all three go. If you can take fifteen cards off your opponets deck it will give you an advantage though.

If played in mill it gets a 9.5/10.

Zaikiro December 1st, 2005 3:48 PM

It has a less chance of getting hit by it but it can reuse it's effect much with 2 of the best face down cards restricted.

Neddle Worm deserves a 8.5/10

Too bad the deck has a less chance of suceeding a mill due to the restriction.

Frostweaver December 1st, 2005 4:14 PM

Losing the 2 books really hurt needle worm =/ Same goes for the restricted jars too (well restricted is almost as bad as losing for this type of deck) Isn't jars+mill the only reason why Book of Taiyou is restricted in the first place, I think? I heard something about that...

Genecidal December 2nd, 2005 1:27 PM

Needle Worm,is sadly,not too playable in todays aggressive environment.Wishing it was,how could you dislike Needle Worm?

4.5/10

Zaikiro December 2nd, 2005 1:53 PM

It still is. It just lost support.

*points to Genecidal sig* That does really matter.

Mullet December 2nd, 2005 2:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zaikiro
It still is. It just lost support.

*points to Genecidal sig* That does really matter.

Needle Worm is still very playable.

Bah wish I could have gone to Regionals.
:\

Frostweaver December 2nd, 2005 2:59 PM

Exchange of the Spirit completely overshadows traditional methods to forcing an opponent to deck out (like needle worm)... it's not even funny =/ The only thing stopping Exchange of the Spirit is its rarity and how it's basically unobtainable at the moment.

Mullet December 2nd, 2005 7:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frostweaver
Exchange of the Spirit completely overshadows traditional methods to forcing an opponent to deck out (like needle worm)... it's not even funny =/ The only thing stopping Exchange of the Spirit is its rarity and how it's basically unobtainable at the moment.

I realize that. No one is playing Exchange or Spirt at big tournies, or at my local ones.:\

Forci Stikane December 4th, 2005 3:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frostweaver
The only thing stopping Exchange of the Spirit is its rarity and how it's basically unobtainable at the moment.

I guess that I should be glad that I have 15, then :D :D ...


...Nah, not really...but there ARE around 10 in my meta of around 15 people...

bd_dillon December 4th, 2005 8:13 PM

I Own one of the BLS-Envoy of the Beginning.

Agent9 December 4th, 2005 9:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bd_dillon
I Own one of the BLS-Envoy of the Beginning.

what was the point in saying that? I always wanted a Needle Worm, encountered it in my GBA gmae, It owned all decks

Frostweaver December 4th, 2005 9:53 PM

Not really... needle worms need to work really fast because don't forget that you are helping the enemy by thinning their decks and dumping monsters into the graveyard for them. A lot of players try to do that on purpose. Unless the worms are quickly following each other on top of the help of the pots, your opponent can easily recover by special summoning stuff with a full graveyard (and a fair amount of decks can do something like this nowadays. Do you seriously want to give Bazoo even more stuff to remove, for example? Or, just the good old dump/recursion)

Can't say that it own all decks. It only works with some intense planning and consecutive card effects following one another to deck out your opponent.


(and what kind of rich neighborhood do you live in with 10 Exchange of the Spirits around? Tell me where you live so I can go Trick or Treat candies there. Those rich guys will probably give out cash on Halloween night <3)

Ranusha December 5th, 2005 11:10 AM

Whoa. I've seen lots of fusion monsters with that many attack points!!

Zaikiro December 5th, 2005 1:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bd_dillon
I Own one of the BLS-Envoy of the Beginning.

I'm sorry to say..but that is a little bit off topic.


Quote:

Originally Posted by Frostweaver
Not really... needle worms need to work really fast because don't forget that you are helping the enemy by thinning their decks and dumping monsters into the graveyard for them. A lot of players try to do that on purpose. Unless the worms are quickly following each other on top of the help of the pots, your opponent can easily recover by special summoning stuff with a full graveyard (and a fair amount of decks can do something like this nowadays. Do you seriously want to give Bazoo even more stuff to remove, for example? Or, just the good old dump/recursion)

Can't say that it own all decks. It only works with some intense planning and consecutive card effects following one another to deck out your opponent.


(and what kind of rich neighborhood do you live in with 10 Exchange of the Spirits around? Tell me where you live so I can go Trick or Treat candies there. Those rich guys will probably give out cash on Halloween night <3)

Speaking of thinning.

Neddle Worm is a little similar to the Sixth Sense. Creature Swap your own and atack and that was a combo of thinning.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Agent9
what was the point in saying that? I always wanted a Needle Worm, encountered it in my GBA gmae, It owned all decks

True. It could do good in the games the most but that in IRL opponent's are more thougher and harder than the programmed decks you know by heart. I agree very much because use it in my Dawn of Destiny and it works well. Like I said. Knowing your opponent's deck.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ranusha
Whoa. I've seen lots of fusion monsters with that many attack points!!

Uhh...which fusion monster?

Neddle Worm may not work well not because of the Bazoo decks and also decks like Strike Ninja and can realy backfire if you discard all of your opponent bad topdecks. =/

New card speaking of thinning.

http://us.st11.yimg.com/store1.yimg.com/I/my1stop2shop_1872_6889638

Frostweaver December 5th, 2005 4:55 PM

I guess that we are suppose to comment on it without looking at Water Dragon?

A must have for all dinosaur decks, simply because there are no other dinosaurs. Now with that aside, water decks don't really need to deck out so badly (doubt you'll be THAT desperate for using salvage) and they got better things to do. It's relatively not that impressive to only be at 1800 after ALO boost. Classical nimble momonga will do much better at decking out, because being destroyed is easier than destroy something else.

If we're talking about Water Dragon... it's a risky monster because it's 4 cards to pull out the Dragon, although Hydrogeddon helps slightly with its effect. The water dragon swamps the field after it's destroyed, but you'll need another H2O bonding in order to keep the "invincible field presense" going (continous bond, break out, bond again, etc.) It's one of those situations where you really need pot of avarice/magician of faith to get back the H2O bonding, and pot can always reclaim one of the monsters if anything goes wrong.

Zaikiro December 5th, 2005 5:55 PM

Nope. Just it alone.

I got this card on sunday and I tried it out. I found out 3 things about it. It can be a bad topdeck. It does not work well in 3,s and you need to make sure that you can atack the monster

Hydrogedon has a chance to prove it self good. Unlike cards like Nimble Momonga..it takes timing. It has a lot of potenital of a monster, it is also offensive and defensive. It can be quicker depending on the game. Outside a Water Dragon is could provide some good field control. Also it can counter those Tomato or Rat control or any searcher deck because it could also destroy the searched monster when it's summoned. It's a great card. It just needs to be notice and used right. It could change the game.

It's a good beat stick overall.

My rating.

Traditional:2.7
Avdanced: 3.4

Agent9 December 5th, 2005 6:46 PM

It'd work well in the usual, ALO/LLAB deck. Great for swarm too ne?

Frostweaver December 5th, 2005 6:51 PM

ALO got better choices/options... >>;

And seriously I won't use 2 slots in my deck for a situational card just to fight against elemental searchers. It is just awful if top-decked, and it's so situational that most of the time you can't afford to "wait for the good opportunity" anymore, and just end up throwing it in defense mode.

Agent9 December 5th, 2005 6:55 PM

and when you draw three in the opening hand, it's useless, unless you discard and premature

Frostweaver December 5th, 2005 7:03 PM

You can fold your hand and forfeit if you got all 3 of almost any card on your opening hand... you need almost a miracle or some insane tech-draw machine to get yourself out of that.

Agent9 December 5th, 2005 7:06 PM

That's why we had Graceful though right? too bad it hit ban street

Frostweaver December 5th, 2005 7:15 PM

You'll still be at a disadvantage no matter how you look at it, if you got 3 of the same cards right from the very beginning. While you can use graceful to get yourself out of those locks and get 3 new cards, you COULD have saved graceful charity for later if you didn't have all copies of that same card, for example... err... k that sounds bad as I can't explain it very well but really I haven't seen anyone do that well with all 3 copies of one card from opening hand, including myself >>;

(ok unless it's some super situational crap like holding all 3 cyber dragons with a power bond/polymerization... that is an exception)

Agent9 December 5th, 2005 8:14 PM

true, atleast you'd have monster resources, and when your opponent discards it, it won't hurt, except Trad-Yata

Frostweaver December 5th, 2005 9:06 PM

It's still losing a potential resource... losing a resource should *always* hurt because all of your cards should be well picked and all cards should contribute to the deck.

Really for water decks that want to be thinned out, use this instead:

http://www.yugioh-cards.net/Merchant2/graphics/00000001/crv/CRV-EN027.jpg

It's morph friendly (just like how many water cards are morph friendly, Mobius to Balter?), it's excellent water art material, and it's THE monster to abuse creature swap with (yes I know that it can't summon more copies of itself then if swapped to the other side of the field, but I don't mind free tribute for Mobius, then wipe out their magic/trap, and then score a 2400 dent in the opponent's LP.)

Of course, that's only if you *REALLY* need to deck thin yourself... otherwise, poison draw frog for the win!

Zaikiro December 6th, 2005 3:42 AM

It goes to the hand? It could really bed for cost cards like Ligthing Vortex, Magic Jammer and so on. It has it uses espacilly in a water deck. Or can also give you draw power for Card Desruction also. Going to the hand can give you many avdtanges just like being summoned to the field.

Mobius is level 6. All of the Monarchs are. B.E.S Crystal Core can do the morphing though.

Abuse with Creature Swap is always good and helpful. This card is good but sadly may not get noticed outside of a water deck D;

Traditional:2.3/4(a lot of thinning there)
Avdanced:3.0/5

Forci Stikane December 6th, 2005 2:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zaikiro
Mobius is level 6. All of the Monarchs are. B.E.S Crystal Core can do the morphing though.

I think he's saying with ALO out...

Anyway, the card is good, and powerful with Des Frog decks (obviously), but otherwise somewhat pointless...

Moving back, however...

Hydrogeddon.

This is better than you think...especially combined with something like Meteorain (there go all 3 Momongas!!)...or against the now-more-constant Tomato Control, or anti-GEAF/GAF/Lel Lei, etc.

Not to mention it'll often translate into an early 1600 direct attack...

Zaikiro December 7th, 2005 4:18 PM

Oh, my mistake then.

Yay ^_^ Another Hydrogeddon supporter. It is a great card overall. A wonderful beatstick.

Meteorain is a great card, but really underrated. The only trample monsters that get noticed is Airknight and Exarion Universe(apprently I don't know what that card is still noticed even though Black Luster Soldier Envoy the Beginning is banned) Meteorian is like Enraged Battle Ox. One of the better trample cards but not a Cookie Cutter card.

Some of the other cards you mention could also make use of it. Besides Goblin Eilete Atack Force none of the others will get noticed outside of Beatdown which will be hard for Hydrogeddon to suceed it's effect in alone. Espacilly if something like Skill Drain is on the field.

A new card.

http://img381.imageshack.us/img381/1189/0211il.jpg

SOI-JP021
Chainsaw Insect
Earth/Insect/4/2400/0
When this card battle, at the end of Damage Step opponent draw a card.
Rare

Frostweaver December 7th, 2005 11:42 PM

O_O; Are they SERIOUS about this card?

3 of this + Appropriate = I win

I'm very sure japanese people are using this already though... it's just too hard not to notice this combo right away.

Zaikiro December 8th, 2005 3:53 AM

I'm pretty sure that there will be a ruling about activating Appropriate during the Battle Step, There must be one now..but in Jappanese -.-;

You could have many combos with this card but not to well enough to be in a average deck. It has beatstick power but giving your opponent hand avdtange is something that many players will refuse to do. It may gain play, only by the serious players.

Agent9 December 8th, 2005 7:29 AM

But, Couldn't you activate Apropiate during your main phase? then attack?

Zaikiro December 8th, 2005 12:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Agent9
But, Couldn't you activate Apropiate during your main phase? then attack?

Yes. But I am talking in terms of it's effect. It could activate any time. But it's effect of chaining to Chainsaw Insect effect during the Battle Step.

Forci Stikane December 8th, 2005 5:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zaikiro
Meteorain is a great card, but really underrated. The only trample monsters that get noticed is Airknight and Exarion Universe(apprently I don't know what that card is still noticed even though Black Luster Soldier Envoy the Beginning is banned) Meteorian is like Enraged Battle Ox. One of the better trample cards but not a Cookie Cutter card.

Some of the other cards you mention could also make use of it. Besides Goblin Eilete Atack Force none of the others will get noticed outside of Beatdown which will be hard for Hydrogeddon to suceed it's effect in alone. Espacilly if something like Skill Drain is on the field.

I know! Excarion is useless, especially with Goats limited to one...if you want trample, get a Fairy Meteor Crush...

...I was saying that Hydrogeddon is ANTI-GAF/GEAF/etc...as in after they attack, use one to smash through that 0 DEF and then use the other to attack directly...

Anyway...

Chainsaw Insect (what a name)...

Good beatstick, and good for disassembling walls, not to mention KILLS CYBER DRAGON!!! Yes, I KNEW Konami wouldn't let a card swarm the meta like BLS did again!!!!!!

Sure, its effect might SEEM bad...but pair it with all those anti-draw cards from SOD (Greed, Null and Void, Bubble Crash, etc), or with Appropriate like Frostweaver mentioned, and you've got one majorly mean 4-star beatstick with serious effect "damage" on your hands...

Oh yeah, one other card--CARD DESTRUCTION. This thing can so EASILY fit in mill/burn decks...

8/10 (needs the right cards for maximum effectiveness).

Zaikiro December 8th, 2005 7:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ichapokemr
I know! Excarion is useless, especially with Goats limited to one...if you want trample, get a Fairy Meteor Crush...

...I was saying that Hydrogeddon is ANTI-GAF/GEAF/etc...as in after they attack, use one to smash through that 0 DEF and then use the other to attack directly...

It is still good. Just should not be praised much like it is. I understood what you mean but if they are still in atack mode bu terms od Skill Drain or if it did'nt atack yet.
Quote:

Originally Posted by Ichapokemr
Anyway...

Chainsaw Insect (what a name)...

Good beatstick, and good for disassembling walls, not to mention KILLS CYBER DRAGON!!! Yes, I KNEW Konami wouldn't let a card swarm the meta like BLS did again!!!!!!

Sure, its effect might SEEM bad...but pair it with all those anti-draw cards from SOD (Greed, Null and Void, Bubble Crash, etc), or with Appropriate like Frostweaver mentioned, and you've got one majorly mean 4-star beatstick with serious effect "damage" on your hands...

Oh yeah, one other card--CARD DESTRUCTION. This thing can so EASILY fit in mill/burn decks...

8/10 (needs the right cards for maximum effectiveness).

Like I said about Appropriate before. It may not be able to chain it's effect (or it's effect activating)during the battle step. I twould be great but UDE(here and in Asia) may seem to counter it.


Let's not forget Slient Magician also. I tcan gain from that. Also Protector of the Sacuantary ( it has reasons for restrictions) for example. It can really go far but not here in a meta where giving your opponent hand avdtange is a bad thing.

It can make great uses in it's own deck and it's good to get insect support since it is rarely gotten unlike Warriors and Arrgo.

A wonderful card that just needs to be noticed outside of it's efect of hand avdtange to the opoonent. We really need a more mature meta =/

8.4/10

Frostweaver December 9th, 2005 1:16 AM

Appropriate should work in battle phase... I checked upperdeck but they don't have it here. However, we just need to check if Appropriate works against Airknight Parshath. If it works against Airknight Parshath whose draw is also during a battle phase, then this little buggy will work with Appropriate. (Just keep in mind that you aren't getting any card advantage unless this combo works for at least 2 turns. This is because 'Appropriate' is one card, therefore neglecting the bonus from drawing 2 cards for the 1 card that the enemy draws.)

Protector of the Sanctuary works with Chainsaw Insect alone, but don't put it together with Appropriate because those two will clash >>;

Mill decks DO need more than just the Pots... finally they got a beatdown card that can stand for a very long time ("invincible" in battle without effect). Guess that mill lives on even if it ignores Exchange of the Spirit.

Insect decks can't use this card just because it's an insect card >>; It's like saying throwing Shining Angel into a light deck that isn't specialized in using fairies (there's hardly any good light cards that you can use with Shining Angel, 2 good ones at most?)

When did Excarion become useless? O.o; It's good defense and fun with enemy reaper all into one big package. Just because goats are gone that will never throw Excarion into the useless pile. And hardly anyone uses Fairy Meteor Crush, as dedicated trample deck will go for the raw strength of Big Bang Shot. Excarion is just not splash-able into any deck (as goats are gone), but it's definitely living.

I think Silent Magician will be much better off relying on classical Level Up! Rather than letting the enemy draw... >>;

There's a darn good reason why everyone is paranoid of hand advantage, especially with no way to catch up because pot/graceful are gone... try playing with a 8 card opening hand with only 4000 LP in the beginning against a normal start of 5 card hand with full 8000 LP, with both player using the same deck. (of course, this test will fail with any deck that relies on winning without depleting life points, such as mill, exodia and etc)

Zaikiro December 9th, 2005 3:47 AM

Me has forgotten about Airknight Parshath >>:

Excarion is not useless. There are just better cards than it. Fairy Meteor Crush is good in trample decks. It strange how people options can change with a atack boost.

Silent Magician does have combos with the drawings. Level Up may produce more speed but it does give your opponent a disavdtange if you play a card like Heavy Slump. Which can give a chance for Silent Magician Lv.8 to stay on the field.

Appropriate is destroyable. Your opponent would not rather draw 1 card and let you draw 2. He/She may even negate the atack.

Forci Stikane December 9th, 2005 1:21 PM

Appropriate WILL work with it, but activating it doesn't give you cards right away.

Excarion is useless for the sheer reason of the ATK decrease.

Frostweaver December 9th, 2005 4:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zaikiro
Appropriate is destroyable. Your opponent would not rather draw 1 card and let you draw 2. He/She may even negate the atack.

Exactly why I said the whole thing about card advantage and the bug...

Excarion will be too insane without the attack decrease, because it's a card that can defend and attack at the same time. Add trample to that whole mess for free? er, no. There's still a fair amount of things that 1400 attack power can run over, and just switch back to 1800 if you need raw power instead. I like it.

Zaikiro December 9th, 2005 7:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ichapokemr
Appropriate WILL work with it, but activating it doesn't give you cards right away.

Excarion is useless for the sheer reason of the ATK decrease.

I have found that our already about Appropriate.

Not useless. Just too praised =/
Quote:

Originally Posted by Frostweaver
Exactly why I said the whole thing about card advantage and the bug...

>.>
Did'nt see that. I'm sorry
Quote:

Originally Posted by Frostweaver
Excarion will be too insane without the attack decrease, because it's a card that can defend and attack at the same time. Add trample to that whole mess for free? er, no. There's still a fair amount of things that 1400 attack power can run over, and just switch back to 1800 if you need raw power instead. I like it.

It is a good card but it takes away the credit from the other tramplers and it shows a sign that last format is still alive. It was wonderful stats but there are many reasons to like a card and to not like a card. It was in 7 out of 8 dcks in the last SJC of the format. Not even Airknight gained that kind of attention when it came out. It just seems like a card that just seems to take away the meaning of trample.

Mullet December 9th, 2005 8:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ichapokemr
Appropriate WILL work with it, but activating it doesn't give you cards right away.

Excarion is useless for the sheer reason of the ATK decrease.

Exarion is good, in certian situations, like to trample Goats, or a pesky Reaper.:\

Frostweaver December 9th, 2005 11:15 PM

Excarion is really good, but just that its subtype isn't very... charming, especially when Enraged Battle Ox has the same subtype. Move Excarion as a beast instead of a beast-warrior, and suddenly a new deck type *will* be born. It's like Manticore of Darkness. it's an insanely powerful card, but it can't be splashed anywhere, and there's too little support for its subtype, so in the end it looks like a bad card cause it's hardly used yet it isn't.

cp30 December 10th, 2005 9:01 AM

jfjkfngdfuighreutyhihbipjdf hbniputrgh

Agent9 December 10th, 2005 1:02 PM

cp30, please don't spam, it makes PC filthy and pointless.

cp30 December 10th, 2005 2:16 PM

what. why do i have to. you dont control me

Agent9 December 10th, 2005 5:09 PM

It's because it's PC's rules. No spamming is allowed

Zaikiro December 10th, 2005 6:48 PM

Please don't spam cp30 overall.

A new card.

http://us.st11.yimg.com/store1.yimg.com/I/my1stop2shop_1871_521375874

Agent9 December 10th, 2005 6:52 PM

It's great in trad, witchable, beat stick.....and has a great affect.

5/5 overall

Frostweaver December 10th, 2005 9:35 PM

*dun dun dun* Jinzo vs Mobius the Frost Monarch

Pros
-stops bottomless traphole, something that Mobius cannot ever evade
-stops Dust Tornado from chaining on to the summon, something that Mobius cannot ever stop as well

Cons
-the traps are still there, just can't be used. When Smashing Ground comes in to destroy Jinzo, the traps will be back and ready again.

Other
-Horn of Heaven and Solemn Judgment can both stop Jinzo and Mobius the Frost Monarch

However, destroying is probably better than just preventing a card from activating... Unless the machine subtype or the dark type are useful to the deck, or if you have ways to protect Jinzo (if Jinzo can last for a long period of time, then it's definitely better than Mobius the Frost Monarch) then it's very likely that Mobius the Frost Monarch is a better choice for this format.

Personally, I admit that I lack the skill to protect monsters without using my own traps (curse those Reinforcement of the Army to call D. D. Assailant and Exiled Forces anytime they need one), so I definitely favor Mobius the Frost Monarch a lot more (on top of the preference just because of the name too, of course ^_^)

Zaikiro December 11th, 2005 11:17 AM

I seen enough of those on pojo >_>. It seems to them that desruction is stronger than negation in this format.

I rebember Mobius as a CotW http://pokecommunity.com/showthread.php?t=16434&page=16

The IMG pic died out but it's Mobius.

I always used Mobius, even in last format over Jinzo. My review is still the same. My option is a little better on it now after seeing it being used more and more.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kyouraku/Zaikiro
Here is my review for both of them.

Mobius the Frost Monarch: It's effect allows S/T removal. It has to be tributed for it's efect to activate and it can be chained by cards like Divine Wrath, Ring of Desurction and so on. 2400 atack is good for a level 6 monster can destroy Jinzo and any of the other Monarchs. Also it can destroy Sacered phoenix of Nepthys. So it's atack is respectable. But 1000 defense can make it be destroyed by Tsukuyomi >__> and other cards if it's swtiched to defense mode.

So it's def is not that reliable. Either way it is useful in many way. Even though it effect requires a tribute. Hey! Breaker requires a normal summon.

So my review
Traditional 2.7/5(We have Harpies Feather Duster and Imperal Order)
Avdenced: 3.2/5
New avdenced 3.6/5(After the ban list on October 1st)

It's one of the best Monarchs out there.

On to Jinzo.

Jinzo has always had the title as the best tribute monster in the game. It is sitll one of the best in the game. It's stats are amaging and it's effect always gives it protection form now to then. It may not destroy but it can negate more and protects your monsterst also. It negates your traps with your opponent so it's wise to play your traps. Jinzo has always been wonderful and always good in tournaments. It was restricted when it was out. It was clearly superior in the past formats. But times has changed.

A great 4.4 both formats.

Forci Stikane December 14th, 2005 3:30 PM

...Amplifier......but IO is gone!!

Seriously, Jinzo...is just better than Mobius in general. Sure, destruction generally is better than negation, but you only get a max of 2 at that time, and if your opponent happens to have more in their hand (from Cyber Jar/Card Destruction), like Magic Cylinder, BTH, Saku, etc., then Mobius is essentially a wasted tribute....whereas at least Jinzo KEEPS GOING.

Oh yeah, that's the other thing--MOBIUS CAN'T BE SPECIAL SUMMONED TO USE ITS EFFECT. Premature/Call are near-staples in this format, yet Mobius is only a beatstick with these two, while Jinzo is a beatstick/permanent Trap blocker (oh, and freebie when combined with CotH).

So, in general, while it is close, Jinzo beats Mobius (other than in a water deck, and even that's a close call).

5/5

Zaikiro December 14th, 2005 5:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ichapokemr
...Amplifier......but IO is gone!!

Seriously, Jinzo...is just better than Mobius in general. Sure, destruction generally is better than negation, but you only get a max of 2 at that time, and if your opponent happens to have more in their hand (from Cyber Jar/Card Destruction), like Magic Cylinder, BTH, Saku, etc., then Mobius is essentially a wasted tribute....whereas at least Jinzo KEEPS GOING.

Oh yeah, that's the other thing--MOBIUS CAN'T BE SPECIAL SUMMONED TO USE ITS EFFECT. Premature/Call are near-staples in this format, yet Mobius is only a beatstick with these two, while Jinzo is a beatstick/permanent Trap blocker (oh, and freebie when combined with CotH).

So, in general, while it is close, Jinzo beats Mobius (other than in a water deck, and even that's a close call).

5/5

Imperal Order?

Near staple you say? I rebember you saying it was. Post

I truly agree with you on your second paragraph. Desruction is good but Negation is better in my opinion. But not to most in this format like I said above. Negation blocks more and is a little bit more gantureed.

Jinzo negates your traps also. But because of the 3x Sakaretsu and Widespreads in this format due to Rind and Mirror Force being gone. If they were restricted to 1(lets pray that never happens),Jinzo may rise agian. Now, Jinzo is not showing a good example as a good topdeck now with the average trap lineup 7 or more.

Inuyasha December 14th, 2005 9:12 PM

Meh. I never did like to use Jinzo... I think I used him once when I first got him, then went back to my Spirit deck... (No, I didnt use yata. Yata is cheap, underhanded, and lacks honor.)
It is a great card though. And then amplifier. >< I hated it. I kept a few cards to destroy jinzo in my deck though... never hadda big problem...

Agent9 December 14th, 2005 9:16 PM

I had one, but I never liked using it. NEGATED MY BEAUTIFUL TRAPS

Frostweaver December 15th, 2005 9:12 AM

Destroying Jinzo is slightly harder than other cards because you can't blow it up with your traps, but with so many suicidal removal cards out there, it's not too hard to do so. And, there is always Smashing Ground if desperate, but usually you probably want to save Smashing Ground for a Spirit Reaper (of course, use it on Jinzo if there's multiple copies of Smashing Ground in your hand)

Mullet December 15th, 2005 9:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frostweaver
Destroying Jinzo is slightly harder than other cards because you can't blow it up with your traps, but with so many suicidal removal cards out there, it's not too hard to do so. And, there is always Smashing Ground if desperate, but usually you probably want to save Smashing Ground for a Spirit Reaper (of course, use it on Jinzo if there's multiple copies of Smashing Ground in your hand)


It's fun to kill Jinzo when you have 3 Smashings, 3 Assailants, a Warrior Lady, and Exiled Force in your deck.:D

Zaikiro December 15th, 2005 4:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Inuyasha
Meh. I never did like to use Jinzo... I think I used him once when I first got him, then went back to my Spirit deck... (No, I didnt use yata. Yata is cheap, underhanded, and lacks honor.)
It is a great card though. And then amplifier. >< I hated it. I kept a few cards to destroy jinzo in my deck though... never hadda big problem...

Yata is noticed as broken, but not cheap. It was $60 when it came out. It's nice to see you agian Inu.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Agent9
I had one, but I never liked using it. NEGATED MY BEAUTIFUL TRAPS

It really depends of the time of the game how Jinzo affects your traps. If late and you use more than half. It can be one of the best cards of the game.

Quote:

Originally Posted by frostweaver
Default
Destroying Jinzo is slightly harder than other cards because you can't blow it up with your traps, but with so many suicidal removal cards out there, it's not too hard to do so. And, there is always Smashing Ground if desperate, but usually you probably want to save Smashing Ground for a Spirit Reaper (of course, use it on Jinzo if there's multiple copies of Smashing Ground in your hand)

How is Smashing Ground is desperate? There are many ways to kill Jinzo. And you could blow it off with your traps(depending which traps they are). Mostly Solemn Judgement and Horn of Heaven can stop Jinzo. The rest Jinzo has pirority.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mullet
It's fun to kill Jinzo when you have 3 Smashings, 3 Assailants, a Warrior Lady, and Exiled Force in your deck.:D

True. There is more than one way to destroy it. It better to look on what to negate Jinzo with than to see what Jinzo negates.

Mullet December 15th, 2005 4:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zaikiro
Yata is noticed as broken, but not cheap. It was $60 when it came out. It's nice to see you agian Inu.

True. There is more than one way to destroy it. It better to look on what to negate Jinzo with than to see what Jinzo negates.

Yata was never $60 dollars, it was either more or less, from what I saw.

You can only negate Jinzo one way, and that's Solom Judgement, I know what you ment though. I forgot if Divine Wrath works on it, cause that would negate it too.
:\

Frostweaver December 15th, 2005 4:33 PM

Horn of Heaven can stop Jinzo from being summoned in the first place, so it works, but no one plays Horn of Heaven. It's just solemn judgement that can really stop Jinzo in terms of traps. Rivalry of Warlords can also be used to stop it from being summoned provided that the opponent has a faceup monster and it isn't machine (but then again, no one plays that either.)

Forget what I said about smashing ground on Jinzo. Made an error there as that rule only applies for non-tribute stuff (except for Reaper) really...

Zaikiro December 16th, 2005 12:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mullet
Yata was never $60 dollars, it was either more or less, from what I saw.

You can only negate Jinzo one way, and that's Solom Judgement, I know what you ment though. I forgot if Divine Wrath works on it, cause that would negate it too.
:\

Depends on the store. Divine Wrath does not work on it. Acid Trap Hole can stop it also(if it's face down) Acid Rain and System Shutdown works well also. But Jinzo is not a threat overall.

Forci Stikane December 16th, 2005 4:23 PM

Divine Wrath is a counter-trap, so it SHOULD work...

Star Crossed Dreamer December 16th, 2005 4:27 PM

I was under the impression that Jinzo negated ALL Traps, not just some. Have they changed things a little more again?

Zaikiro December 16th, 2005 6:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ichapokemr
Divine Wrath is a counter-trap, so it SHOULD work...

The rulings! DDDDDo:

DIVINE WRATH

You can activate the effect of “Divine Wrath” to a Flip Effect, Ignition Effect, Trigger Effect, or Multi-Trigger Effect. But not to a Continuous Effect. This is because Continuous Effects cannot be chained to.

“Divine Wrath” is NOT a card that targets, so “Divine Wrath” may be used against Dragon-Type monsters while “King Dragun” or “Lord of D.” is on the field.

You can activate the effect of "Divine Wrath" against an effect monster's effect that happens anywhere: on the field, in the hand, in the Graveyard, or removed from play.

You must chain "Divine Wrath" to an effect directly preceeding it in the chain. For example, if "Airknight Parshath" equipped with "Cestus of Dagla" attacks a Defense Position monster, "Airknight Parshath" inflicts damage to the opponent's Life Points during damage calculation. Then, during effect resolution, there are 2 simultaneous Trigger Effects that the controller places in a chain however he likes. If the effect of "Airknight Parshath" is Step 1 and "Cestus of Dagla" is Step 2, the opponent cannot chain "Divine Wrath". However, if "Cestus of Dagla" is Step 1 and "Airknight Parshath" is Step 2, "Divine Wrath" can be chained. In this case, the effect of "Airknight Parshath" that allows the controller to draw a card is negated, "Airknight Parshath" is destroyed, and the effect of "Cestus of Dagla" disappears before it resolves.

Another example: if "D.D. Warrior Lady" attacks a face-down "Morphing Jar", and activates her effect to remove both cards from play, "D.D. Warrior Lady" is Step 2 because she has an optional effect, and "Morphing Jar" is Step 1 because its effect is mandatory. So "Divine Wrath" can be chained to the effect of "D.D. Warrior Lady" to negate its effect, but not to the effect of "Morphing Jar" to negate its effect.

You can chain “Divine Wrath” to the effect of “The Creator” (Ignition Effect), “Fox Fire” when it is Special Summoned (Trigger Effect), “Strike Ninja” (Multi-Trigger Effect), and “Homunculus the Alchemic Being” (Ignition Effect).

You can activate “Divine Wrath” in a chain to a Trigger Effect that activates when the Effect Monster is Summoned such as “Breaker the Magical Warrior”, “Dark Magician of Chaos”, or “Marauding Captain”. The opponent must declare the activation of “Marauding Captain”’s effect before “Divine Wrath” can be activated. In this case, the monster that would have been Special Summoned remains in the opponent’s hand.

You can activate “Divine Wrath” during the Damage Step because it is a Counter-Trap, so you may activate it to negate the effect of “D. D. Warrior Lady”, “Reflect Bounder”, “Injection Fairy Lily”, “D. D. Crazy Beast”, "Dark Paladin", or “Mystical Knight of Jackal”.

If you activate "Divine Wrath" during the Damage Step to destroy the attacking monster or the monster being attacked, the monster is destroyed. No replay occurs because a replay can only happen during the Battle Step. If damage calculation has not been performed yet, it is not performed.

You can activate “Divine Wrath” against “Sasuke Samurai” or “Mystic Swordsman LV2” when they attack a face-down Defense Position monster.

You can activate “Divine Wrath” to negate either effect of “Don Zaloog” and to negate the effect of “Airknight Parshath” that allows its controller to draw a card.

You can activate “Divine Wrath” to negate an effect that activates in the Graveyard, such as “Witch of the Black Forest”, “Mystic Tomato”, “Despair from the Dark”, “Night Assailant”, “Electric Snake”, and “Sangan”.

You can activate “Divine Wrath” when the opponent discards “Kuriboh” from his / her hand to negate the effect of “Kuriboh” and when a “Night Assailant” is discarded to negate the effect of returning a Flip Effect monster to the owner’s hand.

You can activate “Divine Wrath” when “Exiled Force”, “Red-Eyes B. Chick”, or “Paladin of White Dragon” is Tributed for its own effect.

You can activate “Divine Wrath” when “Dark Necrofear” activates its effect in the Graveyard during the End Phase, and since a monster in the Graveyard cannot be destroyed, "Dark Necrofear" is not destroyed by a card effect, so its effect does not activate again.

You can chain “Divine Wrath” to the effect of “King Dragun” that Special summons a Dragon-Type monster.

You can activate “Divine Wrath” when the opponent uses “Relinquished”’s effect to equip itself with a monster, or when “Relinquished”’s effect inflicts damage.

You can activate “Divine Wrath” when a Spirit Monster is returned to the owner’s hand by its own effect, and the Spirit Monster will be destroyed and sent to the Graveyard.

You can activate "Divine Wrath" when the effect of "Helpoemer" activates in the Graveyard, and the effect of "Helpoemer" will not activate again.

You can activate "Divine Wrath" when "Vampire Lord" or "Sacred Phoenix of Nephthys" activate their effects in the Graveyard, and their effects are negated and they are not Special Summoned; but because they cannot be "destroyed" while in the Graveyard, they are not destroyed by a card effect so their effect will not activate again.

You can chain "Divine Wrath" to the activation of "Peten the Dark Clown", and the effect of "Peten the Dark Clown" will not resolve (however, the "Peten the Dark Clown" that was removed from play remains out of play).

You can activate "Divine Wrath" when the effect of "Black Luster Soldier - Envoy of the Beginning" activates that allows it to attack a second time.

You cannot chain “Divine Wrath” to Continuous Effects such as: “Perfect Machine King”, “Raging Flame Sprite” (either effect), “Jinzo”, “Fire Princess”, “Mad Sword Beast”, “Hayabusa Knight”, “Cat’s Ear Tribe”, “Amazoness Swords Woman”, “Harpie Lady 3”, “Fusilier Dragon the Dual-Mode Beast”, “The Fiend Megacyber”, “Blade Knight” (either effect), "Patrician of Darkness", or monsters like “Element Saurus” that gain ATK continuously.

You cannot activate “Divine Wrath” when “Giant Orc”, “Goblin Attack Force”, or “Spear Dragon” changes to Defense Position because these are considered Continuous Effects.

You can activate “Divine Wrath” when “Lava Golem” does damage to your Life Points, but you cannot activate it when “Lava Golem” is Special Summoned.

You can activate “Divine Wrath” when any Union Monster activates its effect to equip itself to another monster, because that is an Ignition Effect. However, you cannot activate “Divine Wrath” when a Union Monster Special Summons itself back as a monster, because that is an effect of an Equip Spell Card.

You can activate “Divine Wrath” when a “LV” monster is sent to the Graveyard to Special Summon the next level version (an Ignition Effect), and “Divine Wrath” will negate that effect, even though it cannot destroy the “LV” monster because it is already in the Graveyard.

After you negate the effect of “Sinister Serpent” with “Divine Wrath”, your opponent can activate the effect of “Sinister Serpent” again to return it to his hand, even during the same Standby Phase.


Posted in bold. Staright from UDE.

I have'nt seen any new rulings on Jinzo for a while.

Frostweaver December 17th, 2005 1:25 PM

Granmerg the Rock Monarch

http://static.zoovy.com/img/hotyugioh/-/fet_en009

When this cards is Tribute Summoned successfully, destroy 1 face-down card on the field.


Mobius have to target spells or traps, and is generally most useful for most decks. Zaborg is an excellent choice at control decks as it destroys monsters very well together with Mobius's backfield destruction. What about Granmerg the Rock Monarch? It can possibly target a facedown spell/trap, or a facedown monster. It's a Nobleman of Crossout + Nobleman of Extermination hybrid, taking a little bit of both. What about him?

Agent9 December 18th, 2005 1:29 PM

6/10. It's like blowback dragon, except granmarg targets facedown cards.

Frostweaver December 18th, 2005 7:03 PM

Difference is that blowback is luck dependent, and in theory works multiple times. In reality, a coin flip is never preferred just because it's not skill based, and Blowback Dragon can't target the back row. The "reuse" factor is relatively weak as most monsters can't last very long in this format.

Pogiforce-14 December 18th, 2005 7:46 PM

Granmerg I would say is better than Zaborg as it is still a one for one, but with more options. Mobius I might place higher than Granmerg as he's a one for two, but then again he doesn't have the options. Sometimes though, having too many options can be a bad thing. I'd give granmerg a 7/10. I personally would still prefer Mobius for his ability, or Thestalos because he's burn and I'm a pyromaniac. :D

Frostweaver December 18th, 2005 7:53 PM

Mobius is definitely better because there's a fair amount of monster removal cards in the effect of many non-tribute monsters, but no one can remove the backrow cards as easily as Mobius. Every time Mobius come out, it's gurantee pain unless Mobius walks into Bottomless Traphole + Dust Tornado, as those two will just chain itself to destroy one of your own backrow, then send Mobius to the removed pile.

Zaborg can destroy faceup beatsticks, especially to run over one Cyber Dragon with the effect, then crush the Don Zaloog with the attack power, then send it away for Chaos Sorcerer later when it's destroyed. Strike Ninja really benefits from having Zaborg.

Granmerg is definitely better than Zaborg if it can destroy one of anything (actually, make that broken). It's just that Granmerg hardly helps against arrgo (common deck type) in which everything will be faceup, or burn/ALO (also very common deck types) in which the backrow is filled with continous faceup spells/traps. Granmerg can only beat control, but then the other two monarchs are equally helpful in beating controls.

lol... Thestalos is my least favorite because Dark World came out XD; Even in burn I use Zaborg if I have to have a tribute ^^; (and burn will only have tribute if Scarab isn't enough to destroy the enemy anyway...) Of course, it's another story if it's Molten Destruction-minor burn deck, then obviously Thestalos is the best choice possible ;p

Pogiforce-14 December 18th, 2005 7:56 PM

Yeah, my burn deck had some issues facing it's first darkworld deck. Still managed to win though, as the only hand discarding cards I had were thestalos and Spirit Reaper. And since Thestalos was kinda coutneractive ina deck that had two level limit B and two gravity Bind, I just took him out. My Ultimate Baseball kids were stronger more often than not anyway.

Frostweaver December 18th, 2005 8:00 PM

Burn decks' real enemy ins't Dark World (let Tomato worry about them) but just plain old Mobius. One Mobius come out, and there goes Level Limit Area B. During this time, the weenie steath birds are going to be crushed O.o; (and let's not forget other fellow arrgo friends). Burn decks need to be geared to have just as many ways to destroy monsters as any other deck. Those who cannot do so will be crushed easily... I mean, just 2 scarabs and lava golem summon are far from enough in monster destruction. >>;


Hmm since we somehow moved on to Scarabs, why not talk about Swarm of Scarabs now? How's Scarab doing in comparison to all the other non-tribute monster destruction effect monster cards, such as Yomi Ship, Man Eater Bug and Newdoria?

Pogiforce-14 December 18th, 2005 8:10 PM

I used to play a bug deck with Swarm of Scarabs as my best friend, but right now I just use pure life burn. I wish I had a mask of restrict though, as that would stop those pesky Mobiuses and Jinzos. Of coruse even if they summon one and break two cards, I usually have two left, one of which is either Gravity Bind or NIghtmare Wheel. either that or I have so many fire creatures already my Ultimate Baseball Kids are stronger.

But anyway, scarabs, ahem... Scarabs, like Stealth bird, requires some sort of defense to remain safe. The problem with scarabs though is that it's defense is considerably lower than Bird's and makes him much easier to kill. so he would have to depend on level limit B and other such limiting cards in order for the card to survive. Which to me makes it much a victim of Mobius as any other defense creature, only this one will not get his effect upon flipping up. with that in mind, I think A simple Man-Eater Bug with a Tsukuyomi would work better.

and just some trivia, once my opponent summoned a Jinzo, I activated MST on a face down card and it turned out to be Scapegoats, which they activated (This was not on the same turn) I activated Level limit Area B and just started swinging with Raging Flame Sprite directly. Because they had filled up their field with goats, there was really nothing they could do. not unless they wanted to sacrifice their goats to an all powerful Raging Flame Sprite with 3100 attack power. :D

Frostweaver December 18th, 2005 9:12 PM

And such a deck really deserves to lose if they can't get rid of one Level Lmit Area B... Where's the Mobius? >>; There's a fair amount of monster removal with magic cards even if Heavy Storm and MST are used up, mostly smashing ground.

Depends on what time of the battle that is, but it'll matter a lot if this is mid to late game of that battle. A burn deck isn't hard to identify, so your opponent should just let Scapegoat die right there anyway if this is mid-late game. By then, they should know that they must get out as many monsters as possible to destroy the burning monsters. It sounds like your opponent isn't preserving resources, but instead play whatever at whenever it's allowed to be played...

Pogiforce-14 December 19th, 2005 8:08 AM

well they were blindly following the general rule: if they try to destroy anything that you can activate, do so. he just wasn't thinking I would bypass his creatures. he probably thought I was going to kill Jinzo and then start swinging with baseball kids.

I believe I was playing one of the local Noobs. I seriously doubt he had any MObius or Smashing Grounds. At the very least, I know I don't have smashing ground. I had one, but in all the thousands of useless cards I have floating around, it's pretty hard to find one card.

Zaikiro December 19th, 2005 12:27 PM

Grandmarg is nowhere near Blowback Bragon.

Last format it completely got ingnored. Mostly because of sayings for examplewe have 2 Nobleman of Crossout for a reason and we have Breaker people, which is better.

Hopefully people options will change now on this card.

Mobius is the best. And saw play before the others.

Thestalos was not even noticed before Evan Vargas(Sand Trap on pojo) made top 4 in a SJC with 3 of them.

Zaborg was the most overrated form the start by being used into chaos decks instead of Airknight or any light tribute monster. Always gaining more play in the side deck than few tributes last format.

Grandmarg is underrated. It's effect could chain, Like the others ,but people never really mention that on the other monarchs, espacilly Zaborg. Having the choice to destroy a monster or spell is great. And face down prove to be more letal than a face-up most of the time. Grandmarg is one of the best tributes in the game. But is unoticed.

Traditional: 3.4/5(It kills Fiber Jar)

Avdanced: 3.7/5

Frostweaver December 19th, 2005 5:23 PM

No one mention the chaining part for Zaborg because monsters aren't the same as spells and traps. If you're targetting a spell/trap, it can chain to that effect, use itself up, then you aren't destroying anything anymore. For monsters, that monster is gurantee to die to Zaborg unless the chained spell/trap either stops Zaborg's summon, or can temporaily remove that monster from play for that turn (Interdimension transport? I don't use that card so I forgot the name... not even sure if it's quickplay or not)

Granmerg targetting back row facedown can be potentially useless. In theory, the same can be said for Mobius, but it's unlikely for both of the backrow cards to be chainable and quickplay-ed. I only saw that once and that was a Dust Tornado + Scapegoat.

So really, Granmerg is inferior to both Zaborg and Mobius in specialized area, but Granmerg's advantage is that it can try to do both.

(I don't like Zaborg in chaos, as Soldier/Sorcerer can remove the threat. No need Zaborg to blast it apart. Zaborg is really good in soul control decks where you swap a searcher with the enemy monsters, summon Zaborg, blast the searcher apart to get a search, then attack for LP directly. Any deck that uses high tribute monsters definitely should consider not just Mobius, but Zaborg as well. That's where I think Zaborg fits best.)

MegaDitto December 30th, 2005 7:44 PM

Sad. 11 days has passed and nobody replied.

Last CotW Something that ends and something new that begins. In Yugioh, a new banlist.
An new beginning.

Ending the year with a bang. Blowing away all your trouble and thinking ahead.

http://us.st11.yimg.com/store1.yimg.com/I/my1stop2shop_1877_212933999


http://us.st11.yimg.com/store1.yimg.com/I/my1stop2shop_1877_386436016


http://us.st11.yimg.com/store1.yimg.com/I/my1stop2shop_1877_265954674

Agent9 December 30th, 2005 8:48 PM

Aren't Zaikiro, Mullet, and Frostweaver the only ones who can post cards?

MegaDitto December 30th, 2005 8:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Agent9
Aren't Zaikiro, Mullet, and Frostweaver the only ones who can post cards?

>.> Why are they the only ones? Would'nt it be right for all members to post cards?

Mullet December 30th, 2005 9:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Agent9
Aren't Zaikiro, Mullet, and Frostweaver the only ones who can post cards?

Well actually, it was my job alone, until my computer crashed. Then people stole it from me during my absence.:P

MegaDitto December 30th, 2005 9:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mullet
Well actually, it was my job alone, until my computer crashed. Then people stole it from me during my absence.:P

If I knew that I would have never revived the thread. http://pokecommunity.com/showthread.php?t=16434&page=16

And this is Zaikiro. On his orignal account.

Agent9 December 30th, 2005 9:23 PM

Oh.

HI! *waves*

Raigeki is banned so

Banned/5 Advanced
5/5 Traditional

Heavy is the greatest mass amount of removal we have.

4.5./5 Advanced
same for trad

Freed, great in warrior toolbox. The so called warrior searcher.

5.5/ Warrior Toolbox

2.5/5 other decks.

Mullet December 30th, 2005 9:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Agent9
Freed, great in warrior toolbox. The so called warrior searcher.

5.5/ Warrior Toolbox

2.5/5 other decks.

Freed isn't too great in any deck type.:\

Frostweaver December 31st, 2005 1:29 AM

Raigeki:

(a rating that's only lower than pot of greed, graceful charity, harpie feather duster and monster reborn, but higher than all the other magic cards or a 5) / 5

Heavy Storm:

4.99/5
it loses 0.001 because it keeps making people believe that you may not need it in some decks, though actually even a burn or ALO deck need it...

Freed:

It's really, not that good. Let Reinforcement of the Army do its job and put this tribute monster away. It was a lot better in the past though... It's just because it's a tribute that it sucks, and the 100 lower attack power from the standard "2400 tribute crew" makes it even worst... can't even suicide with them in raw power.

1.5/5

Mullet December 31st, 2005 6:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frostweaver
Freed:

It's really, not that good. Let Reinforcement of the Army do its job and put this tribute monster away. It was a lot better in the past though... It's just because it's a tribute that it sucks, and the 100 lower attack power from the standard "2400 tribute crew" makes it even worst... can't even suicide with them in raw power.

1.5/5

At least give it a bit more credit. It has great deck thinning abilities. It ties with Mystic Lv. 5. Also it dodges Controller, and Snatch. I'd give a 3/5 maybe.

MegaDitto December 31st, 2005 7:36 AM

I hadn't done a review in this account for a long time.

Raigeki has been known as the the ULTIMATE beatdown card. If's effect is simiply amazing. Though it could be stopped, you need to know when to use it. Raikegi is a staple and one that is never unplayed.

Traditional Format: 5/5
Avdanced Format: If it was unabnned.Chaos would break lose/5

Heavy Storm was a good tech card when Mystical Space Typhoon was unrestricted in 3's. It has been always been used almost everywhere. When it was in 2's it was used. The same for now. Even though it's restricted to 1. >>; It is the opposite of Dark Hole. But one of the best field control cards of this format. It best to use it when your opponent has more than you. You can win the game with this card.

Traditional: 4.7/5
Avdanced: 5/5

Freed the Matchless General. One of the best tributes in the game. And should be noticed more. Being negating targets cards is good. Though it can't negate cards that don't target like Smashing Ground and Creature Swap. It does negate stp cards like Snatch Steal, Enemy Controller and Premature Burial if you revive it. It stays on the field. Skipping your draw phase is a rish but getting a warrior monster can really win you the game and can be used in a time of need. Freed is a great game ender. Drawing your card and actoivating it's effect and atacking to him makes him wonderful. Decicated warriors deck can always make use of this card.

Traditional:3.5/5

Avdanced:3.7/5

Mullet December 31st, 2005 12:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kyouraku
Freed the Matchless General. One of the best tributes in the game. And should be noticed more. Being negating targets cards is good. Though it can't negate cards that don't target like Smashing Ground and Creature Swap. It does negate stp cards like Snatch Steal, Enemy Controller and Premature Burial if you revive it. It stays on the field. Skipping your draw phase is a rish but getting a warrior monster can really win you the game and can be used in a time of need. Freed is a great game ender. Drawing your card and actoivating it's effect and atacking to him makes him wonderful. Decicated warriors deck can always make use of this card.

Traditional:3.5/5

Avdanced:3.7/5

I was about to change that Creature Swap thing. Smashing doesn't target does it, forgot about that...

It doesn't deserve the high ratings you gave it.

Frostweaver December 31st, 2005 2:57 PM

It doesn't deck thin because it just specifies what card you are going to draw in the draw phase... for deck thinning purposes, it doesn't do anything.

Negate targetting spell is good, but it's definitely not the only way to destroy monsters there isn't it... again it's like Silent Swordsman lvl 5's effect but even a bit weaker. It only works if it's specifically targetting Freed. It can't dodge Smashing since it doesn't target, but searches for a target as part of the effect, which is the major downfall for this type of magic immunity...

Mullet December 31st, 2005 3:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frostweaver
It doesn't deck thin because it just specifies what card you are going to draw in the draw phase... for deck thinning purposes, it doesn't do anything.

Negate targetting spell is good, but it's definitely not the only way to destroy monsters there isn't it... again it's like Silent Swordsman lvl 5's effect but even a bit weaker. It only works if it's specifically targetting Freed. It can't dodge Smashing since it doesn't target, but searches for a target as part of the effect, which is the major downfall for this type of magic immunity...

True it doesn't really thin, but it can be helpful to hav e a continous Reinforcement-like effect.

I said I had forgoten that Smashing doesn't target. Still can be stolen by Snatch, and beats Cyber Dragon.

MegaDitto December 31st, 2005 3:57 PM

It depends on the build. Freed may make it into a top 8 deck later on.

Mullet December 31st, 2005 4:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kyouraku
It depends on the build. Freed may make it into a top 8 deck later on.

Maybe. He has uses but they are limited.

MegaDitto January 2nd, 2006 8:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mullet
Maybe. He has uses but they are limited.

True. New Card(s). Even though you said you said you used to do the card of the week Ron. I'm sure this is a card you would agree on.

http://www.gamers-tcg.com/ProductImages/pharaonicguardian/Don_Zaloog_029.jpg

http://us.st11.yimg.com/store1.yimg.com/I/my1stop2shop_1874_782980432

Agent9 January 2nd, 2006 8:38 AM

Don is searchable by Sangan and has a rather nice effect.
Strik has seen alot of play though I don't know why...

MegaDitto January 2nd, 2006 8:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Agent9
Don is searchable by Sangan and has a rather nice effect.
Strik has seen alot of play though I don't know why...

Because of it's effect or combos. Srtrike Ninja could evade almost "anything". Monster attacks, spell effects,etc. It could stay on the field longer than most monsters and make your opponent waste their resourced. It is really a remarkable monster if you look at it more clearly. The dark atribute has many options so it uses are never limited. It has combos with D.D Scout Plane and Return from a Different Dimension(I perfer Dimension Fusion though) which can make it a OTK(One Turn Kill) card. It is one of the best swarm monsters in the game. Searachable also, thus it cookie cutter status.

Forci Stikane January 2nd, 2006 12:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frostweaver
In reality, a coin flip is never preferred just because it's not skill based, and Blowback Dragon can't target the back row.

YES IT CAN!!! That's BARREL Dragon who can't hit the back row, but BLOWBACK CAN!!

..Ahem, sorry, but I've been gone and that just had to be said, especially since my main monster happens to be Blowback...

Backing up:

Raigeki: Nothing needs to be said. 5/5

Heavy Storm: Ditto. 4.8/5

Freed: With the new format's constant topdecking and new POT OF AVARICE, this card is better than you think (Hmm, I could either topdeck something worthless, or search my deck for a Blade Knight/GAF/Exiled/Mystic/DDWL to get the win...what'll I choose??), but its true power isn't revealed until it's used in a Warrior deck...4.0/5

Strike Ninja: Not as good as it used to be, with less drawing power, the only drawing card usable out there needing monsters in the grave, and more beatsticks with Dark World...3.8/5

Don Zaloog: BTH-proof, Tomato-searchable, resource-depletion with little out to restore it, and a Warrior for RotA...8/5

Frostweaver January 2nd, 2006 5:02 PM

Pot of Avarice shouldn't be considered a drawing card at all because it absolutely sucks at drawing. The fact that it upsets monster-spell ratio is completely terrible for Pot of Avarice to be considered a drawing card. It's only usable in decks that can special summon from the deck rapidly, such as Hydrogedon and mass-searchers.

With that understanding, Strike Ninja doesn't demote drawing power at all, just like most other cards. Let's just say that seeing a Strike Ninja will give the same signal as seeing a Bazoo: save up spell destruction cards for mid to late game, because that darn RFtDD is coming to haunt you. Now there are those Strike Ninjas used as tech without a RFtDD or D. D. Scout Plane, and I don't really like that very much. Strike Ninja used in this fashion can at most dodge a deadly spell once, but it can't do much to solve the problem in the long run, only to be used as a long-living potential Tribute fodder.

Is there anything bad about Don Zaloog...? I highly doubt it...


About Freed... he *isn't* that good at all even with its searches unless you must play a pure warrior deck (and even then there's Silent Swordsman lv5's complete spell immunity from your opponent) It doesn't stay that long on the field to generate the chance of meeting up a situation where you got no monsters in your hand and you need a monster. If you're topdecking, then it's likely that a Spirit Reaper/Don Zaloog already got a direct hit on you. Oh, "direct hit" did I say? That means Freed have definitely perished already before the chance of topdecking even comes in. Pot of Avarice doesn't boost Freed at all, but in fact amplies the problem generated by Pot of Avarice. Pot of Avarice creates a problem where you can't get spells/traps, and Freed isn't helping by changing a potential draw for a spell/trap into even more monsters. This leaves Freed to be only useful when you choose to topdeck yourself by using a lot of cards in a very short period of time, and that sounds rather too situational to worth a tribute slot if you ask me.

MegaDitto January 3rd, 2006 12:24 PM

Welcome back Ichapokemr Ichapokemr. Strike Ninja is still a good card to use. Sure there may not be much drawing power but that effect all decks to be honest. Strike Ninja can still be played with all of the thinning cards in the meta like Gravekeepers Spy and the many selections of Tomto Control. Strike Ninja decks will always have the options of what to use, and dark monsters can thin them selves out.


Pot of Avarice is a drawing card and will always will be. It does not always ruin the deck ratio. It depends on the time of the game and what you have in the deck. Either way, it is a drawing card.

I think you are very mistaken about Strike Ninja there. It is a great card by it's self. It was used alone before the D.D Scout Plane combo. It can eveade more that what you think. It is also not meant to be used as a tribute flodder. It can survive long in the game. It's not really noticed until people face a lot of Strike Ninja deck. Espacilly in the late game when your graveyard is full. True it is used best with combos but it already good enough as it is. It can work well with out it. It is very well used anginst most deck types in the current meta now. Inculding chaos decks(yes, there are still some left in the game) when there is mass removal, you can even make Chaos Sorcerer remove it self. Sadly, it's underrated alone. ;-__-

About Don Zaloog. Every card had it's drawbacks. Including those cards everyone think is too broken to have draw backs. Don Zaloog is not always well anginst Dark World monsters for example, or other decks that can get cards in the graveyard. Pot of Avarice per say. It does not do well outside ofthe average cookie cutter deck. It's second effect is really underlooked. While most people say that it deck thins to a better card. Half the time it can thin out something good. -__- It is useful anginst decks that require certain cards, because taking from the deck would make a difference and 2 is better than 1 at most times when it comes to Don Zaloog.

Hand Avdtange is taken too much some times in 1 card. What ever happened to Drao Off? <_<

Freed isa fantastic card, espacilly in *this* meta. People who don't use it don't really don't what it can use most of the time in the meta, but it is a great card and deserves more than it's given.

Frostweaver January 3rd, 2006 2:20 PM

Technically every card *should* be vitally important in most decks. Some decks rely on a specific card more than others (Exchange of the Spirit, Dragon Mirror and etc) but at the same time, they don't really care what you thin out unless it is that one specific card, so in the end Don Zaloog's 2nd effect has an equal chance of helping the enemy in comparison to discarding vital cards.

Dark World can't be a very high tier deck, just like how Phoenix can't be a high tier deck either. They both seem really strong and they are, but Phoenix suffers that huge paranoia against D.D.A while Dark World got speed issue. (Phoenix can probably be a high tier though if DDA gets restricted like Asia, and when I'm talking about Dark World here, I mean a dedicated Dark World deck and not those sidedecked Goldd)

Drop Off is a 1 to 1. You waste the drop off card to destroy the drawn card. It doesn't generate advantage in math. People just tend to stay away from it because it's a trap card, and trap cards in this meta are plentiful already. Locking decks will obviously ignore that fact and will keep using it.

Hmm doesn't Strike Ninja's effect only cause Chaos Sorcerer to be idle for one round instead of removing itself? I thought that it should cause a similar case to Book of Moon flipping the target monster facedown.

"if you select a face-up monster with "Chaos Sorcerer"'s effect, and your opponent chains "Book of Moon" to flip the monster face-down, then "Chaos Sorcerer"'s effect disappears. But even if "Chaos Sorcerer"'s effect disappears, its effect was activated so it cannot attack or activate its effect again."

MegaDitto January 3rd, 2006 6:59 PM

I don't know why Upper Deck Enterainment hasn't restricted DDA. It may not be broken but it's not right for the other cards.

I think if Chaos Sorcerer activate it's effect, you can chain and remove Strike Ninja, but if it targets Strike Ninja the effect may disappear. I'm not exactly sure on that.

Drop Off is a good 1 for 1. Mabye not main deck worthy but it is side deck worthy. It's efect is very useful when your opponent is very dependant on topdecking.


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